Author Topic: So....I was BRAVE!  (Read 8233 times)

Mrs Brave

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 13
So....I was BRAVE!
« on: August 25, 2016, 04:45:52 PM »
Hi, I am new here, and I cannot tell anyone in real life about how brave we were so I have come here, to tell people in the virtual world!

Mr Brave and I are very quiet non confrontational people. We have 3 adult children, all in their 20's. 2 very quiet non confrontational young people, and one lying bully. I have not told anyone in real life about what he is like, it seems so disloyal.

Lying Bully does what he wants, takes what he wants, he has a good job for a young chap, but spends his money on what he wants and uses emotional blackmail, lies and manipulation to get more money out of us. He destroys our stuff, in particular Mr Braves tools, and refuses to mend/replace them. The list goes on. If we remonstrate LB shouts at us, and tells us how hard it is for him and we don't understand. In his defence he has NEVER been physically violent. But he can shout us down and we cave in every-time. He has a stronger will than us, and he knows how to use it.

Until last week LB lived at home.

We asked him to leave.

We were very Brave and supported each other, and said we wanted him to go. We kept saying it. We didn't justify it, we just said we thought all of us would be happier if he tried living out.
We did help with the rent in advance and letting fees etc for his bedsit because he spends all his money and we wanted him to go!

He has been the biggest money drain ever, and now he has gone!

And now we can move on with our lives. We have so many plans, like paying the mortgage off before Mr Brave is 60, (it has been going backwards.....line of credit mortgage....since October 2015 LB has had over $8000 from us)and maybe going away without worry about what will have happened when we get back. (He promises not to have parties, but then does)
Mr Brave thinks we should change the locks, but I think that is a bit over the top!

He is my boy, and I do love him, but right now he is not a very nice young man.

So here I am! We are going to get everything sorted, spend nothing at all we don't have to and have fun doing what we want, which is to be FREE to do what we want. And all we want is to live quietly at home, garden, read books, play music and walk Brave Dog on the beach!

Mrs Brave


Knapptyme

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 242
  • Age: 38
  • Location: Florida
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #1 on: August 25, 2016, 05:16:41 PM »
Congrats on being brave. I'm guessing as a young chap I may have been unkind to my loving parents as some point, too. I would hope they showed me the next level of love you are showing him even by making him leave.

Bottom line, stay BRAVE!

The anonymity of the internet can have its perks.

KMMK

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1468
  • Age: 43
  • Location: Edmonton, AB, Canada
    • Meena Kestirke Insurance
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #2 on: August 25, 2016, 05:23:44 PM »
Good for you!
Please change the locks and never give him any more money.

stoaX

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 535
  • Location: South Carolina
  • 'tis nothing good nor bad but thinking makes it so
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #3 on: August 25, 2016, 05:37:26 PM »
My wife and I had to administer the "tough love - you're an adult - get out" approach to our son.  I know we did all we could for him but we were unwilling to have his stress ruin our marriage and finances.  It's hard but there is peace in knowing that you did your best and that it was the right course of action.  Wishing you all the best.

pbkmaine

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 8411
  • Age: 63
  • Location: The Villages, Florida
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #4 on: August 25, 2016, 05:45:43 PM »
Change the locks.

Rural

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 4891
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #5 on: August 25, 2016, 06:15:19 PM »
Good for you! Now change the locks.

Mrs Brave

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 13
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #6 on: August 25, 2016, 06:55:52 PM »
My wife and I had to administer the "tough love - you're an adult - get out" approach to our son.  I know we did all we could for him but we were unwilling to have his stress ruin our marriage and finances.  It's hard but there is peace in knowing that you did your best and that it was the right course of action.  Wishing you all the best.


So what happened? Did he come right? Yes, the stress was beginning to affect our marriage of 31 years, quite apart from the finances! It has been so quiet and calm since he has gone.

alleykat

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 427
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #7 on: August 26, 2016, 04:16:26 AM »
Good for you. I would change the locks.m

meghan88

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 762
  • Location: Montreal
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #8 on: August 26, 2016, 11:49:44 AM »
Another vote for changing the locks.  And don't have any weak moments where you lend him the new key because he will make a copy for sure.

MustachianKentuckian

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 62
  • Age: 44
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #9 on: August 26, 2016, 12:30:04 PM »
Way to go for being brave.  This kid needed some tough love.  Also, I vote for changing the locks.  Hopefully it won't actually be something that was needed, but you don't want it to be a regret that you didn't.

