Author Topic: FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?  (Read 4315 times)

CrabbitDutchie

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FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?
« on: April 03, 2020, 03:06:51 PM »
I hope you MUPPETs can help me with a dilemma.

I am incredibly lucky. My job is fully doable from home, and though we are facing some disruption the future of the company and industry remains secure. There is enough work to go around in our department. We have enough space in our tiny (rented) flat to have turned the spare room into an office, no children to deal with and everything should be hunky dory. However I'm struggling. I'm struggling with motivation. What I do for a living seems so unimportant in the grand scheme of things (not helped by the particular projects I'm working on). I have the attention span of a goldfish and stuff isn't getting done as fast or well as it should be. As a result I am stuck in a bit of a loop of not achieving enough so spending more hours locked in the 'office' because I feel guilty, then not achieving much more. Not good and not good for the work life balance thing.

Now last night the company announced a new scheme to give employees more flexibility (read: save the company money). You can apply for a temporary reduction in hours lasting 30/60 or 90 days. Pro rata pay, but all benefits including holiday entitlement stay as if you were a full time employee.

I can't think of a good reason not to apply for a reduction to 30 hours (4 day week). Obviously it's a temporary pay cut, but I reckon I'd still have a savings rate of around 60% (based on 2.5 years ago when I was earning that amount at the same company, same flat, same rent and very little lifestyle inflation).

So 4 days per week (20% decrease), 3 day weekend (50% increase), 60% savings rate.

Ok I may not have had any real financial accomplishments, but the Reduce Time is pretty appealing. In fact, just looking at the numbers I feel I'd be mad not to at least apply to work a 4 day week in May, June and July! They could say no if lots of people in horrible childcare situations get priority (but sadly a lot of those people can't afford to take the pay cut).

Have I missed anything really obvious that would make this a stupid idea?

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Re: FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?
« Reply #1 on: April 04, 2020, 01:07:00 AM »
Hi CrabbitDutchie. No I don't think so, providing you will have enough to do bearing in mind the lockdown. I don't know what your normal out of work activities look like, but providing you have plenty to occupy yourself with then it sounds like an ideal opportunity to reduce your hours and benefit from a bit of a break.

Congratulations on the really high savings rate (which is the Financial Accomplishment here) allowing you to be able to do this. It does go to show there are many significant milestones prior to full FI being achieved.

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Re: FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?
« Reply #2 on: April 04, 2020, 01:17:34 AM »
I can't see why not either. It's temporary, it may help you with motivation, you won't need the money. Now you are staying in you may save even more money than your normal savings rate. I can imagine you are right that few parents will be able to afford this. And now you get the extra PR benefit of not being a lazy parttimer but a dedicated employee who has made sacrifices for the company.

Playing with Fire UK

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Re: FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?
« Reply #3 on: April 04, 2020, 01:53:02 AM »
I vote do it. Being it is definitely a financial accomplishment to be able to afford it. FART away!

Make sure you don't spend your new free time in the office not working though! Are you looking for suggestions for motivation for working from home also?

Spoiler: show

Pomodoro technique - set a specific task you can do in 20 or 40 minutes, set a timer and stop when it goes off then take a break.

Have a fixed finish time. Don't put work off because you can work later. When it is home-time close the study door or throw a towel over the desk.

Take a minute before you start to think about who this task will help. Even if it is just that your supervisor won't need to chase you or it'll make someone else's job easier

Think about your energy and focus levels and match them to your tasks. I can work for hours on something difficult and interesting early in the morning before I've been caught up in questions and emails. I can do dull tasks in the afternoon as long as they are small enough, or if I have a call scheduled it'll give be an energy boost.

Try out listening to music: computer game music is really good for me because it is designed to keep you going (but not from a game that you actually play). I like fast-pace pop when I'm trying to grind out tasks and classical stuff with no words for deeper stuff.

Experiment with star charts or to-do lists.

Decide that Monday will be a great work day. At the end of the day review everything that you have achieved and take a minute to bask in the glory of it all, it can give a boost for the rest of the week (and if you do have a poor day, decide that the next day will be good and reset).

If you suddenly find that your mind has been wandering, stand up and move before starting again - squats are good, running up and down the stairs is good - whatever works for you.

highlandterrier

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Re: FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?
« Reply #4 on: April 04, 2020, 03:37:15 AM »
Good opportunity for you, and a way to get something positive out of the current situation. Only thing to add is your reduction in wage will be less than 20%, as the extra earnings you are losing will currently be fully taxed, even more so if you are higher rate payer.

