Author Topic: Cable, Internet, Home & Cell Phones... redone MMM-style to save $274/month!!  (Read 16197 times)

Tennis Maniac

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It took a lot of leg work, but I've finally unraveled 10 years of ignorantly entrenched reliance on Time Warner and an unused AT&T Unlimited Data Plan.  Thanks, MMM, for shedding some light on this senselessness.

The journey is not for the faint of heart, but seeing these new line items in your expenses at the end of month is totally worth it!

$337/month (TW/AT&T) --> $63/month (Earthlink/Netflix/Google Voice/OBi Talk/AirVoice)
savings = $274/month

Note: 2 iPhones and 1 other cell phone; add a few hundred dollars in up front costs for hardware and number porting; disclaimer: your wife's reaction to losing her unlimited data and DVR may differ from mine


All your options - posted by I.P.Daley: https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/share-your-badassity/communications-tech-isps-voip-cell/
« Last Edit: December 06, 2012, 03:02:03 PM by Tennis Maniac »

matt_g

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Re: Cable, Internet, Home & Cell Phones... redone MMM-style!
« Reply #1 on: December 03, 2012, 09:39:40 AM »
Stick it to the man for a savings of $3,288 per year!

Ottawa

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Re: Cable, Internet, Home & Cell Phones... redone MMM-style!
« Reply #2 on: December 03, 2012, 10:11:31 AM »
Awesome!  Here is what I was able to do in Urban Canada (all prices included tax and are per month):

Previously
Cable TV (Rogers) - $85.60
Cell Phone* (Wind Mobile Unlimited Data and North America long distance) - $45.20**
Home Phone (Rogers - 6Mbps with ) - $42.15
Internet (Rogers) - $41.12
TOTAL = $214.07

Currently
TV - $9.03 (Netflix) - (using 2nd hand Boxee Box one time cost - $120)
Cell Phone (Wind Mobile Unlimited Data and North America long distance) - $45.20** 
Home Phone (TekTalk - unlimited North America and all kinds of cool gadgets) - $28.19
Internet (TekSavvy - 18Mbps with 300GB cap) - $45.14
TOTAL = $127.56

Savings since MMM = $86.51 (OR $15,312 over 10 years equivalent)
* Our family has only one cellphone as we are rarely if ever both away from our work or home.  Thus, whoever is away takes the phone.
** We are doing some trialling currently to see if we can drop down to Pay as you go.  This would be a massive reduction in monthly cost...probably $40. 

Daley

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Re: Cable, Internet, Home & Cell Phones... redone MMM-style!
« Reply #3 on: December 03, 2012, 03:19:31 PM »
$337/month (TW/AT&T) --> $63/month (Earthlink/Netflix/Google Voice/OBi Talk/AirVoice)
savings = $274/month

Tennis Maniac... you just quite literally brought a tear of joy to my eye. It's results like this that drove me to authoring that guide and keep me going. Thank you for sharing this. :)

It feels really good to spend less money on everything than most people spend on just a cellphone in one month, doesn't it?

strider3700

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Re: Cable, Internet, Home & Cell Phones... redone MMM-style!
« Reply #4 on: December 03, 2012, 04:26:08 PM »
Every year I cancel cabletv then get offered a discount if I come back about a month later.  If the discount doesn't include free cable and lower my bill somehow  I don't take it.  Last year I cancelled in November, and rejoined in december.  The promo I got was free cable for the year, cheaper phone and better internet so my bill dropped by $10/month as well they gave me $100 in visa gift cards.   

My year is up in 2 weeks and the bill of what I'd be paying now just arrived.   It went from $64.90 to $147.90.  $73 after tax to $163. This is the cheap digital,  no HD or anything...   SO this means tv is now roughly $77/month.

Anyways I called them up to cancel once again.   the new plan is now $89.54/month.  home phone is $35 of that.   I get my money's worth from the internet but I really don't get think phone phone is worth it.  Time to start investigating those options I suppose.

Tennis Maniac

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Re: Cable, Internet, Home & Cell Phones... redone MMM-style!
« Reply #5 on: December 03, 2012, 09:11:49 PM »
@Ottawa:
You have trimmed quite a bit already.  It's amazing what a little creativity will do for your 'stache.
It looks like you could cut even more from your Home and Cell Phone costs without sacrificing much.
Cellular data is a killer... turn it off on your phone and see how much you really need it.  I did this and was surprised that I used < 1MB in 3 weeks.  From I.P.Daley's communication primer, it seems like Home Phone should be < $10/month (mine is $0 pending Google Voice pricing for 2013... though this may only be available in the US??).


Here is my before and after for comparison...
Previously
Cable TV (Time Warner Cable with premium add-ons) + Internet (Time Warner Road Runner) - $166.58 (bundle pricing!!!)
Additional TV (Netflix) - $7.99
Cell Phone (AT&T Wireless; 2 iPhones with unlimited data, 1 flip phone) - $173.76
Home Phone (none) - $0
TOTAL = $348.33

Goals:  add home phone; keep existing cell numbers for incoming/outgoing calls and texts; ability to use cellular data if we really need to

Currently
TV (Netflix) - $7.99 (bought an additional WD Live TV box - $97)
TV (Over the Air) - $0 (antenna - $40; self installation - $0)
Cell Phone (AirVoice Wireless; 2 iPhones with data if needed + 1 flip phone) - $23.00 ** (phone number porting - $40 + early termination - $195 + 3 SIM cards - $14.97)
Home Phone (Google Voice + ObiTalk) - $0 (inherited an unused cordless phone from my brother - $0; Obi100 - ~$40)  ***
Internet (Earthlink 10Mbps) - $29.95
TOTAL = $60.94 ($386.97 up front - steep up front costs, but my break even is only 1.5 months)

Sacrifices/Changes involved:  limited cellular data (3 weeks in i've used 1MB of cell data, will see how my wife fares); use cordless home phone for calls when possible; using a combination of apps on iPhone for calls/texts (Google Voice, Talkatone, Phone); wife and I use our new cell numbers for texting to take advantage of iMessage when she is at home and I am at the office (95% of the time)

Savings since MMM = $287.39 (OR $49,718 over 10 years equivalent (x * 173)... just did this math... holy freaking poop!)


