Author Topic: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!  (Read 1318283 times)

MaybeBabyMustache

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7850 on: April 23, 2024, 08:13:20 AM »
Not ExFlyboy, but we had some pretty good sushi downtown during our visit!  The park by the river is a nice walk (we stayed at the cheapish hotel just a couple of blocks north of the bridge -- I think it is a Holiday Inn Express?).

Congrats on having made the decision and hope it turns out to be a great fit for your kiddo!

thanks! We are excited to spend time visiting. I grew up not super far away & have never spent time there. I think it will be a great fit for him, and also super happy the decision is made! On to the same process for DS17. ;-)

PathtoFIRE

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7851 on: April 23, 2024, 10:39:29 AM »
In this trip, I splurged and paid for an extra night to ensure that a room would be waiting for us when we arrived in the morning - luxe travel for sure :-)

We did the same for a recent trip with overnight international flight...then our flight times were shifted late enough that it wouldn't have mattered, but additional peace of mind is definitely worth a few extra $.

Another Reader

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7852 on: April 23, 2024, 05:14:54 PM »
Good job, @Dicey!  I paid too much last tax year and this one.  I can't find any property to buy that makes sense and mortgage rates make the numbers worse.  Grrrr...

couponvan

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7853 on: April 23, 2024, 06:12:28 PM »
Iím bougie economy-floor foot sling, the face cushion you blow up, drugs to knock me out, and a lumbar  pillow. Iím also 5í7Ē and 150, so not ďthatĒ big, and the neck pillow with noise canceling headphones. I probably would put a day in between legs of a 24 hour travel and add an extra week of hotels for the $1K per ticket cost.

jeroly

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7854 on: April 24, 2024, 06:35:23 AM »
@2sk22 how long was the flight? I am usually in the ďeconomy flight for luxury roomsĒ camp because flight times are short and business class isnít ďthatĒ much better than economy.
It's around 24 hours from the east coast to get there - maybe a bit less if you get a nonstop to Singapore (pricier ticket) and get a good connection for the 2+ hour flight to Jakarta.  My return via Jeddah left at 1:20pm EDT and arrived at 3:10pm the next day and included a three hour layover.  The other times I've been there I had traveled via Tokyo and it was about the same travel time.

ETA: Oops, sorry, @couponvan , thought you were asking about the flight of @2sk22 to Indonesia, I forgot about the earlier post...

This reminded me - I visited Indonesia back in 1989 and had a wonderful time. I took the day train from Jakarta to Bandung which was over air-conditioned like you mentioned and shivered in a T-shirt. Apart from Java, I also visited Padang on the west coast of Sumatra and Bali (of course).

Car Jack

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7855 on: April 30, 2024, 04:16:23 PM »
So I thought this might be funny to tell.

What would you think the OP of this thread who is now retired with around $4.4M and paid off everything does?  Well, I was at our local Habitat for Humanity ReStore and they had a 10 cent sale on all media.  So I went in with my phone and a box and went through their CDs one by one on my decluttr app (they buy this stuff).  When the box was full and I was done with doing this, I brought my 39 CDs to the counter, paid about $4 with tax and then got the label and mailed these to decluttr for $21 to me.

Exciting, eh?  I like doing stuff like this and figured some of you do too.

couponvan

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7856 on: April 30, 2024, 06:23:54 PM »
So I thought this might be funny to tell.

What would you think the OP of this thread who is now retired with around $4.4M and paid off everything does?  Well, I was at our local Habitat for Humanity ReStore and they had a 10 cent sale on all media.  So I went in with my phone and a box and went through their CDs one by one on my decluttr app (they buy this stuff).  When the box was full and I was done with doing this, I brought my 39 CDs to the counter, paid about $4 with tax and then got the label and mailed these to decluttr for $21 to me.

Exciting, eh?  I like doing stuff like this and figured some of you do too.

Penny wiseÖ.but you had fun! I do this silly stuff too. A penny saved is a penny earned.

Dicey

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7857 on: April 30, 2024, 07:59:52 PM »
So I thought this might be funny to tell.

What would you think the OP of this thread who is now retired with around $4.4M and paid off everything does?  Well, I was at our local Habitat for Humanity ReStore and they had a 10 cent sale on all media.  So I went in with my phone and a box and went through their CDs one by one on my decluttr app (they buy this stuff).  When the box was full and I was done with doing this, I brought my 39 CDs to the counter, paid about $4 with tax and then got the label and mailed these to decluttr for $21 to me.

Exciting, eh?  I like doing stuff like this and figured some of you do too.
Badass!

pecunia

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7858 on: May 02, 2024, 08:23:20 AM »
So I thought this might be funny to tell.

What would you think the OP of this thread who is now retired with around $4.4M and paid off everything does?  Well, I was at our local Habitat for Humanity ReStore and they had a 10 cent sale on all media.  So I went in with my phone and a box and went through their CDs one by one on my decluttr app (they buy this stuff).  When the box was full and I was done with doing this, I brought my 39 CDs to the counter, paid about $4 with tax and then got the label and mailed these to decluttr for $21 to me.

