Author Topic: Race from $1M to $2M  (Read 247652 times)

zinnie

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 646
  • Location: Boston
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1050 on: January 16, 2020, 02:58:24 AM »
Joining this race now! Been reading MMM since the beginning and started seriously saving 2012ish. Adjusted my FIRE number after taking a year off work and trying it out! Now Im back in the game with a slightly lower salary and a higher COL but still a good savings rate. So here is my plan:

Current liquid: $1.18M
Current NW: $1.45M

Goal liquid:~1.6M
Goal NW: ~2M

Id like to be done Aug 2021. Ill walk if the numbers are even close.

It's been a good month! Update:

Liquid: $1.24M
Net Worth: $1.51M

it felt good to pass the 1.5 mark :)

And the good times continue. Now Mint says Ill hit my number in April 2021.
Liquid: $1.33M
Net Worth: $1.60M

ReadyOrNot

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 54
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1051 on: January 16, 2020, 05:20:41 AM »
Wow I'd like to join the fun.

I haven't really done a NW exercise until recently to see how far my family is on track for FIRE.

NW $1.65m
Liquid NW: $1.3m

Net pay of $140k, savings rate of ~40% means adding $60k to the stashe aside from investment growth.  I think we're at the point where passive growth is equal to or greater than actual active income, which is really amazing.

I'm hoping we hit $2m or $2.5m in the next 5 years or so, and then assess if we want to stop working.  If our stashe should hit $2m before that, it will be extra tempting to RE.

talltexan

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2965
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1052 on: January 16, 2020, 07:23:15 AM »
5/1/2016:  ~$2 million (Pre Divorce)
6/1/2016:  ~0.9 million (Post Divorce)  Not sure why I got less than half of total assets, I guess because I have a Y chromosome

1/1/2017:   ~1.1 million Got Remarried
1/1/2018:   ~1.1 million  Had a baby boy.  2017 was pretty much a total financial flatline.  But stayed the course and we both cut our hours down to 30 hours a week.  (Best money I've ever spent).
1/1/2019:    ~1.45 million.  Glad I kept my money in the market. 

I've got  5.5 years until my older kids are out of high school.  Then I'm FIRE'd.  The financial fallout of divorce was significant, but I'm about halfway recovered financially.  And I credit MMM and Jcollins for that.   It could have easily spiraled the opposite direction.

Congratulations for continuing the positive momentum! I do not know the specifics of your divorce, but I've worked in the industry, and I would be very surprised to see the Total NW of the two spouses be anything close to the NW before the divorce. Lawyers and experts and a whole lot of people are part of the process and they all get paid.

Bourbon

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 243
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1053 on: January 21, 2020, 12:29:34 PM »
Jumping in and we are already a bit down the line -

Jan 2019  - $1.7M
Sep 2017 - $983K
July 2016 - $774K
June 2015 - $670K
June 2014 - $500K


About $120K of that is in kid's 529 accounts, and another $180K is equity in primary residence. 

BlueHouse

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3337
  • Location: WDC
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1054 on: January 22, 2020, 12:26:15 PM »
This week my 401k crossed the $1M mark!  I've been at over $1M liquid net worth for a few years, so I've been trying to get this account over $1M as an interim goal to $2M NW. 

I'm giddy with excitement.  I feel so rich.  I don't know why this one account makes me feel any different and I know the value will float up and down over the next few months (No more contributions this year).  But for now....happy!

Hmmmm.  I don't know quite how to explain this rapid rise, but tomorrow, this same 401K will pass $1.1M.  I made my 2019 max profit sharing contribution of $32K, but was there really growth of $70K in 2.5 months? 

With all of my liquid accounts, I am getting very close to the $2M mark.  Also tomorrow, I'll be wired back some funds that I loaned to a family member.  I gave $115K and I'll get back $82K. (I knew this going in and was okay with it).  I'm dancing around in my chair right now. 

With that being said, I'm also incredibly unhappy with my job.  Is there a thread meant to convince people to make drastic changes?  I know I could do it if I changed my lifestyle, and I'm not terribly unwilling to do that, I'm just scared to do it.  Any suggestions on threads to help me make some much needed changes in my life (quit job, sell house, go somewhere cheaper, enjoy life).

Roots&Wings

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1169
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1055 on: January 23, 2020, 07:21:25 AM »
With that being said, I'm also incredibly unhappy with my job.  Is there a thread meant to convince people to make drastic changes?  I know I could do it if I changed my lifestyle, and I'm not terribly unwilling to do that, I'm just scared to do it.  Any suggestions on threads to help me make some much needed changes in my life (quit job, sell house, go somewhere cheaper, enjoy life).

Financially it seems there's no need to take any job crap that's making you unhappy. There are several case studies in the Ask a Mustachian section where people have made big changes in their life (yes big change is scary). Posting details there might help.

Pinning down what is causing the unhappiness is usually a good starting place before making drastic changes (what has changed with your job or living situation that's prompted this? Do you think moving somewhere new will add to your happiness, or will leaving family/friends cause additional stress? MMM's "moving to a better place" post, https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2011/09/28/get-rich-with-moving-to-a-better-place/

Congrats on nearing the $2M mark, I recently crossed $1M, and the freedom that money brings to make changes is one of the best gifts.

Mmm_Donuts

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 401
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1056 on: January 23, 2020, 07:34:29 AM »

With that being said, I'm also incredibly unhappy with my job.  Is there a thread meant to convince people to make drastic changes?  I know I could do it if I changed my lifestyle, and I'm not terribly unwilling to do that, I'm just scared to do it.  Any suggestions on threads to help me make some much needed changes in my life (quit job, sell house, go somewhere cheaper, enjoy life).

