Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!

[itchyfeet]

Is this your idea of entertainment? I’m not sure why you are spending the time if you have no intention of investing.

1. I figure I might learn something.

2. I accepted the hospitality of these guys so feel I should at least give them the courtesy of listening to their pitch. I did tell them I didn’t think their product was for me, and yet they still wanted to meet.

3. And, a bit left of field, In my work capacity I have a company that needs some additional equity to finance potential growth over the next 5 years that might be attractive to PE. I don’t think it’s a great fit for their fund, but I’ll float the idea to see if there is any appetite.

[DavidAnnArbor]

I definitely think it's worth finding out where the con is.  Maybe it's a Ponzi scheme, maybe the lack of investor protections means the fees are unheard of insane, maybe it's just the usual con that these private equity funds take 20% of the gains. It's definitely worth understanding.

[Bateaux]

Conversation with a coworker.   He went to see a Northwest Mutual financial planner.   A recently retired coworker refered him to the planner.  The retired guy said the planner told him to quit working immediately, in an almost insulting tone.  Basically called him an idiot for working too late in life, he's in his 50s.  The coworker also in his 50s, who recently visited the planner was told pretty much the same thing.   They are both recommending I talk to the planner for a free consultation. Both guys have about one million liquid and 500k in real estate.  I've always planned to manage my own money, but may still talk to Northwest Mutual.   Even if the planner calls me an idiot, I'm going for late 2020 as an end date.   
Are planners getting onboard with FIRE?  Maybe they are just trying to rack up more accounts to manage.  Calling middle aged one-millionaires idiots for not retiring could be a great tactic to sign them up.  If that's the case, I'll toy and fuck with this guy.  I'm going to walk in presenting myself as a dumb assed blue collar worker.  One who just happens to have enough stash to make a financial planner salivate for that 1% fee.

[pecunia]

Conversation with a coworker.   He went to see a Northwest Mutual financial planner.   A recently retired coworker refered him to the planner.  The retired guy said the planner told him to quit working immediately, in an almost insulting tone.  Basically called him an idiot for working too late in life, he's in his 50s.  The coworker also in his 50s, who recently visited the planner was told pretty much the same thing.   They are both recommending I talk to the planner for a free consultation. Both guys have about one million liquid and 500k in real estate.  I've always planned to manage my own money, but may still talk to Northwest Mutual.   Even if the planner calls me an idiot, I'm going for late 2020 as an end date.   
Are planners getting onboard with FIRE?  Maybe they are just trying to rack up more accounts to manage.  Calling middle aged one-millionaires idiots for not retiring could be a great tactic to sign them up.  If that's the case, I'll toy and fuck with this guy.  I'm going to walk in presenting myself as a dumb assed blue collar worker.  One who just happens to have enough stash to make a financial planner salivate for that 1% fee.

I don't think I'd give my business to anyone who would call me an idiot.  That shows a degree of arrogance.  In addition, there are a lot of blue collar workers who have big stashes and it's not from being dumb assed.  Bidding on jobs and knowing the rules of the game takes savvy.

[Dicey]

Conversation with a coworker.   He went to see a Northwest Mutual financial planner.   A recently retired coworker refered him to the planner.  The retired guy said the planner told him to quit working immediately, in an almost insulting tone.  Basically called him an idiot for working too late in life, he's in his 50s.  The coworker also in his 50s, who recently visited the planner was told pretty much the same thing.   They are both recommending I talk to the planner for a free consultation. Both guys have about one million liquid and 500k in real estate.  I've always planned to manage my own money, but may still talk to Northwest Mutual.   Even if the planner calls me an idiot, I'm going for late 2020 as an end date.   
Are planners getting onboard with FIRE?  Maybe they are just trying to rack up more accounts to manage.  Calling middle aged one-millionaires idiots for not retiring could be a great tactic to sign them up.  If that's the case, I'll toy and fuck with this guy.  I'm going to walk in presenting myself as a dumb assed blue collar worker.  One who just happens to have enough stash to make a financial planner salivate for that 1% fee.

I don't think I'd give my business to anyone who would call me an idiot.  That shows a degree of arrogance.  In addition, there are a lot of blue collar workers who have big stashes and it's not from being dumb assed.  Bidding on jobs and knowing the rules of the game takes savvy.

Meh, you're hearing it third hand, who knows what was actually said?     

