Author Topic: Sell and rent dilemma  (Read 2387 times)

jeromedawg

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Sell and rent dilemma
« on: July 11, 2020, 12:42:58 PM »
Hey all,

Kind of in a pickle after getting independent assessments from multiple realtors that *now* is a better time than ever to try to sell if we were considering doing so. We are trying to move into a different area for my kids' schooling (some of you have probably seen my others posts and are familiar with this situation) which we need to do by Feb 2021. The realtors were all basically saying that right now, at least in the Orange County area of SoCal, the market is pretty hot and homes are selling quickly in many areas often above asking. There's an uncertainty of what things will look like with the upcoming elections as well as next year in general. Our initial plan was to move out and rent a unit in the new area, then prep/stage/list our place ASAP. The rental we were looking at fell through because the landlords were being extremely unreasonable with certain contract terms they were imposing on us as our responsibility (rather than the landlord's) which was a big red flag and not worth the potential headache of dealing with for a year.

What is your guys' take on the market for selling at least in the next couple months? I'm not sure how it is in other parts of the country but inventory seems to be moving pretty fast down here. The consensus, from what I've heard between realtors in my area, is that historically home sales have slowed down quite a bit within 60 days of the election and they would expect/anticipate similarly this year. So ideally we'd want to beat that time frame if possible. As far as home sales slowing, I guess what I'm worried about is the home taking a longer time to sell AND having to accept a lower amount on it (I'm not privy to the idea of someone else getting a "deal" on our home if we can avoid that). The unit is entry-level so that's a factor but all the realtors we've spoken with think that our place needs minimal work because we've kept it so clean. If we were to list it now they are confident in getting a pretty quick sale and with a good return back.

If we miss this 'period' the realtors seemed to indicate that Spring time would be the next best time to sell but the caveat is that we don't know how 2021 will look as far as the economy, etc. So it's sort of a gamble to play the waiting game it sounds like.

I guess the other option is that we could just deal with all the prep (which is painting, carpet cleaning and deep cleaning), staging and then listing it with a 360 Virtual Tour and private showings *while* living here which would be stressful. Then if we sell and still haven't found a place to rent by then we'll be in an even tighter situation.


In any case, I'm not clear what direction to consider at the moment. It's pretty overwhelming and rental inventory seems low in the area we want to move. If there are any units, either the landlords are unreasonable or they're asking for an unreasonable amount of rent for the size and condition of the unit.

Our ultimate goal is to buy a new place in the area - renting would afford us the most flexibility but I suppose if we were to prep/stage/list while living here, we could try to make a contingent offer on a new place (assuming we can find one we like) and try to arrange the close dates to coincide with one another for a smooth move-out/move-in transition
« Last Edit: July 11, 2020, 12:47:38 PM by jeromedawg »

srad

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #1 on: July 16, 2020, 10:48:58 AM »
A couple of things i notice here.  First off, moving sucks...  So i like to keep it to a minimum.  If you are familiar with the area and you plan to live there for a long time, i'd personally would search for a home to buy.  I would not want to rent a place for a year then move again into a home.  You have a drop dead date of Feb21 that's coming up fast.  If you want to buy or rent, you need to decide which way you are going and go full steam ahead on it.

Right now, with mortgage rates hitting a new all time low, so its a great time to sell, there's a lack of inventory and lots of buyers still left.  If you place is move in ready and priced right, there should be no problem selling it.  Again, with the lack of inventory that's your next problem, what are you going to buy?

For timing, i've never bought or sold based on who's entering or leaving the office, i buy when i find a place to buy and sell when its time to sell.  Spring and summer are the best times due to most buyers but a house can and will sell in November. 

Concerned about losing out on some  money?  That's why they say your home is not an asset.  When its time to move (sell) you sell.  Hopefully for more than you bought it for but as we've now seen, home prices don't always go up.

IMO, get your house ready to sell and look hard for a place to buy.  For selling, you may reduce your buying pool if you want to rent back your place for 90 days.  And you may reduce your buying power if you are contingent due to the sale of your house..  You better charm the hell out of the seller to have em pick you.

Good luck

jeromedawg

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #2 on: July 16, 2020, 11:10:43 AM »
A couple of things i notice here.  First off, moving sucks...  So i like to keep it to a minimum.  If you are familiar with the area and you plan to live there for a long time, i'd personally would search for a home to buy.  I would not want to rent a place for a year then move again into a home.  You have a drop dead date of Feb21 that's coming up fast.  If you want to buy or rent, you need to decide which way you are going and go full steam ahead on it.

Right now, with mortgage rates hitting a new all time low, so its a great time to sell, there's a lack of inventory and lots of buyers still left.  If you place is move in ready and priced right, there should be no problem selling it.  Again, with the lack of inventory that's your next problem, what are you going to buy?

For timing, i've never bought or sold based on who's entering or leaving the office, i buy when i find a place to buy and sell when its time to sell.  Spring and summer are the best times due to most buyers but a house can and will sell in November. 

Concerned about losing out on some  money?  That's why they say your home is not an asset.  When its time to move (sell) you sell.  Hopefully for more than you bought it for but as we've now seen, home prices don't always go up.

IMO, get your house ready to sell and look hard for a place to buy.  For selling, you may reduce your buying pool if you want to rent back your place for 90 days.  And you may reduce your buying power if you are contingent due to the sale of your house..  You better charm the hell out of the seller to have em pick you.

Good luck


Seems like there's a dilemma here - obviously selling and buying (rather than renting) is preferred. However, you're also saying that you reduce your buying pool and your buying power if you are looking for rent back and or a contingent sale, respectively. So what option does this leave otherwise? To avoid either of those (renting back or a contingent sale), it seems you are forced to move out and rent somewhere (unless you live near someone willing to house you for 'free' like a family member or relative). So are you suggesting that we just vacate and rent somewhere month-to-month (this can get real expensive real fast and also doesn't solve the problem of having to move twice).

The other thing that complicates all this is that my wife is SAHM and I WFH, so prepping/staging/listing/selling our place is going to be a major PITA with all that in mind. I suppose we could figure *something* out in terms of going out somewhere to work and for the kids to play... I have *no* idea what that would be with COVID, however. On the other hand, if it's just paint, carpet cleaning and deep cleaning, it shouldn't be *too* bad but it still sounds like a PITA regardless.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2020, 11:20:56 AM by jeromedawg »

SailingOnASmallSailboat

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #3 on: July 16, 2020, 11:21:46 AM »
We were ready to list it in March, delayed, and then started worrying about the longer term effects of this on the market (within the next year). Unemployment will likely continue to climb and people will be less able to afford to buy, regardless of the interest rates - this was our thinking. We're wanting to move from this area for good in any case.

Tried selling ourselves with no luck. Listed with a realtor and it went under contract in 3 days, within 98.5% of asking price. The realtor we wound up choosing is in agreement with us that it was now or next spring - and her view of next spring is like ours. Pessimistic.

Our situation is different in that we don't want to stay in this area, do not need to look for a place to live, and don't have small children to consider.

A suggestion to ask yourself is whether you'd be happy staying where you are for the next 2 or 3 years if it does not sell. If you sell quickly, you then are in a stronger position to buy anyway (no "sell my house" contingency). And if you sell quickly you've got a bit more money for rent (though you say landlords are unreasonable or the rent is unreasonable; you might have to adjust your expectations.)

Good luck.

jeromedawg

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #4 on: July 16, 2020, 11:31:14 AM »
We were ready to list it in March, delayed, and then started worrying about the longer term effects of this on the market (within the next year). Unemployment will likely continue to climb and people will be less able to afford to buy, regardless of the interest rates - this was our thinking. We're wanting to move from this area for good in any case.

Tried selling ourselves with no luck. Listed with a realtor and it went under contract in 3 days, within 98.5% of asking price. The realtor we wound up choosing is in agreement with us that it was now or next spring - and her view of next spring is like ours. Pessimistic.

Our situation is different in that we don't want to stay in this area, do not need to look for a place to live, and don't have small children to consider.

A suggestion to ask yourself is whether you'd be happy staying where you are for the next 2 or 3 years if it does not sell. If you sell quickly, you then are in a stronger position to buy anyway (no "sell my house" contingency). And if you sell quickly you've got a bit more money for rent (though you say landlords are unreasonable or the rent is unreasonable; you might have to adjust your expectations.)

Good luck.

Thanks for the feedback. These are my thoughts as well - nobody has a crystal ball obviously but it's not looking good, and while there's a hot streak now it seems like *now* is a better time to sell than not. Did you guys do any sort of updates to your place? Or did you sell "as-is" ? I'm concerned about the desirability with the condition of our walls/paint - its the original white paint from a decade ago along with areas in the walls that show cracks/cracking from settling (some areas that I've patched but not painted yet). It has been suggested multiple times that we paint but my realtor also has contemplated not doing any of that and listing with a 360 virtual tour.  We can pay $2500 + cost of paint to have it repainted but that would mean having to move and rearrange a bunch of furniture while all of us are at home working/watching the kids. Not to mention carpet cleaning and deep cleaning. I'm just not sure how manageable it will all be. I would estimate all of that taking a couple weeks to complete so I suppose we could figure out some sort of "staycation" but the logistics still seem difficult with any of this due to COVID

Two reasons we want to move: 1) schooling for our kids - we have to move by Feb 21, so being "happy" for the next 2-3 years is a moot point 2) I'm already not happy having dealt with the past two upstairs tenants who walk heavily and have toddlers that storm the house - I'm done living in this 1st floor unit and am ready to move.

