Author Topic: Trump outrage of the day  (Read 563927 times)

SunnyDays

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7250 on: January 21, 2021, 10:54:36 AM »
I don't even understand.  Trump doesn't even have to sit down and do the plan himself, he merely has to give the go ahead for someone else to make a reasonable plan, and then sit back and take all the credit.

Even after his entire inner and extended circles got infect, he was hospitalized with it, he lost friends to it, it ravaged the economy with shut downs, it brought many hospital systems to their limits, 400k+ deaths and still raging, going on for a year, with multiple vaccines now available his plan was...just wait and see how this pans out?  It sounds like the plan was to intentionally let it rage on and kill people.  Maybe it's killing the right kind of people? Maybe he's just a sadistic fuck?  I can't even comprehend how it's possible without extreme malicious intent. 

I don't know that it was sadistic.  More likely, he just didn't care enough to expend energy on it because there was nothing in it for him.

nereo

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7251 on: January 21, 2021, 10:58:03 AM »
I don't even understand.  Trump doesn't even have to sit down and do the plan himself, he merely has to give the go ahead for someone else to make a reasonable plan, and then sit back and take all the credit.

Even after his entire inner and extended circles got infect, he was hospitalized with it, he lost friends to it, it ravaged the economy with shut downs, it brought many hospital systems to their limits, 400k+ deaths and still raging, going on for a year, with multiple vaccines now available his plan was...just wait and see how this pans out?  It sounds like the plan was to intentionally let it rage on and kill people.  Maybe it's killing the right kind of people? Maybe he's just a sadistic fuck?  I can't even comprehend how it's possible without extreme malicious intent.
He's definitely a sadistic fuck, just look at how hard his administration worked to kill prisoners on death row in the days before the end of his Presidency, knowing that Biden is against the death penalty.

Viewing his rush to execute prisoners on death row, I kinda thought he just got off on legally killing other people - the ultimate "i have your life in your hands".  But maybe it was more about being spiteful towards Biden.  Either way it's pathetic.

We're among the only country left that still has capital punishment. It's like we are determined to abdicate any moral stance, and trip over ourselves to contradict our religious values.

achvfi

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7252 on: January 21, 2021, 11:03:04 AM »
Thousands of person-hours wasted and tens-of-thousands of lives which could have been saved, because.... why exactly?
Hundreds of thousands of lives could have been saved.

ixtap

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7253 on: January 21, 2021, 11:04:12 AM »
I don't even understand.  Trump doesn't even have to sit down and do the plan himself, he merely has to give the go ahead for someone else to make a reasonable plan, and then sit back and take all the credit.

Even after his entire inner and extended circles got infect, he was hospitalized with it, he lost friends to it, it ravaged the economy with shut downs, it brought many hospital systems to their limits, 400k+ deaths and still raging, going on for a year, with multiple vaccines now available his plan was...just wait and see how this pans out?  It sounds like the plan was to intentionally let it rage on and kill people.  Maybe it's killing the right kind of people? Maybe he's just a sadistic fuck?  I can't even comprehend how it's possible without extreme malicious intent.
He's definitely a sadistic fuck, just look at how hard his administration worked to kill prisoners on death row in the days before the end of his Presidency, knowing that Biden is against the death penalty.

Viewing his rush to execute prisoners on death row, I kinda thought he just got off on legally killing other people - the ultimate "i have your life in your hands".  But maybe it was more about being spiteful towards Biden.  Either way it's pathetic.

We're among the only country left that still has capital punishment. It's like we are determined to abdicate any moral stance, and trip over ourselves to contradict our religious values.

Do NOT get me started on the "pro-life" folks who refuse to wear a mask and insist on meeting up in person. I think Jesus had a lot more to say about people doing temple things for show over actual caring acts than he did about abortion :(

Roadrunner53

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7254 on: January 21, 2021, 11:23:11 AM »
I don't even understand.  Trump doesn't even have to sit down and do the plan himself, he merely has to give the go ahead for someone else to make a reasonable plan, and then sit back and take all the credit.