[2sk22]

Having caught up with this thread, I feel compelled to get off the sidelines and say that I'm firmly in this group :-) I hadn't looked at my net worth a while and when I finally added up the the various accounts, I had to pinch myself. Turns out we have over $2M in just liquid assets alone apart from 401k, pension and fully paid off house (no other debts).  My wife intends to work as long as possible since she still enjoys her work as a senior manager in her company - so healthcare is covered for the near future. Accordingly, I have added myself to the class of 2020 - if I can even last that long!

[EscapeVelocity2020]

So, what are we hoping for next week (or so)?  Up or down? 

[Bateaux]

Conversation with a coworker.   He went to see a Northwest Mutual financial planner.   A recently retired coworker refered him to the planner.  The retired guy said the planner told him to quit working immediately, in an almost insulting tone.  Basically called him an idiot for working too late in life, he's in his 50s.  The coworker also in his 50s, who recently visited the planner was told pretty much the same thing.   They are both recommending I talk to the planner for a free consultation. Both guys have about one million liquid and 500k in real estate.  I've always planned to manage my own money, but may still talk to Northwest Mutual.   Even if the planner calls me an idiot, I'm going for late 2020 as an end date.   
Are planners getting onboard with FIRE?  Maybe they are just trying to rack up more accounts to manage.  Calling middle aged one-millionaires idiots for not retiring could be a great tactic to sign them up.  If that's the case, I'll toy and fuck with this guy.  I'm going to walk in presenting myself as a dumb assed blue collar worker.  One who just happens to have enough stash to make a financial planner salivate for that 1% fee.

I don't think I'd give my business to anyone who would call me an idiot.  That shows a degree of arrogance.  In addition, there are a lot of blue collar workers who have big stashes and it's not from being dumb assed.  Bidding on jobs and knowing the rules of the game takes savvy.

Meh, you're hearing it third hand, who knows what was actually said?     

No doubt Dicey.  You'd be an idiot is lesser an insult than, you're an idiot.  The message is however, FIRE NOW!  You've got enough.

[pecunia]

Well,.......Two million without considering the 401K and your health care is covered.  I'll bet that would bring it up to 2-1/2 million.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eikbQPldhPY

This Spring seems particularly beautiful.  I'll bet it will be a good Summer and Fall.  To have your days free to enjoy the sunshine.  To wait until 2020 and one of the best Summers and Autumns of your life may be gone.  It's about 7 months until the end of the year.  It's about 7 months until 2020.  Seven months is time enough for a lot of dreams to come true.

[2sk22]

Um, WHY?

Unless you have some ridiculous spending requirements, with $2mill liquid PLUS 401k, pension and paid off house you are FIREd with probably a 1-2% SWR max once your SO finally quits working.

You can give notice tomorrow if you want to.  If you don't, then the reasons are not financial.

Good point :-)

• I'm still getting used to the idea of early retirement. Until about the middle of last year, I was mostly enjoying my job in tech and getting very well paid for it. After a re-org at the end of 2018, I'm still getting paid very well but was forced to take on some really uninteresting work as we had nobody else to do it.
• Until a few months ago, it had never occurred to me that I didn't need to work until 67. By chance, I found the /r/financialindependence subreddit and have discovered the FIRE community. I am realizing that my wife and I are already financially independent.
• I recently got Your Money or Your Life  and How to Retire Happy Wild and Free and am going through them. Both of these books and blogs like MMM have been tremendously helpful.
• There are a couple of home improvements that that would make post retirement life a lot nicer - it just feels better to do this while I'm still working

This is mostly a matter of mental adjustment and I'm most of the way there. Very likely, I'll be done by the end of the year but I have given myself until the middle of next year to be on the safe side.

[2sk22]

Obviously it's your choice.  But I'm just gonna put this out there, as it is a big part of why I FIREd at 46:

My dad had tons of plans for what he was going to do when he hit his ER age (55, due to pension rules).  He died suddenly of a massive heart attack at age 52.

You have plenty of money to pay for your home renovations.  Just sayin'.....

