Poll

What's your UK FIRE amount?

<£500k
44 (21.8%)
£500k-£750k
44 (21.8%)
£750k-£1m
51 (25.2%)
£1m-1.25m
20 (9.9%)
£1.25m-£1.5m
8 (4%)
£1.5m-£1.75m
10 (5%)
£1.75m-£2m
3 (1.5%)
£2m-2.5m
12 (5.9%)
£2.5m-£3.0m
2 (1%)
£3.0m-£4.0m
5 (2.5%)
£4.0m-£5.0m
1 (0.5%)
£5m+
2 (1%)

Total Members Voted: 201

Author Topic: What's your UK fire amount?  (Read 81544 times)

never give up

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #50 on: October 22, 2017, 06:02:25 AM »
I went for £750k to £1M. Enough to cover about £22k of expenses a year and a paid for house.

edgema

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #51 on: October 25, 2017, 02:18:07 AM »
One hand up as a family who have moved from London (ish) to Devon for a cost of living boost. All part of the plan to set up for FIRE as we got to sell and expensive house in a VHCOL and put a large chunk of this into investments.

Our number is at the high end versus most on here with FIRE on invested assets of about £2m. Fully aware that I am guilty of quite a bit of 'hedonic adaptation', although far less than most of our old friendship group caught in the commuter London 'white range rover' trap. However, I am super cautious and in a career I will not be able to continue in Devon or probably even come back to should FIRE not work out. We also have two young children who are expensive little tykes.

My date looking highly likely for next march, although I will assess at that point whether to fall for the 'one more year' syndrome. As others have commented, the late stage just before FIRE is an amazing one as you are probably at or near peak earning, yet you have put together investments which you are very nearly already able to live off, providing you with effectively another income. As such, another year of saving as you were + another income puts a 'lifetime best' into the pot and further insurance against whatever future life might throw at you.

If I do I won't beat myself up about it as it means retiring at 42 rather than 41 which is beyond the comprehension of most people who have not discovered this community.

It is also higher as I cannot quite see how people do all this travel so inexpensively in the FI community. The things I want to do with my family once I FIRE are just not cheap. To name a few, I want to RV around the US, sail in the Med, motorbike around South Aftrica (not with the family that one) and other such adventures which are just not cheap. Also, my Dad lives in the US and family flights to see him are c£2k at the best of times. All these budgets with people living off £20k a year seem very unreachable when I know I want to spend sometimes half that a year (not every year) on travel alone. Incredible respect for those that do.







 

bownyboy

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #52 on: October 27, 2017, 01:17:33 AM »
Weíre currently at £440k with £79k remaining on mortgage. Target is to have £600k in investments for a £2k a month withdrawal.

Plan is to finish doing up the house and then look at getting consent to let as round here a typically 3 bed semi can rent for £2k to £2.5k per month.

We will then move on a LCOL area near the sea like Devon, Cornwal where you can easily rent a 3 bed house for £1k a month.


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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #53 on: November 04, 2017, 01:00:45 AM »
Interesting post!

My current plan is to create a reasonable passive income from rental properties and other investments.

In my current situation (31 and single) I'd probably have a go at throwing it all in with a passive income of anything more than £3k a month.

skip207

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #54 on: November 05, 2017, 12:55:41 PM »
That would do me nicely.  Just a case of trying to get there as quickly as possible.  As it stands right now I hope to get there in about 3-4 years.

PhilB

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #55 on: November 23, 2017, 11:27:55 AM »
My numbers are a bit embarrassingly high - we should be going into FIRE in 2019 with a little over £2M, including a £600k paid off house.  I freely admit that this is excessive.  Our kids are currently 12 and 14 so that includes their running costs for a few years including Uni and help with house deposits.  Over the period between 10 and 14 years after we retire we have about £20k pa of DB schemes coming on line and 2 SPs of £8.3k and realistically that should be plenty when there are just the 2 of us (it would just about cover what we spend now as a family of 4) , but my basic thinking re budgets is:
-£1k per month for bills (should be plenty)
-£1k per month for living expenses (again generous)
-£1k per month for having fun (lots of holidays)
-£1k per month just in case (and now I'm getting frankly ridiculous)
I would have had the first 3 in place if I'd gone at 50 but as we are in the snowball phase it seemed worthwhile to do 3 extra years to get that fourth £1k per month.  I really can't see me spending it - other than during the years when the kids are at Uni - but it should make the other £3k absolutely bomb proof and stop me from fretting.