Even after his entire inner and extended circles got infect, he was hospitalized with it, he lost friends to it, it ravaged the economy with shut downs, it brought many hospital systems to their limits, 400k+ deaths and still raging, going on for a year, with multiple vaccines now available his plan was...just wait and see how this pans out?  It sounds like the plan was to intentionally let it rage on and kill people.  Maybe it's killing the right kind of people? Maybe he's just a sadistic fuck?  I can't even comprehend how it's possible without extreme malicious intent.

You can apply this to everything he did during his presidency. He had 'people' who could do the work that would make him look like a hero and he could have grabbed all the glory. He could have faked caring about anything and just pounded his chest and claimed he saved the day on every topic that would come up. Dr. Fauci was loved for his honest information and guiding people. All Trump had to do was shake his head in agreement, ride on Fauci's coat tails and praise his scientific knowledge. Instead, he was on the verge of firing him and made snide ugly remarks about him. Of course he was jealous of Fauci's popularity. Anything that took attention away from Trump had to be eliminated. The man was a giant fool. So many experts at his disposal and he chose to make decision from the 'gut'. Well, his gut must be rotten to the core.

How can one human being be so revengeful, spew so much evil and find joy in destroying people?

OtherJen

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7255 on: January 21, 2021, 11:33:44 AM »
I don't even understand.  Trump doesn't even have to sit down and do the plan himself, he merely has to give the go ahead for someone else to make a reasonable plan, and then sit back and take all the credit.

Even after his entire inner and extended circles got infect, he was hospitalized with it, he lost friends to it, it ravaged the economy with shut downs, it brought many hospital systems to their limits, 400k+ deaths and still raging, going on for a year, with multiple vaccines now available his plan was...just wait and see how this pans out?  It sounds like the plan was to intentionally let it rage on and kill people.  Maybe it's killing the right kind of people? Maybe he's just a sadistic fuck?  I can't even comprehend how it's possible without extreme malicious intent.

He isn't able to admit that he fucked up even on something minor, let alone something as colossal as 400,000 human deaths under his watch, many of which could have been prevented by the encouragement and enforcement of simple public health measures.

And because he is completely incapable of admitting his own faults, we all have to suffer.

frugalnacho

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7256 on: January 21, 2021, 12:06:41 PM »
I don't even understand.  Trump doesn't even have to sit down and do the plan himself, he merely has to give the go ahead for someone else to make a reasonable plan, and then sit back and take all the credit.

Even after his entire inner and extended circles got infect, he was hospitalized with it, he lost friends to it, it ravaged the economy with shut downs, it brought many hospital systems to their limits, 400k+ deaths and still raging, going on for a year, with multiple vaccines now available his plan was...just wait and see how this pans out?  It sounds like the plan was to intentionally let it rage on and kill people.  Maybe it's killing the right kind of people? Maybe he's just a sadistic fuck?  I can't even comprehend how it's possible without extreme malicious intent. 

I don't know that it was sadistic.  More likely, he just didn't care enough to expend energy on it because there was nothing in it for him.

There was though! He could have been the hero who vanquished covid (or at least not have the usa be the laughing stock of the world) and he could have done it with literally no effort! He was so jealous of the attention covid was getting too.  "covid, covid, covid".  He didn't even have to expend any energy.  No one expects the president of the united states to be an expert in medicine, immunology, or almost any other subject. He just had to let the experts do their jobs instead of sabotaging them. 

I don't even understand.  Trump doesn't even have to sit down and do the plan himself, he merely has to give the go ahead for someone else to make a reasonable plan, and then sit back and take all the credit.

Even after his entire inner and extended circles got infect, he was hospitalized with it, he lost friends to it, it ravaged the economy with shut downs, it brought many hospital systems to their limits, 400k+ deaths and still raging, going on for a year, with multiple vaccines now available his plan was...just wait and see how this pans out?  It sounds like the plan was to intentionally let it rage on and kill people.  Maybe it's killing the right kind of people? Maybe he's just a sadistic fuck?  I can't even comprehend how it's possible without extreme malicious intent.

He isn't able to admit that he fucked up even on something minor, let alone something as colossal as 400,000 human deaths under his watch, many of which could have been prevented by the encouragement and enforcement of simple public health measures.

And because he is completely incapable of admitting his own faults, we all have to suffer.