Exciting, eh?  I like doing stuff like this and figured some of you do too.

I wish my local Restore sold CDs.  Isn't it just kind of fun to find "diamonds in the rough?"  It's a little like gold mining and finding a nugget.

Fomerly known as something

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7859 on: May 02, 2024, 04:08:41 PM »
I donít do thrift store.  Mainly because Iím not interested in the whole treasure hunt thing.  I donít even really like places like TJMaxx.  Iím more of the I need black pants, go find them quickly type of person.  And if I know a brand I like and I can quickly go there even better.

Car Jack

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7860 on: May 08, 2024, 07:04:14 AM »
I donít do thrift store.  Mainly because Iím not interested in the whole treasure hunt thing.  I donít even really like places like TJMaxx.  Iím more of the I need black pants, go find them quickly type of person.  And if I know a brand I like and I can quickly go there even better.

You sound like me when I have a specific task.  I've done Christmas shopping at the mall.  Car is parked and I'm in and out in 15 minutes and bought presents for 10 people. 

I left out that when I go to ReStore, it's when DW is grocery shopping at market basket.  I drop her, go to the cheap gas station and fill up.  Go in for the free coffee for filling 8 gallons or more, then off to ReStore for maybe 20 minutes. 

While I will shop for clothes at Savers and Goodwill, it's rare that my favorite stuff is at either.  But I do pick up T shirts from my alma mater for $1.99 where as my son says (he went there too), it would be $40 at the college bookstore.

EscapeVelocity2020

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7861 on: May 08, 2024, 07:29:29 AM »
My daughter likes to shop at Goodwill, but these days I just prefer to avoid crowds.  I'd much rather be outside walking with DW or listening to an Audiobook. 

dividendman

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7862 on: May 08, 2024, 08:39:56 AM »
I donít do thrift store.  Mainly because Iím not interested in the whole treasure hunt thing.  I donít even really like places like TJMaxx.  Iím more of the I need black pants, go find them quickly type of person.  And if I know a brand I like and I can quickly go there even better.

I'm the same. I know what I like to wear. Once I find something I like, I buy like 4+ copies, then I don't need to buy that type of item again for years and I keep an eye out for sales. I have 3 pairs of shoes just sitting in boxes. My shoes wear out fast and I wear the same ones... I also wear pretty much the same thing every day so it makes everything simpler.

couponvan

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7863 on: May 08, 2024, 05:56:37 PM »
Ticking another $.5 off this raceÖ.$.5 to go. I am ready for the beyond after all this treading water the past few years.

2sk22

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7864 on: May 09, 2024, 03:51:51 AM »
Ticking another $.5 off this raceÖ.$.5 to go. I am ready for the beyond after all this treading water the past few years.

I assume you left off the M suffix? :-) And what plants do you have once you become a beyonder?


Bateaux

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7865 on: May 09, 2024, 07:26:49 AM »
If there is one thing we're lacking financially it's cash/taxable accounts. We poured everything into 401K, IRA and non income producing real estate. I'm actually receiving my pension now. The pension is enough to pay most of the expenses, but not all. There is a decent buffer of cash, probably more than enough for quite a while. I'm just wanting a bit larger cash float than current. So using the Rule of 55, I'm taking a small draw from my 401K.  I figured I could do this electronically and just use my 401K like a checking account. Unfortunately it's not that simple. It requires the filing of 5 paper documents each time you take a distribution. You can fax the papers to Schwab, I used a stamp. So I'm using the Pony Express to request funds in 2024. Once you reach 59.5 years of age it will get simpler. You can roll over to an IRA and draw without penalties from your account online. Anybody else have to do this? Just seems a bit archaic.

lhamo

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7866 on: May 09, 2024, 07:38:14 AM »
You know there websites/apps that will send a fax of a pdf over the internet, right?  I guess maybe security of account information is a concern.  But would save you the cost of a stamp and some time waiting for the Pony Express to deliver.

Turtle

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7867 on: May 09, 2024, 07:42:38 AM »
If there is one thing we're lacking financially it's cash/taxable accounts. We poured everything into 401K, IRA and non income producing real estate. I'm actually receiving my pension now. The pension is enough to pay most of the expenses, but not all. There is a decent buffer of cash, probably more than enough for quite a while. I'm just wanting a bit larger cash float than current. So using the Rule of 55, I'm taking a small draw from my 401K.  I figured I could do this electronically and just use my 401K like a checking account. Unfortunately it's not that simple. It requires the filing of 5 paper documents each time you take a distribution. You can fax the papers to Schwab, I used a stamp. So I'm using the Pony Express to request funds in 2024. Once you reach 59.5 years of age it will get simpler. You can roll over to an IRA and draw without penalties from your account online. Anybody else have to do this? Just seems a bit archaic.