Adventine

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1281
  • Age: 31
  • Location: Manila, Philippines
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #10 on: August 26, 2016, 12:38:12 PM »
I'll offer a perspective from the opposite kind of brave - I moved out of my parents' home after become sick and tired of being had continuously bullied and belittled for as long as I can remember.

Change your locks. Do it as soon as you can. And make it clear to your other kids that LB is not allowed in your home without your explicit permission.

BlueHouse

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3377
  • Location: WDC
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #11 on: August 26, 2016, 12:53:32 PM »
Congratulations and good job being strong!  Sometimes all a kid needs is to be out on his own for a little bit before he starts to shape up.  Let's hope that's the case. 

Mama & Papa bird just pushed baby bird out of the nest so that he can start flying solo.  No shame in that!  Good for you!

GuitarStv

  • Senior Mustachian
  • ********
  • Posts: 15177
  • Age: 38
  • Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #12 on: August 26, 2016, 12:59:39 PM »
Good job, now you should change the locks.

2Birds1Stone

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 5809
  • Age: 1
  • Location: Earth
  • K Thnx Bye
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #13 on: August 26, 2016, 01:13:12 PM »
Congrats, that's awesome.......but how the heck did you guys put up with an adult child that treated you like that for so long?!?!

stoaX

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 535
  • Location: South Carolina
  • 'tis nothing good nor bad but thinking makes it so
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #14 on: August 26, 2016, 01:22:51 PM »
My wife and I had to administer the "tough love - you're an adult - get out" approach to our son.  I know we did all we could for him but we were unwilling to have his stress ruin our marriage and finances.  It's hard but there is peace in knowing that you did your best and that it was the right course of action.  Wishing you all the best.


So what happened? Did he come right? Yes, the stress was beginning to affect our marriage of 31 years, quite apart from the finances! It has been so quiet and calm since he has gone.

"Did he come right?" - not really.  It's a distant...very distant..but polite relationship now.  Better than what it was, but not like the close and warm relationship I enjoy with my mother and mother in law.  Wish I had something better to report.   

DocMcStuffins

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 110
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #15 on: August 26, 2016, 02:24:34 PM »
These situations are never one sided and are very complicated.  What would you change in looked back...... what would you have changed with all of this over the years.  I assume this is not all nature and some of this is nurture.  Asking because I see this alot in my office and it will help all of all reading this post.  The best thing that I have found is that setting a timeframe is one of the keys of having a person move out of a home.  Thanks for the info.

stoaX

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 535
  • Location: South Carolina
  • 'tis nothing good nor bad but thinking makes it so
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #16 on: August 26, 2016, 02:59:52 PM »
These situations are never one sided and are very complicated.  What would you change in looked back...... what would you have changed with all of this over the years.  I assume this is not all nature and some of this is nurture.  Asking because I see this alot in my office and it will help all of all reading this post.  The best thing that I have found is that setting a timeframe is one of the keys of having a person move out of a home.  Thanks for the info.

What would I have changed?  If I could wave the magic wand and go back in time I would've become mustachian from the beginning of my adult life so I would've more options to spend time at home when my son was in his teens.  I can't think of much else, but our situation was not one of a "normal" older adult child "failing to launch".  This was a young adult with issues/problems akin to what the OP describes, hence my sympathy for what the OP has gone through and my congratulations to them for making a bold positive step.

former player

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 5035
  • Location: Avalon
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #17 on: August 26, 2016, 03:44:29 PM »
Congratulations on your new peaceful and mustachian life.

(Oh, and change the locks.)

valsecito

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 61
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #18 on: August 26, 2016, 04:06:14 PM »
These situations are never one sided
They sometimes _are_ 100% one sided!

Parenting is tricky business. As a parent, you cannot be 100% of the nurture factor, and you shouldn't even try to get close to that if you want to do it well. You can be very capable and do your very best, but you can't guarantee that your child will not be a member of a neonazi party or a psychopath or whatever.

Congratulations Mrs. Brave!

kitkat

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 86
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #19 on: August 26, 2016, 04:13:14 PM »
Congratulations. I wish my mom would do this to my sister. She doesn't live at home, but has always been completely financially supported and is now 27 years old. It is absurd. Next brave step is telling him how much of a bully he is, oh and NEVER giving him money again!!

Pigeon

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1235
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #20 on: August 26, 2016, 05:07:15 PM »
Congratulations!  Now change  the locks, seriously.

