Author Topic: Could you fire in Canada with 170K?  (Read 3321 times)

Jupiter

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Could you fire in Canada with 170K?
« on: December 17, 2015, 12:18:12 AM »
I'm from Australia and 5 months ago bought a one bedroom ground floor apartment a little north of sydney for just under 600K (522K on the loan left but I have 100K+ in forex). That's pretty average for Sydney. But... Canada, I went on realtor.ca and found 2-4 bedroom houses that looked just fine in the 60-100K range (do people even get mortgages there? You wouldn't think they would need to...)

I'm not looking to actually move to canada but I'm 21 with a networth of 171K and I'm wondering could I potentially FIRE in canada? Lets say I bought 3 properties there (don't really care where as long as crime is low) worth around 55K each with cash. The Aussie dollar is worth nearly the same at the moment so don't worry about currency conversion. I wouldn't be paying rent cause I own the place (I know I need to pay property fees like mantinance, bills and stupid land tax ect...) so my fees would be low but could I live off the rent of the two other properties while living in my third property? What kind of rent would I get for a property worth around 55K and would they be hard to find renters?
« Last Edit: December 17, 2015, 12:27:40 AM by Jupiter »

arebelspy

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Re: Could you fire in Canada with 170K?
« Reply #1 on: December 17, 2015, 12:55:30 AM »
Probably not, no.

But some people could, if their expenses were low enough, and they were handy enough to do any work needed themselves.

You're asking some good beginning questions, but first: are you actually INTERESTED in real estate, or becoming a landlord?  Or is it just some "get FIRE quick" scheme?
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Jupiter

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Re: Could you fire in Canada with 170K?
« Reply #2 on: December 17, 2015, 01:12:23 AM »
Of course I'm interested in real estate as general rent income is more predictable than forex, I hate forex, I just need a head start so that's why I'm into forex for now. Toronto looks like a nice place! I'd love to move there and live off $200 a week youtube income plus a rental property.
« Last Edit: December 17, 2015, 01:31:16 AM by Jupiter »

arebelspy

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Re: Could you fire in Canada with 170K?
« Reply #3 on: December 17, 2015, 01:45:00 AM »
Toronto is expensive.

Relying on YouTube income to infinity doesn't sound stable to me.

At some point (probably after getting bitten hard), you'll learn to dial back the risk some.

Start looking into fundamentals of real estate investing--read some of the real estate books in the recommended thread stickied in the real estate section of the forums.
I am a former teacher who accumulated a bunch of real estate, retired at 29, spent some time traveling the world full time and am now settled with three kids.
If you want to know more about me, this Business Insider profile tells the story pretty well.
I (rarely) blog at AdventuringAlong.com. Check out the Now page to see what I'm up to currently.

BarbeRiche

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Re: Could you fire in Canada with 170K?
« Reply #4 on: December 17, 2015, 02:02:45 AM »
60-100k houses seems REALLY low to me unless you want to live in a remote area.

Anywhere near a city (especially Toronto or Vancouver) you'll get a parking space for this price.

deborah

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Re: Could you fire in Canada with 170K?
« Reply #5 on: December 17, 2015, 02:05:03 AM »
You CAN buy properties that cheap in Australia - even in New South Wales - even half the price. But they won't be in Sydney.

Jupiter

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Re: Could you fire in Canada with 170K?
« Reply #6 on: December 17, 2015, 02:55:29 AM »
I've never been a house person to be honest. Apartment living in toronto would do fine. Of course, I won't actually be doing this but I was interested if It was possible. I say I'd be living off 20K per year max. It's just good to know if say I was absolutly at my wits end that I could move to Toronto and Fire earlier than I would in Sydney. Current Fire prediction for Sydney is 30 years old with 1 million networth but of course that's assuming I keep my current job and keep 100K invested in forex as well (withdrawing the profits every few months).

