The Money Mustache Community

General Discussion => Throw Down the Gauntlet => Topic started by: zephyr911 on September 22, 2015, 02:45:00 PM

Title: 75% SR
Post by: zephyr911 on September 22, 2015, 02:45:00 PM
If I can reach 75% and hold it for the next year, I can quit my FT job and never have one again. Not quite FI, not exactly RE, but part-time self-employment: 40-60 days a year of ANG duty and a couple of home sales will do it.

Who's with me? \m/
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: 2Birds1Stone on September 22, 2015, 02:56:12 PM
I will join =)
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: Gone Fishing on September 22, 2015, 03:07:03 PM
Please define the SR formula you would like to use for this challenge.  On a post tax basis, including principal payments, I should slide into home plate right at 75%.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: zephyr911 on September 22, 2015, 07:30:27 PM
Please define the SR formula you would like to use for this challenge.  On a post tax basis, including principal payments, I should slide into home plate right at 75%.
Yes. Post-tax including principal. (In my case, debt payoffs are a majority of the savings in question)
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: Cookie78 on September 30, 2015, 08:39:18 AM
I would like to join this challenge!

I'm sitting at 66% SR on average since January this year. I had a Peru trip planned in May that cut into saving for the beginning of the year, and the rate has been increasing since then. 82% this month!

I think I can manage 75% if I try.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: 2Birds1Stone on September 30, 2015, 09:17:29 AM
I tweaked my numbers for this year and am looking to come in at exactly 75%......will be much harder next year since I had an outstanding year of commission.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: zephyr911 on September 30, 2015, 09:22:04 AM
Come on in. Woot!
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: RWD on September 30, 2015, 09:46:04 AM
I am also aiming for a 75% savings rate. We're probably not going to hit it next year though as we probably need to buy a house...
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: zephyr911 on September 30, 2015, 09:52:45 AM
I am also aiming for a 75% savings rate. We're probably not going to hit it next year though as we probably need to buy a house...
What about buying a house reduces savings? Down payment, principal payments, and any improvements adding equity will all count toward SR.
Excluded: transactional costs, furnishings and decorations, unless they hold resale value.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: RWD on September 30, 2015, 11:57:49 AM
I am also aiming for a 75% savings rate. We're probably not going to hit it next year though as we probably need to buy a house...
What about buying a house reduces savings? Down payment, principal payments, and any improvements adding equity will all count toward SR.
Excluded: transactional costs, furnishings and decorations, unless they hold resale value.

I'm thinking mostly about closing costs and fees. We'll need a new refrigerator but probably little to no furniture. It shouldn't seriously affect our long term savings rate but I think it might push 75% out of reach for 2016.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: zephyr911 on September 30, 2015, 01:30:15 PM
I'm thinking mostly about closing costs and fees. We'll need a new refrigerator but probably little to no furniture. It shouldn't seriously affect our long term savings rate but I think it might push 75% out of reach for 2016.
Just finance the closing costs too. 105% LTV is no big deal, right? xD
But yeah, that'll run you a few grand if you close next year.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: zephyr911 on September 30, 2015, 01:35:30 PM
BTW, my timeline for this is FY16 (now through 9/30/16), but feel free to do calendar year or whatever variant you like. Being more inclusive will make this one more fun, so let's not draw it too tight.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: Cookie78 on September 30, 2015, 01:44:14 PM
BTW, my timeline for this is FY16 (now through 9/30/16), but feel free to do calendar year or whatever variant you like. Being more inclusive will make this one more fun, so let's not draw it too tight.

I'm just going until house #2 sells, at which point I'm the hell outta here*!!! :D

House 1 goes on the market this week. House 2 goes on the market after house 1 sells or in the spring, whichever comes last. I'm hoping mid-2016.


*'here' being work, not the forum!
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: RWD on September 30, 2015, 03:05:16 PM
I'm thinking mostly about closing costs and fees. We'll need a new refrigerator but probably little to no furniture. It shouldn't seriously affect our long term savings rate but I think it might push 75% out of reach for 2016.
Just finance the closing costs too. 105% LTV is no big deal, right? xD
But yeah, that'll run you a few grand if you close next year.
Haha. With the way I calculate my expenses it wouldn't matter if I rolled the closing costs into the mortgage. I would just have closing costs that are offset by the mortgage liability instead being paid from a checking account. I could cheat and pretend that the house is worth more than I pay for it, but the truth would still come out eventually when it is sold.