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #56 on: November 23, 2017, 11:59:09 AM »
Crumbs you should be ok there PhilB, congrats! Can I ask what the difference is between bills and living expenses?

PhilB

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #57 on: November 23, 2017, 02:39:48 PM »
They are very rough and ready categories, but in my mind 'Bills' is recurring things like council tax, home maintenance, insurance, utilities, MOT's, servicing, etc..  Basically fixed costs that don't change much whatever I actually do.  Living expenses is food and drink, other groceries, petrol, children's activities and all the other items that keep turning up on the credit card statement.  It's not an exact science by any means - just a way of persuading myself that I have enough and don't need to worry.

worms

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #58 on: November 29, 2017, 12:50:07 AM »
Interesting thread.  I live a modest life with few luxuries, but reckon the sum is £850k not counting house value. It is often said that the 4% drawdown ďruleĒ is over ambitious for UK, so my planning is based on a 3% figure.

Some of the cost estimates above seem really low to me and I would be wary of pinning too much hope of cost reductions by moving out to the quaintly termed ďarse endĒ.  Living and working in such an area, it is noticeable that although houses are cheaper to buy, non-mortgage housing costs are possibly not much lower.  While insurance should be lower this is more than offset by much higher heating costs if you are not on the gas grid and donít live in balmy southern climes.  Electricity costs are higher too, as (without gas) you canít get a dual-fuel tariff.  Motoring costs are also much higher, due to the combination of greater car dependency, much higher annual mileages and higher fuel prices.

For comparison with the figures given above, my mortgage-free housing costs (not including maintenance or improvement) are about £5,800 and my total car costs including depreciation are also about £5,800 (£4,600 excluding depreciation).  So these two items alone require somewhere between £290k and £387k in FIRE sum.

cerat0n1a

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #59 on: November 29, 2017, 01:50:34 AM »
Interesting thread.  I live a modest life with few luxuries, but reckon the sum is £850k not counting house value. It is often said that the 4% drawdown ďruleĒ is over ambitious for UK, so my planning is based on a 3% figure.

I question this assertion every time it's posted. There's no compelling reason to invest your money in the UK rather than the whole world, so, other than currency risk, why would the drawdown rate be different here?

Quote
For comparison with the figures given above, my mortgage-free housing costs (not including maintenance or improvement) are about £5,800 and my total car costs including depreciation are also about £5,800 (£4,600 excluding depreciation).  So these two items alone require somewhere between £290k and £387k in FIRE sum.

Can you elaborate on this a bit? Both those figures seem high to me and we live in a stupidly large house in a rural area. What housing costs are you including if you exclude maintenance & improvement - insurance, council tax, electricity, water, what else?

What sort of mileage are you doing to spend that amount per year on transport? I drive about 10 000 miles per year currently and a quick check of the spreadsheet says the cost of petrol + insurance + tax + maintenance comes to less than £4k for 3 years of driving.

worms

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #60 on: November 29, 2017, 02:27:05 AM »
You may be correct about the 4% versus 3% question, but I am quite conservative in my approach to financial projections.  I am not necessarily qualified to enter the debate on what is a reasonable rate to plan on, but since there is a debate on it amongst those more knowledgeable than me, I will ďhope for the best, plan for the worstĒ.

My house is a wee three-bed rural cottage about 150 years old.  Rural means different things To different people.  I would not class this place as remote - about ten miles to the nearest shop. But I am possibly 5 degrees of latitude north of you and that probably makes a difference to heating costs.  I appreciate that Cambridge-shire can be cold, but your heating season is possibly shorter.  House costs are: Council tax, £2150; Electricity £996; oil £2100; insurance £550.

