Author Topic: Anyone try to sell a property lately?  (Read 3449 times)

MrBojangles

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Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« on: January 04, 2019, 08:06:40 AM »
Well, it was supposed to be a seller's market last summer...

A rising tide does not raise all ships!  Location. Location. Location.  Even in a seller's market.

Remodeled a kitchen, put in new floors throughout.  Realtor thought I would get multiple offers from the start, I ended up dropping the price about 2% and then another 3%, and no offers.

Challenges.  It's a rental property.  Potential buyers do not realize they are not buying the ratty couch.  Cat present and fairly neat (uses litter box fine) but cat hair.

Not to stereotype, and I had never tried to sell a house before, and with few properties for sale in the area, folks seem not to be desperate to buy a place anymore.  Millenials want perfection, perhaps they get help from parents and don't need a starter home, etc.  Also, they don't expect to do a lick of work.  When I grew up, fairly poor, you were just pleased to have a roof over your head.  It's not a bad area, fenced in yard, etc.  The school district gets ratings of 4 and 5.  A neighboring one gets 6 and 7s.

I had no idea the world revolver around school districts.  The other district is much more desirable.

Comments?  Would love to hear from sellers as well as Millenials, and others, who are purchasing homes.


FIPurpose

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #1 on: January 04, 2019, 09:04:17 AM »
Dude why the hate on Millennials? Sounds like you don't have a competitive house sale. That's all there is to it.

My SO and I are currently looking into buying a house and the market seems to be in a small decline, lots of houses available, and not everyone selling seems to have come to terms with that so we're fine waiting 6-12 months to see how things shake out. The houses that I see go quick are the ones that are priced well. I could care less if the house looks like it's a cookie cutter from the 90's. If I want to reno the kitchen I can do that, but I am going to expect an under-market value for not being up-to-date.

If I can choose between an old rental, and a personal property that was obviously loved for the same price, which one am I going to trust more?

Jon Bon

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #2 on: January 04, 2019, 09:18:07 AM »
Dude why the hate on Millennials? Sounds like you don't have a competitive house sale. That's all there is to it.

My SO and I are currently looking into buying a house and the market seems to be in a small decline, lots of houses available, and not everyone selling seems to have come to terms with that so we're fine waiting 6-12 months to see how things shake out. The houses that I see go quick are the ones that are priced well. I could care less if the house looks like it's a cookie cutter from the 90's. If I want to reno the kitchen I can do that, but I am going to expect an under-market value for not being up-to-date.

If I can choose between an old rental, and a personal property that was obviously loved for the same price, which one am I going to trust more?

I can totally see this, SFH buyers and millennial's (which I am) do not want to do any work what so ever. Most folks in my demo are not even willing to repaint a room. So they most definitely wont be able to see past the renters crappy belongings. Thus why people paint every room a neutral color and hire staging companies to put tiny furniture into it.

Selling a rental as primary residence to the buyer can be a tough sell.

englishteacheralex

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #3 on: January 04, 2019, 09:19:10 AM »
Drop the price. And try to avoid all the butt-hurt narratives about house-buyers. It's a business transaction. Mortgage rates are going up. The market is softening. That's all there is to it--drop the price.

If you could market it more effectively--you know, getting rid of the cat and the ratty sofa, having professional pictures taken, staging the place--you might be able to get your asking price. But you can't. You have a tenant. Getting rid of the tenant in order to sell the place more effectively doesn't seem to be an option? It might take too long and the market would soften even more? You'd lose out on a couple of months' rent? Well, ok. Then drop the price. A house is a piece of merchandise, granted a slightly more complex piece of merchandise than, say, a pair of shoes. But a lot of the same rules apply. If it's not selling, you have to drop the price, not blame the people who aren't buying it. If you want it gone, do like Target with Christmas tchochkes during the fabulous after Christmas sale: slash the price!

Bracken_Joy

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #4 on: January 04, 2019, 09:20:59 AM »
Seriously, what the hell with the millennial hate? I was going to answer your question- yes, I sold our house recently, in Nov, made a tidy profit with all the WORK we did on it- but I'd hate to break your millennial hating ideals here. Christ. I suppose I'll try anyway.

Yes, when we were buying, I DID pass on buying many houses with cats, because for those of us who are severely allergic, that means the potential of a full carpet replacement, repainting all walls, etc etc. The place we bought had indeed been a rental (for other millennials no less) before we bought it. It had been empty for months because their first deal fell through and they had to do some work. Filled with spiders and muggy as shit when we viewed it. Carpeting was in rough shape but was nearly 15 years old, so that was expected. Otherwise it was all just concerns with being outdated cosmetically, and old appliances and water heater that ended up needing replacement. We expected it to be a forever home, though that's not how life went. Replaced all light fixtures, did some plumbing, some painting, then we re-carpeted before we sold. We were on the market 2 days before our first offer, 4 days before the second.

