Author Topic: Anyone started their own LLC (i.e., sans lawyers)?  (Read 4166 times)

dude

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Anyone started their own LLC (i.e., sans lawyers)?
« on: May 19, 2017, 09:05:25 AM »
I've seen many internet options like LegalZoom and others for doing this.  Just wondering if anyone has done it and how it worked out?

Laserjet3051

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Re: Anyone started their own LLC (i.e., sans lawyers)?
« Reply #1 on: May 19, 2017, 09:42:02 AM »
I paid my accountant to file for me since I was clueless at the time. In retrospect though, careful examination of the filing forms and requirements, it seems super easy in CA and I could have done it myself. In CA, your on the hook for $800 minimum each year irrespective of level of profitability, so its expensive (1.5% net income per year), but even considering the 1.5% drag, it was worth it for me over the past 7 years. Extra cost to file my fed/state corp taxes since I do not want to risk doing them  myself. Otherwise, a good deal for my consulting biz.

COEE

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Re: Anyone started their own LLC (i.e., sans lawyers)?
« Reply #2 on: May 19, 2017, 09:49:31 AM »
I'm going through these things as well over in the entrepreneurial sub-forum: https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/entrepreneurship/considering-starting-my-own-contracting-company/

Mostly posting to follow!

Mr. Green

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Re: Anyone started their own LLC (i.e., sans lawyers)?
« Reply #3 on: May 19, 2017, 10:19:02 AM »
What kind of LLC are you looking to create? A sole proprietorship or partnership is pretty simple and some states have made it extremely easy to do so. I'm familiar with both Maryland and North Carolina and both have websites run by the State government that allow you to file an Articles of Incorporation. They even provide the template for the form. You just pay the filing cost, and voila! You have a legit LLC recognized by the state. You can still do this with S Corps or C Corps but you'll need to have the number of shares being issued for the company and some other info at the time of filing. Some states have high yearly filing costs that may make the idea cost prohibitive unless you're really making some money. I created an LLC for real estate investment in North Carolina and the yearly filing cost is $200. It's essentially just a fee the State charges to create revenue. I think Maryland was less expensive but the property we were buying was in NC and an out-of-state LLC was more of a hassle for that purpose.
« Last Edit: May 19, 2017, 10:22:00 AM by Mr. Green »

trollwithamustache

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Re: Anyone started their own LLC (i.e., sans lawyers)?
« Reply #4 on: May 19, 2017, 11:11:47 AM »
How much time do you have?

I got the Nolo books and did all of this kind of stuff myself. But it takes some time and some careful reading. 

If you business is jamming and there is good business work or business development work you could be doing, then it may make sense to pay the accountant.

Salvo

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Re: Anyone started their own LLC (i.e., sans lawyers)?
« Reply #5 on: May 19, 2017, 11:51:18 AM »
I filed my own LLC in Ohio by going to their business gateway portal and paying the $250 LLC licensing fee.  Very simple.  This might be different in your state, but I would not pay any service to do the paperwork... there was very little information required (what type of business, primary product sold, etc) and I think it took a total of 30 minutes to setup.  I should add my own LLC is for online retail/sales, essentially selling things on eBay.  Setup will be different depending on the business.

khangaroo

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Re: Anyone started their own LLC (i.e., sans lawyers)?
« Reply #6 on: May 19, 2017, 12:08:48 PM »
It was a pretty simple process in Oregon since you can do it all electronically. I believe I signed up on the department of commerce website and then had to get an EIN for the LLC from the federal government then pay all the registration fees and BOOM! You got yourself an LLC.

I made an LLC and put my commercial property in there for liability purposes and protection of my personal assets. It was also pretty easy setting up a business checking account and everything too.

I'm fairly confident you can do it yourself, just make sure to get knowledgeable on your state's rules and regulations.

Bicycle_B

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Re: Anyone started their own LLC (i.e., sans lawyers)?
« Reply #7 on: May 19, 2017, 12:28:16 PM »
Yes.  Texas LLC filings can be completed online for $300.  The process can be learned via government websites.

No annual fees, but annual info and tax filings are needed.  If revenue is over $1 million, there is a franchise tax (business tax) to be calculated for the year; if revenue is under $1 million, you must state each year that revenue is less.


big_slacker

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Re: Anyone started their own LLC (i.e., sans lawyers)?
« Reply #8 on: May 19, 2017, 03:35:30 PM »
Yes, I have in the past using legalzoom.

I'm getting ready to do this again as I'm starting a consulting company with a good friend. Will read COEE's thread.

DoubleDown

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Re: Anyone started their own LLC (i.e., sans lawyers)?
« Reply #9 on: May 19, 2017, 05:54:50 PM »
I formed an LLC for a partnership by filling out the state forms and using some templates I found online for the required documents (Articles of Organization, Formation Agreement, Operating Agreement, Power of Attorney, etc.). It really was not complicated, no regrets on doing it on our own. Fortunately our LLC was never "tested" by being sued or anything, so I can only assume that it would have survived attempts to pierce the corporate veil and such.