A few years ago, my brother got a call for advice from my aunt.  My aunt had moved to FL, along with her adult daughter and son, and we hadn't heard much from her in years.  My cousin, who was in his 50s, had gotten in a bar fight and aunt wanted  advice on how to pay for the dental work M needed as a result.  My brother obviously told aunt that M's teeth weren't her problem and to kick the bum out and change the locks.  Aunt was not brave and couldn't bring herself to do it.

Fast forward to a few months ago.  I found M's mug shot online.  He'd been arrested for assaulting elderly aunt when she wanted to sell her house so she could move into senior housing, where he obviously could not be supported in the style to which he had become accustomed.

Don't go there.   Change the locks.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2016, 05:21:00 PM by Pigeon »

.x.

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 434
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #21 on: August 26, 2016, 05:15:13 PM »
I thought I posted earlier, so if you get a double shot of this, apologies.

+100 on the congratulations!

And on the change the locks.

And also, it might be good to talk with the siblings of LB in case LB tries to harass them into allowing entry into the home while you are gone.

It might be good to develop some scripts for situations you might find yourself in:

LB needing more money and being really nice now, cause LB needs money.
LB needing more money and being really mean again, cause LB needs money.
LB needing more money and pretending to be/actually getting very sick and needing to be cared for, cause LB needs money.

Imagine your worst-case scenarios and support all the Braves with what to say in case of LB's approach.

Change the locks on/put locks on everything that LB could access - garage, shed, bikes - anything that could be stolen.

Work up some phrases/back-up plans in case the siblings find themselves bullied by LB - that way everyone has the same approach and forms a united defense.

And yes, enjoy the peace and quiet.

My brother went through a very similar situation recently and is enjoying his marriage for the first time in many years.  There is a new peace in the house.  :)

Mrs Brave

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 13
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #22 on: August 26, 2016, 11:14:57 PM »
These situations are never one sided and are very complicated.  What would you change in looked back...... what would you have changed with all of this over the years.  I assume this is not all nature and some of this is nurture.  Asking because I see this alot in my office and it will help all of all reading this post.  The best thing that I have found is that setting a timeframe is one of the keys of having a person move out of a home.  Thanks for the info.
d

We tried everything. We really did. Actually he was lovely until the Easter before he turned 18. He was a quiet boy, a little self centered and he loved computer games, but aren't they all at that stage. Then he suddenly changed. It was quite dramatic. He started going out to parties, and drinking. He stopped doing stuff with us. We have always eaten dinner together, and cleaned up together afterwards, now he would simply vanish to his room. At first we would go and fetch him, but he became worse and worse and it seemed easier not to bother him. We thought it was simply a stage he was going through. In the end he stopped eating with us too.
Then he ended up at parties where the police were called, although he always managed to not be in trouble himself. Once he ran away through people's gardens. He went in cars with other boys and called rude comments to the police through the windows and almost got arrested.
He had to stay over after parties by now as he was always so drunk. He started smoking cigarettes. He would buy ciggies and beer and spirits and then ask us for money for food. By now he would not eat my home cooked meals but wanted money for take outs. We helped him get his qualifications, and helped with a car to get to work.
We talked to him about rules and things and he would always agree to everything, and then do his own thing anyway. He ignored every agreement we ever made. He was only nice when he wanted something. I ended up dreading him being nice.

I hope time will heal things, and I hope some time away from us will help him grow up. He was a dear child.

What would I change, looking back? I don't know, he was already almost 18 when he changed. If he was younger I would have moved house to get him away from that group of friends. If he had been younger I would have moved into the wilds of the country with no internet access and no beer shops. But at almost 18 what could I have done? I did say the rules of the house are this, and he agreed and ignored them anyway. I would have fought pterodactyls single handed if I thought it could have helped him. I am sure we are at fault somewhere, but I don't know where, and I don't know how to fix things now.

Mrs Brave

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 13
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #23 on: August 26, 2016, 11:18:47 PM »
I thought I posted earlier, so if you get a double shot of this, apologies.

+100 on the congratulations!

And on the change the locks.

And also, it might be good to talk with the siblings of LB in case LB tries to harass them into allowing entry into the home while you are gone.

It might be good to develop some scripts for situations you might find yourself in:

LB needing more money and being really nice now, cause LB needs money.
LB needing more money and being really mean again, cause LB needs money.
LB needing more money and pretending to be/actually getting very sick and needing to be cared for, cause LB needs money.