I hear you - its going to happen alright :-)

[BeanCounter]

I know I'm not supposed to pay attention, but since I am very close to pulling the plug and we are in the peak (or one of) times of spending- kids are driving a lot of cost, it freaks me out that we've lost $50k since the beginning of May. Ugh

[BeanCounter]

I know I'm not supposed to pay attention, but since I am very close to pulling the plug and we are in the peak (or one of) times of spending- kids are driving a lot of cost, it freaks me out that we've lost $50k since the beginning of May. Ugh

Do you have an immediate need to cash out some investments?  If not, then you haven't really "lost" anything.  If the market is making you nervous, then it is ok to pile up cash for awhile -- you can either live on it for 2-3 years, or wait for the market to drop further and take advantage of the buying opportunity.

Good point. We've got about 4% in cash currently. I expect while DH is still working and the kids are still at home we'll need to draw down $50k a year from investments, so we've got 2 years of that in a money market. I'm on my OMY by the end of that I should have added at least another $50k in cash.
The idea of going to one income while we are still spending so much is just really scary but the desire to be home with the kids for the next 10 years is greater than the anxiety. I think.

[Exflyboy]

Having caught up with this thread, I feel compelled to get off the sidelines and say that I'm firmly in this group :-) I hadn't looked at my net worth a while and when I finally added up the the various accounts, I had to pinch myself. Turns out we have over $2M in just liquid assets alone apart from 401k, pension and fully paid off house (no other debts).  My wife intends to work as long as possible since she still enjoys her work as a senior manager in her company - so healthcare is covered for the near future. Accordingly, I have added myself to the class of 2020 - if I can even last that long!

Um, WHY?

Unless you have some ridiculous spending requirements, with $2mill liquid PLUS 401k, pension and paid off house you are FIREd with probably a 1-2% SWR max once your SO finally quits working.

You can give notice tomorrow if you want to.  If you don't, then the reasons are not financial.

Ahh yes the curse of the 1 to 2% WR!.. Ask me how I know about this..

Its funny but when I sort of quit (or didn't) 5 years ago I wasn't REALLY sure (like I hadn't emotionally bought into the idea) that we were completely FI.

I realise now that as time goes on we have a ridiculously large amount of money, i.e our pensions and just the after tax dividends alone will cover our highest spending year so far which included a significant house remodel spend and a 6 week thrash around Europe, a trip to Hawaii and eating out twice a week, every week.

It sounds like you have more $$ than we do!! I think you are more than done financially speaking.

[2sk22]

Ahh yes the curse of the 1 to 2% WR!.. Ask me how I know about this..

Its funny but when I sort of quit (or didn't) 5 years ago I was REALLY sure (like I hadn't emotionally bought into the idea) that we were completely FI.

I realise now that as time goes on we have a ridiculously large amount of money, i.e our pensions and just the after tax dividends alone will cover our highest spending year so far which included a significant house remodel spend and a 6 week thrash around Europe, a trip to Hawaii and eating out twice a week, every week.

It sounds like you have more $$ than we do!! I think you are more than done financially speaking.

Heh - you must be reading my mind :-)

As you may have gathered from my other postings on this forum, I am a super tech nerd as my daughters will attest. I have crunched the numbers and I know I'm done financially. The emotions have not caught up with the intellect. Give it a couple of months to settle in.

[pecunia]

- SNIP -

Heh - you must be reading my mind :-)

As you may have gathered from my other postings on this forum, I am a super tech nerd as my daughters will attest. I have crunched the numbers and I know I'm done financially. The emotions have not caught up with the intellect. Give it a couple of months to settle in.

The beautiful Summer will be half over then.  It can never be recaptured.

[deborah]

It DOES take time to be convinced that the figures might be right - when they apply to you. It also takes time to work out how you will retire, what you need to do before you leave work, and what you’ll do in retirement. It’s reasonable to take a year to go through these things. Even if, like me, retirement looks nothing like you thought it would.

[EscapeVelocity2020]

As you may have gathered from my other postings on this forum, I am a super tech nerd as my daughters will attest. I have crunched the numbers and I know I'm done financially. The emotions have not caught up with the intellect. Give it a couple of months to settle in.

Indeed, as they say, there is safety in numbers :)  For those of us that get there early, FI becomes the easy part and ER (especially the taking of the leap to quit the job early part) becomes the challenge.  For me, it has been a transition to a better job and a relaxed attitude toward being employed.  Nothing wrong with the shift toward ER taking a while, we all have our own comfort level on life transitions and getting comfortable, just don't let yourself be miserable at work or let work come before the things in your life that will be important and lasting - like finding hobbies and passions, mental and physical health, and family.

[2sk22]

The beautiful Summer will be half over then.  It can never be recaptured.

