Author Topic: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!  (Read 310379 times)

Adventine

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #900 on: April 06, 2021, 10:57:13 AM »
2 days before Christmas I found out my husband had been treated for 2 STD’s. If I had still been drinking I probably would have drank more and not taken action. Instead I spent
2 days examining what I wanted and had to face the fact that once my relationship was wonderful but that it should have ended 10 years ago. Since I have dealt with getting the house ready to sell, finding a condo to buy and disposing of all the junk he accumulated in the garage, shed, office, etc.  I am physically and emotionally exhausted but handling everything that needs to get done despite being 66. I never could have done all this if I was drinking.


Something similar happened to me with a Very Bad Abusive Ex. Except... I was the one who got sick with the STDs. And he pleaded complete ignorance of how it could have possibly happened in a supposedly monogamous relationship.

I am glad you got out of that relationship and are taking much better care of yourself.

Cassie

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #901 on: April 06, 2021, 12:47:48 PM »
Adventure, luckily that didn’t happen to me. The other part are bad enough. So sorry you went through that too.

Adventine

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #902 on: April 06, 2021, 02:51:02 PM »
@Cassie  we all have our struggles. I'm glad your alcohol-free choices helped you make those good choices for yourself.

LeftA

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #903 on: April 06, 2021, 06:19:15 PM »
@jps , thank you for the warm welcome! Just closed 3 days. My head is killing me! Also had a short period of irritability earlier this afternoon. I’ve been tracking my wine consumption for a few months now. Looking back to the start of the year, my longest streak (sad to say) has been 4 days. I’ve done it a few times, so I guess starting tomorrow evening will be the true test! Reading your stories and the benefits of not drinking is keeping me motivated right now.

fredbear

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #904 on: April 06, 2021, 07:10:20 PM »
@jps ... my longest streak (sad to say) has been 4 days. I’ve done it a few times, so I guess starting tomorrow evening will be the true test! Reading your stories and the benefits of not drinking is keeping me motivated right now.

It's got a noble resonance to announce not-drinking intentions for the next decade, year, month, week.  But there's a reason AA talks about a day at a time.  In the earliest moments, you need an even finer granularity.  Ask (whoever, whatever, Whoever) to have the desire for this drink taken away.  Ten minutes later, you may note in retrospect that it worked.  I noticed that it worked despite my disbelief, disbelief both on the Grand Atheist level, and on the immediate, cynical, modernist level.  Even more humbling, I learned about it from listening to someone I snidely thought my intellectual, social and spiritual inferior.

Any strong addiction is the black hole at the center of a galaxy of habits, many of them sociable, relaxing, comforting; some self-degrading; some fatal.  It takes a long time for those habits to be reshaped, replaced, rooted out.  The little technique above helps keep you back from the event horizon.

TheFrenchCat

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #905 on: April 07, 2021, 09:08:26 AM »
I'm posting here to hopefully be more accountable in my goal.  I'm planning to take a month off from drinking, with one possible exception for a cocktail tasting I've already planned with my friends.  But that will be one drink max.  I just don't know when that's going to be yet. 

I've been mostly drinking once on the weekend, though more recently I've drank twice or thrice during the week.  If this was only 1-2 drinks a day I wouldn't be concerned, but generally I've had at least 4:(  Which yes, I know is terrible and it's really starting to worry me.  So I want to take at least a month off to hopefully reset and lower my tolerance.  At this point I don't feel any effects from just one drink.  I think ideally I'd prefer to just be a social drinker, like at occasional gatherings of friends and family.

Another thing I've realized is that I've been drinking so that I can feel happy.  I have severe depression, and even with treatment, the best I feel on my own for the most part is neutral.  So I'm going to talk to my therapist this week about ways I can try to seek out things that make me happy.  I just really have no idea how to feel happy at this point.  And I know drinking is awful for depression, but in the moment the temptation makes it easy to ignore that and try to self medicate.

Metalcat

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #906 on: April 08, 2021, 07:26:45 AM »
@TheFrenchCat
Welcome! I also have severe depression, and quitting drinking was a big help in managing it (though I drank more often than you). I found that when I was drinking that I thought that drinking made me happy in the moment too - but it took reading This Naked Mind to reflect on it and realize that although I was less inhibited when drinking, I was actually more desperately miserable than ever (I only ever engaged in self harm when drinking). We think that drinking makes us happy, but it's probably just because we associate drinking with going out and having fun with friends - and it's the companionship that makes us happy. It's hard to retrain ourselves to break that association, but it's worth it. Bonne chance!

We think drinking makes us happy because giving in to a craving is a great feeling, but it wouldn't feel great if the negative force of the craving wasn't there in the first place. I don't remember who wrote this, but it's like the exquisite pleasure of taking off uncomfortable shoes. Yet no one purposefully walks around in painful shoes just for the pleasure of taking them off.

As for depression, alcohol absolutely worsens depression. It may feel like relief in the moment, but it just makes feeling depressed feel more acceptable. Not better, just more normal to be miserable.
I used to describe it as wrapping a wet blanket around myself and sinking comfortably into despair. It felt less like being miserable was a bad thing.