** My old cell number was ported to Google Voice and forwards to my new AV cell number AND the Talkatone app on my iPhone.  Since I am in wifi range 95% of the time (at work and home), I can make and receive calls with Talkatone for free... if i am in my car or out and about, I can answer the call using AV minutes.  Currently, I have texts routed to Google Voice app only, which means I won't get them out of range of wifi... I may adjust that based on how much of my $10 bank I use each month with minutes.

*** My wife's old cell phone number was ported to Google Voice and forwards to her new AV cell number AND our cordless phone via Obi100 (this allows her to receive calls for free at home, where she is most of the time).  The Obi100 box allows two Google Voice numbers to forward to your home phones, so our cordless phone is also connected to a new Google Voice number that we can now use as our house line (added so that babysitter can call my wife).  Texts set up to GV app on iPhone... will adjust options as things play out.


Tennis Maniac

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Re: Cable, Internet, Home & Cell Phones... redone MMM-style!
« Reply #6 on: December 03, 2012, 09:24:14 PM »
@I.P.Daley
My last call to AT&T was to have them remove a $5 late charge on a $0.44 overdue bill (inverted some digits when paying).  I was hassled for 5 minutes because "it was a legitimate charge" before the woman on the phone gave in a gave me a break "this one time" (this happened before I started porting numbers away from them).  It felt so good a week later when I logged into my AT&T online account and saw "Total Balance: $5.15 CR... Account Status: Canceled" (ironically "canceled" was in big red letters, like it was a bad thing)

Thanks for all your work organizing the ridiculous amounts of options out there.  It almost makes AT&T and Verizon fees understandable when you consider the complicated mess they are simplifying for people.  But such is the life of the MMM devotee... self installation and research, research, research.

Tennis Maniac

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Re: Cable, Internet, Home & Cell Phones... redone MMM-style!
« Reply #7 on: December 03, 2012, 09:37:03 PM »
@strider3700
Cable TV is like cocaine... at first it is free; once you are addicted, they can charge whatever they want.
The obvious goal of giving it to us for free is to get us addicted in hopes that we will continue to pay their exorbitant fees down the road.

Satellite Radio has an even better strategy... when you cancel your subscription, the radio in your car stays active for a week so you continue to receive the stations you have been listening to, so when they call a week later you realize the errors of your decision and change your mind.  Gotta love psychology.

I also like how the cable companies are now offering Home Phone VOIP services to get their tentacles even further into people's services/wallets.  Along with using an email address provided (usually for free) by your ISP, if you also use their Home Phone service, you have to untangle a huge web before you can even consider giving them the heave-ho.  This entails porting your phone number and changing your email address with every website you've come in contact with in the past 5 years... too much to take on for the typical consumer, so they give up before they even start!

Good luck with your MMM mini-quest.

strider3700

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Re: Cable, Internet, Home & Cell Phones... redone MMM-style!
« Reply #8 on: December 03, 2012, 11:34:30 PM »
I love my free HD over the Air tv.   Two years ago when I cancelled cable they gave me an HD PVR and all the programming for free for a year. It allowed me to compare HD cable to HD OTA. OTA had a better picture on 90% of the programming hands down.  It didn't have 1000 channels.  That didn't bug me at all.  I can watch two football games each sunday and the news at night. That's more then I really need.

At this point It's just a game to see what the company will give me. 

I know what you're saying about the email address though.  Back in university I changed ISP's every year for 3 straight years.  At that point I gave up on email address's and sold my soul to gmail.  Now I'd happily take a google phone  if it was an option in Canada.


Tennis Maniac

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Re: Cable, Internet, Home & Cell Phones... redone MMM-style!
« Reply #9 on: December 04, 2012, 05:22:43 AM »
@strider3700
Google Voice is working out great, it's a shame you can't get it in Canada.
Like you, OTA is giving me just enough sports and news to keep me happy. I agree that OTA seems to be better quality than cable provides... the cable can only carry so many 1s and 0s I guess. ;)


Ottawa

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Re: Cable, Internet, Home & Cell Phones... redone MMM-style!
« Reply #10 on: December 04, 2012, 06:38:39 AM »
@ Tennis Maniac - yeah - like strider3700 I wish we could get google voice.  Unfortunately no.  The landline price that we've got now is actually very good for Canada...the cellphone (although very good also for Canada) is something we can certainly work on - and have identified it as such. 

And now for a complete tangent!
Much like you say cable tv is like crack...I believe smartphones are the same thing!  Ever notice how people check their phone all the time...they almost have a Pavlovian response when their phone dings/bings/rings...and indeed; even checking their own phone when someone (with a clearly different notification to their own) else's phone goes off. 

Some interesting reading...Now...I'm not necessarily saying smartphones are bad: they can be very Mustachian.  However, there are certainly dangers associated with them if you are prone to non-Mustachianism...such as debt/addiction/indeed; even unhappiness! etc...

Addiction:
"Experts behind a new study have now said compulsively checking a mobile phone is an addiction similar to compulsive spending or credit card misuse"
Source - http://macedoniaonline.eu/content/view/22323/56/

""Cell phones are a part of our consumer culture," says study author Dr. James Roberts, marketing professor at Baylor University. "They are not just a consumer tool, but are used as a status symbol. They're also eroding our personal relationships." The research—which relied on self-reports from nearly 200 business students at two US universities—is said to be the first of its kind to investigate the role materialism plays in mobile phone addiction."
Source - http://www.boston.com/lifestyle/health/2012/11/30/mobile-phone-addiction-like-compulsive-shopping-study-says/SatlWi3lrFVQunCN6Vl9BP/story.html

study here:
http://www.akademiai.com/content/q41011j715q26n7h/

Safety:
While cellphone use (in 1st world countries) have certainly saved lives; I wonder if they haven't killed FAR MORE - does anyone have any firm data source on the comparison of save vs kill/injure?  I found this:
http://www.distraction.gov/content/get-the-facts/facts-and-statistics.html


Daley

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Re: Cable, Internet, Home & Cell Phones... redone MMM-style!
« Reply #11 on: December 04, 2012, 08:24:15 AM »
The Obi100 box allows two Google Voice numbers to forward to your home phones, so our cordless phone is also connected to a new Google Voice number that we can now use as our house line (added so that babysitter can call my wife).  Texts set up to GV app on iPhone... will adjust options as things play out.