Drop the price and swallow your pride.

rothwem

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #5 on: January 04, 2019, 09:21:02 AM »
I agree. Millennials are so entitled, wanting to buy a house that doesn’t suck at a competitive price.

Kroaler

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #6 on: January 04, 2019, 09:28:37 AM »

 with few properties for sale in the area, folks seem not to be desperate to buy a place anymore.  Millenials want perfection,

Honestly, as others have said, this isnt a millenial issue holding you back.  Its basic economics.

But it almost seems that you are upset that people arent so desperate that you can make a tidy profit at their expense?

waltworks

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #7 on: January 04, 2019, 09:31:58 AM »
All RE is local, but if you follow the larger markets in the US (just check CalculatedRisk every few weeks) you can pretty clearly see that the end of the big-time sellers market was spring 2018. Inventory is way, way up in many places, and with interest rates also up, prices are stagnant or in some places declining.

Now, the labor market is great and lending standards have been quite rigorous for the last decade. Barring some crazy black swan North Korean nuclear attack, we're not going to see a crash like 2007-2009. But if you're looking to sell a house, you need to temper your expectations and price pretty aggressively. Especially if you have a renter-occupied property that sounds like it shows like shit in a mediocre school district.

As those darn Millennials are so fond of saying, SMH.

Either ditch the renters (ie, pay them to leave) and stage/paint/etc, or else drop your price a lot (as in, 10% or more).

-W
« Last Edit: January 04, 2019, 09:34:16 AM by waltworks »

wbranch

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #8 on: January 04, 2019, 09:45:02 AM »
My wife and I have bought 4 houses. 2 were primary residences that we made painted + other small improvements that helped to get our money back plus a little after a couple years. This was in an area that was LCOL and the market did not come back as strong as some big metro areas. One was a small house/cabin with 100 acres in a very rural area. Extensive work on roof, foundation, clean up, etc. Planted thousands of trees, cleared some land, timber management plan for tax incentives, other fun stuff like that. Might be selling portion of it with cabin this year. Now have a duplex project that we remodeled one side and moved in and currently working on the other. Most of the remodeling was surface level - painting, flooring, cabinets, exterior fence, appliances, extensive cleaning needed due to low quality renters for 5+ years. Want to buy a place with acreage in summer of 2020 and it will probably be a place that needs some work. Have to decide if we will rent both sides of duplex or sell it at that time. Darn millennials I guess.

If someone is buying your place as a primary residence when are the tenants going to be out?

When it comes down to it, there is only one reason a house won't sell - price is too high.

sammybiker

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #9 on: January 04, 2019, 09:45:12 AM »
Where is the property?  Winter is a pretty brutal time to sell a house in most US markets.  Weather aside, people want to move in Spring/Summer and get into your 4/5 star school district - not right after Christmas.

turketron

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #10 on: January 04, 2019, 09:52:19 AM »
When I grew up, fairly poor, you were just pleased to have a roof over your head.

Uphill, in the snow! Both Ways!

In previous generations, you could also afford a house on a single (minimum wage) salary. Things change, and it's not necessarily the fault of all those darn Millennials. 

As mentioned by others, it sounds like you might need to drop the price some more, and possibly get the tenants out, if possible. How much time is left on the lease? If the new owners will be expected to honor the tenants' existing lease for more than a few weeks that might be part of the problem.

StarBright

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #11 on: January 04, 2019, 09:59:01 AM »
Older millennial here - we've bought two houses and sold one.

We bought our homes based on a couple of factors: under our budget, walkable neighborhood, good school districts. We didn't have kids with our first house, but knew that we'd likely have to sell within a few years and better school districts have easier resale.

We did a lot of work on our first house (our budget was smaller) sold for a nice but smallish profit seven years later, and opted to buy a house with less work involved for our second house because we now have two small children and even busier jobs.

We sold our first house to slightly younger millennials who also bought for the walkable neighborhood and school district.


affordablehousing

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #12 on: January 04, 2019, 11:37:42 AM »
Millenial with two homes here. Both needed (one still needs) a lot of work (one just aesthetic, the other aesthetic plus major structural and pest). There are buyers out there that don't mind transforming a crappy rental to a nice house, but they'll want a deal. The schools matter for someone wanting owner occupied if its over two bedrooms. It also matters if the private schools are expensive. In our market, private school is ~$35K a year for grade school so it matters.

My advice, take your home off the market, buy out your tenants, do the easy stuff- repaint white, clean thoroughly, refinish the hardwood, rip out any carpet (IMO the easiest upgrade ever accomplished), and replace kitchen counters with butcher block if you've got tile or old granite. You can probably have a handyman do all this for $5K and have your price return be 10x.

MrBojangles

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #13 on: January 04, 2019, 11:43:28 AM »
Okay, specifics while wanting to remain anonymous.