The current dilemma is trying to find a place to rent... although srad's opinion is that we should avoid doing that for the purpose of having to move twice - I really don't see what other options we have as it seems riskier to try to find a place to buy that coincides with the sale of this place AND where we won't be caught in a situation where we if we haven't found a place to buy and move in that coincides with the close of escrow/sale on the current place, now we are forced to rent somewhere and have to move all of our stuff twice anyway whether it's into storage or to the temporary rental or both.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2020, 11:34:38 AM by jeromedawg »

Villanelle

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #5 on: July 16, 2020, 11:39:02 AM »
We were ready to list it in March, delayed, and then started worrying about the longer term effects of this on the market (within the next year). Unemployment will likely continue to climb and people will be less able to afford to buy, regardless of the interest rates - this was our thinking. We're wanting to move from this area for good in any case.

Tried selling ourselves with no luck. Listed with a realtor and it went under contract in 3 days, within 98.5% of asking price. The realtor we wound up choosing is in agreement with us that it was now or next spring - and her view of next spring is like ours. Pessimistic.

Our situation is different in that we don't want to stay in this area, do not need to look for a place to live, and don't have small children to consider.

A suggestion to ask yourself is whether you'd be happy staying where you are for the next 2 or 3 years if it does not sell. If you sell quickly, you then are in a stronger position to buy anyway (no "sell my house" contingency). And if you sell quickly you've got a bit more money for rent (though you say landlords are unreasonable or the rent is unreasonable; you might have to adjust your expectations.)

Good luck.

Thanks for the feedback. These are my thoughts as well - nobody has a crystal ball obviously but it's not looking good, and while there's a hot streak now it seems like *now* is a better time to sell than not. Did you guys do any sort of updates to your place? Or did you sell "as-is" ? I'm concerned about the desirability with the condition of our walls/paint - its the original white paint from a decade ago along with areas in the walls that show cracks/cracking from settling (some areas that I've patched but not painted yet). It has been suggested multiple times that we paint but my realtor also has contemplated not doing any of that and listing with a 360 virtual tour.  We can pay $2500 + cost of paint to have it repainted but that would mean having to move and rearrange a bunch of furniture while all of us are at home working/watching the kids. Not to mention carpet cleaning and deep cleaning. I'm just not sure how manageable it will all be. I would estimate all of that taking a couple weeks to complete so I suppose we could figure out some sort of "staycation" but the logistics still seem difficult with any of this due to COVID

Two reasons we want to move: 1) schooling for our kids - we have to move by Feb 21, so being "happy" for the next 2-3 years is a moot point 2) I'm already not happy having dealt with the past two upstairs tenants who walk heavily and have toddlers that storm the house - I'm done living in this 1st floor unit and am ready to move.

The current dilemma is trying to find a place to rent... although srad's opinion is that we should avoid doing that for the purpose of having to move twice - I really don't see what other options we have as it seems riskier to try to find a place to buy that coincides with the sale of this place AND where we won't be caught in a situation where we if we haven't found a place to buy, now we are forced to rent somewhere and have to move all of our stuff twice anyway whether it's into storage or to the temporary rental or both.

What do the realtors say about this?  It can be area and target market specific.  You can also just offer $2000 (or whatever) as an allowance for painting, which might be more desirable for some buyers because they can choose their own colors.

Likewise, what does your agent say about contingent offers (contingent upon selling your current place)?  it seems to me that in may markets, they are pretty standard and if sales are truly as hot as your agents says, then it might not be a huge concern for a seller, especially if the offer is otherwise strong.

I'd list my current place ASAP, suck it up doing showings while you live there (the availability of a virtual tour might decrease the number of showings as it would weed out people for whom it clearly wasn't a good fit), and start shopping as soon as it is listed.  If you find a great place, put in a contingent offer.  They will either accept it, or not. 

jeromedawg

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #6 on: July 16, 2020, 11:50:28 AM »
We were ready to list it in March, delayed, and then started worrying about the longer term effects of this on the market (within the next year). Unemployment will likely continue to climb and people will be less able to afford to buy, regardless of the interest rates - this was our thinking. We're wanting to move from this area for good in any case.

Tried selling ourselves with no luck. Listed with a realtor and it went under contract in 3 days, within 98.5% of asking price. The realtor we wound up choosing is in agreement with us that it was now or next spring - and her view of next spring is like ours. Pessimistic.

Our situation is different in that we don't want to stay in this area, do not need to look for a place to live, and don't have small children to consider.

A suggestion to ask yourself is whether you'd be happy staying where you are for the next 2 or 3 years if it does not sell. If you sell quickly, you then are in a stronger position to buy anyway (no "sell my house" contingency). And if you sell quickly you've got a bit more money for rent (though you say landlords are unreasonable or the rent is unreasonable; you might have to adjust your expectations.)

Good luck.

Thanks for the feedback. These are my thoughts as well - nobody has a crystal ball obviously but it's not looking good, and while there's a hot streak now it seems like *now* is a better time to sell than not. Did you guys do any sort of updates to your place? Or did you sell "as-is" ? I'm concerned about the desirability with the condition of our walls/paint - its the original white paint from a decade ago along with areas in the walls that show cracks/cracking from settling (some areas that I've patched but not painted yet). It has been suggested multiple times that we paint but my realtor also has contemplated not doing any of that and listing with a 360 virtual tour.  We can pay $2500 + cost of paint to have it repainted but that would mean having to move and rearrange a bunch of furniture while all of us are at home working/watching the kids. Not to mention carpet cleaning and deep cleaning. I'm just not sure how manageable it will all be. I would estimate all of that taking a couple weeks to complete so I suppose we could figure out some sort of "staycation" but the logistics still seem difficult with any of this due to COVID

Two reasons we want to move: 1) schooling for our kids - we have to move by Feb 21, so being "happy" for the next 2-3 years is a moot point 2) I'm already not happy having dealt with the past two upstairs tenants who walk heavily and have toddlers that storm the house - I'm done living in this 1st floor unit and am ready to move.

The current dilemma is trying to find a place to rent... although srad's opinion is that we should avoid doing that for the purpose of having to move twice - I really don't see what other options we have as it seems riskier to try to find a place to buy that coincides with the sale of this place AND where we won't be caught in a situation where we if we haven't found a place to buy, now we are forced to rent somewhere and have to move all of our stuff twice anyway whether it's into storage or to the temporary rental or both.

What do the realtors say about this?  It can be area and target market specific.  You can also just offer $2000 (or whatever) as an allowance for painting, which might be more desirable for some buyers because they can choose their own colors.

Likewise, what does your agent say about contingent offers (contingent upon selling your current place)?  it seems to me that in may markets, they are pretty standard and if sales are truly as hot as your agents says, then it might not be a huge concern for a seller, especially if the offer is otherwise strong.

I'd list my current place ASAP, suck it up doing showings while you live there (the availability of a virtual tour might decrease the number of showings as it would weed out people for whom it clearly wasn't a good fit), and start shopping as soon as it is listed.  If you find a great place, put in a contingent offer.  They will either accept it, or not.

The realtors were all suggesting the same thing pretty much: paint (although one was saying it isn't AS necessary; just that it would be a *very* nice to have), carpet cleaning and deep clean (the latter two are just non-negotiables that have to be done which makes sense to me). Good idea on offering the allowance.

Regarding contingent sales, our agent says it's definitely going to reduce our buying/negotiating power. Is that such a bad thing though? It seems like most sellers/buyers are going to have to concede to that 'hard fact' as something you just have to sort of give up.

My agent did say that he did a 360 Virtual Tour on one place, and got an offer on it and closed on it contingent upon the sellers doing a physical walk through.

The other big drawback to factor in is that we need to move into a specific neighborhood boundary for the schooling by the Feb date. So if we were to move forward with the sell/buy route, we would be pretty limited in terms of options as far as buying. That's the catch-22 with all of this. Conceding to rent for a year would alleviate that though, as well as open up options to move outside the neighborhood boundary after acceptance into the program/school.

EDIT: I should mention the case study thread I opened here, https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/case-studies/selling-condo-invest-proceeds-and-rent-or-downpayment-on-a-new-home, which goes back to the rent vs buy question in this area and if it's actually a better idea if I were to just take the proceeds from the home sale (qualifying for section 121 cap gains exclusion) and invest the proceeds into the S&P500 and just rent long-term OR if I should stay the course as far as looking to buy.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2020, 12:11:20 PM by jeromedawg »

SailingOnASmallSailboat

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #7 on: July 16, 2020, 01:14:40 PM »
"Regarding contingent sales, our agent says it's definitely going to reduce our buying/negotiating power. Is that such a bad thing though? It seems like most sellers/buyers are going to have to concede to that 'hard fact' as something you just have to sort of give up."

I know we would not have considered an offer that had a contingency like that; in fact, one realtor talked to ours and didn't even show the house because her clients would have needed that and she didn't want to get their hopes up.

As far as paint goes: we've been working for a while touching up paint inside but did not do a whole scale paint job. It was making sure the dings were invisible (or strategically covered during showings lol). You need to make sure it looks cared for. That said? Listen to whatever realtor you choose to help you, as they know their target market and the rest of what's on the market.

We initially thought we were going to list over a year ago, but our daughter asked us to keep the house for a year so they could come "home" from college on breaks at least a few times, since older brother got to do that. We've had some time to do touch ups (wound up finishing the bamboo flooring in the upstairs and the dining room) that we otherwise would not have done. We had the luxury of doing that with both kids out of the house and no pets for the first time in ages - your situation is different.

srad

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #8 on: July 16, 2020, 03:52:29 PM »
You are moving and you don't want to keep your place.  Painting, cleaning, decluttering, staging, all needs to be done.  A freshly painted room looks great and will increase its desirability.  Don't offer painting credits, just do it.  I'd say paint it yourself.  Even with kids running around, it can be done one room at a time.  But 2500 for 2 weekends of work?  depends on what i had planned i'd take that trade from time to time.