I absolutely agree with your sentiment,  Sed fugit interea, fugit inreparabile tempus

However my idea of summer fun is to sit in my cool home office in my basement working on math problems :-)

[2sk22]

I had lunch with an old college friend who has been a hedge fund manager on Wall Street now for over 20 years. I told him that I was planning to quit soon and his eyes lit up. Apparently, he has also been thinking of quitting too. I asked him the same question that I was asked here a few days ago: "Why are you still working?".

His answer was simple - he has no idea what else he could be doing :-) Mind you, I estimate that his net worth is probably well over $50M.

Incidentally, I added up the NW for our household and it comes to a bit over $5M - so that puts us firmly in the "beyond". And yet, we don't feel especially wealthy. I realize now that this is probably because many of the people we know likely have NW in the 8 figure NW range. So even a 7 figure NW doesn't feel particularly noteworthy in comparison. Neither my wife nor I have expensive hobbies or desire luxuries - I drive a Prius and my wife has a Camry. We tend to hold on to cars for at least 15 years. All the things that really bring me happiness are relatively inexpensive.

I have to say that this forum has been invaluable in getting my thoughts straightened out. The feeling of inadequacy is slowly fading.

[Exflyboy]

Cool.. Yup money is not the reason you're working.. If it is you got serious problems..:)

[pecunia]

Right now I'm jealous of you rich people that actually like to work.

I am actually confused too.  There are soooo many fun things you could do with that money.  I wouldn't be sitting in that dark room doing math problems. 

Oh well - to each their own.

[Exflyboy]

Right now I'm jealous of you rich people that actually like to work.

I am actually confused too.  There are soooo many fun things you could do with that money.  I wouldn't be sitting in that dark room doing math problems. 

Oh well - to each their own.

2sk22 makes a good point though. Work itself can be fun. The most fun I ever had was after I was FI.. Got sent all over the world and paid for every hour while sat on the airplane.

The corporate BS was completely irrelevant and I loved every minute of it.

Eventually the company decided they could do without me and I went back to being RE'd. A year later they called me again but couldn't give me enough $$ to make it worth it to me.. so we parted ways.. It was fine by me either way..:)

[2sk22]

Right now I'm jealous of you rich people that actually like to work.

This needs a little clarification :-)

I like programming computers. Right from when I wrote my first computer program in 1980
and have always enjoyed the actual activity of programming.

But I no longer like working. In fact, I hardly ever get to do much actual programming at work any more.
Mostly work seems to consist of attending meetings :-)

[soccerluvof4]

Right now I'm jealous of you rich people that actually like to work.

This needs a little clarification :-)

I like programming computers. Right from when I wrote my first computer program in 1980
and have always enjoyed the actual activity of programming.

But I no longer like working. In fact, I hardly ever get to do much actual programming at work any more.
Mostly work seems to consist of attending meetings :-)

Oh the good ole days of meetings! Remembering having meetings and setting up the next meetings! You have to get out when you feel comfortable to do so BUT you also need to step out of your comfort zone. Like they say it takes awhile to adjust and its different for everyone. Heck I Fired a little over 4 years ago and I still am adjusting but I'd rather be adjusting than working and its less and less each day. Maybe I should write a book the twelve steps of being fire'd?!?!? hmmmmmm. Actually though I look back and wonder how I ever looked and 2sk22 I know how it is to do remodeling in Fire. I have put 70k into my house since I have fire'd and just finish redoing the entire outside of my home yesterday which was 19k of it. Brought it out of the 70's into the modern day Craftsman style home and its very rewarding. With what you have stashed and your wife still working etc,, you are more than fine. Heck I have two kids at home and two in college that are home right now. Take your time but get to it sooner than later or you'll fall into that one more year trap!

[2sk22]

Oh the good ole days of meetings! Remembering having meetings and setting up the next meetings! You have to get out when you feel comfortable to do so BUT you also need to step out of your comfort zone. Like they say it takes awhile to adjust and its different for everyone. Heck I Fired a little over 4 years ago and I still am adjusting but I'd rather be adjusting than working and its less and less each day. Maybe I should write a book the twelve steps of being fire'd?!?!? hmmmmmm. Actually though I look back and wonder how I ever looked and 2sk22 I know how it is to do remodeling in Fire. I have put 70k into my house since I have fire'd and just finish redoing the entire outside of my home yesterday which was 19k of it. Brought it out of the 70's into the modern day Craftsman style home and its very rewarding. With what you have stashed and your wife still working etc,, you are more than fine. Heck I have two kids at home and two in college that are home right now. Take your time but get to it sooner than later or you'll fall into that one more year trap!