So in that way, drinking makes depression worse, and easier to accept. It makes it much less motivating to actually deal with.

I had exactly ZERO joy from my drinking experiment in January, and as I posted before, I felt profoundly sad within 30 minutes of my first sip. And I wasn't otherwise sad that day! I had had a great day, walking for a few hours along the ocean, seeing giant brown pelicans for the first time, and I'm like a giddy 5 year old when I see new animals. I was in a nice, peaceful mood when I started and then quickly I was full on depressed, but it felt totally normal to be so sad, like I felt no pressure to do anything about it. Meanwhile sober, if I felt that sad I would feel compelled to try and make myself feel better.

The experience really gave me insight into alcohol and depression, and how it actually works as a self medication compared to how we *think* it works.

I can't tell you how many times I had wine after a long, stressful day at work and thought that it helped me relax and shake off the day. Then I compare it to this past year where I briefly did some of the most stressful work I've ever done, and I would come home, wired out of my mind, feeling like I desperately needed to shake off the day, but instead of drinking, I would go for a walk with DH, rant for a solid 30 minutes, feel very, very uncomfortable with the stress, and then it would pass, and I would feel fine and move on with my night and not fixate on work.

With the wine, I would skip all of that discomfort, but I would never move past the negative feelings about work, they would just stay with me all evening, I just wouldn't mind them, but I never got a break from them, never got to enjoy my mental space outside of work because drinking right after work kind of cemented those feelings in for the evening.

MustachioedPistachio

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #907 on: April 08, 2021, 08:22:58 AM »
4 months!

That "pre-deciding" concept is a big part of Anni Grace's approach. It's so much easier to not having to decide every damn day if you are going to drink it not. The choice is already made.

After the "pre-decision" is made, then whether you drink or not depends on maintaining the integrity of your own word to yourself.

That's one of the most insidious parts of being a regular drinker. There are so many times you say you won't drink today, this week, this month, whatever, and then you break that promise to yourself because some kind of "exception" comes up. Over time, you train yourself to have no faith in your own word.

Since I quit drinking, I now basically never question if I'll actually do something I say I'm going to do, and I can no longer imagine it any other way.

+1,000

Blissful Biker

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #908 on: April 08, 2021, 10:16:38 AM »
A good friend from uni posted this on social media a few weeks ago and it really got me thinking:

"I was back and forth on whether or not to post anything about this, because ultimately, it’s only about me.  However, I’ll share my perspective for what it’s worth.  Today marks the 4th anniversary since my last drink.  Am I an alcoholic?  I honestly don’t really know, but I’ll put it this way.  Like the vast majority of the population in the developed world, I have a relationship with alcohol.  There were times in my life where I drank a lot and often, and times where it was merely “social” (whatever that means).  It was when I almost randomly challenged myself to go 1 month without it that I became intensely aware of how casually, almost insidiously it was hooked into almost every facet of my life.  Any occasion with friends and family?  Alcohol is there.  Any sporting event?  Yup.  Hot outside?  Maybe I’ll have a beer.  Etc.  So, when I finished a month, I thought “What about 2?”  And then a year, and now it’s four years.
I don’t miss it at all.  I don’t miss hangovers, I don’t miss the calories, I don’t miss the vague recollections of incredibly stupid things I said, or find out I said.  Ask anyone the knows me, I can be as childish and silly as any drunk person out there, but I won’t feel like death the next day, so I guess the only thing I’m actually missing is THE EXCUSE.  Love me or hate me, at least it’s actually ME.  I got tired of feeling like a passenger in my own head.
Anyhow, if you’re interested in less stress, greater clarity, and a more authentic version of yourself, maybe think about giving the bottle a break.  Love you all, no judgement, I said at the start, this is all about me, it’s entirely a personal decision and a matter of choice.  #sober #soberversary
"

I too have a relationship with alcohol and while it is within societal norms,  I recognize it isn't serving me.  How we spend our days is how we spend our life, and I want my life to be fuller, richer and a better example for my kids.

From this forum thread I learned about the Naked Mind book and program.  Thanks!  I started Annie's 30 Day Alcohol Experiment yesterday https://learn.thisnakedmind.com/the-alcohol-experiment-registration and like her approach of learning, thinking and considering without rules or judgement.

LeftA

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #909 on: April 08, 2021, 08:28:58 PM »
I made it through Day 5!

I’ve been tracking my drinking since May 2020. I’ve had a few 4 days streaks, and one 5 day streak all the way back in September. Now, most often I’d only drink 1 glass with dinner. So, while it wasn’t a crazy amount, I don’t like how habitual it had become.

Also, this year I’ve had fewer wine free evenings and have only had a few 3 days streaks. After that I’d give in and have a glass. Today, I did give it a second thought, but pushed through.

I also ordered This Naked Mind and it should be arriving tomorrow. 
« Last Edit: April 08, 2021, 08:34:23 PM by LeftA »

LeftA

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #910 on: April 08, 2021, 08:40:30 PM »
Quote from: Blissful Biker

I too have a relationship with alcohol and while it is within societal norms,  I recognize it isn't serving me.  How we spend our days is how we spend our life, and I want my life to be fuller, richer and a better example for my kids.