I could have written the above myself. I am not liking my job, and when markets are on a tear like they are now, it's very tempting to leave. I'm trying to stick it out and have a somewhat artificial deadline of FIRE early 2021 but in the back of my mind I know I can:

- quit (cutting off funds = scary)
- go part time and have a much easier yet demoted position (blow to the ego)
- move to a lower COL area (already in the plans for 2021)

I feel like I'm waiting for something to push me over the edge at work. But maybe it's up to me. Or maybe I just have to wait it out until the funds are more padded. I am feeling very impatient and torn on what to do.

When I look at houses in the LCOL we're moving to I feel like the extra X months of work will afford us a nicer house, so that is somewhat motivating. But otherwise I just feel meh about working. 

Wondering too, if there's a thread for people in this limbo stage at the end of the accumulation phase?

Watchmaker

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 616
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1057 on: January 23, 2020, 07:59:14 AM »
Wondering too, if there's a thread for people in this limbo stage at the end of the accumulation phase?

It's often called One More Year syndrome (OMY), so you can probably find relevant threads by searching for that term.

Much Fishing to Do

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 594
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1058 on: January 23, 2020, 08:05:09 AM »

- quit (cutting off funds = scary)
- go part time and have a much easier yet demoted position (blow to the ego)

I feel like I'm waiting for something to push me over the edge at work. But maybe it's up to me.

This really sounds to me like you're going to OMY it for quite a while if you don't go ahead and deal with these two issues, whether we're talking about today or 2021, or 2022....  There's likely nothing thats going to happen to you investments in the next 12 months that will make the cutting off of earned income much less scary, and if ego is tied to work you may have a hard time moving from a good job to being unemployed.  I've sold my business (to cut down on stress/risk/crazy hours) and gone to half-time consulting, and though I still complain about work (its in everyone to do that even when things are 'good') its all fine now, before the switch it was killing me, so give yourself a chance to be in a good place.
« Last Edit: January 23, 2020, 08:06:49 AM by Much Fishing to Do »

Mmm_Donuts

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 401
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1059 on: January 23, 2020, 08:15:18 AM »
My understanding of OMY is that it's when someone has reached their FIRE goal but is still feeling insecure. In my case I haven't reached the goal yet - we're only ~80% there. But COULD get there by selling the house and downsizing more drastically than we plan on doing. OMY would be what happens if we keep prolonging the plan once we've reached our goals, or upping the final number. No?

In terms of the PT vs FT it's more of a debate of do I want to prolong the work period and have it be somewhere more comfortable? Or gun it and get it done ASAP ripping off the bandaid and FIREing sooner?

Much Fishing to Do

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 594
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1060 on: January 23, 2020, 08:36:39 AM »
My understanding of OMY is that it's when someone has reached their FIRE goal but is still feeling insecure. In my case I haven't reached the goal yet - we're only ~80% there. But COULD get there by selling the house and downsizing more drastically than we plan on doing. OMY would be what happens if we keep prolonging the plan once we've reached our goals, or upping the final number. No?

Yes, sorry I wasn't clear, I wasn't saying you were OMYing it now, but these are two big issues that just looked to me like ones that would likely lead you to be OMYing it in the future if they are not worked out now.  Our FIRE goals are all somewhat arbitrary, and things like having 25x expected spending etc that sound fine when we are pushing to the target may not sound as settling when you get there (thats when I see a lot of folks say well, 33x is much better, I should really reach for that, etc....).  If the PT v FT decision is not one of ego re: position at job but instead deciding between quicker and slower FIRE, I'd say if you're miserable try a change, if not stick it out.  Best of Luck!

Bird In Hand

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 690
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1061 on: January 23, 2020, 08:41:56 AM »
My understanding of OMY is that it's when someone has reached their FIRE goal but is still feeling insecure. In my case I haven't reached the goal yet - we're only ~80% there. But COULD get there by selling the house and downsizing more drastically than we plan on doing. OMY would be what happens if we keep prolonging the plan once we've reached our goals, or upping the final number. No?

Psychologically what you're dealing with isn't much different than OMY syndrome IMO.  Yes, OMY implies that FI has already been achieved, but most of us close to FI know that we could probably start downshifting now (or switch jobs/careers to something more pleasant) and the market will likely carry our portfolios to the FI finish line quite soon.  But fear keeps us in a perpetual loop where we can't convince ourselves that we've saved enough to risk doing something different.

Also, this might or might not apply to you, but many of us are highly motivated to achieve a distant goal, and then the motivation wanes drastically as the goal is finally within reach.  "The journey matters more than the destination" is very real for us.  We've been saving diligently for FI/RE for a couple decades, and now that FI is close, I'm finding it's harder to keep up the motivation.  The lack of motivation over a long-held goal can lead to feelings of restlessness and general dissatisfaction.

Quote
In terms of the PT vs FT it's more of a debate of do I want to prolong the work period and have it be somewhere more comfortable? Or gun it and get it done ASAP ripping off the bandaid and FIREing sooner?

Now if you truly dislike your job and it's causing you significant stress -- which will manifest both as unhappiness and eventually as health problems -- I hope you'll take the leap and do something about it.  Either figure out how to make your job more tolerable, downshift the hours, both, or find another job and trust that the market will get your portfolio to FI sooner rather than later.

BlueHouse

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3337
  • Location: WDC
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1062 on: January 23, 2020, 08:55:49 AM »
In my case I haven't reached the goal yet - we're only ~80% there. But COULD get there by selling the house and downsizing more drastically than we plan on doing. OMY would be what happens if we keep prolonging the plan once we've reached our goals, or upping the final number. No?

This is me too.  But the fact that I could be FI now if I changed my goals (moved to a LCOL area and sold my oversized house) means that I think I AM in OMY.  Or just paralyzed with fear of doing something different. 