As I posted on another thread, I feel like a school kid knowing that summer vacation is approaching. It's getting harder to sit through meetings. I don't think I'll last for another year :-)

My older daughter has one more year to go in college and my younger daughter will start college in a couple of years. Thankfully, we have enough liquid assets set aside to cover all remaining educational expenses, no matter where the younger one decides to go.

We have been living in the same house (built in the late 50s) now for almost 25 years  and we have been slowly fixing it up over the years as funds permitted. Most of our house is now in good shape except for the basement which is where I have my home office - the lighting is terrible and it gets chilly in the winter.

[soccerluvof4]

Oh the good ole days of meetings! Remembering having meetings and setting up the next meetings! You have to get out when you feel comfortable to do so BUT you also need to step out of your comfort zone. Like they say it takes awhile to adjust and its different for everyone. Heck I Fired a little over 4 years ago and I still am adjusting but I'd rather be adjusting than working and its less and less each day. Maybe I should write a book the twelve steps of being fire'd?!?!? hmmmmmm. Actually though I look back and wonder how I ever looked and 2sk22 I know how it is to do remodeling in Fire. I have put 70k into my house since I have fire'd and just finish redoing the entire outside of my home yesterday which was 19k of it. Brought it out of the 70's into the modern day Craftsman style home and its very rewarding. With what you have stashed and your wife still working etc,, you are more than fine. Heck I have two kids at home and two in college that are home right now. Take your time but get to it sooner than later or you'll fall into that one more year trap!

As I posted on another thread, I feel like a school kid knowing that summer vacation is approaching. It's getting harder to sit through meetings. I don't think I'll last for another year :-)

My older daughter has one more year to go in college and my younger daughter will start college in a couple of years. Thankfully, we have enough liquid assets set aside to cover all remaining educational expenses, no matter where the younger one decides to go.

We have been living in the same house (built in the late 50s) now for almost 25 years  and we have been slowly fixing it up over the years as funds permitted. Most of our house is now in good shape except for the basement which is where I have my home office - the lighting is terrible and it gets chilly in the winter.

Funny ,  sound alot like me. I have 2 in college and the one finishing up freshman year in HS and then one finishing up 7th grade that we have 529's built up for and still contributing but for the most part they will be covered. I think that was the biggest surprise for us was both my kids went out of state because of sports for college my DD on a Full Ride and my son a partial but even with that so much extra cost of thing we didnt figure like traveling to see them and so on. The next two years now my DS is just going to go to a school in state and hes burnt out from sport so going to go to school and work and if he misses it he can walk on at any school in state and make the team no worries. We bout a 70's ranch going on 5 years when we downsized, well kinda its still 2700 squ feet but from the road you would think its 900. The taxes though are a third of the price and we put a ton of money away downsizing BUT have been modeling it non-stop since we moved in. The inside now is about 90% done and the outside is all redone. Fun fun fun but wanta be done but I dont think you ever get there! :-)

[BeanCounter]

So I’ve been using Cfiresim and the post retirement/death calculator and I was feeling pretty good about our plan for me to quit in a year despite the crazy market situation, and then DH comes home and says the University he works for us having a really tough time with enrollment and may go on fiscal watch with the state this year and could potentially go under. This is scary for me.
I think it’s not extremely likely to happen. I think it will take a few years. But what do we do? Do we move forward with our plan? Using the calculators it’s seems we could likely stay the course and if that happens we could just both RE. But with the kids still in elementary school, future expenses for them are very scary. And health insurance. I’m not confident we could afford to self insure or that there are even good options on the ACA.
Anyway, I hate my job and I hate being away from the kids, but it pays well and is secure.
How do you all FIRE with this level of uncertainty?

[ysette9]

Could either of you in the future get some kind of job, even part time, that provides benefits? Sure, the US healthcare situation is a shit show and we all worry about the ACA, but in the meantime it is great law of the land and has been for a decade. I doubt that between the two of you, goi would be e girly unable to find any decent job for some period of time to cover healthcare if things really did go in a bad way.