This really speaks to me! Welcome @Blissful Biker .

brooklynmoney

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #911 on: April 08, 2021, 08:51:24 PM »
I went to the eye doc today and for the first time I can remember I don’t have dry eye. After doing some research I read even a little alcohol can worsen the condition. I’m a little more than a week out from 100 days with no booze.

LeftA

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #912 on: April 10, 2021, 06:24:33 PM »
The 2 hardest day of the week are now behind me...Friday right after work and Saturday evening. These were the most common times for me to drink wine. With that, I’m at 1 full week wine-free.

I have not committed to a specific timeframe...just taking it one day at a time. So far, I feel more energized and clear headed. Less irritable too.

My copy of this Naked Mind arrived yesterday and I’m half way through it. Not much of it seems new, having read pages of this thread beforehand.

Stubblestache

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #913 on: April 11, 2021, 11:20:50 AM »
I am 101 days sober today. This is the longest I've ever been sober as an adult.

Can't quite believe it.

Metalcat

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #914 on: April 11, 2021, 12:01:20 PM »
I am 101 days sober today. This is the longest I've ever been sober as an adult.

Can't quite believe it.

CONGRATS!!

I know for me, that 100 days milestone felt like a really heartwarming accomplishment.

Cassie

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #915 on: April 11, 2021, 01:06:35 PM »
Stubble, that’s huge! Congrats. I recently hit 8 months.

BikeFanatic

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #916 on: April 11, 2021, 01:45:31 PM »
wow Cassie that is amazing. You are rocking it too stubble stache.

Dee

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #917 on: April 11, 2021, 06:08:02 PM »
Is it 101 days for those of us who went dry on New Year's Day (Jan 1)? If so, I'm now in the triple digit club as well : )

Stubblestache

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #918 on: April 12, 2021, 03:25:15 AM »
Stubble, that’s huge! Congrats. I recently hit 8 months.

Thanks you and congratulations on eight months! Really great.

Stubblestache

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #919 on: April 12, 2021, 03:25:37 AM »
Is it 101 days for those of us who went dry on New Year's Day (Jan 1)? If so, I'm now in the triple digit club as well : )

we're sober twinsies :)

FLBiker

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #920 on: April 12, 2021, 11:57:08 AM »
15 years sober yesterday.  It definitely gets easier -- I am never tempted to drink and I never regret giving it up.  It's great to see so much support here!

The 585

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #921 on: April 12, 2021, 01:08:43 PM »
I would love to quit drinking alcohol for many reasons (mental clarity, health, saving money). The problem is I always cave because it's so engrained in social fabric with friends and family. How do you break this social pattern? My parents have always been big drinkers and keep saying things like "Can't until you're back -- there's SO many new breweries we need to take you too! You'll love them!"

BikeFanatic

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #922 on: April 12, 2021, 01:53:09 PM »
Geographer,
You do not have to quit you can just give it up for a period of time then re evaluate. I started with 3 days then 3 months then 7 months. eventually I realized after many milestones like sober Baseball games , sober Kayaking etc I realized I did not need alcohol and I do not even want to drink anymore.
First admit there is an issue, if there is one, then make a plan to abstain for X amount of time.

Here is the free alcohol experiment I would start there if you are ready. GO to FREE Resources tab and sign up for daily videos the book this naked mind is also a great quit drinking book.

https://thisnakedmind.com/the-alcohol-experiment/

« Last Edit: April 12, 2021, 02:42:16 PM by BikeFanatic »

wenchsenior

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #923 on: April 12, 2021, 02:33:28 PM »
I'm posting here to hopefully be more accountable in my goal.  I'm planning to take a month off from drinking, with one possible exception for a cocktail tasting I've already planned with my friends.  But that will be one drink max.  I just don't know when that's going to be yet. 

I've been mostly drinking once on the weekend, though more recently I've drank twice or thrice during the week.  If this was only 1-2 drinks a day I wouldn't be concerned, but generally I've had at least 4:(  Which yes, I know is terrible and it's really starting to worry me.  So I want to take at least a month off to hopefully reset and lower my tolerance.  At this point I don't feel any effects from just one drink.  I think ideally I'd prefer to just be a social drinker, like at occasional gatherings of friends and family.

Another thing I've realized is that I've been drinking so that I can feel happy.  I have severe depression, and even with treatment, the best I feel on my own for the most part is neutral.  So I'm going to talk to my therapist this week about ways I can try to seek out things that make me happy.  I just really have no idea how to feel happy at this point.  And I know drinking is awful for depression, but in the moment the temptation makes it easy to ignore that and try to self medicate.

I agree with all the previous comments about depression. I spent almost 20 years thinking my couple of glasses of wine each evening were 'chilling me out' and helping me have a little spot of joy in my day. Then when I quit, I realized that the drinking had been greatly worsening both my anxiety and my depression.     In addition, it turned out that drinking had not just been 'numbing' my bad feelings, but the feelings on the other end of the spectrum as well.  And finally, it had been removing my motivation and optimism that would have potentially allowed me to make bigger life changes and create better habits that would help me manage anxiety and depression in healthy ways (which I now do).

