The Money Mustache Community
General Discussion => Post-FIRE => Topic started by: Stash Man on April 17, 2016, 07:14:01 PM
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Completely unscientific poll :) I'm just curious if FIRE is all it's cracked up to be, because trading a job for unlimited free time doesn't automatically make you happier.
Please vote if you have FIRE'd for at least 1/2 year (after the novelty wears off). Thanks a lot!
I'm not FIRE'd yet.
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Every situation is different :-) So, can you please focus the question a bit more? I.e. what is the root of the question?
Also, you may want to listen to podcasts from MadFientist here: http://www.madfientist.com/podcast/
Mad Fientist interviews a bunch of people who have already achieved FI in different ways....awesome discussions.
Hope that helps.
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This might be a negative vote :)
https://livingafi.com/2016/04/01/early-retirement-bites/
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FIRE'd July 2015. Aside from several months dealing with a family illness/death* I find myself thinking "Goddamn, life is awesome!" at least once a day.
*FIRE also enabled me to spend lots of time with family during a bad stretch of time. Yes, FMLA would have made this work as well, but it was just easier and without emotional work strings pulling on me.
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I think most people will be happier without having to work, if they do not worry about money.
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I said somewhat happier because I loved my job very much but the bureaucracy not so much. I can be pretty much happy in many different circumstances. However, I am not sorry I retired one tiny bit.
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This might be a negative vote :)
https://livingafi.com/2016/04/01/early-retirement-bites/
Thanks for posting this. It has given me the motivation to get through another day.
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too funny:))
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I wake up each day happier than the one before. But I also did that before I retired. Life gets better and better everyday. I can't imagine being happier than I am now, but know that in the future I will be. It's a great to be FIRED, but happiness is separate from financial state.
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I voted 'much happier'. Frankly, being 'free' every day is my very definition of happiness!
Other than take care of the kids, I can pretty much do whatever I want now...and sometimes that means nothing!
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Only been a few weeks, but I don't really feel that much different in the general happiness department. I feel like I was always a pretty happy person. Perhaps a bit relieved I don't have to go to the office anymore. I checked with my wife and she says I seem much happier, but when I inquired further, I think she interpreted a lower level of (previously work related) irritation as an increase in happiness. Probably still have some recent retiree jitters as well. I do believe, over time, as I am able to invest more time in the things I enjoy, I will have an increase in satisfaction. So for now, I voted about the same but expect that to change as time goes on.
I'm thinking I'll will see an increase in happiness this summer on our big out west road trip, though! Always love seeing new things, perhaps that's why I feel about the same, as I haven't really seen anything new since I retired.
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I voted much happier , its been a year since April 3rd. It hasnt gone without worry or some doubt but those feeling become less and less as I get further into it.
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Don't know if I should vote since I'm only able to evaluate pre-FI vs. post-FI. This was definitely the best thing that ever happened to me, almost monumental enough to think of life in BC/AD civilization terms. At one point in my life, losing my job would have been stressful and affected me in many ways, but now I haven't a care in the world. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy a little ego stroke that comes with paid work, working with professionals that I respect, and spending some of the bottomless pile of company money (in what I hope are mutually beneficial endeavors).
Maybe pre-ER / post-ER will be another similar step change (I'm hoping so, to offset the downside of the fact that, although life is getting better, I'm still getting nothing but older). Thus far though, I'd vote 'much happier' for being pre-RE-post-FI, but I can already suspect that this unscientific poll isn't going to reveal anything we don't already know.
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I could not possibly answer this question in such a manner to do it justice.
FIRE has been everything AND MORE in terms of delivering a steady stream of happiness and fulfillment into my life...and by extension into the lives of certain people close to me.
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Everything (http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/post-fire/bms-is-it-just-me/) is better in FIRE. Even "those".
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Everything (http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/post-fire/bms-is-it-just-me/) is better in FIRE. Even "those".
I certainly would have less time to read those wonderful threads if I had to be to work every day...
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I've only been FIRE for about 4 months but I can't help but respond. :) Retiring early has been more than what I hoped. Not to get too philosophical but I see things now that were just passing blurs when I was dedicating 12 hours + a day to my career that really make me appreciate life. That includes my relationships, nature, and just my general well being. Just recently two work associates died untimely deaths and that really hit home as to how I want to spend the rest of my life. I highly recommend it to anyone who's life isn't their career.
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My DW proudly recalls when she talked to friends and family on the phone shortly after retiring, and multiple people commented on how she sounded like a completely different person. Removing stress and taking charge of your happiness has measurable positive effects on your life that people can't help but notice. It manifested in me with weight loss, and I often get comments about how different I look.
FIRE is great. It takes a little time to adjust, but IMHO ditching old routines and breaking out of your comfort zone is part of what makes it so exciting.
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Next month will be Best Husband's one-year FIRE anniversary, and mine is in June. It's not just that we're much happier (which is how I voted), but that we're just such different people now, and that's what contributes to the happiness. We're not rushed, anxious, glancing at the phone constantly, exhausted at the end of the day, dealing with commutes, overwhelmed with jobs and trying to manage basic errands, cooking and sufficient exercise, we have more creative time. FIRE has so changed who and how we are that that's what has made us much happier. :)
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I replied "much happier" but I think most of the happiness is because we moved to a place I like much better. But then, we wouldn't have moved had we not been retired :)
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I am naturally an anxious person, so I'm always gonna have some baseline of fear and stress, BUT...
Even I can see that we are in a much less perilous position that almost all of our peers. DH still works but we could easily weather a job loss or just go all the way to ER if we wanted. I can stay home with the kids and we can afford more kids than is typical. Our weird lifestyle has a potentially very low burn rate (our house is paid off and we have very minimal regular bills, although we currently travel and pay for fancy schools and eat out too much, but all of that can be killed quickly) and I just know we are quite safe and secure. I feel resilient and self-sustaining and resourceful, and there's not much that could really blow up our lifestyle, knock wood.
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I'd really like to hear from the person that responded that they are much less happy. Was it FIRE itself? Or other things? Any lessons learned for the rest of us?
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I'd really like to hear from the person that responded that they are much less happy. Was it FIRE itself? Or other things? Any lessons learned for the rest of us?
Second that! I would also love to hear from the folks who voted "about the same". One thing this poll doesn't capture is how happy were you before FIRE. My guess is that some people were already very happy with their lives pre-FIRE, hence even FIRE couldn't boost it much more.
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If someone is less happy it is probably time to go back to work. I work p.t. online from home on my own schedule which brings in good $ and keeps my mind stimulated. For me this is the best of both worlds. I had 2 surgeries this year and can't imagine if I had to go back to work after a short period of time. I was able to thoroughly rest and do things at my own pace. Plus the dogs love having me home so much:))
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I'm very glad to hear that most people are either somewhat or much happier post-FIRE. Sometime I fear that after working so hard for this goal, when I finally achieve it it will be a letdown and I'll feel it wasn't worth it. This gives me hope that it WILL be worth it!
