Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!

[SwordGuy]

So gang - what would you do?  Age 57, in great health, great family, $4.3M total net worth, with no major future expenses (such as college - all done with that!) on the horizon. 

I had planned to hang up the laptop back on March 1 - however the allure of work from home ended up getting me - so now am nearing the half way point of my latest "OMY".  Meantime I am really, REALLY losing interest in life at Mega Corp.  The stupid meetings, the dumb projects and the endless Powerpoints.......so exhausting.  Sooo - the dilemma - if I resign as of Sep 1 I walk away from 2022 bonus, some shares vesting as of next Feb, after tax cash compensation and 401k match between then and now that amounts to $170k all in.  I look at that statistic daily and it keeps me from writing the resignation e-mail.   Which brings me to my question - am I being silly tying myself to that "addition" to our NW?  I hate so say this but I find myself "wishing away" 6 months of life just to get to March 1......

Any thoughts???

Much love!

We have about $1.6m in stocks and bonds.   A 1% rise in the S&P works out to around $10-11k.  In an average results years I can expect a 10% rise in total, or about $100,000 to $110,000 counting dividends.

I'm guessing you have way more in your stock and bond portfolio than we do.   With a $3m portfolio we would be looking at $300,000 to $330,000 in average gains for doing nothing at all -- no powerpoints, no dumb projects, etc.    At a certain point, you have "enough".   

Are you there yet?   Because if you are, that $170k is meaningless but the boredom and frustration never are.

[Dicey]

So gang - what would you do?  Age 57, in great health, great family, $4.3M total net worth, with no major future expenses (such as college - all done with that!) on the horizon. 

I had planned to hang up the laptop back on March 1 - however the allure of work from home ended up getting me - so now am nearing the half way point of my latest "OMY".  Meantime I am really, REALLY losing interest in life at Mega Corp.  The stupid meetings, the dumb projects and the endless Powerpoints.......so exhausting.  Sooo - the dilemma - if I resign as of Sep 1 I walk away from 2022 bonus, some shares vesting as of next Feb, after tax cash compensation and 401k match between then and now that amounts to $170k all in.  I look at that statistic daily and it keeps me from writing the resignation e-mail.   Which brings me to my question - am I being silly tying myself to that "addition" to our NW?  I hate so say this but I find myself "wishing away" 6 months of life just to get to March 1......

Any thoughts???

Much love!

$170k is a drop in the bucket vs. $4.3M.

If you were terminally ill and could extend your life pain-free for 6 months for the price of $170k, would you do it?

Also: Read "Die With Zero".

[arcturus]

So gang - what would you do?  Age 57, in great health, great family, $4.3M total net worth, with no major future expenses (such as college - all done with that!) on the horizon. 

I had planned to hang up the laptop back on March 1 - however the allure of work from home ended up getting me - so now am nearing the half way point of my latest "OMY".  Meantime I am really, REALLY losing interest in life at Mega Corp.  The stupid meetings, the dumb projects and the endless Powerpoints.......so exhausting.  Sooo - the dilemma - if I resign as of Sep 1 I walk away from 2022 bonus, some shares vesting as of next Feb, after tax cash compensation and 401k match between then and now that amounts to $170k all in.  I look at that statistic daily and it keeps me from writing the resignation e-mail.   Which brings me to my question - am I being silly tying myself to that "addition" to our NW?  I hate so say this but I find myself "wishing away" 6 months of life just to get to March 1......

Any thoughts???

Much love!

You have virtually described the scenario I'm aspiring to, although my target at present is age 56 with $4M NW and $3.25M invested.  I would like to think that when I cross over that threshhold it will be a binary decision.    I suppose if I were a month away from a significant event at that time...e.g., stock vest, etc., I might hold on.   But 6 months feels like I'm on a treadmill, because when you get there, it will only be another 3 months until some other event, and then its only.....  you get the idea.    My 2 cents....but you effectively enjoy today the scenario that I aspire to. 

[Bateaux]

So gang - what would you do?  Age 57, in great health, great family, $4.3M total net worth, with no major future expenses (such as college - all done with that!) on the horizon. 

I had planned to hang up the laptop back on March 1 - however the allure of work from home ended up getting me - so now am nearing the half way point of my latest "OMY".  Meantime I am really, REALLY losing interest in life at Mega Corp.  The stupid meetings, the dumb projects and the endless Powerpoints.......so exhausting.  Sooo - the dilemma - if I resign as of Sep 1 I walk away from 2022 bonus, some shares vesting as of next Feb, after tax cash compensation and 401k match between then and now that amounts to $170k all in.  I look at that statistic daily and it keeps me from writing the resignation e-mail.   Which brings me to my question - am I being silly tying myself to that "addition" to our NW?  I hate so say this but I find myself "wishing away" 6 months of life just to get to March 1......

Any thoughts???

Much love!

Go.  It's not worth it.  Your accounts will be earning up to $1000 a day.

[pecunia]

So gang - what would you do?  Age 57, in great health, great family, $4.3M total net worth, with no major future expenses (such as college - all done with that!) on the horizon. 

I had planned to hang up the laptop back on March 1 - however the allure of work from home ended up getting me - so now am nearing the half way point of my latest "OMY".  Meantime I am really, REALLY losing interest in life at Mega Corp.  The stupid meetings, the dumb projects and the endless Powerpoints.......so exhausting.  Sooo - the dilemma - if I resign as of Sep 1 I walk away from 2022 bonus, some shares vesting as of next Feb, after tax cash compensation and 401k match between then and now that amounts to $170k all in.  I look at that statistic daily and it keeps me from writing the resignation e-mail.   Which brings me to my question - am I being silly tying myself to that "addition" to our NW?  I hate so say this but I find myself "wishing away" 6 months of life just to get to March 1......

