Author Topic: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England  (Read 7531 times)

Jacinle

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 147
Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« on: February 27, 2022, 03:01:26 AM »
TDLR:
- a foreigner trying to buy a house but fail
- house price increase
- looking for words of wisdom and comfort and idea
- please be gentle on a stressed out person
- wish I knew how complicated the process was - the chain

The idea of relocation has been hatching for a long time, and the original plan was to move in Summer 2020.  Unfortunately covid hit and we decided to hold back the plan and moved in Spring 2021.
The idea is to buy a house/home within a year so we could minimise our expense and work towards our FI goal, and I need security in my home, never rented.

As my previous thread (https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/uk-tax-discussion/house-that-didn't-sell()-touch-or-no-touch/) mentioned, we saw house 1 right after we landed but I am a bit uncertain to commit, as I want more time to explore the area, dear husband want to buy right away.

House 1 is a long/narrow terrace victorian, turn key, chain-free and vacant property.  Initially I thought it was not in catchment area of secondary schools but I was wrong.  We saw this right after we landed and then it was sold.  One day after my offer is accepted for house 2, house 1 is back to market.  I passed this given I don't like the long proportion of the house, and I just got my offer accepted. In hindsight, it should be the easiest and stress free buying that I should have plunged into?

House 2 is a perfect match, in a cul del sac location, convenient to tube/school/park/town, 100% to get into the secondary school.  I like the 1930 semi layout, driveway, side access.  We will need a loft extension.  I was a bit worried about getting into a chain.  EA-B said every house is in a chain.  I was sold the idea that the vendor wanted to move to a daugther who is ill.  We had our offer accepted and with the memo of sale in hand, we are happily waiting for the chain to complete and imagining we would move in.  Every time I walked past I was painting a future of my family in it.

House 3 is an Edwardian, requires some refresh/updates on decor/kitchen/bathroom and owner is moving to a new built.  House 3 came up on week 5 after our acceptance on House 2.  It matches most of our criteria except not in walking distance of primary school but closer to town/tube.  I was thinking about of making an offer but with news about house 2 owner actively looking and making offer (not accepted though) for their onward purchase, I felt bad (unethical) about pulling out of an offer, I decided to wait for house 2, and here my agony begins.

After the news on week 5 that the owner is actively looking and have offers/several viewings booked, they have then gone radio silence.  In the meantime, house 1 and 3 went under offer and sold quickly, all went under asking price (I knew as they are completed and the EA-K told me the prices).

With the summer coming to an end, so does the supply of houses.  EA-B has been radio silence and I kept pressing over email and just got one - my vendor still looking.

Fast forward to Jan 2022, 3 new chain-free houses came on the market.  They, in my opinion, are not as good as the previous 3 and the asking price are much higher than before.  They are all sold above asking significantly.  I was interested in 1 but put in offer in all 3 to gather some intelligence.  I believe that the competition is coming from my fellow Hongkonger who also, like us, relocated very recently to the area. 

After losing the triplets , ah, sorry, the 3 houses that came on Jan in the market.  I have gone a bit crazy and decided to offer on a house that I would not offer on before, as it does not have a driveway but a on street very full parking.  We were told the owner relocating up north to live closer to family and has a temp place to move into.  Now after the survey is done, the EA told me the owner is buying a chain free probate property so I suddenly end up in a chain, albeit hopefully a moving complete chain.  House 4 is a Terrace Edwardian property and the only one 'left'.  It was slightly above our original budget but given the owner has rewired, replastered, loft extension around 10 years back, and repaint very recently(for the sale???), we believe we could move in without any other major work required.  I have 'doubt' about whether this house would work for us, but on the other hand, I am in constant fear of being priced out further.

In the 0.5 miles radius that I am searching, there's no other suitable house available at the moment, so no houses for me to jump from one fire to the other.

I felt I ruined my FI goals given my 'perfect' house search and lack of comprehension of need to move fast when prices are rising, and getting into a chain.  I am from a country where offer is legally bindings and even I know here it isn't legally binding until exchange, I have a hard time understanding the risks involved.  The original idea was the buy would be a long term, like 10+ years plan, as we understand selling a house here is very difficult as well (not in this market though).
Where we came from, it would be so easy to sell if we didn't like the house and incur quite minimal costs, the biggest would be stamp duty.


On the other hand, looking back it is a very aggressive goal to buy within a year here, and we should have made chain free/complete chain as a criteria in house search, but as in house 4, this seems to be quite elusive even after we added the criteria. 

The news of other fellow hker immigrants moving into their new homes, did make me felt like a failure.

The saying here goes, it isn't meant to be.

Thank you for reading,
Again, looking forward to hear the MMM words of wisdom, encouragement and hope.


