HELP! Hoarding Tenant and What is This? (New Photos!)

[Sandi_k]

It's a directed spot light.

[Dicey]

Can we lock/delete this thread? It's a hoarder, they hoard random and odd things. OP, yes it sucks for you, but posting random pictures of their room isn't going to help you. You already have plans to evict this tenant through owner move-in. Learn your lesson and move on.

Why on earth does it need to be locked?  OP is seeking information to understand what's happening in their property.  That hardly seems like a conversation we have to halt by locking a thread. 

Do you have a hoarder in your life?  Your reaction seems... disproportionate and makes me wonder if maybe it's not hitting a sore spot of some kind.

Agreed. It does feel a bit harsh. We learn from each other here. Perhaps this will help others realize that landlording is not free money.

[GilesMM]

Can we lock/delete this thread? It's a hoarder, they hoard random and odd things. OP, yes it sucks for you, but posting random pictures of their room isn't going to help you. You already have plans to evict this tenant through owner move-in. Learn your lesson and move on.

So sensitive. Are you the tenant?  Or perhaps a home brewer or grower?? Hoarder?

[rothwem]

Can we lock/delete this thread? It's a hoarder, they hoard random and odd things. OP, yes it sucks for you, but posting random pictures of their room isn't going to help you. You already have plans to evict this tenant through owner move-in. Learn your lesson and move on.

Why on earth does it need to be locked?  OP is seeking information to understand what's happening in their property.  That hardly seems like a conversation we have to halt by locking a thread. 

Do you have a hoarder in your life?  Your reaction seems... disproportionate and makes me wonder if maybe it's not hitting a sore spot of some kind.

Agreed. It does feel a bit harsh. We learn from each other here. Perhaps this will help others realize that landlording is not free money.

At the same time, it does feel like a bit of an invasion of privacy and public shaming of someone that might have a mental health disorder. 

OP needs to start the eviction process, or get her hands out of this guy's business.  And stop posting pictures of this guys home (and yes, its HIS HOME per the lease). 

Jeez, and I'm a landlord too, and normally I tend to side with the landlord on stuff. 

[Dicey]

Can we lock/delete this thread? It's a hoarder, they hoard random and odd things. OP, yes it sucks for you, but posting random pictures of their room isn't going to help you. You already have plans to evict this tenant through owner move-in. Learn your lesson and move on.

Why on earth does it need to be locked?  OP is seeking information to understand what's happening in their property.  That hardly seems like a conversation we have to halt by locking a thread. 

Do you have a hoarder in your life?  Your reaction seems... disproportionate and makes me wonder if maybe it's not hitting a sore spot of some kind.

Agreed. It does feel a bit harsh. We learn from each other here. Perhaps this will help others realize that landlording is not free money.

At the same time, it does feel like a bit of an invasion of privacy and public shaming of someone that might have a mental health disorder. 

OP needs to start the eviction process, or get her hands out of this guy's business.  And stop posting pictures of this guys home (and yes, its HIS HOME per the lease). 

Jeez, and I'm a landlord too, and normally I tend to side with the landlord on stuff.

I see your point, and I don't entirely disagree. However, I'm going to give OP some grace. Perhaps she is afraid and wants to approach with caution. She's asking for help in a tricky situation on an anonymous forum, which is a perfectly reasonable place to ask. It may be "HIS HOME", but he does not own it. "Per the lease", the owner is also legally entitled to make sure the tenant is not abusing the property. Nothing in the pictures gives away his location or identity. Calling it public shaming is a stretch.

[InterfaceLeader]

It is illegal to take photos of your tenants possessions without consent. The only time this is not the case is if you are carrying out a repair.

The tenant may or may not be breaking the law. The landlord, however, is.

[Samuel]

It is illegal to take photos of your tenants possessions without consent. The only time this is not the case is if you are carrying out a repair.

The tenant may or may not be breaking the law. The landlord, however, is.

This probably varies quite a bit by jurisdiction. Most places it's probably fine during announced inspections.

[PMJL34]

yeah, I should have expanded more.