I get the problem with having to sell to buy. There's no harm in listing yours with a 90 day rent back clause and see what you get.  While doing that, look for a home to buy.  Worst case, you can't find a home to buy, suck it up and rent anything in the area that meets your minimal standards.  You are renting, its ok to not have stainless appliances, and some cracks in the ceiling..   


jeromedawg

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #9 on: July 16, 2020, 06:13:27 PM »
You are moving and you don't want to keep your place.  Painting, cleaning, decluttering, staging, all needs to be done.  A freshly painted room looks great and will increase its desirability.  Don't offer painting credits, just do it.  I'd say paint it yourself.  Even with kids running around, it can be done one room at a time.  But 2500 for 2 weekends of work?  depends on what i had planned i'd take that trade from time to time.

I get the problem with having to sell to buy. There's no harm in listing yours with a 90 day rent back clause and see what you get.  While doing that, look for a home to buy.  Worst case, you can't find a home to buy, suck it up and rent anything in the area that meets your minimal standards.  You are renting, its ok to not have stainless appliances, and some cracks in the ceiling..

Our place isn't that small - it's nearly 1400sq feet of space. A number of windows that require the blinds removed (10 standard blinds and then 2 vertical blinds for the sliding glass doors). Not only painting the walls but all the trims and baseboards. Having already mentioned the blind removal (and reinstallation), this isn't even factoring the prep time of moving everything out of the way, taping, removing outlet covers, as well as patching cracks, dings/dents, and other holes that will likely be uncovered as we start clearing things out. I'm sure there's more (like putting the primer coats on then at least two coats of paint, all with the dry times between). I have heard that painting an entire interior of a home is one of the more underestimated types of DIY home improvement projects. Of course, that means different things to different people. I've heard the same thing about DIY installing flooring - is it hard? No. Is it tedious and time-consuming? Definitely. The painting would likely need to occur during or immediately after decluttering and packing (or we will be moving a lot of things to the middle of the room). In addition to all that, I still have work (from home) and watching the kids and tending to their needs. I mean, it sounds ideal but it almost sounds like a recipe for disaster too... curious to hear from anyone else who has attempted this and done so successfully with the same/similar circumstances and if it's still highly recommended. We painted an accent wall prior to having kids and that was doable - if we had no kids for sure I'd consider DIYing. Not too long ago, with two kids, painted the kitchen cabinets and it was a BIG drawn out ordeal. I would not want to do this again unless we were able to have someone else take the kids and watch them. And that's just not an option right now especially with COVID. All that to say, unless we're able to vacate the place or clear a lot of it out efficiently/effectively, even one room at a time, I'm not sure it would equate to 2 weekends of work (again, this is us working with the constraints of living here and having to shuffle a bunch of stuff around in addition to all the prep and paint)

In any case, we were relatively selective about rentals but not to the point of having stainless steel appliances. One unit we were close to renting but the landlord sounded like a PITA - basically there were a number of small/easy things they could have fixed (it has been on the market for months now) but refuse to, and are trying to offshore all wear and tear maintenance/repairs to the next tenants. They use home warranty and in the contract put the onus of all home warranty copays on the tenant for dealing with repairs and maintenance of appliances, etc. They refused to remove this stipulation so we dropped them. The dryer was present but broken/non-functional and one of the faucets in the bathroom wouldn't redirect most of the water to the shower head. A year is a short time but I wouldn't want to deal with a landlord like this.
The second place we submitted an application was great - no fridge or W/D but we applied anyway, however we were passed up for the applicant who applied before us.
So now we're looking at another place but all comps of this floorplan/unit have never rented for what they're asking for or higher than that; they are asking $50-100 more than all other comps (several of which are more upgraded). So we put an application but my agent let their agent know our pricing verbally - they said they'll look over our application so we will see what happens. Worst case scenario they say no to negotiating and we might be willing to just concede to paying the asking price. But for now, we have to start packing stuff and either moving it into the garage or pushing stuff towards the center of the room lol.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2020, 06:41:37 PM by jeromedawg »

srad

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #10 on: July 16, 2020, 07:26:28 PM »

[/quote]

Our place isn't that small - it's nearly 1400sq feet of space. A number of windows that require the blinds removed (10 standard blinds and then 2 vertical blinds for the sliding glass doors). Not only painting the walls but all the trims and baseboards. Having already mentioned the blind removal (and reinstallation), this isn't even factoring the prep time of moving everything out of the way, taping, removing outlet covers, as well as patching cracks, dings/dents, and other holes that will likely be uncovered as we start clearing things out. I'm sure there's more (like putting the primer coats on then at least two coats of paint, all with the dry times between). I have heard that painting an entire interior of a home is one of the more underestimated types of DIY home improvement projects. Of course, that means different things to different people. I've heard the same thing about DIY installing flooring - is it hard? No. Is it tedious and time-consuming? Definitely. The painting would likely need to occur during or immediately after decluttering and packing (or we will be moving a lot of things to the middle of the room). In addition to all that, I still have work (from home) and watching the kids and tending to their needs. I mean, it sounds ideal but it almost sounds like a recipe for disaster too... curious to hear from anyone else who has attempted this and done so successfully with the same/similar circumstances and if it's still highly recommended. We painted an accent wall prior to having kids and that was doable - if we had no kids for sure I'd consider DIYing. Not too long ago, with two kids, painted the kitchen cabinets and it was a BIG drawn out ordeal. I would not want to do this again unless we were able to have someone else take the kids and watch them. And that's just not an option right now especially with COVID. All that to say, unless we're able to vacate the place or clear a lot of it out efficiently/effectively, even one room at a time, I'm not sure it would equate to 2 weekends of work (again, this is us working with the constraints of living here and having to shuffle a bunch of stuff around in addition to all the prep and paint)
[/quote]

I'm going to give you some advise, keep it short, all you had to say was A, I don't have the time to do this or B, i don't want to do this. i've been doing live in flips and owning rentals for almost 20 years now.  I know what needs to be done with painting a room.  Judging by the conversations we have had on this post, i probably wouldn't rent to you either.  You don't come off terrible, but you come off like a someone whom I feel like I would be hearing from more than i should be. There are other tenants out there that are just easier to deal with.  If this was a tenants market go ahead and ask for the moon, but currently (and for a long time) there's been a short supply of good rentals.  So finding a tenant whom i'm comfortable with isn't that hard.





jeromedawg

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #11 on: July 16, 2020, 07:31:57 PM »

I'm going to give you some advise, keep it short, all you had to say was A, I don't have the time to do this or B, i don't want to do this. i've been doing live in flips and owning rentals for almost 20 years now.  I know what needs to be done with painting a room.  Judging by the conversations we have had on this post, i probably wouldn't rent to you either.  You don't come off terrible, but you come off like a someone whom I feel like I would be hearing from more than i should be. There are other tenants out there that are just easier to deal with.  If this was a tenants market go ahead and ask for the moon, but currently (and for a long time) there's been a short supply of good rentals.  So finding a tenant whom i'm comfortable with isn't that hard.

Thanks. Working on it :) Wife tells me the same thing. It's how I ultimately end up weighing a lot of decisions and deliberating.... too much I'm sure. I didn't mean any sort of offense btw. That said, you really think that we can paint the entire place in two weekends? It just feels like an ambitious goal given everything else we have to deal with. My wife said she's willing to take on a lot of the painting and thinks she would enjoy it. I suppose I should let her loose on it? My realtor set sort of a 'hard stop' date of August 15th as the date he would want to list at the latest.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2020, 07:34:51 PM by jeromedawg »

lhamo

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #12 on: July 16, 2020, 09:17:23 PM »
You are overthinking this and being penny-wise/pound foolish.

Everyone who knows the market is telling you this is a great time to sell.  You want to move, so GET IT ON THE MARKET! Lock down a decent rental at a fair price in your desired neighborhood, get moved, get your current place sold, and then you can take your leisurely time buying a more permanent place over the next 6-18 months.

Who cares if you spend $600-1200 over your estimation of market rate rent to ease this process a bit? THIS KIND OF SITUATION IS WHAT YOU ARE SAVING MONEY FOR!  To have choices. To make life a little bit easier/less stressful in difficult times. 

You complain about the landlord's attitude but expect everybody to accept YOUR version of value.  To be blunt, you come across as a bit of a tightwad.  Loosen up a bit.  Financially and otherwise.  You might find life more enjoyable.

jeromedawg

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #13 on: July 16, 2020, 09:47:18 PM »
You are overthinking this and being penny-wise/pound foolish.

Everyone who knows the market is telling you this is a great time to sell.  You want to move, so GET IT ON THE MARKET! Lock down a decent rental at a fair price in your desired neighborhood, get moved, get your current place sold, and then you can take your leisurely time buying a more permanent place over the next 6-18 months.

Who cares if you spend $600-1200 over your estimation of market rate rent to ease this process a bit? THIS KIND OF SITUATION IS WHAT YOU ARE SAVING MONEY FOR!  To have choices. To make life a little bit easier/less stressful in difficult times. 

You complain about the landlord's attitude but expect everybody to accept YOUR version of value.  To be blunt, you come across as a bit of a tightwad.  Loosen up a bit.  Financially and otherwise.  You might find life more enjoyable.

You're right. Although I honestly think we dodged a bullet and would have had a really hard time with that first landlord regardless of the price, based on the impression we got of him (both my wife and I and our agent).
We were all-in on the second place but it just didn't work out else we'd be past this point. We will likely jump on this third place and go from there.

As far as paint, I think we're just going to hire a painter or contractor to do everything - I just don't think we'll have the time to plan, purchase supplies, prep and paint everything within a short period of time and without stressing ourselves out majorly (you guys can probably see that by now).
I know I mentioned it would cost $2500 to have my painter do it but he's only doing a partial job (no ceilings and touch-up on doors). The contractor my agent uses quoted $3800 to do *everything* including ceilings and I'm assuming doors. So I'm sort of just leaning towards going that route and doing a full and complete job. Realtor says you want to make sure you do a good job on the paint.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2020, 09:55:02 PM by jeromedawg »

BNgarden

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #14 on: July 16, 2020, 10:00:46 PM »
Yes, you need to do a good job on the paint for a quick sale.  No use trying to DIY, discovering the job quality isn't quite good enough to get that unit off your hands.