Just give the AF thing a try for a few months... 2 years on and I still can't believe how much better my emotional health is, nor how long I 'sawed my own emotional legs' off without realizing it.

wenchsenior

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #924 on: April 12, 2021, 02:35:44 PM »
Also, congrats to everyone reporting in on milestones.  I love hearing that!

wenchsenior

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #925 on: April 12, 2021, 02:47:28 PM »
Geographer,
You do not have to quit you can just give it up for a period of time then re evaluate. I started with 3 days then 3 months then 7 months. eventually I realized after many milestones like sober Baseball games , sober Kayaking etc I realized I did not need alcohol and I do not even want to drink anymore.
First admit there is an issue, if there is one, then make a plan to abstain for X amount of time.

Here is the free alcohol experiment I would start there if you are ready. GO to FREE Resources tab and sign up for daily videos the book this naked mind is also a great quit drinking book.

https://thisnakedmind.com/the-alcohol-experiment/

I second this recommendation, but please note that you will want to sign up at the "Returning Users Login" (it's the link for new members despite the misleading name, and goes to the new site for the Experiment). Don't use the "Legacy login" (it leads to the site that most of us on this thread did the Experiment at, but that site is no longer technically supported and it's all but dead).

There is also a social board (https://www.thisnakedmindcommunity.com/home) that has taken the place of a bunch of the commenting, interactive, and social functions that were features of the old Experiment site, but are not featured on the new Experiment site.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2021, 02:50:06 PM by wenchsenior »

mspym

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #926 on: April 12, 2021, 03:16:33 PM »
@Geographer Seconding the you don't have to Give Up, you can just hit pause for a bit.

My husband brews, his friends brew, going to new breweries/tastings etc was a social thing we did. I was really worried about how to be social/ pressure from friends and family. I decided I was stopping after <specific date>, didn't tell anyone for a couple of weeks, then told my husband I was giving it a break so he wouldn't offer me a beer. (I think I told him it was going to be for a couple months but secretly I was aiming for at least a year/maybe forever.) It's coming up 4 years now. I still enjoy sniffing a good boutique beer to work out what they have done but don't drink. All my friends and family now know I don't drink anymore.

A lot of the time what we perceive as pressure to drink is people making an offer of a shared enjoyment because they want to do something enjoyable with you. It's not necessarily about the drinking. Once they transition to thinking of you as not drinking, the let's check out this brewery offers become let's try this walk/cooking class/fancy coffee place, whatever it is that becomes the replacement Shared Enjoyment. You can help them by proposing other things that can become that shared enjoyment.

Metalcat

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #927 on: April 12, 2021, 03:41:36 PM »
@Geographer Seconding the you don't have to Give Up, you can just hit pause for a bit.

My husband brews, his friends brew, going to new breweries/tastings etc was a social thing we did. I was really worried about how to be social/ pressure from friends and family. I decided I was stopping after <specific date>, didn't tell anyone for a couple of weeks, then told my husband I was giving it a break so he wouldn't offer me a beer. (I think I told him it was going to be for a couple months but secretly I was aiming for at least a year/maybe forever.) It's coming up 4 years now. I still enjoy sniffing a good boutique beer to work out what they have done but don't drink. All my friends and family now know I don't drink anymore.

A lot of the time what we perceive as pressure to drink is people making an offer of a shared enjoyment because they want to do something enjoyable with you. It's not necessarily about the drinking. Once they transition to thinking of you as not drinking, the let's check out this brewery offers become let's try this walk/cooking class/fancy coffee place, whatever it is that becomes the replacement Shared Enjoyment. You can help them by proposing other things that can become that shared enjoyment.

Exactly.

I didn't quit when I first stopped drinking, I had no choice but to stop for 6 months for medical reasons. Within, I think, 2 months, I just didn't *want* to ever drink again. I never felt I "needed" to quit, I was just shocked by the experience of how superior being sober is.

Some people take a pause and decide that they want to modify their relationship with alcohol, others decide that they want to quit permanently.

Most of us Naked Mind types don't drink because not drinking makes us much happier than drinking does, not because we're "alcoholics" who aren't allowed to ever drink again.

So if someone is at a point that the idea of quitting permanently doesn't feel like happiness, then don't worry about quitting permanently, focus on figuring out *what* relationship with alcohol will feel like happiness. A period of sobriety is the BEST way to figure out what that relationship is.

StarBright

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #928 on: April 12, 2021, 06:37:11 PM »
Checkin' in - just because. Had a planned drink w/ a celebratory dinner last week. It tasted good, went well with the meal and I enjoyed it. The next night I had a little yen for a cocktail but didn't. 5 days out, all good. Tentatively planning to have a couple of drinks if we get to take a summer vacation.

My husband said he really misses our Sunday afternoon cocktail together. I think the "soft around the edges" feeling actually helps blunt some of his sensory issues with our kids. I might skim the Naked Mind book to see if there is anything useful there for him.


LeftA

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #929 on: April 12, 2021, 08:01:58 PM »
Wow, so much activity here in the last day or so! Welcome to all the new joiners and congratulations to all those hitting new milestones AF.

I finished This Naked Mind yesterday. It reaffirmed my decision to go alcohol free for a bit. Today was day 9. So many positives to report!