J




SpreadsheetMan

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 428
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #1 on: February 27, 2022, 06:09:16 AM »
My sympathies. It is very easy to sell a house in the UK at the moment, but really hard to find one to buy.

Manchester

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 405
  • Location: UK
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #2 on: February 28, 2022, 07:29:27 AM »
Why are you so keen to get into the catchment area of a particular school?  Do you have a child who is close to admission age or are you planning for the future? 

If you have a child that is close to school age, why not rent within the catchment area with the plan to move out once your child is already in the school? 

If you don't have a child, broaden your search area away from the catchment area. 

Otherwise, just wait for the right opportunity and it will come up eventually.


House buying on the whole is very stressful. 

vand

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2302
  • Location: UK
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #3 on: February 28, 2022, 08:13:39 AM »
The truth is that homebuying is always a compromise on many fronts. You will never find the perfect property that ticks all the boxes you want, at the price you want, and the less flexible you are about certain criteria such as school areas the more frustration you are likely to endure.

Personally I think you should rethink your strategy and consider a much wider area.  I don't know what parts of London you are looking, but in my corner of West London prices haven't moved that much in the last couple of years, and there are still get houses coming onto the market that offer comparable value to a couple of years ago.
Rightmove sold prices confirms that prices have basically been flat since 2015, and it is the same in many boroughs.   

Be patient.. now is not the time to be making silly offers due to regret about "the one that got away last year." Rising interest rates will turn the market much more in favour of buyers as the year draws on. But when you do move, you must move with conviction.

Jacinle

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 147
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #4 on: February 28, 2022, 08:52:53 AM »
Why are you so keen to get into the catchment area of a particular school?  Do you have a child who is close to admission age or are you planning for the future? 

If you have a child that is close to school age, why not rent within the catchment area with the plan to move out once your child is already in the school? 

If you don't have a child, broaden your search area away from the catchment area. 

Otherwise, just wait for the right opportunity and it will come up eventually.


House buying on the whole is very stressful.

I have one child currently in year 5, so catchment, and another in year 2.  I don't drive, trying to learn but the backlog of driving test is crazy so not sure when I could get a license.  So the appeal of walking to school is really appreicated

Jacinle

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 147
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #5 on: February 28, 2022, 09:29:31 AM »
The truth is that homebuying is always a compromise on many fronts. You will never find the perfect property that ticks all the boxes you want, at the price you want, and the less flexible you are about certain criteria such as school areas the more frustration you are likely to endure.

Personally I think you should rethink your strategy and consider a much wider area.  I don't know what parts of London you are looking, but in my corner of West London prices haven't moved that much in the last couple of years, and there are still get houses coming onto the market that offer comparable value to a couple of years ago.
Rightmove sold prices confirms that prices have basically been flat since 2015, and it is the same in many boroughs.   

Be patient.. now is not the time to be making silly offers due to regret about "the one that got away last year." Rising interest rates will turn the market much more in favour of buyers as the year draws on. But when you do move, you must move with conviction.

I am in north greater London.  Given the younger one is in primary school, we can't pivot very far unless we change school again.  Traffic is crazy here during school run and I don't have a driving license yet.

I think your strategy is right ->
I guess we will continue to rent and wait another year, after the secondary school allocation.  Then hopefully I get a driving license so we could pivot around a 3miles radius, but my priority is still close to a tube/train station.

Re: move with conviction ->
Here I am getting very conflicting info online and wish the MMM folks could give me advice, this is the most stressful part,

1. What is the typical time to wait for a chain to form ?
2. Is is unethical to pull out of an offer any time?  If I see a better house, could I pull out?
3. Could I go offer on 2 properties and see which one complete first?
4. How could I verify what the EA said?  EA said house 4 owner is buying a chain-free probate property?

Affable Bear

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 101
  • Location: UK
  • Only if you run
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #6 on: March 01, 2022, 06:04:48 AM »
It's impossible to tell how long a chain will take, if the chain has been waiting for a chain free buyer for sometime its possible that most of the checks and stuff have been completed and its just a waiting game for a buyer to unlock the chain. In this case I would say it could be relatively quick, even chain free houses have issues and the marketing by some EA are not very accurate, the amount of 'chain free' but they are still living there properties is quite substantial.. Usually accompanied with 'they will move into a rental, or with family etc..' well unless they have moved out to me its still a chain! 

You can pull out of a property if you saw something else, however you will probably lose any legal fees and survey costs you have spent so far. Buying a house isn’t a quick process so if you change your mind you are throwing away however long you have been waiting to purchase the house. On the flipside you shouldn’t buy a house because of the stigma that you would be a bad person, circumstances change and if the property is no longer suitable it might be best to pull out rather than be left somewhere you dont want to be.