I've just got one question for you, does your babysitter know she can't dial 911 on your home phone? Google Voice doesn't support emergency services. This is one of the other reasons why I'm a firm proponent of paying a little money on a good VoIP carrier at home: e911 support. It's one of those things that you never think you'll need it until you do. You could always have the local fire and constabulary on speed dial and post those numbers next to the phone as well like people did pre-911 service days, but most people don't understand the concept of dialing anything but in an emergency anymore.



Home Phone (TekTalk - unlimited North America and all kinds of cool gadgets) - $28.19

Now I'd happily take a google phone if it was an option in Canada.

Canadians! There are a few other VoIP options that you might not know about:

VOIP.ms
babyTEL
Voice Network, Inc.
Fongo/Free Phone Line

Beware the unlimited trap, as always. If you know what your average incoming and outgoing usage is on your home phone line, you might be able to save more. Going with VOIP.ms, you could theoretically get your home phone costs down to (under) $10 a month, and still have unlimited incoming calls and between 700-1000 outgoing Canada-wide minutes for that price. Calls to the US would only run about 1¢ a minute.

Fongo also has insanely cheap service, but just like my feelings on Google Voice - what price free and all that. You're typically better off paying for the services you use as you're provided more freedom and control with higher quality.



And now for a complete tangent!
Much like you say cable tv is like crack...I believe smartphones are the same thing!  Ever notice how people check their phone all the time...they almost have a Pavlovian response when their phone dings/bings/rings...and indeed; even checking their own phone when someone (with a clearly different notification to their own) else's phone goes off. 

Some interesting reading...Now...I'm not necessarily saying smartphones are bad: they can be very Mustachian.  However, there are certainly dangers associated with them if you are prone to non-Mustachianism...such as debt/addiction/indeed; even unhappiness! etc...

You're hitting the nail square on the head, and it underlines and punctuates my message on using these things as tools instead of conveniences as well as my eluded argument about technology as a potential enslavement device. There's links between blue light (which monitors/displays on nearly everything from TVs to computers to phones) and serotonin production, and serotonin is a key to learning habits, addiction and general well being. There's also links between dopamine production and positive feedback stimulation (think of gamification of tasks, general positive attention, "Likes" on Facebook, etc.). Part of our entire communications and entertainment costs are undoubtedly tangled up in this feedback loop because we so frequently argue that we "need" all this stuff, and we've been conditioned by post-paid cell phone providers into knee-jerk general avoidance of limited plans due to their gouging us for overages in the past. Then you lump on the fact that these things provide instant gratification with learning and contact and watching, slowly eroding our patience and will-power... suddenly, you've got this perfect storm where people are dumping several hundred dollars a month of services they didn't even dream they wanted 15-20 years ago.

We had an interesting thread regarding cutting back internet usage a few months back that ties into this topic, and it's also worth a read.

Tennis Maniac

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Re: Cable, Internet, Home & Cell Phones... redone MMM-style!
« Reply #12 on: December 04, 2012, 09:44:15 AM »
@Ottawa:

Addiction:
I'm not surprised with the findings of these surveys.  Above I suggested to turn off cellular data to see how much it's actually needed...  this also has the effect of forcing you to notice how addicted you have become to your cell phone... I noticed that I was instinctively checking my email every so often.  With cellular data off, I was forced to consciously decide whether to actually check my email or ignore it until later.  Since there is really no need to check it now, I always wait.  I've noticed that I don't check my email as often now as I did 1 month ago before I switched off cellular data, even on wifi.

Sitting in the local bagel/coffee shop these days everyone is on their smartphone or laptop.  I wish we could go back to the days when people's eyes were up and you actually had random conversations with strangers.  AT&T, Verizon, Rogers, Comcast and Time Warner are stealing our money and our lives (happiness).

Safety:
Whenever my wife and I are driving and we see a car swerving around the road or doing something else out of the ordinary (going really slow, etc), we jokingly question: "drunk or cell phone?".  This isn't really funny... from my experience I can spot cell phone users more blatantly than drunks.  The ironic difference is that when you are drunk, you probably realize it and try to act safe... when you are on your cell phone or texting you are acting unsafe and don't even realize it.

Tennis Maniac

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Re: Cable, Internet, Home & Cell Phones... redone MMM-style!
« Reply #13 on: December 04, 2012, 10:37:24 AM »
@I.P.Daley
I will make sure any babysitter knows that 911 is not available on my home phone.
My biggest concern is needing to make an emergency call during a power outage, which is virtually impossible with any VoIP solution, unless you have a generator.
I don't see why I can't rely on a cell phone for 911 calling...  I believe that cell phones are required by law to allow for emergency calling even if they don't have service.  The key is making sure everyone that is in my house understands how to contact emergency personal.

I wonder if I can set up my Obi100 to forward 911 to the correct emergency number in my area?  I will have to look into that.

As far as the psychology of need vs. convenience goes, the question should be: what would someone have done in the 1960's?  I forget where I read that 1960 (or thereabouts) was the height of progress and ever since then we've been getting progressively less happy.  Each successive generation has had way more technology, but claims they are much less happy.  I think this is similar to your thinking... use technology as a tool, not a convenience.  Imagine if we had today's household income (double salaries) with an expense sheet from 1960 (even with adjustments for inflation)?  No wonder they were better savers than us.

strider3700

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Re: Cable, Internet, Home & Cell Phones... redone MMM-style!
« Reply #14 on: December 04, 2012, 11:30:51 AM »
SHaw's VOIP home phone offering has a small bettery that will provide service during a power outage for awhile.  Of course non of my phone will work when the power is out so it's a moot point anyway.