I made a list:
- so much more energy and motivation to get things done!

- more mental acuity
- less anxiety, feelings of being overwhelmed
- more confidence
- food tastes better
- feeling more in control of my life
And, this is only from a few short days - imagine the potential for long terms benefits, like better health and saving $$!

The only negative so far has been dealing with strong cravings on day 6 and 7. They passed. They also weren’t surprising since I hadn’t gone more than 5 days without wine since the pandemic started...

Thanks to the many regular posters here who have kept this post alive to give me the little nudge I needed to change my life!  @wenchsenior , I’ve found your posts in particular really helpful.

wenchsenior

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #930 on: April 12, 2021, 09:49:34 PM »
You are so welcome, LeftA.  Without this thread, I'm not sure I would have stopped drinking myself (and if I had, assuredly not without a lot more stress and angst).  The people on this thread were so positive and supportive, I really want to pass it forward.

sjlp

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #931 on: April 16, 2021, 04:52:47 AM »
Congrats to those who recently joined the thread, and also to those celebrating milestones! So inspiring to see what everyone else is doing.

Star Bright, it is great to hear your update too. Sounds like you have found a rhythm that works well for you. I totally identify with needing to replace the good vibes of happy hour. Have you tried replacing Sunday afternoon cocktails with mocktails, or a special mezze snack platter? Or take a walk, listen to some nice music, play a word game if you're into that... whatever is a natural stress reliever and something you could do together.

Last week I went on a beautiful 50k bike ride with some friends. We left early in the morning while it was cold and somewhat rainy. As we cycled out of the city, the clouds parted, and I felt the sun rays on my face. We took a path through a forest of tall trees. As we went further, I felt like I was leaving any worries behind me. I had this beautiful feeling of being alive.

In the past, I wouldn't have had the energy to wake up early or to cycle for such a long time. Or I would have been thinking in the back of my mind, I want to get back to spend the afternoon at a beer garden. When I came home I saw my neighbors and asked how they spent this beautiful day. They laughed and proudly said they had been out drinking last night, slept in, sat on the couch, and ordered junk food. I thought to myself, ugh, what a punishment to torture your body and miss out on a day of life.

I'm mostly recovered from my injury that prompted me to stop drinking, so technically I could resume. But I still have no desire whatsoever. I can't remember a time when I had such low levels of stress and anxiety. I am totally a puppy who wakes up every morning, tail wagging and excited for what we get to do next!

jps

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #932 on: April 16, 2021, 09:37:49 AM »
When I came home I saw my neighbors and asked how they spent this beautiful day. They laughed and proudly said they had been out drinking last night, slept in, sat on the couch, and ordered junk food. I thought to myself, ugh, what a punishment to torture your body and miss out on a day of life.

This really resonates with me. I am starting to empathize with how many who are vegan come under caricature-ization for their smug sense of superiority, but I really do think, like you, how could you punish your body like this by drinking stuff that makes you throw up/get hungover? I do have to remember that many, and often I fell into this category, can drink one or two drinks a few times a month and stave off many of the ill-effects of alcohol. Not everybody is torturing themselves in the same way as your neighbors.

But dang, does it absolutely feel good to feel alive. To go for a bike ride through the woods with heart pumping and sweat beading is vastly more life-giving than getting drunk. Often when I'm on my bike riding up a hill I have to remind myself that my body is adapting to this activity - in response to being overworked it develops more oxygen-receptors in the muscles so that it can more effectively get me up the hill next time. Our bodies are remarkably responsive to physical exercise - I wonder when we spend our time sitting on the couch/at the bar drinking, what kinds of messages does our body get? And how does it respond?

Thanks for the update, spjulep!

Cassie

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #933 on: April 16, 2021, 10:13:01 AM »
Spjulep, you are absolutely right!  If I had still been drinking I may not have been able to leave my husband and build a new life. I definitely couldn’t have worked 8-10 hours physically a day hauling all the junk away. Now my treat is ghiradelli hot chocolate and 4 pieces of their candy:)).

TheFrenchCat

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #934 on: April 16, 2021, 10:32:24 AM »
I'm at a week and a half and I'm struggling.  I reread my post to remind myself that I was actually getting concerned and not just my husband.  I know if I drink he'll be disappointed, and I feel like I'm sticking with it just for him and not for me.  It doesn't help that he's super busy at work now which means I don't get a break from childcare.  I'm pretty much abstaining just because I said I would, which feels pointless.  I just wish I had something else that let me feel happy.  I have hobbies but they're just a distraction.  Should I stick with it?

Cassie

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #935 on: April 16, 2021, 10:35:34 AM »
You are in the hardest part. You need to do it for yourself. Read Annie’s book again and also others. You can join the Naked Mind support group online and check in often. Find something else to do when you would normally drink.

StarBright

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #936 on: April 16, 2021, 10:43:20 AM »
I'm at a week and a half and I'm struggling.  I reread my post to remind myself that I was actually getting concerned and not just my husband.  I know if I drink he'll be disappointed, and I feel like I'm sticking with it just for him and not for me.  It doesn't help that he's super busy at work now which means I don't get a break from childcare.  I'm pretty much abstaining just because I said I would, which feels pointless.  I just wish I had something else that let me feel happy.  I have hobbies but they're just a distraction.  Should I stick with it?