Any thoughts???

Much love!

Let's see the title of this is "Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!"  It appears sir that you have reached that great Beyond.  You can now smile at your Mega Corp companions who have accompanied you on your journey to this great beyond.  Place a hand on their shoulders, give them a smile of understanding and tell them that you hope that someday they too will be able to understand the great beyond.  They will tell fond tales of their adventures in Mega Corp with you in the years to come.  Some of the tales will bring smiles to their faces and some may ring tears to their eyes.

Come join us in your personal Shangri-la.

[Fomerly known as something]

@Bateaux.  As the better off kid.  I don’t need my parents money.  It actually annoys me that my mom keeps trying to give me stuff and more money.  I literally turn around and give the money away, but resent my mom when she says I can afford X (some item/experience) with the money she gave me.

[Exflyboy]

So gang - what would you do?  Age 57, in great health, great family, $4.3M total net worth, with no major future expenses (such as college - all done with that!) on the horizon. 

I had planned to hang up the laptop back on March 1 - however the allure of work from home ended up getting me - so now am nearing the half way point of my latest "OMY".  Meantime I am really, REALLY losing interest in life at Mega Corp.  The stupid meetings, the dumb projects and the endless Powerpoints.......so exhausting.  Sooo - the dilemma - if I resign as of Sep 1 I walk away from 2022 bonus, some shares vesting as of next Feb, after tax cash compensation and 401k match between then and now that amounts to $170k all in.  I look at that statistic daily and it keeps me from writing the resignation e-mail.   Which brings me to my question - am I being silly tying myself to that "addition" to our NW?  I hate so say this but I find myself "wishing away" 6 months of life just to get to March 1......

Any thoughts???

Much love!

$170k is a drop in the bucket vs. $4.3M.

If you were terminally ill and could extend your life pain-free for 6 months for the price of $170k, would you do it?

Also: Read "Die With Zero".

I agree with Dicey and we happen to be in the same position with regards to Networth/health/zero financial commitments.

Having said that would I wait 6 months for an extra $170k's worth of gravy? Yeah I probably would honestly, but I could easily see how I might end up regretting that decision.

[Bateaux]

@Bateaux.  As the better off kid.  I don’t need my parents money.  It actually annoys me that my mom keeps trying to give me stuff and more money.  I literally turn around and give the money away, but resent my mom when she says I can afford X (some item/experience) with the money she gave me.

I probably shouldn't be airing this crap out to you guys.  But, you are the best of the best.  I'm imposing my own thought battles upon you.  I do value the input immensely.   The youngest son is working his tail off with the remodel of the house.  It's just an old fishing camp, but the location can't be beat.  Waterfront property on the bayou and only one lot over from our house.  Things are going really good.  Lumber even dropped in price a little bit.
Thanks friends.

[soccerluvof4]

So gang - what would you do?  Age 57, in great health, great family, $4.3M total net worth, with no major future expenses (such as college - all done with that!) on the horizon. 

I had planned to hang up the laptop back on March 1 - however the allure of work from home ended up getting me - so now am nearing the half way point of my latest "OMY".  Meantime I am really, REALLY losing interest in life at Mega Corp.  The stupid meetings, the dumb projects and the endless Powerpoints.......so exhausting.  Sooo - the dilemma - if I resign as of Sep 1 I walk away from 2022 bonus, some shares vesting as of next Feb, after tax cash compensation and 401k match between then and now that amounts to $170k all in.  I look at that statistic daily and it keeps me from writing the resignation e-mail.   Which brings me to my question - am I being silly tying myself to that "addition" to our NW?  I hate so say this but I find myself "wishing away" 6 months of life just to get to March 1......

Any thoughts???

Much love!

$170k is a drop in the bucket vs. $4.3M.

If you were terminally ill and could extend your life pain-free for 6 months for the price of $170k, would you do it?

Also: Read "Die With Zero".

I agree with Dicey and we happen to be in the same position with regards to Networth/health/zero financial commitments.

Having said that would I wait 6 months for an extra $170k's worth of gravy? Yeah I probably would honestly, but I could easily see how I might end up regretting that decision.

I can see the MMP dilemma BUT I would slightly side as well in collecting the 170k. But that for sure would be it regardless if the market has a significant correction or not.

[trashtalk]

If you push through to March 1, think of the whole thing as a slow road to departure.

Even before you reveal your exit plan, make sure your replacements and team are prepped, start clearing out your office, start planning your home setup post-retirement and thinking about a schedule, start detaching emotionally and downshifting by starting to limit your responses to calls and emails on weekends and evenings, declining meetings, not picking up new assignments, etc.

The hardest part will be Aug-Sept-Oct-Nov.

Take two or three weeks off in December. Return in January with the plan in mind, tell people at the end of the month. February will be lots of emotions but also probably quieter than you think, especially once you tell people.

[Exflyboy]

If you push through to March 1, think of the whole thing as a slow road to departure.

Even before you reveal your exit plan, make sure your replacements and team are prepped, start clearing out your office, start planning your home setup post-retirement and thinking about a schedule, start detaching emotionally and downshifting by starting to limit your responses to calls and emails on weekends and evenings, declining meetings, not picking up new assignments, etc.