I am not yet retired, but in the same boat as far as most of my allocations go.  Is the paperwork due to laws around Rule of 55, or the 401k itself?  Or both?

Fomerly known as something

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7868 on: May 09, 2024, 08:20:22 AM »
If there is one thing we're lacking financially it's cash/taxable accounts. We poured everything into 401K, IRA and non income producing real estate. I'm actually receiving my pension now. The pension is enough to pay most of the expenses, but not all. There is a decent buffer of cash, probably more than enough for quite a while. I'm just wanting a bit larger cash float than current. So using the Rule of 55, I'm taking a small draw from my 401K.  I figured I could do this electronically and just use my 401K like a checking account. Unfortunately it's not that simple. It requires the filing of 5 paper documents each time you take a distribution. You can fax the papers to Schwab, I used a stamp. So I'm using the Pony Express to request funds in 2024. Once you reach 59.5 years of age it will get simpler. You can roll over to an IRA and draw without penalties from your account online. Anybody else have to do this? Just seems a bit archaic.

It varies.  Iím lucky with the Governments TSP, I will be able to just make electronic withdrawals, although I have to make sure at the end of the year they didnít fuck up and code it wrong.  (Aka last year they did for many people so had to reissue 1099s).  since we have special rules to let us get at our money earlier.  On the other hand, for the past 24 years Iíve been working in insurances that are illegal for any employer besides the federal government.  (We arenít subject to all labor laws go figure).

Bateaux

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7869 on: May 09, 2024, 11:06:48 AM »
If there is one thing we're lacking financially it's cash/taxable accounts. We poured everything into 401K, IRA and non income producing real estate. I'm actually receiving my pension now. The pension is enough to pay most of the expenses, but not all. There is a decent buffer of cash, probably more than enough for quite a while. I'm just wanting a bit larger cash float than current. So using the Rule of 55, I'm taking a small draw from my 401K.  I figured I could do this electronically and just use my 401K like a checking account. Unfortunately it's not that simple. It requires the filing of 5 paper documents each time you take a distribution. You can fax the papers to Schwab, I used a stamp. So I'm using the Pony Express to request funds in 2024. Once you reach 59.5 years of age it will get simpler. You can roll over to an IRA and draw without penalties from your account online. Anybody else have to do this? Just seems a bit archaic.

I am not yet retired, but in the same boat as far as most of my allocations go.  Is the paperwork due to laws around Rule of 55, or the 401k itself?  Or both?

According to Schwab some companies have a bit easier set-up. It's far better than 72T which has few choices. The paperwork took me all of 10 minutes to fill out and mail. It's not a problem a large portion of the population has. It's a 4.5 year window of life for those that retire and use the option.

couponvan

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7870 on: May 09, 2024, 12:11:42 PM »
Ticking another $.5 off this raceÖ.$.5 to go. I am ready for the beyond after all this treading water the past few years.

I assume you left off the M suffix? :-) And what plants do you have once you become a beyonder?
Yes.  Well, the plants I want to have when I become a beyonder are lots of drought resistant California native versions that are also decent in wildfire situations because our retirement home will be in CA wine/fire country.

As for plans for when I become a beyonder, that really depends on family and what is going on.  Once March 2026 hits, I'm not working anymore as the kids will be finished with college.  DH doesn't want to hang up his hat before 55, so that's 2027 at the earliest (if he retires, his options/stock vest immediately - so he could lock in his profits).  I'm 55 in March 2026.  There will be much travel from one spot to another I predict.

2sk22

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7871 on: May 09, 2024, 02:16:45 PM »
....
As for plans for when I become a beyonder, that really depends on family and what is going on.  Once March 2026 hits, I'm not working anymore as the kids will be finished with college.  DH doesn't want to hang up his hat before 55, so that's 2027 at the earliest (if he retires, his options/stock vest immediately - so he could lock in his profits).  I'm 55 in March 2026.  There will be much travel from one spot to another I predict.

Kids graduating from college is a great point to retire. In my case, I actually retired the year before my younger daughter started college but it was fine as my wife is still working. Also, it's great that your husband's options vest immediately when retiring. I left a lot of unvested options on the table when I retired - but at some point, enough is enough.

PathtoFIRE

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7872 on: May 09, 2024, 04:41:15 PM »
<snip> Governments TSP, I will be able to just make electronic withdrawals <snip>

My wife has a TSP, and I have something in the back of my mind that the TSP, at least at one time, only allowed two withdrawals; everyone was allowed one partial, but then any second withdrawal must be for the entire remainder. Did I have that wrong, or was there a change in the last few years?

couponvan

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7873 on: May 10, 2024, 11:14:01 AM »
....
As for plans for when I become a beyonder, that really depends on family and what is going on.  Once March 2026 hits, I'm not working anymore as the kids will be finished with college.  DH doesn't want to hang up his hat before 55, so that's 2027 at the earliest (if he retires, his options/stock vest immediately - so he could lock in his profits).  I'm 55 in March 2026.  There will be much travel from one spot to another I predict.