N

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Re: Cable, Internet, Home & Cell Phones... redone MMM-style!
« Reply #15 on: December 04, 2012, 11:22:26 PM »
tennis maniac,
congrats on doing all the research and figuring it out! nice savings! :)

I also got mustachian on my cable, internet and cells two months ago:
went from

120 satellite, 45 cable internet, and 115 cells phones (total, 270)

to

0 satellite, 45cable internet/basic cable and 45$ cells (total 90)

fwiw, the ota antenna got WAY better picture on the tv, HD, but...so much pixellation we could not watch it. instead of going with a roof antenna (we live in a condo, and will probably move soon) we just found a internet that included basic cable. husband is still not happy about missing channels and espn, and I miss my dvr a lot.

but anyway ,congrats!

jrhampt

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Re: Cable, Internet, Home & Cell Phones... redone MMM-style!
« Reply #16 on: December 05, 2012, 07:56:01 AM »
How is earthlink for service?  I have comcast's lowest available service in my area right now (39.95 for 3mbps), but it comes out to $47/mo after modem rental fee (agh, I keep meaning to get my own modem, but maybe I'm better off just ditching the cable internet for something else).  In my area, it looks like it's either earthlink dial-up with 56kbps, which I'm not sure would work for my vpn connection (I work at home 2 days a week) or satellite for $59/mo.  Any other good options aside from comcast?

Also, I currently have t-mobile's $30/mo plan.  I use about 1000 minutes/text combined per month and no data, so I wonder if I could get something cheaper.  I'm concerned that if I switched to pay as you go that it might end up costing more than the $30/mo plan.  I don't have a home phone, but I do use google voice when I have to log on at home for conference calls etc., thanks to some tips from this forum.

That's really my total telecom bill, though, at $77/mo - much decreased from pre-mmm days.  Not bad, but still looking to decrease further if possible.

jrhampt

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Re: Cable, Internet, Home & Cell Phones... redone MMM-style!
« Reply #17 on: December 05, 2012, 07:59:17 AM »
Also, I find that it's difficult to shop for internet when most of the providers only post their teaser rates.  That's nice, but I want to know upfront what the rate will re-set to after the intro period.

Daley

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Re: Cable, Internet, Home & Cell Phones... redone MMM-style!
« Reply #18 on: December 05, 2012, 08:12:47 AM »
@I.P.Daley
I will make sure any babysitter knows that 911 is not available on my home phone.
My biggest concern is needing to make an emergency call during a power outage, which is virtually impossible with any VoIP solution, unless you have a generator.
I don't see why I can't rely on a cell phone for 911 calling...  I believe that cell phones are required by law to allow for emergency calling even if they don't have service.  The key is making sure everyone that is in my house understands how to contact emergency personal.

I wonder if I can set up my Obi100 to forward 911 to the correct emergency number in my area?  I will have to look into that.

As far as the psychology of need vs. convenience goes, the question should be: what would someone have done in the 1960's?  I forget where I read that 1960 (or thereabouts) was the height of progress and ever since then we've been getting progressively less happy.  Each successive generation has had way more technology, but claims they are much less happy.  I think this is similar to your thinking... use technology as a tool, not a convenience.  Imagine if we had today's household income (double salaries) with an expense sheet from 1960 (even with adjustments for inflation)?  No wonder they were better savers than us.

You should be able to create a dial-plan for the Obi to re-route 911 dialing to your local police dispatch number.

As to the power outage scenario, there's a really easy fix for that with VoIP service (I actually mentioned it in the guide, too): an Uninterruptable Power Supply, or UPS for short, or a battery back-up for layfolk. If you put your modem, router and ATA device on a battery backup, you'll continue to have phone service during a blackout for however long the UPS has juice in the batteries. Fortunately, the three items don't have a huge power draw, so you don't need a huge UPS to keep them running for a few hours, but the bigger the UPS volt-amp (VA) rating, the longer they'll run.

When shopping for a UPS, look for a unit that sports Auto Voltage Regulation (AVR). CyberPower makes really decent consumer grade UPSes for a fair price. I think there's a 685VA model that runs on Amazon for around $70 that you can replace the lead acid battery in when it eventually starts failing (far cheaper than buying an new UPS). Personally, though... I run my desktop and my networking equipment off of their CP1200AVR (about $125 new these days, I think I picked mine up on close-out from Best Buy five years ago for $60 a pop), and just have my desktop on a two minute shutdown timer when running on battery. The great advantage to a quality UPS in your computer hardware and network mix is longer lasting and happier electronics, as they're no longer being exposed to brownouts and line surges which can damage them, resulting in far longer service times (barring cheap capacitor or mechanical failure). I've been in IT for a decade and a half, and any desktop I've built for folks in that time has had the non-negotiable of them budgeting some of their money for a quality UPS, and I know that decision has paid off in spades for a few of my clients who have had lightning strikes and no damaged computer equipment... the UPS might have snuffed it, but better a $100 part than a $500+ machine loaded with data they don't regularly back up. Just don't plug your printers into the battery back-up end, especially laser printers - that's some bad juju.

As to your last comment regarding this quote:

Quote
Imagine if we had today's household income (double salaries) with an expense sheet from 1960 (even with adjustments for inflation)?  No wonder they were better savers than us.

Absolutely agreed... but I think the Notorious B.I.G. most eloquently summed up the problem regarding most people and their income: Mo' money, mo' problems. It goes right back to hedonic adaptation; people get used to whatever their new normal is.

Daley

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Re: Cable, Internet, Home & Cell Phones... redone MMM-style!
« Reply #19 on: December 05, 2012, 08:33:37 AM »
How is earthlink for service?  I have comcast's lowest available service in my area right now (39.95 for 3mbps), but it comes out to $47/mo after modem rental fee (agh, I keep meaning to get my own modem, but maybe I'm better off just ditching the cable internet for something else).  In my area, it looks like it's either earthlink dial-up with 56kbps, which I'm not sure would work for my vpn connection (I work at home 2 days a week) or satellite for $59/mo.  Any other good options aside from comcast?

Also, I currently have t-mobile's $30/mo plan.  I use about 1000 minutes/text combined per month and no data, so I wonder if I could get something cheaper.  I'm concerned that if I switched to pay as you go that it might end up costing more than the $30/mo plan.  I don't have a home phone, but I do use google voice when I have to log on at home for conference calls etc., thanks to some tips from this forum.

That's really my total telecom bill, though, at $77/mo - much decreased from pre-mmm days.  Not bad, but still looking to decrease further if possible.

