Author Topic: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)  (Read 37254 times)

DragonSlayer

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #50 on: March 04, 2015, 09:05:14 AM »
I hated everything about my job, but I resisted the urge to FU and walk out. I never said a word, to anyone, about my plans to ER. I wasn't close enough to any of my coworkers or bosses to talk about it. So I simply gave 2 weeks notice, as was required, signed a document swearing that I wasn't going to work for a competitor for two years and left at the end of two weeks. No one really asked about future plans and I didn't volunteer because I didn't give a crap what any of them thought. And, obviously, none of them gave a crap about me because they didn't ask. I was simply another cog in their machine, easily replaced with a newer model cog.

I did tell my friends what I was doing and they were mostly supportive, if dubious. No one was mean, just kind of curious. But, here I am 11 years later (I ER'd at 33) and they've grown accustomed to my eccentric self. No one bats an eye anymore when I say I'm off on some crazy trip, or pursuing some weird project.

Gone Fishing

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #51 on: March 04, 2015, 12:34:37 PM »
...signed a document swearing that I wasn't going to work for a competitor for two years and left at the end of two weeks.

Did they give you some money to do this?

DragonSlayer

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #52 on: March 04, 2015, 02:42:26 PM »
...signed a document swearing that I wasn't going to work for a competitor for two years and left at the end of two weeks.

Did they give you some money to do this?

Nope. The non-compete was in place when I was hired, so there was no additional money. I just had to reaffirm my understanding. It's pretty standard in my industry.

Normally, I would have refused or negotiated it downward a bit, but I knew that that job was my last stop on the corporate road when I took it. It was kind of a unique situation. The salary was high enough that I knew I'd hit FI quickly and would, for at least two years after, not be looking for another job because I was already making travel plans. So I just "took the money and ran," as it were.  It was a job and a means to an end. Nothing more.

retired?

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #53 on: March 05, 2015, 04:37:31 PM »

My advice,
when possible, talk about your plans to retire early, so it isn't a shock
Give them plenty of notice,if your job position will take time to replace
Say thank you when you leave.

Generally good advice.  But, I worked in an industry that when people quit (rather than retire) they are often shown the door right away (the industry was trading, where they don't want you familiar with positions after you've shown your intent to leave.

So, one problem I see is people simply not believing you are retiring and figuring you just don't want to say what you are actually doing.

AlwaysBeenASaver

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #54 on: March 05, 2015, 04:48:54 PM »
I too have concerns about being shown the door sooner than I planned - my timing is related to $ event at work that I don't want to be excluded from by leaving sooner. It seems unlikely I'd be walked out early, but it's not worth the $ risk to me. I have already seen one person walked out with no notice, for a reason that I wouldn't have thought would cause firing.

Financial.Velociraptor

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #55 on: March 05, 2015, 07:05:29 PM »
Technically...

I should have been shown the door immediately as I was on the "Financial Insiders Roster" and policy dictated they just cut me a check and cut their exposure by having security walk me to the car and then mail me any 'stuff' left behind at the office.  They had me finish out two weeks anyway.  It was a low drama exit.

mbl

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #56 on: March 06, 2015, 05:52:53 AM »
I don't understand the reluctance to tell people the truth in these situations...it would never occur to me to be anything but totally straightforward with my employers about why I was leaving.  I fully intend to tell my employers that I'm retiring when I give my FIRE notice. 

Am I missing something that I should be thinking about?

Even if you are not ER'ing, many mangers feel offended when someone resigns.  Bring ER into the picture and jealousy becomes a real issue as well.  The whole idea of "softening the blow" is to keep the door open in the event you ever need employment again.

Meh, I think this is pretty overblown.  As a manager, I'd much rather have someone be straightforward with me than dance around questions I'm asking about future plans.  If my boss isn't grown-up enough to handle having an employee leave it's not my problem to soften the blow.  As for future employment, I'm happy relying on my skills to earn myself a job.

Agreed.

It seems that some  of those that are going to RE have a need to observe that they're leaving will elicit a strong reaction.    That somehow,  one's "value",  is reflected in the magnitude of their employer's response.   Yes, it can cause concern and surprise, but it is rare that one person's leaving causes much issue.    It takes very little time usually for one who has gone to be forgotten.  Out of sight out of mind.   
No one is irreplaceable.   

JohnGalt

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #57 on: March 06, 2015, 12:01:25 PM »

It seems that some  of those that are going to RE have a need to observe that they're leaving will elicit a strong reaction.    That somehow,  one's "value",  is reflected in the magnitude of their employer's response.   Yes, it can cause concern and surprise, but it is rare that one person's leaving causes much issue.    It takes very little time usually for one who has gone to be forgotten.  Out of sight out of mind.   
No one is irreplaceable.

I think this is 100% spot on.