[BeanCounter]

Could either of you in the future get some kind of job, even part time, that provides benefits? Sure, the US healthcare situation is a shit show and we all worry about the ACA, but in the meantime it is great law of the land and has been for a decade. I doubt that between the two of you, goi would be e girly unable to find any decent job for some period of time to cover healthcare if things really did go in a bad way.

I'm a CPA so it would probably be pretty easy for me, but not likely to pay as much or be as good of a situation as what I currently have. Especially after taking a break.
DH would struggle to find another job and it might require a big move.

[ysette9]

Could either of you in the future get some kind of job, even part time, that provides benefits? Sure, the US healthcare situation is a shit show and we all worry about the ACA, but in the meantime it is great law of the land and has been for a decade. I doubt that between the two of you, goi would be e girly unable to find any decent job for some period of time to cover healthcare if things really did go in a bad way.

I'm a CPA so it would probably be pretty easy for me, but not likely to pay as much or be as good of a situation as what I currently have. Especially after taking a break.
DH would struggle to find another job and it might require a big move.

So if you are otherwise at your number except for potential future healthcare worries, you could still stick to your plan and pull the trigger, having a worst case scenario backup plan be for you to go back to some work just for health coverage if things got bad enough.

[2Birds1Stone]

I’ve been lurking on this thread for awhile. I guess hoping to gain some insight or comfort from you all about why DH and I (both 41) are still working until we get to the $3M number. And depending on the situation with healthcare may continue until the kids are out of college. Which would put us probably closer to $4M unless we have another recession with stagnant ten year returns.
These last few posts really hit home to me. Especially Itchyfeets post. That is exactly the circle my brain does:
 -I probably won’t live to be 100 and I may not be able to do all the things I want after 60 so I better do it now!
 -but 50 years to fund is a lot!!! What if there is a recession and we have zero returns. What if I’m wrong about expenses for the kids? Or healthcare?
-But the kids are growing fast I’d really like to be home with them! And we are FI by most people’s standards! Our advisor says we are good to go. I should do it! Quit now!!
-But I make so much money and my job is pretty easy, with good people there! Why would I give that up?
-but I’m so tired all the time. And my kids are aging out of nannys and programs. I don’t want them to be latch key kids!
-but I’ve worked so hard to get where I am in my career!! Lots of folks would love to have my job.

And on and on it goes. The plan is for me to work through all this mentally and pull the trigger one year from now- May of 2020. DH will keep working until he feels ready to be done. I hope to try and start my own tax and accounting business and maybe adjunct a few accounting classes. Hopefully that will help me feel like I am still using my skills.

Sounds like you will be just fine. Breathe!

You have way more money than time right now.

[Exflyboy]

Could either of you in the future get some kind of job, even part time, that provides benefits? Sure, the US healthcare situation is a shit show and we all worry about the ACA, but in the meantime it is great law of the land and has been for a decade. I doubt that between the two of you, goi would be e girly unable to find any decent job for some period of time to cover healthcare if things really did go in a bad way.

I'm a CPA so it would probably be pretty easy for me, but not likely to pay as much or be as good of a situation as what I currently have. Especially after taking a break.
DH would struggle to find another job and it might require a big move.

So DH is not ready to be done and his well paid job provides healthcare?

Sounds simple enough.. Just quit. You know intellectually you have more than enough plus you have a source of HC for the forseeable. Unless there is a golden parachute (for YOU) to be had in 2020 then really there is no good reason to wait.

There are lots of good reasons not to stay at work.. You're miserable, you have "paid the piper", you have passed the marshmallow test many times over..

Sometimes you just have to JFDI and see what happens.

Clue.. you'll be just fine.

[DavidAnnArbor]

There are plenty of good health care plans on the ACA marketplace.

I just got my Shingrix vaccine and it was entirely free.

[EngineerOurFI]

I follow this thread because my non-inflation adjuster target (current dollars) is around $3M.  My goal is to work to ensure I can hit at least $2.5M in current dollars while also having fully funded 529s for the kids and some ability to pay for kids’ weddings and honeymoons as well as perhaps minor assistance on their first home down payments.

I feel like some people in this thread need encouragement that “enough is enough”.  For those going a fatFIRE route, I think the “what ifs” combined with relatively easy high paying jobs (golden handcuffs) stop them from declaring FI and/or prod them to keep bumping up FI number.