And, yes, painting ceilings will absolutely make a difference to how the unit shows.

SailingOnASmallSailboat

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #15 on: July 17, 2020, 05:59:03 AM »
You are overthinking this and being penny-wise/pound foolish.

Everyone who knows the market is telling you this is a great time to sell.  You want to move, so GET IT ON THE MARKET! Lock down a decent rental at a fair price in your desired neighborhood, get moved, get your current place sold, and then you can take your leisurely time buying a more permanent place over the next 6-18 months.

Who cares if you spend $600-1200 over your estimation of market rate rent to ease this process a bit? THIS KIND OF SITUATION IS WHAT YOU ARE SAVING MONEY FOR!  To have choices. To make life a little bit easier/less stressful in difficult times. 

You complain about the landlord's attitude but expect everybody to accept YOUR version of value.  To be blunt, you come across as a bit of a tightwad.  Loosen up a bit.  Financially and otherwise.  You might find life more enjoyable.

You're right. Although I honestly think we dodged a bullet and would have had a really hard time with that first landlord regardless of the price, based on the impression we got of him (both my wife and I and our agent).
We were all-in on the second place but it just didn't work out else we'd be past this point. We will likely jump on this third place and go from there.

As far as paint, I think we're just going to hire a painter or contractor to do everything - I just don't think we'll have the time to plan, purchase supplies, prep and paint everything within a short period of time and without stressing ourselves out majorly (you guys can probably see that by now).
I know I mentioned it would cost $2500 to have my painter do it but he's only doing a partial job (no ceilings and touch-up on doors). The contractor my agent uses quoted $3800 to do *everything* including ceilings and I'm assuming doors. So I'm sort of just leaning towards going that route and doing a full and complete job. Realtor says you want to make sure you do a good job on the paint.

Smart moves. Both of them. That kind of money is worth the peace of mind.

dclarke1

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #16 on: July 17, 2020, 10:19:31 AM »
I would not consider anything a realtor says in deciding when or whether to sell your house. Of course they would always say now is the best time and if you miss this great window to sell then you will need to wait for another time, so better do it quick. Asking a realtor if you should sell your house is equivalent to asking a general contractor if you should build a house. The answer would be of course, I'll start right away. The only time to talk to a realtor would be when you have decided you are listing.

SailingOnASmallSailboat

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #17 on: July 17, 2020, 11:11:05 AM »
I would not consider anything a realtor says in deciding when or whether to sell your house. Of course they would always say now is the best time and if you miss this great window to sell then you will need to wait for another time, so better do it quick. Asking a realtor if you should sell your house is equivalent to asking a general contractor if you should build a house. The answer would be of course, I'll start right away. The only time to talk to a realtor would be when you have decided you are listing.

Respectfully disagree. Sure, there are realtors who will say whatever you want to hear. But a good realtor wants you to sell your house, quickly, for the right price. If a house is likely to sit on the market for months at a time because of timing, they'll suggest waiting (we had discussions with one in November who told us to hold on, as spring is a better time.

jeromedawg

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #18 on: July 17, 2020, 11:17:13 AM »
So my agent got back and the third place we're looking at the landlords are now adamant about *requiring* an 18mo minimum lease contract. This is after they lowered their price $50.... 18 months is just too long for us to commit too - and their place is already above fair market rent. I suppose we could offer them the original asking price at 12 months but their reasoning for 18mo+ is that they prefer a longer-term tenant, so I don't know if offering even their original asking price would change that since it seems like an overriding factor.

Where that leaves us is essentially two options (if we want to get in asap on selling now):
1) dealing with having contractors coming in and painting our place one room at a time and piecemeal while we're here (sounds stressful and troublesome).
OR
2) just conceding to listing the property AS-IS and accepting that we'll net less - if we do it this way we'll still have to pack to some extent and probably do some minor touchups.

SailingOnASmallSailboat

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #19 on: July 17, 2020, 11:27:42 AM »
You are overthinking this and being penny-wise/pound foolish.

Everyone who knows the market is telling you this is a great time to sell.  You want to move, so GET IT ON THE MARKET! Lock down a decent rental at a fair price in your desired neighborhood, get moved, get your current place sold, and then you can take your leisurely time buying a more permanent place over the next 6-18 months.

Who cares if you spend $600-1200 over your estimation of market rate rent to ease this process a bit? THIS KIND OF SITUATION IS WHAT YOU ARE SAVING MONEY FOR!  To have choices. To make life a little bit easier/less stressful in difficult times. 

You complain about the landlord's attitude but expect everybody to accept YOUR version of value.  To be blunt, you come across as a bit of a tightwad.  Loosen up a bit.  Financially and otherwise.  You might find life more enjoyable.

@jeromedawg here is in a nutshell. Having an 18 month lease means you get that much more time to find your place as well as do any needed work on it when you do find it. 6 months is not a long time, in the scheme of things. And who knows. If you find a great place sooner you can work to find a new tenant. I'd jump, move, and sell.

jeromedawg

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #20 on: July 17, 2020, 12:41:36 PM »
You are overthinking this and being penny-wise/pound foolish.

Everyone who knows the market is telling you this is a great time to sell.  You want to move, so GET IT ON THE MARKET! Lock down a decent rental at a fair price in your desired neighborhood, get moved, get your current place sold, and then you can take your leisurely time buying a more permanent place over the next 6-18 months.

Who cares if you spend $600-1200 over your estimation of market rate rent to ease this process a bit? THIS KIND OF SITUATION IS WHAT YOU ARE SAVING MONEY FOR!  To have choices. To make life a little bit easier/less stressful in difficult times. 

You complain about the landlord's attitude but expect everybody to accept YOUR version of value.  To be blunt, you come across as a bit of a tightwad.  Loosen up a bit.  Financially and otherwise.  You might find life more enjoyable.

@jeromedawg here is in a nutshell. Having an 18 month lease means you get that much more time to find your place as well as do any needed work on it when you do find it. 6 months is not a long time, in the scheme of things. And who knows. If you find a great place sooner you can work to find a new tenant. I'd jump, move, and sell.

Good point... although the extra 6 months equates to almost $17k more for a total of $50k (rented at $2800) vs $34k (rented at $2850) - btw this wasn't us negotiating them down - they decided to list originally at $2850 @ 12mos and then changed it to $2800 @ 18mos. If we look at it that way, it's not as enticing especially for a place that's renting above market as it is. And as far as finding replacement tenants, I've never had to go through that (or any of this for that matter) but is it difficult to deal with that sort of thing and finding a replacement? My biggest concern is that it ends up being one of those 'sticky' situations that we either find it difficult to get out of without burning bridges. How do you even go about trying to identify replacement tenants? Hotpads? Nextdoor? Facebook?
Anyway, if we signed the contract it would go through Jan 2022. At this point, we're starting to pack stuff up regardless. I'll ask my agent his thoughts on leveraging the time for finding a place with an 18mo lease.
He just inquired again about their original listing offer of renting the place for 12 months at $2850 so we'll see what they say.
« Last Edit: July 17, 2020, 12:59:07 PM by jeromedawg »

Villanelle

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #21 on: July 17, 2020, 01:03:15 PM »
I still think you are crazy for renting, especially since you are having trouble finding a place.  OF COURSE a relator is trying to talk you out of a contingent offer.  It means work work for them.  But you haven't even tried.  Why not start looking today**?  If you find a place, make a contingent offer.  If they say no, you are no worse off then you were before.

**Not actually today.  What I would do today is hire that painter if you are set on doing that work.  Then I'd be ready to make a contingent offer when they finish and I actually got my house listed or at least knew it was within days of being ready to do so.

It seems like you have rejected even trying to buy because it might not work out.  It costs you nothing but some time to look and make a contingent offer.  Yes, it might not work.  But it *might* work and if it does, it seems like the best option for you.  What's the downside?  Some time lost looking at properties? 

jeromedawg

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #22 on: July 17, 2020, 01:07:55 PM »
I still think you are crazy for renting, especially since you are having trouble finding a place.  OF COURSE a relator is trying to talk you out of a contingent offer.  It means work work for them.  But you haven't even tried.  Why not start looking today**?  If you find a place, make a contingent offer.  If they say no, you are no worse off then you were before.

**Not actually today.  What I would do today is hire that painter if you are set on doing that work.  Then I'd be ready to make a contingent offer when they finish and I actually got my house listed or at least knew it was within days of being ready to do so.

It seems like you have rejected even trying to buy because it might not work out.  It costs you nothing but some time to look and make a contingent offer.  Yes, it might not work.  But it *might* work and if it does, it seems like the best option for you.  What's the downside?  Some time lost looking at properties?

Make sense. There are a few places that look OK but not the highest desirability. A big part of the problem is that we're constrained to looking in a very specific neighborhood because of the school . If we were already down there and were able to stay through Feb/March and got him accepted into the program this wouldn't be a problem. So part of the strategy behind renting was to initially just get into the program then that would open up options for us to buy outside of the neighborhood after (because once you're in, you're in regardless of where you may move - just have to get him accepted *while* living in the area).

Anyway, yes, we could pursue making a contingent offer if the place is highly desirable and in that specific neighborhood. There's not much along those lines as it is currently - the problem is low inventory and high demand, spurring multiple bidding wars and homes moving super fast. I'll let my realtor know though.... since it does look to be a "can't hurt to try" scenario.
« Last Edit: July 17, 2020, 01:09:43 PM by jeromedawg »

Villanelle

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #23 on: July 17, 2020, 04:00:10 PM »
I still think you are crazy for renting, especially since you are having trouble finding a place.  OF COURSE a relator is trying to talk you out of a contingent offer.  It means work work for them.  But you haven't even tried.  Why not start looking today**?  If you find a place, make a contingent offer.  If they say no, you are no worse off then you were before.

**Not actually today.  What I would do today is hire that painter if you are set on doing that work.  Then I'd be ready to make a contingent offer when they finish and I actually got my house listed or at least knew it was within days of being ready to do so.