Earthlink is actually just reselling services provided in areas for the most part these days. The service quality with them over cable is going to be identical to the TWC or Comcast offering. I think Earthlink's satellite service is a rebranding of HughesNet, and honestly, satellite broadband is absolutely overpriced and terrible no matter how you slice it, and should be avoided at all cost unless you live in deep dark Appalachia and is literally the only internet option available to you. This goes for Wild Blue as well. Dial-up is also gotten pretty rough to navigate these days as well due to average page sizes exceeding 1MB these days, and combined with some phone lines dealing with digital voice compression now, more and more areas are getting data services throttled down to a 28.8kbps cap due to the home phone lines being "optimized" for voice service. You'd literally be better served with a wireless data package if there's no DSL options and you won't stay with Comcast, even if it's hideous expensive. Buy a modem, though... they're pretty cheap, and even a Motorola DOCSIS 3 model would break even at around 10-12 months it looks like. Check the guide for recommendations.

As for your T-Mo bill, short of scaling back your usage drastically using VoIP service at home and SMS message replacements like Kik or Google Voice, you're running about as cheap as you're going to get for that usage level with talk and text.
« Last Edit: December 05, 2012, 08:35:19 AM by I.P. Daley »

Ottawa

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Tennis Maniac

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Re: Cable, Internet, Home & Cell Phones... redone MMM-style!
« Reply #21 on: December 06, 2012, 12:02:47 PM »
@startingfromthestart
Love the savings!!  Isn't it insane now to think about paying $270 for cable and cell phone... yet we were living it for years!

For OTA, I found that different antennas made a huge difference...
This site will tell you how far from the source signal you are and what type of antenna you need:
      http://www.antennaweb.org/Address.aspx
This is the antenna I have (mounted in my attic, 20+ miles from the transmission towers):
      http://www.amazon.com/RCA-ANT751R-Outdoor-Optimized-Reception/dp/B0024R4B5C/
If you already have a mount on your roof and a cable run, it might be worth $40 to try it out (use a Discover Card on Amazon for free 1 day shipping!).  I had another antenna that was getting me 1 grainy channel... with this one I get 25+ perfect channels.
Obviously, for such a small savings (probably <$10/month), OTA TV might not be your priority to focus on, but might be a quick fix for 1 monthly bill.

Good luck and congrats to you too!

Tennis Maniac

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Re: Cable, Internet, Home & Cell Phones... redone MMM-style!
« Reply #22 on: December 06, 2012, 12:23:00 PM »
@jrhampt
At $77/month for Internet/Cell Phone, It looks like you are fairly streamlined.

Some of this is rehashing @I.P.Daley's comments, but...

I use Earthlink Broadband (10Mbps; I typically see 9.8+Mbps downloads), which is delivered to my house over the Time Warner cable wires (same wires that deliver expensive Road Runner service).  Earthlink uses my existing TW internet modem, but with Earthlink i don't have to pay the $4/month modem rental fee (bonus!).  I pay Earthlink $29.95/month (no taxes or fees); in 6 months that will go up to their normal rate of $41.95.
People on Road Runner in my area were able to buy refurbished or used modems for <$30 to replace their $4/month rental from TW.

The AirVoice cell plan I have (per MMM article) is pay-as-you go, so if you use up the $10, you just buy more.  If you don't use it, it expires after 30 days.  So it is the equivalent of $10/month if you don't use it all.  1000 minutes/texts wouldn't be cost effective on this plan.  The AirVoice "Unlimited" Voice/Text is the same $30 that you are already paying, so it wouldn't be worth it alone.  AirVoice does offer the option of carrying a $10 "cash card" which you could use for data if that is something you need (the $10 only expires if you use it up at $0.33/MB, otherwise it rolls over each month when you pay for the next month's $30 unlimited plan).  I keep cellular data off on my phone unless I need/want to use it.  Like MMM, I turned it off as an experiment and didn't notice it was off for a few weeks.  Your results may vary :)

Tennis Maniac

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Re: Cable, Internet, Home & Cell Phones... redone MMM-style!
« Reply #23 on: December 06, 2012, 12:24:21 PM »
@jrhampt
forgot to post the AirVoice link:
      http://www.airvoicewireless.com/BuyAirTime.aspx

Tennis Maniac

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Re: Cable, Internet, Home & Cell Phones... redone MMM-style!
« Reply #24 on: December 06, 2012, 12:35:19 PM »
This is a very apropos article today:
http://business.financialpost.com/2012/12/04/are-tech-habits-eating-into-canadians-retirement-savings/

Unfortunately for everyone else the article only begs the question and falls short on providing any solutions.  Luckily we all stumbled into MMM-land and have a community to help solve these issues!

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UPDATE:

Quote
Awesome!  Here is what I was able to do in Urban Canada (all prices included tax and are per month):

Previously
Cable TV (Rogers) - $85.60
Cell Phone* (Wind Mobile Unlimited Data and North America long distance) - $45.20**
Home Phone (Rogers - 6Mbps with ) - $42.15
Internet (Rogers) - $41.12
TOTAL = $214.07

Currently
TV - $9.03 (Netflix) - (using 2nd hand Boxee Box one time cost - $120)
Cell Phone (Wind Mobile Unlimited Data and North America long distance) - $45.20** 
Home Phone (TekTalk - unlimited North America and all kinds of cool gadgets) - $28.19
Internet (TekSavvy - 18Mbps with 300GB cap) - $45.14
TOTAL = $127.56

Savings since MMM = $86.51 (OR $15,312 over 10 years equivalent)
* Our family has only one cellphone as we are rarely if ever both away from our work or home.  Thus, whoever is away takes the phone.
** We are doing some trialling currently to see if we can drop down to Pay as you go.  This would be a massive reduction in monthly cost...probably $40.


Currently
TV - $7.99 (Netflix) - (using 2nd hand Boxee Box one time cost - $120)
Cell Phone (Wind Mobile Unlimited Data and North America long distance) - $32.77
Home Phone (TekTalk - unlimited North America and all kinds of cool gadgets) - $28.19
Internet (TekSavvy - 18Mbps with 300GB cap) - $45.14

TOTAL = $114.09

Savings since MMM = $99.98 per month!!!  (OR $17,696 over 10 years equivalent)

* Our family has only one cellphone as we are rarely if ever both away from our work or home.  Thus, whoever is away takes the phone.