Kids graduating from college is a great point to retire. In my case, I actually retired the year before my younger daughter started college but it was fine as my wife is still working. Also, it's great that your husband's options vest immediately when retiring. I left a lot of unvested options on the table when I retired - but at some point, enough is enough.

I donít actually trust him to retire-heís living the dream with his job right now. But, in two years I am definitely embracing the flit from one space to another desire I have had for a long time.

Fomerly known as something

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7874 on: May 10, 2024, 04:55:33 PM »
<snip> Governments TSP, I will be able to just make electronic withdrawals <snip>

My wife has a TSP, and I have something in the back of my mind that the TSP, at least at one time, only allowed two withdrawals; everyone was allowed one partial, but then any second withdrawal must be for the entire remainder. Did I have that wrong, or was there a change in the last few years?

Many changes to the better in the last few years.  The new interface not so much.  The law is also very specific for special category employees so we can withdraw from TSP with no penalties at any age so long as we can also collect our pension immediately at retirement.

BlueHouse

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7875 on: May 15, 2024, 08:34:47 AM »
I made it!  Just sort of into "...and Beyond" territory. 

okay, so I'm using different rules than I have before, but I needed a goal and this was it.  My LNW finally went beyond $3M and I have $1M equity in house.  I've just been trying to get to that $3M number for a few months.  I've tickled it a few times, but then dropped back down a few hundred thousand away.  I think I did get there one day, but wasn't there to open my accounts, and by the time I downloaded my info, it was down again. 
So I'm celebrating today! 

I know...the home equity means nothing because I'm still in the house.  But, I needed a goal and for having not worked for the past 3 years, I'm pretty psyched!

Fomerly known as something

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7876 on: May 15, 2024, 08:42:17 AM »
@BlueHouse fuzzy Math is 100% ok with me.  I got to this thread years before my LNW with fuzzy Math.

couponvan

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7877 on: May 15, 2024, 01:24:51 PM »
I made it!  Just sort of into "...and Beyond" territory. 

okay, so I'm using different rules than I have before, but I needed a goal and this was it.  My LNW finally went beyond $3M and I have $1M equity in house.  I've just been trying to get to that $3M number for a few months.  I've tickled it a few times, but then dropped back down a few hundred thousand away.  I think I did get there one day, but wasn't there to open my accounts, and by the time I downloaded my info, it was down again. 
So I'm celebrating today! 

I know...the home equity means nothing because I'm still in the house.  But, I needed a goal and for having not worked for the past 3 years, I'm pretty psyched!

I'm an auditor - your fuzzy math is way better than MMM math.  You can sell the house if you don't want to eat ramen at some point in the future.

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7878 on: May 15, 2024, 02:40:46 PM »
I made it!  Just sort of into "...and Beyond" territory. 

okay, so I'm using different rules than I have before, but I needed a goal and this was it.  My LNW finally went beyond $3M and I have $1M equity in house.  I've just been trying to get to that $3M number for a few months.  I've tickled it a few times, but then dropped back down a few hundred thousand away.  I think I did get there one day, but wasn't there to open my accounts, and by the time I downloaded my info, it was down again. 
So I'm celebrating today! 

I know...the home equity means nothing because I'm still in the house.  But, I needed a goal and for having not worked for the past 3 years, I'm pretty psyched!

I'm an auditor - your fuzzy math is way better than MMM math.  You can sell the house if you don't want to eat ramen at some point in the future.

No kidding....having a house you can 1) always sell for a decade worth of expenses, including rent or 2) that (more likely) will be a $1M inheritance for your kids, even if you die with 'nothing'..... is not nothing. 

Exflyboy

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7879 on: May 15, 2024, 06:31:31 PM »
OK who else can hardly wait to add up their NW when the numbers are updated later this evening?..:)

ixtap

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7880 on: May 15, 2024, 10:16:27 PM »
OK who else can hardly wait to add up their NW when the numbers are updated later this evening?..:)

Far too lazy for that. I did check that my equities should be about 4% higher than our last snapshot. It is nice we had a chance to make a few contributions to 401k at lower prices in between.

Dicey

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7881 on: May 15, 2024, 11:20:09 PM »
I made it!  Just sort of into "...and Beyond" territory. 

okay, so I'm using different rules than I have before, but I needed a goal and this was it.  My LNW finally went beyond $3M and I have $1M equity in house.  I've just been trying to get to that $3M number for a few months.  I've tickled it a few times, but then dropped back down a few hundred thousand away.  I think I did get there one day, but wasn't there to open my accounts, and by the time I downloaded my info, it was down again. 
So I'm celebrating today! 

I know...the home equity means nothing because I'm still in the house.  But, I needed a goal and for having not worked for the past 3 years, I'm pretty psyched!
Congratulations! That's a huge achievement! Even if the exact number is a little hard to pin down, it counts, IMO.