It seems like you have rejected even trying to buy because it might not work out.  It costs you nothing but some time to look and make a contingent offer.  Yes, it might not work.  But it *might* work and if it does, it seems like the best option for you.  What's the downside?  Some time lost looking at properties?

Make sense. There are a few places that look OK but not the highest desirability. A big part of the problem is that we're constrained to looking in a very specific neighborhood because of the school . If we were already down there and were able to stay through Feb/March and got him accepted into the program this wouldn't be a problem. So part of the strategy behind renting was to initially just get into the program then that would open up options for us to buy outside of the neighborhood after (because once you're in, you're in regardless of where you may move - just have to get him accepted *while* living in the area).

Anyway, yes, we could pursue making a contingent offer if the place is highly desirable and in that specific neighborhood. There's not much along those lines as it is currently - the problem is low inventory and high demand, spurring multiple bidding wars and homes moving super fast. I'll let my realtor know though.... since it does look to be a "can't hurt to try" scenario.

I didn't realize you didn't have to buy in the neighborhood.

You might also consider creative options.  If a one month lease on a place--furnished or not-- (or could you enroll while living at a long-term stay hotel in the area, even, or an airbnb rented for a month?) allows you to buy whatever wherever (and possibly in a cheaper area), then that might make sense.  (Someone who doesn't follow the letter of the law might even suggest you don't even have to occupy the place... But if you aren't that person, you can your family could easily move into a cheap little furnished rental--it can be small and undesirable because you aren't staying long--while you search for a place to buy and hopefully finish up closing on your old place.    If any of those things would work, consider them, and then you can list your place now and start an aggressive house search without the constraint of the exact neighborhood.  If it costs you $3000 in rent for a month to month lease, that's not much in the grand scheme of things, especially if it allows you to buy a cheaper house. 


Dicey

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #24 on: July 17, 2020, 04:12:15 PM »
I thought of this thread when I read that rents are falling in the highest-demand areas around the Bay (SF, Silicon Valley, etc.) and rising slightly in the outlying areas. Theory is people have figured out they can get more space for less if they move out of the high-demand hubs. Work from home seems to be a big influence in their decisions to move. I noted that the spendy places are experiencing double digit drops, while the outlying areas are only seeing modest gains. More changes to come, no doubt.

jeromedawg

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #25 on: July 17, 2020, 04:22:56 PM »
I still think you are crazy for renting, especially since you are having trouble finding a place.  OF COURSE a relator is trying to talk you out of a contingent offer.  It means work work for them.  But you haven't even tried.  Why not start looking today**?  If you find a place, make a contingent offer.  If they say no, you are no worse off then you were before.

**Not actually today.  What I would do today is hire that painter if you are set on doing that work.  Then I'd be ready to make a contingent offer when they finish and I actually got my house listed or at least knew it was within days of being ready to do so.

It seems like you have rejected even trying to buy because it might not work out.  It costs you nothing but some time to look and make a contingent offer.  Yes, it might not work.  But it *might* work and if it does, it seems like the best option for you.  What's the downside?  Some time lost looking at properties?

Make sense. There are a few places that look OK but not the highest desirability. A big part of the problem is that we're constrained to looking in a very specific neighborhood because of the school . If we were already down there and were able to stay through Feb/March and got him accepted into the program this wouldn't be a problem. So part of the strategy behind renting was to initially just get into the program then that would open up options for us to buy outside of the neighborhood after (because once you're in, you're in regardless of where you may move - just have to get him accepted *while* living in the area).

Anyway, yes, we could pursue making a contingent offer if the place is highly desirable and in that specific neighborhood. There's not much along those lines as it is currently - the problem is low inventory and high demand, spurring multiple bidding wars and homes moving super fast. I'll let my realtor know though.... since it does look to be a "can't hurt to try" scenario.

I didn't realize you didn't have to buy in the neighborhood.

You might also consider creative options.  If a one month lease on a place--furnished or not-- (or could you enroll while living at a long-term stay hotel in the area, even, or an airbnb rented for a month?) allows you to buy whatever wherever (and possibly in a cheaper area), then that might make sense.  (Someone who doesn't follow the letter of the law might even suggest you don't even have to occupy the place... But if you aren't that person, you can your family could easily move into a cheap little furnished rental--it can be small and undesirable because you aren't staying long--while you search for a place to buy and hopefully finish up closing on your old place.    If any of those things would work, consider them, and then you can list your place now and start an aggressive house search without the constraint of the exact neighborhood.  If it costs you $3000 in rent for a month to month lease, that's not much in the grand scheme of things, especially if it allows you to buy a cheaper house.

This did cross our minds as far as possibly trying to find an AirBNB or short-term rental or even renting a unit unoccupied (as you alluded to) for 2-3 months month-to-month. However, I know that most would consider that your "Primary Residence" is technically supposed to be anywhere you've lived (or I suppose intend to live) for 6 months or more. Obviously with AirBNB the units will likely be furnished so not sure what we'd do with all of our stuff. And as far as cost, it's definitely not going to be $3000 month to month. Probably more like upwards of $5000 - one apartment complex wanted like $8000 month to month!
I believe and would assume that the school district's policy as far as applying for this program is that the address you supply should be your intended primary residence. I think this might be a bit of a moral/ethical gray area lol. But the idea floated to simply rent the cheapest possible 1 bed/1 bath/studio apt either month to month or say on a 3-4 month lease sounds relatively appealing.
It's the overall timing of selling the current place that complicates things, particularly if we are wanting to sell within the next month. We will still need to find a place to live/rent at least through March/April (when we would expect to get confirmation of acceptance into the program). So if we were wanting to open up/expand our home search to the broader area, we wouldn't really be able to look until *after* that point in time. As you can start to see, there are multiple catch-22s at play.

I thought of this thread when I read that rents are falling in the highest-demand areas around the Bay (SF, Silicon Valley, etc.) and rising slightly in the outlying areas. Theory is people have figured out they can get more space for less if they move out of the high-demand hubs. Work from home seems to be a big influence in their decisions to move. I noted that the spendy places are experiencing double digit drops, while the outlying areas are only seeing modest gains. More changes to come, no doubt.
Interesting observation - I could see that being the case. The area we're moving to I would consider to be an "outlying area" of OC, but as far as some of the rents I've seen, some people seem to be accepting lesser rent than prior years (the rationale is to just get the place occupied ASAP due to COVID-19). But I can also see how some are demanding higher rent than normal market rent - however, I haven't necessarily seen a rush of renters take those (one example is the first unit I looked at that was $200-300 OVER market rent... but the other reason it may not have been as popular, besides that, is due to how unreasonable that landlord is).
« Last Edit: July 17, 2020, 04:37:28 PM by jeromedawg »

cchrissyy

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #26 on: July 17, 2020, 04:45:05 PM »
Quote
If we were already down there and were able to stay through Feb/March and got him accepted into the program this wouldn't be a problem. So part of the strategy behind renting was to initially just get into the program then that would open up options for us to buy outside of the neighborhood after (because once you're in, you're in regardless of where you may move - just have to get him accepted *while* living in the area).

Quote
I don't know what the school district's exact policy is as far as applying for this program and IF the address you supply should be your intended primary residence.

Since residency doesn't guarantee a spot, I think renting is best. If your kids don't get in, you will probably want to move. If they are accepted, and you like the school after a year or more enrolled, that knowledge gives you a lot of structure in choosing a permanent home.

I also think you should verify the rules right now. Don't assume. For example, in my district, they require many kinds of proof during registration (January?) as well as they require residency on the 1st day of school for grades K, 6, and 9, and they literally knock on doors to see if the kids are there. One of my kids was not allowed to attend day 1 because we happened to be traveling when they sent somebody over and I had to appeal it and pass another unannounced check before they let her start attending.

jeromedawg

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #27 on: July 17, 2020, 05:00:35 PM »
Quote
If we were already down there and were able to stay through Feb/March and got him accepted into the program this wouldn't be a problem. So part of the strategy behind renting was to initially just get into the program then that would open up options for us to buy outside of the neighborhood after (because once you're in, you're in regardless of where you may move - just have to get him accepted *while* living in the area).

Quote
I don't know what the school district's exact policy is as far as applying for this program and IF the address you supply should be your intended primary residence.

Since residency doesn't guarantee a spot, I think renting is best. If your kids don't get in, you will probably want to move. If they are accepted, and you like the school after a year or more enrolled, that knowledge gives you a lot of structure in choosing a permanent home.

I also think you should verify the rules right now. Don't assume. For example, in my district, they require many kinds of proof during registration (January?) as well as they require residency on the 1st day of school for grades K, 6, and 9, and they literally knock on doors to see if the kids are there. One of my kids was not allowed to attend day 1 because we happened to be traveling when they sent somebody over and I had to appeal it and pass another unannounced check before they let her start attending.

So what I found out after asking the program coordinator, because I brought up the scenario of "What happens we if move into the immediate neighborhood boundary of the school, apply and are accepted into the program, then end up moving outside of the neighborhood boundary? Does this make our son ineligible to enroll?" (applications, if they are the same as they have always been, are due early Feb and you hear back sometime between March and April). She communicated to me that once he's in he's in for good and you can opt to give up your spot but they won't take it away from you if you move, even if you move outside of the school district. This makes sense because they do accept applications for the program from families who live outside of the neighborhood and outside the district - you basically have 1st priority (and are more or less guaranteed in) if inside the neighborhood boundary, if you live outside the immediate boundary but are still in the district, you are given 2nd priority, and if you live in another school district you are given 3rd priority or put into a lottery. I don't think anything has changed but will probably just call the coordinator again to verify.

cchrissyy

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #28 on: July 17, 2020, 05:27:31 PM »
OK, I'm glad you've spoken with them, and I'm glad that living in the neighborhood guarantees the spot.

In that case, I think you should let the school idea structure your decisions so you're not jumping all over the place.