PhilB

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Re: FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?
« Reply #5 on: April 04, 2020, 06:13:32 AM »
It sounds great.  I would sound two notes of caution though:
  • You want to be sure you aren't going to be expected to do just as much work as before so that you end up still working 5 days while being paid for 4.
  • As with FIRE itself, you need to be FARTing to something not just away from work.  If you can think of plenty of fun things to do with your extra day off each week, bearing in mind that you're locked down, then go for it.

BikeFanatic

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Re: FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?
« Reply #6 on: April 04, 2020, 06:20:40 AM »
I was hoping for furlough as I am so done with this job, but so far WFH has been cool, I mean no commute that’s been great, but I am working more hours I have to learn to bear down and work, I feel more motivated when I have deadlines.
I am also grateful   with every paycheck, I really lucked out with this job, I don’t like it much, and not sure I am good at it, but it pays so much more than my other jobs, so I cling to that.

CrabbitDutchie

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Re: FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?
« Reply #7 on: April 04, 2020, 07:02:44 AM »

Thank you all, lots of good things to think about and you've all been nice enough to provide me with the validation needed to FART away!
I was worried I'd overlooked something essential, but for obvious reasons am not about to run just how affordable this is to me past too many colleagues. Everyone is struggling and no one needs me to rub in that I'm able to take advantage when they can't.

Hi CrabbitDutchie. No I don't think so, providing you will have enough to do bearing in mind the lockdown. I don't know what your normal out of work activities look like, but providing you have plenty to occupy yourself with then it sounds like an ideal opportunity to reduce your hours and benefit from a bit of a break.

Yes, the evenings and weekends still have not felt nearly long enough, despite the lockdown! I'm a massive introvert who likes to go for walks, grow food, cook food, read, learn (currently the MSc which I mostly genuinely enjoy), do jigsaw puzzles and play board games. I've also been getting involved with some mutual aid things and even a single delivery takes a lot of time! I took a whole bunch of books out of the library just before it shut and am loving how many audiobooks are available for free at the moment. Seriously, I feel I could easily drop to 2 or 3 days a week and still not get bored!

I vote do it. Being it is definitely a financial accomplishment to be able to afford it. FART away!

Make sure you don't spend your new free time in the office not working though! Are you looking for suggestions for motivation for working from home also?

That's the problem, some of the free time will probably have to be spent in the office not working. And that's just because I have 2 MSc assignments and an exam to do over the next 2 months! However it's the reason I'd like to drop a day. I'll then still spend 5 days a week in the 'office' but I'll actually get a full weekend!

Thank you for the suggestions. A lot are being implemented and things are improving. To be honest, given the current situation I think I'd have similar struggles even if I was still in the office. I'm realizing that WFH 5 days a week is not optimizing for my happiness and it seems a waste to be spending so much of my life doing things that are pointless in the grand scheme of things. Overall what we do is important, but the company I work for has added so much extra paperwork that it can become difficult to see the wood for the trees. Add in conflict in some the teams I'm in at the moment and working with time zones that are not conducive to my personal productivity and things are just bleh.

Think about your energy and focus levels and match them to your tasks. I can work for hours on something difficult and interesting early in the morning before I've been caught up in questions and emails. I can do dull tasks in the afternoon as long as they are small enough, or if I have a call scheduled it'll give be an energy boost.

^^ That's generally key for me. Unfortunately I'm doing a lot of work with APAC zones at the moment which is impacting the amount of difficult/interesting work I can get done in the morning. It means that even when I get a lot done, my day hasn't felt fulfilling/productive. I'll need to have a think about how I can protect my morning time.

I can't see why not either. It's temporary, it may help you with motivation, you won't need the money. Now you are staying in you may save even more money than your normal savings rate. I can imagine you are right that few parents will be able to afford this. And now you get the extra PR benefit of not being a lazy parttimer but a dedicated employee who has made sacrifices for the company.

You're right, I might well save a bit more. No horse and much lower transport costs compared to the last time I earned that amount, but I am spending A LOT more on food. Partly odd substitutions, partly buying more from smaller independent shops to help them stay afloat.

Good opportunity for you, and a way to get something positive out of the current situation. Only thing to add is your reduction in wage will be less than 20%, as the extra earnings you are losing will currently be fully taxed, even more so if you are higher rate payer.

Yes, I think it will be around 85% (not a higher rate tax payer, even in Scotland) of my current take home pay, but some of it depends a little on how the pension contributions work during this time. I'm still waiting for an answer, but it won't impact my decision as such. Numbers will be fine either way.


