Author Topic: US ICE  (Read 10734 times)

RetiredAt63

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #50 on: May 06, 2025, 05:24:39 AM »
German hiker was refused entry and banned from the US for 5 years.   https://aztrail.org/arizona-trail-thru-hiker-has-been-detained-deported-and-banned-from-the-us-without-a-hearing/

Apparently hiking in Arizona is now off limits.

Carl Stanfield (@prof_carl) posted that his Canadian girlfriend was refused entry for their planned Arizona hike because the agent accused her of trying to work in the us based on her not having enough luggage, ignoring the fact that she could prove that she had a house and car in Canada. The agent refused to allow her to show him the documents proving her Canadian residency and financial ties, and made her sign a document stating she understood why she was denied entry.  That document listed the things she needed to demonstrate significant ties to home country, they were the documents she tried to show the agent, when she asked to show them again, she was told it was her job to make sure the agent saw them and that she didn’t do a good job of it. She didn’t have much luggage because her boyfriend already had her pack ready to go in the US.

What’s interesting about this is that (I surmise) due to Trump’s nastiness over Canada and continuous threats of annexation, ICE is now feeling empowered to treat some Canadians the way they have treated Mexicans and Latin Americans for decades. Canadians do not require a visa to visit the US, while Mexicans do. I wonder if that’s coming? BTW everything she was required to show is commonly required for Mexicans in order to acquire said visa.

We keep being told by the US that as long as our paperwork is in order there are no problems.   Her paperwork was in order but the agent ignored it.

If they thought Canadian (and world) tourism was bad now, just wait until this makes the general news.  Sure, there are fun things to do there, but there are fun things to do in other countries.

Plus I saw elsewhere that there were more military helicopter incursions into commercial air space at Reagan airport (I think it was Reagan,  it was the one where there was already a collision between a military helicopter and a plane).  And an ATC told someone off record that it is getting less safe to fly. 

Update, saw a report it was DCA, helicopter going to the Pentagon.   It's easy to find if anyone wants more info.
« Last Edit: May 06, 2025, 05:38:32 AM by RetiredAt63 »

ATtiny85

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #51 on: May 06, 2025, 05:47:12 AM »
German hiker was refused entry and banned from the US for 5 years.   https://aztrail.org/arizona-trail-thru-hiker-has-been-detained-deported-and-banned-from-the-us-without-a-hearing/

Apparently hiking in Arizona is now off limits.

Carl Stanfield (@prof_carl) posted that his Canadian girlfriend was refused entry for their planned Arizona hike because the agent accused her of trying to work in the us based on her not having enough luggage, ignoring the fact that she could prove that she had a house and car in Canada. The agent refused to allow her to show him the documents proving her Canadian residency and financial ties, and made her sign a document stating she understood why she was denied entry.  That document listed the things she needed to demonstrate significant ties to home country, they were the documents she tried to show the agent, when she asked to show them again, she was told it was her job to make sure the agent saw them and that she didn’t do a good job of it. She didn’t have much luggage because her boyfriend already had her pack ready to go in the US.

Sounds like the agent is bad at their job. Quite unfortunate for sure. Bad policies and incompetent workers is a terrible combination. Plus of course the agent certainly could be one of those power drunk goons, adding fuel to the fire.

And finally, it’s possible that the story doesn’t quite have the facts right. End result yes, but without being there it’s not possible to know what actually happened. Defense mechanisms are quite powerful things.

Morning Glory

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #52 on: May 06, 2025, 05:57:25 AM »
German hiker was refused entry and banned from the US for 5 years.   https://aztrail.org/arizona-trail-thru-hiker-has-been-detained-deported-and-banned-from-the-us-without-a-hearing/

Apparently hiking in Arizona is now off limits.