I purchased the property for about $185k in 2009.  Started looking in the 140 range, nothing decent.  Had to buy in this range.  Sellers would laugh if you did not offer within a grand or 2 of full asking price.  Bought after the recession as a comp for this place sold for 235k in 2006.  Small town, near a major highway, 15 miles or so near a small city, 1 1/2 to 2 hrs to two major cities.  Amenities nearby, doctor, dentist, supermarket, etc.

Better school district is 5 mi South.  Amazingly, folks will pay 50 to 100% more to be in a better school district.  I never even considered school districts then, just saw it was cheaper so close to everything. 

I received the $8000 home buyers credit, which, IMHO should never have disappeared.  But it did.  And here is what happened to real estate.  It got hit hard 2010 and a few years afterwards.

It had a 1980's kitchen, some sloping to floors as is over 100 years old.  Water damage meant I put in all new oak hardwood floors and a new kitchen with granite countertops and stainless steel appliances.

When I was looking to buy, I did my homework, like the Frugalwoods.  I did not have the benefit of being in or near Cambridge, Mass however.

Went with a realtor from the small city nearby.  She wanted me to get it on early spring, but it was still being remodeled.  I got it on the market late June, photos looked good, still needed some painting.  Decided to list at 205k, which is basically no profit over 10 yrs.  I don't understand this, except the realtor concluded I bought during a buyer's market nationally and tried to sell during a seller's market nationally, but the local trends are not the same.  Even the small city realtor didn't understand the local trends.

I dropped the price to 200k after a few months and then 194k a few months later.

Despite the listing agreement stating will be painted in full by closing, feedback was that it needs too much work, and the floors are crooked.

I don't mean to stereotype, but folks looking for homes now don't want to pay anything for them and they are entitled and lazy.  It's expected that you will paint the house the colors you desire, etc!

Not that I watch HGTV, but so much for that crap!  They lead you to believe every impmovement is money in the bank.  All that junk is is an infomercial for the building industry.

If I had 30 folks walk through in a few weeks, I'd kick out the tenant tomorrow.  Given that I had 9 showings in 6 mos time, I keep it rented.

I planned on doing over the kitchen in about 2025 and then selling it.  An insurance check made this happen sooner.  I am ripped already about this and would be much more so if this was paid for from my savings.

I pulled it off the market before Christmas.  Am debating whether to even list it in the spring.  When I pulled it off the market, had I sold it, I still would have not turned a profit on it after paying real estate fees, and this is with a new kitchen and new floors throughout.

When I bought the place, it appraised out fine.  Not sure what gives???

This is despite buying during a downturn and supposedly a good economy since then

MrBojangles

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #14 on: January 04, 2019, 11:52:25 AM »
Millenial with two homes here. Both needed (one still needs) a lot of work (one just aesthetic, the other aesthetic plus major structural and pest). There are buyers out there that don't mind transforming a crappy rental to a nice house, but they'll want a deal. The schools matter for someone wanting owner occupied if its over two bedrooms. It also matters if the private schools are expensive. In our market, private school is ~$35K a year for grade school so it matters.

My advice, take your home off the market, buy out your tenants, do the easy stuff- repaint white, clean thoroughly, refinish the hardwood, rip out any carpet (IMO the easiest upgrade ever accomplished), and replace kitchen counters with butcher block if you've got tile or old granite. You can probably have a handyman do all this for $5K and have your price return be 10x.

But I've done most of that already!  Ripped out a wall to open up the kitchen, new stainless steel appliances, new cabinets and granite countertops.  Painted white throughout, 75% complete.  Hardwood floors throughout, except in laundry room (tile).  All brand new.  Bathroom not water damaged, redone in 2007.

I reduced the tenant's rent in return for painting.  His lease ends the end of April.  He moved in in November, was supposed to clean up the yard some...we'll see.

I always thought there were buyers everywhere for modestly priced houses such as mine.  No one seems to have the mentality that I had better buy this house now or else I will have to pay a whole lot more later and end up with a whole lot less.

waltworks

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #15 on: January 04, 2019, 12:20:51 PM »
I would be careful throwing around the word "entitled" based on your post, dude. People are not obligated to want your house, and you're not owed a profit on a speculative investment.

The house isn't desirable. Sounds like the area/location just aren't doing it for potential buyers if you've really fixed things up nicely. So you can drop your price more, or you can keep renting it out and hope that prices rise in the area in a few years (though it doesn't sound too likely). Pretty simple.

Question: it sounds like this was your residence for a while and then you moved out/rented it. Why did you hold onto it as a rental? What has changed since then that makes you want to sell it? If it was a good rental a few years ago, presumably it still is now, right? Who cares what the market value is - if you're cash flowing it as a rental, just let it stay rented.

-W

StarBright

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #16 on: January 04, 2019, 12:41:11 PM »
It does take a specific type of buyer to take on a 100 year old house, especially if you live in area that has plenty of new builds. Our second house we bought was an old one, but we bought it in an area known for historical cuteness. The new builds up the road usually turn over faster than the historical homes. Old homes are quirky and take work.