Ottawa

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Oh and one more thing I posted just now (FOR NON-AMERICANS only!) in this thread: https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/throw-down-the-gauntlet/break-up-with-cable/

Here is a Copy/Paste of the post:

Quote
This might be breaking news for some folks...but...there is a way in CANADA (and I believe other NON-USA countries) to LEGALLY get HULU and US NETFLIX for free! 

Hulu is free, Netflix of course costs you $7.99 including tax per month in Canada.

Just grab the Chrome or Firefox internet browser, and add on the appropriate extension "Media Hint" here:

Media Hint for Chrome:
https://mediahint.com/install_chrome.html

Media Hint for Firefox
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-us/firefox/addon/media-hint/

unplugged

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I love this thread! I think with the guide I.P made I might be able to try this. I'm totally lost but plan to reread the guide over and over until I understand it. My phone and di*rect tv contracts don't end for a long while but I can prep in the meantime :)  Thanks for sharing this post OP and for IP for the guide!

Daley

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I love this thread! I think with the guide I.P made I might be able to try this. I'm totally lost but plan to reread the guide over and over until I understand it. My phone and di*rect tv contracts don't end for a long while but I can prep in the meantime :)  Thanks for sharing this post OP and for IP for the guide!

The guide needs a bit of reorganization, I know. In the mean time, don't be afraid to ask questions if you get stumped. :)

Tennis Maniac

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Update
Been saving almost $300 per month for 6 months and I haven't had any major issues. A few more dropped calls, but some interesting conversations with disbelievers.  I do love seeing my bills every month.
As a bonus I found out that AirVoice wireless rolls over your balance each month, so right now my wife and I have $30-$40 balances on our $10/month cellphone plans; enough for luxurious data usage if we need it on vacation some time.

@unplugged... You can always flex your MMM muscles by putting your directv box in the closet and turning off cellular data on your smart phone.  You will be amazed how many places have free wifi and how many quality shows you can get over the air and on netflix or Hulu.  Those two pieces of your entertainment budget are probably costing you $150-$250 per month right now.  "Unlimited data" and paying $100+ per month for TV are causing people to fork over more money per month than they probably pay on their mortgage principle... Yikes!  If you are over 35, you likely didn't have either of these things as a kid and were probably happier in life.  If you are near an over the air HDTV broadcast site, you can probably get a cheap antenna for Walmart and set next to your tv; if not, like myself, you'll have to install an antenna in your attic or on your roof.  RCA has been the best brand I've found.
Good luck!!

unplugged

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Thanks for your help. I have winds!@#$ DSL and it wont stream sadly. Just too slow. I pay $40 for a "green line" that's dsl only, no home phone service. I live in the boonies and we are too far away from anything to get a signal. We built and bought many antennas and poles and there are just too many mountains, trees, and miles from anything. So streaming and antennas are a fail. I'm a bit of a homebody but have to go a bit to get 3 kids around. I admit that my cheap direct tv plan right now is worth the haggled down price. Gas keeps going up and when I had no streaming, no antenna, and no direct tv, my gas bill went up. I think I got bored LOL. Reading free books and library videos was just too sedentary for me.

I think my bigger goal here would be cell phones for 3 (husbands is free from work). 2 kids text a bit. Daughter and I have smart phones but we turn off cellular data (but still have to pay, it's mandatory to have a smart phone with ATT). I did not know you could even turn off data until reading that here. Son has freebie cheap phone with just txting at around $23, daughter I believe is around $43 due to the mandatory data plan. Then my part is the main plan so I pay a lot more as being the main account holder.

Until we can get Wind$%&* some competition in rural areas that likely will remain at around $40 per month. I think I have haggled Direct TV down to $40-50 (have not got my new bill yet). Though I read here yesterday something about a cheaper plan that's not advertised, gotta go find that. By my cell bills is where I see real potential. I'm am extremely confused on the cell options I read here and need to try to understand that before I make a change.  I did not know there was life after ATT hahahhaha.

Tennis Maniac

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@unplugged
Too bad that you can't get OTA TV or netflix.  I agree that having no TV would be too sedentary, especially with two kids.
It sounds like you are paying around $175/month to AT&T. That is exactly what I was paying for 2 smartphones and 1 cheapie phone.  Good news... if you truly don't need data on your phones you stand to save big!  I switched to AirVoice wireless and for $10/month/per phone get 500 texts OR 250 minutes or a combination of the two.  If you use up the minutes/texts before the month is up you just pay for the next 30 days sooner, so you don't really spend that much more; if you don't use up your $10 during the 30 days, it rolls to the next 30 days.  You can use you $10 for data, but it is fairly expensive ($0.30/MB), but at least it is available if you need it (I haven't used cellular data in 5 months, so I can't comment on why you would "need" it)

You say you don't have home phone service. Do you use your cell phones at home a lot?  It may be cost effective to get a home phone and not use cell phones at home.

Suggestions:
-First, see if you can get the 3 cell phones you pay for onto your husband's plan. This is what MMM was doing before they had to pay for all their cell phones. His wife's employer paid her part of the bill and MMM paid for his extra part, around $15.
-Look into AirVoice Wireless (AT&T reseller, featured in MMM's $10 cell phone plan article) plans and see if they will meet yours and your kids' needs. Call and ask them if they support your phones (they support iPhones, not sure about others) and look at their service in your area. If you are roaming off of AT&T a lot you may not be able to use AirVoice.
-Call AT&T and ask them to unlock your phones; don't explain what you are doing, if they ask tell them you plan on traveling.  This is not required for using AirVoice but will ensure you can use your smart phones on other carriers if you decide to in the future.
- Find out how long your current contracts with AT&T are for.  Mine was not up for 1 year, but I paid the early termination fee ($195 for me) to get out of my contract.  I made that back in the first 2 months after the switch. My wife's phone was past the end of her contract so there wasn't any fees for switching.

AirVoice annoyance:
You have to manually log into their website every 30 days. Not really that big a deal as it reminds you that you are saving $150/month.

If you post more details about your current phones and plans and usage we can help you run the numbers.  Either way if you are only using minutes and texts I can almost garauntee you can save a lot by using AirVoice.  Even if you are buying $10 of airtime every two weeks instead of every 30 days, it's still only $20/month/phone, far below your current plan expense.

Good luck.

unplugged

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Tennis, thanks SO much!