I get the first couple of pictures, but OP keeps posting more and more pictures (the most recent one is 2 full months after the first), I believe OP crossed the line into public shaming and I feel it's wrong to keep posting personal photos/items of a person without their consent. It is their house after all and we as the owners need to not only respect, but protect their privacy and peace. Plus it's a small world and you never know who is on this forum and OP just needs to be more careful imo.

OP is already doing an owner move in and will be evicting this tenant. There isn't any questions anymore. OP also admitted to being an absentee rental owner. It feels like OP is just trying to get back at the renter at this point. If there were true concerns, OP can call law enforcement/APS/fire dept/etc. but instead here we are.

And no, I have no strong feeling one way or another about hoarding or this situation lol. Just voiced my opinion that this thread has run it's course.

 

[Villanelle]

yeah, I should have expanded more.

I get the first couple of pictures, but OP keeps posting more and more pictures (the most recent one is 2 full months after the first), I believe OP crossed the line into public shaming and I feel it's wrong to keep posting personal photos/items of a person without their consent. It is their house after all and we as the owners need to not only respect, but protect their privacy and peace. Plus it's a small world and you never know who is on this forum and OP just needs to be more careful imo.

OP is already doing an owner move in and will be evicting this tenant. There isn't any questions anymore. OP also admitted to being an absentee rental owner. It feels like OP is just trying to get back at the renter at this point. If there were true concerns, OP can call law enforcement/APS/fire dept/etc. but instead here we are.

And no, I have no strong feeling one way or another about hoarding or this situation lol. Just voiced my opinion that this thread has run it's course.

It seems to me like this is what the OP is trying to determine.  She's asking what this stuff is so she knows whether there is illegal activity, or just a hoarding tenant who likes to home brew (or whatever). 

[nereo]

yeah, I should have expanded more.

I get the first couple of pictures, but OP keeps posting more and more pictures (the most recent one is 2 full months after the first), I believe OP crossed the line into public shaming and I feel it's wrong to keep posting personal photos/items of a person without their consent. It is their house after all and we as the owners need to not only respect, but protect their privacy and peace. Plus it's a small world and you never know who is on this forum and OP just needs to be more careful imo.

OP is already doing an owner move in and will be evicting this tenant. There isn't any questions anymore. OP also admitted to being an absentee rental owner. It feels like OP is just trying to get back at the renter at this point. If there were true concerns, OP can call law enforcement/APS/fire dept/etc. but instead here we are.

And no, I have no strong feeling one way or another about hoarding or this situation lol. Just voiced my opinion that this thread has run it's course.

I’m someone who takes my privacy seriously, and how has been both a landlord and a renter in the last two years.  However, I don’t think this hits the mark for either privacy or public shaming. There is nothing I can see that connects the photos to an individual. OP has not given the city, let alone the address.

[LightStache]

In terms of privacy, the OP hasn't included any personally identifying information, so I would doubt that a Canadian court would find against them. Also, there's an argument to be made that there is little presumption of privacy when an announced visit is being made, and the photos  pertained to the satisfactory maintenance of the OP's property.

Having kids in that environment is heartbreaking. It might also provide you with another avenue of approach. Since the rental market and homelessness issue in BC are so insane, my guess is that local authorities will try to drag their feet on an eviction. You have my sympathies.

However, if the home is filthy, or if you believe that unsafe activities are taking place there, you could report them to Child and Family Services, and let them know that (at very least) the parents have disconnected the smoke detectors. Reporting them would ensure that your relationship would sour, but it might motivate them to look for other accommodations, where the landlord isn't reporting them to CFS.

You think that having kids in that environment is "heartbreaking," but calling CFS to harass them out of the place wouldn't be way more evil? Wow.

[Dicey]

In terms of privacy, the OP hasn't included any personally identifying information, so I would doubt that a Canadian court would find against them. Also, there's an argument to be made that there is little presumption of privacy when an announced visit is being made, and the photos  pertained to the satisfactory maintenance of the OP's property.

Having kids in that environment is heartbreaking. It might also provide you with another avenue of approach. Since the rental market and homelessness issue in BC are so insane, my guess is that local authorities will try to drag their feet on an eviction. You have my sympathies.