Bicycle_B

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #58 on: March 06, 2015, 01:24:38 PM »
   I told my boss several times during the summer that I would be retiring at the end of September. She was good natured about it. I didn't fill out the paperwork until August 25th so she had 5 weeks notice.  Stopped by today-they have 5 people in my department instead of 4 in my day. So I really was doing the work of 2 men (Laurel and Hardy).

Funny!

Dawn

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #59 on: March 08, 2015, 05:18:15 AM »
I just had "the talk" with my boss. I have a great deal of respect for her and my place of work. I also have lots of nosey co-workers. I have tried to help them or encourage them and organized a free Dave Ramsey program, etc. Not many of them get it. So - when an email is sent out that I am leaving, I'd love to say, when they ask - that I am able to do this because of ideas like Dave's and MMM but, really, folks don't REALLY want to know. They are just nosey!

I don't know what I am going to say when the email goes out but one thing I will say is that I want to spend time with my family. I am 45 and have worked hard to get where I am. The first question in, "how many properties do you own?" My husband's canned response is, "not enough!"

I will see people I work with after retirement so I gave a notice for as long as they need me......small community, great non-profit. My heart believes in what we do so I want to make sure my leaving doesn't interfere with it negatively.

Bottom line, it really isn't anybody's business......

steveo

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #60 on: March 08, 2015, 02:47:38 PM »
One of my friends at work who is a year older than me (61), actually told me that he just signed a two year lease on a car, so he has to work 2 more years!  My frugal side was appalled!  I just couldn't imagine making myself work 2 more years for a car!

I just read this and I feel exactly the same. I was telling my wife a couple of months ago we went out for a work function and 2 of the more highly paid people were talking about this nice car that cost something like $200k. I just thought to myself what a waste of your life to be working for that.

JohnGalt

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #61 on: March 08, 2015, 06:42:23 PM »
One of my friends at work who is a year older than me (61), actually told me that he just signed a two year lease on a car, so he has to work 2 more years!  My frugal side was appalled!  I just couldn't imagine making myself work 2 more years for a car!

I just read this and I feel exactly the same. I was telling my wife a couple of months ago we went out for a work function and 2 of the more highly paid people were talking about this nice car that cost something like $200k. I just thought to myself what a waste of your life to be working for that.

To me, stuff like that is doubly sad because the $200,000 car is not twice or $100,000 more effective as the $100,000 car. At that point, it's more of a status symbol than anything. So they're working so they can show off how much they make.

steveo

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #62 on: March 08, 2015, 07:35:19 PM »
One of my friends at work who is a year older than me (61), actually told me that he just signed a two year lease on a car, so he has to work 2 more years!  My frugal side was appalled!  I just couldn't imagine making myself work 2 more years for a car!

I just read this and I feel exactly the same. I was telling my wife a couple of months ago we went out for a work function and 2 of the more highly paid people were talking about this nice car that cost something like $200k. I just thought to myself what a waste of your life to be working for that.

To me, stuff like that is doubly sad because the $200,000 car is not twice or $100,000 more effective as the $100,000 car. At that point, it's more of a status symbol than anything. So they're working so they can show off how much they make.

I just can't relate to people like that. That car would give me as much pleasure as my $5k car.

MrsCoolCat

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #63 on: March 08, 2015, 09:40:59 PM »
Then they collected my things and escorted me out of the building because after seven years on the insider roster, I couldn't be trusted not to steal a coffee maker on the way out or something like that.

You'd be surprised or not by how often you're escorted out because they fear you'll be slick and cause a rebellion or something... It's kinda funny and ironic how most companies don't give a sh!t about you before but give a sh!t that you'll steal their stapler or say something slick on your way out!

Miss Tash

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #64 on: March 13, 2015, 03:00:06 PM »
I mentioned my plan to retire to my boss yesterday at lunch.  I told him I wanted to stay and do a really kick-ass job on a contract we're just starting (so RE would be 8 months away).  He's a very thoughtful kind of guy.  If I really want something from him, I'll mention it then wait a month or so and mention it again.  By three months he generally brings it up as his own idea.  This has worked time and again.  I'd really like part-time/intermittent work because I LOVE what I do.  I bet sometime this summer he comes up with the idea for me to become a contractor for the company.  Wish me luck!

Hunny156

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #65 on: March 25, 2015, 12:19:23 PM »
Not ready to do it yet, but am probably 3-5 years away.  I have, however given notice many times, and I too fall into the category of giving the standard two weeks, and providing minimal details.

When we relocated out of state for my husband's employer, I was working for a great company and felt obligated to provide them with 6 weeks notice, so they could hire and I could fully train my replacement.  When I left, they hadn't even filled out a job requisition, so it didn't do them any good.

Hubby works in sales, and they traditionally show you the door the minute you give notice.  As a result, the resignation letter specifically states the intent to give two weeks notice, and if they choose to terminate immediately, the expectation that they provide a paycheck for that 2 week time period.  All but one employer has agreed to that.