Carl Stanfield (@prof_carl) posted that his Canadian girlfriend was refused entry for their planned Arizona hike because the agent accused her of trying to work in the us based on her not having enough luggage, ignoring the fact that she could prove that she had a house and car in Canada. The agent refused to allow her to show him the documents proving her Canadian residency and financial ties, and made her sign a document stating she understood why she was denied entry.  That document listed the things she needed to demonstrate significant ties to home country, they were the documents she tried to show the agent, when she asked to show them again, she was told it was her job to make sure the agent saw them and that she didn’t do a good job of it. She didn’t have much luggage because her boyfriend already had her pack ready to go in the US.

Sounds like the agent is bad at their job. Quite unfortunate for sure. Bad policies and incompetent workers is a terrible combination. Plus of course the agent certainly could be one of those power drunk goons, adding fuel to the fire.

And finally, it’s possible that the story doesn’t quite have the facts right. End result yes, but without being there it’s not possible to know what actually happened. Defense mechanisms are quite powerful things.

I don't understand the luggage issue. I would have more luggage than usual if planning to overstay and work, not less.
« Last Edit: May 06, 2025, 05:59:33 AM by Morning Glory »

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #53 on: May 06, 2025, 05:58:22 AM »
If they thought Canadian (and world) tourism was bad now, just wait until this makes the general news.  Sure, there are fun things to do there, but there are fun things to do in other countries.

Nothing’s fun enough to risk interrogation and potential imprisonment. I’m content spending my holidays at my cottage. If my American friends want to see me, I’d be absolutely delighted to host them.

GuitarStv

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #54 on: May 06, 2025, 09:24:07 AM »
In an effort to dodge accusations of rampant racism, US ICE has started randomly treating white people like shit for no reason as well as minorities.  :P

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #55 on: May 06, 2025, 09:41:44 AM »
Can't speak for everyone here in Canada, but the US is off my destination list for the next few years, possibly forever.

Heartbreaking because an American friend of mine just invited me to join him at his condo in Palm Desert for a few days of golf and relaxation.  Not much of a golfer, but free accommodation and a few days of funtime would have been great.  It will just have to happen here in Canada, or literally almost anywhere else.

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #56 on: May 06, 2025, 09:44:19 AM »
In an effort to dodge accusations of rampant racism, US ICE has started randomly treating white people like shit for no reason as well as minorities.  :P

Most logical explanation I've seen so far.

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #57 on: May 06, 2025, 10:01:08 AM »
Can't speak for everyone here in Canada, but the US is off my destination list for the next few years, possibly forever.

Heartbreaking because an American friend of mine just invited me to join him at his condo in Palm Desert for a few days of golf and relaxation.  Not much of a golfer, but free accommodation and a few days of funtime would have been great.  It will just have to happen here in Canada, or literally almost anywhere else.

I hope you clearly explained your reason for not coming. It blows my mind that we Americans have been taking the chief rapist’s words as inconsequential ramblings instead of threats.

RetiredAt63

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #58 on: May 06, 2025, 10:15:41 AM »
In an effort to dodge accusations of rampant racism, US ICE has started randomly treating white people like shit for no reason as well as minorities.  :P

Most logical explanation I've seen so far.

And of course Canadians are not nice anymore (he calls us nasty) because we are not all massively enthusiastic to become the 51st state.


jinga nation

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #59 on: May 06, 2025, 11:48:28 AM »
In an effort to dodge accusations of rampant racism, US ICE has started randomly treating white people like shit for no reason as well as minorities.  :P

Equal Opportunity Offenders.
No skin color left behind.
Everyone gets a fair shake.

Prairie Gal

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #60 on: May 06, 2025, 05:36:36 PM »
Can't speak for everyone here in Canada, but the US is off my destination list for the next few years, possibly forever.

Heartbreaking because an American friend of mine just invited me to join him at his condo in Palm Desert for a few days of golf and relaxation.  Not much of a golfer, but free accommodation and a few days of fun time would have been great.  It will just have to happen here in Canada, or literally almost anywhere else.