I'm interested in buying an investment property in sydney but only if the market collapses so I can take advantage of low prices and my current loan is under 200K. Just seems those living in Canada and the US have it so easy due to the much lower property prices (excluding new york). I don't see why anyone would rent if you could get a home of any sort for under 100K.

Anyway, question has been answered... Seems like it's possible to retire on 170K in Canada but it wouldn't be a very comfortable retirement.
« Last Edit: December 17, 2015, 02:57:58 AM by Jupiter »

marty998

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Re: Could you fire in Canada with 170K?
« Reply #7 on: December 17, 2015, 03:09:41 AM »
Jupiter, admire your ballsy enthusiam but lets get a little real.

If Sydney does come down a bit and you say you want to buy another place, how do you think you'll get finance when you have negative equity on you current investment property?

How are you going to stay under 80% to avoid very expensive LMI?

How are you going to prove servicing capacity in the event both properties are untenanted for a period of time?

What happens when interest rates rise?

Go over to propertychat.com.au

you'll get much similar responses over there.

Jupiter

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Re: Could you fire in Canada with 170K?
« Reply #8 on: December 17, 2015, 05:35:52 AM »
I'm talking years down the track and only if there is a massive drop in the market allowing me to grab a property in Sydney for 300K. Ultra unlikely though. I don't plan to get another loan until my current one is paid off in normal conditions. If I pay off the loan I'll save a deposit for a new property and only buy when the market collapse or I have enough money to buy the property in cash.

I'm pretty annoyed that my job required me to own a certain property thus why I had buy at a time when the market was high (2015) so I'm not letting that happen again. I'm only buying when the market is low. That goes for shares as well when I want to begin investing in them. As they say, I want to make my money on the purchase.

zephyr911

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Re: Could you fire in Canada with 170K?
« Reply #9 on: December 17, 2015, 07:02:05 AM »
In real estate, you'll almost always earn higher rates of return by using leverage. If I had $170K in free cash right now I'd put 20% down on the biggest complex I could find (and I'd FIRE not long after).

deborah

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Re: Could you fire in Canada with 170K?
« Reply #10 on: December 17, 2015, 03:32:48 PM »
In real estate, you'll almost always earn higher rates of return by using leverage. If I had $170K in free cash right now I'd put 20% down on the biggest complex I could find (and I'd FIRE not long after).
So you are talking about $850,000. That kind of money might buy you a very ordinary house in Sydney - no way would it buy more than a couple of appartments!

backyardfeast

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Re: Could you fire in Canada with 170K?
« Reply #11 on: December 17, 2015, 04:03:13 PM »
Ummm...better brush up on your geography a little.  I know Oz has super-expensive real estate right now, but just because you found some random listing online for a theoretically cheap home, doesn't mean that's representative of Canada!!

Toronto, Vancouver, and Victoria are almost as expensive as San Francisco or NYC...and Sydney.  My mother has her modest 2 br condo in a nice location in Vancouver up for sale at the moment for $850K.  Victoria has a rental apartment vacancy rate of about .5%; it's hard to get a nice 1 br anywhere in the central city for less than $1000/mo, although it's possible if you're willing to live in something less nice or in a slightly dodgier neighbourhood.  My sister just moved out of an OLD, dirty 1 br place in a great area in Vancouver, where they had been grandfathered a little in the rent.  When they moved out, the landlords raised their previously $950/mo rent to $1750.

Little experience with Toronto; it's a bigger city, so there may be a few neighborhood gems that aren't quite as high...but that's not the reputation.

And remember that, unlike Oz, in Canada, people pay for climate and services.  Those 50-60K homes?  Are they in rural Saskatchewan? If so, get ready for -30C winters...with all the home maintenance that requires...  Other cheap real estate areas, like New Brunswick or PEI, often come with very high home heating costs, property taxes, lower wages, and other expenses that balance out some of that initial affordability.

The problem here is that, much like Australia, we have a small population clustered in desirable areas, which raises prices.  To get cheap real estate, you have to go really rural and small...which can be a very different lifestyle.