As for us, when the time comes, since we own rental properties, we'll just say we are leaving to focus on our rental business.  The less people know, the better.  We are all replaceable and forgettable, so no need to create a stir or provide tons of detail.

SwordGuy

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #66 on: April 27, 2015, 07:55:19 PM »
One of my friends at work who is a year older than me (61), actually told me that he just signed a two year lease on a car, so he has to work 2 more years!  My frugal side was appalled!  I just couldn't imagine making myself work 2 more years for a car!

I just read this and I feel exactly the same. I was telling my wife a couple of months ago we went out for a work function and 2 of the more highly paid people were talking about this nice car that cost something like $200k. I just thought to myself what a waste of your life to be working for that.

If it was a really nice car and they could drive it for years after retiring, and they really liked cars, ok.  At least it would make some semblance of sense.  But it was a lease!

Gumbo1978

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #67 on: April 28, 2015, 06:31:50 AM »
I feel like I have given my company 3 years notice.  I was in my monthly meeting with my boss last week and we were talking career path for me.  I brought up that in 2-3 years, my wife finishes school and I will be looking at phased retirement (I'll be 39) into a part-time career.  My boss indicated there were no part time opportunites currently and likely would not be in 3 years.  I advised I'd like to get some experience shadowing other jobs to find a potential career where I could contract or work a part-time schedule. 

I don't have to worry much about it impacting my position.  I get a small merit increase each year and do not want to "move up" to a higher level position in the next 2-3 years.  Little chance of being let go.  Like a lot of the posts I've read, my company has a hard time getting permission from corporate to hire, so if they let go of me, they'd just be short a person (which is a worse position).  Even with 3 years notice, they will not interview until I've been out the door 2-3 weeks which is hard on my co-workers as it takes 4-6 months to train someone.  However, my company (like most) is more worried about the bottom line than doing the right thing and having a replacement in place to keep work/life balances in tact.

Daisy

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #68 on: April 29, 2015, 09:35:54 PM »
I feel like I have given my company 3 years notice.  I was in my monthly meeting with my boss last week and we were talking career path for me.  I brought up that in 2-3 years, my wife finishes school and I will be looking at phased retirement (I'll be 39) into a part-time career.  My boss indicated there were no part time opportunites currently and likely would not be in 3 years.  I advised I'd like to get some experience shadowing other jobs to find a potential career where I could contract or work a part-time schedule. 

I don't have to worry much about it impacting my position.  I get a small merit increase each year and do not want to "move up" to a higher level position in the next 2-3 years.  Little chance of being let go.  Like a lot of the posts I've read, my company has a hard time getting permission from corporate to hire, so if they let go of me, they'd just be short a person (which is a worse position).  Even with 3 years notice, they will not interview until I've been out the door 2-3 weeks which is hard on my co-workers as it takes 4-6 months to train someone.  However, my company (like most) is more worried about the bottom line than doing the right thing and having a replacement in place to keep work/life balances in tact.

That's funny...I was just thinking of this on my drive home today. I was wondering if my boss would ever ask me what my "5 year plan" was and if I would answer truthfully or not.

My company is also giving tiny merit increases and I'm not sure how likely they would be to let me go if I answer the question truthfully.

I'm on the edge of FIRE and was hoping for a layoff or voluntary severance package at some point. That possibility may no longer be on the table since my company has had a lot of attrition lately due to a lot of changes occurring. So after a bunch of layoffs it looks like we are hiring again. Sounds good in theory, but not if you're looking for a layoff.

So as in your case I thought the only way I can get myself on a layoff list in the future is if I answer the "5 year plan" question truthfully. If my boss thinks I'm not interested in sticking around for 5 years, maybe he'll put me high on that list at some point. I try to do a quality job, so underperforming to get laid off is not an option for me.

Some answers I thought to the 5 year question are:
- "Not here." (short and to the point)
- "I'd like to be doing something different in my life by then."
- "I plan to change careers by the time I am 50." (BTW, turning 50 is 4 years away for me - so within the 5 year range)
- "Maybe switch to part-time work." (this will really have him questioning keeping me around)
- "I'd like to take a leave of absence at some point in the next 5 years to take care of elderly parents." (sets me up to ask for a sabbatical at some point)

Cinder

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #69 on: May 27, 2015, 08:00:44 PM »
amazing stories.. commenting here to see what else pops up!

AlwaysBeenASaver

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #70 on: May 27, 2015, 08:37:39 PM »
Now that the deed has been done here's how it went.

Last Weekend
I wrote my resignation letter, the main part of which said "I have an opportunity I can't pass up". I didn't go into any more details than that; the rest of the letter was just my end date, and some fluff about nice team, nice company, etc. I was happy my SO helped me come up with this wording. I'm a quiet person and didn't want to spend 2 weeks having people hammer me with questions/warnings about my decision to leave my career.