Basically, I'm hanging out in a job that is making me unhappy to afford a house in a city that I will eventually leave anyway (just don't want to leave right now, but not sure on the reasons why).  I think I may just start running scenarios on leaving now/selling now vs. staying to see if I can isolate what is keeping me in this place that makes me so unfulfilled.

Bateaux

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1601
  • Location: Port Vincent
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1063 on: January 23, 2020, 09:02:31 AM »
My understanding of OMY is that it's when someone has reached their FIRE goal but is still feeling insecure. In my case I haven't reached the goal yet - we're only ~80% there. But COULD get there by selling the house and downsizing more drastically than we plan on doing. OMY would be what happens if we keep prolonging the plan once we've reached our goals, or upping the final number. No?

Yes, sorry I wasn't clear, I wasn't saying you were OMYing it now, but these are two big issues that just looked to me like ones that would likely lead you to be OMYing it in the future if they are not worked out now.  Our FIRE goals are all somewhat arbitrary, and things like having 25x expected spending etc that sound fine when we are pushing to the target may not sound as settling when you get there (thats when I see a lot of folks say well, 33x is much better, I should really reach for that, etc....).  If the PT v FT decision is not one of ego re: position at job but instead deciding between quicker and slower FIRE, I'd say if you're miserable try a change, if not stick it out.  Best of Luck!

I'm guilty of living in OMY limbo.  My first goal was 1.5M in investments and zero debt.  That came and went.  Then another goal of 2M in investments and no debt came and went.  Now the new goal of 2.5M investments and no debt is rapidly approaching, at 2.38M.   I've got my eyes on 3M investments and no debt.  If this market rise continues, 3M is a very close number.  The game gets much easier and faster at these levels.  Fighting lifestyle creep gets harder and YOLO plays with your mind. 

BlueHouse

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3337
  • Location: WDC
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1064 on: January 23, 2020, 10:58:26 AM »
I'm getting close so much faster than I expected.  I might as well share more info:

Dec 2015      $0.867M
Dec 2016      $1.069M
Dec 2017      $1.442M
Dec 2018      $1.338M (I took out $150K for other purposes)
Dec 2019      $1.773M
01/23/2020   $1.911M

I think I'll definitely hit $2M this year.  And if I sell my house, then I'm at my number.  Watching these numbers just may motivate me enough to make a big change to get me to my end goal faster (which is FIRE, not an actual number)

JGS1980

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 186
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1065 on: January 23, 2020, 02:14:13 PM »
In my case I haven't reached the goal yet - we're only ~80% there. But COULD get there by selling the house and downsizing more drastically than we plan on doing. OMY would be what happens if we keep prolonging the plan once we've reached our goals, or upping the final number. No?

This is me too.  But the fact that I could be FI now if I changed my goals (moved to a LCOL area and sold my oversized house) means that I think I AM in OMY.  Or just paralyzed with fear of doing something different. 

Basically, I'm hanging out in a job that is making me unhappy to afford a house in a city that I will eventually leave anyway (just don't want to leave right now, but not sure on the reasons why).  I think I may just start running scenarios on leaving now/selling now vs. staying to see if I can isolate what is keeping me in this place that makes me so unfulfilled.

It's not all or nothing. You don't have to quit your job AND sell your house AND move to a LCOL. Why not put your resume out to alternative jobs in your field? Why not try to work part time at another job until you can figure some stuff out? Sometimes, also, you will not be able to see what made you feel "so unfulfilled" until you actually leave. Hindsight and all that.

Hope this helps,

JGS

Freedomin5

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2385
  • Location: China
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1066 on: January 23, 2020, 02:24:33 PM »
Fighting lifestyle creep gets harder and YOLO plays with your mind.

I have this problem too. When eating out at a nice restaurant or buying lunch at work is only 0.1% of your net pay, oftentimes, I wonder, Why not? And before I realize it, Ive spent $400 on mediocre cafeteria lunches at work.

markbike528CBX

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1239
  • Location: the Everbrown part of the Evergreen State (WA)
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1067 on: January 23, 2020, 03:12:54 PM »
My understanding of OMY is that it's when someone has reached their FIRE goal but is still feeling insecure. In my case I haven't reached the goal yet - we're only ~80% there. But COULD get there by selling the house and downsizing more drastically than we plan on doing. OMY would be what happens if we keep prolonging the plan once we've reached our goals, or upping the final number. No?
Yes, sorry I wasn't clear, I wasn't saying you were OMYing it now, but these are two big issues that just looked to me like ones that would likely lead you to be OMYing it in the future if they are not worked out now.  Our FIRE goals are all somewhat arbitrary, and things like having 25x expected spending etc that sound fine when we are pushing to the target may not sound as settling when you get there (thats when I see a lot of folks say well, 33x is much better, I should really reach for that, etc....).  If the PT v FT decision is not one of ego re: position at job but instead deciding between quicker and slower FIRE, I'd say if you're miserable try a change, if not stick it out.  Best of Luck!

I'm guilty of living in OMY limbo.  My first goal was 1.5M in investments and zero debt.  That came and went.  Then another goal of 2M in investments and no debt came and went.  Now the new goal of 2.5M investments and no debt is rapidly approaching, at 2.38M.   I've got my eyes on 3M investments and no debt.  If this market rise continues, 3M is a very close number.  The game gets much easier and faster at these levels.  Fighting lifestyle creep gets harder and YOLO plays with your mind.

For those who have OMY or future-OMY syndrome I'd suggest the thread
https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/post-fire/serious-'one-more-year'-syndrome-advice-appreciated/
, which was OP'd by the happily now misnamed @Omy,  This thread shows the community help get someone over the "hump" of OMY-ness.

The last comment by @Bateaux shows the moving goalposts explicity presented as OMY, but not the root cause- fear (of A, B, C, D ....X, Y, Z).