Imagine your worst-case scenarios and support all the Braves with what to say in case of LB's approach.

Change the locks on/put locks on everything that LB could access - garage, shed, bikes - anything that could be stolen.

Work up some phrases/back-up plans in case the siblings find themselves bullied by LB - that way everyone has the same approach and forms a united defense.

And yes, enjoy the peace and quiet.

My brother went through a very similar situation recently and is enjoying his marriage for the first time in many years.  There is a new peace in the house.  :)

Thank you for this. And yes, I think we need a family chat with the others about the whole thing. And scripting/role playing some scenarios is a really good idea.

I am so glad your brother is living in peace now.

Mrs Brave

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 13
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #24 on: August 26, 2016, 11:22:38 PM »
These situations are never one sided and are very complicated.  What would you change in looked back...... what would you have changed with all of this over the years.  I assume this is not all nature and some of this is nurture.  Asking because I see this alot in my office and it will help all of all reading this post.  The best thing that I have found is that setting a timeframe is one of the keys of having a person move out of a home.  Thanks for the info.

What would I have changed?  If I could wave the magic wand and go back in time I would've become mustachian from the beginning of my adult life so I would've more options to spend time at home when my son was in his teens.  I can't think of much else, but our situation was not one of a "normal" older adult child "failing to launch".  This was a young adult with issues/problems akin to what the OP describes, hence my sympathy for what the OP has gone through and my congratulations to them for making a bold positive step.

I did give up work when LB was 10 so I could be at home with them and support LB and the other Braves through high school. I had so much time for them, we had a great time, we did things together, i drove them to school, I baked things for them to eat after school. The other 2 young Braves have done well but LB did not.

So don't berate yourselves about that. Sometimes it still doesn't work.

chrisgermany

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 167
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #25 on: August 27, 2016, 04:46:41 AM »
Well done, now change the locks, please.

My guess is that he came in touch with drugs.
It can cause change of personality as described (of course users would deny).
I have heard similar stories before.
And when you would open up some friends or family some parents would tell you similar stories.

dandypandys

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 471
  • Age: 43
  • Location: USA
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #26 on: August 27, 2016, 05:53:47 AM »
YEAH, change the locks! You can always say a small white lie, like you lost a key and had to do it- if it comes up.
Also well done! I am proud of you :)
Sounds like they had a lovely childhood and def sounds like he is under the influence- drugs/friends/beer/lifestyle. He needs a wakeup call, but that will come with leading life on his own.

Do the other siblings have any insight on the change in him at 18? I am they also tried to reach him?

pbnj

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 87
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #27 on: August 27, 2016, 06:51:55 AM »
You did him a favor.  He failed to launch so you launched him.  If he is not into drugs and is just a user of people then he will figure it out.

Do not lie about it but CHANGE THE LOCKS and tell him why.  You love him and this is tough love.  You will not be here forever to continue to bail him out.  The truth is always better even if it hurts. 

You deserve the household peace and financial security.

Congratulations on your bravery, we mustacians are proud of you!!

Stay brave and change the LOCKS.

BlueHouse

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3377
  • Location: WDC
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #28 on: August 27, 2016, 06:57:32 AM »
I suspect this is going to get harder before it gets easier.  Keep reaffirming to yourself why you are doing this - not just for you and Mr. Brave's benefit, but also for LB.  He cannot move forward in the same circumstances.  Practice your responses for all kinds of confrontations while LB deals with the reality.  Make sure you can respond in a calm and unemotional, analytical way.  LB's next move will be to hurt and guilt you.  Be ready for it and you'll do fine!


Songbird

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 36
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #29 on: August 27, 2016, 12:55:14 PM »
I echo the sentiment to change the locks.

It really does sound like he got mixed up with drugs.  I'm so sorry.

Stay strong.  You can do this!  Sending internet hugs. 

debbie does duncan

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 158
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #30 on: August 27, 2016, 02:37:11 PM »
Hard to believe he is family , eh?
Change the locks.

RetiredAt63

  • Senior Mustachian
  • ********
  • Posts: 12140
  • Location: Eastern Ontario, Canada
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #31 on: August 27, 2016, 02:48:39 PM »
Change the locks on everything.  Change all your computer (and cellphone?) passwords, especially if you do internet banking, and make sure the new ones are not anything he could guess, and the recovery questions are nothing he could guess. If you have an alarm system, change the security code(s).  Tell the security company the old codes are all invalid.  Gavin de Becker points out that people who use verbal violence can escalate to physical violence very easily if they are thwarted.