Car costs are for 24,000 miles.  That will fall once retired, but I am not betting on it being less than 18,000.  Costs for budget purposes are: tax £200; insurance £400; servicing £800; depreciation £1200; fuel £3,200 (roughly 40mpg at £1.20/litre).

cerat0n1a

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #61 on: November 29, 2017, 03:55:30 AM »
I would not class this place as remote - about ten miles to the nearest shop.

Can't be many (if any) places in England that are 10 miles from a shop? Perhaps also true for Norn Ireland and maybe even Wales? So I think most people would class that as remote. My parents live about 3 miles walk to a bus stop to catch a bus that travels 3 miles into a place with a shop and doctors and I suspect that's about as isolated as it gets in England. Possibly there are farmhouses in the Forest of Bowland or Northumberland that would be 10 miles, but I reckon even in the national parks you'd struggle to find somewhere. I think 7 miles is the furthest you can get from a road on land in England, but not many people live in the middle of Kielder Forest.

Quote
I appreciate that Cambridge-shire can be cold, but your heating season is possibly shorter.

Think I have posted elsewhere that there have been days in June, July & August in previous years when my wife has had the heating on. But yes, people I know with oil heating round here are not spending anything like £2k per year. Delivery costs are quite a factor with heating oil, so I suspect your location comes into play there too.

Quote
fuel £3,200 (roughly 40mpg at £1.20/litre).

I guess that's the part I wasn't getting - you're driving more than 3 times the average amount, not surprising that you're spending more than 3 times as much (Govt reckons the average car does 7800 miles per year.) No scope for a more fuel efficient vehicle?

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #62 on: November 29, 2017, 10:35:17 AM »
Quote
not many people live in the middle of Kielder forest

I think my uncle did for a while. He was something to do with red squirrel conservation. Slightly odd man, but one of those people who really seems to have done his life right in doing whatever the heck he wanted. Worked in outdoor/conservationy things and then retired and now watches birds at home and goes on outdoorsy holidays all over the world. Went trekking in the lower Himalayas at 70. He's had his fair share of troubles (multiple divorces) but I can't help but admire his general life pattern.

skip207

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #63 on: November 29, 2017, 12:25:16 PM »
You don't have to buy a shack in the middle of nowhere to get a cheap FIRE property.  Massive swathes of the north of England are very cheap and you can still get access to good services, entertainment, hospitals etc. 

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #64 on: November 29, 2017, 12:37:18 PM »
Quote
not many people live in the middle of Kielder forest

I think my uncle did for a while. He was something to do with red squirrel conservation. Slightly odd man, but one of those people who really seems to have done his life right in doing whatever the heck he wanted. Worked in outdoor/conservationy things and then retired and now watches birds at home and goes on outdoorsy holidays all over the world. Went trekking in the lower Himalayas at 70. He's had his fair share of troubles (multiple divorces) but I can't help but admire his general life pattern.

Me too, I always admire these people who know what they want, and make it happen, even if the rest of the world thinks they are a bit mad. Hell I aspire to be one of these people.



I would not class this place as remote - about ten miles to the nearest shop.

Can't be many (if any) places in England that are 10 miles from a shop? Perhaps also true for Norn Ireland and maybe even Wales? So I think most people would class that as remote. My parents live about 3 miles walk to a bus stop to catch a bus that travels 3 miles into a place with a shop and doctors and I suspect that's about as isolated as it gets in England. Possibly there are farmhouses in the Forest of Bowland or Northumberland that would be 10 miles, but I reckon even in the national parks you'd struggle to find somewhere. I think 7 miles is the furthest you can get from a road on land in England, but not many people live in the middle of Kielder Forest.

Quote
I appreciate that Cambridge-shire can be cold, but your heating season is possibly shorter.

Think I have posted elsewhere that there have been days in June, July & August in previous years when my wife has had the heating on. But yes, people I know with oil heating round here are not spending anything like £2k per year. Delivery costs are quite a factor with heating oil, so I suspect your location comes into play there too.


Yeah, I'd call my mum's place remote, it's probably about 5 miles to the nearest shop by road (much less as the crow flies).

And those car costs are high, I've always maintained living in London is actually reasonable if you have housing taken care of...... and public transport is reliable and reasonably priced.