I didn't include RE in our pre-FIRE calculations before this thread existed, but we own a fair amount of it. If push came to shove, we could sell our primary for close to $2M (before fees and taxes, of course) and happily move into any of our minimally mortgaged rentals.

A post-FIRE inheritance pushed us into "and Beyond" territory, which still blows my mind. Now I just kind of spitball the numbers and get on with living a happy life.

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7882 on: May 16, 2024, 01:16:36 AM »
I recently gave a FIRE presentation where I told the attendees that the first million takes the longest, the second million comes quickly, and everyone just kind of stops counting after the third million, which was based on the comments I've been reading on this thread about fuzzy math, spitballing numbers, and being too lazy to check NW. You all crack me up! I look forward to getting to the point where I'm just making random ballpark guesses as to net worth.

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7883 on: May 16, 2024, 02:31:15 AM »
I know...the home equity means nothing because I'm still in the house.  But, I needed a goal and for having not worked for the past 3 years, I'm pretty psyched!

Congrats! 

I would definitely not say "home equity means nothing because I'm still in the house." 

Part of my FIRE plan involves being widely diversified to protect against even black swan events.  For me, paying off the house (even though it wasn't mathematically optimal) is useful in that regard.  If other elements of my FIRE plan fall apart (a market crash or a pension bankruptcy, for example) the house gives me the option to downsize and move to a LCOL area.  And a primary residence can be a protected asset in bankruptcies and lawsuits. 

I think of my retirement as having about six major parts between pensions, investment accounts, SS, and house.  If life goes vastly wrong, we could live comfortably on a combination of any two of them. 

Is this paranoid?  Or just very conservative?  I don't know, but it works for me.  FWIW, I don't hoard gold coins or canned food in the basement...

BlueHouse

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7884 on: May 16, 2024, 07:12:30 AM »
Thanks everyone!  It's so fun to share this celebration because I can't do it IRL.  I will still be peeking daily until I'm above for a sustained enough time that I won't fall below it again.   Not sure if that's even possible because this is the first year that I'll have to make a withdrawal for my retirement expenses.  Oh well... I'm pretty thrilled with where I am so I might as well realize that good enough is pretty darn great!

ATtiny85

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7885 on: May 16, 2024, 08:06:44 AM »
OK who else can hardly wait to add up their NW when the numbers are updated later this evening?..:)

I was planning to wait until June before contemplating our next glidepath step, but decided around lunchtime to go ahead and put in another exchange order within my tIRA from VTSAX to VBTLX. So I did go in this morning to our simple spreadsheet and make some updates. Still going to take another step(s) sometime later this year to get where we need to be, and will need to be repeated next year also as we home in on something like 65/35 or maybe even 60/40 (I am finding it very difficult to make a decision...) Of course, it is possible, even somewhat likely, that the market will make the adjustment for me.

lhamo

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7886 on: May 16, 2024, 08:22:25 AM »
TheX and I have completed the paperwork to exchange funds from my Roths and his TradIRA so that our future tax situation will be more or less the same, per our settlement agreement (I had a Roth 403b at my last job so my Roth total was much more than his).  I submitted my paperwork first and the transaction closed this morning.  I'm kind of hoping that things drop a bit again so that I don't have to invest the money coming in from him at even higher prices!  I did have the funds set aside for the transaction in a very conservative fund because I was worried about a market drop.  HIndsight is 20/20.

Taran Wanderer

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7887 on: May 16, 2024, 11:42:14 AM »
We're climbing further into beyond territory.  It's all kind of ridiculous.  The first million took 16 years of careful spending and dedicated saving.  I joined the MMM Forum around that time.  The second million took 6 years, and we joined this club.  The third million took 3 years.  The fourth was less than 2.

Back in the beginning I would hear people say that the first million is the hardest and think, "What a jackass!"  But it's true, the first million is the hardest.

Cheers to everyone approaching this club, in this club, or in the beyond.  Your hard work is paying off!

EscapeVelocity2020

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7888 on: May 16, 2024, 12:12:07 PM »
Yeah, I'm finally getting around to doing a little bit of work with my tax folks that will net me over $10,000 extra a year...  I could've done this back in 2019 when foreign tax collectors started this 25% withholding on my IRA dividends, but I've just been too lazy until now (that and the fact that dividends keep going up nicely)...  It's all very ridiculous at these levels, keeping track of all the leaks.  I sorta miss making $20/week for mowing the neighbor's lawn and feeling rich :)

Turtle

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7889 on: May 16, 2024, 12:13:41 PM »
Thanks everyone!  It's so fun to share this celebration because I can't do it IRL.  I will still be peeking daily until I'm above for a sustained enough time that I won't fall below it again.   Not sure if that's even possible because this is the first year that I'll have to make a withdrawal for my retirement expenses.  Oh well... I'm pretty thrilled with where I am so I might as well realize that good enough is pretty darn great!