If your home has any neat historical features it might be worth playing them up? I know plenty of people who deal with sloped floors if it comes with original molding or door hardware.

Cassie

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #17 on: January 04, 2019, 01:33:42 PM »
We found it impossible to sell with a tenant. We sold fast once the tenant was gone.

Mustache ride

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #18 on: January 04, 2019, 06:29:56 PM »
It's ironic your calling millennials entitled when you come across as such in all of your posts. You aren't owed anything from anyone, including a high paying job or the sale of your house. Stop blaming other people when you don't get your way and start acting like an adult.

Apple_Tango

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #19 on: January 04, 2019, 07:16:10 PM »
Sounds like you might have bought too high? Or possibly over-improved for the area. School zone definitely matters for lots of people. Either way, the market is telling you that your price is too high. Real estate goes up and goes down...definitely not a slam dunk like some people think. If you canít sell it for the price you need, I guess youíll have to either keep renting it out, or do a short sale.

MrUpwardlyMobile

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #20 on: January 04, 2019, 07:43:16 PM »
School district means literally more than anything you did for a starter house.  Why buy a house if you donít have kids? The answer is, there are very few rational reasons to do so that arenít investment oriented.  If you have kids, you want them in schools that suck.  Thatís not amazing, itís one of the most basic rules of real estate (location...).

It sounds like youíre trying to sell ancient house, with no special benefits.  You mention sloped floors. An old house with defects is not desirable for young parents who are busy parenting and earning money.  Who wants to remodel an old house in a crappy school district? If you really had so few people look at it, itís either over priced, ugly, or both. From your post and reading between the lines, it sounds like it might be both.

Worse is that it is far as hell away from major cities.  You say 1.5-2 hours from major cities.  Thatís 3-4 hours return trip travel. Itís outside of a reasonable commute or even a pleasant day trip.

The market isnít that spectacular anymore for sellers.  Rising rates mean buying is less attractive.  Honestly, it sounds like you really overpaid for a dump during a sellers market, fixed a lot, and found you fixed a dump that wasnít worth what you spent.

FYI, when it comes to spending hundreds of thousands of dollars, people arenít entitled and lazy. Theyíre cautious and reasonable. It sounds like you might have benefitted from forethought before buying the sloped floor 100 year old house in a crappy school district.

« Last Edit: January 04, 2019, 08:14:36 PM by MrUpwardlyMobile »

BicycleB

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #21 on: January 04, 2019, 07:51:42 PM »
It's ironic your calling millennials entitled when you come across as such in all of your posts. You aren't owed anything from anyone, including a high paying job or the sale of your house. Stop blaming other people when you don't get your way and start acting like an adult.

^Saved me the typing.

Amazingly, folks will pay 50 to 100% more to be in a better school district.  I never even considered school districts then, just saw it was cheaper so close to everything. 

People paying much more for a better school district is a basic. I've never sold a house but my home's tax appraisal is up more than 700% since purchase. I rent out rooms and have earned more in rent than the entire purchase price. My area in the school district was a "bad" area and still mostly is. Fwiw, "bad school district" is often code for "the neighbors are scary black people" or "scummy poor people live here". Ratty couches and sloping floors could reinforce such impressions. Maybe you have to reprice as a result? In any case, being surprised at the school issue suggests to me the biggest issue is you must keep learning more.

Some lessons are expensive. It sounds like you're paying for a few of them now. I have made my own mistakes, so I sympathize. Based on my own life, the realtor's comments sound like nice things to say to an unhappy client, not necessarily honest evaluations. Maybe a realtor who knows the exact market you're selling in, not just the "nearby" city, could give more accurate assessments. Anyway, good luck!!

js82

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #22 on: January 04, 2019, 08:00:50 PM »

If I had 30 folks walk through in a few weeks, I'd kick out the tenant tomorrow.  Given that I had 9 showings in 6 mos time, I keep it rented.


Read the part of your statement I bolded.  Read it again. And again.  And again.  Think about what it means. Ask yourself whether such a small number of showings might just be an indication that your asking price versus size/condition of your home is out of line with other houses in your area.

The problem isn't "those damn millennials", it's that you're asking too much for your house relative to what the market will bear.  You need to drop your price if you want to sell.  Either that, or your house doesn't look attractive in the pictures you've put up, and you need some photos that show the house in a better light.

Sorry if this comes across as harsh, but if you've only had 9 showings in 6 months it's a pretty obvious sign that EVERYONE(not just millennials) thinks your house is worth less than you think it is, and that you need to adjust your expectations accordingly.
« Last Edit: January 04, 2019, 08:02:57 PM by js82 »

MrBojangles

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #23 on: January 04, 2019, 08:11:58 PM »
Well, when I bought it, it was after the bubble burst.  A house a few blocks away sold for $50k more a few years previously and it's comparable.  I had comps when I purchased this property and it appraised at more than I bought it at.

