HOW I PAID OFF MY $115,000 3O YEAR MORTGAGE IN 23 MONTHS !!!!!

[FIPurpose]

I just thought today that I could get rid of my trash bill by strategically spreading my trash in my neighbors' cans.

[MilesTeg]

Not unsafe, the power assist breaks do little for a Metro due to the weight of the car. No biggy. Massive following distance is key.  But hey to each to their own.

No power brakes, no ability to increase speed if necessary, significantly reduced traction, significantly increased stopping distance, extremely poor ice and cold weather performance, and the list goes on an one. Cap that off with making your engine work harder to maintain proper operating temperature causing increased wear and tear.

Hyper milers = penny wise, pound foolish.

[doug111]

Congratulations Doug! Thoughts on starting a journal? I like the way you roll

I actually did, I was just looking it over and I kept track of every thing that I sold. Every credit card I churned, every free cup of coffee that I saved on by not buying coffee. A lot of stuff was a ton of parts from a parts car that I had from when I was 18. I basically parted out a 1969 Pontiac that I wrecked when I was a kid. Its amazing how many parts that you can sell from one car. It blew me away. Thanks for being one of the nice ones on here. Theres a lot of jerks on this site. Maybe jealousy because maybe they still have a mortgage. I dont want jealous !!!! I want to inspire that it can be done AND DONE FAST !!!!!

[doug111]

I drive a 1992 Geo Metro that I get about 68 MPG from it because I shut the engine off and coast a on of miles for free and I pump the tires up to 50 pounds of air and duct tape the grill shut.

Gratz on the payoff.

Stop operating your vehicle in a reckless manner that endangers others, please.

I drove a semi truck for 12 years and over a million miles of city driving in heavy Portland Oregon traffic. Im sure that I can handle clicking off the key which I've done for over 12 years now and no accidents in my Geo Metro nor my semi truck.  Never clicked the key off in my semi truck, I wasn't paying for the gas. lol . Following distance is key. Thanks for the Gratz on the payoff though !!!!!

A lack of negative outcomes is not proof of safety.

Im glad that you stated your opinion.

[doug111]

]
Survivor bias at its finest.  Nobody posting here is already dead from their goofy driving habits, so it must be risk free.  Shutting off your power assist brakes is not safe, especially when inside a tin can like an old Metro.

Not unsafe, the power assist breaks do little for a Metro due to the weight of the car. No biggy. Massive following distance is key.  But hey to each to their own.

Following distance only helps for the car that's in front of you.  It doesn't help when an object unexpectedly moves into your path, like a car swerving into your lane or a kid dashing into the street.

It also doesn't help the people behind you, who are already on edge for having to avoid the giant ladder sticking out the back of your 1992 Geo Metro.

I love this thread.

I did put a red flag on it right after that pic was taken. Im more worried about the collapse of the dollar. lol

[doug111]

]
Survivor bias at its finest.  Nobody posting here is already dead from their goofy driving habits, so it must be risk free.  Shutting off your power assist brakes is not safe, especially when inside a tin can like an old Metro.

Not unsafe, the power assist breaks do little for a Metro due to the weight of the car. No biggy. Massive following distance is key.  But hey to each to their own.

Following distance only helps for the car that's in front of you.  It doesn't help when an object unexpectedly moves into your path, like a car swerving into your lane or a kid dashing into the street.

Thats a nice thought.

[newelljack]

Doug for president! He's already good at fuzzy math and I'm sure he would pay the national debt down in the first 100 days.

Seriously though, Doug, big congrats on paying off your mortgage. I think you're the real deal.

[doug111]

]
Survivor bias at its finest.  Nobody posting here is already dead from their goofy driving habits, so it must be risk free.  Shutting off your power assist brakes is not safe, especially when inside a tin can like an old Metro.

Not unsafe, the power assist breaks do little for a Metro due to the weight of the car. No biggy. Massive following distance is key.  But hey to each to their own.

Following distance only helps for the car that's in front of you.  It doesn't help when an object unexpectedly moves into your path, like a car swerving into your lane or a kid dashing into the street.

It also doesn't help the people behind you, who are already on edge for having to avoid the giant ladder sticking out the back of your 1992 Geo Metro.

I love this thread.

Cool story bro

[doug111]

This would be a great snark post if it was funny.

I thought it was super funny!  So much detail about free coffee.

5 grand a month in free coffee and loose change, apparently.

Just sold an old window from a 1969 Pontiac today. $120 more towards the mortgage !!!!!

[totoro]

You know, these posts could really use a few more exclamation marks.

[doug111]

You know, these posts could really use a few more exclamation marks.

IM KICKING ASS ON THIS MORTGAGE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!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  IM KICKING ASS ON THIS MORTGAGE !!!!!!

[doug111]

I just thought today that I could get rid of my trash bill by strategically spreading my trash in my neighbors' cans.

What ever it takes !!!!!! GETTER DONE !!!!!  I reduced my garbage bill in half !!!!!! I forgot to list that as one of the ways I'm paying off my house in 23 short months !!!!!!

[doug111]

Not unsafe, the power assist breaks do little for a Metro due to the weight of the car. No biggy. Massive following distance is key.  But hey to each to their own.

No power brakes, no ability to increase speed if necessary, significantly reduced traction, significantly increased stopping distance, extremely poor ice and cold weather performance, and the list goes on an one. Cap that off with making your engine work harder to maintain proper operating temperature causing increased wear and tear.

Hyper milers = penny wise, pound foolish.

Wrong , wrong , and more wrong. No need for power breaks with only a 1600 poundish car. With engine off and miles still racking up on the odometer the more miles that the car will last. So basically its impossible for the engine to work hard when its off 50% of the time coasting down hills only wearing on the wheel bearings and the tires. Wrong again on the hyper miler quote. Correct answer. Hyper miler = over flowing pockets with massive and I mean massive cash !!!!!

[doug111]

Doug for president! He's already good at fuzzy math and I'm sure he would pay the national debt down in the first 100 days.

Seriously though, Doug, big congrats on paying off your mortgage. I think you're the real deal.

Thanks for the congrats lol !!!!! But fuzzy math ? No fuzzy math here. LOL !!!!! Why would you say fuzzy math ?

[K-ice]

Congrats!

Maybe some people want more details. Not just how you scrimped & saved but did you double up payments, did you pay extra every year etc.

What is your monthly income?

How did you avoid fees of paying so much so soon?

Was your mortgage open or closed? What was the interest rate fixed or variable?

Did you do some HELOC mortgage combo magic?

We were able to pay down a larger 25y mortgage but in more time. $325K in 68 months. So I believe roughly the same monthly payments. If we paid equal monthly payments.

However, we stock piled cash & threw lump sums down most years. Basically any time $5K accumulated we would slap it against the mortgage. We could pay just under $50K extra per year but only hit that max one year. I also had a spouse on board. Income was a bit unstable over the 5 years. It included ~ 1 year of unemployment & 1y of parental leave. Thankfully not at the same time. No extra pmts were made that unemployed year.

We also sold a $40K chunk of stocks which put a big dent in the mortgage.