Congrats from me as well!  I totally hear you on the celebrating here vs IRL.  Mid month check in has me at a new high water mark, 2 years ahead of where I hoped to hit it.  Unlikely that I'll hit 3 any time soon, or ever, but being solidly in this race enough to not drop back out - exactly the feelings you expressed in your last sentence.

secondcor521

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7890 on: May 16, 2024, 12:17:46 PM »
I recently gave a FIRE presentation where I told the attendees that the first million takes the longest, the second million comes quickly, and everyone just kind of stops counting after the third million, which was based on the comments I've been reading on this thread about fuzzy math, spitballing numbers, and being too lazy to check NW. You all crack me up! I look forward to getting to the point where I'm just making random ballpark guesses as to net worth.

Still not sure I feel or am a part of this club.

I literally at certain points - years ago - would count the cash and spare change in my wallet as a net worth line item and would update it sometimes in an effort to hit a round number milestone.  Like if I was at $9,997.42 I'd go check my wallet and update my spreadsheet just to get over $10K.

At a certain point it gets to be somewhere between too much work and impossible to be precise to the penny anyway.  I have assets that value throughout the trading day, assets that value at the close, and assets that value overnight.  I spend  money nearly daily, and sometimes don't feel like entering those receipts for a day or two.

Then there are the assets that are known to be of some value but of an uncertain amount:

A.  I have a side gig that brings in $XK a year - but the yearly income varies by 50% or more, so I just use the current year's predicted income and multiply by 25.  But that's not right, because I'll stop doing that side gig at some point when it becomes less fun and more hassle.

B.  Social Security.  Lots of ways this will be worth less, maybe a few in which it will be worth more.  Congress, my longevity, inflation, wage inflation, budget reform, etc.

C.  My house.  Paid off, but do I use Zillow, Realtor.com, actual realtor comps?  Those sites vary by $10s of $Ks.

D.  Inheritance.  Obviously lots of minefields here, including emotional and relational ones, and again, like SS, lots of ways for it to be worth less and maybe a few in which it may be more.

E.  And of course, market assets vary by a percent or sometimes more in a day or week.

Finally, it's rather futile in my case.  My net WR% per my spreadsheet is 1.13% (and that excludes my house and possible inheritance).  So I was sort of excited to update with the market's new highs yesterday, but I then had a "ho hum" reaction because it was really just more money that I wasn't going to spend in my lifetime.  Mostly now I try to figure out the ways to play the game best for and with my offspring, who are all already doing well on their own.

ottawan

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7891 on: May 17, 2024, 09:28:23 PM »
Hi everyone, long time MMM forum lurker but haven't posted anything much in years.
I've been reading this thread recently with interest and wanted to say hello (from Ontario Canada).  Our NW in investments is over $4M and another >$1M in our primary residence plus cottage we bought several years ago so we are in the 'beyond' group.
My DH and I are in our late 40s, both still working FT, with 2 kids ages 11 and 14. We know our financial situation is secure, but both having grown up in families with very little, never really feel comfortable thinking we've "made it".  We've been fortunate to have done well in our careers and investments, live well within our means and generally quite enjoy our work and the mental challenges it offers.  So, while I often think about RE, as it would be so unusual amongst our family and friends, and DH isnt comfortable retiring yet, we don't actually have plans to retire soon.
  I'd like to in the next 2-3 yrs but DH seems to think he will work another 10+yrs!  I have a lot of hobbies,  love travel, have friends around the world I'd love to see more frequently but have a DH who likes to stay home mostly.  A conundrum.  I do most of the financial planning, investing, FIRE reading, but he's content with the traditional path.  I've read enough case studies and other threads to see this discussed but it's strange to be at this stage of having more than we'd ever planned for, especially in the last 3 yrs with me shifting to consulting work yet having no plan to stop and enjoy the fruits of our labour for more than 1-2 weeks vacation at a time.  Anyone else go through this and convince their spouse it's ok to RE, or did you just RE while spouse kept on working years more?  That question may be better for another discussion/thread, but given everyone in this thread has a healthy NW thought I'd ask.  Also it's nice to say out loud to someone that we've worked really hard and saved so well. Nobody IRL knows we have >$4M as our lifestyle hasn't changed and we mainly just put it all into investments...so, this post is also a small cheer and a yay us post too!😊

MaybeBabyMustache

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7892 on: May 18, 2024, 07:35:32 AM »
@ottawan - welcome & I can kind of relate. I'm in my late 40s, DH is in his late 50s. We're about to become empty nesters (DS18 leaves for college this fall, DS17 is one year behind him.) I have a very clear vision of our empty nester lifestyle, and it doesn't include much work. DH has always said he wants to "work" in some capacity forever, which is fine with me. But, I want that work to get more flexible over time, so we can spend more time together, doing lots of things, including planning.