Yesterday
I brought the letter to work, ready to have the talk, and my boss emailed that she was sick and not coming in.
After debating what to do for a couple hours, I had the talk with HR instead, because I was concerned my boss could be out sick all week. I told her I had a great opportunity I didn't want to pass up. She assumed that meant "job opportunity", although she didn't ask for any details and I happily didn't provide any.

Today
I told my boss the same thing "great opportunity I don't want to pass up", and she made the same assumption, that it was a "job opportunity." She also didn't ask for details, fortunately, because I didn't plan to lie, but also didn't want get into any details for reasons stated above. She got teary eyed and later in the day told me she was sad and relies on me, and that she appreciates all the hard work I've done in the time I've been with the company. I was really relieved she didn't ask if she could talk me into changing my mind, or staying a bit longer.

After talking to my boss, I told my co-worker. He asked directly if I had a new job and I told him "no, I'm doing something different, but I don't want to spend 2 weeks answering questions about it so I'll tell you at the end." And if he asks me, I'll tell him, just before leaving.

madamwitty

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #71 on: May 27, 2015, 08:50:19 PM »
After talking to my boss, I told my co-worker. He asked directly if I had a new job and I told him "no, I'm doing something different, but I don't want to spend 2 weeks answering questions about it so I'll tell you at the end." And if he asks me, I'll tell him, just before leaving.

Oh, I like that! I'm going to keep that idea in my back pocket.

ysette9

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #72 on: May 27, 2015, 09:34:30 PM »
This is not my story as we are still 5+ years from FIRE, but my husband texted me yesterday because his CEO's sister was going around the office handing out mimosas to celebrate her retirement. I haven't given it much thought yet, but I expect I will go out more quietly than that. :)

Arktinkerer

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #73 on: May 28, 2015, 09:01:34 AM »


It seems that some  of those that are going to RE have a need to observe that they're leaving will elicit a strong reaction.    That somehow,  one's "value",  is reflected in the magnitude of their employer's response.   Yes, it can cause concern and surprise, but it is rare that one person's leaving causes much issue.    It takes very little time usually for one who has gone to be forgotten.  Out of sight out of mind.   
No one is irreplaceable.

Best line I ever heard about leaving a company--

" Stick your thumb in a cup of water and pull it out.  The hole left behind is how much you will be missed at work."

The Pigeon

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #74 on: May 28, 2015, 12:21:58 PM »
"AlwaysBeenASaver" and I are on the same path, almost. I composed my resignation letter last Friday at work, and turned it in to my boss at about 3:30 (1 hour left). I prepped everything just in case I was going to be escorted out.

The Notice:

"The Talk" was super scary for me, I was shaking and emotional. I almost put it off again. I felt so bad about leaving this job after only 4 months, but myriad reasons (not the least of which is FI/RE) pushed my decision back from originally May 2016 to February, then to August, then to now. (Thanks to many of the MMM forum participants who, via a thread here, helped me gain clarity on the leaving-after-short-tenure issue!).

Of the many issues factoring into leaving this job, I only told him two. One, that my arm has had enough of 8 hours at the computer (repetitive stress), and two, that I'm leaving the workforce entirely--retiring.

He was a lot cooler than I expected, expressed he was sorry to lose me. He said he'd be angry if I were leaving to go work for someone else, but could fully understand my reasons. I expressed regret at wasting their time/training, and the inconvenience.

Once done, I walked to my desk and told my only remaining coworker (the other two had gone home).

Long Holiday Weekend:

A lot of time to reflect and think about what I had done, whether I had made a mistake, and how to get all the stuff like health insurance nailed down as an individual, followed by thoughts of knowing this is TOTALLY the right thing to do, imagining my new freedoms, imagining how my days might be, feeling relieved to no longer have to do tasks I hate doing.

I also wondered how weird or uncomfortable my next workday would be...

First Workday After Notice:

Nothing different than usual. I walk in, say hello like normal. My coworkers just did their thing. No questions. No reaction. Nothing. OK... I turned around toward them, thinking maybe I would mention it, but then thought better of it, and just started working. I feel weird walking around here.

Second Workday After Notice:

Still nothing. No comments, no indication that anyone has any knowledge of this. I have thoughts that maybe it was all a dream. Did Friday even happen?

Near the end of my workday, I approach the one coworker that I told right after having the meeting with my boss. I asked if he or the boss had told anyone. Coworker replied that he had told my small group right away on the Tuesday, and that the news had filtered out to everyone.

No one acts any differently. Not a peep.

Third Workday After Notice:

Still no acknowledgement from any coworker... I'm starting to get the idea that they're just going to ignore it. Kinda makes you feel like a ghost. hmmm... I guess I *am* a ghost.

+++

Don't get me wrong--I'm not *wishing* for acknowledgement or commentary. I just think it's *damned odd* that it's being completely ignored.

I have *6.5* more workdays (officially, according to my notice) I did offer to stay on a bit more, if they needed help training (they've not hired anyone)... but the way this is going I think they're just going to ignore it until I sail off into the sunset.