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I have been FIRE for about a year now. I voted somewhat happier because I realized in the last 5 years of my job that it was not really making me happy even though it was flexible and at times interesting. I decided to find enjoyment in my hobbies and activities outside of work and concluded that it was just a job that brought in a good income that I could use to retire on. So when I finally retired my baseline happiness was already good. It went up somewhat because I did not have to spend 8+ hours away from the things that I enjoyed doing and not having to go to meetings, deal with the office politics and be on call was a plus to.
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Well, since Saturday is my favorite day of the week...and the last year since FIRE has been like perpetual Saturday, it's about 7x better than pre-FIRE :D
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My true answer is "immeasurably ".
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This post is good affirmation for those who haven't FIRE'd yet - myself included. I'm definitely interested to hear from the 'less than' and 'about the same' folks to get an understanding of why happiness hasn't improved.
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I didn't expect such an overwhelming majority in the happier camp! Frankly, my guess was that once the novelty wears off people start to get bored. I also expected that, after being institutionalized for so long, people would have trouble adjusting to a free life. Really glad to be wrong this time.
Hopefully the poll wasn't biased because the unhappy people chose not to vote or aren't on this forum for whatever reasons. Definitely looking forward to my own FIRE now.
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I didn't expect such an overwhelming majority in the happier camp! Frankly, my guess was that once the novelty wears off people start to get bored. I also expected that, after being institutionalized for so long, people would have trouble adjusting to a free life. Really glad to be wrong this time.
Hopefully the poll wasn't biased because the unhappy people chose not to vote or aren't on this forum for whatever reasons. Definitely looking forward to my own FIRE now.
I think if you are persuing FIRE, you are already a psychological outlier. You are, in society's view, "not quite right in the head". To me, it makes sense we have outcomes that are counter-intuitive.
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I'm not even retired yet, and I'm much happier knowing that I will be retiring soon. Every time something nuts happens at work I think "not my circus, not my monkeys"
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This might be a negative vote :)
https://livingafi.com/2016/04/01/early-retirement-bites/
April 1 would be a great day to FIRE.
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Hopefully the poll wasn't biased because the unhappy people chose not to vote or aren't on this forum for whatever reasons.
FIRE'd in Sept 2015. When I ask myself if I would ever want to go back, the answer is NOOOOOOOOOOO! But I can't say I'm ecstatic either. For me it was a big adjustment and I have had many "wait a minute - I can do that now" moments. I often still find myself behaving like the canary who stays in the cage even with the cage door wide open.
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Our poll matches the results of a much larger survey by the University of Michigan:
http://blogs.wsj.com/experts/2015/12/01/why-retirees-are-happier-than-you-may-think/
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I didn't expect such an overwhelming majority in the happier camp! Frankly, my guess was that once the novelty wears off people start to get bored. I also expected that, after being institutionalized for so long, people would have trouble adjusting to a free life. Really glad to be wrong this time.
Hopefully the poll wasn't biased because the unhappy people chose not to vote or aren't on this forum for whatever reasons. Definitely looking forward to my own FIRE now.
If the novelty ever wears off, one could go back to work? Or just boot up the pc and read a thread or two on here - it'll quickly remind one how great it is to be free. That is, if one has time between all the ass-kicking they're doing at WHATEVER THE HELL THEY WANT TO DO that day.
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For me, I make good money at a job I used to love. I like the people I work with which makes a difference.
The kicker is that I have to sit through mind-numbing meetings each day which add nothing to productivity.
Upper management likes to treat us like kids who have to be micro-managed constantly.
Working for a large company has really turned me off to my career.
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I'm one of the people who voted about the same. I replaced some stressors of my job with other stressors in retirement. Just see the post I started about feeling I have to accomplish something everyday. But, I think this has more to do with my general personality and not FIRE per say.
It is nice not to have to get up early and go to work, but I still kind of miss my job and coworker interactions. I seem to be filling my time with household chores which to me are boring, but again, must be accomplishing something! Also, my husband and I are not used to being together all the time and that has caused some stress too! I need a lot of alone time to recharge and he is the opposite and loves to be around people all the time. We solve this by driving to gatherings separately, so I can go home when I feel I need to.
I feel like I should be volunteering or something, but I am not a people person and it would cause me more stress in the long run. Basically, I am most happy when travelling somewhere. We have been doing as much of that as possible and that is when I truly feel very happy. Luckily, my husband loves to travel too, so when we are on the go, we get along great and have a lot of fun.
I think most people's happiness level is a set thing, and after the euphoria of retiring wears off, you revert to your natural disposition.
Miss Prim
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I feel like I should be volunteering or something, but I am not a people person and it would cause me more stress in the long run.
There are volunteer tasks that don't require much interaction. Some are even remote. I am very involved with a small animal rescue group and I can quickly think of four people that volunteer regularly that barely interact with others. Sunday cleaning, internet posts, schedules for animals to attend events, etc. And I would love to find someone that will take over more of my data entry/management. Its difficult to find people for these tasks, because people that want to work with the animal rescue want to actually work with the animals. The Sunday cleaning folks probably have the best animal lover/non-people person job. They come in when the place is closed, clean a little, then play with all the animals. The rest are valuable jobs that people can do from their sofa.
Anyway, I realize you said "I feel like I should be volunteering" which is different that wanting to volunteer, but there are plenty of things you can do as a non-people person. Its just that you probably have to ask specifically about those.
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I find it interesting how often executives and other high-powered professionals have a hard time retiring. I've seen that at my old workplaces as well...old guys who come back a few months after retirement because they have nothing else to do.
I would bet that were retirement forced on certain subsets of the population, a lot of these people would have a hard time with it, and their survey results would be more mixed.
That said, these survey results above don't surprise me much, since we of this forum presumably a) aren't in love with our jobs, and b) have lots of ideas for what we will do with our post-retirement time.
I am firmly in the "much happier" camp. I used to spend Sunday worried about Monday. Now, every day is like Saturday!
Post-retirement is all about creativity: come up with an idea, execute it, then come up with another idea. A trip, a project, a hobby.
Fortunately, everyone on these forums seems to be full of great ideas!
I'd bet you will mostly fall into the "much happier" camp as well.
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120% happier, maybe more.
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I am not FIRE but I wanted to offer some insight.
I have been, 2 times in my life, able to stop working for an extended period of time. These were temporary situations.
Both times, I went in to big depression.
The problem I found, was that I had nothing to do. And, when I tried to do more with other people, I ran in to roadblocks because they were still on regular monday-friday 40plus hour work schedules. So, I was limited to seeing them on the weekend (if they were free) and so, a majority of my time was with nothing to do. Sure, I could have joined a club or something but I didn't.