He asked as recently as last night if we can afford a three week trip to Europe next year. We have a paid off $4m house, $3m in retirement, paid for college accounts for the teens, and another $800k.... I think we're okay. For him, the income coming in is much more meaningful, and drawing down assets is... scary. He objectively understands that we have "enough", and came around quickly that we can do many trips to Europe, if we want.

I was unexpectedly FIREd (laid off at the end of April), so we hadn't quite prepared to have all of these conversation so soon. They are very helpful, and we're both thinking creatively about the collision of our empty nest years + one of us being FIREd. Anyway, I'd encourage more discussion & thinking, as well as you sketching out what your ideal FIRE'd life would look like. He may just want to work longer because he nejoys it, and that's fine. But, if one spouse is working & one isn't, I think plenty of clear communication is required.

ROF Expat

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7893 on: May 18, 2024, 08:14:46 AM »
  I'd like to in the next 2-3 yrs but DH seems to think he will work another 10+yrs!  I have a lot of hobbies,  love travel, have friends around the world I'd love to see more frequently but have a DH who likes to stay home mostly.  A conundrum.  Anyone else go through this and convince their spouse it's ok to RE, or did you just RE while spouse kept on working years more?  😊

If you search this forum, you'll find a number of discussions about getting a spouse on board with ER and on retiring while your spouse continues to work. 

FWIW, I am retired and my spouse continues to work.  Part of the reason it works is because we were already FI at a level that would cover the lifestyle we wanted.  With a young kid, I thought it was important to be clear that I was "retiring" not "quitting to be a stay-at-home dad."  I think that the key to our success was 100% communication and agreement.  If my spouse weren't in agreement, I would probably have continued to work, at least part time, rather than create problems in our relationship. 

Good luck!  And congrats on your financial successes!

FireLane

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7894 on: May 18, 2024, 08:37:21 AM »
I'd like to in the next 2-3 yrs but DH seems to think he will work another 10+yrs!  I have a lot of hobbies,  love travel, have friends around the world I'd love to see more frequently but have a DH who likes to stay home mostly.  A conundrum.  I do most of the financial planning, investing, FIRE reading, but he's content with the traditional path.  I've read enough case studies and other threads to see this discussed but it's strange to be at this stage of having more than we'd ever planned for, especially in the last 3 yrs with me shifting to consulting work yet having no plan to stop and enjoy the fruits of our labour for more than 1-2 weeks vacation at a time.  Anyone else go through this and convince their spouse it's ok to RE, or did you just RE while spouse kept on working years more?

I'm in the same situation. I've been around $2.5M for a while. That third million is taking an annoyingly long time, mostly because of the market drop in 2022.

I FIREd in 2021, but my wife is still working, by her own choice. She has a pretty easy job with good benefits, so she's reluctant to give it up. I can't complain too much, since her income covers our spending and I don't have to draw down on investments. It's also worked out well for me to be the stay-at-home parent and handle the cooking and other household chores.

But I'd really like to travel more and be more adventurous, and we're limited by her work schedule until she quits. I don't want to pressure her, but I also feel like we've won the game already. We have our freedom, we should be taking advantage of it!

In the past, she's said she'll FIRE when we hit $3M. If the market cooperates, that could be within another year or two, so I'll have to revisit that discussion when the time comes and see how she feels.

EscapeVelocity2020

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7895 on: May 18, 2024, 08:39:57 AM »
  I'd like to in the next 2-3 yrs but DH seems to think he will work another 10+yrs!  I have a lot of hobbies,  love travel, have friends around the world I'd love to see more frequently but have a DH who likes to stay home mostly.  A conundrum.  Anyone else go through this and convince their spouse it's ok to RE, or did you just RE while spouse kept on working years more?  😊

If you search this forum, you'll find a number of discussions about getting a spouse on board with ER and on retiring while your spouse continues to work. 

FWIW, I am retired and my spouse continues to work.  Part of the reason it works is because we were already FI at a level that would cover the lifestyle we wanted.  With a young kid, I thought it was important to be clear that I was "retiring" not "quitting to be a stay-at-home dad."  I think that the key to our success was 100% communication and agreement.  If my spouse weren't in agreement, I would probably have continued to work, at least part time, rather than create problems in our relationship. 

Good luck!  And congrats on your financial successes!

That bolded bit really caught my eye @ROF Expat , I'd love for you to elaborate if you don't mind!

Our anecdote was that DW 'retired' / SAHP when we became expats in 2007.  Up to that point, there was a lot of tension around her job.  Her work was very flexible, but paid about $40k and we were paying somewhere around $24k for daycare.  She was fine with working, but too exhausted to enjoy our newborn and 2 year old and didn't like putting them in daycare.  I was the one chomping at the bit to retire from my contract engineering job and all the overtime, but my pay and benefits were really good.  We had hit our lean FI number.  Thank goodness I was able to switch jobs and try an expat assignment at the time, it fixed all our problems in one fell swoop.  We were firmly FI once that assignment ended (despite the Global Financial Collapse in 2008/9), but I enjoyed the work and expat life so much that we did another assignment in 2011 and I'm still working now.  Final kid is headed off to college, DW is back working full time, and options are abundant about what lies in store...

