Author Topic: I made a really simple FI calculator  (Read 3342 times)

lightwolfcavalry

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 5
I made a really simple FI calculator
« on: May 26, 2017, 08:41:53 AM »
Just a way to project the value of your taxable, 401(k), and Roth accounts given present value, contribution rate, and current age. Would really appreciate any feedback you have to give - just reply here!

http://lifestylefinance.us/main.html

Raenia

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1444
Re: I made a really simple FI calculator
« Reply #1 on: May 26, 2017, 08:54:32 AM »
I haven't put my numbers in yet, but the first thing I'd say is to add a line for traditional IRA as well as ROTH, since many people have both.

Edit: Having now run my numbers, I do have a question.  Are the Recurring Deposit numbers tied to the Pay Frequency field?  I assumed they were, so I put my weekly contributions since I am paid weekly.  However, after a year my account balances didn't look nearly high enough.  I tried switching the Pay Frequency to monthly, and the numbers didn't change at all.
« Last Edit: May 26, 2017, 08:59:42 AM by Raenia »

lightwolfcavalry

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 5
Re: I made a really simple FI calculator
« Reply #2 on: May 27, 2017, 08:29:34 AM »
I haven't put my numbers in yet, but the first thing I'd say is to add a line for traditional IRA as well as ROTH, since many people have both.

Thanks for the recommendation! I didn't think of that since that's an account type I don't have. I will do some research and see what I can come up with.

Are the Recurring Deposit numbers tied to the Pay Frequency field?  I assumed they were, so I put my weekly contributions since I am paid weekly.  However, after a year my account balances didn't look nearly high enough.  I tried switching the Pay Frequency to monthly, and the numbers didn't change at all.

I really appreciate you trying it out! Doubly so because you just caught a really stupid error on my part. Yes, it was supposed to tie recurring deposits to pay frequency, but I had a bug in my code that was not updating that. I have fixed that now - I'd be super grateful if you gave it a whirl and see if that lines up with your expectations.

Thanks a bunch for trying it!

nereo

  • Senior Mustachian
  • ********
  • Posts: 13332
  • Location: Just south of Canada
    • Here's how you can support science today:
Re: I made a really simple FI calculator
« Reply #3 on: May 27, 2017, 09:33:46 AM »
Just a way to project the value of your taxable, 401(k), and Roth accounts given present value, contribution rate, and current age. Would really appreciate any feedback you have to give - just reply here!

http://lifestylefinance.us/main.html

Interesting for a quick calculator which might give a very broad picture, but for me it's lacking quite a few things that will make it genuinely useful.
as examples;
SS payouts/pension/defined benefit plan (and at what age)

any treatment of taxes ($100k in a ROTH is worth much more to me than a similar amount in a taxable account)

ability to increase/decrease contributions annually. Our plan is to increase payments dramatically as debt is payed off. Similar situation for those with kids, a mortgage or anticipated pay-raises.

An annual contribution (e.g. end of year bonuses) column.

A graph.  If you can link the numbers to a graph it's pretty powerful.

lightwolfcavalry

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 5
Re: I made a really simple FI calculator
« Reply #4 on: May 27, 2017, 09:52:36 AM »
Just a way to project the value of your taxable, 401(k), and Roth accounts given present value, contribution rate, and current age. Would really appreciate any feedback you have to give - just reply here!

http://lifestylefinance.us/main.html

Interesting for a quick calculator which might give a very broad picture, but for me it's lacking quite a few things that will make it genuinely useful.
as examples;
SS payouts/pension/defined benefit plan (and at what age)

any treatment of taxes ($100k in a ROTH is worth much more to me than a similar amount in a taxable account)

ability to increase/decrease contributions annually. Our plan is to increase payments dramatically as debt is payed off. Similar situation for those with kids, a mortgage or anticipated pay-raises.

An annual contribution (e.g. end of year bonuses) column.

A graph.  If you can link the numbers to a graph it's pretty powerful.

Thanks for the detailed feedback! I had thought of the taxes and bonuses ideas, but the changing contributions/pension payouts, and graphing are all really great ideas that I hadn't had. Will definitely be adding all of these features to the to-do list.

Cheers for a really thoughtful response!

With This Herring

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1207
  • Location: New York STATE, not city
  • TANSTAAFL!
Re: I made a really simple FI calculator
« Reply #5 on: May 27, 2017, 09:59:55 AM »
I think it needs a lot of work.

Taking a REALLY simple example, set current age as 30.  Set current Roth balance as $30,000.  Do nothing to change default return or withdrawal.  Add no contributions.  Ages 30 to 59 presented.

Leave pay frequency as monthly. 
Balance at 31 is   $32,168.70
Balance at 59 is $227,078.84

Set pay frequency to semi-monthly.
Balance at 31 is   $32,171.97
Balance at 59 is $227,748.67

  • Why is compounding frequency of your investment returns based on your pay period?
  • Why does that chart stop at 59 no matter what age you type?
  • When does withdrawal start?  Does it ever start?
  • Why does no income appear unless the balance is in the "Taxable" column instead of a retirement account column?  It looks like this is where the 4% goes, but why does it not decrease the balances of the accounts?

lightwolfcavalry

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 5
Re: I made a really simple FI calculator
« Reply #6 on: May 28, 2017, 01:58:35 AM »
  • Why is compounding frequency of your investment returns based on your pay period?
  • Why does that chart stop at 59 no matter what age you type?
  • When does withdrawal start?  Does it ever start?
  • Why does no income appear unless the balance is in the "Taxable" column instead of a retirement account column?  It looks like this is where the 4% goes, but why does it not decrease the balances of the accounts?

Hey - thanks for looking! I'll see if I can't clear up your questions.

  • Pay frequency affects the time at which each of investments are in the market. Say you were to deposit $1000 into your investment account. You'd expect a slightly different ROI at the end of the month if you deposited it as a $500 payment at the beginning of the month and a $500 payment halfway through the month instead of $1000 at the beginning of the month, because the annuity would be priced differently at each point. I assumed continuous compounding here, which might not be the right assumption for annuity growth.
  • Age 59 (or 59.5, really) is the age at which you can start withdrawing from tax advantaged accounts without a penalty. I didn't include anything beyond that, because I'd like to make another tool for helping visualize income from each of those accounts once you're FIRE'd. Haven't quite figured out the best way to do that yet, but I plan on workshopping it here when I get it done!
  • You're right - this calculator doesn't include withdrawals yet. Right now, it's just designed to give you an idea of when you could retire given the current snapshot of your finances. It assumes you've got a good idea of your regular expenses, and pits that against the income your holdings would generate. Showing the value of your holdings, and how that would change over time given regular withdrawals, is one of my next big to-dos!
  • I sort of mentioned this offhand in my last two points, but right now "Income" is only based off of "Taxable"
     holdings up until age 59. I chose that because I figured most people who have tax-sheltered accounts wouldn't want to pull from them early and paying the associated penalties.

Lots of good ideas for next steps here. Thanks for taking time to reply. :)

lightwolfcavalry

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 5
Re: I made a really simple FI calculator
« Reply #7 on: May 29, 2017, 12:57:12 PM »
Hey all - super appreciative of the feedback I've received here.

I pushed out a newer version of the site which adds a second table to show income during FI, as well as growth of tax-advantaged accounts when you're not contributing to them. Still working on some of the ideas I've read here - really great stuff! If you have any feedback in the meantime, I'd love to hear it!