However, if the home is filthy, or if you believe that unsafe activities are taking place there, you could report them to Child and Family Services, and let them know that (at very least) the parents have disconnected the smoke detectors. Reporting them would ensure that your relationship would sour, but it might motivate them to look for other accommodations, where the landlord isn't reporting them to CFS.

You think that having kids in that environment is "heartbreaking," but calling CFS to harass them out of the place wouldn't be way more evil? Wow.

OMG, there have been so many pitiful stories of parental neglect lately. If calling CFS is what it takes to save those kids, so be it. That question indicates a warped interpretation of "evil", IMO.

[LightStache]

In terms of privacy, the OP hasn't included any personally identifying information, so I would doubt that a Canadian court would find against them. Also, there's an argument to be made that there is little presumption of privacy when an announced visit is being made, and the photos  pertained to the satisfactory maintenance of the OP's property.

Having kids in that environment is heartbreaking. It might also provide you with another avenue of approach. Since the rental market and homelessness issue in BC are so insane, my guess is that local authorities will try to drag their feet on an eviction. You have my sympathies.

However, if the home is filthy, or if you believe that unsafe activities are taking place there, you could report them to Child and Family Services, and let them know that (at very least) the parents have disconnected the smoke detectors. Reporting them would ensure that your relationship would sour, but it might motivate them to look for other accommodations, where the landlord isn't reporting them to CFS.

You think that having kids in that environment is "heartbreaking," but calling CFS to harass them out of the place wouldn't be way more evil? Wow.

OMG, there have been so many pitiful stories of parental neglect lately. If calling CFS is what it takes to save those kids, so be it. That question indicates a warped interpretation of "evil", IMO.

Right, but that's not the story here. The story is that the landlord thinks there's some weird stuff in a tenant's house. And the suggestion was to use CFS to harass the tenants out of their home, not to help the kids. Harassing a family to get them out of their home is not acting in the interest of the children.

[uniwelder]

In terms of privacy, the OP hasn't included any personally identifying information, so I would doubt that a Canadian court would find against them. Also, there's an argument to be made that there is little presumption of privacy when an announced visit is being made, and the photos  pertained to the satisfactory maintenance of the OP's property.

Having kids in that environment is heartbreaking. It might also provide you with another avenue of approach. Since the rental market and homelessness issue in BC are so insane, my guess is that local authorities will try to drag their feet on an eviction. You have my sympathies.

However, if the home is filthy, or if you believe that unsafe activities are taking place there, you could report them to Child and Family Services, and let them know that (at very least) the parents have disconnected the smoke detectors. Reporting them would ensure that your relationship would sour, but it might motivate them to look for other accommodations, where the landlord isn't reporting them to CFS.

You think that having kids in that environment is "heartbreaking," but calling CFS to harass them out of the place wouldn't be way more evil? Wow.

OMG, there have been so many pitiful stories of parental neglect lately. If calling CFS is what it takes to save those kids, so be it. That question indicates a warped interpretation of "evil", IMO.

Right, but that's not the story here. The story is that the landlord thinks there's some weird stuff in a tenant's house. And the suggestion was to use CFS to harass the tenants out of their home, not to help the kids. Harassing a family to get them out of their home is not acting in the interest of the children.

I might have missed it, but I don't think there any kids.  This series of 4 quoted messages are the only ones where I see kids being discussed throughout this thread, so its an imaginary concern.

[stoaX]

Every so often I toy with the idea of buying a condo in my community with the idea that I would move into it a few years from now.  I would rent it out in the meantime.  Posts like this bring me back to my senses.

[ChpBstrd]

LL in my neighborhood just evicted an 80 year old lady who was a hoarder.

They found a dead cat amid debris in the back bedroom. The lady thought it ran away.

[rothwem]

Every so often I toy with the idea of buying a condo in my community with the idea that I would move into it a few years from now.  I would rent it out in the meantime.  Posts like this bring me back to my senses.

Yeah, and I also think that SC has some pretty gnarly property taxes for second homes to try to discourage rental property ownership. 

[LightStache]

[snip]

I might have missed it, but I don't think there any kids.  This series of 4 quoted messages are the only ones where I see kids being discussed throughout this thread, so its an imaginary concern.

Yes I think you're right. Thanks for realigning us to the facts.