I was hoping that this would blow over quickly, but it seems like the Cheetoh has dug in his heels. The last two years I have taken a cruise out of the U.S. for a winter break. I already have 2026 and 2027 cruises booked to get the best deals. I have until November to cancel before final payment. It doesn't seem likely that I will be going, which makes me sad.

rocketpj

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #61 on: May 06, 2025, 05:45:08 PM »
Can't speak for everyone here in Canada, but the US is off my destination list for the next few years, possibly forever.

Heartbreaking because an American friend of mine just invited me to join him at his condo in Palm Desert for a few days of golf and relaxation.  Not much of a golfer, but free accommodation and a few days of funtime would have been great.  It will just have to happen here in Canada, or literally almost anywhere else.

I hope you clearly explained your reason for not coming. It blows my mind that we Americans have been taking the chief rapist’s words as inconsequential ramblings instead of threats.

Of course.  He actually lives in Canada (though he is a US citizen).  I bought my house from him.  We are on the same page, but he is American and so does not feel threatened going to spend time at his property in the US.  I don't particularly feel threatened either, but I am not going to support a country whose leader regularly talks about annexing my own, and I am not going to visit a country that might arrest me or otherwise harm me for no good reason.

Poundwise

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #62 on: May 06, 2025, 06:25:29 PM »
If you must come to the US or do business with us, please work with blue states or blue businesses, such as NY, IL, and CA. We are going to struggle quite a bit as Trump has stolen tax money that we support the country with, and which Congress allocated to us. And I am worried that this will cause anger at the local blue governments.

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #63 on: May 07, 2025, 12:22:37 AM »
American airlines are getting desperate. Saw an ad in my email today for buy-one-get-one-free flights between Canada and the US to select cities mainly in California and New York. The flights themselves were not expensive to begin with - e.g., LA to Toronto for $153.

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #64 on: May 07, 2025, 05:53:04 PM »
American airlines are getting desperate. Saw an ad in my email today for buy-one-get-one-free flights between Canada and the US to select cities mainly in California and New York. The flights themselves were not expensive to begin with - e.g., LA to Toronto for $153.

Until they guarantee full refunds for random immigration entry refusals, I don’t see this swaying most people.

reeshau

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #65 on: May 07, 2025, 06:00:07 PM »
American airlines are getting desperate. Saw an ad in my email today for buy-one-get-one-free flights between Canada and the US to select cities mainly in California and New York. The flights themselves were not expensive to begin with - e.g., LA to Toronto for $153.

Until they guarantee full refunds for random immigration entry refusals, I don’t see this swaying most people.

Yeah, I bet every travel insurance company is sharpening their wording on exceptions for immigration.

PeteD01

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #66 on: May 09, 2025, 09:54:35 AM »
What are they going to do for the next arrest in the town - rolling in with the National guard or the military?


Worcester police respond after ICE arrest draws crowd

Chaos unfolded in Worcester on Thursday when ICE agents detained a woman. In response, a crowd of people showed up chanting "where is the warrant," and then attempted to block the agents' car from leaving.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K7Aeu3Y5ptk

Travis

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #67 on: May 09, 2025, 12:10:45 PM »
Judge orders university student release from custody who was arrested in March for writing an op-ed.


https://x.com/garciareports/status/1920890751975563568

GuitarStv

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #68 on: May 09, 2025, 12:23:02 PM »
Judge orders university student release from custody who was arrested in March for writing an op-ed.


https://x.com/garciareports/status/1920890751975563568

Wonder if the administration will listen to this order, or deport her to another country and then say they're not able to.

Telecaster

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #69 on: May 09, 2025, 12:40:48 PM »
Mother and 2 year old deported, except the child is a US citizen by birth. They were going after the mother, and didn't give anybody a chance to let the kid stay with the father.

https://www.politico.com/news/2025/04/25/us-citizen-deportation-donald-trump-00311631

Which tells you need to know about Trump and his drooling sycophants.  The mother was checking in for her ICE appointment when they kidnapped her.   

These thugs aren't going MS13 gang members--they are targeting young mothers because it is easy, and it causes terror in the community.  They don't give them due process because they know they are breaking the law.   