Personally, I believe if you haven’t read Big ERN’s 31 part series on Ultimate SWR Guide - you should stop what you’re doing and go read it now.  It’s a highly data-driven look at SWRs that may give you greater comfort in your selected FI number.

https://earlyretirementnow.com/2016/12/07/the-ultimate-guide-to-safe-withdrawal-rates-part-1-intro/

[Bateaux]

I follow this thread because my non-inflation adjuster target (current dollars) is around $3M.  My goal is to work to ensure I can hit at least $2.5M in current dollars while also having fully funded 529s for the kids and some ability to pay for kids’ weddings and honeymoons as well as perhaps minor assistance on their first home down payments.

I feel like some people in this thread need encouragement that “enough is enough”.  For those going a fatFIRE route, I think the “what ifs” combined with relatively easy high paying jobs (golden handcuffs) stop them from declaring FI and/or prod them to keep bumping up FI number.

Personally, I believe if you haven’t read Big ERN’s 31 part series on Ultimate SWR Guide - you should stop what you’re doing and go read it now.  It’s a highly data-driven look at SWRs that may give you greater comfort in your selected FI number.

https://earlyretirementnow.com/2016/12/07/the-ultimate-guide-to-safe-withdrawal-rates-part-1-intro/

I know personally that I used Mustacianism to get here, but now that I'm here I've become more Bogleheadish.  Money gets easier and easier to make as you get here.  You think back to a time you worked as farm labor for $3 dollars an hour.  How you ate a corn dog and drank water because you couldn't affford a hamburger and a beer.  How you can speak your mind at work now, when in the past you had to bite your tongue and take it.   It's not necessarily about buying shiny things, it's the shine of the money itself.  Money accumulating money is extremely mentally satisfying.   

[2sk22]

I feel like some people in this thread need encouragement that “enough is enough”.  For those going a fatFIRE route, I think the “what ifs” combined with relatively easy high paying jobs (golden handcuffs) stop them from declaring FI and/or prod them to keep bumping up FI number.

You must surely be referring to me :-)

I feel that my company is throwing such ridiculous amounts of money at me that I has caused me to delay "RE", long after we became FI. But it will happen soon - the wheels are turning.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2019/02/religion-workism-making-americans-miserable/583441/

“For many of today’s rich there is no such thing as ‘leisure’; in the classic sense—work is their play,” the economist Robert Frank wrote in The Wall Street Journal. “Building wealth to them is a creative process, and the closest thing they have to fun.”

[Bateaux]

2sk22 you've turned the corner where employment is nolonger threatening.   Once FI work is an option to you and they know it.  They give you a wide berth.

[FIREstache]

Money gets easier and easier to make as you get here.

That's been easy to say for a while... until the next recession hits and stocks drop 50% and take years to recover.

[ysette9]

Money gets easier and easier to make as you get here.

That's been easy to say for a while... until the next recession hits and stocks drop 50% and take years to recover.

True, but I read this as the making money from income has become easier and easier.
If retired then we’ll all likely make some adjustments when that kind of market correction happens. But if we are still working and raking in piles of cash.....

I do really wonder how many of us will still be as sanguine when a big dump happens, trusting the math that we have been studying for years, and who will panic. I’d like to think I will be in the calm crowd. But more and more reaching our number has become more and more important to me as it is increasingly difficult to balance home and two full time careers. I’m hoping that finding some compromise in between total FIRE and two careers will let us coast with more enjoyment until we get to a point of total comfort with the numbers.

[FIREstache]

Money gets easier and easier to make as you get here.

That's been easy to say for a while... until the next recession hits and stocks drop 50% and take years to recover.

True, but I read this as the making money from income has become easier and easier.

It was the comment "Money accumulating money is extremely mentally satisfying" that I related to investments making money.

If retired then we’ll all likely make some adjustments when that kind of market correction happens. But if we are still working and raking in piles of cash.....

I do really wonder how many of us will still be as sanguine when a big dump happens, trusting the math that we have been studying for years, and who will panic. I’d like to think I will be in the calm crowd. But more and more reaching our number has become more and more important to me as it is increasingly difficult to balance home and two full time careers. I’m hoping that finding some compromise in between total FIRE and two careers will let us coast with more enjoyment until we get to a point of total comfort with the numbers.

IIRC from previous posts, I think you, Bateaux and I aren't planning to work more than one or two more years, so there aren't too many of those high income earning years left.  With such as short timeline to FIRE and just 10 years to SS, I've reduced my equities below 50% (last adjustment to AA on May 3rd).  I've already hit an adequate stash, so I'm more concerned with holding on to it than building it higher.