The hardest part will be Aug-Sept-Oct-Nov.

Take two or three weeks off in December. Return in January with the plan in mind, tell people at the end of the month. February will be lots of emotions but also probably quieter than you think, especially once you tell people.

Your reply took me back to the time I did this some 7.5 years ago. I absolutely hated the company I worked for and the bosses who treated my team like absolute shyte.. I was their manager.

I had decided I was done just prior to Christmas, but financially it made sense to work to April to fully find my 401k, Roth IRA and HSA.

I went back to work on Jan 4th 2014 and the feeling of dread I had when the alarm went off at 4:30am in preparation to drive the 80 miles to the place I despised was awful.

When I got there, the first thing I learned was that one of my most excellent technicians had his adult Daughter pass away over the Christmas break, she was 28 I believe.

That sense of "WTF is it all about" hit me like a ton of bricks.

It was pretty clear there was no way I was going to make it till April!

Turns out they wer'nt happy with me anyway so they fired me a week and a half later with a 4 month "sign here that you won't sue us" severence check!

It was a most surreal experience.

[pecunia]

If you push through to March 1, think of the whole thing as a slow road to departure.

Even before you reveal your exit plan, make sure your replacements and team are prepped, start clearing out your office, start planning your home setup post-retirement and thinking about a schedule, start detaching emotionally and downshifting by starting to limit your responses to calls and emails on weekends and evenings, declining meetings, not picking up new assignments, etc.

The hardest part will be Aug-Sept-Oct-Nov.

Take two or three weeks off in December. Return in January with the plan in mind, tell people at the end of the month. February will be lots of emotions but also probably quieter than you think, especially once you tell people.

Your reply took me back to the time I did this some 7.5 years ago. I absolutely hated the company I worked for and the bosses who treated my team like absolute shyte.. I was their manager.

I had decided I was done just prior to Christmas, but financially it made sense to work to April to fully find my 401k, Roth IRA and HSA.

I went back to work on Jan 4th 2014 and the feeling of dread I had when the alarm went off at 4:30am in preparation to drive the 80 miles to the place I despised was awful.

When I got there, the first thing I learned was that one of my most excellent technicians had his adult Daughter pass away over the Christmas break, she was 28 I believe.

That sense of "WTF is it all about" hit me like a ton of bricks.

It was pretty clear there was no way I was going to make it till April!

Turns out they wer'nt happy with me anyway so they fired me a week and a half later with a 4 month "sign here that you won't sue us" severence check!

It was a most surreal experience.

It sounds like the bad thing was actually a good thing.  Thanks for sharing that.  I think too many of these bright successful people posting herein just love their jobs, OMY, TMY, TMY+1,......  And, they don't even need the money!

[rmorris50]

My husband has at this moment has the opportunity to pull the FU I got money card but won’t do it and is taking the high road, even though I have told him many times over the weekend I support that move.

He started a news job as a nurse manager at a for profit hospital 8 months ago and the place is a dysfunctional mess, since they are always extremely understaffed (shock). He was hired to oversee 4 units and affect change, but what they really wanted was another nurse, and lo and behold he can’t do both. It came to a head Friday and they asked him to resign.

I said you hate that effin’ place, don’t go back and let them deal with their mess. We have plenty of money for you to take time off and figure out what’s next. But he is insisting on going in the next FOUR WEEKS that he has left.

He’s too nice. Just goes to show how ingrained we are to operate in corporate USA, even when you have the eff you money.


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[EscapeVelocity2020]

My husband has at this moment has the opportunity to pull the FU I got money card but won’t do it and is taking the high road, even though I have told him many times over the weekend I support that move.

He started a news job as a nurse manager at a for profit hospital 8 months ago and the place is a dysfunctional mess, since they are always extremely understaffed (shock). He was hired to oversee 4 units and affect change, but what they really wanted was another nurse, and lo and behold he can’t do both. It came to a head Friday and they asked him to resign.

I said you hate that effin’ place, don’t go back and let them deal with their mess. We have plenty of money for you to take time off and figure out what’s next. But he is insisting on going in the next FOUR WEEKS that he has left.

He’s too nice. Just goes to show how ingrained we are to operate in corporate USA, even when you have the eff you money.

If it makes you or him feel any better, DW is in a similar place of not needing the money but going in as a long term substitute teacher starting tomorrow.  The demand for teachers and nurses is intense here in Texas, and won't be easing up anytime soon!  She literally gets 3 or more offers a day, and this is before school has even started.  I'm imagining, once kids and teachers are getting Covid (no mask mandate in our school district and relatively low vaccination rate in school-age kids), it'll only get worse...

[2sk22]

Here is something fun: https://www.reddit.com/r/FinancialPlanning/comments/p4qplj/if_you_had_5_million_dollars_what_would_you_do

It was interesting reading about what others would do if they were in a situation similar to those of people in this group.

[rmorris50]

Here is something fun: https://www.reddit.com/r/FinancialPlanning/comments/p4qplj/if_you_had_5_million_dollars_what_would_you_do

It was interesting reading about what others would do if they were in a situation similar to those of people in this group.

I get the sentiment, but most people answered as if they were given $5m of after tax money all at once to do with as they please. While most of us here have accounts that have been built up over time and are socially engineered with rules, stipulations, tax consequences, tied up in real estate, etc. Everyone wants to control your money, and it makes quitting your job a much more complicated decision!