If you are a Trump supporter you are a pretty sorry human being.   

PeteD01

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #70 on: May 09, 2025, 12:52:51 PM »
What are they going to do for the next arrest in the town - rolling in with the National guard or the military?


Worcester police respond after ICE arrest draws crowd

Chaos unfolded in Worcester on Thursday when ICE agents detained a woman. In response, a crowd of people showed up chanting "where is the warrant," and then attempted to block the agents' car from leaving.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K7Aeu3Y5ptk

More on the Worcester incident - there is clearly a lack of imagination on the part of ICE, these things can quickly and unpredictably spiral out of control. Local residents had them surrounded before the police could get there.


Teen girl violently arrested for trying to stop mother's ICE 'kidnapping': witnesses
Julia Conley
May 9, 2025

Matt Szafranski, editor-in-chief of Western Mass Politics and Insight, said that "we are going to see more" of the kind of resistance Worcester residents showed on Thursday.

"I think what's interesting is ICE is not prepared to deal with it," he said. "They think they have impunity, but civil disobedience is only going to grow."

"Worcester Police Department has explaining to do, but local cops are going to be put in bad situations if ICE keeps acting like this," Szafranski added. "Is it 'assisting ICE' to keep the peace? Well, yes in a basic sense. But who's causing the disturbance?"

https://www.rawstory.com/teen-girl-violently-arrested-for-trying-to-stop-mother-s-ice-kidnapping-in-massachuset/
« Last Edit: May 09, 2025, 01:07:26 PM by PeteD01 »

reeshau

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #71 on: May 09, 2025, 05:04:02 PM »
The US is now planning to accept refugees from Africa...white Afrikaners from South Africa.

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cx2q937wlqgo
« Last Edit: May 10, 2025, 06:58:54 AM by reeshau »

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #72 on: May 09, 2025, 06:45:10 PM »

FIRE Artist

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #73 on: May 09, 2025, 07:29:18 PM »
The US is now planning tomaccept refugees from Africa...white Afrikaners from South Africa.

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cx2q937wlqgo

Make America white again.

GuitarStv

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #74 on: May 09, 2025, 08:58:43 PM »
ICE arrested the mayor of Newark, NJ.

https://apnews.com/article/immigration-protest-ice-newark-mayor-arrested-5a2b3fefd7da563c48d2f85831cf2194

Arrested him without cause while he was on public land, peacefully protesting.

Travis

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #75 on: May 09, 2025, 10:52:39 PM »
ICE arrested the mayor of Newark, NJ.

https://apnews.com/article/immigration-protest-ice-newark-mayor-arrested-5a2b3fefd7da563c48d2f85831cf2194

Arrested him without cause while he was on public land, peacefully protesting.

And attacked the Congressional delegation.

https://fixupx.com/RepMenendez/status/1920986132713542028

https://fixupx.com/RepBonnie/status/1920953784521683399

https://fixupx.com/RepBonnie/status/1920989902520340582

https://fixupx.com/RepLaMonica/status/1920981987591921738

The White House's official response - they "stormed" the facility.
The GOP's official response - Mendendez was visiting his family.

GuitarStv

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #76 on: May 10, 2025, 05:02:29 PM »
ICE arrested the mayor of Newark, NJ.

https://apnews.com/article/immigration-protest-ice-newark-mayor-arrested-5a2b3fefd7da563c48d2f85831cf2194

Arrested him without cause while he was on public land, peacefully protesting.

And attacked the Congressional delegation.

https://fixupx.com/RepMenendez/status/1920986132713542028

https://fixupx.com/RepBonnie/status/1920953784521683399

https://fixupx.com/RepBonnie/status/1920989902520340582

https://fixupx.com/RepLaMonica/status/1920981987591921738

The White House's official response - they "stormed" the facility.
The GOP's official response - Mendendez was visiting his family.