Yeah he fucked covid up, and was wrong about damn near everything he ever spoke about, but he was still touting his success in getting a vaccine developed in record time.  As of yesterday he was still spouting that nonsense like he was somehow personally responsible for any part of it.  And yet he appears to be actively sabotaging the vaccine roll out too.  He still could have sat back and claimed "everything I did with the coronavirus was right, we just got unlucky with it.  But here is the vaccine! We made it! Actually I made it, because I'm the greatest.  No one knows more about vaccines than me! And we have this excellent rollout of the vaccine because of me!".

And he could have done that without actually doing any work.  Just give the green light to the experts and tell them to get it done.  He comes out the hero for no effort.  Instead he guts the pandemic playbook, and doesn't let anyone do anything.  That's the part I don't even understand.  Assuming you aren't a sadistic prick that enjoys watching the nation suffer and die from covid, why would you at a bare minimum not at least stand back and do nothing, and stop actively sabotaging the response?

bacchi

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7257 on: January 21, 2021, 12:37:17 PM »
And he could have done that without actually doing any work.  Just give the green light to the experts and tell them to get it done.  He comes out the hero for no effort.  Instead he guts the pandemic playbook, and doesn't let anyone do anything.  That's the part I don't even understand.  Assuming you aren't a sadistic prick that enjoys watching the nation suffer and die from covid, why would you at a bare minimum not at least stand back and do nothing, and stop actively sabotaging the response?

Because his head could file for statehood.

He's a genius business person who could've been a pro baseball player, ffs! When he visited the CDC, the scientists kept asking him how he knew so much. He doesn't need to listen to some eggheads when he has a natural ability to understand immunology.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7258 on: January 21, 2021, 12:40:46 PM »
I don't even understand.  Trump doesn't even have to sit down and do the plan himself, he merely has to give the go ahead for someone else to make a reasonable plan, and then sit back and take all the credit.

Even after his entire inner and extended circles got infect, he was hospitalized with it, he lost friends to it, it ravaged the economy with shut downs, it brought many hospital systems to their limits, 400k+ deaths and still raging, going on for a year, with multiple vaccines now available his plan was...just wait and see how this pans out?  It sounds like the plan was to intentionally let it rage on and kill people.  Maybe it's killing the right kind of people? Maybe he's just a sadistic fuck?  I can't even comprehend how it's possible without extreme malicious intent. 

I don't know that it was sadistic.  More likely, he just didn't care enough to expend energy on it because there was nothing in it for him.

There was though! He could have been the hero who vanquished covid (or at least not have the usa be the laughing stock of the world) and he could have done it with literally no effort! He was so jealous of the attention covid was getting too.  "covid, covid, covid".  He didn't even have to expend any energy.  No one expects the president of the united states to be an expert in medicine, immunology, or almost any other subject. He just had to let the experts do their jobs instead of sabotaging them. 

I don't even understand.  Trump doesn't even have to sit down and do the plan himself, he merely has to give the go ahead for someone else to make a reasonable plan, and then sit back and take all the credit.

Even after his entire inner and extended circles got infect, he was hospitalized with it, he lost friends to it, it ravaged the economy with shut downs, it brought many hospital systems to their limits, 400k+ deaths and still raging, going on for a year, with multiple vaccines now available his plan was...just wait and see how this pans out?  It sounds like the plan was to intentionally let it rage on and kill people.  Maybe it's killing the right kind of people? Maybe he's just a sadistic fuck?  I can't even comprehend how it's possible without extreme malicious intent.

He isn't able to admit that he fucked up even on something minor, let alone something as colossal as 400,000 human deaths under his watch, many of which could have been prevented by the encouragement and enforcement of simple public health measures.

And because he is completely incapable of admitting his own faults, we all have to suffer.

Yeah he fucked covid up, and was wrong about damn near everything he ever spoke about, but he was still touting his success in getting a vaccine developed in record time.  As of yesterday he was still spouting that nonsense like he was somehow personally responsible for any part of it.  And yet he appears to be actively sabotaging the vaccine roll out too.  He still could have sat back and claimed "everything I did with the coronavirus was right, we just got unlucky with it.  But here is the vaccine! We made it! Actually I made it, because I'm the greatest.  No one knows more about vaccines than me! And we have this excellent rollout of the vaccine because of me!".