Bateaux

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1601
  • Location: Port Vincent
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1068 on: January 23, 2020, 06:24:52 PM »
My understanding of OMY is that it's when someone has reached their FIRE goal but is still feeling insecure. In my case I haven't reached the goal yet - we're only ~80% there. But COULD get there by selling the house and downsizing more drastically than we plan on doing. OMY would be what happens if we keep prolonging the plan once we've reached our goals, or upping the final number. No?
Yes, sorry I wasn't clear, I wasn't saying you were OMYing it now, but these are two big issues that just looked to me like ones that would likely lead you to be OMYing it in the future if they are not worked out now.  Our FIRE goals are all somewhat arbitrary, and things like having 25x expected spending etc that sound fine when we are pushing to the target may not sound as settling when you get there (thats when I see a lot of folks say well, 33x is much better, I should really reach for that, etc....).  If the PT v FT decision is not one of ego re: position at job but instead deciding between quicker and slower FIRE, I'd say if you're miserable try a change, if not stick it out.  Best of Luck!

I'm guilty of living in OMY limbo.  My first goal was 1.5M in investments and zero debt.  That came and went.  Then another goal of 2M in investments and no debt came and went.  Now the new goal of 2.5M investments and no debt is rapidly approaching, at 2.38M.   I've got my eyes on 3M investments and no debt.  If this market rise continues, 3M is a very close number.  The game gets much easier and faster at these levels.  Fighting lifestyle creep gets harder and YOLO plays with your mind.

For those who have OMY or future-OMY syndrome I'd suggest the thread
https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/post-fire/serious-'one-more-year'-syndrome-advice-appreciated/
, which was OP'd by the happily now misnamed @Omy,  This thread shows the community help get someone over the "hump" of OMY-ness.

The last comment by @Bateaux shows the moving goalposts explicity presented as OMY, but not the root cause- fear (of A, B, C, D ....X, Y, Z).

In the first million run up it's fear of running out that keeps you working.  You remain frugal and save aggressively.  Post one million fear of running out is still there, but you know in just a few more, one more years you can eliminate that almost entirely.     Post two million fear of running out no longer dominates your desire to OMY.  Now fear of missing out creeps in.  Your accounts are now growingat $500 or more dollars a day.  You start to justify trading a few more years for a level of security and wealth you didn't dream possible.   All the while you're ageing and time is rapidly becoming the most precious possession.  Perpetual, generational wealth can be achieved. It's a MMM to Boglehead transition.   Maybe most of you can avoid it.

Omy

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 516
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1069 on: January 24, 2020, 06:37:25 AM »
Thanks for the mention, @markbike528CBX . Starting that thread (and especially all of the amazing advice I received) was life-changing. I'm thrilled to be 5 months FIREd and the stash is growing just fine without me slaving away to add just a little more buffer against all imaginable (and unimaginable) possibilities.

Watchmaker

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 616
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1070 on: January 24, 2020, 08:46:44 AM »
My understanding of OMY is that it's when someone has reached their FIRE goal but is still feeling insecure. In my case I haven't reached the goal yet - we're only ~80% there. But COULD get there by selling the house and downsizing more drastically than we plan on doing. OMY would be what happens if we keep prolonging the plan once we've reached our goals, or upping the final number. No?

I guess it depends exactly what feeling you're talking about in the earlier post.

If your issue is that you could retire with some lifestyle changes right now, but you're not-- that sounds like OMY, even if you haven't hit your number (it might just mean your number was higher than it needed to be). You *could* RE right now, but you want more safety/comfort than your current stash would give. Once you've passed your original number it's still the same problem, it has just shifted from deciding between lean FIRE and regular FIRE to between regular FIRE and fat FIRE. I'm in the same place you are (the final stretch), and I know OMY will be a problem for me. Because, from where I am now, the marginal benefit of a year of work looks pretty good.

If you're talking about the frustration of being so close to your number but not quite there yet, I get that as well. And I think that can be a useful emotion for countering OMY urges. But certainly being so close to FIRE has distracted me, causing me to put in less time and effort into my job. I spend so much time daydreaming now, but some of the daydreams would require a larger stash and therefore keep me employed longer. Argh.





aspiringnomad

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 898
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1071 on: January 24, 2020, 08:49:39 AM »
My understanding of OMY is that it's when someone has reached their FIRE goal but is still feeling insecure. In my case I haven't reached the goal yet - we're only ~80% there. But COULD get there by selling the house and downsizing more drastically than we plan on doing. OMY would be what happens if we keep prolonging the plan once we've reached our goals, or upping the final number. No?

Yes, sorry I wasn't clear, I wasn't saying you were OMYing it now, but these are two big issues that just looked to me like ones that would likely lead you to be OMYing it in the future if they are not worked out now.  Our FIRE goals are all somewhat arbitrary, and things like having 25x expected spending etc that sound fine when we are pushing to the target may not sound as settling when you get there (thats when I see a lot of folks say well, 33x is much better, I should really reach for that, etc....).  If the PT v FT decision is not one of ego re: position at job but instead deciding between quicker and slower FIRE, I'd say if you're miserable try a change, if not stick it out.  Best of Luck!

I'm guilty of living in OMY limbo.  My first goal was 1.5M in investments and zero debt.  That came and went.  Then another goal of 2M in investments and no debt came and went.  Now the new goal of 2.5M investments and no debt is rapidly approaching, at 2.38M.   I've got my eyes on 3M investments and no debt.  If this market rise continues, 3M is a very close number.  The game gets much easier and faster at these levels.  Fighting lifestyle creep gets harder and YOLO plays with your mind.