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[Dicey]

My husband has at this moment has the opportunity to pull the FU I got money card but won’t do it and is taking the high road, even though I have told him many times over the weekend I support that move.

He started a news job as a nurse manager at a for profit hospital 8 months ago and the place is a dysfunctional mess, since they are always extremely understaffed (shock). He was hired to oversee 4 units and affect change, but what they really wanted was another nurse, and lo and behold he can’t do both. It came to a head Friday and they asked him to resign.

I said you hate that effin’ place, don’t go back and let them deal with their mess. We have plenty of money for you to take time off and figure out what’s next. But he is insisting on going in the next FOUR WEEKS that he has left.

He’s too nice. Just goes to show how ingrained we are to operate in corporate USA, even when you have the eff you money.

If it makes you or him feel any better, DW is in a similar place of not needing the money but going in as a long term substitute teacher starting tomorrow.  The demand for teachers and nurses is intense here in Texas, and won't be easing up anytime soon!  She literally gets 3 or more offers a day, and this is before school has even started.  I'm imagining, once kids and teachers are getting Covid (no mask mandate in our school district and relatively low vaccination rate in school-age kids), it'll only get worse...

I just overheard a conversation today. The person was visiting from Texas. Apparently she used to live here. She was rather condescending about how much "freer" things are in Texas vis a vis masks and related Covid protocols. Good for you lady, but please don't expect tears from us when people die unnecessarily. Sheesh.

[Dicey]

Here is something fun: https://www.reddit.com/r/FinancialPlanning/comments/p4qplj/if_you_had_5_million_dollars_what_would_you_do

It was interesting reading about what others would do if they were in a situation similar to those of people in this group.

I get the sentiment, but most people answered as if they were given $5m of after tax money all at once to do with as they please. While most of us here have accounts that have been built up over time and are socially engineered with rules, stipulations, tax consequences, tied up in real estate, etc. Everyone wants to control your money, and it makes quitting your job a much more complicated decision!

Funny, DH and I just finished a road trip. At one point, I asked him what he'd do with an extra million dollars. After much discussion, he said he'd buy a diesel truck, but only one with a pre-2006 engine. Yeah, that's going to made a real dent, dude. Thing is, it's not a theoretical comversation, exactly...

[arcturus]

Here is something fun: https://www.reddit.com/r/FinancialPlanning/comments/p4qplj/if_you_had_5_million_dollars_what_would_you_do

It was interesting reading about what others would do if they were in a situation similar to those of people in this group.

I get the sentiment, but most people answered as if they were given $5m of after tax money all at once to do with as they please. While most of us here have accounts that have been built up over time and are socially engineered with rules, stipulations, tax consequences, tied up in real estate, etc. Everyone wants to control your money, and it makes quitting your job a much more complicated decision!


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Well said!

[Bateaux]

Here is something fun: https://www.reddit.com/r/FinancialPlanning/comments/p4qplj/if_you_had_5_million_dollars_what_would_you_do

It was interesting reading about what others would do if they were in a situation similar to those of people in this group.

I get the sentiment, but most people answered as if they were given $5m of after tax money all at once to do with as they please. While most of us here have accounts that have been built up over time and are socially engineered with rules, stipulations, tax consequences, tied up in real estate, etc. Everyone wants to control your money, and it makes quitting your job a much more complicated decision!

Funny, DH and I just finished a road trip. At one point, I asked him what he'd do with an extra million dollars. After much discussion, he said he'd buy a diesel truck, but only one with a pre-2006 engine. Yeah, that's going to made a real dent, dude. Thing is, it's not a theoretical comversation, exactly...

Smart man.  The diesel engines were less complicated back then. 

[Dicey]

Here is something fun: https://www.reddit.com/r/FinancialPlanning/comments/p4qplj/if_you_had_5_million_dollars_what_would_you_do

It was interesting reading about what others would do if they were in a situation similar to those of people in this group.

I get the sentiment, but most people answered as if they were given $5m of after tax money all at once to do with as they please. While most of us here have accounts that have been built up over time and are socially engineered with rules, stipulations, tax consequences, tied up in real estate, etc. Everyone wants to control your money, and it makes quitting your job a much more complicated decision!

Funny, DH and I just finished a road trip. At one point, I asked him what he'd do with an extra million dollars. After much discussion, he said he'd buy a diesel truck, but only one with a pre-2006 engine. Yeah, that's going to made a real dent, dude. Thing is, it's not a theoretical comversation, exactly...

Smart man.  The diesel engines were less complicated back then.

Yeah, our RV is on the Sprinter platform and everything about it is a pain in the ass. The RV part is awesome, the  eng8ne and chassis, not so much.

[EscapeVelocity2020]

Here is something fun: https://www.reddit.com/r/FinancialPlanning/comments/p4qplj/if_you_had_5_million_dollars_what_would_you_do

It was interesting reading about what others would do if they were in a situation similar to those of people in this group.

Wow, the question was so poorly worded and clueless that it was difficult to understand exactly what the OP was hoping for.  Financial security?  YOLO?  Real advice on what to do with his/her lottery winnings??

The replies were also quite mundane.  I had a whole batch of popcorn ready, especially after the clueless start, but nary a 'hookers and blow' comment to be found (at least for the upvoted stuff I read)...