We had a mortgage & a HELOC. As the mortgage was paid the borrowing power in the HELOC went up. This provided a "squishy" debt security blanked so no emergency fund was stashed. MMM has talked about this.

Anyway, it's not my thread so I won't hijack it with my details.

 Huge congrats! Paying it off so quick is a great accomplishment.

But maybe more financial details so others can learn more. 

I doubt you literally took your bottle depot change to the bank to make an extra mortgage payment.

[bobechs]

Doug, let's face it:  you are a nut.

But you are a prolific nut, I'll give you that.

[nereo]

Not unsafe, the power assist breaks do little for a Metro due to the weight of the car. No biggy. Massive following distance is key.  But hey to each to their own.

No power brakes, no ability to increase speed if necessary, significantly reduced traction, significantly increased stopping distance, extremely poor ice and cold weather performance, and the list goes on an one. Cap that off with making your engine work harder to maintain proper operating temperature causing increased wear and tear.

Hyper milers = penny wise, pound foolish.

Wrong , wrong , and more wrong. No need for power breaks with only a 1600 poundish car. With engine off and miles still racking up on the odometer the more miles that the car will last. So basically its impossible for the engine to work hard when its off 50% of the time coasting down hills only wearing on the wheel bearings and the tires. Wrong again on the hyper miler quote. Correct answer. Hyper miler = over flowing pockets with massive and I mean massive cash !!!!!

"massive cash"?  well that's just demonstrably false.

[OurTown]

There are plenty of threads on this forum with valuable information and actionable advice, based in reality, to inspire, motivate, and assist us in our personal finance journey.  This thread is not one of them.

[doug111]

There are plenty of threads on this forum with valuable information and actionable advice, based in reality, to inspire, motivate, and assist us in our personal finance journey.  This thread is not one of them.

Am I on the wrong thread ?   

[doug111]

Doug, let's face it:  you are a nut.

But you are a prolific nut, I'll give you that.

YES I AM A NUT !!!!! THANK GOD THAT I AM !!!!! If people are normal and are OK with lingering debt for 30 years let me make myself clear !!!! I WILL LUST AFTER BEING A DEBT FREE NUT !!!!! YooHoo !!!!!! JUST CALL ME F-ING CRAZY !!!!! I CANNOT WAIT TO NUT OUT THE NEXT 30 YEAR MORTGAGE ON MY OTHER HOUSE NEXT !!!!! This NUT called DOUG is going to knock out the next house even faster because I will be compounding the next payment with this old NUTTED knocked out previous payment !!!!!  If you want to get DEBT FREE and MORTGAGE FREE people you have to become an ECCENTRIC NUT !!!!! lol !!!!!!  Let me ask you this people ? When MMM says to "PAYOFF YOUR DEBT LIEK YOUR HAIR IS ON FIRE !!!!!" do you refer to him as a "NUT" also ? lol !!!!!

[doug111]

Not unsafe, the power assist breaks do little for a Metro due to the weight of the car. No biggy. Massive following distance is key.  But hey to each to their own.

No power brakes, no ability to increase speed if necessary, significantly reduced traction, significantly increased stopping distance, extremely poor ice and cold weather performance, and the list goes on an one. Cap that off with making your engine work harder to maintain proper operating temperature causing increased wear and tear.

Hyper milers = penny wise, pound foolish.

Wrong , wrong , and more wrong. No need for power breaks with only a 1600 poundish car. With engine off and miles still racking up on the odometer the more miles that the car will last. So basically its impossible for the engine to work hard when its off 50% of the time coasting down hills only wearing on the wheel bearings and the tires. Wrong again on the hyper miler quote. Correct answer. Hyper miler = over flowing pockets with massive and I mean massive cash !!!!!

"massive cash"?  well that's just demonstrably false.

Well lets see here !!!! lol !!!!! When I went from my old pickup truck I started saving $5.00 a day in gas driving my Geo Metro to work. % dollars a day savings is $25 a week, is $1,300 a year, x 30 year working life for most people (which it retired in less time than that ) = $39,000 over 30 years and Im not even figuring this savings in at a compounding rate. Also remember that all of these savings are tax free because its not considered income. lol !!!!! I WOULD SAY THAT THIS IS A MASSIVE PILE OF CASH !!!!! lol !!!!!

[Yankuba]

Doug, let's face it:  you are a nut.

But you are a prolific nut, I'll give you that.

YES I AM A NUT !!!!! THANKS GOD THAT I AM !!!!! If people are normal and are OK with lingering debt for 30 years let me make myself clear !!!! I WILL LUST AFTER BEING A DEBT FREE NUT !!!!! YooHoo !!!!!! JUST CALL ME F-ING CRAZY !!!!! I CANNOT WAIT TO NUT OUT THE NEXT 30 YEAR MORTGAGE ON MY OTHER HOUSE NEXT !!!!! This NUT called DOUG is going to knock out the next house even faster because I will be compounding the next payment with this old NUTTED knocked out previous payment !!!!!  If you want to get DEBT FREE and MORTGAGE FREE people you have to become an ECCENTRIC NUT !!!!! lol !!!!!!  Let me ask you this people ? When MMM says to "PAYOFF YOUR DEBT LIEK YOUR HAIR IS ON FIRE !!!!!" do you refer to him as a "NUT" also ? lol !!!!!

YoU GO dOUg ANd DOn't LEt the HaTerz GEt You dOWn!!!!!!!!

[doug111]

]
Survivor bias at its finest.  Nobody posting here is already dead from their goofy driving habits, so it must be risk free.  Shutting off your power assist brakes is not safe, especially when inside a tin can like an old Metro.

Not unsafe, the power assist breaks do little for a Metro due to the weight of the car. No biggy. Massive following distance is key.  But hey to each to their own.

Following distance only helps for the car that's in front of you.  It doesn't help when an object unexpectedly moves into your path, like a car swerving into your lane or a kid dashing into the street.

Thanks for the input.

[doug111]

Doug, let's face it:  you are a nut.

But you are a prolific nut, I'll give you that.

YES I AM A NUT !!!!! THANKS GOD THAT I AM !!!!! If people are normal and are OK with lingering debt for 30 years let me make myself clear !!!! I WILL LUST AFTER BEING A DEBT FREE NUT !!!!! YooHoo !!!!!! JUST CALL ME F-ING CRAZY !!!!! I CANNOT WAIT TO NUT OUT THE NEXT 30 YEAR MORTGAGE ON MY OTHER HOUSE NEXT !!!!! This NUT called DOUG is going to knock out the next house even faster because I will be compounding the next payment with this old NUTTED knocked out previous payment !!!!!  If you want to get DEBT FREE and MORTGAGE FREE people you have to become an ECCENTRIC NUT !!!!! lol !!!!!!  Let me ask you this people ? When MMM says to "PAYOFF YOUR DEBT LIEK YOUR HAIR IS ON FIRE !!!!!" do you refer to him as a "NUT" also ? lol !!!!!

YoU GO dOUg ANd DOn't LEt the HaTerz GEt You dOWn!!!!!!!!