And he could have done that without actually doing any work.  Just give the green light to the experts and tell them to get it done.  He comes out the hero for no effort.  Instead he guts the pandemic playbook, and doesn't let anyone do anything.  That's the part I don't even understand.  Assuming you aren't a sadistic prick that enjoys watching the nation suffer and die from covid, why would you at a bare minimum not at least stand back and do nothing, and stop actively sabotaging the response?

Add a political party that believes that government is the problem (remember Reagan's: "The nine most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the Government, and I'm here to help. " ) and add a short-sighted narcissist who was more afraid of a change in short term stock prices than a few covid deaths heading into 2020, and then add an inability to change course and always just double down and push back on any criticism and you get what we have now. It's worse than just incompetence. 

RetiredAt63

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7259 on: January 21, 2021, 02:51:22 PM »
Marjorie Taylor Greene.  Apparently the Republicans are stuck in a rut?

LennStar

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7260 on: January 22, 2021, 04:07:56 AM »
Do NOT get me started on the "pro-life" folks who refuse to wear a mask and insist on meeting up in person. I think Jesus had a lot more to say about people doing temple things for show over actual caring acts than he did about abortion :(
Please don't start a "stupid people outrage of the day" thread. It would be way too much!


I don't even understand.  Trump doesn't even have to sit down and do the plan himself, he merely has to give the go ahead for someone else to make a reasonable plan, and then sit back and take all the credit.

Even after his entire inner and extended circles got infect, he was hospitalized with it, he lost friends to it, it ravaged the economy with shut downs, it brought many hospital systems to their limits, 400k+ deaths and still raging, going on for a year, with multiple vaccines now available his plan was...just wait and see how this pans out?  It sounds like the plan was to intentionally let it rage on and kill people.  Maybe it's killing the right kind of people? Maybe he's just a sadistic fuck?  I can't even comprehend how it's possible without extreme malicious intent.

You can apply this to everything he did during his presidency. He had 'people' who could do the work that would make him look like a hero and he could have grabbed all the glory. He could have faked caring about anything and just pounded his chest and claimed he saved the day on every topic that would come up. Dr. Fauci was loved for his honest information and guiding people. All Trump had to do was shake his head in agreement, ride on Fauci's coat tails and praise his scientific knowledge. Instead, he was on the verge of firing him and made snide ugly remarks about him. Of course he was jealous of Fauci's popularity. Anything that took attention away from Trump had to be eliminated. The man was a giant fool. So many experts at his disposal and he chose to make decision from the 'gut'. Well, his gut must be rotten to the core.

How can one human being be so revengeful, spew so much evil and find joy in destroying people?
Trump is the Greatest. And best looking and most intelligent. It can't be if there is someone else who is better. I don't think Trump enjoys destroying people. He enjoys showing to be the alpha gorilla. Because inside he is scared shit, as he knows he is not half of what the says he is. At the same time he knows he the Greatest.

It's as it was with his (first) election day face: He was not happy at all. He was "Oh shit, I have no idea what to do as a president and still have to look good. What should I do?"
And since in everything he does he only things about himself (at the front), he cannot take a step back, even if that would be good for him and he knows it.
 

talltexan

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7261 on: January 22, 2021, 06:57:35 AM »
Do NOT get me started on the "pro-life" folks who refuse to wear a mask and insist on meeting up in person. I think Jesus had a lot more to say about people doing temple things for show over actual caring acts than he did about abortion :(
Please don't start a "stupid people outrage of the day" thread. It would be way too much!


I don't even understand.  Trump doesn't even have to sit down and do the plan himself, he merely has to give the go ahead for someone else to make a reasonable plan, and then sit back and take all the credit.

Even after his entire inner and extended circles got infect, he was hospitalized with it, he lost friends to it, it ravaged the economy with shut downs, it brought many hospital systems to their limits, 400k+ deaths and still raging, going on for a year, with multiple vaccines now available his plan was...just wait and see how this pans out?  It sounds like the plan was to intentionally let it rage on and kill people.  Maybe it's killing the right kind of people? Maybe he's just a sadistic fuck?  I can't even comprehend how it's possible without extreme malicious intent.