The Gestapo knows that what they're doing is illegal, that's why they mask up when they're doing it.  Anyone currently working for ICE in the US right now is either a traitor to the country, or a happy collaborator.

jinga nation

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #77 on: May 11, 2025, 11:51:50 AM »
The US is now planning tomaccept refugees from Africa...white Afrikaners from South Africa.

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cx2q937wlqgo

Make America white again.

Already happening with the White refugees from South Africa (Afrikaaners).
Wonder how many of them are his relatives.

OzzieandHarriet

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #78 on: May 11, 2025, 12:58:49 PM »
ICE arrested the mayor of Newark, NJ.

https://apnews.com/article/immigration-protest-ice-newark-mayor-arrested-5a2b3fefd7da563c48d2f85831cf2194

Arrested him without cause while he was on public land, peacefully protesting.

And attacked the Congressional delegation.

https://fixupx.com/RepMenendez/status/1920986132713542028

https://fixupx.com/RepBonnie/status/1920953784521683399

https://fixupx.com/RepBonnie/status/1920989902520340582

https://fixupx.com/RepLaMonica/status/1920981987591921738

The White House's official response - they "stormed" the facility.
The GOP's official response - Mendendez was visiting his family.

The Gestapo knows that what they're doing is illegal, that's why they mask up when they're doing it.  Anyone currently working for ICE in the US right now is either a traitor to the country, or a happy collaborator.

I keep wondering who these individuals are who are choosing to participate in this horrible behavior and where they are getting their orders from.  It is not legal.

Poundwise

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #79 on: May 11, 2025, 10:02:36 PM »
I keep wondering who these individuals are who are choosing to participate in this horrible behavior and where they are getting their orders from.  It is not legal.

The way forward is for state and local governments to arrest these ICE "agents". They're committing felonies according to USC Title 18 Section 242.

JLee

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #80 on: May 12, 2025, 07:15:56 AM »
I keep wondering who these individuals are who are choosing to participate in this horrible behavior and where they are getting their orders from.  It is not legal.

The way forward is for state and local governments to arrest these ICE "agents". They're committing felonies according to USC Title 18 Section 242.

God I'd be tempted to go back to law enforcement if they'd put me on that team...

reeshau

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #81 on: May 15, 2025, 03:33:25 AM »
The House Judiciary Committee has proposed $77B in new fees as part of the Republican budget bill, including a $1,000 fee for asylum applications, and a $100 annual fee for applications that are pending.

LOL--that's not a conflict of interest, is it?  We'll keep you waiting for years, and you'll pay us for the privilege!

Also worrying: a $5,000 fee for "anyone who is prepared to take custody of an unaccompanied migrant child."

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #82 on: May 15, 2025, 09:32:25 AM »
The House Judiciary Committee has proposed $77B in new fees as part of the Republican budget bill, including a $1,000 fee for asylum applications, and a $100 annual fee for applications that are pending.

LOL--that's not a conflict of interest, is it?  We'll keep you waiting for years, and you'll pay us for the privilege!

Also worrying: a $5,000 fee for "anyone who is prepared to take custody of an unaccompanied migrant child."

And no guarantee that they're not going to just arrest and deport you anyways.

OzzieandHarriet

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #83 on: May 15, 2025, 01:11:23 PM »
You know what’s really crazy about all this? The vast majority of these immigrants, whether here legally or not, would absolutely support conservative values (or what used to be such). Most of them work very hard, have a lot of initiative and the potential to become entrepreneurs, and many are socially conservative and religious. If the Republicans were actually smart, they would NOT be threatening and torturing these people but instead encouraging them to stay here and become citizens and voters.

I look at some of my immigrant neighbors who work their asses off; they saved up to buy nice houses, run their own businesses, have big tight-knit families, go to church, the whole bit.

But if Republicans were of that stripe, we wouldn’t be where we are now.

Instead, they are doubling down on cementing the most racist and xenophobic people we have as their core voters, and damn all the rest of us.

reeshau

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #84 on: May 16, 2025, 06:20:49 AM »
The Department of Homeland Security is turning over a new leaf.  Kristi Noem is said to support a friendly game show format, where immigrants can compete for citizenship, called The American.