Stick with it! Give it a shot for 30 days. "Because you said you would" is a good reason - you are worthy of keeping a promise to yourself.

I have two kids that are A LOT and I am probably 80-85% responsible for pre and post school childcare and wakes up and bed times so I get it.

I am also struggling with figuring out what makes me happy (and also fits into my tiny windows of autonomy). I feel this post so much. I'm 100ish days out from taking a very conscious break with drinks.  I do feel better for it.

wenchsenior

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #937 on: April 16, 2021, 11:21:52 AM »
I'm at a week and a half and I'm struggling.  I reread my post to remind myself that I was actually getting concerned and not just my husband.  I know if I drink he'll be disappointed, and I feel like I'm sticking with it just for him and not for me.  It doesn't help that he's super busy at work now which means I don't get a break from childcare.  I'm pretty much abstaining just because I said I would, which feels pointless.  I just wish I had something else that let me feel happy.  I have hobbies but they're just a distraction.  Should I stick with it?

In general, I think kicking an addictive substance or counterproductive habit can only be successful if we ourselves are committed to doing it.  That said, there are a few things to consider...

1) I found it crucial to reframe my experience of being alcohol free from "I'm depriving myself of something" to "I'm gaining something"...but this didn't happen overnight. Participating in the structured Alcohol Experiment mentioned by many people on this thread was crucial to that change my mindset.  It also made the initial month of abstaining, when I was having cravings and feeling very 'deprived' much much easier to manage b/c I was 'in the company' of dozens of other people all experiencing (and discussing) the same things. And the experiment itself regularly offers tools to deal with cravings and feelings of deprivation.

2) You are literally just at the end of active detox...and the first two weeks are, for most people, the worst.  Your body has barely even begun to normalize function in the absence of alcohol.  How you feel right now is highly unlikely to be 'what living alcohol free feels like'.  Some people start to feel notably better right around the 10 day mark, but it is super common to actually feel worse (especially emotionally) during the first few weeks. The reason for this is that regular drinking damages our pleasure neurotransmitter function. As that happens (as you describe), we then find that we need an artificial stimulation from drinking to feel any pleasure at all.  Then if we remove the drinking, we are left with the sub-functioning neurotransmitter function and consequently we feel WORSE for the first few weeks to months.  Most medical websites indicate it takes 30-100 days to restore neurotransmitter function and some of us feel shittier than usual until then. 

For example, I had a history of depression and anxiety, and I didn't begin to see mood benefits until around 25 consecutive days AF.   If I had gotten 2 weeks under my belt with no change, and given up and had something to drink (even just a couple drinks), I would have been 'resetting' my detox window to day 0, thus repeating all the worst parts of detox (the worse anxiety, the worse mood, the insomnia, etc) while never stringing together enough consecutive days without drinking to start experiencing improvement in mood. 

* As a side note, most people don't realize that by drinking even once per week, they are more or less in constant low-level detox, which means they are always feeling at least somewhat worse than they would have if they hadn't had any drinks at all.  Drinking more frequently means you are on a constant roller coaster of a very brief bit of objective pleasure (in my case 30 minutes), in exchange for the rest of each day (1,410 minutes) feeling shittier than I would have if I hadn't  drunk at all.  So in reality, I was trading 47 units of pain for 1 unit of pleasure, and somehow believing that was worth it. 

3)  One thing to consider (this was a big motivator for me) was to step back and look at the inevitable long-term trajectory of relying on a physically addictive substance as my main pleasure and main coping method of dealing with stress. Tolerance creep is inevitable if one drinks regularly, which means eventually more of the substance is required to get the supposed benefits one is after.  I knew this from years of struggling against increasing my own amounts of alcohol.  And that road goes only one way; it's very very difficult to reverse course.  Look ahead at your own trajectory...1 year, 5 years, 20 years...if you keep relying on alcohol to feel good.  What does that look like and does it serve your goals and aspirations for mental health and basic life-function?

4) Depression is really really tough. I know, having struggled with it on and off much of my life time.  There are many things that can be done to improve mental health and combat depression, some of which you are likely already doing.  But maybe you could ask for some specific suggestions as to things that helped some of us, that you might not have tried.  I can tell you that my motivation for pursuing those healthier methods of depression management was completely undercut by my drinking.  Drinking kills motivation for pretty much everything but itself.

I really feel you pain.  I really do.  Before you give up, I would absolutely suggest actively participating in the Alcohol Experiment if you are not already doing so. You can even do it while you are still drinking if you wish (though at some point it's really useful to try to truly hit at least 30 days without drinking, to get the most out of it and for the reasons I outlined in point 2).

:hugs:

Metalcat

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #938 on: April 16, 2021, 11:29:42 AM »
I'm at a week and a half and I'm struggling.  I reread my post to remind myself that I was actually getting concerned and not just my husband.  I know if I drink he'll be disappointed, and I feel like I'm sticking with it just for him and not for me.  It doesn't help that he's super busy at work now which means I don't get a break from childcare.  I'm pretty much abstaining just because I said I would, which feels pointless.  I just wish I had something else that let me feel happy.  I have hobbies but they're just a distraction.  Should I stick with it?