Speaking of piercing the corporate veil, you probably already know all this already but be certain to open separate bank or credit accounts for your business and use only those, never your personal accounts. Don't do anything as yourself, always maintain sufficient arms-length separation. For example, ONLY pay expenses using the business checking account; keep meticulous records for everything; sign everything as "Dude, Managing Partner, The Dude LLC" not just as "Dude"; when you pay yourself do so as the corporate entity from the business accounts with records to document everything; and so on.

One drawback I discovered since I was operating a real estate investment partnership is that banks will not allow a new, small business to hold a mortgage. We had to put the property mortgages in our own names, which could have exposed us personally, to a degree, if something had gone horribly wrong. I know no way around this until you become a large enough, established business with tons of assets and capital and proven track record before the bank will be willing to issue a mortgage to the LLC.

Dexterous

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Re: Anyone started their own LLC (i.e., sans lawyers)?
« Reply #10 on: May 21, 2017, 10:05:04 AM »
It's extremely simple in Florida.  I happened to look it up this morning before seeing your post.  :)  It can be done online and costs about $160 there.

dude

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Re: Anyone started their own LLC (i.e., sans lawyers)?
« Reply #11 on: May 22, 2017, 08:34:43 AM »
Thanks, everyone, for the responses!  Just looking to start a sole proprietorship outdoor guide service, so figured it should be fairly simple.

BlueHouse

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Re: Anyone started their own LLC (i.e., sans lawyers)?
« Reply #12 on: May 22, 2017, 08:53:00 AM »
Yes, I used one of the online services when I started my s-corp. 

If I recall correctly, it was about $100, and I got a corporate stamp, notebook, share documents all in a pretty package. 

No regrets other than they charge me $80/year to keep them as my registered agent.  I could change to another company, but they all cost about the same and I am required to have one because I no longer have an office in the state I incorporated in. 

shawndoggy

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Re: Anyone started their own LLC (i.e., sans lawyers)?
« Reply #13 on: May 22, 2017, 11:20:12 AM »
As a lawyer who sets these things up, and helps people fix problems as they arise down the road, legalzoom is great for me from a job security perspective.  Every legalzoom entity I've seen has been universally f'd up.

For those of you who set up your own real estate LLCs, you did deed the property into the LLC too, right? (you'd be surprised how many people don't do this).

MaaS

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Re: Anyone started their own LLC (i.e., sans lawyers)?
« Reply #14 on: May 22, 2017, 12:46:10 PM »
I'm currently in the process of opening an S-corp for my consultancy.  It's just me, and the tax benefits (skip self-employment tax on 'distributions' after a reasonable salary) were appealing.  I'm working with an accountant rather than a LegalZoom, as they'll be handling my taxes (I'd rather focus on the work).

BlueHouse

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Re: Anyone started their own LLC (i.e., sans lawyers)?
« Reply #15 on: May 22, 2017, 02:07:24 PM »
I'm currently in the process of opening an S-corp for my consultancy.  It's just me, and the tax benefits (skip self-employment tax on 'distributions' after a reasonable salary) were appealing.  I'm working with an accountant rather than a LegalZoom, as they'll be handling my taxes (I'd rather focus on the work).
Good luck MaaS!  Becoming your own consultancy will open the doors for massive savings into tax-deferred savings.  I opened my s-corp about 7 years ago and it's been a HUGE boon to my march toward FIRE.  Exciting times!!!

nawhite

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Re: Anyone started their own LLC (i.e., sans lawyers)?
« Reply #16 on: May 22, 2017, 03:44:58 PM »
I guess I had the simplest experience yet. I set up a sole proprietor LLC in Colorado for the sole reason of getting an EIN so that I could get a "business" level account with Verizon because of a loophole they used to have about moving old accounts. (It has also been helpful for credit card churning as I'll never get denied for a business card for not having a "real" business). It cost $50 and about 30 minutes online to register an LLC in Colorado and another $50/year every year after that.

I have since decided to use it as an entity for letting people give me money for my hobbies. I technically have a separate checking account for the business and route hobby money through it. Affiliate fees from our blog, if I give someone a kayak lesson, if my wife teaches a yoga lesson, it all routes through the LLC. Not for liability protection, mostly just for tracking purchases and calling things "business expenses." We probably could have just set up a business account without the LLC but the EIN is nice for credit card churning and idk how to get one without an LLC or a Corp.

nara

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Re: Anyone started their own LLC (i.e., sans lawyers)?
« Reply #17 on: May 25, 2017, 12:04:26 PM »
I had started my LLC on my own without a lawyer. When we became an S-Corp, our accountant did all the paperwork for us.