[Dancin'Dog]

LL in my neighborhood just evicted an 80 year old lady who was a hoarder.

They found a dead cat amid debris in the back bedroom. The lady thought it ran away.

I watched the Hoarders TV series awhile ago and it was crazy.  Dozen of dead cats, thousands of rats, trash and feces (often human) piled high, etc.. Most seemed to he elderly women but the "man hoardes" we're even more impressive too and often covered acres of land with a massive amount of stuff. Many were renters.

While I do understand it's a mental health issue, I don't think anyone renting out a property should be subject to that - nor should the neighbors.

But we'd miss out on some really entertaining TV. 

[Miss Piggy]

LL in my neighborhood just evicted an 80 year old lady who was a hoarder.

They found a dead cat amid debris in the back bedroom. The lady thought it ran away.

I watched the Hoarders TV series awhile ago and it was crazy.  Dozen of dead cats, thousands of rats, trash and feces (often human) piled high, etc.. Most seemed to he elderly women but the "man hoardes" we're even more impressive too and often covered acres of land with a massive amount of stuff. Many were renters.

While I do understand it's a mental health issue, I don't think anyone renting out a property should be subject to that - nor should the neighbors.

But we'd miss out on some really entertaining TV.

I watched that show exactly two times. It gave me nightmares. Actual, real nightmares for days after watching. So I decided it wasn't the show for me.

[rothwem]

LL in my neighborhood just evicted an 80 year old lady who was a hoarder.

They found a dead cat amid debris in the back bedroom. The lady thought it ran away.

I watched the Hoarders TV series awhile ago and it was crazy.  Dozen of dead cats, thousands of rats, trash and feces (often human) piled high, etc.. Most seemed to he elderly women but the "man hoardes" we're even more impressive too and often covered acres of land with a massive amount of stuff. Many were renters.

While I do understand it's a mental health issue, I don't think anyone renting out a property should be subject to that - nor should the neighbors.

But we'd miss out on some really entertaining TV.

I watched that show exactly two times. It gave me nightmares. Actual, real nightmares for days after watching. So I decided it wasn't the show for me.

Hahah you guys realize that show is fake, right?

All of those reality shows are complete crap. My cousin worked on the crew of storage wars and they “seeded” most/all of the units to make good television. One of my neighbors was on “homestead rescue” and they made up an entire storyline. Anyone who thinks reality TV is anything but crap to get you to watch the commercials they’ve inserted in there is a bigger sucker than I can even fathom.

[uniwelder]

In terms of privacy, the OP hasn't included any personally identifying information, so I would doubt that a Canadian court would find against them. Also, there's an argument to be made that there is little presumption of privacy when an announced visit is being made, and the photos  pertained to the satisfactory maintenance of the OP's property.

Having kids in that environment is heartbreaking. It might also provide you with another avenue of approach. Since the rental market and homelessness issue in BC are so insane, my guess is that local authorities will try to drag their feet on an eviction. You have my sympathies.

However, if the home is filthy, or if you believe that unsafe activities are taking place there, you could report them to Child and Family Services, and let them know that (at very least) the parents have disconnected the smoke detectors. Reporting them would ensure that your relationship would sour, but it might motivate them to look for other accommodations, where the landlord isn't reporting them to CFS.

You think that having kids in that environment is "heartbreaking," but calling CFS to harass them out of the place wouldn't be way more evil? Wow.

OMG, there have been so many pitiful stories of parental neglect lately. If calling CFS is what it takes to save those kids, so be it. That question indicates a warped interpretation of "evil", IMO.

Right, but that's not the story here. The story is that the landlord thinks there's some weird stuff in a tenant's house. And the suggestion was to use CFS to harass the tenants out of their home, not to help the kids. Harassing a family to get them out of their home is not acting in the interest of the children.

Point taken. I can be cold. I wasn't thinking about the children, because I don't think that I know enough about child welfare to decide whether it is better for the kids to stay with parents who disregard their welfare enough to disconnect smoke detectors or to go into care. Not my area. Better for CFS to decide. My suggestion was aimed at the landlord and her efforts to get the tenants to leave willingly. I think that calling CFS could help both the landlord and kids. I don't see the downside of calling in experts. It might even be an avenue to getting psychiatric care for the parents.