In any case, one time expenses like closing costs aren't indicative of retirement expenses so I'm not too worried about it. I'd rather focus on optimizing recurring expenses.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: zephyr911 on September 30, 2015, 09:17:49 PM
Haha. With the way I calculate my expenses it wouldn't matter if I rolled the closing costs into the mortgage. I would just have closing costs that are offset by the mortgage liability instead being paid from a checking account. I could cheat and pretend that the house is worth more than I pay for it, but the truth would still come out eventually when it is sold.
You'll never get an accounting job at Enron with that attitude!
Quote
In any case, one time expenses like closing costs aren't indicative of retirement expenses so I'm not too worried about it. I'd rather focus on optimizing recurring expenses.
+1

Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: ozbeach on September 30, 2015, 11:57:32 PM
I'm in.

I'm currently on 75%, up from 70% average over last four years, so this will be encouragement to maintain good habits.

I'm booked in to take a 12 month sabbatical in Nov16 at half pay, so no way will I be maintaining 75% in 2017!
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: AllieVaulter on October 02, 2015, 11:54:20 AM
whoa!  When people calculate savings rates is it typical to include mortgage principle and post-tax dollars? 

I thought I had a 40% savings rate.  But then I added my mortgage and I got to 60%.  And when I adjusted for post-tax dollars that puts me right around 75%!  That's crazy.  My income is pretty low, which is probably why the swing is so large, but still...  it seems weird.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: zephyr911 on October 02, 2015, 11:56:25 AM
whoa!  When people calculate savings rates is it typical to include mortgage principle and post-tax dollars? 

I thought I had a 40% savings rate.  But then I added my mortgage and I got to 60%.  And when I adjusted for post-tax dollars that puts me right around 75%!  That's crazy.  My income is pretty low, which is probably why the swing is so large, but still...  it seams weird.
There is some debate over the finer points, but most use post-tax and include principal payments because it isolates the spending component for easy analysis (and destruction). Key note: this makes even more sense if you plan on paying your mortgage off before retirement.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: AllieVaulter on October 02, 2015, 12:21:45 PM
whoa!  When people calculate savings rates is it typical to include mortgage principle and post-tax dollars? 

I thought I had a 40% savings rate.  But then I added my mortgage and I got to 60%.  And when I adjusted for post-tax dollars that puts me right around 75%!  That's crazy.  My income is pretty low, which is probably why the swing is so large, but still...  it seams weird.
There is some debate over the finer points, but most use post-tax and include principal payments because it isolates the spending component for easy analysis (and destruction). Key note: this makes even more sense if you plan on paying your mortgage off before retirement.

Well, it certainly alters my perceptions!  My previous numbers are a bit off, since I wasn't including my husband's income.  With that, and the previous assumptions, I think we're actually closer to a 65% savings rate.  I'll join your challenge. 

If we can just find my husband a full time job, It should be easy.  Unfortunately, finding that job has so far not proved to be easy.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: MEJG on October 03, 2015, 11:21:30 AM
I will join for 2016... But I think this will be a huge stretch. We are looking to come in at 50% from March (financial reset for us) and year end. However our earnings are high enough we should be reaching for it.  I will be claculating on a post tax basis and including principle on debts.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: zephyr911 on October 05, 2015, 08:38:11 AM
I will join for 2016... But I think this will be a huge stretch. We are looking to come in at 50% from March (financial reset for us) and year end. However our earnings are high enough we should be reaching for it.  I will be claculating on a post tax basis and including principle on debts.
Huge stretches are what we're all about! Sounds good!
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: zephyr911 on October 15, 2015, 09:57:21 AM
BAMP!

I hit 75%, for now.

I bumped up TSP repayments (loans were for debt consolidation and bigger house down payment) to put $1600 (over half my FT gross) into the market, happily coinciding with the first paycheck of Stocktober. Take-home is now only 34% of gross. I laugh every time I see my check... thinking of knocking it down to three figures just for bragging rights.

I added a small TSP deduction from my drill pay, because my deductions from FT work process so slowly (multiple pay periods! WTF!?) that I gave up trying to calibrate it to max out exactly. I now take home $700 from drill, offset by $333 invested monthly in a rental partnership and almost $500 in automatic principal payments. This puts my after-tax SR at 67% before any other debt payments. Since I'm selectively killing a handful of small 0% deals as they expire, the payoffs are erratic but I need $520/mo there to hit 75%. With my average running closer to $1K, I'm probably near 80%, though I'm not accustomed to this territory to know how easily I'll be able to stay put here. Impending family visits and holiday travel may lead me to slack off slightly, but the deep winter will be a festival of frugality - cocooning with the wife and dogs, cooking in mass quantities, and spending very little.