In my mind, and this may go against the grain here, I never want to retire. I always want to work at least part time until I die. I never want to work full time for life mind you. But I never want to be completely without a job to go to. I find it keeps me grounded in real world life. When you have no anchor to the normal heart-beat of the rest of the world, it seems I was lost and alone. Maybe cause I am single as well.
I wish there was a method for FIRE that included working your whole life. I'd rather not FIRE and instead, do a half FIRE. Instead of building u a huge nest - egg that FIRES me (trading huge amounts of labor to get there), I'd rather start working part time now and do so for life.
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I wish there was a method for FIRE that included working your whole life. I'd rather not FIRE and instead, do a half FIRE. Instead of building u a huge nest - egg that FIRES me (trading huge amounts of labor to get there), I'd rather start working part time now and do so for life.
There is a method. Work PT. There are no rules to this other than the ones that you believe suit your situation. You say you could have joined a club, but didn't. The truth is you did: the "people with a job" club. That's a valid choice.
I am also single and my plans for FIRE include volunteering and having a wide range of friends. One of my best friends is 20 years older than I am. Her kids are grown and she works PT on a flexible schedule.
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Full retirement was not for me either. That's why I consult and teach a college class. I probably work about 10 - 15 hours/week which is perfect depending on what is going on.
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I know I've answered this, but every time I see the topic, my brain pipes up with "immeasurably" Every darn time. Hooray!
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I know I've answered this, but every time I see the topic, my brain pipes up with "immeasurably" Every darn time. Hooray!
IKR! It's fantastic to wake up every day and know that the day is going to be awesome, and that you'll be happier than ever!
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I know I've answered this, but every time I see the topic, my brain pipes up with "immeasurably" Every darn time. Hooray!
IKR! It's fantastic to wake up every day and know that the day is going to be awesome, and that you'll be happier than ever!
I do have to wonder, although I am happier than ever and amassing more money than I ever could spend on physical goods and maybe experiences (although I might like space travel and medical advances available to me in 20 years), is there something I'm missing? Is it really this easy :) I really hope it is!
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There is a method. Work PT. There are no rules to this other than the ones that you believe suit your situation.
1. My current job does not offer part time and all the jobs that I know of that do offer part time are really low paying, not very attractive jobs. The closest thing I've got so far is using my vacation days to work 4 days a week instead of 5. I get a lot of vacation days cause I've been there so long.
2. My expenses are so extremely low (less than $10,000 a year) that I don't know what to base FIRE or part-time-FIRE on. I think my numbers, being so low, cannot possibly sustain my whole life. But, I don't know what number too use!
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I know I've answered this, but every time I see the topic, my brain pipes up with "immeasurably" Every darn time. Hooray!
IKR! It's fantastic to wake up every day and know that the day is going to be awesome, and that you'll be happier than ever!
I do have to wonder, although I am happier than ever and amassing more money than I ever could spend on physical goods and maybe experiences (although I might like space travel and medical advances available to me in 20 years), is there something I'm missing? Is it really this easy :) I really hope it is!
I hope so too! I've never felt that anything was missing though. Maybe I need to expose myself to more advertising. :D
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I'm not even retired yet, and I'm much happier knowing that I will be retiring soon. Every time something nuts happens at work I think "not my circus, not my monkeys"
Exactly. Just having a FIRE plan makes dealing with work so much easier. Instead of worrying about my career path and trying to make as much money as I possibly can just to keep up with an ever inflating lifestyle, I know that my plan is solid and any more money I happen to make is just going to make it happen a bit sooner or be a little extra safety margin. My "career" that I use to worry about is only a couple more years, so I just sit back and do my job.
Funny thing...since I created my FIRE plan, one of the biggest reasons I hated my job was resolved (new boss). So it feels like the energy I spent finding the fastest way out of the rat race was rewarded with both peace of mind and an easier sentence until I'm free. I guess I have that bad boss to thank for motivating me to look for a way out...which lead me to finding MMM in the first place.
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Ten thousand billion percent happier.
100% I do what I want. It's almost been a year, and I've *NEVER* been bored. Actually, I'm so busy now that I wonder how I ever managed to work a full-time job. I'm a musician, and now I can spend as much time as I want on improving my skills, or learning songs, or writing music.
Anyway. I can't imagine anyone being unhappy in FIRE.
Every time I'm out and about and see employees and bosses, I just think about how I couldn't stand to go back to that ever again. UGH!
No one tells the Pigeon what to do!
Coo! Coo! Coo!
-The Pigeon
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Ten thousand billion percent happier.
100% I do what I want. It's almost been a year, and I've *NEVER* been bored. Actually, I'm so busy now that I wonder how I ever managed to work a full-time job. I'm a musician, and now I can spend as much time as I want on improving my skills, or learning songs, or writing music.
Anyway. I can't imagine anyone being unhappy in FIRE.
Every time I'm out and about and see employees and bosses, I just think about how I couldn't stand to go back to that ever again. UGH!
No one tells the Pigeon what to do!
Coo! Coo! Coo!
-The Pigeon
To me, this highlights the fact that people shouldn't ER expecting to 'go back to work if they have to'. Nope, ride that job into ER and then burn the idea that you'll do a little more work sometime when you're older.
Also, I think people that hated their jobs will enjoy retirement substantially more than I will, although I'll still enjoy it quite a lot when I feel that the 'trade-off' is right.
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Ten thousand billion percent happier.
100% I do what I want. It's almost been a year, and I've *NEVER* been bored. Actually, I'm so busy now that I wonder how I ever managed to work a full-time job. I'm a musician, and now I can spend as much time as I want on improving my skills, or learning songs, or writing music.
Anyway. I can't imagine anyone being unhappy in FIRE.
Every time I'm out and about and see employees and bosses, I just think about how I couldn't stand to go back to that ever again. UGH!
No one tells the Pigeon what to do!
Coo! Coo! Coo!
-The Pigeon
To me, this highlights the fact that people shouldn't ER expecting to 'go back to work if they have to'. Nope, ride that job into ER and then burn the idea that you'll do a little more work sometime when you're older.
Also, I think people that hated their jobs will enjoy retirement substantially more than I will, although I'll still enjoy it quite a lot when I feel that the 'trade-off' is right.
I loved my job. I love FIRE even more.
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I'm in the ten thousand billion percent happier club. :)
4 months into an endless weekend and loving it.
I hated my job but now I can't really even imagine taking a job I like - it's that thing about them expecting you to show up, like everyday... ;)
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100% I do what I want. It's almost been a year, and I've *NEVER* been bored. Actually, I'm so busy now that I wonder how I ever managed to work a full-time job... Every time I'm out and about and see employees and bosses, I just think about how I couldn't stand to go back to that ever again. UGH!