I'm about to pull the plug at 37 with ~1.75M. The original goal when I found MMM was FIRE by 45 with at least $2M. Depending on the market's movements I would likely hit $3M if I waited until then, so I know the lure you speak of. I also enjoy my job. But when I think YOLO, I think it's time to move on from doing the same thing I've been doing the last 16 years at various companies for 40+ hours a week. The world is big and wonderful and interesting, and since I'd like to take my time seeing it, I can't really have it both ways. Waiting another 8 years, or even just 1 year, certainly wouldn't be the worst thing in the world, but for me the value of each year of freedom versus additional investments has turned quickly in favor of freedom as the accounts have grown. Obviously, YMMV.

Mmm_Donuts

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 401
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1072 on: January 24, 2020, 09:32:53 AM »
My understanding of OMY is that it's when someone has reached their FIRE goal but is still feeling insecure. In my case I haven't reached the goal yet - we're only ~80% there. But COULD get there by selling the house and downsizing more drastically than we plan on doing. OMY would be what happens if we keep prolonging the plan once we've reached our goals, or upping the final number. No?

I guess it depends exactly what feeling you're talking about in the earlier post.

If your issue is that you could retire with some lifestyle changes right now, but you're not-- that sounds like OMY, even if you haven't hit your number (it might just mean your number was higher than it needed to be). You *could* RE right now, but you want more safety/comfort than your current stash would give. Once you've passed your original number it's still the same problem, it has just shifted from deciding between lean FIRE and regular FIRE to between regular FIRE and fat FIRE. I'm in the same place you are (the final stretch), and I know OMY will be a problem for me. Because, from where I am now, the marginal benefit of a year of work looks pretty good.

If you're talking about the frustration of being so close to your number but not quite there yet, I get that as well. And I think that can be a useful emotion for countering OMY urges. But certainly being so close to FIRE has distracted me, causing me to put in less time and effort into my job. I spend so much time daydreaming now, but some of the daydreams would require a larger stash and therefore keep me employed longer. Argh.

Thanks for this, Watchmaker, and other posters above. This whole conversation has really had me rethinking things. I appreciate the thoughtful responses and I realize -- OMY syndrome is beyond what I first thought it was, and that feeling of "not enough" could still be there once the arbitrary number has been reached.

I suppose the current feeling is mostly frustration at realizing that with all the variables and moving parts that go into determining a FIRE number, the number itself is fairly arbitrary. Yet I felt pressure to stick to the plan until the number is reached. Meanwhile I'm really not happy with my work and could relatively easily go PT and feel much less stressed. So - why wouldn't I do that? I realized I had to sort through some cognitive dissonance and rigid thinking.

Since posting here, I wrote a list of pros and cons to staying on in my current position. The cons list was long. I.e. reasons for leaving -- plentiful. There was really only one valid reason to stay: It allows me to pad the stash more aggressively. But in examining the variables that go into this final number, the aggressive stashing becomes moot. Because it's just not worth it. I can work with the other variables to make it work. My SO still works, so we'll have a ~0% withdrawal rate for the foreseeable future anyway. Selling our expensive house can get us to where we want to be. Cutting back on expenses shouldn't be too hard. I can bring in a decent income even PT. Etc.

I would love to be able to slack my way through the rest of the year, to say "fuck it" to the office politics, the deadlines, the workload, the effort, and keep going full time as originally planned, but with less stress. But without going into detail here, the nature of the work does not allow for that. I can do my best to ignore office politics but they will seep back in quite quickly.

So - decision made. I am OLYing it. Well, going PT this year, with option to FIRE completely at any point.

Emotions like fear and insecurity are so tricky! This has been really valuable exercise to go through, and I feel like the light bulb has finally flickered on. Thanks again, smart people.

JGS1980

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 186
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1073 on: January 24, 2020, 09:37:47 AM »
4 to 5 years from now, when we are close to FIRE, the big question for my family will be whether OMY will afford us necessary flexibility for the long term.

I have 3 children, so undergrad education, grad school, "launching" all matter.

My wife isn't a true Mustachian, so may regard long term financial "restriction" (i.e. you can't just buy whatever you want whenever you want it) as a burden. I am not willing to make her unhappy, regardless if I agree with that viewpoint.

The eventual compromise may be that she will work PT for her own long term spending money after we get to a certain point of financial security.

For comparison, I could FIRE easily on 50K spending per year with our family. My wife would be a lot more comfortable with 80-100K/year.

BlueHouse

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3337
  • Location: WDC
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1074 on: January 24, 2020, 09:55:51 AM »
My understanding of OMY is that it's when someone has reached their FIRE goal but is still feeling insecure. In my case I haven't reached the goal yet - we're only ~80% there. But COULD get there by selling the house and downsizing more drastically than we plan on doing. OMY would be what happens if we keep prolonging the plan once we've reached our goals, or upping the final number. No?

I guess it depends exactly what feeling you're talking about in the earlier post.

If your issue is that you could retire with some lifestyle changes right now, but you're not-- that sounds like OMY, even if you haven't hit your number (it might just mean your number was higher than it needed to be). You *could* RE right now, but you want more safety/comfort than your current stash would give. Once you've passed your original number it's still the same problem, it has just shifted from deciding between lean FIRE and regular FIRE to between regular FIRE and fat FIRE. I'm in the same place you are (the final stretch), and I know OMY will be a problem for me. Because, from where I am now, the marginal benefit of a year of work looks pretty good.

If you're talking about the frustration of being so close to your number but not quite there yet, I get that as well. And I think that can be a useful emotion for countering OMY urges. But certainly being so close to FIRE has distracted me, causing me to put in less time and effort into my job. I spend so much time daydreaming now, but some of the daydreams would require a larger stash and therefore keep me employed longer. Argh.

Thanks for this, Watchmaker, and other posters above. This whole conversation has really had me rethinking things. I appreciate the thoughtful responses and I realize -- OMY syndrome is beyond what I first thought it was, and that feeling of "not enough" could still be there once the arbitrary number has been reached.