GOD THERE IS SO MANY HATERS ON HERE !!!!!!   Thanks for the vote through, I've added you to my buddy list.

[Classical_Liberal]

God I like this guy!  Congrats!

[doug111]

Congrats!

Maybe some people want more details. Not just how you scrimped & saved but did you double up payments, did you pay extra every year etc.

What is your monthly income?

How did you avoid fees of paying so much so soon?

Was your mortgage open or closed? What was the interest rate fixed or variable?

Did you do some HELOC mortgage combo magic?

We were able to pay down a larger 25y mortgage but in more time. $325K in 68 months. So I believe roughly the same monthly payments. If we paid equal monthly payments.

However, we stock piled cash & threw lump sums down most years. Basically any time $5K accumulated we would slap it against the mortgage. We could pay just under $50K extra per year but only hit that max one year. I also had a spouse on board. Income was a bit unstable over the 5 years. It included ~ 1 year of unemployment & 1y of parental leave. Thankfully not at the same time. No extra pmts were made that unemployed year.

We also sold a $40K chunk of stocks which put a big dent in the mortgage.

We had a mortgage & a HELOC. As the mortgage was paid the borrowing power in the HELOC went up. This provided a "squishy" debt security blanked so no emergency fund was stashed. MMM has talked about this.

Anyway, it's not my thread so I won't hijack it with my details.

 Huge congrats! Paying it off so quick is a great accomplishment.

But maybe more financial details so others can learn more. 

I doubt you literally took your bottle depot change to the bank to make an extra mortgage payment.

I am in SHOCK that you paid off that much that fast !!!! GOOD JOB !!!!! If I went to every little tiny detail I would be here forever. It was a massive mutitude of things to get it paid off. The only thing that I truly know that would have speeded up your pay off would be to instead of saving up 5K at a time and dumping it on your mortgage is to go daily and if not daily weekly. See what people forget is that your dealing with compounding interest working against you and even when your sleeping. You dont want to wait to save up lump somes. You want to race to the bank every chance you get to stop as much compounding as possible and yes take back as many pop bottles as you can and as fast as you can and sell crap lying around your house. REMEMBER EVERY LITTLE BIT HELPS !!!!!! See I have a ton of time on my hands because I'm not married to the "TICKING TIME TRAP" anymore referring to the time consuming time clock at a job.  My mortgage was with Chase Bank and its within walking distance. On the way there in the store I even had a route that I would find change in vending machines. I know I'm a bit of a nut, but I would rather be a nut than an indebted sheeple. lol

[nereo]

"massive cash"?  well that's just demonstrably false.

Well lets see here !!!! lol !!!!! When I went from my old pickup truck I started saving $5.00 a day in gas driving my Geo Metro to work. % dollars a day savings is $25 a week, is $1,300 a year, x 30 year working life for most people (which it retired in less time than that ) = $39,000 over 30 years and Im not even figuring this savings in at a compounding rate. Also remember that all of these savings are tax free because its not considered income. lol !!!!! I WOULD SAY THAT THIS IS A MASSIVE PILE OF CASH !!!!! lol !!!!!

It's a false analogy to compare your previous pickup truck to hyper-mileing a Geo Metro when comparing whether hypermileing saves you a massive pile of cash.  A far more reasonable comparison would be to examine the cost differences from driving a typical mustachian carin a safe, mustachian driving style to your reported 62mpg with hypermileing.
 
So let's apply some math here: (8,000 miles ÷ mpg hypermiling) x $2.25/gallon = $290/yr.  Compared to: 8,000 miles ÷ 40mpg x $2.25 = $450.  A difference of $160 per year.  Not a massive amount of cash.

You can quibble that you drive 2x (or even 5x) as much or pay the highest price for fuel but you still don't anywhere close to the $1,300/year savings you are quoting.  To hit that you'd need to start driving 30,000+miles and/or have fuel prices go above $4/gallon. Bottom line is you aren't saving "massive piles of cash' by hypermileing... almost all the savings comes from not having a clown car habit. Any reasonable car gets you 95% of the way to the goal without breaking laws and impacting other people.  And not driving always beats driving regardless of your strategy.  Ditto for buying an EV (many of which are on crash-sales) and using the complementary charging stations, PVs, or off-peak pricing.
Don't loose the forest because you're busy obsessing over a single leaf, that's all I'm saying.

[K-ice]

Congrats!

Maybe some people want more details. Not just how you scrimped & saved but did you double up payments, did you pay extra every year etc.

What is your monthly income?

How did you avoid fees of paying so much so soon?

Was your mortgage open or closed? What was the interest rate fixed or variable?

Did you do some HELOC mortgage combo magic?

We were able to pay down a larger 25y mortgage but in more time. $325K in 68 months. So I believe roughly the same monthly payments. If we paid equal monthly payments.

However, we stock piled cash & threw lump sums down most years. Basically any time $5K accumulated we would slap it against the mortgage. We could pay just under $50K extra per year but only hit that max one year. I also had a spouse on board. Income was a bit unstable over the 5 years. It included ~ 1 year of unemployment & 1y of parental leave. Thankfully not at the same time. No extra pmts were made that unemployed year.

We also sold a $40K chunk of stocks which put a big dent in the mortgage.

We had a mortgage & a HELOC. As the mortgage was paid the borrowing power in the HELOC went up. This provided a "squishy" debt security blanked so no emergency fund was stashed. MMM has talked about this.

Anyway, it's not my thread so I won't hijack it with my details.

 Huge congrats! Paying it off so quick is a great accomplishment.

But maybe more financial details so others can learn more. 

I doubt you literally took your bottle depot change to the bank to make an extra mortgage payment.

I am in SHOCK that you paid off that much that fast !!!! GOOD JOB !!!!! If I went to every little tiny detail I would be here forever. It was a massive mutitude of things to get it paid off. The only thing that I truly know that would have speeded up your pay off would be to instead of saving up 5K at a time and dumping it on your mortgage is to go daily and if not daily weekly. See what people forget is that your dealing with compounding interest working against you and even when your sleeping. You dont want to wait to save up lump somes. You want to race to the bank every chance you get to stop as much compounding as possible and yes take back as many pop bottles as you can and as fast as you can and sell crap lying around your house. REMEMBER EVERY LITTLE BIT HELPS !!!!!! See I have a ton of time on my hands because I'm not married to the "TICKING TIME TRAP" anymore referring to the time consuming time clock at a job.  My mortgage was with Chase Bank and its within walking distance. On the way there in the store I even had a route that I would find change in vending machines. I know I'm a bit of a nut, but I would rather be a nut than an indebted sheeple. lol

OK so you did just throw daily amounts of leftover change at the mortgage.

Yes I agree, the earlier you can make the payment the better.

In Canada I don't think multiple small payments would be allowed with our "Closed" mortgages.  Mine was quite flexible with the lump sum payments but some only let you do it once a year on the "anniversary date".

I am looking to try some combo HELOC/Mortgage magic on a rental mortgage soon.

Kind of like this:

http://natalimorris.com/blog/2016/01/06/save-thousands-with-heloc/

& this

https://www.listenmoneymatters.com/how-to-actually-save-thousands-on-your-mortgage/

I want to lock in a large part of my mortgage with a closed rate & have a small HELOC.