Rent something for a year. Stop stressing about an extra $50 or $100 per month. It's only 12 months.

Choose a rental you really like, and trust that landlords have researched a fair price more than you have. 

This is one of those things where "do you want to be right or you want to be happy?" Because if the landlord says the house you want is $x, then you will either pay $x or you will be going to a different house. Maybe you're right that it should be $x-50 but that doesn't get you the house you liked and now you have to spend more days searching and stressed.

After that year (or two, no rush) making sure you like the school and the town you will decide about buying and whether to stay in that exact neighborhood or to live a little further out. You don't need that game plan yet. All you need right now is to get out of your current house so it can get painted/cleaned/sold and get into the rental before registration.

jeromedawg

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #29 on: July 17, 2020, 06:22:48 PM »
OK, I'm glad you've spoken with them, and I'm glad that living in the neighborhood guarantees the spot.

In that case, I think you should let the school idea structure your decisions so you're not jumping all over the place.

Rent something for a year. Stop stressing about an extra $50 or $100 per month. It's only 12 months.

Choose a rental you really like, and trust that landlords have researched a fair price more than you have. 

This is one of those things where "do you want to be right or you want to be happy?" Because if the landlord says the house you want is $x, then you will either pay $x or you will be going to a different house. Maybe you're right that it should be $x-50 but that doesn't get you the house you liked and now you have to spend more days searching and stressed.

After that year (or two, no rush) making sure you like the school and the town you will decide about buying and whether to stay in that exact neighborhood or to live a little further out. You don't need that game plan yet. All you need right now is to get out of your current house so it can get painted/cleaned/sold and get into the rental before registration.

Agreed - I think the two routes we can take now are either A) rent for 12 months in the boundary at a reasonable or close to "fair rents" which I guess is $50-100 give or take or B) list our place ASAP and put a contingent offer on a new place in the boundary

Thinking through it, maybe a short list of pros/cons might help as I process it (I feel like I've done this before but I guess it doesn't hurt to spell it out again):

Cons of A:
- spending money on rent
- having to deal with an extra full move
- uncertainty of interest rates in 2021 if we go to buy (home prices might be lower but if not significantly lower, monthly payments could also be higher as interest rates go up)

Pros of A:
- being able to vacate the current place and getting it fully primed/prepped/staged/listed/sold for max sale value and faster sale
- taking our time finding a home we really like and potentially at a more favorable price point, and after Mar 2021, broadening our search outside of the school boundary

The caveat with this of course is rental availability AND conformity to a 12 mo lease term. I mentioned above but the current and only other place that will work for us to rent is now asking for an 18mo lease term


Cons of B:
- if we decide to paint, etc we would have to deal with stress of moving our stuff around for the painters and having them here while we're here
- if we decide not to paint, etc we would likely concede to a lower selling price listing as-is (this may be a non-factor if the market is hot enough to the point where people are desperate and don't care... which it sounds like is kind of the case here in Irvine)
- locked into the immediate neighborhood and therefore lesser selection of homes/floor plans
- we could end up not liking the school or program and would sort of be in a tougher position vs if we had rented

Pros of B:
- one move and we're done
- current mortgage rates are pretty favorable @ 3% and possibly lower on average


Seems renting per plan A would buy us more of that flexibility but at the same time if we find a place we really like I don't think plan B is a bad one either - even if we don't like the school/program or whatever, which I highly doubt, I don't think I'd mind staying in that area overall. So I feel like it's sort of a toss-up and we would ultimately be fine either way. I'm working on getting pre-approved so that we can make that offer if it makes sense to do so. In the meantime, we'll keep looking for a year lease as well. And we're also starting pack stuff up and will eventually be moving things into our garage so that, if needed, we will be able to get the painting done while here (sure it'll be stressful but better having someone else do it versus ourselves based on all that's going on)
« Last Edit: July 17, 2020, 06:34:01 PM by jeromedawg »

lhamo

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #30 on: July 17, 2020, 07:16:31 PM »
Why don't you rent a furnished Air BnB place for 2-6 weeks, declutter/pack up your place, and get it painted, staged and listed. In the meantime you can keep looking at both rentals and homes for sale in your target school zone.  If you find a suitable house to buy, place a contingent offer.  Or if you find a rental that is reasonably priced with a 6-12 month lease option, you can settle on that. 

In the meantime if this current unit doesn't rent the landlords may be more willing to work with you.

And for god's sake -- stop trying to save $50-100/month on rent.  If you end up with a crappy relationship with your landlord you are going to be so eager to leave the rental that you will probably overpay for your next home purchase.  Take the long view.  Assuming you can't find a house to buy, the rental gives you a place to land in your desired school zone and time to find the right house to buy in the next 12-36 months. 


jeromedawg

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #31 on: July 17, 2020, 07:47:34 PM »
Why don't you rent a furnished Air BnB place for 2-6 weeks, declutter/pack up your place, and get it painted, staged and listed. In the meantime you can keep looking at both rentals and homes for sale in your target school zone.  If you find a suitable house to buy, place a contingent offer.  Or if you find a rental that is reasonably priced with a 6-12 month lease option, you can settle on that. 

In the meantime if this current unit doesn't rent the landlords may be more willing to work with you.

And for god's sake -- stop trying to save $50-100/month on rent.  If you end up with a crappy relationship with your landlord you are going to be so eager to leave the rental that you will probably overpay for your next home purchase.  Take the long view.  Assuming you can't find a house to buy, the rental gives you a place to land in your desired school zone and time to find the right house to buy in the next 12-36 months.


The idea of a 'staycation' has crossed my mind while the contractor works on the place so that's an idea - but yea we would have to pack things up and possibly move some stuff around. I'm assuming the contractor/painter would handle moving stuff around and protecting it with coverings otherwise.

As far as saving on rent, I have already conceded to paying up to $100 (maybe even $150) over fair market rent so I'm past that. More of the concern goes back to the place being big enough for us and our stuff as well as the lease term - I'd strongly prefer not having to rent for longer than 12 months and also to not be in a place that's so cramped, considering WFH and my wife and kids at home all day, as well as dealing with the move-in/move-out. Guess we could always rent a storage unit too in the worst case scenario...


BTW: thanks all for the input, feedback and also *facepunches* thus far - it is definitely helping me think through our options more clearly as well as providing some direction.
« Last Edit: July 17, 2020, 07:54:36 PM by jeromedawg »

LostGirl

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #32 on: July 17, 2020, 09:58:00 PM »
Quote
If we were already down there and were able to stay through Feb/March and got him accepted into the program this wouldn't be a problem. So part of the strategy behind renting was to initially just get into the program then that would open up options for us to buy outside of the neighborhood after (because once you're in, you're in regardless of where you may move - just have to get him accepted *while* living in the area).

Quote
I don't know what the school district's exact policy is as far as applying for this program and IF the address you supply should be your intended primary residence.

Since residency doesn't guarantee a spot, I think renting is best. If your kids don't get in, you will probably want to move. If they are accepted, and you like the school after a year or more enrolled, that knowledge gives you a lot of structure in choosing a permanent home.

I also think you should verify the rules right now. Don't assume. For example, in my district, they require many kinds of proof during registration (January?) as well as they require residency on the 1st day of school for grades K, 6, and 9, and they literally knock on doors to see if the kids are there. One of my kids was not allowed to attend day 1 because we happened to be traveling when they sent somebody over and I had to appeal it and pass another unannounced check before they let her start attending.
Wow! Thatís crazy that they checked your house make sure you lived there and wouldnít let her attend until they verified. That must be better than my school district

Villanelle

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #33 on: July 18, 2020, 05:41:22 PM »
Why don't you rent a furnished Air BnB place for 2-6 weeks, declutter/pack up your place, and get it painted, staged and listed. In the meantime you can keep looking at both rentals and homes for sale in your target school zone.  If you find a suitable house to buy, place a contingent offer.  Or if you find a rental that is reasonably priced with a 6-12 month lease option, you can settle on that. 

In the meantime if this current unit doesn't rent the landlords may be more willing to work with you.

And for god's sake -- stop trying to save $50-100/month on rent.  If you end up with a crappy relationship with your landlord you are going to be so eager to leave the rental that you will probably overpay for your next home purchase.  Take the long view.  Assuming you can't find a house to buy, the rental gives you a place to land in your desired school zone and time to find the right house to buy in the next 12-36 months.

Yes.  This.  All of it. 

jeromedawg

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #34 on: July 18, 2020, 06:10:54 PM »
Why don't you rent a furnished Air BnB place for 2-6 weeks, declutter/pack up your place, and get it painted, staged and listed. In the meantime you can keep looking at both rentals and homes for sale in your target school zone.  If you find a suitable house to buy, place a contingent offer.  Or if you find a rental that is reasonably priced with a 6-12 month lease option, you can settle on that. 

In the meantime if this current unit doesn't rent the landlords may be more willing to work with you.

And for god's sake -- stop trying to save $50-100/month on rent.  If you end up with a crappy relationship with your landlord you are going to be so eager to leave the rental that you will probably overpay for your next home purchase.  Take the long view.  Assuming you can't find a house to buy, the rental gives you a place to land in your desired school zone and time to find the right house to buy in the next 12-36 months.

Yes.  This.  All of it.