Why are you continuing with this?  There is nothing mentioned by OP indicating there are any kids living at the residence.

edited to add--- Also, why did you ignore my and LightStache's prior comments indicating kids living in the house hasn't been mentioned prior to you doing so?

[stoaX]

Every so often I toy with the idea of buying a condo in my community with the idea that I would move into it a few years from now.  I would rent it out in the meantime.  Posts like this bring me back to my senses.

Yeah, and I also think that SC has some pretty gnarly property taxes for second homes to try to discourage rental property ownership.

I don't know about the whole state, but yes, in my county an owner occupied house pays less property tax than one that is rented out.  When I last looked it was about 30% less.

[Villanelle]

LL in my neighborhood just evicted an 80 year old lady who was a hoarder.

They found a dead cat amid debris in the back bedroom. The lady thought it ran away.

I watched the Hoarders TV series awhile ago and it was crazy.  Dozen of dead cats, thousands of rats, trash and feces (often human) piled high, etc.. Most seemed to he elderly women but the "man hoardes" we're even more impressive too and often covered acres of land with a massive amount of stuff. Many were renters.

While I do understand it's a mental health issue, I don't think anyone renting out a property should be subject to that - nor should the neighbors.

But we'd miss out on some really entertaining TV.

I watched that show exactly two times. It gave me nightmares. Actual, real nightmares for days after watching. So I decided it wasn't the show for me.

Hahah you guys realize that show is fake, right?

All of those reality shows are complete crap. My cousin worked on the crew of storage wars and they “seeded” most/all of the units to make good television. One of my neighbors was on “homestead rescue” and they made up an entire storyline. Anyone who thinks reality TV is anything but crap to get you to watch the commercials they’ve inserted in there is a bigger sucker than I can even fathom.

But but but where did the prop people store 20 years of grandma's dirty diapers, containers full of urine, endless reams of maggot, mouse, rat and roach infested trash piled to the ceiling you had to crawl over, dead cats, and rotted food in order to stage the hoarded house? That must be a well paid job - poop prop master and rat wrangler lol.

I've seen enough RL hoarders to know that it's a real thing even if the show is staged. I don't blame the OP for wanted to evict tenants by any means possible if they won't clean up.

Yeah, my impression is that Hoarders is more "reality" than most reality shows.  And people definitely live like that.  My coroner sister once tile me a story about how she spent many minutes in a house where she was told there was a dead body, but couldn't find it.  And it wasn't a fresh dead body, so it stunk mightily, except the whole house smelled so bad that was a good location-finder, either. 

[uniwelder]

In terms of privacy, the OP hasn't included any personally identifying information, so I would doubt that a Canadian court would find against them. Also, there's an argument to be made that there is little presumption of privacy when an announced visit is being made, and the photos  pertained to the satisfactory maintenance of the OP's property.

Having kids in that environment is heartbreaking. It might also provide you with another avenue of approach. Since the rental market and homelessness issue in BC are so insane, my guess is that local authorities will try to drag their feet on an eviction. You have my sympathies.

However, if the home is filthy, or if you believe that unsafe activities are taking place there, you could report them to Child and Family Services, and let them know that (at very least) the parents have disconnected the smoke detectors. Reporting them would ensure that your relationship would sour, but it might motivate them to look for other accommodations, where the landlord isn't reporting them to CFS.

You think that having kids in that environment is "heartbreaking," but calling CFS to harass them out of the place wouldn't be way more evil? Wow.

OMG, there have been so many pitiful stories of parental neglect lately. If calling CFS is what it takes to save those kids, so be it. That question indicates a warped interpretation of "evil", IMO.

Right, but that's not the story here. The story is that the landlord thinks there's some weird stuff in a tenant's house. And the suggestion was to use CFS to harass the tenants out of their home, not to help the kids. Harassing a family to get them out of their home is not acting in the interest of the children.

Point taken. I can be cold. I wasn't thinking about the children, because I don't think that I know enough about child welfare to decide whether it is better for the kids to stay with parents who disregard their welfare enough to disconnect smoke detectors or to go into care. Not my area. Better for CFS to decide. My suggestion was aimed at the landlord and her efforts to get the tenants to leave willingly. I think that calling CFS could help both the landlord and kids. I don't see the downside of calling in experts. It might even be an avenue to getting psychiatric care for the parents.