And the oil....what temperature are you heating the house to?

skip207

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #65 on: November 29, 2017, 01:36:27 PM »
My wife and I do about 7000 miles PA combined!
Car costs in my FIRE budget is £2400 PA. Just an estimate at this stage but hopefully not that far off.



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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #66 on: November 29, 2017, 03:53:37 PM »
In case it's of any use to anyone using heating oil...

...either find a local bulk buying group for discounts or...

...fueltool.co.uk will give you a price comparison (no affiliation, just a satisfied customer; their delivery times have been quicker than stated too)

We go through about £1000 a year for rural 3 bedroomed 100 y.o. cottage, though we have underfloor heating which gives excellent bang for buck (but it's expensive to fit unless you have to have the floors up anyway, as we did)

worms

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #67 on: November 29, 2017, 11:47:20 PM »
Sorry to spoil peopleís image of me living in a hut in the forest or on top of a mountain!  My house is in the middle of a village with a couple of hundred other folk and on the Scottish Governmentís Urban/Rural classification we are ďaccessible ruralĒ.  Ten miles from village to Village is quite common here and is perhaps the natural historic settlement pattern - a morningís walk from one place to the next.  In common with most parts of the country, village shops are closing at an alarming rate, leaving many villages with no retail outlet and a concentration in the larger settlements. So ten miles to the shop is not that unusual.

Household energy costs are higher for a number of reasons around here, and average annual costs per household are said to be £1,000 a year higher than the average further south - that figure would probably work for me. 50% of Highland households are estimated to be in fuel poverty (defined as spending more than 10% of income on heating costs).  I am one of the lucky ones that is nowhere near the fuel poverty level.  The house could be better insulated and is certainly not kept at the warmer end of the scale!

Iíve not been on a plane for a number of years and my 24,000 miles includes holidays, so I have a transfer of costs that others might have in a different category in their budgeting.

Please donít think I am in any way complaining about the costs, I am simply making sure that I plan and budget realistically.  In some of our communities, about a third of the population is made up of people retiring and down-sizing from the south - some of these may have made a mistake by having unrealistic expectations of the costs, and once you have down-sized itís difficult to move back!

The Cardinal

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #68 on: November 30, 2017, 07:26:02 AM »
I'm looking to have £460k in today's terms by the time I'm 50.  I'm currently 37 with a decent start on that sum and the end of the mortgage within sight. 

£460k is the sum I calculate is needed to cover the 10 years from 2030-40 (when my first pension starts) and then partially from 2040-48 (when my second and state pensions start).  £610k is the sum I'd need were I to aim for age 45. 

I've assumed 3% inflation and no job promotions.  If there are any upsides in the intervening years, I will aim to bring forward the date. 

PhilB

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #69 on: December 01, 2017, 03:22:15 AM »
The house could be better insulated...
I was going to ask about that as even with your climate and higher oil costs that seems a crazy amount.  Upping the insulation, if possible, could have a really big return on investment.  When we rebuilt our house we greatly improved the insulation and the impact on our running costs was dramatic.  They've dropped even lower since I put a wood burner in to provide most of our daytime heating ;0)

cerat0n1a

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #70 on: December 01, 2017, 04:18:07 AM »

Please donít think I am in any way complaining about the costs, I am simply making sure that I plan and budget realistically.  In some of our communities, about a third of the population is made up of people retiring and down-sizing from the south - some of these may have made a mistake by having unrealistic expectations of the costs, and once you have down-sized itís difficult to move back!

Interesting post, thank you. Hadn't really appreciated that there were reasonable numbers of English retirees in the highlands. Highlands, Orkney, Western Isles often feature in those "happiest places in Britain" lists - hardly the image of the dour Scot :-)

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #71 on: December 01, 2017, 08:04:13 AM »
I'm really excited to hear that some of the UK forum members are within sight of their goal. I'll be so interested to hear how it works out for them post-FIRE - both in financial/logistical terms and in emotional/mental terms. I know FIRE is FIRE whatever side of the Atlantic you're on, but it seems like there must be some differences.