Being a FTB is probably an advantage and means chains are less of an issue because you don't have to sell a house in order to buy one. You can essentially move straight away however you may still have to wait for the seller to move in order for this to happen, but it's probably less of an issue.

You could put multiple offers in on properties if you wanted to but it will increase your legal and survey costs as you will have to do this for each house you put an offer in and wait for whichever one completes first. Personally I wouldn’t do this because what if you have 2 offers and they are both near to completion after months of work it comes to the exchange and you pull out at the last minute for the only reason that they were your insurance policy, I guess you could do this but yeah its not really a nice thing to do.. Plus you are throwing money away getting 2 lots of checks done.

No idea on how to verify this with EA, unfortunately you will have to put an offer in and wait (hope) for it to go through. From reading your post its only really one house that let you down and its not uncommon for one property to fall through now and then, I think a bit of patience and perseverance will see you through, hopefully it all works out!

 


Jacinle

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 147
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #7 on: March 01, 2022, 07:57:35 AM »
I am losing my patience as I think rent is money throwing down the drain

Should have gone for the chain-free vacant property in hindsight
Now paying almost 50k more plus rent .

Lessons learnt!

vand

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2302
  • Location: UK
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #8 on: March 01, 2022, 01:16:17 PM »
Rent is the price you are paying to borrow something. It certainly isn't money down the drain. If you could rent a house for a tenner a month would you say that was money down the drain, or money well spent?  You see? It all depends on the price. 

Right now in London yields are 4% or so... maybe lower.  That means you're borrowing the use of the asset for just 4% of its total value a year. That's a pretty great deal.. for the renter.

Jacinle

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 147
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #9 on: March 11, 2022, 09:09:26 AM »
@vand, @Affable Bear , @Manchester, @SpreadsheetMan

Thank you very much for your advice


Jacinle

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 147
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #10 on: March 11, 2022, 09:20:46 AM »
@vand, @Affable Bear , @Manchester , @SpreadsheetMan

Thank you very much for your advice.

I wish I could travel back in time and just offered on either the chain-free or chain-complete one.  I felt quite stupid to believe EA words and ran into an dodgy EA who disappeared and gone radio silence.

Finger crossed for the next one.

Albatross

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 98
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #11 on: March 13, 2022, 08:35:50 PM »
I think in some ways you have to look at unfortunate events in house buying a bit like your stock market investments. We can always say "Oh only if...". Only if I bought House 1, or 3, or 2, or settled in an entirely different catchment area etc. It's really the same as trying to say "oh only if I bought SP500 a few months earlier, then it would have risen x% by now" or indeed what people are now thinking "oh if only I didn't pour my bonus in January 2022 into SP500, I wouldn't have lost so much".

Don't fret. You can never really time these things and sometimes despite our best efforts (and it certaintly sounds like you've put all your effort in), your timing is just off. If the market had gone down, or if suddenly there were fewer fellow Hong Kongers on the look out for Greater London properties, you would be glad, instead of stressed. It's all just an ocean of larger and smaller waves - sometimes you're up, sometimes you're down. So don't worry it will all work out in the end. The fact that you are aware of FIRE principles should, of itself, comfort you that you are on the right track.


Jacinle

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 147
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #12 on: March 21, 2022, 11:54:02 AM »
Thank you @Albatross

Jacinle

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 147
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #13 on: March 31, 2022, 07:45:24 PM »
It's impossible to tell how long a chain will take, if the chain has been waiting for a chain free buyer for sometime its possible that most of the checks and stuff have been completed and its just a waiting game for a buyer to unlock the chain. In this case I would say it could be relatively quick, even chain free houses have issues and the marketing by some EA are not very accurate, the amount of 'chain free' but they are still living there properties is quite substantial.. Usually accompanied with 'they will move into a rental, or with family etc..' well unless they have moved out to me its still a chain! 

House 4 - a supposingly chain free house with owner moving to temp place is now with a chain.  The story from EA or buyer keep changing.  Sometimes they are buying a chain free, sometime the seller's seller is buying chain free.  Sometimes it is chain complete, sometimes the seller's seller chain is unknown.
The survey is done, searches should be back.
Nothing else in the market.  Houses all are going significantly over asking.
I hate house 4 for lack of a driveway but offered on based on 'chain free'.  It is very near town center but probably affect resale value

What should I do?

Affable Bear

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 101
  • Location: UK
  • Only if you run
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #14 on: April 01, 2022, 08:44:56 AM »
It's impossible to tell how long a chain will take, if the chain has been waiting for a chain free buyer for sometime its possible that most of the checks and stuff have been completed and its just a waiting game for a buyer to unlock the chain. In this case I would say it could be relatively quick, even chain free houses have issues and the marketing by some EA are not very accurate, the amount of 'chain free' but they are still living there properties is quite substantial.. Usually accompanied with 'they will move into a rental, or with family etc..' well unless they have moved out to me its still a chain! 