Why are you continuing with this?  There is nothing mentioned by OP indicating there are any kids living at the residence.

edited to add--- Also, why did you ignore my and LightStache's prior comments indicating kids living in the house hasn't been mentioned prior to you doing so?

 When I saw your response to my comment, I felt that your response merited a comment.

 I replied without reading all of the following comments closely, so I missed the point that there were no kids. I had genuinely believed that the OP had mentioned there being kids in the house. I regret my error.

 Just to be clear, I'm not trying to upset you. I see this as a collaborative forum where we can exchange ideas, and I was trying to help the OP by adding an idea, and the forum community by commenting on Canadian privacy law (which I have studied).

 I would never deliberately harass the disabled. I am also disabled with a severe mental illness. I understand stigma acutely. My suggestion (to involve CFS in the case of the non-existant children) stems from a lack of sympathy for those who endanger the vulnerable and also the OPs investment. I accept that the issues are not tidily separate, and that I presented my suggestion with a lack of sensitivity. For that, I am sorry.

Sorry I came across so harsh.

[Car Jack]

Thread earmarked to point to with the next newbie wannabe landlord looking for "passive income".  I tend to point to VTI as my passive income.

[nereo]

Thread earmarked to point to with the next newbie wannabe landlord looking for "passive income".  I tend to point to VTI as my passive income.

I can’t stress how many discussions I’ve had with ‘never-been-landlords’ that having renters isn’t “passive income” - or that as landlords you will somehow never have issues with your tenants or time-consuming repairs that need to be done ASAP, or vacancies.  Some years you spend far more than you bring in, and spend dozens of hours doing it. 

You can make a ton of money with the right properties, but yeah - it’s not “passive” like owning VTI or other index funds.

[Metalcat]

Thread earmarked to point to with the next newbie wannabe landlord looking for "passive income".  I tend to point to VTI as my passive income.

I can’t stress how many discussions I’ve had with ‘never-been-landlords’ that having renters isn’t “passive income” - or that as landlords you will somehow never have issues with your tenants or time-consuming repairs that need to be done ASAP, or vacancies.  Some years you spend far more than you bring in, and spend dozens of hours doing it. 

You can make a ton of money with the right properties, but yeah - it’s not “passive” like owning VTI or other index funds.

About a year ago I was sitting on the floor of a rental unit crying my eyes out bawling "this is fucking horrible!"

And that's a GREAT rental property, totally worth it, minimal work and hassle, and I'm thrilled with the outcome. But yeah...not passive, like, AT ALL.

[nereo]

Another observation - I’ve known several “retired” landlords who earned far more than their annual spend in rent after accounting for expenses and vacancies.  They ultimately sold some or all of their properties to “cut down on work” and chose more shares over more doors

[Dancin'Dog]

The “right “ properties can sit vacant for years and still be great investments. 

[Omy]

Just sold my first rental...and I am thrilled!

It was almost never vacant and had very few problems, but when things go wrong it's NO fun.

[ChpBstrd]

Just sold my first rental...and I am thrilled!

You're making it sound like boat ownership.

Another observation - I’ve known several “retired” landlords who earned far more than their annual spend in rent after accounting for expenses and vacancies.  They ultimately sold some or all of their properties to “cut down on work” and chose more shares over more doors

I've also noticed LLs tend to get out of their properties to "retire" in their 60's/70's. But if rentals and stocks have similar return profiles, I've always wondered why not just start where you are going to end up?

[uniwelder]

Just sold my first rental...and I am thrilled!

You're making it sound like boat ownership.

Another observation - I’ve known several “retired” landlords who earned far more than their annual spend in rent after accounting for expenses and vacancies.  They ultimately sold some or all of their properties to “cut down on work” and chose more shares over more doors

I've also noticed LLs tend to get out of their properties to "retire" in their 60's/70's. But if rentals and stocks have similar return profiles, I've always wondered why not just start where you are going to end up?