PhilB - thanks for the note of caution. Things to do is fine :) It is likely that for at least a couple of weeks I'll end up working a 'compressed week', but I should be able to reduce overall work commitments appropriately. One of my projects is very impacted by COVID-19 and we're basically downing tools until we know whether the client will still be solvent after all of this! Rubbish for them, but perfect timing for me. If I act now that 'gap' shouldn't be filled by more work.

BikeFanatic - good luck :) I can definitely relate

vand

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Re: FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?
« Reply #8 on: April 04, 2020, 11:26:15 AM »
I agree with the replies already stated.. it does sound like a perfectly good option provided that you don't just end up just as unmotivated and now enduring 3 day weekends that pass by in the same fashion as the rest of the working week.


Personally I'm hoping to work full time through the coming downturn, and at the moment am lucky enough to be able to do so. I'm quite lucky, really. I don't hate my job at all, even if some of it is quite mundane and boring, I get a lot of freedom in my role, and nice short commute (in normal times), and a nice hands-off boss.

If the economy gets hit really badly then I don't want the regret of looking back and say that I didn't make the most of my employment situation while I was still able to. I guess I'm adopting a "hope for the best, plan for the worst" mindset.

« Last Edit: April 04, 2020, 11:29:37 AM by vand »

CrabbitDutchie

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Re: FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?
« Reply #9 on: April 05, 2020, 03:50:22 AM »


If the economy gets hit really badly then I don't want the regret of looking back and say that I didn't make the most of my employment situation while I was still able to. I guess I'm adopting a "hope for the best, plan for the worst" mindset.


I guess my adoption of the same mindset has led me down a different path. I don't want to look back and regret not having focused on what's important while I still could (hint, it's not my work). I too want to make the most of my incredibly fortunate employment situation - by using options hat would normally not be available to rebalance my life a little.

It wasn't so long ago that I was working full time and getting the same as I'll be getting now by dropping a day. October 2017 to October 2018 my gross salary was 80.3% of current gross salary and during that time my savings rate was 64%. I'd always planned to go down to 4 days in the next few years anyway because I simply don't need more money (I know, wrong forum) and I'd rather live well during the journey than single mindedly pursue FIRE at all costs.

vand

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Re: FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?
« Reply #10 on: April 05, 2020, 06:07:26 AM »
It's strange how different people can come at the same situation from different angles and come up with opposite yet entirely logical conclusions.

In my view, with everything shut down the opportunity cost of working right now is much lower than it would otherwise be. I mean, it's not like there's the opportunity to backpack around the world or go on that 3 month cruise that you've always been promising yourself. You can't even go to the pub on a whim.
Stuck at home getting paid to work, or stuck at home picking your nose.. I'll reluctantly take the first option.

PhilB

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Re: FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?
« Reply #11 on: April 05, 2020, 07:20:40 AM »
It's strange how different people can come at the same situation from different angles and come up with opposite yet entirely logical conclusions.

In my view, with everything shut down the opportunity cost of working right now is much lower than it would otherwise be. I mean, it's not like there's the opportunity to backpack around the world or go on that 3 month cruise that you've always been promising yourself. You can't even go to the pub on a whim.
Stuck at home getting paid to work, or stuck at home picking your nose.. I'll reluctantly take the first option.

Just so long as you washed your hands first.

Imma

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Re: FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?
« Reply #12 on: April 05, 2020, 07:29:50 AM »
]

Stuck at home getting paid to work, or stuck at home picking your nose.. I'll reluctantly take the first option.

I haven't been bored for a second and I've been 100% work from home for a month. There's so much to do, reading, crafting, gardening, cooking, DIY. I finally have time to do all the things I've wanted to do for years. I've found out I can't wait to FIRE!

CrabbitDutchie

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Re: FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?
« Reply #13 on: April 22, 2020, 01:09:06 AM »
update: My reduction has been approved by HR and senior management.

During May, June and July I'll be working 30 hrs per week

I doubt there will be too much sitting about picking my nose ;)


Playing with Fire UK

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Re: FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?
« Reply #14 on: April 22, 2020, 01:55:07 AM »
Hurray!! That's great news. Hope it is fun and productive.

Gingersnaps

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Re: FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?
« Reply #15 on: June 02, 2020, 10:39:39 AM »
How are you getting on after a month @CrabbitDutchie ?

CrabbitDutchie

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Re: FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?
« Reply #16 on: June 03, 2020, 10:54:17 AM »
Hi @Gingersnaps


I've really felt I've needed the extra time off, but I'm still struggling with proper balance and end up working a compressed week.
Part of that is because we're in the final stages of a project I've been heavily involved with for the past 2.5 years is winding up and I feel responsible, but i did say earlier that I'd likely be working a compressed week for a couple of weeks. It's due to be wrapped up by the end of this week and after that I'll have more freedom!