I thought I had bought in a dip after the recession and the reasons why I bought were twofold.  Rentals in the area were disgusting and overpriced.  Also, having bought when prices decline, I thought it was ripe for rebound.

I know many are Millenials out there.  Many are entitled, probably most of them are not on this forum.  I know of one who stays at home all day, daddy gives him money, cannot hold a job despite a degree in accounting.  He has trouble keeping a schedule and being told what to do.

Why the animosity towards me?  Didn't you all sit in college thinking I'm doing this to make it big?  Something is seriously wrong in a world where a painting can sell for over $400 million, and yet most folks are lucky to have 1/10 of 1% of that.  And that's my point!  It sure is EXPENSIVE out there.  Folks need to be compensated accordingly.  How can more and more folks go to college and wages go nowhere?

The house, BTW, is a Victorian.  Unique in appearance, not unattractive.  It was the best I could do at the time to actually have a yard.  At the time, folks were doing the long commute to have that.  That appears to have diminished over time.  Small town America isn't what it was anymore.  Also, everyone wants brand new.  It's amazing anything historic can sell anymore.

MrBojangles

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #24 on: January 04, 2019, 08:16:26 PM »

If I had 30 folks walk through in a few weeks, I'd kick out the tenant tomorrow.  Given that I had 9 showings in 6 mos time, I keep it rented.


Read the part of your statement I bolded.  Read it again. And again.  And again.  Think about what it means. Ask yourself whether such a small number of showings might just be an indication that your asking price versus size/condition of your home is out of line with other houses in your area.

The problem isn't "those damn millennials", it's that you're asking too much for your house relative to what the market will bear.  You need to drop your price if you want to sell.  Either that, or your house doesn't look attractive in the pictures you've put up, and you need some photos that show the house in a better light.

Sorry if this comes across as harsh, but if you've only had 9 showings in 6 months it's a pretty obvious sign that EVERYONE(not just millennials) thinks your house is worth less than you think it is, and that you need to adjust your expectations accordingly.

How low do you go?  Where else on the East Coast can you have a house with a brand new kitchen and floors, 3 bedrooms and an office, and a 1 1/2 bay garage, and more, for under $200k?  The area isn't horrible, either.

MrBojangles

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #25 on: January 04, 2019, 08:19:20 PM »
By the way, I think I will kick the tenant out if I even list it this year.  Too many hassles trying to sell it otherwise.

Frankies Girl

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #26 on: January 04, 2019, 09:44:57 PM »
If you've had very few lookers over months of listing, it's waaaay too high.

Lots of looking but no offers, you're priced too high but maybe 20-30K lower will get it into the ball park.

You likely put too much into the renos, and I honestly would go back to looking for aggressive/hungry realtors that are not going to blow sunshine up your skirt and give you more realistic comps/pricing for this property.

No one cares about the comps, or what you paid when you bought it, or the realtor thought it might be worth, or whether you've sunk X amount into renovations, or what you think/feel/whatever about how much it should sell for. The simple fact: you're too high priced for the area and you're not going to sell it unless things take off significantly or you lower the price significantly.

It has nothing - NOTHING - to do with the buyers available. It has everything to do with your unrealistic expectations on what you think you should get out of this property.

« Last Edit: January 04, 2019, 09:48:55 PM by Frankies Girl »

Freedomin5

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #27 on: January 04, 2019, 10:00:58 PM »
If you kick the tenant out, consider getting a professional stager to make your home look nice. Looking nice and re-configuring furniture placement can really help potential buyers get a feel for the place. And if you are already familiar with the comps and know that your house is priced fairly, then sometimes it's just about showing it well.

Anecdotal data: Back in 2008, my family tried to sell our luxury 2-year-new 2-bedroom condo in a good location and excellent school district, and had no takers for over 3 months. Brought in a stager who came with good references who basically got rid of all our furniture and put in all of her own high-end, modern furniture that suited the look of the condo. It sold within two weeks for slightly less than asking. I don't even think we dropped the price.

Moral of the story: Making your house look good to potential buyers is important (not based on your opinion of what looks good, but based on the opinion of a professional decorator with a proven track record selling homes).

Also, obviously, fix structural issues (if any).

MrBojangles

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #28 on: January 04, 2019, 10:05:58 PM »
I recall a time when it didn't really matter what property you bought.  Hold onto it a few years, it was better than money in the bank.  Some books I read way back basically stated, back then, that you hold onto a property 7 years, you were assured a profit.  Not now...

What I have trouble understanding is how can you purchase a property AFTER the bubble burst, have several years of price appreciation in the market nationwide, and still have such poor growth!?!?

Properties HAVE sold in my ballpark range in the last year.  The tenant helps nothing, however.

LAST time I buy in an area without researching school districts.  I live in a better school district now, and taxes are significantly higher, the area is congested/over developed, traffic is worse.  But, amazingly, this is what people want.