You can apply this to everything he did during his presidency. He had 'people' who could do the work that would make him look like a hero and he could have grabbed all the glory. He could have faked caring about anything and just pounded his chest and claimed he saved the day on every topic that would come up. Dr. Fauci was loved for his honest information and guiding people. All Trump had to do was shake his head in agreement, ride on Fauci's coat tails and praise his scientific knowledge. Instead, he was on the verge of firing him and made snide ugly remarks about him. Of course he was jealous of Fauci's popularity. Anything that took attention away from Trump had to be eliminated. The man was a giant fool. So many experts at his disposal and he chose to make decision from the 'gut'. Well, his gut must be rotten to the core.

How can one human being be so revengeful, spew so much evil and find joy in destroying people?
Trump is the Greatest. And best looking and most intelligent. It can't be if there is someone else who is better. I don't think Trump enjoys destroying people. He enjoys showing to be the alpha gorilla. Because inside he is scared shit, as he knows he is not half of what the says he is. At the same time he knows he the Greatest.

It's as it was with his (first) election day face: He was not happy at all. He was "Oh shit, I have no idea what to do as a president and still have to look good. What should I do?"
And since in everything he does he only things about himself (at the front), he cannot take a step back, even if that would be good for him and he knows it.

I've read that most people suffer from a form of this "imposter" syndrome.

But most of us weren't brought up the scions of wealthy families who would go to any lengths to preserve their power and influence. Normal people experience consequences.

nereo

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7262 on: January 22, 2021, 07:11:37 AM »
So pivoting the meaning of “Trump outrage” from “things we are outraged that Trump has done” to “Things Trump is [probably] outraged about”...

Trump’s required business filings upon leaving office paint a horrible picture about the fiscal health of the Trump Organization.  Overall, revenue from 47 of his businesses declined over 35% last year and reported combined losses of over $120MM last year.
The picture for several of his marque properties are even worse.  The Washington Post reports:
Quote
His Washington hotel, which has a $170 million loan outstanding, saw revenue drop more than 60 percent. His Doral resort in Miami — also carrying a huge debt load — saw a 44 percent drop.

Fundraising from his supporters not withstanding, it’s unclear how Trump can around these properties in 2021 while new lock-down procedures are going into place, he can no longer conduct EO business at his properties and there’s less incentive for lobbyists and foreign governments to patronize those establishments.

GuitarStv

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7263 on: January 22, 2021, 07:25:37 AM »
So pivoting the meaning of “Trump outrage” from “things we are outraged that Trump has done” to “Things Trump is [probably] outraged about”...

Trump’s required business filings upon leaving office paint a horrible picture about the fiscal health of the Trump Organization.  Overall, revenue from 47 of his businesses declined over 35% last year and reported combined losses of over $120MM last year.
The picture for several of his marque properties are even worse.  The Washington Post reports:
Quote
His Washington hotel, which has a $170 million loan outstanding, saw revenue drop more than 60 percent. His Doral resort in Miami — also carrying a huge debt load — saw a 44 percent drop.

Fundraising from his supporters not withstanding, it’s unclear how Trump can around these properties in 2021 while new lock-down procedures are going into place, he can no longer conduct EO business at his properties and there’s less incentive for lobbyists and foreign governments to patronize those establishments.

Given the amount of evidence that Trump was using his position as President to further his personal business interests, the decline during the final year of his presidency doesn't seem very surprising in any way.

OtherJen

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7264 on: January 22, 2021, 07:31:53 AM »
Do NOT get me started on the "pro-life" folks who refuse to wear a mask and insist on meeting up in person. I think Jesus had a lot more to say about people doing temple things for show over actual caring acts than he did about abortion :(
Please don't start a "stupid people outrage of the day" thread. It would be way too much!


I don't even understand.  Trump doesn't even have to sit down and do the plan himself, he merely has to give the go ahead for someone else to make a reasonable plan, and then sit back and take all the credit.

Even after his entire inner and extended circles got infect, he was hospitalized with it, he lost friends to it, it ravaged the economy with shut downs, it brought many hospital systems to their limits, 400k+ deaths and still raging, going on for a year, with multiple vaccines now available his plan was...just wait and see how this pans out?  It sounds like the plan was to intentionally let it rage on and kill people.  Maybe it's killing the right kind of people? Maybe he's just a sadistic fuck?  I can't even comprehend how it's possible without extreme malicious intent.