PLAN

1) Lock in $300K mortgage.
2) Borrow $10K from a HELOC and put it as a lump-sum towards the mortgage
3) Put all rent checks into the HELOC and take the basic monthly mortgage payment out. (HELOC = checking account)
4) Once HELOC is above zero repeat steps 2-4 until mortgage is paid.

This way I can make small daily (whenever rent checks come in) contributions to immediately paying off the HELOC debt.
The lump sums are applied earlier in the term of the mortgage having a greater impact on the compound interest.

The HELOC interest rate is variable but is usually below the mortgage rate so it makes sense to borrow against it. Even if it is the same or slightly higher with the magic of compound interest & every rent check helping pay the HELOC, it is advantageous to apply this method.

 

[doug111]

God I like this guy!  Congrats!

Your a great person !!!! Thanks for the LIKE !!!!! Theres a ton of haters on here, probably just jealous !!!! I understand why, because paying off your house is like climbing mount everest and most people just simply dont have the discipline in them to accomplish that task. They would rather be less than nice to people that do. lol !!!!!

[doug111]

Congrats!

Maybe some people want more details. Not just how you scrimped & saved but did you double up payments, did you pay extra every year etc.

What is your monthly income?

How did you avoid fees of paying so much so soon?

Was your mortgage open or closed? What was the interest rate fixed or variable?

Did you do some HELOC mortgage combo magic?

We were able to pay down a larger 25y mortgage but in more time. $325K in 68 months. So I believe roughly the same monthly payments. If we paid equal monthly payments.

However, we stock piled cash & threw lump sums down most years. Basically any time $5K accumulated we would slap it against the mortgage. We could pay just under $50K extra per year but only hit that max one year. I also had a spouse on board. Income was a bit unstable over the 5 years. It included ~ 1 year of unemployment & 1y of parental leave. Thankfully not at the same time. No extra pmts were made that unemployed year.

We also sold a $40K chunk of stocks which put a big dent in the mortgage.

We had a mortgage & a HELOC. As the mortgage was paid the borrowing power in the HELOC went up. This provided a "squishy" debt security blanked so no emergency fund was stashed. MMM has talked about this.

Anyway, it's not my thread so I won't hijack it with my details.

 Huge congrats! Paying it off so quick is a great accomplishment.

But maybe more financial details so others can learn more. 

I doubt you literally took your bottle depot change to the bank to make an extra mortgage payment.

I am in SHOCK that you paid off that much that fast !!!! GOOD JOB !!!!! If I went to every little tiny detail I would be here forever. It was a massive mutitude of things to get it paid off. The only thing that I truly know that would have speeded up your pay off would be to instead of saving up 5K at a time and dumping it on your mortgage is to go daily and if not daily weekly. See what people forget is that your dealing with compounding interest working against you and even when your sleeping. You dont want to wait to save up lump somes. You want to race to the bank every chance you get to stop as much compounding as possible and yes take back as many pop bottles as you can and as fast as you can and sell crap lying around your house. REMEMBER EVERY LITTLE BIT HELPS !!!!!! See I have a ton of time on my hands because I'm not married to the "TICKING TIME TRAP" anymore referring to the time consuming time clock at a job.  My mortgage was with Chase Bank and its within walking distance. On the way there in the store I even had a route that I would find change in vending machines. I know I'm a bit of a nut, but I would rather be a nut than an indebted sheeple. lol

OK so you did just throw daily amounts of leftover change at the mortgage.

Yes I agree, the earlier you can make the payment the better.

In Canada I don't think multiple small payments would be allowed with our "Closed" mortgages.  Mine was quite flexible with the lump sum payments but some only let you do it once a year on the "anniversary date".

I am looking to try some combo HELOC/Mortgage magic on a rental mortgage soon.

Kind of like this:

http://natalimorris.com/blog/2016/01/06/save-thousands-with-heloc/

& this

https://www.listenmoneymatters.com/how-to-actually-save-thousands-on-your-mortgage/

I want to lock in a large part of my mortgage with a closed rate & have a small HELOC.

PLAN

1) Lock in $300K mortgage.
2) Borrow $10K from a HELOC and put it as a lump-sum towards the mortgage
3) Put all rent checks into the HELOC and take the basic monthly mortgage payment out. (HELOC = checking account)
4) Once HELOC is above zero repeat steps 2-4 until mortgage is paid.

This way I can make small daily (whenever rent checks come in) contributions to immediately paying off the HELOC debt.
The lump sums are applied earlier in the term of the mortgage having a greater impact on the compound interest.

The HELOC interest rate is variable but is usually below the mortgage rate so it makes sense to borrow against it. Even if it is the same or slightly higher with the magic of compound interest & every rent check helping pay the HELOC, it is advantageous to apply this method.

 

Ive often thought about taking out a O% credit card loan and dumping it on my mortgage and then focus on paying down the card really fast. Doing that trick would have worked great before 2008 when all the banisters were flooding my mail box with massive O% offers but thats a lot harder to do now because they all want to charge you 3% balance transfer fees so its really not worth it anymore. But the Chase slate card is good for 15 months at O% with no balance transfer fee.

[TexasRunner]

Not unsafe, the power assist breaks do little for a Metro due to the weight of the car. No biggy. Massive following distance is key.  But hey to each to their own.

No power brakes, no ability to increase speed if necessary, significantly reduced traction, significantly increased stopping distance, extremely poor ice and cold weather performance, and the list goes on an one. Cap that off with making your engine work harder to maintain proper operating temperature causing increased wear and tear.

Hyper milers = penny wise, pound foolish.

]
Survivor bias at its finest.  Nobody posting here is already dead from their goofy driving habits, so it must be risk free.  Shutting off your power assist brakes is not safe, especially when inside a tin can like an old Metro.

Not unsafe, the power assist breaks do little for a Metro due to the weight of the car. No biggy. Massive following distance is key.  But hey to each to their own.

Following distance only helps for the car that's in front of you.  It doesn't help when an object unexpectedly moves into your path, like a car swerving into your lane or a kid dashing into the street.

Thanks for the input.

I'm gonna have to side with Doug.  I've ridden a few 800# plus bikes and braking on them was generally fine.  You will easily get 3x the leverage out of a brake pedal than a handle lever so I can see how non-powered brakes on a car that light would be fine (with good calipers and disks).

Doug, I'm not sure if you are a troll or just very enthusiastic (and a bit cheap).  If the former, not bad you're actually kinda funny.  If the latter, well congrats on your enthusiasm but not many here will fully embrace your tactics.  Good luck sir.

[doug111]

"massive cash"?  well that's just demonstrably false.

Well lets see here !!!! lol !!!!! When I went from my old pickup truck I started saving $5.00 a day in gas driving my Geo Metro to work. % dollars a day savings is $25 a week, is $1,300 a year, x 30 year working life for most people (which it retired in less time than that ) = $39,000 over 30 years and Im not even figuring this savings in at a compounding rate. Also remember that all of these savings are tax free because its not considered income. lol !!!!! I WOULD SAY THAT THIS IS A MASSIVE PILE OF CASH !!!!! lol !!!!!