House 4 - a supposingly chain free house with owner moving to temp place is now with a chain.  The story from EA or buyer keep changing.  Sometimes they are buying a chain free, sometime the seller's seller is buying chain free.  Sometimes it is chain complete, sometimes the seller's seller chain is unknown.
The survey is done, searches should be back.
Nothing else in the market.  Houses all are going significantly over asking.
I hate house 4 for lack of a driveway but offered on based on 'chain free'.  It is very near town center but probably affect resale value

What should I do?

This is a difficult one, it could be time to haggle on the price maybe? Remember even in a hot market you still have an advantage over somebody else who would have to sell their house first. This is probably why there are multiple reports of what house they are purchasing as they know their house has sold with a chain free buyer and can view/put offers in on a variety of properties.

I think considering your offer is based on the chain free aspect and them moving into temporary housing it would be reasonable to negotiate a lower price to reflect that they aren't doing this. Its something that I would have thought the EA should understand as well given that you can move relatively quickly.

It's also probably a good time to go over the survey and checks to see if there is anything in there you could also use to further negotiate them down on price.

No guarentees of course but there is usually scope to negotiate the initial offer, especially if circumstances change or things are flagged up during the checks and survey.

Of course they could refuse to accept a lower offer but even if they can find a buyer with an equal or higher offer if they arent chain free llike you are it will slow them down and reduce their negotiating power when they are searching for properties themselves. It's all sort of linked, depending on the level of property you are buying chances are there are probably very few chain free buyers in your price point as the vast majority of chain free buyers are first time buyers with much more restrictive budgets. 

But yeah im not an advisor or expert or anything so dont take anything here as fact or solid advice its just my personal opinion. I would be having those discussions with the EA as to if the sellers will be moving out temporarily to allow the sale to progress and if not I would be discussing reducing the offer to reflect this, but it depends on your personal circumstances and how badly you need the property, what the local area is like, if prices will soon be so far out of reach etc... Probably worth an informal chat with EA though

vand

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2302
  • Location: UK
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #15 on: April 02, 2022, 07:23:48 AM »
Re House #4

Probably someone further up the chain has the option to move to rented, but would like to buy, hence when the status of the chain keeps flipping and flopping

At the end of the day, I'd advise to proceed (or not) purely on how much you like the house and whether you think you will be happy there for the next 10 years. Everything else is short term noise that won't matter once you are in.

Chains are a fact of life when buying property, especially when you are talking about million pound family homes. The thing to keep an eye on is the expiry on your mortgage offer - they are usually only valid for 6 months.

Take what any estate agent tells you with a very large pinch of salt. With good reason they are pretty universally derided as a "profession" in the UK for being, let's just say, economical with the truth.  Terms like "cash buyer" and "chain free" are frquently not what they say on the tin when EAs start to bandy them around.

"Buying a home" frequently tops the list of most stressful undertakings. You just need to suck it up and develop a healthy degree of stoicism during the process, and make sure that YOU are not the cause of any avoidable delays.
« Last Edit: April 02, 2022, 07:36:55 AM by vand »

Jacinle

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 147
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #16 on: April 03, 2022, 03:03:28 PM »
Hi

I am really shocked as the house buy/sell system here, even though I have tried to learn it as much as I can.

I am a honest, too naive perhaps, true cash, chain free buyer and I just hope to have some certainty of when the exchange and complete will happen.  Not to have the price up another 10% by the time the sale falls apart.

I have no idea what the seller is buying, a million house or not, as they say it is up north.  or what the seller's seller is doing.  well, not sure how much should I trust though

House #4 is okay, but not as good as house #1,2,3.  I will forever kick myself when it rains and I couldn't park in the resident permit road in front of the house. 

J

js0554719

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 3
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #17 on: April 21, 2022, 03:35:36 AM »
I always feel that I ruined my FI goals given my 'perfect' house search and lack of comprehension of need to move fast when prices are

Sent from my TECNO KC8 using Tapatalk


Jacinle

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 147
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #18 on: April 22, 2022, 03:14:30 AM »
Hi

It's me again and need to seek some advice from money mustache

While I am unable to figure out how many houses are in the chain or where everybody in the chain is, got a call from seller's EA that they want exchange end of April and complete in 2 weeks time.  I still think the EA might have got the wrong number to call and I tried to write back in email to make sure it is correct.

Panic in moments for my first buy,

- mortgageable property?
it is a cash buy and surveyor and solicitor think should be okay that the property is mortgagable.  According to my mortgage advisor, seems they only do desk valuation and as long as it has a kitchen and bathroom they will usually lend.
Not sure if there is any additional checks/questions I should raise?