So I guess my point is to stay flexible, keep an open mind for ways to improve and try new things, and be willing to take some risks.  When we did that first expat assignment in 2007, we sold the house and cars and headed to Norway with a 1 and 3 year old!  Having FI gives you a huge safety net.

Dicey

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7896 on: May 18, 2024, 09:57:05 AM »
Welcome, and congratulations, @ottawan! It's always lovely to have more people join the ranks.

I'm going to make a gentle observation. It may seem so at first, but I am not being a Grammar Nazi, I promise.

As I read your post, it struck me that you are cramming so much information into every sentence there is no room to breathe. You've been in "go, go, go" mode for so long that it feels normal to you. Taking/making more time for yourself might be an important first step for you on the path to RE.

To answer your question, I retired in 2012. DH continued to work until 2022. For the first ~ 7 years, his mom and her pal, AL Z. Heimer, lived with us, as did his young adult son. I actively looked for things to do (and continued doing things I was already doing) to keep my sanity. Now that his mom has passed, and the bonus kid is launched, I have expanded the things I do in ways that feel organic. DH jokes that I'm the President of Everything, but it's really just that I kept skipping my turn when I had so many obligations at home. I am a reasonable amount of busy and very connected in my community,  which is just the way I like it. My busy-ness ebbs and flows, which makes me happy. I do have occasional days where I never leave the house and stay in my bathrobe all day, too.

Now that DH has retired, he's struggling a bit, because work was his social network. He has plenty of projects to do while he figures out how busy he wants to be.

In the meantime, we both have plenty of time to b-r-e-a-t-h-e, ant it feels amazing!

Dicey

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7897 on: May 18, 2024, 10:17:27 AM »
After posting the above, i stumbled on this article from Travel + Leisure:

https://www.travelandleisure.com/new-york-city-named-wealthiest-city-in-the-world-8648801

Specifically, this caught my eye, as it was relevant to @BlueHouse's recent post/discussion. Bold is mine.

"The company also shared its definition of "wealth," which it refers to as an "individualís liquid investable wealth, which only includes listed company holdings, cash holdings, and debt-free residential property holdings." Additionally, it noted it defined "high-net-worth individuals" as those with $1 million or more in liquid, investable assets."

What I find most curious is how they mine their information to determine the number of milionaires. Our money is not all in ine place, so who besides us has any idea of what we are worth? If a couple has multi-millions, do they count as one millionaire or two?

Fun stuff to think about on a lazy Saturday morning.

ROF Expat

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7898 on: May 18, 2024, 03:15:55 PM »
That bolded bit really caught my eye @ROF Expat , I'd love for you to elaborate if you don't mind!

@EscapeVelocity2020 I've read a number of your posts in the past, and I think our situations and outlooks have a lot in common. 

My spouse and I had careers overseas.  We both loved our work and knew it would be almost impossible to work in the same country as we became more senior in our organizations.  When that time came, I told my wife I was willing to RE.  I had already reached a very high level in my profession, and it seemed right to offer my wife her chance to do the same.  We were already FI. 

I am a believer in communication in marriage.  I would rather have difficult conversations before making big decisions than misunderstandings afterward, so I thought it was important that we agree that I was "retiring."  To me, this meant I was going to follow my interests, which involve a substantial amount of travel (solo at this point) and money.  I wasn't "quitting my job to be a SAHD, which would imply taking primary responsibility for childcare and the  house.  I would happily spend a lot of time at home with my child (which I love and is a great benefit of RE), but we would continue paying for help with childcare and the house.  Essentially, I'd be living the retirement life we planned to have together, but I'd be starting earlier.  I wouldn't have proposed this if it harmed our shared family and financial goals.  At the same time, my wife's choice to continue working past FI shouldn't mean I can't retire. 

We had serious conversations to be sure there were no hidden doubts.  To try and prevent problems, I sold some of my investments to pay off our mortgage.  I use my pension income to pay for my travel and hobbies as well as to contribute to shared expenses and fund our 529 plan.  It shouldn't really matter since all our assets are jointly owned, but I'd feel funny using my wife's income to travel without her. 

Being FI gave us the finances to make it possible. 

EscapeVelocity2020

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #7899 on: May 18, 2024, 03:49:15 PM »
That's really cool ROF Expat!  100% agree that communication is key in FIRE.  One of the reasons I didn't ER right at FI was the complication around becoming a stay at home parent.  It made much more sense for DW to go the SAHP route once we started the expat assignments.  I was very fortunate because she was open minded and adventurous.  I was on a 'commuter assignment' to Paris around when Covid hit and haven't traveled since, so I'm back considering the options around ER...  DW and I have lots of walks and talks about it...

 

Wow, a phone plan for fifteen bucks!