I think sweat equity is a big reason.  I don't mind doing a bunch of work on my rentals now, but probably won't want to deal with them later in life.  As a young-ish landlord, I can make more money than in the stock market by fixing up houses and then renting them out (or selling), as long as I'm not counting my labor.  It allows someone who doesn't have a high paying job a way to get ahead quicker than they otherwise would.

[daverobev]

Just sold my first rental...and I am thrilled!

You're making it sound like boat ownership.

Another observation - I’ve known several “retired” landlords who earned far more than their annual spend in rent after accounting for expenses and vacancies.  They ultimately sold some or all of their properties to “cut down on work” and chose more shares over more doors

I've also noticed LLs tend to get out of their properties to "retire" in their 60's/70's. But if rentals and stocks have similar return profiles, I've always wondered why not just start where you are going to end up?

I think sweat equity is a big reason.  I don't mind doing a bunch of work on my rentals now, but probably won't want to deal with them later in life.  As a young-ish landlord, I can make more money than in the stock market by fixing up houses and then renting them out (or selling), as long as I'm not counting my labor.  It allows someone who doesn't have a high paying job a way to get ahead quicker than they otherwise would.

And/or the leverage.

[GuitarStv]

LL in my neighborhood just evicted an 80 year old lady who was a hoarder.

They found a dead cat amid debris in the back bedroom. The lady thought it ran away.

I watched the Hoarders TV series awhile ago and it was crazy.  Dozen of dead cats, thousands of rats, trash and feces (often human) piled high, etc.. Most seemed to he elderly women but the "man hoardes" we're even more impressive too and often covered acres of land with a massive amount of stuff. Many were renters.

While I do understand it's a mental health issue, I don't think anyone renting out a property should be subject to that - nor should the neighbors.

But we'd miss out on some really entertaining TV.

I watched that show exactly two times. It gave me nightmares. Actual, real nightmares for days after watching. So I decided it wasn't the show for me.

Hahah you guys realize that show is fake, right?

All of those reality shows are complete crap. My cousin worked on the crew of storage wars and they “seeded” most/all of the units to make good television. One of my neighbors was on “homestead rescue” and they made up an entire storyline. Anyone who thinks reality TV is anything but crap to get you to watch the commercials they’ve inserted in there is a bigger sucker than I can even fathom.

But but but where did the prop people store 20 years of grandma's dirty diapers, containers full of urine, endless reams of maggot, mouse, rat and roach infested trash piled to the ceiling you had to crawl over, dead cats, and rotted food in order to stage the hoarded house? That must be a well paid job - poop prop master and rat wrangler lol.

I've seen enough RL hoarders to know that it's a real thing even if the show is staged. I don't blame the OP for wanted to evict tenants by any means possible if they won't clean up.

Yeah, my impression is that Hoarders is more "reality" than most reality shows.  And people definitely live like that.  My coroner sister once tile me a story about how she spent many minutes in a house where she was told there was a dead body, but couldn't find it.  And it wasn't a fresh dead body, so it stunk mightily, except the whole house smelled so bad that was a good location-finder, either.

Hoarding is a real and terrifying thing.  I helped my dad clean up a rental of an old man with a hoarding problem who had had to be put into a home by his family when he lost his marbles.  The old guy had been living in the same location for about fifty years (It was a house that I believe he built in his youth), and collected musical instruments (family wanted nothing to do with his stuff):

Kitchen:


Master bedroom:


Guest bedroom:


Living room:


The guy had filled up every room of the house with guitars and violins.  Filled 'em floor to ceiling and one by one.  Then he couldn't get into the rooms any more, so he just stopped trying.  The roof eventually started leaking, but the guy didn't notice since it was leaking in some of the filled rooms.  Almost all the instruments were destroyed by water damage and mouse droppings/urine (hell yes, there were a LOT of mice running around there).  Eventually he could only access a small part of the counter in the kitchen with a microwave, the bathroom, and a patch of floor in the living room.  So he put a space heater in the living room and used that through the cold Ottawa winters when the furnace stopped working and he couldn't get to it to fix it.  It is a miracle the place didn't burn to the ground with him in it and that he didn't get sick enough to die from the diseases from the mice.