I suppose the current feeling is mostly frustration at realizing that with all the variables and moving parts that go into determining a FIRE number, the number itself is fairly arbitrary. Yet I felt pressure to stick to the plan until the number is reached. Meanwhile I'm really not happy with my work and could relatively easily go PT and feel much less stressed. So - why wouldn't I do that? I realized I had to sort through some cognitive dissonance and rigid thinking.

Since posting here, I wrote a list of pros and cons to staying on in my current position. The cons list was long. I.e. reasons for leaving -- plentiful. There was really only one valid reason to stay: It allows me to pad the stash more aggressively. But in examining the variables that go into this final number, the aggressive stashing becomes moot. Because it's just not worth it. I can work with the other variables to make it work. My SO still works, so we'll have a ~0% withdrawal rate for the foreseeable future anyway. Selling our expensive house can get us to where we want to be. Cutting back on expenses shouldn't be too hard. I can bring in a decent income even PT. Etc.

I would love to be able to slack my way through the rest of the year, to say "fuck it" to the office politics, the deadlines, the workload, the effort, and keep going full time as originally planned, but with less stress. But without going into detail here, the nature of the work does not allow for that. I can do my best to ignore office politics but they will seep back in quite quickly.

So - decision made. I am OLYing it. Well, going PT this year, with option to FIRE completely at any point.

Emotions like fear and insecurity are so tricky! This has been really valuable exercise to go through, and I feel like the light bulb has finally flickered on. Thanks again, smart people.

I'll be going through a similar exercise this weekend.  One thing that hadn't occurred to me was that I may be able to cut back hours drastically for the next few years.  If I work just enough to cover my bills, then I may not need to stash any more (I'm older, so I reach SS age sooner than most).   But I have been assuming SS would still be there when I hit 62 and I have been assuming that healthcare wouldn't increase substantially.  I'm really looking forward to working a few different scenarios.  This is a different game for me.  The past few years I've worked almost every retirement calculator to see if my assumptions carry from one to the other and to see when I get "enough".  But now I'm going to work different scenarios to see what life choices are "enough". 

ixtap

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1793
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1075 on: January 24, 2020, 10:57:50 AM »
My husband dropped a 2MY bomb on me last night. Except that we have already agreed to sign a two year lease in a couple of months, so this is really 4MY.

We have achieved our initial goals, but we can also see where some lifestyle inflation might be nice as we age. What if we didn't have to choose between a boat and an RV? What if we could afford a resort home with amazing amenities? Would we ever enjoy a luxury vacation? I have been poor. He has been financially stressed. We want options.

We love where we live. He even loves his job unless his pain flares up. But he hates everything when his pain flares up, so that might not improve on sabbatical. I did tell him that if he had brought this up last week I would have had him committed, he was that stressed. And he agreed.

So, for now, we have agreed to making the most of our current life. Which is a pretty great one, but we do have things we are looking forward to that just won't happen with an office job.


Bird In Hand

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 690
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1076 on: January 24, 2020, 11:55:28 AM »
So - decision made. I am OLYing it. Well, going PT this year, with option to FIRE completely at any point.

Awesome!  What concrete steps have you taken (or will be taking imminently) to bring this plan to fruition?  Do you have a date by which you resolve to be working PT?

Is your SO supportive of your PT plan?  And also of potentially downsizing (in $$, if not location) your house?

Quote
Emotions like fear and insecurity are so tricky! This has been really valuable exercise to go through, and I feel like the light bulb has finally flickered on. Thanks again, smart people.

I'm a bit jealous.  I've had similar epiphanies to what you described, but it's never been enough to push me over the edge and actually shift to PT.  I distinctly remember 2-3 years ago discussing our financial situation and the possibility of PT work with my wife.  She was supportive, and I resolved that I would move to PT as soon as I could work out the logistics.  I even broached the topic with management at work (they weren't especially enthusiastic, but were willing to give it a try if I really wanted to)...and then I guess I just chickened out.

Looking back, I'm pretty sure I've added ~$10k/yr to our expected 4% SWR target.  I don't remember consciously deciding that, but all my FIRECalc simulations are now performed with the larger number.  It's frustrating and a little embarrassing to admit this.

Watchmaker

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 616
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1077 on: January 24, 2020, 01:10:18 PM »
I feel like the light bulb has finally flickered on. Thanks again, smart people.

Cool! Now you just need to promise to stick around to help me avoid my OMY.

talltexan

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2965
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1078 on: January 24, 2020, 01:39:02 PM »
My employer is switching their Health Savings Account provider, so I'm having to removed more than $30,000 from risky investments and stick it in cash for at least a couple of weeks. De-risking forced on me by default


Mmm_Donuts

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 401
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1079 on: January 25, 2020, 09:22:00 AM »
So - decision made. I am OLYing it. Well, going PT this year, with option to FIRE completely at any point.

Awesome!  What concrete steps have you taken (or will be taking imminently) to bring this plan to fruition?  Do you have a date by which you resolve to be working PT?

Is your SO supportive of your PT plan?  And also of potentially downsizing (in $$, if not location) your house?


I have talked it over with my SO. He's fully supportive of this plan. Steps taken so far have been accountability based -- I've told a few family members (and this forum). Maybe I'll sign up for the Class of 2020 thread. :) And I've been thinking about timing - due to just taking on a new project I need to see it through to a certain stage. The best time to aim for is March / April. I'm thinking I'll give 3 weeks notice so there is time to train someone, and I'll probably give notice sometime in March. Exact date TBD.

I've also thought about how to phrase it when I talk to my boss. They will try to argue to get me back unless I make it clear that this is about me, leaving on a positive note, rather than giving them any work-related reason that they can try to fix. I have to word it so that it's about me needing more free time - there's nothing they can really offer to fix that other than have me go PT.

Quote
Emotions like fear and insecurity are so tricky! This has been really valuable exercise to go through, and I feel like the light bulb has finally flickered on. Thanks again, smart people.