Just touching the goal for a minute feels good, considering 50% was a pipe dream in early 2014. If I can hold fast... life will change very quickly as new options unfold.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: Rosy on October 16, 2015, 06:24:57 PM
Quote
Just touching the goal for a minute feels good, considering 50% was a pipe dream in early 2014. If I can hold fast... life will change very quickly as new options unfold

I doubt I can make it happen in 2015, but maybe I can up with a new strategy for 2016 - intriguing thought, thanks for the inspiration, zephyr:) I will mull it over.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: 2Birds1Stone on October 16, 2015, 07:21:27 PM
Made a 2016 spreadsheet today and without commission the best I can muster is 51% savings rate for 2016, this means I have to step up my game and close a lot of new business in 2016 if I want a 75% savings rate for the year =D
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: Kriegsspiel on October 16, 2015, 10:02:03 PM
I may or may not. But rest assured

(http://ak-hdl.buzzfed.com/static/enhanced/webdr01/2013/9/9/21/anigif_enhanced-buzz-18683-1378778274-0.gif)
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: Faraday on October 17, 2015, 07:31:21 PM
If I can reach 75% and hold it for the next year, I can quit my FT job and never have one again. Not quite FI, not exactly RE, but part-time self-employment: 40-60 days a year of ANG duty and a couple of home sales will do it.

Who's with me? \m/

I'm with you! This is an excellent challenge. We going at it a month at a time, just "report in" how we're doing?

BTW: These kinds of threads seem to generate "failure reports", which I am tired of. I'm not too interested in "failure reports" that go much further than "we missed by a few percentage points because my budgie fell and broke his beak and the vet bills dropped us to 73% for the first half of October". It seems kinda stupid to go into a 75% SR thread, come in justifying a 35% rate and not saying anything about what you want to do to fix that.

So, I guess my real question is: Is this a "pro facepunch" or "con facepunch" thread?
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: RWD on October 17, 2015, 10:20:53 PM
We got pretty close to 75% last month...
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: zephyr911 on October 26, 2015, 01:49:19 PM
Impending family visits and holiday travel may lead me to slack off slightly
CALLED IT! We blew a couple hundred on our mothers' first-ever meeting and a bunch of sweet memories; no regrets, still basically on track. The rest of the year is looking pretty good too... we're staying put for the holidays, I've got all her gifts lined up, family won't cost much, and the only other thing in the pipe is a cheap multifunction printer so I can occasionally telework. At my hourly, it justifies itself by Day Two.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: zephyr911 on November 04, 2015, 07:11:08 AM
I have a $1200 property tax bill coming up too, but I also appear to have locked in about $2k in unexpected real estate commission. Cha ching!
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: 2Birds1Stone on November 04, 2015, 08:08:10 AM
I hit 82% for both September and October.

If I can stick to my budget for November and December I will be right at 75.01% savings rate for all of 2015.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: Cookie78 on November 04, 2015, 09:45:52 AM
71.47% this month.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: Nancy on December 02, 2015, 04:16:28 AM
I'd like to join! I'll be posting my SR monthly and then our joint SR for the year.

Sorry to be dumb, but are we calculating SR based only on take home pay and ignoring contribution to 401K, or take home pay plus amount we contriuted to 401K on each side of the equation? 
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: arebelspy on December 02, 2015, 04:37:46 AM
Those of you that hit this, I salute you.

I made it to 75% SR on random months when expenses were lower than average, or income higher than average, but I didn't hit it overall--our long term savings rate was about 73% (73.37% from the five year period when I started tracking our spending in April 2010 through right before we FIRE'd in June 2015, and 73.34% from the 12 months before FIRE, so basically exactly in line with our 5-year savings rate).

We could have hit 80%+ with cuts, but it would have been going past optimization to deprivation, something we weren't interested in.

So if you can hit this without affecting your happiness, whether you can get by on very little, or make a lot, I salute you!

Well done, you badasses!  :D
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: grosvenor6 on December 10, 2015, 05:44:12 AM
I'm at 80% SR with a 40k job now but that'll change since I am still living at home,  trying to shove as much money as I can now towards retirement/downpayment.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: FrugalLakes on December 10, 2015, 07:39:34 AM
I am sitting at a 78% SR for 2015.  Aiming for 80+ for 2016.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: Faraday on December 10, 2015, 11:05:23 AM
I'm at 80% SR with a 40k job now but that'll change since I am still living at home,  trying to shove as much money as I can now towards retirement/downpayment.

