Author Topic: Vinyl Flooring - Tenant Options?  (Read 8116 times)

oldschool33

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Vinyl Flooring - Tenant Options?
« on: July 14, 2013, 05:52:29 PM »
I have a tenant the damaged  (2 X 1 ft) areas of the vinyl flooring within my condo.  The damage is pretty noticeable.  The tenant  is moving out of my 10 year old condo in the next couple of months.  The vinyl flooring is ten years old as well, installed when the unit was built.  Tenant was only in the unit for 2 years.  I have read online that I can only depreciate the vinyl flooring over 7 years, anything beyond is $0. 

Fellow MMMs, what are my real options?  A new floor is $1K. 

Thanks,
Oldschool33

Kazimieras

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Re: Vinyl Flooring - Tenant Options?
« Reply #1 on: July 16, 2013, 10:59:39 AM »
If it came in the initial build you typically can't depreciate it, as it is considered part of the unit. If you were to lay down new flooring, you would be allowed to depreciate that over a period of several years (as a capital expenditure)

Another Reader

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Re: Vinyl Flooring - Tenant Options?
« Reply #2 on: July 16, 2013, 06:41:42 PM »
The depreciation is less relevant than what you are going to do to get the place rented.  Vinyl is typically glued to a particle board subfloor which is laid over the real subfloor.  It's expensive to pull up.  Often you can lay another layer of vinyl over the existing floor if the surface is level and smooth.  If it's glued to slab, a second floor layer is easiest.  You may be able to lay a floating laminate floor over the vinyl if you like that better.

dragoncar

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Re: Vinyl Flooring - Tenant Options?
« Reply #3 on: July 16, 2013, 06:58:10 PM »
I'm no tax expert, but can't you deduct the expense of fixing damage?  That's not wear and tear (depreciation).

Edit:  what about security deposit?  Insurance?
« Last Edit: July 16, 2013, 07:00:49 PM by dragoncar »

oldschool33

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Re: Vinyl Flooring - Tenant Options?
« Reply #4 on: July 17, 2013, 04:54:46 AM »
I have a security deposit of $1,800, how much to take?

Micheal

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Re: Vinyl Flooring - Tenant Options?
« Reply #5 on: July 17, 2013, 05:55:27 AM »
Depends on how much its going to cost you.  If a new floor is going to cost you 1k in materials+labor, charge it that way.  If you can get it cheaper do it and take that out and return the rest.  That's the purpose of a security deposit, that and lost rent over the eviction period.  But check the lease you had them sign carefully before doing anything.

DocCyane

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Re: Vinyl Flooring - Tenant Options?
« Reply #6 on: July 17, 2013, 06:32:20 AM »
I have a security deposit of $1,800, how much to take?

How about nothing? Your floor lasted 10 years and that sounds like normal wear and tear. Why should the renter be liable?

This is why I rent from large companies instead of individuals. Companies build in a logical repair and replace budget into the rent. Individuals think it's the "fault" of the last tenant that the 20 year old toilet needs replacing or the 8 year old carpet is beyond a quick cleaning.

dragoncar

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Re: Vinyl Flooring - Tenant Options?
« Reply #7 on: July 17, 2013, 09:39:52 AM »
I have a security deposit of $1,800, how much to take?

How about nothing? Your floor lasted 10 years and that sounds like normal wear and tear. Why should the renter be liable?

This is why I rent from large companies instead of individuals. Companies build in a logical repair and replace budget into the rent. Individuals think it's the "fault" of the last tenant that the 20 year old toilet needs replacing or the 8 year old carpet is beyond a quick cleaning.

Hm it sounded to me like the "damage" was not simply wear and tear.  It's also not clear if the floor has been fully depreciated.  As described, I thought it hadn't been.  If already fully depreciated in taxes, then yeah I guess it should just be replaced at owner's expense.  If not, consider deducting the repair cost, or the remaining undepreciated floor value.

daverobev

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Re: Vinyl Flooring - Tenant Options?
« Reply #8 on: July 17, 2013, 09:44:14 AM »
I have a security deposit of $1,800, how much to take?

How about nothing? Your floor lasted 10 years and that sounds like normal wear and tear. Why should the renter be liable?

This is why I rent from large companies instead of individuals. Companies build in a logical repair and replace budget into the rent. Individuals think it's the "fault" of the last tenant that the 20 year old toilet needs replacing or the 8 year old carpet is beyond a quick cleaning.

Um, read the OP? Poster said the 2-year tenant visibly damaged an area of the flooring. That's different from wear and tear.

If the floor was previously in 'perfectly good' condition and NOT in any way in need of replacement, I'd say then yes, they are at least *partially* liable.