I'm a bit jealous.  I've had similar epiphanies to what you described, but it's never been enough to push me over the edge and actually shift to PT.  I distinctly remember 2-3 years ago discussing our financial situation and the possibility of PT work with my wife.  She was supportive, and I resolved that I would move to PT as soon as I could work out the logistics.  I even broached the topic with management at work (they weren't especially enthusiastic, but were willing to give it a try if I really wanted to)...and then I guess I just chickened out.

Looking back, I'm pretty sure I've added ~$10k/yr to our expected 4% SWR target.  I don't remember consciously deciding that, but all my FIRECalc simulations are now performed with the larger number.  It's frustrating and a little embarrassing to admit this.
I'm fortunate in that I know PT work would not be a problem at my workplace. It will just be somewhat of a demotion. But the work itself will be way more relaxed so I think that is worth it.

And I have definitely seen some target WR creep too. Hoping when I have more time in downshifting / FIRE to manage expenses and bring it back down. (We pay for a lot of non mustachian conveniences as a working couple.)

I feel like the light bulb has finally flickered on. Thanks again, smart people.

Cool! Now you just need to promise to stick around to help me avoid my OMY.

It's a deal! :)

SCUBAstache

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1118
  • Age: 34
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1080 on: January 25, 2020, 01:44:35 PM »
When eating out at a nice restaurant or buying lunch at work is only 0.1% of your net pay, oftentimes, I wonder, Why not? And before I realize it, Ive spent $400 on mediocre cafeteria lunches at work.

I can't believe you would call me out like that. :-o

This has been good for me to read, thanks for all the insightful posts, and congrats @Mmm_Donuts on making a decision to down shift! I look forward to hearing how the transition goes for you.

I feel like I'm in a similar boat. I've surpassed my former FIRE goal of 750k by a lot, but now that I'm married with a kid, things have changed a bit since apparently I now have to take other people into account! But my husband has a pension of 3k a month, a NW of about 500k, I have a NW of just over 1MM... I mean I know kids are "expensive" but I think we could FIRE and be okay at this point. My husband is a bit more worried about turning off the firehose of cash. I'm too tired to argue, because we have a baby, and I don't hate my job right now and it's currently providing a free house... so, this seems like one of those times where OMY-ing might not be so bad?

In a perfect world I would also go part time. But part time doesn't come with free rent, sadly!

Fomerly known as something

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 851
  • Location: Midwest
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1081 on: January 28, 2020, 04:54:45 AM »
Just popping in to bump the thread over the SPAM. 

Seriously disappointed with the 2 day market downturn as I was $3000 away from having $750k in my TSP and I like reaching "milestones" darn it.  Oh well at least this weeks contribution is being bought on the low.

talltexan

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2965
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1082 on: January 28, 2020, 07:54:07 AM »
I have to transfer my health savings account to a new provider, so I went in and sold all the risky investments in that on Friday. That timing appears to have worked in my favor.

Now I've got to navigate a paperwork mess to get it back and exposed before the market takes off again!

YellowCat

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 312
  • Age: 29
  • Location: Michigan
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1083 on: January 31, 2020, 05:20:18 AM »
Posting a day early for January since we're going to the hospital early tomorrow morning for an induction / baby eviction :)

Dec 2020: $1,030,547
Jan 2020: $1,059,159 (+$28,612)

I'm especially proud of our household spending this month - we're currently at $3,091 for both of us. A huge amount of this is groceries (pre-baby stock up of pantry & fridge) + $200 pre-payment for our CSA share for this summer. I anticipate we could spend another $20-$30 today but overall this was a very low spend month for us. Apparently my quest for a frugal detox in Jan was somewhat successful. Our spending may go straight to hell once the baby is here but we'll have to wait and see...

trashtalk

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 104
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1084 on: January 31, 2020, 07:14:05 PM »
Posting a day early for January since we're going to the hospital early tomorrow morning for an induction / baby eviction :)

Dec 2020: $1,030,547
Jan 2020: $1,059,159 (+$28,612)

I'm especially proud of our household spending this month - we're currently at $3,091 for both of us. A huge amount of this is groceries (pre-baby stock up of pantry & fridge) + $200 pre-payment for our CSA share for this summer. I anticipate we could spend another $20-$30 today but overall this was a very low spend month for us. Apparently my quest for a frugal detox in Jan was somewhat successful. Our spending may go straight to hell once the baby is here but we'll have to wait and see...

It might go down just because it's harder to leave the house LOL

Arbitrage

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 573
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1085 on: February 01, 2020, 08:01:28 AM »

Liquid NW / Total NW

1/1/16: $455k / 675k
1/1/17: $555k / 822k
1/1/18: $735k / 1.071M
1/1/19: $765k / 1.152M
12/1/19: $1.011M / 1.477M
1/1/20: $1.049M / 1.531M
2/1/20: $1.041M / 1.522M

Zamboni

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2578
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1086 on: February 01, 2020, 04:01:09 PM »
                      LNW           TNW
Nov 2019     $1.02MM     $1.18MM
Dec 2019     $1.02MM     $1.24MM
Jan 2020      $1.11MM     $1.27MM


Herbert Derp

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 517
  • Age: 29
  • Location: United States
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1087 on: February 02, 2020, 07:43:15 PM »
One month later, the gap has closed almost by a half. $162K to go!