DAMN THIS IS BADASS. 80% SR on ANY salary is an achievement, but under $50k, you are kicking ass and deserve recognition.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: steveo on December 10, 2015, 01:05:40 PM
We are about 70% but I'm not getting to 75% this year or any year at this point.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: albireo13 on December 10, 2015, 05:02:19 PM
Are you including any 401k company matching in your savings?
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: zephyr911 on December 30, 2015, 11:57:39 AM
Well, I just got an unexpected bit of help (call it cheating if you will) in the form of a totally unanticipated raise effective this week. Should bump up my average SR by about 3% of TH.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: onlykelsey on December 30, 2015, 12:08:24 PM
whoa!  When people calculate savings rates is it typical to include mortgage principle and post-tax dollars? 

I thought I had a 40% savings rate.  But then I added my mortgage and I got to 60%.  And when I adjusted for post-tax dollars that puts me right around 75%!  That's crazy.  My income is pretty low, which is probably why the swing is so large, but still...  it seems weird.

To make this ontopic, I'll say that I'm ashamed that I haven't ever calculated my savings rate, and need to do that, ASAP.

But really, I'm commenting because OMG IS THAT AN AIREDALE I HAVE AN AIREDALE!!!!!!!!!  He's a money sink, but I'll be worth ~500K by 30 so I'm not too worried about it. 
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: JLee on December 30, 2015, 12:10:13 PM
When running the math (post-tax), how are you factoring in 401k/HSA contributions?  Using post 401k/HSA net income, my room rental alone is 18% of my income, giving me $279/mo for everything else to achieve 75%. :P

Using the MMM instructions here (http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2012/01/13/the-shockingly-simple-math-behind-early-retirement/) and factoring in (estimated) 25% tax on my rental income, including 401k/HSA and principal payments, I'm at 38% SR automatically.  This requires me to save an additional $2403/month to achieve 75% SR, giving me a monthly budget of $1713.  I might actually be able to pull this off, if I stop traveling everywhere!
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: onlykelsey on December 30, 2015, 12:11:21 PM
Well, I just got an unexpected bit of help (call it cheating if you will) in the form of a totally unanticipated raise effective this week. Should bump up my average SR by about 3% of TH.

Time to start an 80% thread!
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: zephyr911 on December 30, 2015, 01:32:26 PM
whoa!  When people calculate savings rates is it typical to include mortgage principle and post-tax dollars? 

I thought I had a 40% savings rate.  But then I added my mortgage and I got to 60%.  And when I adjusted for post-tax dollars that puts me right around 75%!  That's crazy.  My income is pretty low, which is probably why the swing is so large, but still...  it seems weird.

To make this ontopic, I'll say that I'm ashamed that I haven't ever calculated my savings rate, and need to do that, ASAP.

But really, I'm commenting because OMG IS THAT AN AIREDALE I HAVE AN AIREDALE!!!!!!!!!  He's a money sink, but I'll be worth ~500K by 30 so I'm not too worried about it.
Dogs are worth it. Look at it this way: way cheaper than a kid (or another kid, as applicable).
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: onlykelsey on December 30, 2015, 01:36:34 PM
Dogs are worth it. Look at it this way: way cheaper than a kid (or another kid, as applicable).

I get such immense joy out of my 100 lb dog, there is no question for me.  Of course it ties up income for more than a decade, but I'm okay with that.  DH was probably correct in resisting me getting a second dog, though.  Probably one giant breed in my 12-ft wide Manhattan apartment is enough.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: zephyr911 on December 30, 2015, 03:26:33 PM
Time to start an 80% thread!
I'm losing motivation TBH... lol. I need a kick in the ass.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: MonkeyJenga on December 30, 2015, 03:41:44 PM
Time to start an 80% thread!
I'm losing motivation TBH... lol. I need a kick in the ass.

I'll start an 80% thread if you don't. It's a huge stretch goal for me, but doable if a lot of things line up.

I think. Maybe.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: Cookie78 on December 31, 2015, 01:09:28 PM
Time to start an 80% thread!
I'm losing motivation TBH... lol. I need a kick in the ass.

I'll start an 80% thread if you don't. It's a huge stretch goal for me, but doable if a lot of things line up.

I think. Maybe.

I posted in your thread thinking it's not very possible for me.... but the more I think about it the more I wonder HOW can I do it, not IF I can do it. :p Tempting.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: 2Birds1Stone on December 31, 2015, 01:14:52 PM
Finished the year at 76.2%

Also found out this week that I am getting promoted and a nice 20% raise as well effective Jan 4th. I also just celebrated my one year anniversary with my employer so I will be getting a 401k match to the tune of 50% of the first 5% of my salary. Not much but it all adds up!