Another idea that just crossed my mind as I was thinking through all of this. We could just look to sell and buy a new place NOW in a neighboring city where home prices per sq foot are less (still possibly dealing with contingent offers and or rent back) and then in January, assuming there is availability, rent the cheapest studio apt in the area we can find either month-to-month or on a 3-4 month lease starting January, making that our primary residence but not necessarily living there. This is if we want to take the "gray area" approach in terms of the definition of "primary residence" and how strict the school/district would actually be about this or potentially investigate (per cchrissyy's experience). We got quotes earlier last year on a 2bed/2bath place where doing a 3-4 month lease would range anywhere from $2600-3700 per month (so around $11k of a 'sunk cost'). It should be even less if we just rented a small studio apt.
To justify why we might consider this, in the neighboring city not too far away, a home just listed with a price per sq foot of ~$303 listing just under $900k. A home in the neighborhood boundary that's a few hundred sq feet smaller has a price per sq foot of $385 and lists for just under $1mm...! That's almost a $100k price differential, so factoring that in, signing up for a short-term lease and paying $11k is peanuts.... the question is if that'll be 'problematic' from the school district's perspective. And it would be weird laying that scenario out with the program coordinator basically asking if it's OK if something like that were to hypothetically occur all within the context of trying to get our kid into the program LOL
« Last Edit: July 18, 2020, 06:13:15 PM by jeromedawg »

lhamo

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #35 on: July 18, 2020, 06:47:08 PM »
Please don't do this.

Rent in your target neighborhood.  Legitimately establish a residence there and see if you like living there enough to pay for a house in the school boundary.  If not, that's fine - you can buy in the other neighborhood and still keep your seat in the school.  But don't go playing ethically questionable games like pretending a studio apartment is the primary residence for a family of four. 


SailingOnASmallSailboat

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #36 on: July 18, 2020, 08:47:32 PM »
Please don't do this.

Rent in your target neighborhood.  Legitimately establish a residence there and see if you like living there enough to pay for a house in the school boundary.  If not, that's fine - you can buy in the other neighborhood and still keep your seat in the school.  But don't go playing ethically questionable games like pretending a studio apartment is the primary residence for a family of four.

100% this.

KateFIRE

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #37 on: July 18, 2020, 08:52:37 PM »
We are selling our house right now. We are still living here. It is tough!! I wish we had decided to sell after moving. There is no where to go when we have showings. We are both working from home. We havenít refused a showing yet, but we did have to kick a showing out who overstayed their time slot by 30 minutes! We needed to work.

The market is high right now!! I read that the low interest rates are allowing home prices to rise 7% from the beginning of the year (same monthly payment).

We will rent for 1 year, but we can get out of our lease anytime by paying a 1 month rent fee. Thatís awesome! If we find something we like we can move anytime! I had a lot of stress about having a slow sale of our current home so this was best for us. Iím very happy to space out the sell and the buy. If moving isnít difficult for you I would recommend this. Go look with a realtor for rentals and homes for sale. If you found something you liked it would make this so much easier!!

cchrissyy

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #38 on: July 18, 2020, 09:07:18 PM »
don't think of rent as a sunk cost

rent is exchanging money for a place to live. you need a place to live. cool!

it buys a ticket to the school system you want to be in. great!

it means you have time to carefully choose the next home, no pressure. great!

you expect house prices to fall in the coming years. if true, the whole time you are renting you are moving closer to a future lower purchase price or easier buyer's market. cool!

renting means you can get out of this house and make it ready for market while you think prices are still good. great!

you expect to net more than $500k from the sale of your current house. while you're paying rent you are not paying what you currently spend on PITI and you'll have a large lump sum conservatively invested for however long you stay.


you have too much money to be stressing about small differences in purchase prices or the cost per square foot. when choosing the 15-year family home you should probably pay more attention to how easy it is to walk to school, or where do your kids friends live, or if there is a certain park or church or whatever you want to be close to.  IMO you should rent close to the school and learn the neighborhoods very well. In time, you will know where your kids' best friends or activities and sports are.  I doubt that moving out of boundaries will make sense at that point. but it might, and that is the time you will be prepared to decide it. not now.

jeromedawg

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #39 on: July 18, 2020, 09:50:27 PM »
don't think of rent as a sunk cost

rent is exchanging money for a place to live. you need a place to live. cool!

it buys a ticket to the school system you want to be in. great!

it means you have time to carefully choose the next home, no pressure. great!

you expect house prices to fall in the coming years. if true, the whole time you are renting you are moving closer to a future lower purchase price or easier buyer's market. cool!

renting means you can get out of this house and make it ready for market while you think prices are still good. great!

you expect to net more than $500k from the sale of your current house. while you're paying rent you are not paying what you currently spend on PITI and you'll have a large lump sum conservatively invested for however long you stay.


you have too much money to be stressing about small differences in purchase prices or the cost per square foot. when choosing the 15-year family home you should probably pay more attention to how easy it is to walk to school, or where do your kids friends live, or if there is a certain park or church or whatever you want to be close to.  IMO you should rent close to the school and learn the neighborhoods very well. In time, you will know where your kids' best friends or activities and sports are.  I doubt that moving out of boundaries will make sense at that point. but it might, and that is the time you will be prepared to decide it. not now.

We are selling our house right now. We are still living here. It is tough!! I wish we had decided to sell after moving. There is no where to go when we have showings. We are both working from home. We haven’t refused a showing yet, but we did have to kick a showing out who overstayed their time slot by 30 minutes! We needed to work.

The market is high right now!! I read that the low interest rates are allowing home prices to rise 7% from the beginning of the year (same monthly payment).

We will rent for 1 year, but we can get out of our lease anytime by paying a 1 month rent fee. That’s awesome! If we find something we like we can move anytime! I had a lot of stress about having a slow sale of our current home so this was best for us. I’m very happy to space out the sell and the buy. If moving isn’t difficult for you I would recommend this. Go look with a realtor for rentals and homes for sale. If you found something you liked it would make this so much easier!!

Please don't do this.

Rent in your target neighborhood.  Legitimately establish a residence there and see if you like living there enough to pay for a house in the school boundary.  If not, that's fine - you can buy in the other neighborhood and still keep your seat in the school.  But don't go playing ethically questionable games like pretending a studio apartment is the primary residence for a family of four. 





The other reason we are considering buying outside the boundary besides the home prices is that the current middle school and high school to continue the immersion program are in different neighborhood boundaries lol - if we moved a bit north of where the initial school boundary is for the elementary, we'd be right in the 'sweet spot' as far as commuting between all three schools. The immersion program is rare in that it goes from k-12: the middle and high school extends the program through the language electives. So that would definitely play a factor in all this.

Yea, I ultimately don't feel comfortable with the notion of renting a studio apartment solely as a placeholder. What we *may* consider doing though is to rent a small 2/2 or 2/1 unit and pay for storage as needed for the rest of the stuff that we couldn't bring to fit or left for staging at the current place.
This would actually end up costing less than renting a bigger place BUT we would also have to deal with multiple moves of items.
Actually, the place we are considering renting the 2/2 or 2/1 unit from is great because they are offering a concession currently where you can break a 12 month lease at any time just by giving 30 days written notice and you will not be penalized. But in addition to that, there are more options available as far as immediate move-ins are concerned. So we could theoretically move out of the current place ASAP (faster than looking for a private landlord rental unit or messing with rentback/contingent offers) and vacate the place, which is HUGE. So this would afford us even more flexibility to shop around for a new home in or outside of the neighborhood and be ready to move and not be locked into something (or have to deal with finding replacement tenants and paying for lost rent etc) for a full 12 months. It gives us options and costs less, but of course at the expense of a smaller space and multiple moves, etc.

« Last Edit: July 18, 2020, 09:55:02 PM by jeromedawg »

Zamboni

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #40 on: July 19, 2020, 07:48:48 AM »
You are over thinking this.

You know where you need to live. You need to be there by February. OMG that is so soon! Just based upon that, you need to get your house on the market now.

If it sells fast (Yay!), then you will still have at least a few weeks to figure out where you are going to live. I've never seen a house sale close in less than two weeks, for example. Most take 1-2 months to close. You can live there that whole time. You can try to negotiate a rent-back later if you need to, but I wouldn't even mention that to the agent right now. You don't know what kind of offers you will get until you start getting offers, and you can't get offers until prospective buyers are looking at it. Get it on the market! Get some bids!

When I needed to move fast, I sold my home to OpenDoor. I have a large dog and didn't want to deal with the hassle of taking her out for showings. Plus her presence meant pet odors, which buyers don't like, and I'd have to vacuum up her fur pretty much daily, which I don't like. Not sure if they buy homes in your area, but they were really easy to work with. I got an offer from them right away, but they give you a long time to think about their offer, so I took that time to have other similar companies give me offers (Zillow and a local real estate investor who buys homes) and I also got "what sales price do you recommend" solid quotes with comps from two realtors I know and trust and one random realtor. All of the "price it right" realtor pricing suggestions were completely on target with what I already knew from looking up my own comps in the area, and were about the same or even lower than the OpenDoor offer I already had! I did used my spreadsheet powers to include all costs and figure out that I would most likely lose money if I went any route besides OpenDoor.

I did some low level surface cleaning and decluttering before OpenDoor came to view it, but I didn't paint or get new carpet or stage of anything (they don't care about that.) Some areas were in great shape and some were terrible, like the wall behind the stove that was half unpainted because we took out the giant hood a year before. They had already made me an offer within a day or two of my initial online request, which was actually a fair valuation based upon subsequent data I collected, and then they only reduced their offer a tiny bit after their walk through ($2K lower, which I successfully appealed, so it was back to a full offer!) It's normal for buyers to come back and try to lower the sales price after inspection! They do charge a "real estate commission", which is how they make their money, but I ask them to lower that percentage by a point, telling them I had a new roof and new siding, and they did! I went from contacting them to having a closed sale and a six figure check for my sales proceeds in my bank account in about a month. Easy peasy!

OpenDoor did offer to rent it back to me AFTER closing (so I already had the sales proceeds), but I decided to just move out. It then took them over 3 months to sell it, which is not terrible but it would have stressed me out because it didn't sell until January. They sold it for 3% more than they paid me. Good for them! They also painted it, trimmed up my absolutely out of control bushes in the front and back, deep cleaned, mowed the whole time, etc. So, it wasn't pure profit for them, and it wasn't very much money in the grand scheme of things. And, honestly, it was worth it to me to just have the money fast to make the giant down payment on my new home, which I absolutely love!

Stop over thinking this. You need to sell your house and you need to move to a very specific location.