And we can all be entertained by their chutzpah and their antics! /s

Sensing the obvious comparison, Rob Worsoff, a producer and writer who has been pitching the show since the Obama administration, said: "This isn't 'The Hunger Games' for immigrants."

GuitarStv

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #85 on: May 16, 2025, 07:01:40 AM »
So . . . will they be fighting to the death until only one remains to become a citizen, or will Kristi Noem be executing one unlucky contestant (like a puppy in her care) each week until only one remains?

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #86 on: May 16, 2025, 08:28:18 AM »
Whoever ends up taking over after the MAGA madness comes to an end is going to have to actually follow through with serious investigations of all of this stuff.  The usual practice of 'looking forward not back' no consequences for illegal behaviour has to stop, or it will never stop.

The Democrats as currently configured are unlikely to do that, but they are also unlikely to win.  I'm quietly hoping that party will rediscover its spine, or build a new one. 

Travis

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #87 on: May 16, 2025, 09:37:29 AM »
So . . . will they be fighting to the death until only one remains to become a citizen, or will Kristi Noem be executing one unlucky contestant (like a puppy in her care) each week until only one remains?

Probably just be a conga line of dehumanizing activities while dangling a green card over their heads. Remember, humiliation is the point with this group.

Freedomin5

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #88 on: May 16, 2025, 02:41:15 PM »
So . . . will they be fighting to the death until only one remains to become a citizen, or will Kristi Noem be executing one unlucky contestant (like a puppy in her care) each week until only one remains?

Probably just be a conga line of dehumanizing activities while dangling a green card over their heads. Remember, humiliation is the point with this group.

That’s so repellent that someone can even consider deriving entertainment from one’s anxiety and suffering. Kinda like how the Romans enjoyed watching gladiators fight to the death.

GuitarStv

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #89 on: May 16, 2025, 08:55:38 PM »
So . . . will they be fighting to the death until only one remains to become a citizen, or will Kristi Noem be executing one unlucky contestant (like a puppy in her care) each week until only one remains?

Probably just be a conga line of dehumanizing activities while dangling a green card over their heads. Remember, humiliation is the point with this group.

That’s so repellent that someone can even consider deriving entertainment from one’s anxiety and suffering. Kinda like how the Romans enjoyed watching gladiators fight to the death.

Not a country music fan?  :P

scottish

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #90 on: May 17, 2025, 10:06:40 AM »
Whoever ends up taking over after the MAGA madness comes to an end is going to have to actually follow through with serious investigations of all of this stuff.  The usual practice of 'looking forward not back' no consequences for illegal behaviour has to stop, or it will never stop.

The Democrats as currently configured are unlikely to do that, but they are also unlikely to win.  I'm quietly hoping that party will rediscover its spine, or build a new one.

Yeah, that worked so well last time the key perp became president.  Again.

rocketpj

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #91 on: May 17, 2025, 09:55:57 PM »
Whoever ends up taking over after the MAGA madness comes to an end is going to have to actually follow through with serious investigations of all of this stuff.  The usual practice of 'looking forward not back' no consequences for illegal behaviour has to stop, or it will never stop.

The Democrats as currently configured are unlikely to do that, but they are also unlikely to win.  I'm quietly hoping that party will rediscover its spine, or build a new one.

Yeah, that worked so well last time the key perp became president.  Again.

They need to do it for real this time.  They needed to put bankers in jail in 2009, but the Democrats at the time were beholden to Wall St. so they just papered it over and let lots of small people lose their homes while they bailed out the bankers.  They needed to put Trump and many others in jail in 2017 for their many crimes, but they slow walked it and tried to act like it was in the past - we were back to normal. 

None of that works and none of it applies.  Until the D party wakes up and stops kowtowing to the oligarchs this will not change.