This. 100% this. I have been so busy this past year that I have no idea how I ever worked a full-time job. I know I did, I just cannot fathom HOW. Fortunately, my mom and stepdad retired the same year DH and I achieved FIRE, so now we can all be irritating and marvel to each other that we don't know how we ever managed to work. ;)
Like you, I live in San Francisco, and occasionally (rarely) have found myself downtown during a weekday, and oh, my heart breaks for everyone: all the clusters of upset coworkers, getting yet another coffee to escape the office hell, complaining about their (justifiably horrible sounding) bosses; the awkward "one on one" meetings with managers and their direct reports; the commuting hell. I would have to be starving to go back to that.
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I didn't realize how stressful my job had become until I left it behind. I'm just wrapping up my first year post-FIRE and couldn't be happier. I took a full year to just explore new places and study random topics. I think in year two I will try to get a little more involved in the community, but I've loved having a year with no responsibilities.
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I am much more relaxed, even my wife noticed a big difference in me.
We are extreme DIY's so we basically work for ourselves. So I don't feel bored and anything like that. I am lazy though & will put off any chore to hit the road or whatever.
I am 49 and my wife is 32. We do not fit into anyones group so we are mostly loners. We split our time evenly between AZ and MT. Most snowbirds don't want anything to do with us in AZ. In MT we have family & a couple of friends although they have kids, school activities, jobs, etc. so we don't hang with them much. Just stuff we have experienced, but we wouldn't change anything at all. We have been fully retired for two years.
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There is another thread going on about whether FIRE is subject to hedonic adaptation:
http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/welcome-to-the-forum/if-hedonic-adaptation-exists-what's-the-point-of-early-retirement/
For those who indicated that they are happier after FIRE, do you feel like it is something you will eventually adapt to, or do you feel like it has resulted in a real, permanent change to your happiness level?
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Well I really hope I don't just adapt! I was thinking about this recently and wondering if I'm just in the honeymoon phase (4 months free). I think my happiness comes from a heightened awareness now that I'm not in drone mode. I have such gratitude and appreciation for all the good things in my life. I just enjoy everything more, from that cup of tea to the walk in the forest - it's like I just NOTICE everything more. Another big part is that I get to decide when and what I'm going to do each day so I always 'feel like' doing what I'm doing, instead of 'having to' do something, if that makes sense? The fun stuff is obvious but even the chores are easy. I might decide that today is a great day to hang the clothes on the line or it's a nice day to bike to the grocery store. I have the time and flexibility rather than having to do the laundry and groceries around a work schedule. Or I can just blow the chores off if an unexpected invite comes along - because I feel like I have all the time in the world! And not only have I gained the physical hours of my week back, but I have gained the mental freedom from thinking about my job. That’s priceless!
I think it is a permanent change because I am now in control of my time. If I find that I am less happy - then I am free to make changes. I'm free to do what I want, when I want. What could be better than that?
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It really is a gift to be able to choose what you want to do each day. I invited a group of friends from HS to come visit with their spouses for a week. They will be here tomorrow from all over the country. If I was still working f.t. I would not have been able to do this. It has been so fun to plan, cook, clean and get everything ready for them. WE have been semi-retired for 4 years now and it still feels good.
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Does FIRE also improve one's positive empathy?
I would suspect it does. Being at or very near FI, I have become far more happy for other peoples accomplishments and goals.
I was more competitive and petty when hearing others' good news in the past. I always had the black cloud of needing a steady paycheck hovering over me. That seemed to dampen my ability to be as positive for others' success as I could have been.
When the lever flipped to work becoming optional or simply as a means to reduce RE risk, I suddenly started being less of a jerk so to speak. (I'm still part jerk so no worries there)
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I loved my job. I thought I would miss it - the interactions, the teamwork in achieving things you couldn't achieve alone...
I am much much happier now, and like others, I am happier every day. The other day we were driving somewhere, and I couldn't believe the traffic. Then I noticed that it was 5:30pm, and the traffic was normal peak hour, and I thought how happy I was that I didn't have to contend with this each day. Those sorts of thoughts come up each day - seeing a flock of King Parrots during the day, not having to drag oneself to work when you are not feeling the best. Being able to sleep in if you want to. All these things bring happiness because life is infinitely more pleasurable.
And I have been retired for more than a few years now.
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It's clear to me that all of my mental health issues were work related. I absolutely love my life now and wake up excited every day. I'm achieving my dream of being a professional student. I was a bit worried that I would feel isolated because I am an extrovert, but nope! I feel happy and connected the vast majority of the time.
I found the last few months before FIRE stressful, but I wouldn't change my mind one bit.
I'm just over six months in.
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3 month update. Just passed the MUCH MUCH Happier level and still climbing! :)
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6 months update
6000 km done on the road bike and 20 lbs less weight
no more stress and worries...
Every day is great...
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For me personally, the worry and stress has been removed now that I know I'm financially free; that for me is a huge burden that's been lifted off my mind and means I can relax and enjoy life.
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Oh man this thread makes me want to FIRE so bad... lol
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One thing I love is not having to set an alarm anymore or going into work when you don't feel well but are not deathly sick. Also that feeling that although not sick you just need a mental health day so no one dies:)) All that kind of stress is gone.
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One thing I love is not having to set an alarm anymore or going into work when you don't feel well but are not deathly sick. Also that feeling that although not sick you just need a mental health day so no one dies:)) All that kind of stress is gone.
Ugh. I can't imagine how hard it must be for people that have to set alarms everyday to get up out of bed. I'm convinced its a sign of severe sleep deprivation.
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Not only is that horrible Sunday night letdown gone, but recently I've noticed that I now like weekdays better than weekends. There are less people to compete with if you have to do any kind of errand.
This is after years of Friday afternoon giddiness anticipating the weekend. And a THREE DAY WEEKEND - well that was heaven. It's a strange post-retirement world.
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I've been free 6.5 weeks and it's been like a light switch. I've always been a happy person outside of work but most of my days at work were filled with boredom and my personality can't handle boredom. Ironically, most days since quitting I've just been sitting at home, yet it's still infinitely better than work. I'm about to start building a house (which is the main reason I've been doing some waiting) so I've been reading state building codes, learning about electrical and plumbing. I've spent full days reading, I've watched TV when I've wanted to. I go for walks or run whenever I feel like it. Already, I'm losing track of the days because there's nothing that usually requires me to know what day it is. It's literally a completely different life, like the work Mr. Green has been replaced by a leisure Mr. Green. Here in another week or two I'll be starting a period of long, intense physical labor for days on end. I'm really looking forward to it.
The oddest thing that I've noticed so far is that I'm waking up naturally, earlier than when I did when I went to work. Without an alarm it would be between 8 and 9 AM when I would wake up before. Now it's rare that I wake up after 8 and it's usually closer to 7 AM, just after my wife walks out the door.