I will be gunning for 80% next year for sure.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: MonkeyJenga on December 31, 2015, 01:28:14 PM
Time to start an 80% thread!
I'm losing motivation TBH... lol. I need a kick in the ass.

I'll start an 80% thread if you don't. It's a huge stretch goal for me, but doable if a lot of things line up.

I think. Maybe.

I posted in your thread thinking it's not very possible for me.... but the more I think about it the more I wonder HOW can I do it, not IF I can do it. :p Tempting.

Mission accomplished. :)
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: CanuckExpat on January 03, 2016, 03:56:05 AM
Time to start an 80% thread!
I'm losing motivation TBH... lol. I need a kick in the ass.

I'll start an 80% thread if you don't. It's a huge stretch goal for me, but doable if a lot of things line up.

I think. Maybe.

You started the thread (http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/throw-down-the-gauntlet/80-savings-rate/) but never linked to it!
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: MonkeyJenga on January 03, 2016, 08:10:06 AM
SORRY. Look, I said I'd start it, never said anything about telling anyone about it.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: AllieVaulter on January 03, 2016, 05:01:24 PM
whoa!  When people calculate savings rates is it typical to include mortgage principle and post-tax dollars? 

I thought I had a 40% savings rate.  But then I added my mortgage and I got to 60%.  And when I adjusted for post-tax dollars that puts me right around 75%!  That's crazy.  My income is pretty low, which is probably why the swing is so large, but still...  it seems weird.

To make this ontopic, I'll say that I'm ashamed that I haven't ever calculated my savings rate, and need to do that, ASAP.

But really, I'm commenting because OMG IS THAT AN AIREDALE I HAVE AN AIREDALE!!!!!!!!!  He's a money sink, but I'll be worth ~500K by 30 so I'm not too worried about it.

Important things first:  It's not an Airedale.  He's a Welsh Terrier.  They're basically miniature Airedales.  He's full grown at 20 pounds of crazy.  My husband grew up with Airedales, but we don't have the space for a mondo dog.  So we compromised and got this guy.  And we love him to pieces.  :)

Well, I think we closed out the year with a 70% savings rate.  A bit short, but DH hasn't landed a job yet so that's definitely slowed the stashing. 
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: PhysicianOnFIRE on January 17, 2016, 02:39:17 PM
Count me in.  Someone suggested 80% but I don't think we can swing that.  Family of 4.  They boys need food and piano lessons.
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: zephyr911 on January 17, 2016, 09:24:50 PM
Count me in.  Someone suggested 80% but I don't think we can swing that.  Family of 4.  They boys need food and piano lessons.
Welcome!
I'm holding at 75% but I've got it easy... no kids, just dogs. ;)
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: Cookie78 on January 18, 2016, 11:19:56 AM
I lost a tenant this month and there's no way I'm going to make 75% for January, but who knows, maybe I'll bounce back in the next few months. :)
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: Bardo on January 19, 2016, 06:53:24 AM
Great challenge.  Including mortgage principal I was at 71% last year so 75% should be in reach, but I'm planning some trips so it would really be a stretch target for me.

Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: 2Birds1Stone on January 19, 2016, 08:20:31 AM
Paid for an all inclusive 9 day trip to the Caribbean this month.....SR for January will be about 20-30%

Funny how that is low for the purpose of this thread.....yes so much higher than 99.99% of America
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: BriarRose111 on April 02, 2016, 11:00:09 AM
I'm in.  If I include principal I'm at 75%.  Actually it will be a bit higher now as I just increased company stock purchase 1% for another challenge.

This will be a tight year, but worth it!

Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: BarbeRiche on April 10, 2016, 03:26:15 PM
If any of you get employer contributions for pension or stock purchase plan, do you include that in the SR?

I started including the portion I put in the pension and stocks but not my employer contribution yet.

What do you guys think?
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: tightwaddy on April 11, 2016, 05:35:23 AM
EDIT:  I realized original formula was wacky--was trying to not count employer contributions as my own savings, but I actually ended up counting it against me.

I'll give this one a try, although I may need to figure out a better tracking system.  As a quick and dirty estimate for March, I did:

Income = Net pay
Savings = Mortgage principal + my 403 contribution + my HSA contribution

Result = 77%

Maybe I need to shoot for the 80%!
Title: Re: 75% SR
Post by: 2Birds1Stone on April 11, 2016, 09:37:45 AM
YTD SR = 72.63%