Sandi_k

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #92 on: May 17, 2025, 11:41:53 PM »
Odd that you focus on the Dems and their indentured status with the oligarchs. The GOP originated it, yet you don't note their complicity. And the Great Recession began under Bush, who began some of the bailouts and QE policies; Obama continued it.

It's not a one party problem.

ATtiny85

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #93 on: May 18, 2025, 06:09:33 AM »
Odd that you focus on the Dems and their indentured status with the oligarchs. The GOP originated it, yet you don't note their complicity. And the Great Recession began under Bush, who began some of the bailouts and QE policies; Obama continued it.

It's not a one party problem.

Sure, but one likely has a better chance at progress by working to fix their own house.

GuitarStv

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #94 on: May 18, 2025, 08:30:02 AM »
How many billionaires were sitting next to Trump at his inauguration?  Which party decided to give a billionaire free reign to reshape government however he felt like?  The oligarchs seem to have taken sides, and it's not with Democrats.

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #95 on: May 18, 2025, 09:46:15 AM »
How many billionaires were sitting next to Trump at his inauguration?  Which party decided to give a billionaire free reign to reshape government however he felt like?  The oligarchs seem to have taken sides, and it's not with Democrats.

There was a bunch of propaganda on social media before the election about how the dems are "just as bad" about representing corporate interests and the Israeli government etc.. I was disappointed to see it repeated in left-leaning groups and even on here. All politicians have flaws but I don't see how any of it could have been "just as bad" as what we're stuck with now. I wonder how many people didn't bother voting because they believed that shit.

rocketpj

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #96 on: May 18, 2025, 10:26:02 AM »
Odd that you focus on the Dems and their indentured status with the oligarchs. The GOP originated it, yet you don't note their complicity. And the Great Recession began under Bush, who began some of the bailouts and QE policies; Obama continued it.

It's not a one party problem.

I am focusing on the Dems because the Republicans are a lost cause.  I want the Democrats to recover their purpose by reconnecting with working people and fighting for the well-being of everyone.  I don't think anyone who was paying attention could have believed that HRC was going to do that.  Biden actually was doing that, at least moving in the right direction.  But he was fighting an extremely hostile Republican party and a faction of his own party that just wants to go back to when there wasn't a fascist party on the other side and they could all just work their donors and be shills.

In the choice between the two parties there is really no choice for someone who believes in democracy and rule of law.  But that doesn't mean I can't wan't the party I prefer to do better.  And I don't think they are going to win unless they start actually doing that.

Just Joe

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #97 on: May 18, 2025, 11:22:04 AM »
I think it is important to repeat that you think the GOP is a lost cause b/c your post reads like the Dems are wholly responsible - to my lizard brain anyhow.


rocketpj

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #98 on: May 18, 2025, 01:57:41 PM »
I think it is important to repeat that you think the GOP is a lost cause b/c your post reads like the Dems are wholly responsible - to my lizard brain anyhow.

I thought it was obvious in the context of the conversation, but I get it.  People are defensive about the Dems right now.  Unfortunately/Fortunately the Democrat leadership is still in 'mitigate damage' mode rather than full blown crisis mode.  Shumer voting for the budget and his rationale made sense if you think of them as working together to operate government.  However, one side is actively working to destroy most of what makes the government worthwhile.  Rather than forcing them to own the results of their chaos the Dem leadership did the mature thing and tried to mitigate the damage.  Whether empowering the chaos merchants through mitigating a bit of their damage turns out to be a good idea or not is open to debate.


Just Joe

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Re: US ICE
« Reply #99 on: May 18, 2025, 07:58:23 PM »
FWIW I would really like to see the Dems get nasty about the double standards the Repubs operate by. There are a few outspoken Dems making stern statements. I would however hope that the next time the Dems are in control they put laws on the books to regulate exactly what is happening now by Trump's team .

Yes - my take is a very amateur one and I realize that. I am but an under (politically) educated spectator hoping for better for our nation.

 

Wow, a phone plan for fifteen bucks!