 Wind$%^&* adds fees and taxes that make a basic home line pricey. I currently pay $40 for the green dsl but can receive calls for free. Just can't dial out. I use cell phone for all calls out and they are short. I have literally thousands of roll over minutes from the last 13 years.

We can't get on husbands cell phone plan.

I think my cell phone bill is $140 but I need to get new bill to be sure. Daughter replaced her 5 year old iphone at Christmas so that may have changed things.

I wanted to mention too that our youngest/last/3rd child is 8. Eventually she will get a phone but I assume that's a few + years away.

We stay in the ATT area. I don't believe I have ever roamed?

Just to be clear our Iphone 4 and Iphone 5 will still work with Airvoice? We love our phones we just don't really use them the way they were intended. When daughter is home using wifi on the iphone, will the phone try to connect to Airvoice and use up all my data with them? If we turn off our cellular data is also turns off wifi access?!

I am so excited that I might be able to do this. The only other issue I see is that sons contract long expired, think I have a year on mine, and likely 2 years on daughters. The last daughter would start fresh later and have to acquire a phone somehow?



KC

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@ottawa

Have you been happy with the TekSavvy Internet service? I had never heard of them until I read your post but realize I could be saving about 20$/month if I switched. I feel like there must be a catch.

Daley

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Wind$%^&* adds fees and taxes that make a basic home line pricey. I currently pay $40 for the green dsl but can receive calls for free. Just can't dial out. I use cell phone for all calls out and they are short. I have literally thousands of roll over minutes from the last 13 years.

I don't recommend them often for reasons I've made clear, but you would actually be an excellent candidate for Google Voice for the home line as the service primarily utilizes ringback to initiate calls through the website. This would let you make outgoing calls on your incoming only phone line for the price of privacy invasion from the Googleplex.

I think my cell phone bill is $140 but I need to get new bill to be sure. Daughter replaced her 5 year old iphone at Christmas so that may have changed things.

Yeah, that shiny new iBrick is really gonna ramp costs up to disconnect. Airvoice is one option for retreating to, but if T-Mobile coverage is good in your area, Platinumtel is another excellent option, and superior to Airvoice in a couple ways with their Real Paygo option.

I wanted to mention too that our youngest/last/3rd child is 8. Eventually she will get a phone but I assume that's a few + years away.

I don't mean this as a criticism or mean to offend with your parenting as I don't know circumstances and situations, but kids and teenagers don't need cell phones... they want cell phones. With the prices of services like Platinumtel and Airvoice, if they want 'em, they can pay for it themselves, especially if they're working... handsets and all. Helps teach them some financial discipline and budgeting. Speaking of handsets, that new iPhone your daughter got? If it's the iPhone 5, that thing costs $600 unsubsidized... expect to pay that amount in total between the up-front and the ETF once you're done, and you can't even replace the battery yourself. This is one of the many reasons why I'm not keen on the things.

We stay in the ATT area. I don't believe I have ever roamed?

Your AT&T coverage map is probably fine, which means Airvoice coverage would be fine. It'll still be worth your time to shop around and take a look at T-Mobile coverage for providers like Platinumtel and GoSmart, though.

Just to be clear our Iphone 4 and Iphone 5 will still work with Airvoice? We love our phones we just don't really use them the way they were intended. When daughter is home using wifi on the iphone, will the phone try to connect to Airvoice and use up all my data with them? If we turn off our cellular data is also turns off wifi access?!

Yes they will, but you'll have to reprogram the data APN to get data and MMS to work. Ideally you want to pay off the ETFs and get them carrier unlocked before you go elsewhere. If you're on a WiFi data connection, it won't use 3G data. As you already are aware, you can even switch off 3G data on the handset entirely. Barring that, if the need for "unlimited" is even required, Airvoice has a $30 talk and text only option. You can't use data on a prepaid plan if there is no data to use. WiFi is not a cellular connection... to keep it simple, WiFi is a local wireless area network standard that can be used for sharing internet access off of your home connection.

I am so excited that I might be able to do this. The only other issue I see is that sons contract long expired, think I have a year on mine, and likely 2 years on daughters. The last daughter would start fresh later and have to acquire a phone somehow?

Buying out those iPhone contracts are going to be hefty, but that's the price of going under contract and wanting out for more reasonably priced services. Links to calculating that stuff are posted in the other thread here.

As for the last part, yes, but used and refurbished handsets are plentiful for reasonable prices. When you go prepaid, you're on your own for purchasing unsubsidized handsets. This means no more "free" or "cheap" high-end Apple smartphones. However, keep in mind that with the money saved in some instances, the savings are so dramatic, they could technically buy a brand new iPhone outright every two years and still have saved a little over the contract and postpaid service. It of course raises the question if whether you should spend $600 on a fargin' cell phone in the first place when there's perfectly serviceable options in the sub $100 market, but that's for another discussion.

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@ottawa

Have you been happy with the TekSavvy Internet service? I had never heard of them until I read your post but realize I could be saving about 20$/month if I switched. I feel like there must be a catch.

Hey KC - I haven't even thought about my internet service in the last 4 or so months I've had it...which means - I've been totally pleased with the service.  I have consistently achieved advertised speeds and have no problem running my phone, internet and HD netflix simultaneously.  I bought their router (you don't have to - you could actually buy it new or second hand elsewhere - their price was very competitive) - from the forums it seems alot of the unhappy people have tried to use incompatible routers...I also hear that teksavvy doesn't monitor useage.  So, if you go over the cap they wouldn't know.  Officially, they say if you go over the cap - worst case scenario for that month is that they'd charge you the unlimited plan (I think it is $54).

swiper

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I switched over from Videotron to TekSavvy after I got tired of Videotron's ridiculous data caps.

+ They seem to care about net neutrality, customer privacy etc
+ More competent tech support
+ Competitive rates with less emphasis on data caps.
+ Clear pricing (no stupid 50% for 3 months bs, no rental equipment etc)

@ottawa, well done!  I'm in the process of switching to petro-canada pay-as-you-go plan. Ditching mobilicity and their "unlimited" plans.