Still, I'm really not bored and think my overall wellbeing would definitely be worse if I was working a full 5 day week just now!

MustacheAndaHalf

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Re: FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?
« Reply #17 on: June 03, 2020, 10:34:08 PM »
Let me make the case for taking Wednesday off, instead of Friday, and see if you agree:

With Friday off, you still have a 4 day work week.  Your weekend grew slightly, but it was already a break from work.

Change that to Wednesday off: now you have 2 days of work and a break, then another 2 days of work.  You get to relax every 3rd day.

PhilB

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Re: FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?
« Reply #18 on: June 04, 2020, 01:29:37 AM »
Let me make the case for taking Wednesday off, instead of Friday, and see if you agree:

With Friday off, you still have a 4 day work week.  Your weekend grew slightly, but it was already a break from work.

Change that to Wednesday off: now you have 2 days of work and a break, then another 2 days of work.  You get to relax every 3rd day.

It all rather depends.  Friday seems to be the most popular day to take off so either a) Friday is a lousy day to be working as half the people you need to talk to aren't there; or b) Friday is a great day to be working as half the people aren't there and therefore can't bug you :o)

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Re: FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?
« Reply #19 on: June 04, 2020, 02:18:47 AM »
For 8 years before I retired I worked 4 days a week (I got paid for 4 and a half days because slightly long days) and took Mondays off.  Added to retirement it means I haven't had the Monday morning blues for nearly two decades.  Perhaps more importantly I haven't had to listen to anyone else complain about Monday mornings for nearly two decades.

Workwise I found Mondays off worked very well: there are very few deadlines on a Monday to miss or have to bring forward as against a Friday, and not being in on Mondays gives colleagues time to realise they need your input on something but will have to wait for it, boosting one's perceived value to the organisation.

Playing with Fire UK

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Re: FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?
« Reply #20 on: June 04, 2020, 03:05:16 AM »
At my work, taking Monday off is a nightmare because most of our bank holidays are on a Monday, so you end up losing a lot of holiday days to cover them. Different companies address it in different ways.

CrabbitDutchie

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Re: FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?
« Reply #21 on: June 04, 2020, 10:49:59 AM »
Interesting, I don't think I had mentioned which day I was taking off ;)


Playing with Fire UK

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Re: FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?
« Reply #22 on: June 05, 2020, 01:37:04 AM »
We have opinions about these things and demand to be heard! Unless you would prefer we be quiet, that's fine too...

InterfaceLeader

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Re: FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?
« Reply #23 on: June 05, 2020, 10:17:05 AM »
For 8 years before I retired I worked 4 days a week (I got paid for 4 and a half days because slightly long days) and took Mondays off.  Added to retirement it means I haven't had the Monday morning blues for nearly two decades.  Perhaps more importantly I haven't had to listen to anyone else complain about Monday mornings for nearly two decades.

Workwise I found Mondays off worked very well: there are very few deadlines on a Monday to miss or have to bring forward as against a Friday, and not being in on Mondays gives colleagues time to realise they need your input on something but will have to wait for it, boosting one's perceived value to the organisation.

When I was 4 days a week, I didn't work Mondays and it was the ideal day exactly for these reasons. You missed all the negative Monday blues. The only downside was invariably coming in to some 5 or 6 emails from my manager who had an entire day to dream up extra things for me to do.

We got extra holiday entitlement to make up for 'missing' bank holidays.

CrabbitDutchie

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Re: FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?
« Reply #24 on: June 05, 2020, 12:12:55 PM »
opinions are good :)

I actually think Monday might be better for me (I am taking Fridays off, but was just a little taken aback when it was assumed or known without me saying anything).
I'll give it another couple of weeks though and make the switch halfway through if I do

highlandterrier

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Re: FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?
« Reply #25 on: June 05, 2020, 12:22:15 PM »
To be fair you mentioned a three day weekend so it had to be either Friday or Monday :). I take every second Monday off and it's great, Sundays can be truly enjoyed. Fridays at work are the least bad day so would rather work that day. Wednesday off is attractive though, my wife does that and loves it.

Playing with Fire UK

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Re: FARTing out the virus (4 day week for the next 3 months)?
« Reply #26 on: June 06, 2020, 12:42:34 AM »
opinions are good :)

I actually think Monday might be better for me (I am taking Fridays off, but was just a little taken aback when it was assumed or known without me saying anything).
I'll give it another couple of weeks though and make the switch halfway through if I do

I like the idea of switching from Friday to Monday off and having a four day weekend one week.

 

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