The only stress in my life is all the new stuff I have to learn for building this house. One thing I still need to figure out is exercise. I need to develop a habit of doing something every day. Now that there are no requirements of my time I have no excuse not to, and I have a rower so I can't even use dangerously high heat as a reason not to get my heart rate up.
Retirement has been everything I thought it could be so far, and I know that I'm barely touching the tip of the iceberg since I'm still hamstrung a bit by the fact that we're moving to another state but I have to build the house first.
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The only stress in my life is all the new stuff I have to learn for building this house. One thing I still need to figure out is exercise. I need to develop a habit of doing something every day. Now that there are no requirements of my time I have no excuse not to, and I have a rower so I can't even use dangerously high heat as a reason not to get my heart rate up.
Retirement has been everything I thought it could be so far, and I know that I'm barely touching the tip of the iceberg since I'm still hamstrung a bit by the fact that we're moving to another state but I have to build the house first.
Wait. House building to commence in a week or two. And you're worried about exercise? Relax. Your exercise worries are about to resolve themselves for at least the next couple of years.
Source: have built one.
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Wait. House building to commence in a week or two. And you're worried about exercise? Relax. Your exercise worries are about to resolve themselves for at least the next couple of years.
Source: have built one.
Right? Also the stress level with not likely drop until it's built; just the source changes. Constantly. Having been in the same situation, an exercise regime that does not involve moving dozens of 2x4's multiple times or hoisting 70lb sheets of 'rock above your head may help reduce the effects of the stress. Good luck!
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Wait. House building to commence in a week or two. And you're worried about exercise? Relax. Your exercise worries are about to resolve themselves for at least the next couple of years.
Source: have built one.
Right? Also the stress level with not likely drop until it's built; just the source changes. Constantly. Having been in the same situation, an exercise regime that does not involve moving dozens of 2x4's multiple times or hoisting 70lb sheets of 'rock above your head may help reduce the effects of the stress. Good luck!
I keep reminding myself not to get too worked up over any of it. When I have a project like this I tend to focus on it with great intensity. I must remember to relax!
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As predicted, the amazing post fire experiences are starting to pile up and memories are being made. When compared to the monotony of office life, I'm no doubt happier. Still can't relax though, I'm pretty much in overdrive trying to make up for 12 years at a desk. Maybe this winter;)
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Very. Extremely. Our favorite phrase: "Living the Dream!" :-)
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Haven't used an alarm in 3 months, surf and read all day instead of playing with meaningless spreadsheets in an office, spend way more time with the wife and kids and go on crazy adventures together... What's not to love?
Yes, I voted much happier.
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Posting for doses of happy motivation. Love this thread.
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I am not FIRE but I wanted to offer some insight.
I have been, 2 times in my life, able to stop working for an extended period of time. These were temporary situations.
Both times, I went in to big depression. The problem I found, was that I had nothing to do.
In my mind, and this may go against the grain here, I never want to retire. I always want to work at least part time until I die. I never want to work full time for life mind you. But I never want to be completely without a job to go to. I find it keeps me grounded in real world life. When you have no anchor to the normal heart-beat of the rest of the world, it seems I was lost and alone. Maybe cause I am single as well.
I wish there was a method for FIRE that included working your whole life. I'd rather not FIRE and instead, do a half FIRE. Instead of building u a huge nest - egg that FIRES me (trading huge amounts of labor to get there), I'd rather start working part time now and do so for life.
Thanks for a very interesting post. I'm in a different situation, and so far things are working out. I DO work part time - maybe 15-20 hours a week - as a freelance writer for newspapers and corporates, and then write fiction for another 2-3 hours a day. Plus I have my son to look after, am a member of a soccer team, and have made friends with a lot of retired/semi-retired/full time artist folks in their 50s, 60s, 70s and 80s.
I would like to add two things to the discussion as follows: firstly, and this is personal, the only thing I've not enjoyed about the last year has been the (relatively) restricted access to cash compared to when, as a couple, we earned 3x as much as we now have in income. I have an aversion to touching my stash, you see, which makes me even more mustachian. But that capacity to just say screw it and order in a bottle of wine and a pizza because you're feeling lazy/tired is precious.
The second thing I want to add is how quickly one forgets the boredom, inanity, stupidity and politics of working life. It's all too easy to look at the money given by jobs and forget the 20+ years in a cubicle (in my case) which led to the decision to FIRE. From the outside, many day jobs look comfortable, pensioned, etc etc and relatively easy to accomplish. It was, in the main, the spirit-crushing BOREDOM of them that I found, er, diffcult.
BA
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I am not FIRE but I wanted to offer some insight.
I have been, 2 times in my life, able to stop working for an extended period of time. These were temporary situations.
Both times, I went in to big depression. The problem I found, was that I had nothing to do.
In my mind, and this may go against the grain here, I never want to retire. I always want to work at least part time until I die. I never want to work full time for life mind you. But I never want to be completely without a job to go to. I find it keeps me grounded in real world life. When you have no anchor to the normal heart-beat of the rest of the world, it seems I was lost and alone. Maybe cause I am single as well.
I wish there was a method for FIRE that included working your whole life. I'd rather not FIRE and instead, do a half FIRE. Instead of building u a huge nest - egg that FIRES me (trading huge amounts of labor to get there), I'd rather start working part time now and do so for life.
Thanks for a very interesting post. I'm in a different situation, and so far things are working out. I DO work part time - maybe 15-20 hours a week - as a freelance writer for newspapers and corporates, and then write fiction for another 2-3 hours a day. Plus I have my son to look after, am a member of a soccer team, and have made friends with a lot of retired/semi-retired/full time artist folks in their 50s, 60s, 70s and 80s.
I would like to add two things to the discussion as follows: firstly, and this is personal, the only thing I've not enjoyed about the last year has been the (relatively) restricted access to cash compared to when, as a couple, we earned 3x as much as we now have in income. I have an aversion to touching my stash, you see, which makes me even more mustachian. But that capacity to just say screw it and order in a bottle of wine and a pizza because you're feeling lazy/tired is precious.
The second thing I want to add is how quickly one forgets the boredom, inanity, stupidity and politics of working life. It's all too easy to look at the money given by jobs and forget the 20+ years in a cubicle (in my case) which led to the decision to FIRE. From the outside, many day jobs look comfortable, pensioned, etc etc and relatively easy to accomplish. It was, in the main, the spirit-crushing BOREDOM of them that I found, er, diffcult.
BA
Yes, I can relate to the down side of not working. I do feel isolated sometimes in retirement, which is why I'm semi retired. First and foremost I wanted the ability to do things that don't necessarily make money, but that keep me socially and mentally active. So, my part time gig addresses that.