 


Ottawa

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Re: Cable, Internet, Home & Cell Phones... redone MMM-style!
« Reply #37 on: January 26, 2014, 05:53:11 AM »
Awesome!  Here is what I was able to do in Urban Canada (all prices included tax and are per month):

Previously
Cable TV (Rogers) - $85.60
Cell Phone* (Wind Mobile Unlimited Data and North America long distance) - $45.20**
Home Phone (Rogers - 6Mbps with ) - $42.15
Internet (Rogers) - $41.12
TOTAL = $214.07

Currently
TV - $9.03 (Netflix) - (using 2nd hand Boxee Box one time cost - $120)
Cell Phone (Wind Mobile Unlimited Data and North America long distance) - $45.20** 
Home Phone (TekTalk - unlimited North America and all kinds of cool gadgets) - $28.19
Internet (TekSavvy - 18Mbps with 300GB cap) - $45.14
TOTAL = $127.56

Savings since MMM = $86.51 (OR $15,312 over 10 years equivalent)
* Our family has only one cellphone as we are rarely if ever both away from our work or home.  Thus, whoever is away takes the phone.
** We are doing some trialling currently to see if we can drop down to Pay as you go.  This would be a massive reduction in monthly cost...probably $40.

Update!
TV - $7.99 (Netflix)
Cell Phone (Wind Mobile Pay Before) - $6.66*** 
Home Phone (TekTalk - unlimited North America and all kinds of cool gadgets) - $25.93
Internet (TekSavvy - 18Mbps with 300GB cap) - $47.40 (price increase)

Total = $87.98

*** - $40 every 6 months, or $80 per year.  This is the minimum...I don't think we'll exceed it.

Grateful Stache

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Re: Cable, Internet, Home & Cell Phones... redone MMM-style!
« Reply #38 on: January 26, 2014, 10:03:02 AM »

Tennis Maniac... you just quite literally brought a tear of joy to my eye. It's results like this that drove me to authoring that guide and keep me going. Thank you for sharing this. :)


Another Airvoice convert over here, thanks to you Daley.

Currently on the $40/month unlimited, but switching to the $30/month if I can. Not sure if I'm ready for the 'pay as you go' yet, but I'm loving the savings already.

Thanks SO MUCH for your helpful advice!

Cheers.

Tennis Maniac

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Update
TV (netflix + OTA) $7.99
Cellphone (AirVoice 2 phones) $6.66 *
Home phone (google voice) free
Internet - (EarthLink) $34.95

Total - $49.60

* just switched to $10 for 90 days plan.  My wife and I have had cellular data turned off for over a year and haven't noticed.  Also haven't used that many minutes since we use VoIP most of the time, even from our cellphones.

I'm not sure there is much more squeezing we can do here. Ha!  :)

Tennis Maniac

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@Ottawa
Between the two of us we are saving $413 per month.
That is the equivalent of $4,956 per year we can add to our stache and $123,900 in stache that we don't need in retirement.  Damn.  Expenses add up quick.

LibrarIan

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I'll just throw in my two cents.

Internet (10mbps): $34.98
Phone*: $31.80
Xbox Live: $5.00 (I game on here lots and watch Netflix free courtesy of my sister who owes me lots of $$)

Total: 71.96/month or 863.52/year.

* I have a Samsung Galaxy S3 that my dad gave me. I use T-Mobile Prepaid which gets me 500 MB data, 100 talk min. and unlimited text. This device is apparently not supported by AirVoice (according to their site) since it's not a GSM device. I wish I could get in on that.

Daley

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* I have a Samsung Galaxy S3 that my dad gave me. I use T-Mobile Prepaid which gets me 500 MB data, 100 talk min. and unlimited text. This device is apparently not supported by AirVoice (according to their site) since it's not a GSM device. I wish I could get in on that.

If you can use T-Mobile, you can use Airvoice. They're both GSM providers (Airvoice uses the AT&T network, which is the only other major GSM provider in the USA outside of T-Mobile, and T-Mobile pentaband phones are 100% compatible with the AT&T voice and data bands). However, you will need to get the phone carrier unlocked from T-Mobile first.

LibrarIan

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If you can use T-Mobile, you can use Airvoice. They're both GSM providers (Airvoice uses the AT&T network, which is the only other major GSM provider in the USA outside of T-Mobile, and T-Mobile pentaband phones are 100% compatible with the AT&T voice and data bands). However, you will need to get the phone carrier unlocked from T-Mobile first.

I just dug through the options in my phone and it is GSM compatible (right now it is set to Global). I can choose between LTE/CDMA, GSM/UMTS and Global.

Here's the thing: This phone was originally used on a Verizon network. I did not buy it from T-Mobile. I rigged it onto to their prepaid network by simply buying one of their SIM cards and setting up the plan on their site. Their phone support told me they don't support Galaxy S3s on prepaid so I had to work around that by just not telling them I was doing this. So I guess the phone has never been 'unlocked' (whatever that means). Do you think since I was able to swap so easily from Verizon to T-Mobile that I can just hop on over to AirVoice? I doubt T-Mobile would be willing to mess with unlocking my phone (if that's needed) since I didn't buy it from them.

Daley

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Do you think since I was able to swap so easily from Verizon to T-Mobile that I can just hop on over to AirVoice?

Here's the deal with Verizon LTE devices: due to FCC regulations put in place on the spectrum purchase that Verizon made for their LTE network (which is a SIM card/GSM compatible network), they are technically required to leave the SIM slot carrier unlocked. This means that the very technology on the handset that prevents you from taking your Verizon LTE handset to a Verizon MVNO like PagePlus, should let you take it to any GSM provider you like, including T-Mobile, AT&T, Airvoice Wireless, P'tel, and Spot Mobile so long as the model handset has support for GSM 850/1900 bands (which yours apparently does if it's working on T-Mobile without issue or hacking).

I'd research what software updates might due to it, but otherwise? I think it might be safe to suggest you try and switch away!
« Last Edit: January 27, 2014, 04:18:28 PM by I.P. Daley »

Ottawa

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@Ottawa
Between the two of us we are saving $413 per month.
That is the equivalent of $4,956 per year we can add to our stache and $123,900 in stache that we don't need in retirement.  Damn.  Expenses add up quick.

Wow!  Imagine this times all the Mustachians (and other cable cutters)....that's a lot of lost 'stash for the cable/satellite companies...  which brings me no end of joy :-)

 

Wow, a phone plan for fifteen bucks!