[2sk22]

I get the sentiment, but most people answered as if they were given $5m of after tax money all at once to do with as they please. While most of us here have accounts that have been built up over time and are socially engineered with rules, stipulations, tax consequences, tied up in real estate, etc. Everyone wants to control your money, and it makes quitting your job a much more complicated decision!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thats exactly the big contrast - getting $5M as a windfall is entirely different from earning and saving it over decades.

[pecunia]

I get the sentiment, but most people answered as if they were given $5m of after tax money all at once to do with as they please. While most of us here have accounts that have been built up over time and are socially engineered with rules, stipulations, tax consequences, tied up in real estate, etc. Everyone wants to control your money, and it makes quitting your job a much more complicated decision!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thats exactly the big contrast - getting $5M as a windfall is entirely different from earning and saving it over decades.

You know - it's a little bit like government project housing.  Money that comes free does not have the same internal worth.  When you put sweat, blood and time into getting that money it is far different.  You watch it more closely.  You take care of it. Your house has taken years to have.  What would a spoiled rich kid do with 5 million dollars, maybe spend it at the Casino.  You guys have great insight.

[Bateaux]

I get the sentiment, but most people answered as if they were given $5m of after tax money all at once to do with as they please. While most of us here have accounts that have been built up over time and are socially engineered with rules, stipulations, tax consequences, tied up in real estate, etc. Everyone wants to control your money, and it makes quitting your job a much more complicated decision!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thats exactly the big contrast - getting $5M as a windfall is entirely different from earning and saving it over decades.

You know - it's a little bit like government project housing.  Money that comes free does not have the same internal worth.  When you put sweat, blood and time into getting that money it is far different.  You watch it more closely.  You take care of it. Your house has taken years to have.  What would a spoiled rich kid do with 5 million dollars, maybe spend it at the Casino.  You guys have great insight.

I worked for $3 an hour on farms as a teen.  $3.35 an hour in college.  Now our wealth increases ten times that per hour.  Every hour of every day even if I don't go to work.  I'm still that boy with a shovel.  It's a much bigger shovel.

[PathtoFIRE]

Money that comes free does not have the same internal worth.

Complete tangent, but your comment made me wonder if social science could answer exactly what level of work would instill a similar level of worth? Taking the two extremes as a given (though I'd like these verified as well) that "free" things have low worth to humans, and "earned" things have a much higher worth, what could be done to bring the individual worth of "free" things up. Would something as simple as being forced to play a short simple game to get cash or rent assistance do it? Something more complex or complicated? Something completely unrelated to the assistance or benefit, or does it need to be tied directly to it? Would people treat various public goods better if some small, trivial, but universal step or action needed to partake? Just a few musings I thought I'd share in case anyone else has wondered the same.

[EscapeVelocity2020]

Money that comes free does not have the same internal worth.

Complete tangent, but your comment made me wonder if social science could answer exactly what level of work would instill a similar level of worth? Taking the two extremes as a given (though I'd like these verified as well) that "free" things have low worth to humans, and "earned" things have a much higher worth, what could be done to bring the individual worth of "free" things up. Would something as simple as being forced to play a short simple game to get cash or rent assistance do it? Something more complex or complicated? Something completely unrelated to the assistance or benefit, or does it need to be tied directly to it? Would people treat various public goods better if some small, trivial, but universal step or action needed to partake? Just a few musings I thought I'd share in case anyone else has wondered the same.

This is a significant conundrum with UBI.  Economists argue that it is vastly more efficient to just hand out a subsistence level stipend to poverty-stricken groups vs. all the social programs and management currently in place (SNAP, CHIP, WHIP, DIP :)  Folks that want to improve their position will at least have a bootstrap.  But the worry from society is that folks will just be content subsisting while contributing nothing (apparently forgetting the fact that all they are doing now is spending all their time gaming the systems), whereas economists are worried that providing subsistence will further erode the availability of jobs and the 'meaning' work provides for many folks. 

The biased MMM Forum is probably not the place to have a conversation about work providing people with identity and self-worth though... 

[Exflyboy]

The biased MMM Forum is probably not the place to have a conversation about work providing people with identity and self-worth though...

What because most of us have spent our (short) working lives trying to get away from our jobs?

Yeah I think thats a reasonable assumption..:)

[wannabe-stache]

So gang - what would you do?  Age 57, in great health, great family, $4.3M total net worth, with no major future expenses (such as college - all done with that!) on the horizon. 

I had planned to hang up the laptop back on March 1 - however the allure of work from home ended up getting me - so now am nearing the half way point of my latest "OMY".  Meantime I am really, REALLY losing interest in life at Mega Corp.  The stupid meetings, the dumb projects and the endless Powerpoints.......so exhausting.  Sooo - the dilemma - if I resign as of Sep 1 I walk away from 2022 bonus, some shares vesting as of next Feb, after tax cash compensation and 401k match between then and now that amounts to $170k all in.  I look at that statistic daily and it keeps me from writing the resignation e-mail.   Which brings me to my question - am I being silly tying myself to that "addition" to our NW?  I hate so say this but I find myself "wishing away" 6 months of life just to get to March 1......

Any thoughts???

Much love!

We have about $1.6m in stocks and bonds.   A 1% rise in the S&P works out to around $10-11k.  In an average results years I can expect a 10% rise in total, or about $100,000 to $110,000 counting dividends.

I'm guessing you have way more in your stock and bond portfolio than we do.   With a $3m portfolio we would be looking at $300,000 to $330,000 in average gains for doing nothing at all -- no powerpoints, no dumb projects, etc.    At a certain point, you have "enough".   