Second, I'm finding a new downside to retirement or semi retirement, that will most likely pass, but is a bit hard to get used to. A lot of friends just don't get it. Some do, or don't care, or are happy for us, but others are really, really hung up on it. Even after I have explained the situation as best as I can without giving them financial details, they still ask if DH or I have a job yet, and are we looking, aren't we bored, etc etc. I sense part confusion, part jealousy. Every time - no, we are not bored, no, we are not looking, we are fine, semi retired, yadda yadda. Not a huge deal but it does get a bit annoying - like we are just too different, and they can't get over this difference in lifestyle, or maybe they were mostly friends with the miserable workaholic side of our selves, which is thankfully gone. All this to say, that it's sad to let go of friendships.
Otherwise we are definitely happier than before!
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Just checking in since it's been almost a year.. Still much much happier! Just a note to the post above. One reason I think I don't miss working is that I moved to a community that is largely retirees. There are many many things going on here to keep one occupied. If I had retired in the home/location I lived when I worked I could see myself getting totally bored. Cheers!
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2.5 years away from FIRE now and it seems like an eternity to go! So psyched to see the overwhelming number of people in the happier/much happier camp.
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I am not FIRE but I wanted to offer some insight.
I have been, 2 times in my life, able to stop working for an extended period of time. These were temporary situations.
Both times, I went in to big depression.
Me too, I have had extended time periods of unemployment. They both ended up with me going into depression because of the lack of any meaning.
I tried making myself do something. Like, I made up plans that tomorrow I am going to do X. Then when I woke up the next day I simply felt like surfing the internet and taking naps on the sofa was more appealing.
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Just checking in since it's been almost a year.. Still much much happier! Just a note to the post above. One reason I think I don't miss working is that I moved to a community that is largely retirees. There are many many things going on here to keep one occupied. If I had retired in the home/location I lived when I worked I could see myself getting totally bored. Cheers!
Congrats on the upcoming anniversary!
Where one lives in FIRE is as important as where one lives when working - and those two areas are probably not the same for most people.
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Donuts: we lost a couple of friendships over jealousy when we semi-retired at 53 & 58 even though we had been talking about it for years and we have pensions. WE have many of the same friends and have made some new friends too. The friends we lost openly disagreed with our choices to downsize our home while they bought a big, new house in their late 60's, etc. We kept our mouths shut about their decisions but in the end I wasn't enjoying the friendships and dropped them.
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This is an extremely motivating thread. Thanks for all who have contributed. We're likely 4-5 years from FI at our current location, but we're considering part-time work for the last few years to make the transition easier, or perhaps part time work will become the norm so we have that extra cash or buffer we may want.
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One month check-in for posterity, and I would say: relatively same level of happiness, slightly more relaxed.
Not sure, but possibly less fulfilled, that might be situation dependent, so no firm commitments on that yet :)
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One month check-in for posterity, and I would say: relatively same level of happiness, slightly more relaxed.
Not sure, but possibly less fulfilled, that might be situation dependent, so no firm commitments on that yet :)
The first six months to a year are the adjustment period. It strikes people differently. Give it time.
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One month check-in for posterity, and I would say: relatively same level of happiness, slightly more relaxed.
Not sure, but possibly less fulfilled, that might be situation dependent, so no firm commitments on that yet :)
The first six months to a year are the adjustment period. It strikes people differently. Give it time.
I expect as much. I should add, my answer doesn't mean I am unhappy now. I was quite happy before, and am quite happy now, though I find there is a lot more up and down in my days.. it was more even level of happiness before.
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We met with a friend yesterday who early retired normally, because he worked in the military where they retire 10 years earlier than normally. He said he was banging his head against the walls after 6 months. Now he has taken a new job in a bicycle store, as cycling is one of his hobbies. He is working more than 100% there and not making a lot of money. But he is again enjoying himself. It may have played a role that his wife has not yet retired.
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Oh man this thread makes me want to FIRE so bad... lol
agreed!!!
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I find it interesting how often executives and other high-powered professionals have a hard time retiring. I've seen that at my old workplaces as well...old guys who come back a few months after retirement because they have nothing else to do.
This is because many of the high powered have huge egos that are fed by not just the large salaries but all those around them that are forced to fawn all over them for the same. If they are liked, they get more of that. If they are unliked, the ego feed may be fake but if they are narcissistic, then they won't recognize or care about that part.
I can't see people with large egos that need to be stroked being happy in retirement unless they can find a feedback loop that will fawn all over them again. That is why those of us that want to retire are happy because we have escaped these people and those that don't really want to wind up being miserable, especially if they can't find people on the same wave length to share their misery.
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I see it's been 18 months since I last replied. Dec. 5 will be my five year FIRE-versary. Yup, still immeasurably happier. My goal was to be able to say "I don't know how I ever had time to work" as soon after retirement as possible. Check.
Very rarely now, but occasionally I get a call from a clueless former customer seeking business information. Such a cheap thrill to say, "Sorry, I retired X number of years ago."
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FIRE'd July 2015. Aside from several months dealing with a family illness/death* I find myself thinking "Goddamn, life is awesome!" at least once a day.
*FIRE also enabled me to spend lots of time with family during a bad stretch of time. Yes, FMLA would have made this work as well, but it was just easier and without emotional work strings pulling on me.
+1 - even on spending time with ill parents, but thankfully they are okay for now. Sorry about your loss, but understand how thankful you likely are to have had that time to spend with them.
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I wake up each day happier than the one before. But I also did that before I retired. Life gets better and better everyday. I can't imagine being happier than I am now, but know that in the future I will be. It's a great to be FIRED, but happiness is separate from financial state.
So is today the happiest day of your life ?
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Gosh, I can't believe it's been 1.5 years since I replied to this thread. Whoo, I've been SOOO busy.
FIRE has given me the opportunity to enroll in college to study jazz music, and I've now completed my third semester. Although the classes, homework and practice can be quite difficult and challenging, and I *do* sometimes have to wake up to an alarm clock and hustle to class, I am *so* much happier engrossed in the study of something I am passionate about. Also my skills and knowledge have advanced so much faster in full-time study than could have ever happened with a once-a-week private lesson (which was the only option I had when I was working).
I still maintain that I am ten thousand billion percent happier. Once in a while I think about "hmmm, maybe you should consider a job again," but then I remember bosses, and dumb rules, and customers, and deadlines, and phones, and schedules, and being told 'no' you can't have that day off, and realize that--nope--I don't ever want to do that sh*t again.
Yep. Things are better on this side of the "desk."
-The Pigeon. Life's better when *you* drive the bus.
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4 months in. I'm happier for sure, but I still have a few stressy loose ends to tie up before I will feel the sense freedom I desire. Also I still don't have near enough time to do all the things I want to do, and I guess I haven't decompressed enough yet to convince myself that there's no rush.
I'm curios to hear from more people who commented before when they had recently FIREd with any updates regarding:
For those who indicated that they are happier after FIRE, do you feel like it is something you will eventually adapt to, or do you feel like it has resulted in a real, permanent change to your happiness level?