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #72 on: December 01, 2017, 08:54:38 AM »
I'm really excited to hear that some of the UK forum members are within sight of their goal. I'll be so interested to hear how it works out for them post-FIRE - both in financial/logistical terms and in emotional/mental terms. I know FIRE is FIRE whatever side of the Atlantic you're on, but it seems like there must be some differences.
I don't think there's any doubt that the biggest difference is the NHS and the fact that UK retirees don't need to factor in colossal sums for health insurance.  I have a chronic condition and used to hang out on a US forum for people with the same disease.  Most US people were more worried about how on earth they would be able to afford the drugs than they were about the prospect of dying if the drugs didn't work.  A lot of Brits are unaware just how lucky we are to have it and I'd say it more than offsets our higher house prices.

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #73 on: December 03, 2017, 08:08:39 AM »
I agree completely about the good old NHS being a major boon to us here in the UK.  Some of the stories your hear or read about from the USA are terrifying - people's insurance not being enough to cover the treatment they need and the like.  Our system may creak at the the edges a bit, bit it's always there if you really need it. 

Another difference possibly is that our state pension is pretty much guaranteed, as long as you have enough National Insurance contributions years.  The US social security system - which I don't pretend to understand - seems more variable.

I've also read quite a lot of threads where our American friends talk about selling up in retirement to move to a lower cost of living area, often another state or across the country somewhere.  We often talk about downsizing, but we usually mean selling our family houses and buying something smaller and cheaper relatively locally I think. 

(Mrs PD and I, btw, are planning to retire next April!)

Manchester

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #74 on: December 04, 2017, 04:58:00 AM »
I think £900,000 should be more than enough for me.  That would give me £27,000/£36,000 per year. 

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #75 on: December 04, 2017, 07:59:57 AM »
I've put 750-1m (for a couple) but I've never made a serious attempt to estimate this because cost of living is so dependent on where I end up. Currently living in Switzerland though intending to come back to the UK at some point (probably). Don't think I could afford to retire in Switzerland much before normal retirement age but it's a long way off so not given it much thought.

Currently net worth is about 420k (again couple) so probably not worth worrying about it for a good few years. I'm 34 at the moment. My plan is to keep my head down save as much as possible and see where I've got to at 40 and come up with a plan then.

Agreed on the NHS making a massive difference. Here we pay a total of 550 GBP a month just for the lowest level of health insurance. It's our single largest expense after rent. And that only covers 90% of the final cost of treatment so if you have very expensive care you could still see life changing costs.

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #76 on: December 04, 2017, 02:21:45 PM »
Yeah the healthcare difference would appear to be the largest I can see from my time on the boards. Out of interest though does anyone have private healthcare as a consideration as part of their FIRE amount? I donít myself.

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #77 on: December 04, 2017, 02:36:39 PM »
Yeah the healthcare difference would appear to be the largest I can see from my time on the boards. Out of interest though does anyone have private healthcare as a consideration as part of their FIRE amount? I donít myself.
We're going to move from the UK to the Med as part of my FIRE.  Still deciding on Spain or Cyprus.  In Spain we'll have to be private for the first year and then we can decide whether to voluntarily pay into the State System or stay with private.  In Cyprus we'll have to be private for a loooong time (providing Brexit doesn't further mess it up making it forever).  That said Cyprus is working on a type of NHS which under current proposals would let us pay into the State System once we became a Permanent Residents.

So yes, private healthcare is very much a consideration in this household.

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #78 on: December 05, 2017, 03:04:55 AM »
I find the whole private health insurance question very tricky to get my head around.  I currently get it for 'free' through my employer, although pay about £1kin tax and NI on that.  I don't plan to continue with it in retirement and so part of me feels that I really should opt out now to save that £1k, but somehow I can't bring myself to do so.

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #79 on: December 05, 2017, 10:10:38 AM »
RIT - yes I can see if youíre not going to live in the UK then itís very much a factor. Iím sure if you are as thorough as you are on your website, youíll have the best approach tied down.

PhilB - yes this is my situation too. The fact that I canít bring myself to opt out is what is making me think should I be doing anything to factor this in for post FIRE.