Are you there yet?   Because if you are, that $170k is meaningless but the boredom and frustration never are.

We have a relatively large portfolio - even assuming inflated expense levels, we are probably at a 2.25% SWR - and could probably stop working...but I can't help from feeling uneasy when I read comments like these.

The market doesn't give you average returns year over year, it gives you actuals.  40 years from now we might look back and realize an 8% or 10% return.  Or, it could be more, or less, but year to year, it can vary wildly.  And it's hard to argue against folks that point to the correlations between a) high valuations like we have today and b) lower expected returns.

Undoubtedly, someone will read this that has been investing or invested in the markets for 20+ years.  I hope they weigh in with their perspective.

Personally, as a 41 year old, I didn't have "real" money in the market until 2011/2012, and the markets have been good to us all over that time period.  So, my track record is only 10 years.  If I pull the plug now, i could need to live off my portfolio for 50 years.

i don't post often, and love this group and the optimism they imbue, but when i see folks in other threads talking about buying stocks on margin, or selling their homes to invest in ARK funds, or counting on a 10% return, it makes me uneasy.

I don't think "this time is different" but I do think there are clouds on the horizon.  i suppose that's why i am at a <2.5% SWR...

sorry for the rant, i don't want to be the resident raincloud.

[SwordGuy]

So gang - what would you do?  Age 57, in great health, great family, $4.3M total net worth, with no major future expenses (such as college - all done with that!) on the horizon. 

I had planned to hang up the laptop back on March 1 - however the allure of work from home ended up getting me - so now am nearing the half way point of my latest "OMY".  Meantime I am really, REALLY losing interest in life at Mega Corp.  The stupid meetings, the dumb projects and the endless Powerpoints.......so exhausting.  Sooo - the dilemma - if I resign as of Sep 1 I walk away from 2022 bonus, some shares vesting as of next Feb, after tax cash compensation and 401k match between then and now that amounts to $170k all in.  I look at that statistic daily and it keeps me from writing the resignation e-mail.   Which brings me to my question - am I being silly tying myself to that "addition" to our NW?  I hate so say this but I find myself "wishing away" 6 months of life just to get to March 1......

Any thoughts???

Much love!

We have about $1.6m in stocks and bonds.   A 1% rise in the S&P works out to around $10-11k.  In an average results years I can expect a 10% rise in total, or about $100,000 to $110,000 counting dividends.

I'm guessing you have way more in your stock and bond portfolio than we do.   With a $3m portfolio we would be looking at $300,000 to $330,000 in average gains for doing nothing at all -- no powerpoints, no dumb projects, etc.    At a certain point, you have "enough".   

Are you there yet?   Because if you are, that $170k is meaningless but the boredom and frustration never are.

We have a relatively large portfolio - even assuming inflated expense levels, we are probably at a 2.25% SWR - and could probably stop working...but I can't help from feeling uneasy when I read comments like these.

The market doesn't give you average returns year over year, it gives you actuals.  40 years from now we might look back and realize an 8% or 10% return.  Or, it could be more, or less, but year to year, it can vary wildly.  And it's hard to argue against folks that point to the correlations between a) high valuations like we have today and b) lower expected returns.

Undoubtedly, someone will read this that has been investing or invested in the markets for 20+ years.  I hope they weigh in with their perspective.

Personally, as a 41 year old, I didn't have "real" money in the market until 2011/2012, and the markets have been good to us all over that time period.  So, my track record is only 10 years.  If I pull the plug now, i could need to live off my portfolio for 50 years.

i don't post often, and love this group and the optimism they imbue, but when i see folks in other threads talking about buying stocks on margin, or selling their homes to invest in ARK funds, or counting on a 10% return, it makes me uneasy.

I don't think "this time is different" but I do think there are clouds on the horizon.  i suppose that's why i am at a <2.5% SWR...

sorry for the rant, i don't want to be the resident raincloud.

Dreadfully, sorry, I forgot to include a statement that included something to the effect of "... and a 4% SWR income of a bit over $120k."

[Bateaux]

@wannabe-stache   You have been investing in a more Goldy Locks period.   Not that you personally didn't do your own part becoming financially successful.  It takes more than opportunity, you have to put the energy and dollars in to reach your status.   That being said, I was a young investor in the 90s.  Some of us were completely wiped out with the Dot.com bust and then again in 2008.  I'm glad for index funds.  I'm a Brute Force Millionaire, I'm not financially savvy.  I just keep hitting with dollars till they add up.  It's hard to just stay the course and wait for compounding to work.  The smart guys like Herbert Derp, wherever he went, I think is a Tesla millionaire.  He ran through this thread in a year, making multi millions in a year.  I think index funds will continue to average.  It takes time to cross the rough spots and you enjoy the times like the past decade when everyone made money.  My parents retired in the 90s and have had a less than stellar financial journey since then.  They did use professional advisors and that didn't help either.  Advisors back in the day sold you a bag of loaded funds and took another percent in management for the privilege.  Hopefully the top is never in.

[2sk22]

Personally, as a 41 year old, I didn't have "real" money in the market until 2011/2012, and the markets have been good to us all over that time period.  So, my track record is only 10 years.  If I pull the plug now, i could need to live off my portfolio for 50 years.

...

sorry for the rant, i don't want to be the resident raincloud.