Is this what Big Corporate is like? (this is my first (and last/only) taste of Big Corporate.

Oh well. Counting down.
-The Pigeon
« Last Edit: May 28, 2015, 12:26:08 PM by The Pigeon »

AlwaysBeenASaver

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #75 on: May 28, 2015, 01:28:00 PM »
The Pigeon:

I enjoyed reading your experience (so far) and I'm *so glad* you did it! The next 6.5 days will likely be equally strange, but eventually that will be over!

And yeah, "the talk" is scary. I still don't understand (for myself) why it was scarier to have the talk this time than any other time? I've left plenty of jobs so had "the talk" many times, and it's always uncomfortable but the anticipation this time was much worse, no idea why.

I work in big corporate too, but I'm not having quite the same experience of people acting like I'm not leaving, as you are, although it did seem really strange at first that my boss hasn't given me any directions as to whether to just keep working as always or to start transitioning stuff. I decided on my own this morning to not write any new code (I'm a programmer) but instead of start writing notes and so on to get things in a good state for someone to pick up where I left off.

My co-worker who I told is just acting normal, but really there isn't much else he can ask or do about it. As other people hear the news, a few have come by and commented or asked me "why". I don't think a lot of people have heard yet though. I don't have any desire to discuss it, so haven't told anyone myself that doesn't need to know. And I'm really glad I didn't say I'm leaving the workforce - I know this works for many people, but most people here work til they're 65+ and additionally people tend to guess I'm younger than I am, so it would have been super uncomfortable to get a bunch of "you're too young" and "you'll be bored" type stuff.

MarcherLady

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #76 on: May 31, 2015, 03:20:08 AM »
So as in your case I thought the only way I can get myself on a layoff list in the future is if I answer the "5 year plan" question truthfully.

Daisy, my company has been through many phases of layoff's over the last few years.  As a manager I was even in a position where I had one of my employees volunteer for a layoff.  I would strongly advise caution if you plan to tell your boss you want to leave. 

Picture this:  I'm a manager who has the task of making a certain % of my team redundant.  I have a pool of cash to ease their progress out of the door.  I have to make the decision about who to let go - most of these people need their jobs, and will be screwed if I let them go.  The pool of cash is never big enough.  I feel bad about it.  One of my people comes to me and says 'I'm thinking about leaving.'  What do I do?  I think "phew, Daisy wants to go, all these other people want to stay.  She was going to leave even without the cash incentive.  Great news, that's one fewer person I need to push, but I haven't spent a penny, I can share that around the ones that I have to let go unwillingly."   Daisy gets no layoff cash.

Circumstances may be different in your company, but, as I say, approach with caution.

Insanity

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #77 on: May 31, 2015, 12:27:04 PM »

So as in your case I thought the only way I can get myself on a layoff list in the future is if I answer the "5 year plan" question truthfully.

Daisy, my company has been through many phases of layoff's over the last few years.  As a manager I was even in a position where I had one of my employees volunteer for a layoff.  I would strongly advise caution if you plan to tell your boss you want to leave. 

Picture this:  I'm a manager who has the task of making a certain % of my team redundant.  I have a pool of cash to ease their progress out of the door.  I have to make the decision about who to let go - most of these people need their jobs, and will be screwed if I let them go.  The pool of cash is never big enough.  I feel bad about it.  One of my people comes to me and says 'I'm thinking about leaving.'  What do I do?  I think "phew, Daisy wants to go, all these other people want to stay.  She was going to leave even without the cash incentive.  Great news, that's one fewer person I need to push, but I haven't spent a penny, I can share that around the ones that I have to let go unwillingly."   Daisy gets no layoff cash.

Circumstances may be different in your company, but, as I say, approach with caution.

Huh?  Why wouldn't you give the layoff package to one who wants to go?  It makes it less painful for you as you have one less that you have to let go unwillingly.   Unless you are saying that the person leaving gives you more money to distribute to the one fewer you have to let go?


The Pigeon

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #78 on: June 01, 2015, 10:51:28 AM »
Well, Friday (4 days post-notice) was the day the co-workers "heard it through the grapevine," and finally a couple mentioned it to me. I had nice conversations with them, but other than that, it's pretty hush-hush here. This place is SO buttoned down, there's not any real social stuff, people pretty much come in, zombie-like, *maybe* say hello, and keep on working. I think there's a lot of fear here, at least I felt fear here in my tiny 4 months that I've been here. Most other places have had a jovial atmosphere, after all, we're all here in this hellhole together, so let's at least try to make each other's day tolerable. Here, it's like a bunch of automatons.

My boss and his management-underlings haven't said jack all to me since I gave notice. I'm a pariah!

So today is my LAST MONDAY. (Although I offered to stay and train a new person, but no new person has appeared, nor any rumble of a new person, so I think Friday will indeed be my last day as a working person). (!!!!)

Freaking out a little bit about it, but also looking forward to jumping off this hamster wheel--I'm a *PIGEON* not a hamster FFS!