So sorry you are having to go through this, but it sounds like something totally unrelated to family life happened to him.  All you can do is protect yourselves and give him the lifestyle wake-up call.   {{{hugs}}}

cyndre4

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 59
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #32 on: August 27, 2016, 09:29:04 PM »
Sending you so much virtual support and comfort. And another vote to change the locks! I'm sure all of us here have a nasty story that happened either to us or a friend... That's why so many of us are hoping you follow through and get those locks changed.

This is an amazing situation where you're setting real boundaries. This also sounds like the first time there's a real consequence, which tells me he'll try to push past you however he can. You deserve real peace and tranquility, and that means making sure you've done everything you can to take personal responsibility for that.
It's not his responsibility to respect you. He's already chosen not to do that many times, right? It's your responsibility to be sure he can't.
Now change your locks and take an amazing trip!

Mrs Brave

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 13
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #33 on: August 28, 2016, 07:43:39 PM »
The Braves are very sad this weekend.

We were cleaning out LB's room, he had left everything he didn't want to take mostly lying on the floor, plus loads of litter, and 2 half full bin bags. You know what coming don't you....

Mr Brave is a keen recycler, and there was paper and bottles in the bin bags so he was sorting the bags into the various bins, and he came across irrefutable evidence of drugs.

I am still trying to believe it.

So this has changed a lot of things. Eldest young Brave is overseas at the moment, travelling. She is a very healthy person, she has just run a 50 mile race and came 5th woman. No bad stuff ever crosses her lips, she doesn't drink or smoke, and rarely eats anything processed. She is coming home for Christmas, and will be living here with us. She has a good job and is on a sabbatical at the moment. She will pay proper rent for her room, and understands our desire to get our finances in order so we can retire. Her rent will help us along and she gets a nice place to live.

Littlest Brave has just finished university. He has done very well, and is currently working at the university, but is saving up money as fast as possible because he wants to take a gap year. Although little Brave (who is over 6feet tall!) officially lives at home, he often stays with his university friends. He pays no rent, but has always helped around the home. We are discussing maybe asking him for a peppercorn rent, we want to help him save up to travel, but maybe we should help him be responsible. When he was in full time education we didn't ask for rent. As he often is not here but couch surfing in college digs it is a bit problematic.

So, now LB will not have access to this house again, and Little Brave and eldest Brave will have to be told why, and to not let him come home. LB also knows various passwords etc, so these will have to be changed. I cannot believe this is happening. And why did I not see it before? I knew he drank and smoked but we are a clean living family. It never occurred to me that one of mine would get into drugs.

From the very sad Mrs Brave.


.x.

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 434
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #34 on: August 28, 2016, 08:14:06 PM »
Dearest Mrs Brave,
I imagine that finding it about LB's drug use is very hard for you and Mr Brave.  You do sound as though you are pulling together and thinking with clear heads.  May the support you offer each other see you through this hard time.

Pigeon

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1235
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #35 on: August 28, 2016, 08:33:36 PM »
I'm so sorry.  Nobody ever thinks their kids will do drugs, but unfortunately being good parents and siblings is no guarantee.  I hope LB turns things around.

okits

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 9714
  • Location: Canada
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #36 on: August 28, 2016, 08:38:03 PM »
Mrs Brave, huge congratulations on setting boundaries with LB.  It is really the necessary, first step.

I know you and Mr Brave are sad, but may I offer a different perspective?  You could feel relieved to find that LB has a drug problem, because addiction is a disease with existing treatments and supports.  It is possible for him to go straight and get clean.  And now you know why he is behaving the way he is.

What if there were no drugs and he really was just a lying bully/sociopath/asshole?  That would be a lot harder to influence or change. There's no personality transplant procedure yet. 

I know it will be hard to tell your other kids why LB can't access the family home, but they can be supports for you and him (they sound like great people; they can be part of the solution).  Sending lots of moral support your way.  And remember: if you're going to feel any blame for LB's failings then you must feel pride in your other kids' achievements.  Also, feel pride that you're doing the hard work to help LB come back from the addiction spiral he's in.

NowClear

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 36
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #37 on: August 28, 2016, 10:39:36 PM »
Mrs. Brave, I know it's so heartbreaking to discover this. I'm thinking of you and your family. But I have to echo okits: at least you know the cause behind it, and there is some hope there.