It's a false analogy to compare your previous pickup truck to hyper-mileing a Geo Metro when comparing whether hypermileing saves you a massive pile of cash.  A far more reasonable comparison would be to examine the cost differences from driving a typical mustachian carin a safe, mustachian driving style to your reported 62mpg with hypermileing.
 
So let's apply some math here: (8,000 miles ÷ mpg hypermiling) x $2.25/gallon = $290/yr.  Compared to: 8,000 miles ÷ 40mpg x $2.25 = $450.  A difference of $160 per year.  Not a massive amount of cash.

You can quibble that you drive 2x (or even 5x) as much or pay the highest price for fuel but you still don't anywhere close to the $1,300/year savings you are quoting.  To hit that you'd need to start driving 30,000+miles and/or have fuel prices go above $4/gallon. Bottom line is you aren't saving "massive piles of cash' by hypermileing... almost all the savings comes from not having a clown car habit. Any reasonable car gets you 95% of the way to the goal without breaking laws and impacting other people.  And not driving always beats driving regardless of your strategy.  Ditto for buying an EV (many of which are on crash-sales) and using the complementary charging stations, PVs, or off-peak pricing.
Don't loose the forest because you're busy obsessing over a single leaf, that's all I'm saying.

And you say that I'm obsessing ? lol !!!!! By the way my Geo Metro is more efficient than my human body lol !!!!! If I put a 1 dollar McChicken in my belly on think of that as my fuel, I will gas out after about 15 Miles and want more McChickens. Now if I put a dollar in my Geo Metro I can go about 34 miles !!!! So what I'm saying is that a clown car habit does not pertain to all cars !!!! Geo Metro's and yes hyper milling flat out KICK ASS !!!!! No big over priced batteries in a Geo either.

[doug111]

Not unsafe, the power assist breaks do little for a Metro due to the weight of the car. No biggy. Massive following distance is key.  But hey to each to their own.

No power brakes, no ability to increase speed if necessary, significantly reduced traction, significantly increased stopping distance, extremely poor ice and cold weather performance, and the list goes on an one. Cap that off with making your engine work harder to maintain proper operating temperature causing increased wear and tear.

Hyper milers = penny wise, pound foolish.

]
Survivor bias at its finest.  Nobody posting here is already dead from their goofy driving habits, so it must be risk free.  Shutting off your power assist brakes is not safe, especially when inside a tin can like an old Metro.

Not unsafe, the power assist breaks do little for a Metro due to the weight of the car. No biggy. Massive following distance is key.  But hey to each to their own.

Following distance only helps for the car that's in front of you.  It doesn't help when an object unexpectedly moves into your path, like a car swerving into your lane or a kid dashing into the street.

Thanks for the input.

I'm gonna have to side with Doug.  I've ridden a few 800# plus bikes and braking on them was generally fine.  You will easily get 3x the leverage out of a brake pedal than a handle lever so I can see how non-powered brakes on a car that light would be fine (with good calipers and disks).

Doug, I'm not sure if you are a troll or just very enthusiastic (and a bit cheap).  If the former, not bad you're actually kinda funny.  If the latter, well congrats on your enthusiasm but not many here will fully embrace your tactics.  Good luck sir.

Thanks for the congrats and your a nice person and no I am NOT a troll lol !!!!!  And of course a good MAJORITY of people on here will EVER and i mean EVER embrace my tactics because they consider them to be VERY EXTREME in their eyes and my tactics involve MASSIVE DISCIPLINE and SACRIFICE !!!! Most people look at me like I'm CRAZY because I walk by a bunch of clown cars in a COFFEE SHOP line and I yell out BAAAAAAH BAAAAAH !!!! BY the way I am overly cheap not just a bit cheap !!!! BUT I DO HAVE A BLAST IN LIFE !!!! Thanks to credit card churning my wife and I went on 8 free trips thanks to sign up bonuses, but we've tapered off and now for the last 2 years we've sold the FREE points and miles to buyers that I have and used the free money to pay off the mortgage faster !!!!

[boarder42]

your tactics are extreme but you're chasing leaves as nereo said not looking at the big picture.  if you make an extra dollar hypermiling your geo metro daily over me and put that into a mortgage at 3.25% you're probably still coming out behind me when i'm actually investing the money not putting it towards basically normal inflation.

you're so focused on what YOU'RE doing and how YOU'RE doing it you arent actually listening to any of the advice on here.  which is fine if all you want to do is brag about all these ridiculous things you're putting time and energy into vs when you could save alot of time and energy by optimizing investing strategy more power to you but ... starting in the same place with the same salary there is alot a person could be doing to optimize time and money spent and come out miles ahead of you.

[doug111]

your tactics are extreme but you're chasing leaves as nereo said not looking at the big picture.  if you make an extra dollar hypermiling your geo metro daily over me and put that into a mortgage at 3.25% you're probably still coming out behind me when i'm actually investing the money not putting it towards basically normal inflation.

you're so focused on what YOU'RE doing and how YOU'RE doing it you arent actually listening to any of the advice on here.  which is fine if all you want to do is brag about all these ridiculous things you're putting time and energy into vs when you could save alot of time and energy by optimizing investing strategy more power to you but ... starting in the same place with the same salary there is alot a person could be doing to optimize time and money spent and come out miles ahead of you.

See I disagree with you, I am operating 100% on what my grandfather beat into my head all the way from the great depression type thinking and thats the "every little bit helps theory" well its actually fact. I will never display my net worth on here but it would shock you. Ive been a Landlord for over 20 years now and thanks to my Grandfathers "every little bit helps" theory I have never came close to failure and in fact I've excelled even far beyond my wildest dreams. I never thought 20 years ago that I would be this secure. Ive always been a true Mustachian way before MMM was even thought of, Ive always laughed when I hear people saying "I put a measly 6% into my 401k, lol. I had a Union Pension which I still won't get for another over 20 years, but I won't even come close to needing it. I maybe saving a few bucks a day in my Geo Metro but thats just the start. Everything I do is frugal. I never pay full price for anything. I am extremely patient to hunt out deals and even when I find a deal luckily I am a master negotiator which also has to do with that "every little bit helps" theory. I dont buy stocks because id rather start a company and trust myself as the Ceo instead of trusting another company that I've never met thats in the stock market. I only spend when theres a profit to be made.

[doug111]

Mortgage interest compounding
This may vary based on locality and financial institution, but... my credit union mortgage interest is calculated on the first of the month, based on that balance. Because of this, the optimal way to make an extra payment is on the last business day of the previous month.

(I've only been making extra payments to reach 78% LTV and eliminate PMI.)

Money and math
As others have pointed out or hinted out, if you have a low interest mortgage, the better financial move (based on math) is to invest the extra money and keep your mortgage. Of course, for some, that extra money wouldn't be invested, so they might as well pay off their mortgage. Just be aware that it's not optimal (and this site is somewhat engineer-heavy, so optimization is pretty much our favorite.)

