BBC article: "it's hard to break free from 'golden handcuffs'"

[reeshau]

Full title truncated in the subject line:  For high-earning workers, it's hard to break free from 'golden handcuffs'

No new point in particular; I think most here are well aware of the dangers of this particular lifestyle.  Good to see some people profiled who "escaped."  Maybe it will get some more people to wonder what is possible.  I did find it funny that there was a bizzaro reflection of FIRE buried in one quote:

"'Pre-2008, it was easier to grind it out and retire early – but very few now are able to make their millions and stop working at 35,' she says. 'It's more than a salary you're tied to: it's also lifestyle, friendship group and sense of worth.'"

[ixtap]

That last bit is particularly interesting because most journalists date the FIRE movement to around the Great Recession, even while citing predecessors from the 90s.

I knew people who retired in their 50s back in the 90s and 00s, but not in their 30/40s.

[FireLane]

It's sad how defeatist that article is. They point out that these high-stress careers destroy people's lives and health, but the tone of it is, "well, what can you do?" They even mention that people are tied to these lifestyles because that's what their social group does, as if it were impossible to resist peer pressure.

For whatever it's worth, I made a six-figure salary during my career and I didn't work crazy hours like these people did. I'm sure some of this pressure is real, depending on the industry. But some of it is self-imposed, too, because some people want to look like the hardest-working person around to impress their bosses.

I learned that early in my career. There were people in my department who routinely stayed in the office until 8 or 9 at night, but they weren't getting any more work done than I was when I left at 5:30.

[ixtap]

It's sad how defeatist that article is. They point out that these high-stress careers destroy people's lives and health, but the tone of it is, "well, what can you do?" They even mention that people are tied to these lifestyles because that's what their social group does, as if it were impossible to resist peer pressure.

For whatever it's worth, I made a six-figure salary during my career and I didn't work crazy hours like these people did. I'm sure some of this pressure is real, depending on the industry. But some of it is self-imposed, too, because some people want to look like the hardest-working person around to impress their bosses.

I learned that early in my career. There were people in my department who routinely stayed in the office until 8 or 9 at night, but they weren't getting any more work done than I was when I left at 5:30.

DH's mentor is the first to say that DH pushes himself too hard. It isn't really to impress anyone; he works on personal projects the same way. And it has affected his health.

[Ron Scott]

Sounds like the author is blaming the world for his unhappiness.

We’re supposed to see people who push themselves to see how far they can go and how much they can achieve in a specific career as unwitting victums of a sick machine designed to torture them? That dog don’t hunt buddy.

I suppose the players in the NBA, MLB, NFL et al would have had more fulfilling lives being the high school gym teacher.

LOL

[Freedomin5]

I attended a top business school. The unspoken expectation was that you get into an investment bank, top consulting firm, a Big 4 accounting firm, or a Fortune 500 company as a "management-track trainee" (in that specific order of prestige). Most of my classmates went the route described in the article. I didn't.

I was expecting to read about salaries in the mid-six figures range in the article. I was a bit surprised to see that the consultants working themselves to death only make around $160K. I make a lot more than that working a lot fewer hours.

I guess most of the people who attend business school are trained to think within a very narrow box.

[GilesMM]

That last bit is particularly interesting because most journalists date the FIRE movement to around the Great Recession, even while citing predecessors from the 90s.

I knew people who retired in their 50s back in the 90s and 00s, but not in their 30/40s.

I know several who hit the jackpot in their 30s/40s in the 90s (tech and entertainment startups) and they sort of fired but just kept doing other interesting things full time - non profits, local retail, etc.

[ATtiny85]

That last bit is particularly interesting because most journalists date the FIRE movement to around the Great Recession, even while citing predecessors from the 90s.

I knew people who retired in their 50s back in the 90s and 00s, but not in their 30/40s.

I know several who hit the jackpot in their 30s/40s in the 90s (tech and entertainment startups) and they sort of fired but just kept doing other interesting things full time - non profits, local retail, etc.

“Welcome to Walmart, how can I help you?”

“No sorry, we don’t carry these diamond shoes”

[Laura33]

"I thought about leaving the industry, but the finances just aren't there elsewhere," he says. "Once you get to a certain salary, that's what you're worth – a big step down in salary just isn't feasible."

Where's the eye-roll emoji when I need it?  Everything is "feasible."  You're stuck only if you define "feasible" as "maintain exactly the same lifestyle."

I do appreciate the comments about friends, perception of worth, etc., though -- when you're raised to see XYZ job as "success," it is really hard to wrench yourself away from that and find a different mechanism of judging your own worth.  But "golden handcuffs" is about the money, not that other stuff.