Obviously if they were otherwise good tenants, a $1000 floor isn't so bad. I'd *personally* go for $300 max, which you can explain to them - IF it is totally clear that they wrecked an otherwise perfectly fine floor!

Micheal

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Re: Vinyl Flooring - Tenant Options?
« Reply #9 on: July 17, 2013, 12:06:40 PM »
I am a renter have been for a long time, but I usually replace or repair thing myself after talking with a landlord and have only ever paid 1 security deposit we had to fight to get back, who charges 2k for a lightbulb then sends you an invoice for it?

DocCyane

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Re: Vinyl Flooring - Tenant Options?
« Reply #10 on: July 17, 2013, 01:56:48 PM »
I have a security deposit of $1,800, how much to take?

How about nothing? Your floor lasted 10 years and that sounds like normal wear and tear. Why should the renter be liable?

This is why I rent from large companies instead of individuals. Companies build in a logical repair and replace budget into the rent. Individuals think it's the "fault" of the last tenant that the 20 year old toilet needs replacing or the 8 year old carpet is beyond a quick cleaning.

Um, read the OP? Poster said the 2-year tenant visibly damaged an area of the flooring. That's different from wear and tear.

If the floor was previously in 'perfectly good' condition and NOT in any way in need of replacement, I'd say then yes, they are at least *partially* liable.

Wear and tear isn't always gradual. I'm thinking of the recently replaced bathroom floor where I work. I don't think the ladies were spending their 2-minute potty breaks tearing at the floor. Instead, over the past decade, the flooring weakened, the adhesive failed and the seams separated. The last person who used the facilities wasn't at fault.

But this will be an issue of sides -- those who are renting versus those who are landlords.

Individual landlords see their properties as passive income streams.

Instead, they should see them as businesses that require maintenance and upkeep, and major investments from time to time. They should put aside money for normal wear and tear, knowing floors don't last forever. Upkeep expenses are forecast and fixed into the rent price, amortized over years, not dumped on the last poor soul who rented.

But as I've said, this is why I rent from companies, not people.


ncornilsen

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Re: Vinyl Flooring - Tenant Options?
« Reply #11 on: July 17, 2013, 04:44:45 PM »
Doc, noone is advocating saddling the last tenant with the responsibility for all the wear and tear the floor saw over the years. If it was 80% worn out when this tenant moved in, and now is 100% worn out... then yes, it's a wear and tear thing. If the floor was 3% worn when the tenant moved in, and is now damaged to the point of requiring replacement... then, in my mind, the tenant IS responsible for a good portion of it. Maybe 100% of repair costs, or 85% of replacement costs. 

For example, I rent rooms out to two tenants. One tenant has lived in a room for two years. I do semi-annual inspections to make sure nothing's going wrong, check weatherstripping, etc.  There are minor scratches and dings in the floor. This is wear and tear, and he'll get his deposit back. (Except for the $50 for a drunken friend punching a hole in my drywall and refusing to pay to repair it.)

I had another tenant. He's been in the room 6 months. When he left, there was gouges and dents in the floor from dropping things all the time. The rental agreement spells out that ALL chairs shall either be on a rug, OR shall have (provided by me) pads on the feet.  He chose to remove the rug I gave him, and proceeded to grind a 1/8" deep groove in the floor where he slid his chair back and forth from his PC. that is NOT reasonable wear and tear. It cost me nearly $500 to repair all of this.That amount came out of his deposit. He took me to court and lost, so the court agreed as well.

Point is, I see my rental rooms as a business, and set aside about ~15% for repairs and contributions to the maintenance fund, but tenants can and DO damage houses beyond reasonable wear and tear.
« Last Edit: July 17, 2013, 05:00:29 PM by ncornilsen »

Another Reader

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Re: Vinyl Flooring - Tenant Options?
« Reply #12 on: July 17, 2013, 05:24:14 PM »
Different states and municipalities have different laws, so you should check to see what the rules are where the condo is.  Some jurisdictions use a straight line depreciation for calculating the value of the damage.  For example, if the floor has an anticipated life of 10 years and the tenant destroys it at the end of 8 years, you can deduct 100 percent of the remaining 20 percent of the life at current replacement cost.  However, if the "damage" can reasonably be construed as normal wear and tear, you are likely responsible.  You may have a local landlord association or an investors' association that can give you more information pertinent to your jurisdiction.  Some of this may be a matter of case law rather than statute or ordinance, which is why these associations can be very helpful.

Micheal

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Re: Vinyl Flooring - Tenant Options?
« Reply #13 on: July 17, 2013, 10:20:09 PM »
Going back to the question, talk to the tenant and let him know whats up if it was an amicable parting.  IMHO this should always be the first avenue of action especially if he was s good renter for 2 years.