- hidden issues / money pit?
it is a 1900 property
we have a home buyer survey and while the report is 70 pages long, the surveyor is happy and don't think anything needs fixing immediately or near future
How much should I budget / save for a house maintanence pot?

- lack of driveway
the price does certainly reflect that and there is resident permit parking on street but always full in the evening. 
there are definitely space in a side street about 3mins walk so not the end of the world I guess as we only use cars for weekends trip or school run in very bad (rainy) weather.  We walked whenever it is dry or slightly wet, even if it is super cold.

- Wait for the perfect ONE or not?
there is 1 property that came up that seems to have potential for the perfect house.    (with potential for driveway and potential to extend for space)  I am unable to secure a viewing, away from Easter, and it has already gone under offer.
properties are snapped up in days, or even before on RM here.  So I guess I should just proceed ?

Any other advice for a FTB? 

J

MarcherLady

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6021
  • Age: 10
  • Location: North of the Wall, UK
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #19 on: April 22, 2022, 05:34:24 AM »
It seems to me that you aren't in love with this house. There is no such thing as the perfect ONE, every house has compromises, but usually there is something about one that overwhelms all the less than perfect bits, and makes it the One for you. It sounds like you have decided with your head and wallet that now is the time to buy and this is the house, but not with your heart. That's perfectly OK, but you are still listing potential problems with it quite late in the day, which worries me. I think you should list the things that make you want to live in it, and compare the for and against lists. Then work out if you still want to proceed. It might make sense financially to buy this house, but it's going to be your home. As you are finding, moving house is stressful - you don't want to be doing this again in 18 months because this one isn't right for you.

vand

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2302
  • Location: UK
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #20 on: April 22, 2022, 11:03:44 AM »
So you already pulled out of one deal, and now seriously thinking about pulling out of another... something's beginning to hint to me that it's not the houses that are the problem, it's the wannabe buyer..

Buying is stressful... if you allow it to be stressful.. and you are allowing it to be stressful.

Jacinle

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 147
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #21 on: April 22, 2022, 02:07:47 PM »
It seems to me that you aren't in love with this house. There is no such thing as the perfect ONE, every house has compromises, but usually there is something about one that overwhelms all the less than perfect bits, and makes it the One for you.

Location location location, this house is in location I wanted

Hmm, I can't fall in love with this, because I am still in love with house #2 (the vendor could not find a house to buy )

Jacinle

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 147
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #22 on: April 22, 2022, 02:11:05 PM »
So you already pulled out of one deal, and now seriously thinking about pulling out of another... something's beginning to hint to me that it's not the houses that are the problem, it's the wannabe buyer..

Buying is stressful... if you allow it to be stressful.. and you are allowing it to be stressful.

I didn't pull out of the first one, house #2 buy fell apart because the vendor could not find a house to buy

I am anxious, as I just heard that a neighbour's recently new built house need to pay 50k for an incorrect drainage connection, the builder has liquidated, so likely the owner has to pay

Just wonder what insurance/ anything I should do to protect myself?

Affable Bear

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 101
  • Location: UK
  • Only if you run
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #23 on: April 25, 2022, 02:25:56 AM »
You could pay a little extra for a thorough property survey, make sure they are reputable and they should flag any big stuff, if they do miss anything glaringly obvious you could possibly pursue the surveyor. Not sure about specific insurance for buying though other than when you move in and purchase buildings insurance.
 

MarcherLady

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6021
  • Age: 10
  • Location: North of the Wall, UK
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #24 on: April 25, 2022, 04:32:32 AM »
I am anxious, as I just heard that a neighbour's recently new built house need to pay 50k for an incorrect drainage connection, the builder has liquidated, so likely the owner has to pay

Just wonder what insurance/ anything I should do to protect myself?

If it is a newbuild, there should be an NHBC which should protect the buyer.

@Jacinle , I'm trying to ask this very gently. Do you have a history of anxiety? It seems to me that you are going looking for problems (catastrophising) that don't exist yet and are making this even more stressful than it needs to be. I think you should take a long breath, try to deal with the issues that are in front of you, and stop trying to preempt issues that might not even happen. I also think you should maybe talk to your Dr about whether there are any options for medication that might help you through this.

Jacinle

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 147
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #25 on: April 29, 2022, 05:51:18 AM »
I am anxious, as I just heard that a neighbour's recently new built house need to pay 50k for an incorrect drainage connection, the builder has liquidated, so likely the owner has to pay

Just wonder what insurance/ anything I should do to protect myself?

If it is a newbuild, there should be an NHBC which should protect the buyer.