My family has been through this; unfortunately, the country seems to be going through a bit of an uptick in serious drug abuse. For my sister, like many others, it began with a legal prescription of vicodin after her wisdom teeth removal. That escalated to buying painkillers from her friends (likely nicked from their parents' medicine cabinets) to painkillers from unsavory types to finally, in desperation, turning to the "harder" illicit stuff. By 22, she was doing many of the same behaviors you saw in LB.

It took a long time, and a lot of tears, and a few stints in rehab to get us to today. It wasn't easy, and as they say, getting better has to be something the addict really and truly fights for. You can't make the decision for them. You're doing the absolute right thing by not enabling LB any further--no more money for him or anything that can make it easier to do drugs, including a place to stay or access to goods he might steal. But I hope you'll consider letting him know what you've found, and that you love him and when he's ready you'll help him get the help he needs (treatment, not money or housing or whatever else). He probably won't take the opportunity right away, but I don't think he'll forget the offer. And in his darkest moment he may reach out for the kind of help you can give.

I also think that in these situations secrets only make everything worse, so would encourage you to be upfront to his siblings as well, as you've already decided to do.

My sister has totally blossomed in these past four years of her sobriety. It is an absolute joy to get to know her this way, and the strength and courage she displays marks her as my own personal hero. We're lucky to be here now--I'm very aware not all stories turn out so well, and addiction is for life, so who knows what the future holds--and I'm so glad we let her know that she could turn to us when she was ready for treatment. Stay strong, you're already doing so well. So much love going your way.

yuka

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 376
  • Location: East coast for now
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #38 on: August 28, 2016, 11:24:21 PM »
I've seen drug problems go in a lot of different directions. Some angles you might want to consider:
  • Possibility that LB is self-medicating. I have known one person in particular who I'm convinced was doing it because of severe social anxiety. I'm not sure if he's over the hill yet. If this is the case, therapy/counseling may be a helpful step to deal with underlying problems, in which case someone will probably have to pay for it. Which relates closely to #2.
  • How much active damage control you'll do if things get worse. Will you be coming to the rescue with lawyers and paying for rehab? Actually I'm not sure who pays for rehab. But the point is, you should discuss with your family where you stand on that, because disagreements and miscommunicated expectations could cause lots of family/marital stress.

Goldielocks

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6788
  • Location: BC
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #39 on: August 28, 2016, 11:26:03 PM »
So sorry for your news!

Change the locks.   

Even without drugs, it would be likely that LB would come and borrow tools, (not return them), use your things, take food from your fridge, appear for dinner, or suddenly move back in again (when eventually kicked out of where he is now).

With drugs it is doubly so, if money runs tight, that he will look for items to sell, and not care.

Most parents here of adult (druggie) children pay for a basic room in a boarding house, if they can, just to keep the disasters out of their home, so not inviting him back in when it gets rough is a decision that many others make.

Can you find a support group for family members of addicts to talk to?

chrisgermany

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 167
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #40 on: August 29, 2016, 06:46:20 AM »
I am so sorry that my guess was right.

Now change the locks and passwords even quicker.

Open up to the family and look out for a co-dependents or parents support group.
It will help you to see that you are not alone with this and how others deal with their former loved one.
You'll need a support system to be able to help LB in the right way once he is ready to look out  for help.

claire.harris

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 13
  • Location: Manchester, England
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #41 on: August 30, 2016, 06:02:02 AM »
Mrs Brave
So sorry for what you're going through. My ex-fiance's brother was also using drugs (heroin in his case), and the parents changed the locks after he stole and sold their hifi system (this was the late 90s) to finance his habit.
Wishing you continued strength x

2Birds1Stone

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 5809
  • Age: 1
  • Location: Earth
  • K Thnx Bye
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #42 on: August 30, 2016, 06:23:24 AM »

We tried everything. We really did. Actually he was lovely until the Easter before he turned 18. He was a quiet boy, a little self centered and he loved computer games, but aren't they all at that stage. Then he suddenly changed. It was quite dramatic. He started going out to parties, and drinking. He stopped doing stuff with us. We have always eaten dinner together, and cleaned up together afterwards, now he would simply vanish to his room. At first we would go and fetch him, but he became worse and worse and it seemed easier not to bother him. We thought it was simply a stage he was going through. In the end he stopped eating with us too.
Then he ended up at parties where the police were called, although he always managed to not be in trouble himself. Once he ran away through people's gardens. He went in cars with other boys and called rude comments to the police through the windows and almost got arrested.
He had to stay over after parties by now as he was always so drunk. He started smoking cigarettes. He would buy ciggies and beer and spirits and then ask us for money for food. By now he would not eat my home cooked meals but wanted money for take outs. We helped him get his qualifications, and helped with a car to get to work.
We talked to him about rules and things and he would always agree to everything, and then do his own thing anyway. He ignored every agreement we ever made. He was only nice when he wanted something. I ended up dreading him being nice.