Thanks for the info, I just cut back in another way today, I decided to quit putting milk in my coffee. So nows its black with honey. That will save me about $8,100 over the next 30 years !!!!! IM SO EXCITED !!!!! YooHoo !!!!!! LESS SPENDING !!!!! LESS CONSUMING !!!!! SCREW THOSE COWS !!!!! THEY CAN KEEP THEIR DAMN MILK !!!!! I WILL ADD WATER TO MY COFFEE FOR NEAR FREE INSTEAD !!!!! lol !!!!!

[doug111]

your tactics are extreme but you're chasing leaves as nereo said not looking at the big picture.  if you make an extra dollar hypermiling your geo metro daily over me and put that into a mortgage at 3.25% you're probably still coming out behind me when i'm actually investing the money not putting it towards basically normal inflation.

you're so focused on what YOU'RE doing and how YOU'RE doing it you arent actually listening to any of the advice on here.  which is fine if all you want to do is brag about all these ridiculous things you're putting time and energy into vs when you could save alot of time and energy by optimizing investing strategy more power to you but ... starting in the same place with the same salary there is alot a person could be doing to optimize time and money spent and come out miles ahead of you.

You know I was just laughing and thinking about how you called my tactics "EXTREME" lol !!!! What I think is "EXTREME" is when people stay in debt and risk the roof over their head leveraging it for a measly few more % in the markets. What I also think is "EXTREME" is when people buy stocks and trust that some CEO isn't cooking the books and how the stock buyers trust all the input in their books, instead of starting their own company. I guess that I just see things differently. But hey that "DIFFERENTLY" is what makes this site so colorful. But hey thanks for the "KIND" input and for "NOT" being an ass like some people on here.

[nereo]

Doug - I suggest you check out the forums at Early Retirement Extreme.  The folks there may more your style.

I'm going to attempt to reboot this conversation one more time.  It's admirable that you have reached FI at such a young age.  There are many young people on this forum who also have impressively large net worths. Overall this is a very constructive forum (particularly by internet standards) and much of the feedback you have received is aimed at getting you to look at the broader picture; many of your statements indicate that you are so focused on saving small amounts of money that you may be overlooking much larger wealth-optimization strategies, and ignoring how your actions impact others.  As Boarder42 said, if you just started this thread to brag about how wealthy you are and aren't willing to participate in any discussion, so be it.  This is the "share your badassity" subforum, but you may also want to visit the "journals" subform and create your own there.

Index investing, landlording/real-estate and creating a lifestyle that favors human-powered transportation over driving everywhere are big themes here. There are also many, many entrepreneurs here who run their own side-gigs or who have started their own companies. There are many threads here that discuss the merits and drawbacks of each, and it would be great to have your input in these thread.  One thing this forum does intensely focus on is actual metrics; ROI, opportunity costs, and re-occuring expenses are always carefully examined to see if they make sense.  When you post numbers like eliminating milk from coffee will save you $8,100 in 30 years, people are going to be extremely skeptical (that would require using 74¢ of milk into coffee every single day. A more realistic estimate would be 7-10¢).  It isn't hate or haters, it's what we do here; we examine each others postings, call out bogus numbers and suggest ways that person can better optimize their financial life.

Cheers
~Nereo~

[SwordGuy]

Congrats on your mortgage paydown!

(Feel free to reply in regular case, not upper case.  It hurts my eyes. :) )

The $60 beer bottle supply at the marina is a sweet gig.  How often can you pull that off?  Once a week, after the weekend?
52  * $60 is serious cash! 

One of the things I did was compare my various sources of income with how many hours I had to put into them.  That way, if I have to choose between one activity or another, I know which one to prioritize.  (Assuming, of course, that adding more hours would yield more money!)

So, out of curiosity, how much per hour are you making on the marina beer bottle caper?


I definitely like the idea of being debt free.  We just bought a house last December and decided to invest the money from selling my deceased mom's house sale rather than pay off our mortgage early.   We're on a 15yr fixed at 2.75%.  Pure math tells me it's the right choice but gosh, I sure hate being that much in debt.

We may revisit that decision when we go FI next year and just pay it off for peace of mind.

We just started our own rental property business 2 years ago.  We have 4 houses to rent out, 2 of which have been fixed up and rented out.   We still have work to do on the 3rd rental and our old house before we rent them out.  It's been slow going this year on those tasks. :(   We have one HELOC on our old house that we used to buy rental #3 with.  I'll be glad to get rid of that, too.

[boarder42]

Congrats on your mortgage paydown!

(Feel free to reply in regular case, not upper case.  It hurts my eyes. :) )

The $60 beer bottle supply at the marina is a sweet gig.  How often can you pull that off?  Once a week, after the weekend?
52  * $60 is serious cash! 

One of the things I did was compare my various sources of income with how many hours I had to put into them.  That way, if I have to choose between one activity or another, I know which one to prioritize.  (Assuming, of course, that adding more hours would yield more money!)

So, out of curiosity, how much per hour are you making on the marina beer bottle caper?


I definitely like the idea of being debt free.  We just bought a house last December and decided to invest the money from selling my deceased mom's house sale rather than pay off our mortgage early.   We're on a 15yr fixed at 2.75%.  Pure math tells me it's the right choice but gosh, I sure hate being that much in debt.

We may revisit that decision when we go FI next year and just pay it off for peace of mind.

We just started our own rental property business 2 years ago.  We have 4 houses to rent out, 2 of which have been fixed up and rented out.   We still have work to do on the 3rd rental and our old house before we rent them out.  It's been slow going this year on those tasks. :(   We have one HELOC on our old house that we used to buy rental #3 with.  I'll be glad to get rid of that, too.

if it makes you drop tax brackets lower it may actually make financial sense if it can keep you in the 15% bracket.  you can put math to any situation.  but if thats not the case i'd rather have the "piece of mind" that historically keeping the mortgage is a less risky position. 

[SwordGuy]

Very good point!

[doug111]

What I think is "EXTREME" is when people stay in debt and risk the roof over their head leveraging it for a measly few more % in the markets. What I also think is "EXTREME" is when people buy stocks

You are contradicting yourself, because, as you said, "every little bit helps." A few % on large sums (like the amount of a mortgage) makes a big difference, a huge difference over time.

Besides, as has been pointed out many times on these forums, to have a $200k mortgage debt and $150k in investments is quite lower risk than having $50k mortgage debt and $0 in investments - if your income ends, you stop paying the bank, and the house is gone! Having those investments means you have funds to draw from in case you lose your income. That's risking the roof over your head as much or more than being somewhat leveraged but having large amounts invested.

Yes - for some people, having their own company returns more on investment (and on sweat equity) than a fully diversified investment portfolio, and any individual is free to assess themselves and make that choice. However, there's ample reason to believe in making money on investments. While there's lots of speculation in the stock market value at any given moment, there's still capital assets and revenue that underlie the true value of those equities. Over a long enough timeline, the speculation becomes merely bumps on the road (which help make dollar-cost averaging and re-balancing valuable investment tools) on a solid long-term investment strategy.