You can apply this to everything he did during his presidency. He had 'people' who could do the work that would make him look like a hero and he could have grabbed all the glory. He could have faked caring about anything and just pounded his chest and claimed he saved the day on every topic that would come up. Dr. Fauci was loved for his honest information and guiding people. All Trump had to do was shake his head in agreement, ride on Fauci's coat tails and praise his scientific knowledge. Instead, he was on the verge of firing him and made snide ugly remarks about him. Of course he was jealous of Fauci's popularity. Anything that took attention away from Trump had to be eliminated. The man was a giant fool. So many experts at his disposal and he chose to make decision from the 'gut'. Well, his gut must be rotten to the core.

How can one human being be so revengeful, spew so much evil and find joy in destroying people?
Trump is the Greatest. And best looking and most intelligent. It can't be if there is someone else who is better. I don't think Trump enjoys destroying people. He enjoys showing to be the alpha gorilla. Because inside he is scared shit, as he knows he is not half of what the says he is. At the same time he knows he the Greatest.

It's as it was with his (first) election day face: He was not happy at all. He was "Oh shit, I have no idea what to do as a president and still have to look good. What should I do?"
And since in everything he does he only things about himself (at the front), he cannot take a step back, even if that would be good for him and he knows it.

I've read that most people suffer from a form of this "imposter" syndrome.

But most of us weren't brought up the scions of wealthy families who would go to any lengths to preserve their power and influence. Normal people experience consequences.

Yes. Imposter syndrome was something discussed openly, especially among women, when I was in grad school (I was lucky to be in a supportive rather than competitive program). Many people recognize that they do not feel up to a big challenge and either work diligently to make themselves so or bow out gracefully and move on. In my program, some of us completed our degrees, others realized that they were unhappy or uninterested and took other paths (and the ones I followed have all done well).

And then you have those who are walking examples of the Dunning–Kruger effect, who refuse to accept that they might not immediately be suited for a task and refuse to do any of the work to become actually competent. Trump had no experience with elected office, or even as the head of a non-family or publicly traded company. Yet he was sure that he alone could save America and was the best person to do it. He knew more than anyone about business, law, science, medicine, foreign policy, immigration, etc. It’s why anyone around him with real expertise was fired or muzzled (BTW, did anyone see how joyful Dr. Fauci was during yesterday’s press conference?) and why he eventually had mostly “acting” directors and secretaries; that way he could surround himself with yes-men without having them scrutinized in a normal confirmation process.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7265 on: January 22, 2021, 07:32:45 AM »
So pivoting the meaning of “Trump outrage” from “things we are outraged that Trump has done” to “Things Trump is [probably] outraged about”...

Trump’s required business filings upon leaving office paint a horrible picture about the fiscal health of the Trump Organization.  Overall, revenue from 47 of his businesses declined over 35% last year and reported combined losses of over $120MM last year.
The picture for several of his marque properties are even worse.  The Washington Post reports:
Quote
His Washington hotel, which has a $170 million loan outstanding, saw revenue drop more than 60 percent. His Doral resort in Miami — also carrying a huge debt load — saw a 44 percent drop.

Fundraising from his supporters not withstanding, it’s unclear how Trump can around these properties in 2021 while new lock-down procedures are going into place, he can no longer conduct EO business at his properties and there’s less incentive for lobbyists and foreign governments to patronize those establishments.

Given the amount of evidence that Trump was using his position as President to further his personal business interests, the decline during the final year of his presidency doesn't seem very surprising in any way.

Well also: I would expect that hotels and resorts don't do too great during a pandemic. Hmm, the real reason he was trying to "downplay" COVID?!

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7266 on: January 22, 2021, 08:11:08 AM »
So pivoting the meaning of “Trump outrage” from “things we are outraged that Trump has done” to “Things Trump is [probably] outraged about”...

Trump’s required business filings upon leaving office paint a horrible picture about the fiscal health of the Trump Organization.  Overall, revenue from 47 of his businesses declined over 35% last year and reported combined losses of over $120MM last year.
The picture for several of his marque properties are even worse.  The Washington Post reports:
Quote
His Washington hotel, which has a $170 million loan outstanding, saw revenue drop more than 60 percent. His Doral resort in Miami — also carrying a huge debt load — saw a 44 percent drop.