The first thing that popped into my mind when you posted this was drug abuse. I didn't want to make any assumptions but you just confirmed what I thought.

I have a few former friends and current friends who fell off the wagon like this at various points in life. The culprit was usually heroin/opioids.

I have my fingers crossed for you, it's not an easy battle. 

Stashing Swiss-style

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 416
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #43 on: August 30, 2016, 06:43:53 AM »
You are very brave.  I feel very sad for you and for LB.  He's a good person from a loving home.  I hope he seeks help for his drug problems and finds his goodness again.  But you can't risk your marriage, your home, your future or the happiness of the other Little Braves in your home and so you must keep LB at a distance.  Follow the wise advice given above and change locks / passwords etc and protect your home.  Install an alarm. His need for drugs may drive him to do terrible things and your home will be the first place he goes to when he needs cash.  I hope he gets help and comes back to you happy and healthy in the future.  Be  strong.  Hugs.

BlueHouse

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3377
  • Location: WDC
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #44 on: August 30, 2016, 07:07:32 AM »
Dear Mrs. Brave,
Thank you for the update. From a practical matter, I suggest starting to document every single instance and every piece of evidence. Take photos and put them in a box on the top shelf of your closet. Don't look at them unless they are needed. And they will be needed.
LB will eventually come back with a story about getting well and needing help. You can choose to help or not, but just keep the reminders of times past. Because LB will try to convince you that it's not as bad as you think. And then because you are his parents and you still love him, you will want to believe him. When you want to put your foot down but you feel guilty, that is the time to open the box. Just use it for when you need the strength to do what you know is right. It is so natural for us to try to forget the times that caused us pain, so we need physical reminders to help us remember.

An in-law's teen son is going through a very dark time with drugs and the rest of the family just sees it getting worse and worse because the parents refuse to enforce any limits on this kid. The parents are master enablers and they cut off anyone who tries to do anything because ye think we're being too harsh and we don't understand their kid. The parents take him to doctors until the doc says something the kid doesn't want to hear, then the parents say "that doctor doesn't know what he's talking about"   It's so sad none of us can help.

I'm so glad you realize that saying "yes" all the time makes the situation worse. So glad you are facing the hard truth because that's the only way to resolve problems. So sorry that you have a long struggle ahead and probably a long time of hurt. Please stay strong and get the help you need. Don't be ashamed of the situation - it's not your fault. Treat it like a disease and bring those close to you into your sharing circle. Remember that this is a disease the your LB has to want to kick and until he wants to kick it, you cannot and should not help him.
Good luck. We're all here pulling for you and your family
 

RedmondStash

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 882
Re: So....I was BRAVE!
« Reply #45 on: August 30, 2016, 09:55:07 PM »
Oh, that's hard. I'm sorry you're dealing with all this.

Well done on giving LB the boot.

+1 to all the suggestions to change every lock, every password, every security-related thing, etc. LB may currently be incapable of understanding or respecting boundaries. You are doing him no favors by allowing him any kind of access to anything of yours.

I wish you & all the other Braves the very best. I especially wish LB rehab or whatever he needs to clean up his life, as that will benefit your entire family.

Good luck.

Dear Mrs. Brave,
Thank you for the update. From a practical matter, I suggest starting to document every single instance and every piece of evidence. Take photos and put them in a box on the top shelf of your closet. Don't look at them unless they are needed. And they will be needed.
LB will eventually come back with a story about getting well and needing help. You can choose to help or not, but just keep the reminders of times past. Because LB will try to convince you that it's not as bad as you think. And then because you are his parents and you still love him, you will want to believe him. When you want to put your foot down but you feel guilty, that is the time to open the box. Just use it for when you need the strength to do what you know is right. It is so natural for us to try to forget the times that caused us pain, so we need physical reminders to help us remember.

Wise advice.