I personally don't think the reason matters for the first month.

Your brain isn't really your own until you've fully detoxed and are able to think properly.

So even if it feels like you have no reason, think of it this way: how fucked up is it if you *can't* comfortably not drink for just 30 days without a hugely motivating reason for doing so?

Doesn't that tell you something about how unhealthy your habit is?

Your reason doesn't have to be anything more than the fact that you should be able to.

TrMama

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #939 on: April 16, 2021, 11:43:11 AM »
A week and a half was absolutely the hardest time for me. It didn't even occur to me that I might have a problematic relationship with alcohol until that point. I'd quit because I was trying to avoid having to have heart surgery. My motive was purely physical and I was shocked to learn that there was also a psychological component. However, after I wrapped my head around the idea that I might have to put some effort into quitting, things got better fairly quickly.

Find something else to do during those times you really want a drink, even if those things don't make you immediately happy. In fact, they probably won't. For a few weeks after I quit, I rage cleaned the house in the evenings while I stewed about the fact that I was apparently more hooked on booze than I'd realized. I certainly wasn't happy, in fact I was pretty pissed off. Over the next month, you basically just need to kill time while your brain gets over the idea of booze. If you need help coming up with ideas to help kill time, we'll be happy to suggest some things. If you're still miserable a couple months from now then you can think about whether you want to add booze back into your life.

Metalcat

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #940 on: April 16, 2021, 12:03:36 PM »
A week and a half was absolutely the hardest time for me. It didn't even occur to me that I might have a problematic relationship with alcohol until that point. I'd quit because I was trying to avoid having to have heart surgery. My motive was purely physical and I was shocked to learn that there was also a psychological component. However, after I wrapped my head around the idea that I might have to put some effort into quitting, things got better fairly quickly.

Find something else to do during those times you really want a drink, even if those things don't make you immediately happy. In fact, they probably won't. For a few weeks after I quit, I rage cleaned the house in the evenings while I stewed about the fact that I was apparently more hooked on booze than I'd realized. I certainly wasn't happy, in fact I was pretty pissed off. Over the next month, you basically just need to kill time while your brain gets over the idea of booze. If you need help coming up with ideas to help kill time, we'll be happy to suggest some things. If you're still miserable a couple months from now then you can think about whether you want to add booze back into your life.

Lol! So much rage cleaning!!

I'm not an angry person, and I too quit for mandatory health reasons, but I was SHOCKED at how angry I was in the evening when I couldn't have my after-work "feel good" wine.

That took a few weeks to pass, but it totally threw me while it was happening.

wenchsenior

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #941 on: April 16, 2021, 12:25:40 PM »
A week and a half was absolutely the hardest time for me. It didn't even occur to me that I might have a problematic relationship with alcohol until that point. I'd quit because I was trying to avoid having to have heart surgery. My motive was purely physical and I was shocked to learn that there was also a psychological component. However, after I wrapped my head around the idea that I might have to put some effort into quitting, things got better fairly quickly.

Find something else to do during those times you really want a drink, even if those things don't make you immediately happy. In fact, they probably won't. For a few weeks after I quit, I rage cleaned the house in the evenings while I stewed about the fact that I was apparently more hooked on booze than I'd realized. I certainly wasn't happy, in fact I was pretty pissed off. Over the next month, you basically just need to kill time while your brain gets over the idea of booze. If you need help coming up with ideas to help kill time, we'll be happy to suggest some things. If you're still miserable a couple months from now then you can think about whether you want to add booze back into your life.

Lol! So much rage cleaning!!



Same.  Going without my wine made me realize how I didn't even have a decent hobby that I could do in the evening.  I mean, I could read, which was fine. But I had to actually Google for lists of hobbies and leisure activities for ideas...that's how much of a workaholic I was.  Work, drink/make dinner, drink watch movie, bed. Repeat.

TheFrenchCat

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #942 on: April 16, 2021, 01:35:35 PM »
Thank you all for your support and advice.  It's good to hear it gets better.  And I didn't know it took that long for it to be completely out of your system.  I thought it only took a couple days.  I haven't read The Naked Mind, and my library doesn't have it; is it worth the read or is just signing up for the alcohol experiment enough?   It's not super literal, right?  I truly need my medications and treatment. 

I'll stick with it and see what happens after a month. 

Cassie

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #943 on: April 16, 2021, 01:39:17 PM »
Reading the book changed my life and some of my friends. It took away most of my desire to drink. The best money I ever spent.

Metalcat

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #944 on: April 16, 2021, 01:42:57 PM »
Thank you all for your support and advice.  It's good to hear it gets better.  And I didn't know it took that long for it to be completely out of your system.  I thought it only took a couple days.  I haven't read The Naked Mind, and my library doesn't have it; is it worth the read or is just signing up for the alcohol experiment enough?   It's not super literal, right?  I truly need my medications and treatment. 

I'll stick with it and see what happens after a month.

I don't know what you mean by literal?

The alcohol experiment doesn't even require that you quit drinking. So you really can't lose trying it. I recommend both the experiment and the book. The book is a super easy read, and the experiment takes, like, 20 minutes a day, and that's putting full effort into it.