@Jacinle , I'm trying to ask this very gently. Do you have a history of anxiety? It seems to me that you are going looking for problems (catastrophising) that don't exist yet and are making this even more stressful than it needs to be. I think you should take a long breath, try to deal with the issues that are in front of you, and stop trying to preempt issues that might not even happen. I also think you should maybe talk to your Dr about whether there are any options for medication that might help you through this.
Hi MarcherLady
Yes I have anxiety and have professional help at the moment.  I am surprised it could be seen by my threads. 

As I am fairly new in UK/England, I found this forum really useful for me to air out my concerns , as all of your collective wisdom give me a balance to my catastrophising thoughts.  Writing worries (non existing problem) also help me to put things into perspective , as when I am writing it out, I would have ah-ah moment, and put down counter balance thoughts or risk-mitigation strategy.

We have transferred 10% deposit to our solicitors and are now waiting for exchange to happen today.  Finger crossing!
J

MarcherLady

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6021
  • Age: 10
  • Location: North of the Wall, UK
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #26 on: April 29, 2022, 12:12:01 PM »
It's easy to recognise when you have been there yourself. :-)  I'm glad you have support and that the forum is helping. Best of luck with the move and with your health.
« Last Edit: April 29, 2022, 12:13:59 PM by MarcherLady »

Jacinle

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 147
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #27 on: May 01, 2022, 03:31:42 AM »
Exchange hasn't happened yet ..

It seems top of the chain has issues to resolve and said they will try again next Tue, I think 3 houses are involved if my understanding is correct.

I guess I could only wait or ?

Jacinle

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 147
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #28 on: May 03, 2022, 10:52:09 AM »
Exchange hasn't happened.  Top of the chain has issues and I don't know what it is

What should I do ?

I viewed a house over the weekend which we would offer , should I go offer?  should I wait?  How long to wait?

Should I try to get more details from solicitor to estimate the successful probability?

MarcherLady

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6021
  • Age: 10
  • Location: North of the Wall, UK
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #29 on: May 03, 2022, 11:01:06 AM »
Should I try to get more details from solicitor to estimate the successful probability?

Yes. Ask your solicitor for their input on whether giving the vendor an ultimatum is likely to be worth it. Keep in view that if you pull out of this sale now you are still on the hook to pay your solicitor for the work they have already done, plus the cost of the work for the next purchase too, so the solicitor has nothing to lose, and something to gain from you backing out at this point. You can also try leaning on the estate agent too. They don't work for you, but they don't get paid til the house sells, so it's in their interest to get things moving if you want to threaten to pull out.

vand

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2302
  • Location: UK
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #30 on: May 03, 2022, 11:31:34 AM »
Don't be daft. Sit tight. It'll be OK. Delays are common. It's not like there isn't a few million quid on the line and every party doesn't want to dot their i's and cross their t's.

Jacinle

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 147
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #31 on: May 03, 2022, 02:05:08 PM »
Thank you all for your encouragement

The completion date is still next week, or no one has updated me otherwise yet.

Should I still transfer the rest of the money, (i am doing a cash buy) end of this week to get ready?


If the solicitor goes bankrupt/any issues (sorry worst case scenario) would I be protected?

Jacinle

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 147

Jacinle

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 147
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #33 on: May 08, 2022, 03:01:53 AM »
Update - exchanged Friday!!!

We are preparing to transfer rest of the balance Monday and complete to be happen next week.  Should I breathe a relief given that it is legally binding now?

I am looking at building insurance, what else should I need to do ?  I need to find a checklist.

Looking back

AM I unlucky / not my destiny?
People here said 'It is not meant to be'
It is a foreign concept to me that you need luck to buy a house, and you need to take a basic vet on proceedability and motivation.

Or the system has issues
The stories I have heard
- 2 months to complete with a chain of 4
- 2 months to complete as a seller willing to break chain
- 1 year still yet to complete , a no chain probate sale

I have found a news article dated 1999 of the 'flaws' in the system, so I don't think this system will change(?) but who knows

Learnings
1. offer is legally not binding so don't be emotionally invested into the house before completion
2. offer is legally not binding - vet seller motivation and proceedability - well - on best effort basis
3. offer is legally not binding - play dirty? hmmmm ......
4. a gentlement agreement is nothing ?
I am hurt that my previous sellor could just go radio silence, not even a word that they can't find an onward purchase and need to pull out


Howdotheyriseup?

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 19
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #34 on: May 09, 2022, 02:30:03 AM »
Congratulations! Sounds to me like you should take a moment to celebrate.
I think there are some pretty hefty payments if someone pulls out at this stage - so I'd say try not to worry too much about it, you've done your bit!

Affable Bear

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 101
  • Location: UK
  • Only if you run
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #35 on: May 09, 2022, 07:11:40 AM »
Congratulations!!

I agree the system is far from perfect but I am glad you have finally exchanged, now its time to settle in and breathe a sigh of relief!