I think in the end we counted more than 400 guitars in this small house and a solid 80 or so violins.  About 20 of them were salvageable to sell, then rest got bulldozed with the house.  I spent three days going through the crap with a respirator and full body suit to get that (really hurt my soul to throw away so many instruments but they were wrecked).

[Dicey]

So sad that his hoarding effectively silenced all those lovely voices. Imagine the happiness he could have created by sharing his treasure with the world.

[GuitarStv]

I tell you, it really makes me think twice every time I want to bring a new guitar home.  :P

[Omy]

We got into rentals unintentionally. The first rental was our first home. We didn't want to sell it at a loss when we bought our current home (a wonderful short sale in awesome condition)...so we turned it into a rental. Rented it for the past 12 years and just sold it at the top of the market.

The second rental was to help out a sibling who needed a good flexible rental that would take pets. Sibling has rented for 4 years and the place has appreciated $100k in that time. We will happily sell it when sibling is ready to move on.

While we weren't intentional about becoming landlords, net rents have covered our expenses and made the transition to FIRE easier emotionally because we haven't had to sell any stocks to cover our expenses in our first 4 years of retirement. Now that we're 4 years in  (and have a higher net worth than we did in 2019), we no longer need rentals as an emotional crutch.

[stoaX]

So sad that his hoarding effectively silenced all those lovely voices. Imagine the happiness he could have created by sharing his treasure with the world.

Amen.

My soul hurt just reading about it.

[ChpBstrd]

So sad that his hoarding effectively silenced all those lovely voices. Imagine the happiness he could have created by sharing his treasure with the world.

Amen.

My soul hurt just reading about it.

IDK. Is there really a shortage of guitars in the world? Can a person who wants a guitar not obtain one at a reasonable price for the quality? It seems to me that they are simply manufactured objects just like all the other manufactured objects we hoard. In a world of mass production and planet-spanning supply chains, the only limit is demand. More demand would equal more production.

We should not mourn objects. Every one of our treasures will arrive in a landfill someday. If anything mourn the planet for all the waste and pollution that was generated just to support this person's hoarding habit. Maybe also mourn the person, who seems to have gotten lost and centered their life around an abstract symbol of happiness rather than the real thing. 

[stoaX]

So sad that his hoarding effectively silenced all those lovely voices. Imagine the happiness he could have created by sharing his treasure with the world.

Amen.

My soul hurt just reading about it.

IDK. Is there really a shortage of guitars in the world? Can a person who wants a guitar not obtain one at a reasonable price for the quality? It seems to me that they are simply manufactured objects just like all the other manufactured objects we hoard. In a world of mass production and planet-spanning supply chains, the only limit is demand. More demand would equal more production.

We should not mourn objects. Every one of our treasures will arrive in a landfill someday. If anything mourn the planet for all the waste and pollution that was generated just to support this person's hoarding habit. Maybe also mourn the person, who seems to have gotten lost and centered their life around an abstract symbol of happiness rather than the real thing.

Logically I agree with you, except for these considerations:
-there are some guitars and violins that improve with age and playing,
-it would've been better for the environment if those instruments would've landed in the hands of people who would've played them and not have purchased a new instrument.
-finally, some people may have benefitted financially by purchasing some of those instruments used instead of buying new.

[Villanelle]

So sad that his hoarding effectively silenced all those lovely voices. Imagine the happiness he could have created by sharing his treasure with the world.

Amen.

My soul hurt just reading about it.

IDK. Is there really a shortage of guitars in the world? Can a person who wants a guitar not obtain one at a reasonable price for the quality? It seems to me that they are simply manufactured objects just like all the other manufactured objects we hoard. In a world of mass production and planet-spanning supply chains, the only limit is demand. More demand would equal more production.

We should not mourn objects. Every one of our treasures will arrive in a landfill someday. If anything mourn the planet for all the waste and pollution that was generated just to support this person's hoarding habit. Maybe also mourn the person, who seems to have gotten lost and centered their life around an abstract symbol of happiness rather than the real thing.

There are many, many kids who would love to play an instrument and can't afford to do so.  Sometimes schools have loaners, but often lower income area schools--the ones that are mostly likely to need loaner instruments--are the ones who have the fewest options, or they are old and in awful condition.

So yeah, plenty of people who want guitars can't obtain them.