Since my observations are not particularly good, is it an old vs new thing?  I have never been one for cookie cutter houses, and I admire the craftsmanship available only in older houses.  I might be a rare breed today???  I almost feel that younger generations would prefer just to plough everything under and just have all new.  Just look at the antique furniture market.  You can now purchase beautiful pieces at 10% or less of what they were selling for 20 or 30 years ago and they are older than this country.

Omy

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #29 on: January 04, 2019, 10:20:26 PM »
I'm a realtor. Tenants have no incentive to make it easy to show. And they have no incentive to make it look nice for showings. Wait until the tenant is out, get rid of all cat evidence, clean, paint, stage appropriately.

That being said, price solves ALL problems. If you price it competitively it WILL sell. You need to lower the bait to where the fish are.

Neo

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #30 on: January 04, 2019, 10:42:04 PM »
Have you tried marketing the property as an investment rather than a primary residence? If you demonstrate that the property is profitable as a rental maybe an investor will buy it. Investors tend to be more able to look past the ugly couch and see the potential profitability of the property. Good luck and hope it works out for you.

maizeman

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #31 on: January 04, 2019, 10:58:10 PM »
I know many are Millenials out there.  Many are entitled, probably most of them are not on this forum.  I know of one who stays at home all day, daddy gives him money, cannot hold a job despite a degree in accounting.  He has trouble keeping a schedule and being told what to do.

Why the animosity towards me?

Any generation will have plenty of individual people whose choices we can question. If you'd like to list your age/generational affiliation I'd be happy to tell you stories of a person of your generation I know or know of who is entitled and/or lazy. ... but where will that get us? About the same place you are venting hatred for a whole cohort of people based on nothing but age, provoking an awful lot of animosity to no good end.

If that doesn't explain the animosity, try replacing millennial's with "swedish people" or "baptists" in your posts and see if re-reading them with that substitution explains why they would provoke animosity from both swedish people and non-swedish people.

With any house, the fair price is the price the market will pay. You cannot argue with the market or try to logically reason it into being willing to pay more for a house. For what it's worth, I am sorry for what you are feeling right now, having sunk a bunch of money into renovations having been convinced that they would result in you making a larger net profit (or smaller net loss) than you otherwise would have. It sucks to lose money, and it sucks to feel tricked. It sounds like your relator mislead you whether intentionally or through ignorance.

Others have given good advice: either cut the price a lot, or wait until the tenants leave and pay to have it professionally staged and photographed.

ilsy

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #32 on: January 04, 2019, 11:03:19 PM »
  A house a few blocks away sold for $50k more a few years previously and it's comparable.
That should be your clue. It's your house, the tenant and other things. Get rid of the tenant and hire a professional to stage your house, as someone had offered. Who are those people who bought that property a few blocks away? Are they a family, try to appeal to those people, they are your potential buyers. Check Zillow listing for that house, the photos might still be up, check out what sold that house, try to do the same. Use the same wording.

And leave millennials alone. You can't change the world, get used to it.

It's still the case about properties going up in price over time. My property is in prime school district, I bought it updated and flipped for $169k in 2012, the seller couldn't sell in 2010 and rented for 2 years until the market warmed up and the tenants wanted to leave (the rents in this area are great too). Now 6.5 year later it's worth more than $315k. The house next door with the same sqft-age, after the flip got sold for $315k. And they left the old windows and a crappy backyard, that the new owners refuse to do anything about (but that's my pet-peeve: home-owners who should never own a home, but rent instead) . And it got sold in the dead of winter within two weeks. All of our block was packed with cars on a snowy open house day. Before the flip, this dilapidated 3bd, 2.5ba got sold for $170k, the flipper had to put in an egress window to make it a 4bd house. That egress sticks out like a sore thumb, while in my property the 4th bd has 2 large full size windows on the other side of the basement. 

So, my guess, you paid for your property too much.

waltworks

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #33 on: January 04, 2019, 11:09:18 PM »
I call troll on this OP/thread. Nobody can possibly be this obtuse about RE.

-W

englishteacheralex

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #34 on: January 04, 2019, 11:11:38 PM »
@waltworks  even stopped by! I was hoping for a more comprehensive takedown, but hey, the brevity speaks volumes in and of itself.

Jon Bon

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #35 on: January 05, 2019, 05:21:11 AM »
Obviously everyone on here has been trigged by OP's microaggressions......

Relax folks I just hear a guy/gal venting that his house won't sell.

MrBojangles

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #36 on: January 05, 2019, 06:07:10 AM »
Obviously everyone on here has been trigged by OP's microaggressions......

Relax folks I just hear a guy/gal venting that his house won't sell.

Exactly! 