I do hope that I just glide the hallways as a ghost for the remainder of the week. I do not want any party or send-off (Gawd, I hope they don't try to 'acknowledge' it)--On Friday I just want to quietly scuttle along the baseboards, rat-like, unnoticed, to the elevator, press the "L" button, drop my badge, push open the door and spread my wings.

4 days, 6 hrs, 42 mins until I jump into the FIRE.

!!!!!!!!!!

-Pigeon

AlwaysBeenASaver

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #79 on: June 01, 2015, 10:56:36 AM »
Yay for "last Mondays!" Looks like I'm on the same schedule as you. When I woke up this morning, the first thing I thought was "next Monday, I won't have to get out of bed this early!"

The Pigeon

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #80 on: June 01, 2015, 01:45:55 PM »
Congrats and happy high-fives to you, AlwaysBeenASaver! Friday is gonna be good!
(It also appears that ARebelSpy is joining us for the big June 5 retirement party!)

On Friday let's all have a drink and toast each other's grand achievement from afar!

:-D


AlwaysBeenASaver

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #81 on: June 01, 2015, 01:51:48 PM »
Congrats and happy high-fives to you, AlwaysBeenASaver! Friday is gonna be good!
(It also appears that ARebelSpy is joining us for the big June 5 retirement party!)

On Friday let's all have a drink and toast each other's grand achievement from afar!

:-D
Sounds like a great idea to me!!

G-dog

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #82 on: June 02, 2015, 07:19:22 AM »
My "talk" became an email because my boss is out on a work trip. So I returned from vacation, learned that the boss was not here, and sent the email with a more formal letter attached.

So, no drama. Email was acknowledged calmly. So, no angst or counter offers from the boss.

 Telling Co-workers is the next stage of the process

earlyFI

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #83 on: June 02, 2015, 08:16:20 AM »
My "talk" became an email because my boss is out on a work trip. So I returned from vacation, learned that the boss was not here, and sent the email with a more formal letter attached.

So, no drama. Email was acknowledged calmly. So, no angst or counter offers from the boss.

 Telling Co-workers is the next stage of the process

Congrats G-dog! Glad to hear it went so swell. And best wishes going forward.

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #84 on: June 02, 2015, 01:33:32 PM »


...Great news, that's one fewer person I need to push, but I haven't spent a penny, I can share that around the ones that I have to let go unwillingly."   Daisy gets no layoff cash.

Huh?  Why wouldn't you give the layoff package to one who wants to go?  It makes it less painful for you as you have one less that you have to let go unwillingly.   Unless you are saying that the person leaving gives you more money to distribute to the one fewer you have to let go?

Exactly.  I have to cut my head count by 3 people.  I have 12k to split between them.  I discover that someone is about to leave voluntarily.  Now I have 2 people to pay off.  6k each. Why would a company pay you to leave if you have told them you are going to leave anyway?

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #85 on: June 02, 2015, 02:34:39 PM »


...Great news, that's one fewer person I need to push, but I haven't spent a penny, I can share that around the ones that I have to let go unwillingly."   Daisy gets no layoff cash.

Huh?  Why wouldn't you give the layoff package to one who wants to go?  It makes it less painful for you as you have one less that you have to let go unwillingly.   Unless you are saying that the person leaving gives you more money to distribute to the one fewer you have to let go?

Exactly.  I have to cut my head count by 3 people.  I have 12k to split between them.  I discover that someone is about to leave voluntarily.  Now I have 2 people to pay off.  6k each. Why would a company pay you to leave if you have told them you are going to leave anyway?

Places I have worked have an actual policy where the payout isn't arbitrarily decided, but decided by a formula.  The reasoning here is to develop a formula that can't be easily challenged in a lawsuit.  So... volunteering to be in the layoff is usually a godsend for managers in that situation.  (I've volunteered many times, but never been chosen.)

Often it isn't "I'm leaving anyway" ... it's "If you have to make someone leave, I won't be adversely affected.  It's okay."  So NOT giving me the package means I would have still been around (and was).

Daisy

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #86 on: June 06, 2015, 11:36:52 PM »
So as in your case I thought the only way I can get myself on a layoff list in the future is if I answer the "5 year plan" question truthfully.

Daisy, my company has been through many phases of layoff's over the last few years.  As a manager I was even in a position where I had one of my employees volunteer for a layoff.  I would strongly advise caution if you plan to tell your boss you want to leave. 

Picture this:  I'm a manager who has the task of making a certain % of my team redundant.  I have a pool of cash to ease their progress out of the door.  I have to make the decision about who to let go - most of these people need their jobs, and will be screwed if I let them go.  The pool of cash is never big enough.  I feel bad about it.  One of my people comes to me and says 'I'm thinking about leaving.'  What do I do?  I think "phew, Daisy wants to go, all these other people want to stay.  She was going to leave even without the cash incentive.  Great news, that's one fewer person I need to push, but I haven't spent a penny, I can share that around the ones that I have to let go unwillingly."   Daisy gets no layoff cash.