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4 months in. I'm happier for sure, but I still have a few stressy loose ends to tie up before I will feel the sense freedom I desire. Also I still don't have near enough time to do all the things I want to do, and I guess I haven't decompressed enough yet to convince myself that there's no rush.
I'm curios to hear from more people who commented before when they had recently FIREd with any updates regarding:
For those who indicated that they are happier after FIRE, do you feel like it is something you will eventually adapt to, or do you feel like it has resulted in a real, permanent change to your happiness level?
Wouldn't a great lack of stress automatically mean being more happy? At least it should mean being more healthy, because permanent stress is not good for your health.
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4 months in. I'm happier for sure, but I still have a few stressy loose ends to tie up before I will feel the sense freedom I desire. Also I still don't have near enough time to do all the things I want to do, and I guess I haven't decompressed enough yet to convince myself that there's no rush.
I'm curios to hear from more people who commented before when they had recently FIREd with any updates regarding:
For those who indicated that they are happier after FIRE, do you feel like it is something you will eventually adapt to, or do you feel like it has resulted in a real, permanent change to your happiness level?
Wouldn't a great lack of stress automatically mean being more happy? At least it should mean being more healthy, because permanent stress is not good for your health.
That's what I believe. :)
I feel happier just visualizing the day when my stressy loose ends will be dealt with.
I also realize that when I got rid of my top stress (having to work) the second highest stress (rental house) because the new top. When I sell the rental house will there be another new highest stress thing for me to worry about and that will cause me to be less happy than I could be? It feels like more of a character flaw in my case than any real reasons to be less happy/more stressy. However with each step I AM more happy, so I'll roll with it for now.
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<...>
That's what I believe. :)
I feel happier just visualizing the day when my stressy loose ends will be dealt with.
I also realize that when I got rid of my top stress (having to work) the second highest stress (rental house) because the new top. When I sell the rental house will there be another new highest stress thing for me to worry about and that will cause me to be less happy than I could be? It feels like more of a character flaw in my case than any real reasons to be less happy/more stressy. However with each step I AM more happy, so I'll roll with it for now.
Currently I experience stress from:
Work, for several reasons.
The house we bought is not in perfect state as it was supposed to be. We need to go to court for this.
I am now chairman of our private road. We get so much shit in form of neighbouring twists.
We have very steep roads to our house. They cause an amount of stress.
Winters around 0 degrees Celsius, when rain freezes on the ground.
Lack of snow during winter. Then I don't get enough exercize.
I am probably quite easily stressed.
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There is another thread going on about whether FIRE is subject to hedonic adaptation:
http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/welcome-to-the-forum/if-hedonic-adaptation-exists-what's-the-point-of-early-retirement/
For those who indicated that they are happier after FIRE, do you feel like it is something you will eventually adapt to, or do you feel like it has resulted in a real, permanent change to your happiness level?
It has almost been a year for me now (January 1 will be one year since I freed myself from the veal fattening pen.) I didn't want to comment earlier because I thought it had been too soon, but now I can say that I am definitely happier than I was. And here's the thing, I thought I was happy at my job, but clearly I wasn't. I didn't know what happiness felt like. As this FIRE year has progressed I find myself happier every month. Perhaps there will come a point where it tapers off, but I doubt it.
I have always believed that our happiness is in our own hands and that if we are unhappy we must take steps to resolve that for ourselves. What I didn't realize was that without freedom, I was limited in what steps I could take to improve my happiness. Freedom is the cure for hedonic adaptation.
So, so happy. I am so glad I FIREd. It was worth much more than what I paid for it.
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I have always believed that our happiness is in our own hands and that if we are unhappy we must take steps to resolve that for ourselves. What I didn't realize was that without freedom, I was limited in what steps I could take to improve my happiness. Freedom is the cure for hedonic adaptation.
So, so happy. I am so glad I FIREd. It was worth much more than what I paid for it.
Too much real life.
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I was just commenting to DH how fun it is for us to plan each leg of our travels. Part of the enjoyment of FIRE is that we sold our home and now travel full time. We live in permanent 'vacation' mode. When I call to make reservations at campgrounds, I always talk to happy park managers and rangers, they have no idea we do this full time, they assume we are planning our vacation.
We had a very high maintenance home and now just take care of our truck and trailer. Neither are totally care-free mind you but I still associate them with 'vacation'. and their needs are minor compared to a home.
I have always loved sleeping in whatever RV we have, and I have now slept in this setup full time for a year and a half. I am not tired of it yet. Waking up to birds and slow moving diesel trucks coming and going never gets old.
I get to stay up late and sleep in almost every day! Like most folks, I'd gone to school or worked an early morning job my whole life. As soon as I was old enough, I worked summers, so was up early all year round. That means 40 or so years of early to bed early to rise. And now... I can do what I want! Pure Heaven:)
We get to spend time planning our next day's/week's/month's activities well in advance, so we don't feel rushed all the time.
Just last night I woke up at 3:30am wide awake. So I got up for an hour and worked on a blog article for my website. Never, ever would that have happened when I worked! If I had got up in the middle of the night while working, it would be only for work, and I would be fixing a broken web server!
I teach card making classes now and was chatting with a couple of students and their husbands. One couple both worked at the same company, he in IT (CRM Manager) and she was his customer. He asked me if I had gotten hired back on as a contractor for 3x the pay. I said No WAY, I am done working! I teach card classes now and it is a heck of alot more fun! I already earned my money... He was likely shocked at that, but it is true. I am totally done doing stressful work and being on call 7 x 24.
I am much, much more happy post FIRE!
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4 months in. I'm happier for sure, but I still have a few stressy loose ends to tie up before I will feel the sense freedom I desire. Also I still don't have near enough time to do all the things I want to do, and I guess I haven't decompressed enough yet to convince myself that there's no rush.
I'm curios to hear from more people who commented before when they had recently FIREd with any updates regarding:
For those who indicated that they are happier after FIRE, do you feel like it is something you will eventually adapt to, or do you feel like it has resulted in a real, permanent change to your happiness level?
My 2-year FIRE anniversary is in two days. It really has been "a real, permanent change to my happiness level."
I remember four days after my last day, so December 22, 2015, I was sitting on my couch next to my boyfriend and I felt like I had taken Ativan. And I have remained that relaxed the vast majority of the time since. I don't feel stoned though, just relaxed.
I had such bad anxiety related to work that impacted my entire life. Not anymore. Even when stressful things do happen (like the work and consideration it took before and during the process of selling my home), I wasn't anxious like I would have been before.
I sleep well. I often catch myself smiling like I didn't do before. I can do the things I want to do when I want to do them.
Every day I am happy that my time is my own and I don't have to deal with the bullshit of having a job.