 


Jacinle

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 147
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #36 on: May 13, 2022, 06:46:18 AM »
We completed and collected the keys. 

@MarcherLady , the thoughts of worry hit me, whether I would like the house, whether I would be able to sell it in 12+ years time.
I re-read your advice

I think you should take a long breath, try to deal with the issues that are in front of you, and stop trying to preempt issues that might not even happen.


Issues in front of me
Renovation - before moving in
I have never done any.  Could anyone give me advice? 

With a limited budget, what would be your priority? 

Windows
1. Single glazed wooden frame windows/door
a. 1 bedroom window
b. 2 windows in kitchen, 1 back door
c. 1 patio door
d. 1 balcony door.
Should I replace this?  For some the wood is rotten

2. Double glazed windows - probably 30+ years old but look like working

Carpet and floor
1. Replace or remove carpet in 2 bedrooms and stairs (probably a must ...)

Re-paint
1. probably could DIY

Kitchen
there's a scullery at the back and we are thinking if we should do open plan or just upgrade/update the unit.
Open plan would allow us to use the space much better and fix the flat roof leaks above the scullery, wooden patio doors and windows.
If we replace the windows and doors and not do extension, it seems to be a waste

The kitchen unit is dated but usable, if we don't do extension, I am thinking of painting it over?
It has a dark tabletop and wooden drawer/doors

Garden
1. a new shed
2. fence - I could not find on title plan which fence I own, who should I ask?
3. there is a little brick footpath and want to change it to grass so kids could play

If I find builder in and give me quotes, how to make sure it won't under-budget and I have to pay more?
Thank you everyone!

SpreadsheetMan

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 428
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #37 on: May 13, 2022, 11:12:53 AM »
Do the things first that are really disruptive once you are living in it. The kitchen extension would be a good example of something hard to do when living in the house (but get any roof leaks fixed as a priority anyway). Flooring to the main rooms is also a pain when you are in there with furniture.

Paint at least the ceilings and bedrooms before moving in, it’s easier to do ceilings with rooms empty and sleeping in a room with drying paint is awful.

Windows can be done at any time with minimal disruption. Outside is not a priority (unless you need to make things secure).

Get lots of building quotes and compare them carefully. Finding someone that won’t rip you off is hard unless you can get recommendations from people you know. Local Facebook groups are a good place to look to see who gets recommended often.

Jacinle

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 147
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #38 on: May 13, 2022, 01:04:28 PM »
@SpreadsheetMan
Thank you

Is an extension really add value?  Could re-sale cover the cost usually?

Cost of building seems to be gone up significantly, as in everything else ...

Affable Bear

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 101
  • Location: UK
  • Only if you run
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #39 on: May 20, 2022, 06:12:11 AM »
I tend to think that the higher the value of the property the more cost effective it is when you extend. The reason being that if it costs a builder say £80k to do a double extension on a house and this increases the value of the property by 25% then it probably makes less financial sense spending the money on a lower valued property as you will struggle to make the money back.

For example

£200k house
£80k extension
+25% house value
Value of property at the end: £250,000
Resulting in a spend/loss of £30k

£600k house
£80k extension
+25% house value
Value of property at the end: £750,000
Resulting in a potential £70k return

This is all relative, most areas generally have a ceiling price where they wont sell above a certain amount in that area regardless of what improvements are made. I just think there is more wiggle room at the higher end of the market, some properties will also go up significantly more than 25% others less. Looking at what other properties sell for with similar improvements are useful when judging potential.

Many people move up the housing ladder using this technique as you are exempt from capital gains tax on your primary residence so in theory you could buy a house, move in, make improvements and sell it on at a profit giving you more money to buy a more expensive house etc... A very stressful way to do it, we did this with our first property and nearly killed us with all the works we had to do whilst living there but at the end we made a large profit and moved to a lovely house we couldnt have afforded had we not bought a 'fixer upper', probably wouldnt repeat the process though.

Also if you like the area and dont plan to move anytime in the short to medium term it can still make sense to extend and not to make all of your money back right away. It becomes more of a 'I love the area and need the space im here for the next 20 years so its worth spending the money to make my life more enjoyable' kinda thing.




Jacinle

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 147
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #40 on: May 24, 2022, 03:52:10 AM »
Also if you like the area and dont plan to move anytime in the short to medium term it can still make sense to extend and not to make all of your money back right away. It becomes more of a 'I love the area and need the space im here for the next 20 years so its worth spending the money to make my life more enjoyable' kinda thing.

Pretty much I am at the ceiling price right now given the rise in price/mad rush I think.

I like the area but don't like the house (yet?), so I am thinking about resell potential, if I did find my dream house then I could either re-sell or rent it out.

It is pretty much my head told me I had to get a house (now) and the maths make sense, just like @MarcherLady said. 