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #80 on: December 08, 2017, 09:46:11 PM »
Out of interest though does anyone have private healthcare as a consideration as part of their FIRE amount? I donít myself.

I do. Not private health insurance, but the "contingencies" section of my retirement planning includes being able to self-fund cataract surgery and joint replacements if NHS provision is scaled back as threatened, as well as dental implants, of which my husband has already needed one.

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #81 on: December 09, 2017, 12:42:30 AM »
Out of interest though does anyone have private healthcare as a consideration as part of their FIRE amount? I donít myself.

I do. Not private health insurance, but the "contingencies" section of my retirement planning includes being able to self-fund cataract surgery and joint replacements if NHS provision is scaled back as threatened, as well as dental implants, of which my husband has already needed one.

This is similar to me. At my stage of life and health private health insurance seems poor value for money. I looked into my work policy (sounds similar to @PhilB and @never give up), and I could get cover for less than the tax and NI I'd pay for the "free" cover. I wouldn't spend the money on health insurance if it wasn't the default, so I opted out of it.

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #82 on: December 09, 2017, 12:56:48 AM »
I love how thorough you are with everything Playing. You really set a great example for doing proper research and making good decisions.

Over 12% of votes on the poll that started this thread have target numbers of over £2m. That seemed like a lot to me and therefore I wondered if health care considerations were part of the number.

We are very lucky to have the NHS but I do wonder if TartanTallulah and Playing have it right here, and an allocation of some funds to cover some self funding of treatments may be a sensible way forward.

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #83 on: December 10, 2017, 04:18:22 AM »

Over 12% of votes on the poll that started this thread have target numbers of over £2m. That seemed like a lot to me and therefore I wondered if health care considerations were part of the number.


Not specifically, but I do worry about social care in old age, so have planned and budgeted for that, also I donít expect there to be a state pension in 30 years time so Iím planning for a higher net worth to protect against that

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #84 on: December 10, 2017, 09:57:31 AM »
Thatís interesting Monkeytennis. Is it ok to ask how you have budgeted for social care? I.e. what calculations and thoughts went into this. I wouldnít have thought it was easy to arrive at a number.

Monkeytennis

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #85 on: December 10, 2017, 03:35:37 PM »
Thatís interesting Monkeytennis. Is it ok to ask how you have budgeted for social care? I.e. what calculations and thoughts went into this. I wouldnít have thought it was easy to arrive at a number.

Totally not in a scientific way, my dad has the same number budgeted for his or my mums social care costs, so Iíve allocated the same which is based on a worst case scenario of each (my wife and I) needing 5 years of social and nursing care but not wanting to sell their home (as the other person may be in it and still incurring costs).

never give up

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #86 on: December 10, 2017, 09:26:01 PM »
I see. Thatís interesting, thanks.

poppydog

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #87 on: December 14, 2017, 04:40:08 AM »
Out of interest though does anyone have private healthcare as a consideration as part of their FIRE amount? I donít myself.

I do. Not private health insurance, but the "contingencies" section of my retirement planning includes being able to self-fund cataract surgery and joint replacements if NHS provision is scaled back as threatened, as well as dental implants, of which my husband has already needed one.

OMG - dental implants!  Both me and Mrs PD have been through this. Now I know why you never see a poor dentist!

As for private medical insurance, I have it currently via my employer, but when I retire next year I will lose it. Iíve looked into the cost of continuing it but itís very expensive and so will self-insure if needed for more minor stuff, and trust to the NHS for major treatment.

cerat0n1a

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #88 on: December 14, 2017, 05:30:57 AM »
OMG - dental implants!  Both me and Mrs PD have been through this. Now I know why you never see a poor dentist!

I'm in the middle of this at the moment - five figure amount - seriously considered going to Eastern Europe to have it done. All stemming from being hit by a car while crossing the road nearly 30 years ago. My employer is contributing nearly half of the cost. The dentist is classic Mr. Spendypants, he's had a different rolex every time I have seen him, marble & fountains in the waiting room.