Well when I do the "EVERY LITTLE BUT HELPS" theory I am not even doing calculated risk, there is ZERO risk. The never feel RISKY doing the frugal things that I do. So in my opinion I am not risking anything in the markets by driving a Geo Metro or skipping breakfast or eating dandelions for lunch. I am amazed at how there are so many so-called followers of MMM on here when he specifically says that "YOUR DEBT IS AN EMERGENCY" lol  But hey anyway to each their own and I really appreciate your input because you sound like you actually try to teach instead of just scolding me. So I give you a thumbs up for that. I guess that I'm just set in my ways and my ways have worked rather well for me.

[doug111]

Doug - I suggest you check out the forums at Early Retirement Extreme.  The folks there may more your style.

I'm going to attempt to reboot this conversation one more time.  It's admirable that you have reached FI at such a young age.  There are many young people on this forum who also have impressively large net worths. Overall this is a very constructive forum (particularly by internet standards) and much of the feedback you have received is aimed at getting you to look at the broader picture; many of your statements indicate that you are so focused on saving small amounts of money that you may be overlooking much larger wealth-optimization strategies, and ignoring how your actions impact others.  As Boarder42 said, if you just started this thread to brag about how wealthy you are and aren't willing to participate in any discussion, so be it.  This is the "share your badassity" subforum, but you may also want to visit the "journals" subform and create your own there.

Index investing, landlording/real-estate and creating a lifestyle that favors human-powered transportation over driving everywhere are big themes here. There are also many, many entrepreneurs here who run their own side-gigs or who have started their own companies. There are many threads here that discuss the merits and drawbacks of each, and it would be great to have your input in these thread.  One thing this forum does intensely focus on is actual metrics; ROI, opportunity costs, and re-occuring expenses are always carefully examined to see if they make sense.  When you post numbers like eliminating milk from coffee will save you $8,100 in 30 years, people are going to be extremely skeptical (that would require using 74¢ of milk into coffee every single day. A more realistic estimate would be 7-10¢).  It isn't hate or haters, it's what we do here; we examine each others postings, call out bogus numbers and suggest ways that person can better optimize their financial life.

Cheers
~Nereo~

WOW !!!! What a great read there, thanks for the constructive criticism sir. When I wanted to inspire other people to pay off their own mortgage and to show them that they can knock it out of the park in a short period of time, I looked at the posting sections and thought to myself, Yes what I have done all by myself by paying off a mortgage is PURE BADASSITY and thats where I figured that it should be posted. I am not trying to BRAG, I am trying to INSPIRE. This country is in a ton of trouble with all of this exorbitant amount of debt. I am still amazed that people are even willing to risk a measly 10% or less rate of return leveraging their house in the markets. But hey you seem like a nice guy and thanks for not being a hater.

[nereo]

...
 I am amazed at how there are so many so-called followers of MMM on here when he specifically says that "YOUR DEBT IS AN EMERGENCY" lol  But hey anyway to each their own and I really appreciate your input because you sound like you actually try to teach instead of just scolding me. So I give you a thumbs up for that. I guess that I'm just set in my ways and my ways have worked rather well for me.

Doug - this may help explain it a bit better:
http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2012/02/24/pay-down-the-mortgage-or-invest-more-a-winwin-question/
there's also a great deal of back-and-forth discussion (much of it very insightful on both accounts) here:
http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/investor-alley/paying-off-mortgage-early-how-bad-is-it-for-your-fi-date/

A key component is what kind of debt you have and what your rates are.  Literally no one (except as a joke) would argue that credit card debt at 15% isn't a hair-on-fire sort of financial emergency. However, there are very good reasons for holding onto a 3.0% fixed mortgage, and it can be MORE risky to pay that debt off in many cases.

[boarder42]

Doug - I suggest you check out the forums at Early Retirement Extreme.  The folks there may more your style.

I'm going to attempt to reboot this conversation one more time.  It's admirable that you have reached FI at such a young age.  There are many young people on this forum who also have impressively large net worths. Overall this is a very constructive forum (particularly by internet standards) and much of the feedback you have received is aimed at getting you to look at the broader picture; many of your statements indicate that you are so focused on saving small amounts of money that you may be overlooking much larger wealth-optimization strategies, and ignoring how your actions impact others.  As Boarder42 said, if you just started this thread to brag about how wealthy you are and aren't willing to participate in any discussion, so be it.  This is the "share your badassity" subforum, but you may also want to visit the "journals" subform and create your own there.

Index investing, landlording/real-estate and creating a lifestyle that favors human-powered transportation over driving everywhere are big themes here. There are also many, many entrepreneurs here who run their own side-gigs or who have started their own companies. There are many threads here that discuss the merits and drawbacks of each, and it would be great to have your input in these thread.  One thing this forum does intensely focus on is actual metrics; ROI, opportunity costs, and re-occuring expenses are always carefully examined to see if they make sense.  When you post numbers like eliminating milk from coffee will save you $8,100 in 30 years, people are going to be extremely skeptical (that would require using 74¢ of milk into coffee every single day. A more realistic estimate would be 7-10¢).  It isn't hate or haters, it's what we do here; we examine each others postings, call out bogus numbers and suggest ways that person can better optimize their financial life.

Cheers
~Nereo~

WOW !!!! What a great read there, thanks for the constructive criticism sir. When I wanted to inspire other people to pay off their own mortgage and to show them that they can knock it out of the park in a short period of time, I looked at the posting sections and thought to myself, Yes what I have done all by myself by paying off a mortgage is PURE BADASSITY and thats where I figured that it should be posted. I am not trying to BRAG, I am trying to INSPIRE. This country is in a ton of trouble with all of this exorbitant amount of debt. I am still amazed that people are even willing to risk a measly 10% or less rate of return leveraging their house in the markets. But hey you seem like a nice guy and thanks for not being a hater.

measley 10% return rate.  you're getting a measly 3.5% or whatever your mortgage is ... 6.5% compounded is worth piles of money its not measley.  but if you're not open to others ideas so be it.  around here this is a hot debate and 10% isnt measly.   call it whatever you want but thats outrageous.  this also is a forum full of people who are trying to FIRE and some enjoy the feeling of being safer in their mind more than the mathmatical advantage of less risk and more safety.  this is clearly the camp you fall in but to call it measley proves quite simply you dont really understand the metrics behind it or care to listen.

[doug111]

Congrats on your mortgage paydown!

(Feel free to reply in regular case, not upper case.  It hurts my eyes. :) )

The $60 beer bottle supply at the marina is a sweet gig.  How often can you pull that off?  Once a week, after the weekend?
52  * $60 is serious cash! 

One of the things I did was compare my various sources of income with how many hours I had to put into them.  That way, if I have to choose between one activity or another, I know which one to prioritize.  (Assuming, of course, that adding more hours would yield more money!)

So, out of curiosity, how much per hour are you making on the marina beer bottle caper?


I definitely like the idea of being debt free.  We just bought a house last December and decided to invest the money from selling my deceased mom's house sale rather than pay off our mortgage early.   We're on a 15yr fixed at 2.75%.  Pure math tells me it's the right choice but gosh, I sure hate being that much in debt.