Circumstances may be different in your company, but, as I say, approach with caution.

Well the point is moot now. I heard that with all of the attrition happening after all of the layoffs over the past couple of years, that now they are worried that too many people are leaving. I was told that there won't be any more lucrative voluntary packages, and that the involuntary ones may be changing. Who knows what it all means? They are now actively begging us all to stay and making it all sound so rosy and exciting for the future.

Meh...I don't have much more to go. I may just start being honest with my boss and letting him know that the future work assignments he has envisioned for me are not the types of assignments I want. He has already warned me what I'd be doing after my current project and it's not what I want to do. So I may take the risk of being honest with him in the hopes that it gets me a better next assignment. If he can't provide that, then I'll just stick around until the next layoff. I won't say it in such a direct form, but will try to proactively warn him that I won't be happy doing what he wants me to do and maybe it would be best if they would just let me go if that's what they have planned.

Bicycle_B

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #87 on: June 08, 2015, 08:47:05 PM »
So as in your case I thought the only way I can get myself on a layoff list in the future is if I answer the "5 year plan" question truthfully.



Meh...I don't have much more to go. I may just start being honest with my boss and letting him know that the future work assignments he has envisioned for me are not the types of assignments I want. He has already warned me what I'd be doing after my current project and it's not what I want to do. So I may take the risk of being honest with him in the hopes that it gets me a better next assignment. If he can't provide that, then I'll just stick around until the next layoff. I won't say it in such a direct form, but will try to proactively warn him that I won't be happy doing what he wants me to do and maybe it would be best if they would just let me go if that's what they have planned.

Consider checking out "How to Engineer Your Own Layoff" by Financial Samurai, www.financialsamurai.com.  I have no relation to him and get no benefit, it just is a book (small book) specializing in the situation where you want to leave and they haven't given you golden keys to the exit door yet.

Zamboni

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #88 on: June 08, 2015, 09:30:44 PM »
Congrats to everyone who has successfully navigated this!

Around here there seem to be two ways people go:

1)  Make the announcement many months or even years in advance, during "peak season" when everyone is around to here about it, ask you about, express their best wishes or ire, or

2)  Make the announcement as late as possible with as little notice as possible, during "low season" when almost no one is around to ask about it.

Not sure which way I will choose.  I've used essentially the same resignation letter twice before. It's short, polite, says thank you but nothing about my future plans beyond my last plan date of work. The whole "conversation with God" is a good idea, though, I might just go with that regardless of the timing. 

G-dog

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #89 on: June 09, 2015, 07:10:03 PM »
Well, even though I could inform my boss via email and avoid the Mano-a-Mano talk, she recently set up monthly 1:1 meetings with everyone and I 'get' to have a meeting this week. This was one of her goals this year, and she finally started in June.

This could be interesting. Apparently she told someone she is surprised that I am leaving/retiring, but she hasn't said anything to me ...... Yet.....

If anything interesting happens (actually unlikely), I'll report back.

G-dog

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #90 on: June 11, 2015, 06:00:19 PM »
Well, even though I could inform my boss via email and avoid the Mano-a-Mano talk, she recently set up monthly 1:1 meetings with everyone and I 'get' to have a meeting this week. This was one of her goals this year, and she finally started in June.

This could be interesting. Apparently she told someone she is surprised that I am leaving/retiring, but she hasn't said anything to me ...... Yet.....

If anything interesting happens (actually unlikely), I'll report back.

Nothing very interesting, no questions, pretty much a non-event. I reported on my current priorities, including meeting with othe officer manager to make sure I do a good job mopping up my mess on the way out.
Offered a farewell party, and better yet accepted my answer when I opted out. I am not comfortable being the subject of large group focus in this scenario. I'll miss folks, many good people.
Another thing on my exits list is sending kudos to folks and their bosses. Plenty of people have done things to make my life easier along the way. I try to alert bosses on a timely way, but now I feel free to shovel on a thicker layer!

G-dog

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #91 on: June 17, 2015, 06:18:10 PM »
Well, even though I could inform my boss via email and avoid the Mano-a-Mano talk, she recently set up monthly 1:1 meetings with everyone and I 'get' to have a meeting this week. This was one of her goals this year, and she finally started in June.

This could be interesting. Apparently she told someone she is surprised that I am leaving/retiring, but she hasn't said anything to me ...... Yet.....

If anything interesting happens (actually unlikely), I'll report back.

Nothing very interesting, no questions, pretty much a non-event. I reported on my current priorities, including meeting with othe officer manager to make sure I do a good job mopping up my mess on the way out.
Offered a farewell party, and better yet accepted my answer when I opted out. I am not comfortable being the subject of large group focus in this scenario. I'll miss folks, many good people.
Another thing on my exits list is sending kudos to folks and their bosses. Plenty of people have done things to make my life easier along the way. I try to alert bosses on a timely way, but now I feel free to shovel on a thicker layer!