No need to apologize! I am now in my late 50s. But If I was 41, I would feel the same as you. In fact I was about your age a few years after the big Dotcom crash and the memory of that crash was still fresh in my mind. At the lunch table at work, several people had taken out home equity loans to buy stock. That experience and living through the 2008 crash have made me more cautious.

[LightTripper]

I didn't have that much money to spare in the run up to the Dot Com crash (a bit more in the run up to the financial crisis), but I "foresaw" both, pulled money out in advance, and although I haven't done the sums I don't think it helped me at all overall.  My patterns might have been right but my overall market exposure has always been too low.  So I've missed the downs, but haven't fully taken advantage of the ups either. 

It's one thing to see that trouble is coming down the road.  It's quite another to figure out when to exit the market and (perhaps even more critically) when to get back in.  Basically I am a worrier, which means I see the crises coming far too early and am generally too long out of the market once they land.  I mostly missed the crashes, but also a lot of the growth that pre-dated them and a chunk of the bounce-back that followed (I generally managed to get partially in pretty quickly after each crash - but was far too cautious in the amounts to invest - it always felt like there might be more bad news around the corner, and this what turned out to be the turning point might actually just be a staging post on the way down).

This current market is going to make things rather uncomfortable for me over the next few years unless things do reverse as I'm just gradually stopping work over the next 6 months, and plan to do a reverse equity glide path over the next few years (currently only about 66% of my non-house wealth is in equities, and I plan to get up to 90% over the next 10-15 years or so as my children get older and the risk of needing a chunk of cash right now declines).  So I may well find myself buying at very high multiples.  But I was a good little robot and increased my equity exposure gradually across last spring/summer, even when it felt pretty shitty, knowing that my failure to do so in the past had cost me an even earlier retirement - and that's worked out well (so far).

So in the end my experience of my own psychology teaches me that even when I'm at some level "correct", trying to market time hasn't served me that well!  So I'm going to attempt to continue to be a good little robot.  Drip drip drip.

[ysette9]

Money that comes free does not have the same internal worth.

Complete tangent, but your comment made me wonder if social science could answer exactly what level of work would instill a similar level of worth? Taking the two extremes as a given (though I'd like these verified as well) that "free" things have low worth to humans, and "earned" things have a much higher worth, what could be done to bring the individual worth of "free" things up. Would something as simple as being forced to play a short simple game to get cash or rent assistance do it? Something more complex or complicated? Something completely unrelated to the assistance or benefit, or does it need to be tied directly to it? Would people treat various public goods better if some small, trivial, but universal step or action needed to partake? Just a few musings I thought I'd share in case anyone else has wondered the same.

This is a significant conundrum with UBI.  Economists argue that it is vastly more efficient to just hand out a subsistence level stipend to poverty-stricken groups vs. all the social programs and management currently in place (SNAP, CHIP, WHIP, DIP :)  Folks that want to improve their position will at least have a bootstrap.  But the worry from society is that folks will just be content subsisting while contributing nothing (apparently forgetting the fact that all they are doing now is spending all their time gaming the systems), whereas economists are worried that providing subsistence will further erode the availability of jobs and the 'meaning' work provides for many folks. 

The biased MMM Forum is probably not the place to have a conversation about work providing people with identity and self-worth though...

This is one of these things where I think smart people can theorize all day long but we really need a strong experiment to find out what people would do. The few small experiments I’ve heard about (Freakonomics had an episode) were tantalizing.

I can see people being happy to have subsistence-level guaranteed support and quickly decide they want more than that in life and then go out and work to make their lives cushier.

[pecunia]

- RIP!  RIP! -

I can see people being happy to have subsistence-level guaranteed support and quickly decide they want more than that in life and then go out and work to make their lives cushier.

I am a cynical person, but even I realize that there are a lot of good souls out there.  I also realize there are a lot of good things that need to be done.  I'll bet IF a lot of people were given survival and were of sound mind and body, THEN these people would use some of the given time to go out and do some of these good things.  In fact, it may make the whole country better.  It wouldn't show up on any GDP calculation or raise the price of any stock.  I do think this doing good stuff may spread if it started.  You see, it feels good to some of us when we know we have done good.

[Bateaux]

I'm probably going to be off the air for a while.  I'm supposed to be pulling into my Florida house about now.  I cancelled the trip and I'm staying in Louisiana.  We're in Ascension Parish.  Not on the coast but directly under the line for a major hurricane hit.  I'm staying for family.  Our family will need our help these two days before the storm and after.  This is the big one I'm afraid.  It could rival Katrina.  I'll post back if we still have communication after Sunday.

[aspiringnomad]

So gang - what would you do?  Age 57, in great health, great family, $4.3M total net worth, with no major future expenses (such as college - all done with that!) on the horizon. 

I had planned to hang up the laptop back on March 1 - however the allure of work from home ended up getting me - so now am nearing the half way point of my latest "OMY".  Meantime I am really, REALLY losing interest in life at Mega Corp.  The stupid meetings, the dumb projects and the endless Powerpoints.......so exhausting.  Sooo - the dilemma - if I resign as of Sep 1 I walk away from 2022 bonus, some shares vesting as of next Feb, after tax cash compensation and 401k match between then and now that amounts to $170k all in.  I look at that statistic daily and it keeps me from writing the resignation e-mail.   Which brings me to my question - am I being silly tying myself to that "addition" to our NW?  I hate so say this but I find myself "wishing away" 6 months of life just to get to March 1......