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I have some FU money and I’m in a career transition now. I’m not even close to fired, but right now am only sporadically consulting. I am finding that I need a project, structure, or a plan for the day to be happy. Otherwise I just sit down all day and waste my time. And maybe that’s because I’m in “decompress” mode still, but it’s been 4 weeks and I’m realizing that I need to get out of the house and talk to more people!!! I’m applying for jobs, catching up on doctor and dentist appointments, and taking time to actually cook good meals, as well as going to the gym a few times a week. But I’m craving some more social stuff.
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I have some FU money and I’m in a career transition now. I’m not even close to fired, but right now am only sporadically consulting. I am finding that I need a project, structure, or a plan for the day to be happy. Otherwise I just sit down all day and waste my time. And maybe that’s because I’m in “decompress” mode still, but it’s been 4 weeks and I’m realizing that I need to get out of the house and talk to more people!!! I’m applying for jobs, catching up on doctor and dentist appointments, and taking time to actually cook good meals, as well as going to the gym a few times a week. But I’m craving some more social stuff.
I understand what you are saying that you feel you would be bored not working and are happier working (which is totally okay...SWAMI status is an enviable status to have), but you live with your mom and have a negative net worth right now, so honestly, your experiences to date so far are nowhere close to FIRE.
I am an extrovert and have found enough social stimulation without having a job luckily.
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Oh for sure!. But I think my point still stands. When I have something planned for the day (either related to making money, or something social, or a project) my day is much better! Right now I’m able to work whenever I want. I’m working a lot at the moment but I can chose to work with only the clients that interest me. Even though my total account balance is not anywhere close to firing, I imagine the attitude of “working only when I choose” is similar since I plan to keep my professional license until I die. It’s making me excited to experience the real thing! (In at least a decade lol)
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I'm with you Apple Tango. For me this whole stash thing is more for security and flexibility. Much as I dislike working, I find that you need that tension to enjoy your time off.
I had an experience where I was laid off for a bit. Money wasn't a big issue as I had government benefits, I had a decent stash (about 6 years expenses) and there was a lower pay job offer available if needed. I didn't enjoy the experience as much as I thought I would. I actually found it to be work to keep myself entertained. With a job you have so much time occupied that you appreciate a smaller set of activities. Once you have all day for them it isn't enough. Maybe it would have helped if I had more money or maybe it just takes longer to adjust. I don't think that's it though. I think some people are just wired such that they need to work. Just maybe not for 40 hours a week.
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There certainly are people who enjoy working and good for them. That would have made my working life easier if I could have been one of them. I did enjoy my job for the first fifteen years.
However, the original question in this thread was directed at people who had been FIREd for at least six months so as to give others an idea of whether or not people were happier after FIRE or not.
While it is totally okay for others to have opinions about what they think it would be like for them, it is not an accurate representation.
And do you have FU money if you have a negative net worth? Maybe you can. But I would think that the original MMM forums would have decreed not.
Anyway, best of luck to Apple Tango. I'm glad you're jumping on the wagon at a young age.
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Regarding the FU money thing. I have enough cash to live without working for about 1 year. I am living at my mom’s now and paying rent but I don’t have to- I could go off the grid in my RV and pay next to nothing on rent. If I did that I’d probably be ok for 2 years just on my cash reserves if I stripped everything down to the bare bones. Like I said...I’m about 10 years away from actually being FI so I won’t be doing that. But my current situation allows me to work when I want, aka as much as possible to get to FI, and in the future I can also work as much as I want (hopefully way less). For me....I think I have FU money. I have been able to leave jobs that asked me to compromise my ethics, I have been able to stand up to my bosses, and voice my opinion because I’m not scared of loosing my job because I have a safety net of cash. sure it’s only $20,000. But for me that’s all I need if I did an ERE style 1-2 years of living. Again...not going to do that lol. And if it really got down to that I would sell some of the things that have put me in debt. So i’d realistically have $45,000 or so. But who are you to say that I do or don’t have FU money?
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I just wonder if there isn't a selection bias here. If somebody retires to find that they are bored they will likely go back to work. Would this type of person be going to the mmm forum? Just a thought, I certainly don't doubt that there are many who are retired and enjoying it.
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There certainly are people who enjoy working and good for them. That would have made my working life easier if I could have been one of them. I did enjoy my job for the first fifteen years.
However, the original question in this thread was directed at people who had been FIREd for at least six months so as to give others an idea of whether or not people were happier after FIRE or not.
While it is totally okay for others to have opinions about what they think it would be like for them, it is not an accurate representation.
I agree that this is an inappropriate place for speculation about whether or not someone will enjoy Post-FIRE. The question here is whether people who have retired early on enough money to stay retired indefinitely enjoy it.
A long layoff, even if you have enough money for a year or two is not the same as FIRE and the reason comes down to freedom. It is not whether or not you do work that matters. Many of us in FIRE begin works of passion or donate time and labor generously to others. Some take occasional gigs as consultants. It doesn't really matter. What matters is the freedom to do what you want, when you want and know within a reasonable certainty that you will be ok.
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And if it really got down to that I would sell some of the things that have put me in debt. So i’d realistically have $45,000 or so. But who are you to say that I do or don’t have FU money?
Do you understand what the term "negative net worth" means? You mention in your journal that you have a negative net worth. That means you owe more than what you could sell for cash. That means you can't sell all you own and expect to be out of debt.
It's logic like this that gives me the right to say, you don't have FU money. You don't. And especially for the purposes of this specific thread you have no credibility.
Sorry if that facepunch hurts, but you trying to represent your views as relevant to the discussion that has been taking place is ridiculous.
I just wonder if there isn't a selection bias here. If somebody retires to find that they are bored they will likely go back to work. Would this type of person be going to the mmm forum? Just a thought, I certainly don't doubt that there are many who are retired and enjoying it.
That would be interesting. I also wonder if there is some sort of correlation between OMY and going back to or missing work.
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There certainly are people who enjoy working and good for them. That would have made my working life easier if I could have been one of them. I did enjoy my job for the first fifteen years.
However, the original question in this thread was directed at people who had been FIREd for at least six months so as to give others an idea of whether or not people were happier after FIRE or not.
While it is totally okay for others to have opinions about what they think it would be like for them, it is not an accurate representation.
I agree that this is an inappropriate place for speculation about whether or not someone will enjoy Post-FIRE. The question here is whether people who have retired early on enough money to stay retired indefinitely enjoy it.
A long layoff, even if you have enough money for a year or two is not the same as FIRE and the reason comes down to freedom. It is not whether or not you do work that matters. Many of us in FIRE begin works of passion or donate time and labor generously to others. Some take occasional gigs as consultants. It doesn't really matter. What matters is the freedom to do what you want, when you want and know within a reasonable certainty that you will be ok.
I agree. It's the freedom that is the important ingredient. I was a teacher and had two months off every summer. I did decompress, but it was nowhere near what FIRE has been like.