11/23/2012: $45,000.00
08/03/2013: $100,000.00
01/01/2016: $408,896.04
01/01/2017: $617,283.09
06/06/2017: $758,104.40
10/15/2017: $856,488.71
11/18/2017: $929,536.54
11/27/2017: $944,395.35
12/17/2017: $956,928.07
01/01/2018: $968,307.87
01/05/2018: $987,442.11
01/08/2018: $996,215.32
01/09/2018: $998,819.79
01/10/2018: $999,079.24
01/11/2018: $1,003,101.34
02/01/2018: $1,061,732.89
02/28/2018: $1,062,750.48
05/18/2018: $1,149,432.76
06/06/2018: $1,203,026.63
07/11/2018: $1,232,435.26
08/02/2018: $1,269,509.32
09/01/2018: $1,326,015.73
03/05/2019: $1,327,833.14
06/10/2019: $1,462,549.50
07/07/2019: $1,519,162.03
12/14/2019: $1,628,320.78
01/01/2020: $1,705,284.27
02/02/2020: $1,838,397.87

winkleweizen

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 18
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1088 on: February 02, 2020, 11:10:38 PM »
Missed a few posts

march 2019: 1.04m
july 2019:     1.18m
Oct 2019:     1.24m
Feb 2020:     1.42m

Herbert Derp

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 517
  • Age: 29
  • Location: United States
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1089 on: February 13, 2020, 11:26:51 PM »
Not even two weeks have passed since my last update, holy crap! I'm so close now! I wonder if I can make it to $2MM before the market has a correction. I mean, this run-up has been unreal and we are facing a viral pandemic. The market seems to be disconnected with reality right now.

11/23/2012: $45,000.00
08/03/2013: $100,000.00
01/01/2016: $408,896.04
01/01/2017: $617,283.09
06/06/2017: $758,104.40
10/15/2017: $856,488.71
11/18/2017: $929,536.54
11/27/2017: $944,395.35
12/17/2017: $956,928.07
01/01/2018: $968,307.87
01/05/2018: $987,442.11
01/08/2018: $996,215.32
01/09/2018: $998,819.79
01/10/2018: $999,079.24
01/11/2018: $1,003,101.34
02/01/2018: $1,061,732.89
02/28/2018: $1,062,750.48
05/18/2018: $1,149,432.76
06/06/2018: $1,203,026.63
07/11/2018: $1,232,435.26
08/02/2018: $1,269,509.32
09/01/2018: $1,326,015.73
03/05/2019: $1,327,833.14
06/10/2019: $1,462,549.50
07/07/2019: $1,519,162.03
12/14/2019: $1,628,320.78
01/01/2020: $1,705,284.27
02/02/2020: $1,838,397.87
02/13/2020: $1,961,653.87
« Last Edit: February 13, 2020, 11:32:47 PM by Herbert Derp »

BlueHouse

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3337
  • Location: WDC
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1090 on: February 14, 2020, 09:01:25 AM »
Dec 2015      $0.867M
Dec 2016      $1.069M
Dec 2017      $1.442M
Dec 2018      $1.338M
Dec 2019      $1.773M
01/23/2020   $1.911M
02/14/2020   $1.997M

KBecks

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2118
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1091 on: February 14, 2020, 04:05:13 PM »
You are both super-close to 2M! Congrats!


TempusFugit

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 384
  • Location: In my own head, usually
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1092 on: February 14, 2020, 04:07:28 PM »
It looks like we have a couple of folks about to bust through the tape!   

Have you called ahead to the 2-4M (and beyond)  thread so they can have the staff prepare some spots for you? 

Congrats on the imminent achievement! 


itchyfeet

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 846
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1093 on: February 15, 2020, 10:46:48 AM »
Always room for a few more in the $2M and beyond thread.

Another visitor. Stay a while. Stay forever! haha haha haha 🤓 (old dudes will be the only ones that get the reference).

Zoot

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 398
  • Location: USA
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1094 on: February 17, 2020, 08:11:16 AM »
Always room for a few more in the $2M and beyond thread.

Another visitor. Stay a while. Stay forever! haha haha haha 🤓 (old dudes will be the only ones that get the reference).

Confirming that old dames also get the reference.  ;-)  Thanks for the memory! 

Bird In Hand

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 690
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1095 on: February 17, 2020, 09:01:12 AM »
All our combined accounts across various institutions have been over $1M for a few years.  Our combined Vanguard accounts have been over $1M for a year or two.  My own Vanguard funds (employer retirement + IRAs) have been over $1M for most of the past year.  But within the past couple weeks the employer retirement portion of my own Vanguard funds have finally crested (and, for the time being, stayed above) $1M.  Yay for small milestones on a larger journey.

Bateaux

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1601
  • Location: Port Vincent
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1096 on: February 17, 2020, 12:11:08 PM »
Always room for a few more in the $2M and beyond thread.

Another visitor. Stay a while. Stay forever! haha haha haha 🤓 (old dudes will be the only ones that get the reference).

New 2 to 4 and beyond Club Members coming.  Yeah! 

Car Jack

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1481
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1097 on: February 17, 2020, 01:22:03 PM »
Always room for a few more in the $2M and beyond thread.

Another visitor. Stay a while. Stay forever! haha haha haha 🤓 (old dudes will be the only ones that get the reference).

New 2 to 4 and beyond Club Members coming.  Yeah!

I've unlocked the door and prepared tea and biscuits for your arrival.

BlueHouse

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3337
  • Location: WDC
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1098 on: February 17, 2020, 03:45:19 PM »
I think I backslid a little bit!  I am really gonna be crushed if coronavirus turns into the next Spanish flu and kills the economy for a decade.   I want out of this club!!!

1.999 on 2/14.

ETA: 
2/18 end of day:  $1.996M. 

I already went over to the $2 to $4M race and introduced myself and now I feel like a fraud!  I've probably crashed the market because I counted my chickens before they hatched
« Last Edit: February 19, 2020, 07:39:46 AM by BlueHouse »

UnleashHell

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 7036
  • Age: 52
  • Location: Florida
  • Chapter IV - A New ... er.. something
Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #1099 on: February 18, 2020, 04:13:54 AM »


1.999 on 2/14.

ha! that's fantastic and irritating at the same time!