Let me clear up a few misconceptions.  The 50k greater figure.  That was not relative to this house now.  That was a comp back in 2006 that sold for 50k greater than my similar property did when I bought it in 2009.  The seller showed me some information when she thought about listing it then, and it dropped 50k when I bought it in 2009.  I think due to the homebuyers credit, when I bought it, there was a spike.  And I expected this.  I figured once the credit ceased, values might drop 5 or 10% for 6 mos or so and resume the steady climb.  I think the spike interrupted a continual decline that probably bottomed in 2012 or so.  And once the credit disappeared, it was more than I anticipated.  Almost freefall.  I think there has been a return closer to what I paid for it.  About 175k is what it will bring.

But it's a tough pill to swallow.  I thought that a new kitchen with granite and new floors would make someone, or many someones, say "I have to have this place!"  Most housing stock in the area is like mine, older.  I think the reality is, and what HGTV won't tell you, is the market can only bear so much.  I think if someone had to live in that area, which most don't, obviously, mine might move a little quicker over a comparable place with an older kitchen.  But there are few comps.  Similar places, which aren't even similar, have sold for 175k and 200k could be pushing it.  I didn't think so with the new kitchen, but apparently so.

I will look into staging.  The realtor mentioned that.  I thought it was a stupid gimmick.  Maybe not.  I did want to sell and put ZERO more into the property.

There are some huge McMansions within 5 miles of this place.  Not sure who and why someone would want to live there in them.  Maybe 5 or 600k range.  Realtor said be glad you don't own them.  They are down about a third over the last decade.

StarBright

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #37 on: January 05, 2019, 07:38:40 AM »

How low do you go?  Where else on the East Coast can you have a house with a brand new kitchen and floors, 3 bedrooms and an office, and a 1 1/2 bay garage, and more, for under $200k?  The area isn't horrible, either.


hmm - Having lived in several east coast states from MA down to SC - I'm going to say that what you are saying should basically be true from NOVA northward as long as you are within an hour or so of the Atlantic (for instance I'm not including Hagerstown MD or western, MA as "East Coast"). If you are south of Richmond or more northern but pretty westward, which I would guess you are based on your distance from a large city then, in my experience, there is a fair amount of housing stock under 200k.

As a millennial with a very old house, in an old neighborhood that is about half millennial families, I have lots of friends that own old homes. Not just in my town, but in several towns from Durham, NC and northwards.

But the key to the old homes is that their old features are played up, and the houses are generally in walking distance of amenities (restaurants, libraries, etc) or public transportation. And it still takes a bit to sell, because old house types are a special type of buyer.

Another thing I've seen with old houses with sloped floors is having a foundation expert check out the house before it is on the market and verify that the foundation is in good shape, just settled because the house is older. Then when the people looking at the house comment on the sloped floors, the real estate agent can put their mind at ease about foundation problems. Good Luck!



« Last Edit: January 05, 2019, 07:43:33 AM by StarBright »

BicycleB

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #38 on: January 05, 2019, 07:39:17 AM »


...what HGTV won't tell you, is the market can only bear so much.  I think...mine might move a little quicker over a comparable place with an older kitchen.  But there are few comps.  Similar places, which aren't even similar, have sold for 175k and 200k could be pushing it.  I didn't think so with the new kitchen, but apparently so.

Yes, things to learn here:
1. HGTV is entertainment supported by advertisers who sell supplies for kitchen renos and similar things. It's not real estate education. No, they don't tell you what investors need to know. You are right!! You're better off reading real estate threads, noting remarks by experienced investors, getting to know professional investors in your area.
2. It's a real estate basic that fixtures above the typical level of a neighborhood don't usually make their money back, because no one will pay enough for them. This is learnable by the methods in 1, but you have learned it by experience. Costly, isn't it? (I've had expensive experiences too.)

I will look into staging.  The realtor mentioned that.  I thought it was a stupid gimmick.  Maybe not.  I did want to sell and put ZERO more into the property.

There are some huge McMansions within 5 miles of this place.  Not sure who and why someone would want to live there in them.  Maybe 5 or 600k range.  Realtor said be glad you don't own them.  They are down about a third over the last decade.

3. Let us know how the staging goes. I've never done it, but as far as being a gimmick - if it has become common and it works, it's not a gimmick, it's a state of the art tool that probably explains your house's inability to sell. Let us know what happens!

4. If even the McMansions are still down, maybe your area generally just isn't so hot in buyers' eyes. Maybe escaping with minimal losses is a win.

MrBojangles

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #39 on: January 05, 2019, 07:49:03 AM »
Yes not a desirable area.  Why?  Not sure.  Homes look nice nearby, mostly, but not exciting.  Not really walking distance to a library, businesses are within a few miles.  Better to drive, but could walk it.

I AM thinking of letting it go at a slight loss.  Homebuyers credit I got could offset some of this, although I counted on it as money in the bank.

Fortunately an insurance check paid for these renovations...well, about 80% of it.  Was hoping to get back my investment...




Another Reader

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #40 on: January 05, 2019, 08:24:57 AM »
Yes not a desirable area.  Why?  Not sure.  Homes look nice nearby, mostly, but not exciting.  Not really walking distance to a library, businesses are within a few miles.  Better to drive, but could walk it.