BookLoverL

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #89 on: January 13, 2018, 09:06:48 AM »
I haven't calculated the specific amount yet, since my currently variable and unknown income makes it hard to estimate how many years I'll need to fund. Still:

I'm in the north, so I expect that when I'm ready, I should be able to get a house in a not-terrible area for somewhere between £100,000 and £300,000. Maybe £400,000 if I'm really being picky.

Right now, my yearly costs are below £5000, but the bills are pretty much being subsidised by my parents. Still, I'm pretty sure that even living on my own, I'd be able to keep costs below £10000 (ignoring inflation). Ideally, I'd like to keep them even lower than this, but I'll use £10000 as the figure.

I'm 24. Let's be incredibly optimistic and assume I live to 100, because that way I'll have calculated for too much money, rather than too little. Also, I'm ignoring the state pension, because who knows if that'll still exist when I'm old.

Withdrawal RateBase Stache SizeWith £100,000 houseWith £400,000 house
4% at £10,000 a year£250,000£350,000£650,000
3%£333,333.33£433,333.33£733,333.33
2%£500,000£600,000£900,000
1%£1,000,000£1,100,000£1,400,000
4% at £8,000 a year£200,000£300,000£600,000
3%£266,666.67£366,666.67£666,666.67
4% at £7,000 a year£175,000£275,000£575,000
3%£233,333.33£333,333.33£633,333.33

I'm probably going to aim for one of the lower values in this table, because I don't really want to work for long enough to earn the higher values, to be honest, even self-employed. Unless, of course, I have a great entrepreneurial idea or write a bestselling novel and somehow increase my earnings by a lot.

skip207

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #90 on: January 13, 2018, 03:05:22 PM »
Unless something very strange happens globally you don't need to go under 3% SWR.

3% is considered very, very safe.  To the point of almost being too safe.  If you want to be safer than 4% but still have best return 3.5% is the best number.

If you go with a SWR that is too low you might be tempted to increase the WR later on which could expose you to much higher chance of failure.



BookLoverL

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #91 on: January 13, 2018, 04:01:18 PM »
Well, as I said, I'm pretty sure I don't have the patience on this matter to save up for a higher than 3% WR anyway. ;)

highlandterrier

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #92 on: July 06, 2019, 03:24:04 AM »
Just found this thread, my goal translates to

Total FIRE: £1.71m @ 48 yrs (for a couple)
Workplace DB Pensions: £760k
SIPPs: £180k
ISA & GIA's: £360k
Cash : £90k
Property : £320k

Real aim is to allow for £30K per year expenditure, current spend is about £25K so can drop to that if times are tough.

KathrinS

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #93 on: July 07, 2019, 11:22:41 AM »
My goal is £300 000 for a basic income of £800-1000 pm. Should be achievable in 10 years (age 35-36). 
However, since I do not currently own a house, I will probably keep working 10-15 hrs/week at that point, which could cover most of my living expenses and allow the passive income to grow further. That would still mean having 4-5 days to myself and would also allow me to keep doing work I enjoy - just not 10-12 hours, 5 days a week!

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #94 on: July 11, 2019, 05:26:28 AM »
Such a very interesting read - especially how everyone is so different.  And can I just say how nice it is that no one is judgy on this board?  Just seems everyone is super enthusiastic for each other.

We are aiming for 1.6 plus our (paid for) house which is worth about £400,000 give or take.   We currently have 1.3, with most of that held in our business.  No real pension to speak of.   We are 57 and 52 and as our business is going very well we are probably within aim of our goal in the next 12 months.

When I look at our figure I do believe it is really high.  But our situation is slightly complicated by 3 grown up children who live in London, Hong Kong and New Zealand.  I decided long ago that relationships trump things every time so my OH and I have one very small car, a small house and we wear a 'uniform' of old jeans and t-shirts :).  This has enabled us to see our kids on a regular basis. 

To further complicate it all our one in New Zealand has a severe mental illness so a lot of the figure above is factoring in leaving him and his sisters with enough so he can be taken care of financially (so his sisters can just enjoy him).

Another complication is we have fallen in love with sailing...lol. 

I don't fly to London anymore and am limiting my flights to Hong Kong and NZ only (which is still awful, I know... but this topic is perhaps for another thread, or another forum altogether....)