Any thoughts???

Much love!

Just chiming in as another Bills fan and someone who broke free of golden handcuffs last year after similar trepidation about lost income. I'm ~20 years younger than you and have a bit over half your wealth, but I have zero regrets about making the leap when I did. Wouldn't trade this last year or the next year in for another $170k despite the bigger impact that would have on my net worth compared to yours.

[Dicey]

I'm probably going to be off the air for a while.  I'm supposed to be pulling into my Florida house about now.  I cancelled the trip and I'm staying in Louisiana.  We're in Ascension Parish.  Not on the coast but directly under the line for a major hurricane hit.  I'm staying for family.  Our family will need our help these two days before the storm and after.  This is the big one I'm afraid.  It could rival Katrina.  I'll post back if we still have communication after Sunday.

I'll be holding my breath until you post again. I hope it's not as bad as anticipated.

[Exflyboy]

I'm probably going to be off the air for a while.  I'm supposed to be pulling into my Florida house about now.  I cancelled the trip and I'm staying in Louisiana.  We're in Ascension Parish.  Not on the coast but directly under the line for a major hurricane hit.  I'm staying for family.  Our family will need our help these two days before the storm and after.  This is the big one I'm afraid.  It could rival Katrina.  I'll post back if we still have communication after Sunday.

I'll be holding my breath until you post again. I hope it's not as bad as anticipated.

Holy S!.. I had no idea it was predicted to be that bad.... Hoping it blows itself out..

[LightTripper]

Thinking of you and yours @Bateaux - hope it's not as bad as feared.

[2Birds1Stone]

Holy S!.. I had no idea it was predicted to be that bad.... Hoping it blows itself out..

It's not, but that doesn't keep people glued to the little black box.

[2sk22]

Good luck @Bateaux !

[Bateaux]

Thanks for the well wishes.  I spent the day helping my parents prepare.  The are about twenty miles from us.  Tonight and tomorrow my family and I will make our preps here.  One son works for a local television station and will likely be at the station for the storm in Baton Rouge.  The youngest will be off work till Monday and will be here.  I'll probably try a d get my wife to higher ground unless she insists on staying.  We have all the equipment to sustain ourselves including boats.  We'll make it through.  I'll keep in touch unless we lose cell towers.

[arcturus]

Thanks for the well wishes.  I spent the day helping my parents prepare.  The are about twenty miles from us.  Tonight and tomorrow my family and I will make our preps here.  One son works for a local television station and will likely be at the station for the storm in Baton Rouge.  The youngest will be off work till Monday and will be here.  I'll probably try a d get my wife to higher ground unless she insists on staying.  We have all the equipment to sustain ourselves including boats.  We'll make it through.  I'll keep in touch unless we lose cell towers.

Ditto from me @Bateaux -- wishing you and yours the best as you hunker down.....

[Bateaux]

Thanks for the well wishes.  I spent the day helping my parents prepare.  The are about twenty miles from us.  Tonight and tomorrow my family and I will make our preps here.  One son works for a local television station and will likely be at the station for the storm in Baton Rouge.  The youngest will be off work till Monday and will be here.  I'll probably try a d get my wife to higher ground unless she insists on staying.  We have all the equipment to sustain ourselves including boats.  We'll make it through.  I'll keep in touch unless we lose cell towers.

Ditto from me @Bateaux -- wishing you and yours the best as you hunker down.....

Appreciate it.

My wife has decided to stay with family in Baton Rouge on higher ground.   I may encourage my youngest son to join her.   My parents are on high ground.  Nothing we can do about the winds.  I'm getting them safe from the flooding.

[ysette9]

Fingers crossed.

I’ve never lived through anything even remotely similar but I did two trips to do cleanup in New Orleans after Katrina. To say that was eye-opening was putting it mildly.

[pecunia]

Good luck @Bateaux !

Same

[SwordGuy]

Best of luck!

[wannabe-stache]

[/quote]

We have a relatively large portfolio - even assuming inflated expense levels, we are probably at a 2.25% SWR - and could probably stop working...but I can't help from feeling uneasy when I read comments like these.

The market doesn't give you average returns year over year, it gives you actuals.  40 years from now we might look back and realize an 8% or 10% return.  Or, it could be more, or less, but year to year, it can vary wildly.  And it's hard to argue against folks that point to the correlations between a) high valuations like we have today and b) lower expected returns.

Undoubtedly, someone will read this that has been investing or invested in the markets for 20+ years.  I hope they weigh in with their perspective.

Personally, as a 41 year old, I didn't have "real" money in the market until 2011/2012, and the markets have been good to us all over that time period.  So, my track record is only 10 years.  If I pull the plug now, i could need to live off my portfolio for 50 years.

i don't post often, and love this group and the optimism they imbue, but when i see folks in other threads talking about buying stocks on margin, or selling their homes to invest in ARK funds, or counting on a 10% return, it makes me uneasy.

I don't think "this time is different" but I do think there are clouds on the horizon.  i suppose that's why i am at a <2.5% SWR...

sorry for the rant, i don't want to be the resident raincloud.
[/quote]

Dreadfully, sorry, I forgot to include a statement that included something to the effect of "... and a 4% SWR income of a bit over $120k."
[/quote]
i am not sure what the jist of the "dreadfully sorry" is, hope you didn't take offense to my post.

[SwordGuy]

Nah, just sorry to have been unclear and cause your concern.   Thanks for caring!