TheFrenchCat

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #945 on: April 16, 2021, 01:51:56 PM »
Thank you all for your support and advice.  It's good to hear it gets better.  And I didn't know it took that long for it to be completely out of your system.  I thought it only took a couple days.  I haven't read The Naked Mind, and my library doesn't have it; is it worth the read or is just signing up for the alcohol experiment enough?   It's not super literal, right?  I truly need my medications and treatment. 

I'll stick with it and see what happens after a month.

I don't know what you mean by literal?

The alcohol experiment doesn't even require that you quit drinking. So you really can't lose trying it. I recommend both the experiment and the book. The book is a super easy read, and the experiment takes, like, 20 minutes a day, and that's putting full effort into it.
The Naked Mind makes me think it's recommending you don't take any mind-altering substances, which isn't really an option for me.  I guess it doesn't mean that if you don't even need to stop drinking.  I'll definitely give the experiment a try.

wenchsenior

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #946 on: April 16, 2021, 02:35:04 PM »
Thank you all for your support and advice.  It's good to hear it gets better.  And I didn't know it took that long for it to be completely out of your system.  I thought it only took a couple days.  I haven't read The Naked Mind, and my library doesn't have it; is it worth the read or is just signing up for the alcohol experiment enough?   It's not super literal, right?  I truly need my medications and treatment. 

I'll stick with it and see what happens after a month.

I don't know what you mean by literal?

The alcohol experiment doesn't even require that you quit drinking. So you really can't lose trying it. I recommend both the experiment and the book. The book is a super easy read, and the experiment takes, like, 20 minutes a day, and that's putting full effort into it.
The Naked Mind makes me think it's recommending you don't take any mind-altering substances, which isn't really an option for me.  I guess it doesn't mean that if you don't even need to stop drinking.  I'll definitely give the experiment a try.

It doesn't recommend that at all, and certainly not for depression. The author suffers from serious depression herself. She is currently off meds (I believe) but was on them for many years. There is at least one lesson in the Alcohol Experiment where she addresses depression and drinking in detail.  But she is not anti med.  She also has some material for people who wish to try Naltrexone, which is a medication used to treat alcohol and opioid addiction, and she is very pro- doing 'whatever works', as long as harm is not increased.

Cassie

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #947 on: April 16, 2021, 02:37:51 PM »
I have taken anxiety medication for 16 years. She doesn’t suggest people quit their medication.

TrMama

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #948 on: April 16, 2021, 02:44:45 PM »
FWIW I never read any books or sought out any help at all when I quit drinking. I just stopped. It worked because fear of surgery is a big motivator for me and I was willing to put up with quite a bit of BS if it meant I didn't have to see the OR. I have no idea what this book is or how helpful it may be. You may be the same, or reading it may help. Regardless, it's not absolutely necessary.

It's also important to keep in mind that stopping drinking doesn't fix everything. It's not magic. Whatever underlying problems a person has are still going to be there regardless of how they chose to deal, or not deal, with them. In the end, I chose to have the surgery anyway and it was the right decision. Stopping drinking just allowed me to put the decision off for a few more years.

wenchsenior

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Re: Give Up the Hooch: Booze Free for as long as you please!
« Reply #949 on: April 16, 2021, 02:48:53 PM »
I might be mistaken, but your (TheFrenchCat's) posts read to me that you are subconsciously trying to avoid hearing the information about drinking that will make it untenable for you to continue drinking.  If so, I TOTALLY relate.  I drank almost every day for decades, and studiously avoided information that would force me to confront my habit.  I selectively only clicked on 'heart healthy benefits of drinking' type articles while  averting my eyes from the headlines that noted the ever increasing metadata that showed how dangerous drinking was.  I hung out with people that would not criticize or judge my habit b/c they had their own.

I actively avoided clicking on this thread for at least 2 years LOL. 

I was concerned that I couldn't actually stop drinking; and I was scared to try the Alcohol Experiment for fear it would confirm that I couldn't stop.

Then once I read this thread and started to get 'sober curious', I put off trying to do the Alcohol Experiment partly b/c everyone was so enthusiastic about it (I'm a bit contrarian that way), despite the fact that I could have done it while continuing to drink.  Looking back, this is pretty funny to me now, but that's how I felt.

Then once I decided I had to try the Experiment, I put off actually starting it b/c of anxiety. Instead, I hung out in the Naked Mind community forums, on the (old/original) Experiment website, listened to the personal stories on This Naked Mind podcast, and tried to 'cut down' my drinking while I got over my resistance to trying.

Eventually, I got more curious about how I might feel living without drinking than fearful of trying to stop. After all, I had almost 20 years of knowing what drinking was like, but only a dim memory of what things had been like in the "Before Times".   

If you are experiencing this kind of subconscious resistance, join the club of tons of us.  We've been there.   In that case, just keep trying to engage with the material (even just a little bit at a time) b/c what you might find (as I eventually did) is that your anxiety will wane over time.

If this isn't what you are experiencing, then discount the above.
« Last Edit: April 16, 2021, 02:50:35 PM by wenchsenior »