My DH has the actual golden handcuffs.  Once you get to a certain level in his company, they give you options/stock grants with a 3-year vesting period -- and those grants make up probably about half his total comp.  So if he walks, he's forfeiting three years' of options that were given but haven't vested yet, and effectively giving up half his salary for the past three years.  It's a real incentive to hang on until a few years after they decide you're no longer worth future grants.  It's also a major disincentive to poaching from competitors, because anyone else would have to come up with a mid-six-figures "bonus" just to balance out the options/grants he'd lose.

Lucky for us, he likes playing with cool tech, even though the politics do annoy him on a regular basis.  No amount of money is worth hanging on to a job that makes you totally fucking miserable.

[rothwem]

I attended a top business school. The unspoken expectation was that you get into an investment bank, top consulting firm, a Big 4 accounting firm, or a Fortune 500 company as a "management-track trainee" (in that specific order of prestige). Most of my classmates went the route described in the article. I didn't.

I was expecting to read about salaries in the mid-six figures range in the article. I was a bit surprised to see that the consultants working themselves to death only make around $160K. I make a lot more than that working a lot fewer hours.

I guess most of the people who attend business school are trained to think within a very narrow box.

Enh, that was base salary. Lots of finance jobs have a relatively low base and the large portion of the comp is bonus income.

[Fomerly known as something]

I attended a top business school. The unspoken expectation was that you get into an investment bank, top consulting firm, a Big 4 accounting firm, or a Fortune 500 company as a "management-track trainee" (in that specific order of prestige). Most of my classmates went the route described in the article. I didn't.

I was expecting to read about salaries in the mid-six figures range in the article. I was a bit surprised to see that the consultants working themselves to death only make around $160K. I make a lot more than that working a lot fewer hours.

I guess most of the people who attend business school are trained to think within a very narrow box.

Enh, that was base salary. Lots of finance jobs have a relatively low base and the large portion of the comp is bonus income.

It was also pounds, and from what I understand salaries overall are less across the pond.

[Turtle]

"I thought about leaving the industry, but the finances just aren't there elsewhere," he says. "Once you get to a certain salary, that's what you're worth – a big step down in salary just isn't feasible."

Where's the eye-roll emoji when I need it?  Everything is "feasible."  You're stuck only if you define "feasible" as "maintain exactly the same lifestyle."

I do appreciate the comments about friends, perception of worth, etc., though -- when you're raised to see XYZ job as "success," it is really hard to wrench yourself away from that and find a different mechanism of judging your own worth.  But "golden handcuffs" is about the money, not that other stuff.

My DH has the actual golden handcuffs.  Once you get to a certain level in his company, they give you options/stock grants with a 3-year vesting period -- and those grants make up probably about half his total comp.  So if he walks, he's forfeiting three years' of options that were given but haven't vested yet, and effectively giving up half his salary for the past three years.  It's a real incentive to hang on until a few years after they decide you're no longer worth future grants.  It's also a major disincentive to poaching from competitors, because anyone else would have to come up with a mid-six-figures "bonus" just to balance out the options/grants he'd lose.

Lucky for us, he likes playing with cool tech, even though the politics do annoy him on a regular basis.  No amount of money is worth hanging on to a job that makes you totally fucking miserable.

My brother has that sort of golden handcuffs.  Mine are more bronze than golden, and easier to walk away from. Still planning to tie my leave date to an optimal date for maximization, same as my company's bean counters did when laying people off only a few days before annual bonus eligibility would have given them a bump on their way out the door.

[Laura33]

"I thought about leaving the industry, but the finances just aren't there elsewhere," he says. "Once you get to a certain salary, that's what you're worth – a big step down in salary just isn't feasible."

Where's the eye-roll emoji when I need it?  Everything is "feasible."  You're stuck only if you define "feasible" as "maintain exactly the same lifestyle."

I do appreciate the comments about friends, perception of worth, etc., though -- when you're raised to see XYZ job as "success," it is really hard to wrench yourself away from that and find a different mechanism of judging your own worth.  But "golden handcuffs" is about the money, not that other stuff.

My DH has the actual golden handcuffs.  Once you get to a certain level in his company, they give you options/stock grants with a 3-year vesting period -- and those grants make up probably about half his total comp.  So if he walks, he's forfeiting three years' of options that were given but haven't vested yet, and effectively giving up half his salary for the past three years.  It's a real incentive to hang on until a few years after they decide you're no longer worth future grants.  It's also a major disincentive to poaching from competitors, because anyone else would have to come up with a mid-six-figures "bonus" just to balance out the options/grants he'd lose.

Lucky for us, he likes playing with cool tech, even though the politics do annoy him on a regular basis.  No amount of money is worth hanging on to a job that makes you totally fucking miserable.

My brother has that sort of golden handcuffs.  Mine are more bronze than golden, and easier to walk away from. Still planning to tie my leave date to an optimal date for maximization, same as my company's bean counters did when laying people off only a few days before annual bonus eligibility would have given them a bump on their way out the door.

Yep.  Sauce for the goose and all.  Whenever DH does decide to hang it up, it will be the day after his prior grants vest and after that year's bonuses are announced.