We may revisit that decision when we go FI next year and just pay it off for peace of mind.

We just started our own rental property business 2 years ago.  We have 4 houses to rent out, 2 of which have been fixed up and rented out.   We still have work to do on the 3rd rental and our old house before we rent them out.  It's been slow going this year on those tasks. :(   We have one HELOC on our old house that we used to buy rental #3 with.  I'll be glad to get rid of that, too.

Put it this way, I have met a ton of very wealthy people in life because I used to drive a lumber truck at a local Lumber yard and I would deliver to a lot of mega Landlords. One thing that I noticed is that the ones that grew 100% debt free were the EXTREMELY rich ones. The one that leveraged were always chasing their tails. One of those Landlords is in Portland Or. named Joe Weston, he's probably thee largest Landlords in Portland Oregon and his motto is that once he pays off a property under no circumstance does he ever borrow from it to buy another ever again, another wealthy guy I met has close to 100 debt free rental houses and he stared in his 20s and sure the prices were cheap back then on real estate. But those are the kinds of people that I take advice from. Thats who I will always follow. Leverage killed people around 2008, luckily I wasn't now of them, what saved me was being a cheap skate and an anti spender. So now that times are good I AM KNOCKING OUT DEBT PERIOD !!!!!  Thanks for your reply though.

[boarder42]

also "b/c it worked for me" is a terrible example of anything you can litteraly apply that to anything...

"hey guys just wanted to share my badassity i've been spending 10k a year on lotto tickets and just hit the powerball jackpot everyone else should too IT WORKED FOR ME!!!!"

around here as nereo said we like to back things up and show the actual math behind it and analyze other peoples numbers.

[doug111]

...
 I am amazed at how there are so many so-called followers of MMM on here when he specifically says that "YOUR DEBT IS AN EMERGENCY" lol  But hey anyway to each their own and I really appreciate your input because you sound like you actually try to teach instead of just scolding me. So I give you a thumbs up for that. I guess that I'm just set in my ways and my ways have worked rather well for me.

Doug - this may help explain it a bit better:
http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2012/02/24/pay-down-the-mortgage-or-invest-more-a-winwin-question/
there's also a great deal of back-and-forth discussion (much of it very insightful on both accounts) here:
http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/investor-alley/paying-off-mortgage-early-how-bad-is-it-for-your-fi-date/

A key component is what kind of debt you have and what your rates are.  Literally no one (except as a joke) would argue that credit card debt at 15% isn't a hair-on-fire sort of financial emergency. However, there are very good reasons for holding onto a 3.0% fixed mortgage, and it can be MORE risky to pay that debt off in many cases.

Im trying to open up my mind here and learn. What are the risks of paying off a 3% mortgage. I mean the only risk that I see is that if an opportunity came up on a steal of a deal on a car or a house your cash would be tied up in your paid off house. Thats the only risk that I see. Whats your thoughts ?

[nereo]

Put it this way, I have met a ton of very wealthy people in life because I used to drive a lumber truck at a local Lumber yard and I would deliver to a lot of mega Landlords. One thing that I noticed is that the ones that grew 100% debt free were the EXTREMELY rich ones. The one that leveraged were always chasing their tails. One of those Landlords is in Portland Or. named Joe Weston, he's probably thee largest Landlords in Portland Oregon and his motto is that once he pays off a property under no circumstance does he ever borrow from it to buy another ever again, another wealthy guy I met has close to 100 debt free rental houses and he stared in his 20s and sure the prices were cheap back then on real estate. But those are the kinds of people that I take advice from. Thats who I will always follow. Leverage killed people around 2008, luckily I wasn't now of them, what saved me was being a cheap skate and an anti spender. So now that times are good I AM KNOCKING OUT DEBT PERIOD !!!!!  Thanks for your reply though.

If you are interested in discussing landlording strategies (particularly as it pertains to wealth-accumulation) Bigger Pockets is the place to go.  There's also our real-estate subforum here and a lot of good explanations about how having a mortgage can shift much of the RISK to the banks while allowing for larger profits.

[doug111]

Doug - I suggest you check out the forums at Early Retirement Extreme.  The folks there may more your style.

I'm going to attempt to reboot this conversation one more time.  It's admirable that you have reached FI at such a young age.  There are many young people on this forum who also have impressively large net worths. Overall this is a very constructive forum (particularly by internet standards) and much of the feedback you have received is aimed at getting you to look at the broader picture; many of your statements indicate that you are so focused on saving small amounts of money that you may be overlooking much larger wealth-optimization strategies, and ignoring how your actions impact others.  As Boarder42 said, if you just started this thread to brag about how wealthy you are and aren't willing to participate in any discussion, so be it.  This is the "share your badassity" subforum, but you may also want to visit the "journals" subform and create your own there.

Index investing, landlording/real-estate and creating a lifestyle that favors human-powered transportation over driving everywhere are big themes here. There are also many, many entrepreneurs here who run their own side-gigs or who have started their own companies. There are many threads here that discuss the merits and drawbacks of each, and it would be great to have your input in these thread.  One thing this forum does intensely focus on is actual metrics; ROI, opportunity costs, and re-occuring expenses are always carefully examined to see if they make sense.  When you post numbers like eliminating milk from coffee will save you $8,100 in 30 years, people are going to be extremely skeptical (that would require using 74¢ of milk into coffee every single day. A more realistic estimate would be 7-10¢).  It isn't hate or haters, it's what we do here; we examine each others postings, call out bogus numbers and suggest ways that person can better optimize their financial life.

Cheers
~Nereo~

WOW !!!! What a great read there, thanks for the constructive criticism sir. When I wanted to inspire other people to pay off their own mortgage and to show them that they can knock it out of the park in a short period of time, I looked at the posting sections and thought to myself, Yes what I have done all by myself by paying off a mortgage is PURE BADASSITY and thats where I figured that it should be posted. I am not trying to BRAG, I am trying to INSPIRE. This country is in a ton of trouble with all of this exorbitant amount of debt. I am still amazed that people are even willing to risk a measly 10% or less rate of return leveraging their house in the markets. But hey you seem like a nice guy and thanks for not being a hater.

measley 10% return rate.  you're getting a measly 3.5% or whatever your mortgage is ... 6.5% compounded is worth piles of money its not measley.  but if you're not open to others ideas so be it.  around here this is a hot debate and 10% isnt measly.   call it whatever you want but thats outrageous.  this also is a forum full of people who are trying to FIRE and some enjoy the feeling of being safer in their mind more than the mathmatical advantage of less risk and more safety.  this is clearly the camp you fall in but to call it measley proves quite simply you dont really understand the metrics behind it or care to listen.

Im sorry, maybe I should have given you more input about why I call 10% measly. I like astronomical rates of returns on tiny eansy weensy investments. I am a buyer and seller for my side gig, I actually have a carlot with my son that I had him start many years ago. Cars do a lot better than 10%, but you have to know what in the heck that your doing, its not for everyone. Ive seen a ton and I mean a ton of people fail miserably at owning carlots and its usually due to what they call in the car business "flooring or floating" which is the same as leverage. I leverage zero in the car business also.