A grateful shout out to the healthcare system in the UK, Canada and New Zealand where my family all hails from.  We are indeed blessed.


--Clodagh







londonbanker

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #95 on: July 12, 2019, 12:56:37 PM »
How long is a piece of string... whether you want to retire in a remote part of Scotland or in central London, the number would vary wildly.
My number is north of £3m as I live within the M25 and want to have £2.5-3m invested on top of a house paid for.

PhilB

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #96 on: August 05, 2019, 03:10:44 AM »
My numbers are a bit embarrassingly high - we should be going into FIRE in 2019 with a little over £2M, including a £600k paid off house.  I freely admit that this is excessive.  Our kids are currently 12 and 14 so that includes their running costs for a few years including Uni and help with house deposits.  Over the period between 10 and 14 years after we retire we have about £20k pa of DB schemes coming on line and 2 SPs of £8.3k and realistically that should be plenty when there are just the 2 of us (it would just about cover what we spend now as a family of 4) , but my basic thinking re budgets is:
-£1k per month for bills (should be plenty)
-£1k per month for living expenses (again generous)
-£1k per month for having fun (lots of holidays)
-£1k per month just in case (and now I'm getting frankly ridiculous)
I would have had the first 3 in place if I'd gone at 50 but as we are in the snowball phase it seemed worthwhile to do 3 extra years to get that fourth £1k per month.  I really can't see me spending it - other than during the years when the kids are at Uni - but it should make the other £3k absolutely bomb proof and stop me from fretting.
It was interesting re-reading this old thread when it came back to life.  We actually pulled the plug in Oct 2018, but I've stayed on one day a week, term time only and will keep that up until next July as it fits in well with having kids still at school.  Those part time earnings have been enough to get me to the planned £4k per month target.  Actual spending (including lots of holidays) is closer to £3k per month, but psychologically I'm much happier with the thought of coming in well under budget almost every month.  We could cut back if the markets completely tank, but at the moment I'm enjoying living the high life - I even managed to bring myself to spend Ä3.60 on some gratons de canard last week - think pork scratchings made from duck instead -without feeling guilty about the extravagance!

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #97 on: August 07, 2019, 09:25:32 AM »
Phil, massive congrats. That sounds like a great setup work wise.

I would love to know more about your fun budget. How do you get to £1k/month of fun spending while still feeling funny about £3 nibbles Ė what amazing fun *is* it going on with the other £997?! Or is it that your bills and expenses are still higher than £2k since the kiddos are about.

PhilB

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #98 on: August 08, 2019, 01:39:56 AM »
In a word, holidays.  Since pulling the plug we have had the following holdays in rented cottages / gites
  • A week in Pembrokeshire in Oct
  • A week in Herefordshire in Feb
  • Two weeks in Snowdonia at Easter
  • A week in Shropshire in May
  • Five and a bit weeks in France and Spain over the summer holidays (part way through)
That's about £7k plus fuel and activities.  Then there are some additional trips with school for the kids. 

The most interesting thing about the whole budgeting process for me has definitely been trying to work out how my mind works.  For a while I was using some very conservative assumptions and safety margins to give me a budget somewhere around what I actually expect to be spending.  I have been much happier since moving some of that safety margin into a higher budget which I then effortlessly underspend - and have therefore found it much easier to blow huge sums like Ä3.60 on frivolities knowing that they really don't move the needle at all.

sea_saw

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Re: What's your UK fire amount?
« Reply #99 on: August 08, 2019, 04:35:41 AM »
That sounds so lovely :) what an amazing difference from scraping together the odd week.

It's interesting what you say about the psychology of budgeting. I found when I didn't have a budget I was much more cautious about spending because I didn't know whether something was actually okay or not. When I added a budget my spending didn't really change but my confidence about it did.

Right now the tension for me is between spending and saving, so my budget is set such that it's generally right on the nose and the surplus gets whisked away to savings. If I had a big margin it would feel like a wasted opportunity to save. But I can imagine that if I was spending my savings I would want to feel like I was coming in safely under budget.

Brainz, what are they like!