[2sk22]

I do really wonder how many of us will still be as sanguine when a big dump happens, trusting the math that we have been studying for years, and who will panic. I’d like to think I will be in the calm crowd. But more and more reaching our number has become more and more important to me as it is increasingly difficult to balance home and two full time careers. I’m hoping that finding some compromise in between total FIRE and two careers will let us coast with more enjoyment until we get to a point of total comfort with the numbers.

We have been steadily investing in an index fund on an automatic monthly plan, uninterrupted since the mid 90s - right through two crashes. We didn't panic through those events so I'm hoping that we have the same discipline on the other side when drawing down our savings.

In my case, helping my aged parents cope with medical crises and my kids through school and college is becoming a lot more important than work. In fact, i'm  off tomorrow to spend a couple of weeks with my parents. My older kid had a rough term in college earlier this year and I had to spend a lot of time helping her through that. Juggling all that and a demanding job is getting a bit much.

[pecunia]

I've not the vast sums of wealth that some of you have piled up, but there should be enough for my duration in this world.  The following comes to mind:

 For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?

That's out of the Bible.  I'm not too religious, but I realize there is wisdom in that book.  It's not too hard to imagine losing everything to money.  It's sort of like not seeing the forest for the trees and I've done enough of that in other ways.

I've wondered if I hung it up if I could do both myself and maybe some other people some good before I check out.  Helping a corporation achieve it's objectives could be considered good, but I just can't see it being the same as other things.

I'm still in the race.  What is the real, ".....and beyond!"?

[soccerluvof4]

The thing to remember is even when your fire'd if need be and you have any intelligence when the market crashes or even before there are alot of ways to make some cash. Im fired over 4 years and I have been doing some cash jobs on my terms only and for something to do. So that makes it fun. It also feels good to be doing something when the market is monkeying around like it is now and taking less out of investments. The good thing is most everyone here is in a position of being able to make many choices and in having that privilege feel good you have won the game.

[Car Jack]

IIRC from previous posts, I think you, Bateaux and I aren't planning to work more than one or two more years, so there aren't too many of those high income earning years left.  With such as short timeline to FIRE and just 10 years to SS, I've reduced my equities below 50% (last adjustment to AA on May 3rd).  I've already hit an adequate stash, so I'm more concerned with holding on to it than building it higher.

Include me in that group.  Already at 50/50.  I could take reduced SS today if I wanted to.  A few years on Bogleheads has turned my plan completely around, though.....  I've been saying since the 80's that SS is a big pyramid scheme and that I'd start taking it the minute I was eligible.  Now, I'm thinking more about medicare costs linked with income and increasing the payout for my wife.  <sigh>  I guess I'm in the "wait till 70" camp now.  I'm an older parent with one son finishing off some straggling courses for his BS as he transferred in.....and second son starting community college in the fall.  It will be nice not having $70k private college bills anymore, I have to say.

[DavidAnnArbor]

I loved this latest blog post on Social Security and early retirement from the Finance Buff

https://thefinancebuff.com/early-retirement-social-security-benefits.html

[Car Jack]

This is really cool, David.  I've never seen anything as clear as this.  I found out I'm above the second bend point (I had absolutely no idea).

[ysette9]

I loved this latest blog post on Social Security and early retirement from the Finance Buff

https://thefinancebuff.com/early-retirement-social-security-benefits.html

I’ve bookmarked this so I can go back and run my own numbers later when I have a little more time. I’ve really been looking for something clearly laid out like this since the SS website assumes you are going to work until you are ancient. :)

[Exflyboy]

Ok good luck making sense of that article and your own SS benefits projection.

so i am below the second bend point (yay!).. At an average monthly income of $4025 (I took all my earnings for the last 20 years I have been in the US, added them up and divided by 35).

So my PIA (payments at 67) should be.

0.9* 926 +0.32*(4024-926) = $1825.

My projected earning according to my statement (and it says this assumes you earn $zero from now till you retire) is $2257 at full retirement age = 67 in my case.

I can only assume the $2257 is in future dollars???????

[CoffeeR]

I can only assume the $2257 is in future dollars???????

Correct. If by future dollars you mean the actual payout at 67 (or whenever) is adjusted for inflation.