You are putting way too much drama into renting. Yes, the first place sounded bad, so I'm glad you bailed on that one, but most places will be okay so just find a home or rental in the location needed for the elementary school and move. Seriously. I once had to help a relative find a place to live after a home fire. We found a reasonable place to rent and he was living in the new place within 4 days of the fire. He had almost nothing to move (fire sucks), so he bought a new mattress the day he picked up the keys and spent the next month furnishing it beautifully with a selection of furniture in his preferred style off of Craigslist and art from the local thrift shop. He only lived there for a year, but it was exactly what he needed at the time. So your hemming and hawing just seems ridiculous, in comparison. Yes, this process is going to cost you some money, whether it is hiring painters or renting a storage unit or paying movers. Relocations cost money. But, remember, time is money as well! If you try to nickle and dime too much, then you will drive yourself crazy.

Another Reader

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #41 on: July 19, 2020, 08:43:33 AM »
Every day you sit on your hands is a day closer to the election.  In your shoes, my goal would be to be moved by August 1 and on the market a week after that.  The market can turn quickly.  Don't lose your opportunity to get the place sold. Sign a lease and focus on getting this done.

jeromedawg

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #42 on: July 19, 2020, 10:02:41 AM »
Every day you sit on your hands is a day closer to the election.  In your shoes, my goal would be to be moved by August 1 and on the market a week after that.  The market can turn quickly.  Don't lose your opportunity to get the place sold. Sign a lease and focus on getting this done.

Yep, I'm about to put a hold on a 2 bed 1 bath place to hold us over. Trying to get a painter to come end of next week so we can get that knocked out. Hopefully it doesn't take too long. We plan to leverage our garage space and much of the existing furniture for staging, which should help with not having to move as much... will have to deal with getting all that stuff into a storage unit when the time comes.

EDIT: do you think it's better just to buy a storage unit *now*? Or should we just do it when the current place goes into escrow? Since we'll be using the garage to store a majority of our stuff, I'd lean towards just getting the storage unit once we get into escrow. Of course, I don't know how fast things will move either. And I also don't know how easy or hard it is to find a properly sized storage unit for our needs (I'm thinking we would need a 10x15 or maybe 10x20).
« Last Edit: July 19, 2020, 10:53:48 AM by jeromedawg »

BNgarden

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #43 on: July 19, 2020, 11:13:56 AM »
Research storage options so you know what sizes are (readily) available, and what price deals / discounts are on.  It may be that the first XX days are free (as they were for us) and you only pay starting a couple of months down the road.  Then you have your answer (on the cost front at least). 

From our personal experience, one move into storage now, (particularly if you know your things won't all fit the new rental), then a move out when you buy.  You have to choose what to store quickly, but that shouldn't be as big a task as trying to find all the things you want to use in the rental but have mixed into the garage storage.  Plus, keeping your parking / storage place cleared out gives buyers a better idea of their usefulness, and doesn't suggest that the place you're selling is too small for them.  You also get more options for staging your place if you have some room left in your storage.

jeromedawg

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #44 on: July 19, 2020, 11:34:22 AM »
Research storage options so you know what sizes are (readily) available, and what price deals / discounts are on.  It may be that the first XX days are free (as they were for us) and you only pay starting a couple of months down the road.  Then you have your answer (on the cost front at least). 

From our personal experience, one move into storage now, (particularly if you know your things won't all fit the new rental), then a move out when you buy.  You have to choose what to store quickly, but that shouldn't be as big a task as trying to find all the things you want to use in the rental but have mixed into the garage storage.  Plus, keeping your parking / storage place cleared out gives buyers a better idea of their usefulness, and doesn't suggest that the place you're selling is too small for them.  You also get more options for staging your place if you have some room left in your storage.

Ah ok. we have a ton of packing still left to do. What sort of complicates things is that the stager who we had come in suggested using some of the current furniture pieces, which happen to be the biggest items (esp our master bedroom set - king bed/mattress, two dresser drawers, two nightstands). Whatever else we move is going to be whatever personal belongings we can't fit at the new place. My realtor was saying that the garage isn't as big of a deal though, especially I think because it's a condo unit. However, we're a corner unit and the garage has lots of storage and a high vaulted ceiling, so I think it might actually be sort of a beneficial thing to show. We'll play it by ear - I think we'll have a bit of time to figure stuff out. I ended up putting the hold on the apartment, so we have that squared away.

Villanelle

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #45 on: July 19, 2020, 02:16:51 PM »
Research storage options so you know what sizes are (readily) available, and what price deals / discounts are on.  It may be that the first XX days are free (as they were for us) and you only pay starting a couple of months down the road.  Then you have your answer (on the cost front at least). 

From our personal experience, one move into storage now, (particularly if you know your things won't all fit the new rental), then a move out when you buy.  You have to choose what to store quickly, but that shouldn't be as big a task as trying to find all the things you want to use in the rental but have mixed into the garage storage.  Plus, keeping your parking / storage place cleared out gives buyers a better idea of their usefulness, and doesn't suggest that the place you're selling is too small for them.  You also get more options for staging your place if you have some room left in your storage.

Ah ok. we have a ton of packing still left to do. What sort of complicates things is that the stager who we had come in suggested using some of the current furniture pieces, which happen to be the biggest items (esp our master bedroom set - king bed/mattress, two dresser drawers, two nightstands). Whatever else we move is going to be whatever personal belongings we can't fit at the new place. My realtor was saying that the garage isn't as big of a deal though, especially I think because it's a condo unit. However, we're a corner unit and the garage has lots of storage and a high vaulted ceiling, so I think it might actually be sort of a beneficial thing to show. We'll play it by ear - I think we'll have a bit of time to figure stuff out. I ended up putting the hold on the apartment, so we have that squared away.

If the market is as hot as your agent seems to be pushing, why do you need to pay for professional staging?  "Things are flying off the market!" and "you need to spend money to make sure your place shows especially well" seem to be somewhat in conflict.  Clean it up, box up what you can, do some basic rearranging if it makes thing feel more spacious, but don't pay a stager. 

jeromedawg

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #46 on: July 19, 2020, 06:07:40 PM »
Research storage options so you know what sizes are (readily) available, and what price deals / discounts are on.  It may be that the first XX days are free (as they were for us) and you only pay starting a couple of months down the road.  Then you have your answer (on the cost front at least). 

From our personal experience, one move into storage now, (particularly if you know your things won't all fit the new rental), then a move out when you buy.  You have to choose what to store quickly, but that shouldn't be as big a task as trying to find all the things you want to use in the rental but have mixed into the garage storage.  Plus, keeping your parking / storage place cleared out gives buyers a better idea of their usefulness, and doesn't suggest that the place you're selling is too small for them.  You also get more options for staging your place if you have some room left in your storage.

Ah ok. we have a ton of packing still left to do. What sort of complicates things is that the stager who we had come in suggested using some of the current furniture pieces, which happen to be the biggest items (esp our master bedroom set - king bed/mattress, two dresser drawers, two nightstands). Whatever else we move is going to be whatever personal belongings we can't fit at the new place. My realtor was saying that the garage isn't as big of a deal though, especially I think because it's a condo unit. However, we're a corner unit and the garage has lots of storage and a high vaulted ceiling, so I think it might actually be sort of a beneficial thing to show. We'll play it by ear - I think we'll have a bit of time to figure stuff out. I ended up putting the hold on the apartment, so we have that squared away.

If the market is as hot as your agent seems to be pushing, why do you need to pay for professional staging?  "Things are flying off the market!" and "you need to spend money to make sure your place shows especially well" seem to be somewhat in conflict.  Clean it up, box up what you can, do some basic rearranging if it makes thing feel more spacious, but don't pay a stager.

It's not just our agent but multiple others who have recommended "light staging" if anything. I just assumed staging was part of the deal with most realtors, especially since they commonly work with a stager to show your home to begin with. How much does staging cost? I know it has been said not to penny-pinch or to skimp or be a tightwad, so would the cost of professional staging really be that significant in the big picture and if it adds any sort of value (maybe it means the place sells faster or you get more offers in a shorter time frame and incite a crazier bidding war?). I'm clarifying with my realtor what the staging costs are, because it was someone on his team (the wife of the owner of the group) who was giving ideas on staging. So maybe it's not so much paying extra for a stager as it is having a stager who is part of the team and where they're not charging 'extra' as a benefit. I haven't sold a home before (nor rented from a private landlord as clearly seen from above) so this is all new territory.

EDIT: just asked and it's not additional cost to me - maybe that's absorbed into the closing fees to my agent but honesty I don't think it's a big deal. He has already helped us out in so many ways and has been a great friend (even prior to him becoming a realtor), that even if he charges slightly more than others he has worked hard for it.
« Last Edit: July 19, 2020, 06:25:30 PM by jeromedawg »

SailingOnASmallSailboat

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #47 on: July 19, 2020, 06:12:39 PM »
We "staged" with our realtor's help by shifting furniture around to showcase the size of one of the rooms, all her idea.

Staging seems to run the gamut of "spend a zillion dollars hiring an interior designer" to "make sure the toilets are flushed and the garbage put out" and lots in between. Definitely ask the realtor what the cost is but it might not be any additional, as you surmised.

We had more than one person tell us how neat and tidy and well-kept our place is. We had decluttered significantly and touched up paint, but it wasn't much more than what we usually do. Making sure the house stands out (in a good way) is a great way to get offers.

srad

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #48 on: July 20, 2020, 09:42:17 AM »
I sold two homes last year, both were higher end for the area's.  On one, (which was my primary) we hired a stager to come over to our house and show us what to remove and where to put the existing furniture.  It was like $300 and made a noticeable difference.  The other our real estate agent paid for the staging.  Seems you like to ask for deals, ask if you agent will pony up for it, or at least half.

Dicey

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Re: Sell and rent dilemma
« Reply #49 on: August 18, 2020, 10:11:08 AM »
@jeromedawg, it's been a month with no updates. What's happening?