I AM thinking of letting it go at a slight loss.  Homebuyers credit I got could offset some of this, although I counted on it as money in the bank.

Fortunately an insurance check paid for these renovations...well, about 80% of it.  Was hoping to get back my investment...

Why?  The schools.  People with financial capacity and kids are going to buy elsewhere.  If the McMansions are in the same school district, those owners will never recover their investment.

You said up thread that you thought you could get $175k.  If that is an accurate assessment, kick the tenant out, clean it up, and price it at $179,900.  However, I would get the foundation inspected beforehand.  If you don't, the buyer will.  If it's bad, you may not be able to sell until that is repaired.

SwordGuy

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #41 on: January 05, 2019, 08:57:08 AM »
I have never been one for cookie cutter houses, and I admire the craftsmanship available only in older houses.  I might be a rare breed today??? 

"No one ever lost money underestimating the taste of the American public." is an old saying that has a fair bit of truth in it.

As for your house selling problem, you've been given plenty of good advice.   





MrBojangles

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #42 on: January 05, 2019, 09:29:38 AM »
It goes on the market once I get the tenant out.  Got to get moving, I guess.

I bought it as a place to live but also as an investment.  Once this place goes, I'll invest in the stock market and not another place.

Some folks just aren't meant to make money in real estate.  It's just not the gains previous generations enjoyed.

SwordGuy

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #43 on: January 05, 2019, 09:34:31 AM »
This might be useful to consider.

I'm a red panda

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #44 on: January 05, 2019, 09:34:37 AM »
I agree. Millennials are so entitled, wanting to buy a house that doesnít suck at a competitive price.

Seriously.  I'm a millenial.  My first house sucked. We put in a ton of work on it to make it liveable. We also didn't make a profit when we sold it because the market was shit. We lost money.

But the house was worth it, because it was what we could afford. Our next house was perfect. 6 years and we still haven't done a lick of work on it.  But it cost more than double what the first house cost.

If you sell me a shitty house, I want to pay a low price. If you want a high price, sell me a pristine house.

But this poster is an entitled troll across the forum, so really, not sure what my point in posting here is...

Spitfire

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #45 on: January 07, 2019, 10:38:26 AM »
My parents had a heck of a time trying to sell the house I grew up in, in Massachusetts. They tried in 2015 and couldn't, so they ended up renting it for 2 years and tried to sell it again afterwards to avoid capital gains taxes. It took almost all of 2018 to sell. It's an old house, good condition (no leaks, structure, hvac, or appliance problems) but with kind of a weird layout and not fully updated. It was not in a good school district either. Many people looked at it, never commented on the price as a problem, but also did not make offers. Finally someone fell in love with it and made 3 visits to it within a week followed by an offer. I guess it just needed the right person to see it.

It sounds like you have done more updates, including taking down a wall to make it look more modern, so this may not apply to you. Many people do want things to look a certain way and do not want to do a lot of work to get there when they buy a house. It's a big investment that they will be paying for most of their adult life. Having the renter gone and good staging/pictures should help get people in the door at least. 

J Boogie

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #46 on: January 07, 2019, 12:56:12 PM »
It's really difficult for this forum to figure out exactly what factor is in play except that your price is too high or your tenants prevent buyers from seeing the potential. We can speculate about public schools, but that shouldn't account for any difference between when you bought and now.

But really, without knowing the town and the nearby areas, without seeing what your place looks like, we're just guessing.

It could be that the better paying jobs are in the more urban areas. It could be that millennials are either renting or having families (and wanting to be in a good district, or avoid lead paint). We don't know the major employers in the region. Could be anything for all we know.

Sorry to hear you won't make any money given all you've put in to improve the place. As a millennial, I disprove your theory (I'm breathing new life into a Victorian duplex that had both units rented out) but am not offended by it.


Enough

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #47 on: January 07, 2019, 01:57:27 PM »
We found it impossible to sell with a tenant. We sold fast once the tenant was gone.
+1

nwnative

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #48 on: January 07, 2019, 11:29:16 PM »
Yes not a desirable area.  Why?  Not sure.  Homes look nice nearby, mostly, but not exciting.  Not really walking distance to a library, businesses are within a few miles.  Better to drive, but could walk it.

I AM thinking of letting it go at a slight loss.  Homebuyers credit I got could offset some of this, although I counted on it as money in the bank.

Fortunately an insurance check paid for these renovations...well, about 80% of it.  Was hoping to get back my investment...

I can't remember how long you said you rented the house, but when you're calculating your profit/loss, keep in mind that you have to recapture your depreciation expense on your taxes.

MrBojangles

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Re: Anyone try to sell a property lately?
« Reply #49 on: January 08, 2019, 03:40:57 AM »
How does that work?  Let's say you bought a house for $100000 and you depreciate 25k.  Does that mean your basis is 75k?