This week a meeting showed up on my calendar with the head of the whole department. It is next week - what is this about? Four people have left from my section of the department in the last 14 months - 2 went to other jobs, the other 2 retired, no exit interviews for them. I think I may be the last Jenna piece pulled before the tower collapses....
Or it could be something else completely....

Zamboni

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #92 on: June 17, 2015, 07:30:35 PM »
Hmmm, the plot thickens.  Usually it is HR who handles exit interviews, not the head of the whole division. 

So, what could it be?

Could be to ask you why you are leaving. 
Could be to ask you why other people have left.
Could be to get your honest opinion on a few things, now that you are leaving.
Could be to give you some inside information that he thinks might make you want to stay (A change in management, for example).
Could be to ask you to stay.  If so, decide what (if anything) would entice you to stay. No ask is too outrageous.  You don't need this job, after all. Maybe you would be willing to work part time at double or triple the wage? Maybe you would be willing to stay on as a consultant for $300 an hour?
Could be to tell you that you are making a big mistake (my friend had to endure one of these meetings).
Could be to invite you to a charity ball at his house ;-)

Whatever it is, good luck!

G-dog

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #93 on: June 17, 2015, 08:14:55 PM »
Hmmm, the plot thickens.  Usually it is HR who handles exit interviews, not the head of the whole division. 

So, what could it be?

Could be to ask you why you are leaving. 
Could be to ask you why other people have left.
Could be to get your honest opinion on a few things, now that you are leaving.
Could be to give you some inside information that he thinks might make you want to stay (A change in management, for example).
Could be to ask you to stay.  If so, decide what (if anything) would entice you to stay. No ask is too outrageous.  You don't need this job, after all. Maybe you would be willing to work part time at double or triple the wage? Maybe you would be willing to stay on as a consultant for $300 an hour?
Could be to tell you that you are making a big mistake (my friend had to endure one of these meetings).
Could be to invite you to a charity ball at his house ;-)

Whatever it is, good luck!

The charity ball would be fun!
Actually, they just announced a reduction in force. Also, because of "dotted line" reporting structure, the head of the department isn't really my boss's boss - so he isn't in any position to negotiate for me to stay or do contract work (except in a different role in his group).
I suspect that it is fishing for information - but being up front and honest in the past has resulted in no changes in the past, so I see no benefit now, other than maybe making things worse for those remaining. If he asks me direct questions, I'll likely be honest. Is he asks vague questions or open questions, I will be equally vague in response.

As much as I dreaded some of this, once you know you are leaving (all the control is in your court), it can be kind of entertaining.

The company has significantly decreased HR, at least certain functions. But who knows, while I am the only one I see on the invite, there could be a surprise guest too.

CanuckExpat

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #94 on: June 17, 2015, 11:51:39 PM »
I've really been enjoying this thread and hearing how everybody handled it.
I don't have a story of my own to contribute (yet?), but thought some of you may enjoy these two tales:
http://www.bravenewlife.com/04/retiring-early-a-final-update/
http://livingafi.com/2015/03/17/quitters-never-win-except-when-they-do-1/

G-dog

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Re: Having "the talk" with your boss (and others)
« Reply #95 on: June 26, 2015, 07:53:27 PM »
Hmmm, the plot thickens.  Usually it is HR who handles exit interviews, not the head of the whole division. 

So, what could it be?

Could be to ask you why you are leaving. 
Could be to ask you why other people have left.
Could be to get your honest opinion on a few things, now that you are leaving.
Could be to give you some inside information that he thinks might make you want to stay (A change in management, for example).
Could be to ask you to stay.  If so, decide what (if anything) would entice you to stay. No ask is too outrageous.  You don't need this job, after all. Maybe you would be willing to work part time at double or triple the wage? Maybe you would be willing to stay on as a consultant for $300 an hour?
Could be to tell you that you are making a big mistake (my friend had to endure one of these meetings).
Could be to invite you to a charity ball at his house ;-)

Whatever it is, good luck!

The charity ball would be fun!
Actually, they just announced a reduction in force. Also, because of "dotted line" reporting structure, the head of the department isn't really my boss's boss - so he isn't in any position to negotiate for me to stay or do contract work (except in a different role in his group).
I suspect that it is fishing for information - but being up front and honest in the past has resulted in no changes in the past, so I see no benefit now, other than maybe making things worse for those remaining. If he asks me direct questions, I'll likely be honest. Is he asks vague questions or open questions, I will be equally vague in response.

As much as I dreaded some of this, once you know you are leaving (all the control is in your court), it can be kind of entertaining.

The company has significantly decreased HR, at least certain functions. But who knows, while I am the only one I see on the invite, there could be a surprise guest too.

General 'thank you' for years of service, may have been a general exit interview. Ask for tips for improvement. Mostly a non-event as I don't want to burn bridges