Here I need your advice
I am very tempted to continue looking for my dream house while I have one in my hand.  With a mortgage, that will put 50% of our nested eggs into houses equity.

880k current house
950k dream house - 500k mortgage

Total nested eggs - ~3m, including pensions (~300k) that we could only get at 55

Am I being unreasonable?  Am I being too crazy to attempt to do that in an uncertain market?
J


MarcherLady

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6021
  • Age: 10
  • Location: North of the Wall, UK
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #41 on: May 24, 2022, 11:17:37 AM »
I would not do this in your position. Interest rates have only just started to go up, they will go higher yet (says my crystall ball) House prices will drop as people can't pay their mortgages and/or try to downsize to reduce their heating bills, or lose their jobs in the coming recession.

But I am pretty cautious, maybe you have more appetite for risk than I do.   

Jacinle

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 147
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #42 on: May 25, 2022, 06:12:35 AM »
I would not do this in your position. Interest rates have only just started to go up, they will go higher yet (says my crystall ball) House prices will drop as people can't pay their mortgages and/or try to downsize to reduce their heating bills, or lose their jobs in the coming recession.

But I am pretty cautious, maybe you have more appetite for risk than I do.

Thank you @MarcherLady ;  I needed different perspective/opinions as my illness is affecting my judgement.  I have an illusion that if I get the 'dream' house, I would be happily ever after.  What am I thinking?  Do I just want a replacement to comfort my pain of losing the first one that the vendor silently walk away?

vand

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2302
  • Location: UK
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #43 on: May 26, 2022, 11:28:09 AM »
I don't want to sound nasty, but.... Good grief. You've barely even moved in and you are already talking about rennovation, extensions and the next "dream house".
Seriously.... get a grip.

There is NO dream house. You're just chasing an illusion that a bigger house will fix all your problems and make you happy. It won't, and I feel comfortable saying that it's completely juxtapose to the MMM philosophy.

I wish I could say that I am flabbergasted, but far from it.. this sort of "I must have everything" mentality is very predictable if you are unable to cherish what you already have.

SpreadsheetMan

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 428
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #44 on: May 26, 2022, 12:21:01 PM »
Good point by vand - there is no dream house. Every house is a compromise to some extent.

Jacinle

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 147
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #45 on: May 27, 2022, 03:13:21 AM »
I don't want to sound nasty, but.... Good grief. You've barely even moved in and you are already talking about rennovation, extensions and the next "dream house".
Seriously.... get a grip.

There is NO dream house. You're just chasing an illusion that a bigger house will fix all your problems and make you happy. It won't, and I feel comfortable saying that it's completely juxtapose to the MMM philosophy.

I wish I could say that I am flabbergasted, but far from it.. this sort of "I must have everything" mentality is very predictable if you are unable to cherish what you already have.
Indeed ... I should cherish what I had, very well said @vand.
My head is screaming 'Let it go ...'
But I couldn't let go and keep dreaming every night the first house that we offered on.
I want to extend and renovate to make it like the first house.  The first house actually is smaller, but had an open plan kitchen extension and a lovely garden.
The house we got now had lots of issues we didn't notice after the owner vaccanted out.  Sigh, FTB in a desperate rush...

Hubby said I am like breaking up with someone I love.

I felt so painful of the $$$ lost due to house price rise that originally we could buy at a much cheaper price for a house that suited us and we wanted.  We had been saving so hard for the FIRE goals.  We had only done 1 vacation in last 10 years, and in a very MMM way to save.  But now, it seems it could just evaporate.

RE: You're just chasing an illusion that a bigger house will fix all your problems and make you happy
Yes, I think I need professional help/medication

Jacinle

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 147
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #46 on: May 27, 2022, 03:27:07 AM »
Might be as @Albatross had said, I should just view myself as unlucky and in an unfortunate situation ?
given I think seldom in 6months time, an almost identical hosue could go up from 700k to 775k, where it is in a much worst condition.

vand

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2302
  • Location: UK
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #47 on: December 25, 2022, 05:25:10 AM »
As speculated at the start of this thread, UK housing market is now firmly in decline

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/mortgageshome/article-11504401/How-cut-asking-price-home-isnt-selling.html







Market has turned in favour of buyers:




Jacinle

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 147
Re: Stressed out house buying in Greater London , England
« Reply #48 on: January 11, 2023, 09:35:57 AM »
Yes Indeed @vand .  A painful lesson learnt about me

The urge to fill the void of a 'home'
The fear of pricing out
The demanding voice to be prefect
The anxiety of making mistakes
The stress of matriach
The loneliness of covid new normal
The decades of looking after a depressive & abrusive mum
The catastrophic thought
The burden of losing a 'home'
The loss in translation
The mind that play tricks

and I still think the England house transaction law system is rubbish and outdated