Fundraising from his supporters not withstanding, it’s unclear how Trump can around these properties in 2021 while new lock-down procedures are going into place, he can no longer conduct EO business at his properties and there’s less incentive for lobbyists and foreign governments to patronize those establishments.

Maybe that was his COVID plan - to rush towards herd immunity as fast as possible so that after he is a private citizen again the worst of COVID has passed and people will go back to living normally and patronizing his establishments. VIPs won't be patronizing his businesses as much after he is a private citizen.

After all, Americans have short memories so they'll forget about 500,000 dead quickly won't they? It was unavoidable. He did the best anyone could he'd say.

Now that he isn't President, he can't control the COVID non-response and financially he suffers like everyone else. I'll bet he thought the pandemic could be over in 6 months, it would like he said in speeches - burn itself out. And it didn't. Another gamble that did not pay off. And this is the problem - he gambles rather than play the long slow and steady game.

I base my theory on no facts.

talltexan

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7267 on: January 22, 2021, 08:24:47 AM »
So pivoting the meaning of “Trump outrage” from “things we are outraged that Trump has done” to “Things Trump is [probably] outraged about”...

Trump’s required business filings upon leaving office paint a horrible picture about the fiscal health of the Trump Organization.  Overall, revenue from 47 of his businesses declined over 35% last year and reported combined losses of over $120MM last year.
The picture for several of his marque properties are even worse.  The Washington Post reports:
Quote
His Washington hotel, which has a $170 million loan outstanding, saw revenue drop more than 60 percent. His Doral resort in Miami — also carrying a huge debt load — saw a 44 percent drop.

Fundraising from his supporters not withstanding, it’s unclear how Trump can around these properties in 2021 while new lock-down procedures are going into place, he can no longer conduct EO business at his properties and there’s less incentive for lobbyists and foreign governments to patronize those establishments.

Maybe that was his COVID plan - to rush towards herd immunity as fast as possible so that after he is a private citizen again the worst of COVID has passed and people will go back to living normally and patronizing his establishments. VIPs won't be patronizing his businesses as much after he is a private citizen.

After all, Americans have short memories so they'll forget about 500,000 dead quickly won't they? It was unavoidable. He did the best anyone could he'd say.

Now that he isn't President, he can't control the COVID non-response and financially he suffers like everyone else. I'll bet he thought the pandemic could be over in 6 months, it would like he said in speeches - burn itself out. And it didn't. Another gamble that did not pay off. And this is the problem - he gambles rather than play the long slow and steady game.

I base my theory on no facts.

I get that the Trump properties are hurting for cash flow right now, but interest rates are low, and--with the vaccines rolling out--we should expect that customers will flood back in for the second half of the year. For the Florida properties, it's basically one winter season that's been lost.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7268 on: January 22, 2021, 08:35:02 AM »
So pivoting the meaning of “Trump outrage” from “things we are outraged that Trump has done” to “Things Trump is [probably] outraged about”...

Trump’s required business filings upon leaving office paint a horrible picture about the fiscal health of the Trump Organization.  Overall, revenue from 47 of his businesses declined over 35% last year and reported combined losses of over $120MM last year.
The picture for several of his marque properties are even worse.  The Washington Post reports:
Quote
His Washington hotel, which has a $170 million loan outstanding, saw revenue drop more than 60 percent. His Doral resort in Miami — also carrying a huge debt load — saw a 44 percent drop.

Fundraising from his supporters not withstanding, it’s unclear how Trump can around these properties in 2021 while new lock-down procedures are going into place, he can no longer conduct EO business at his properties and there’s less incentive for lobbyists and foreign governments to patronize those establishments.

Maybe that was his COVID plan - to rush towards herd immunity as fast as possible so that after he is a private citizen again the worst of COVID has passed and people will go back to living normally and patronizing his establishments. VIPs won't be patronizing his businesses as much after he is a private citizen.

After all, Americans have short memories so they'll forget about 500,000 dead quickly won't they? It was unavoidable. He did the best anyone could he'd say.

Now that he isn't President, he can't control the COVID non-response and financially he suffers like everyone else. I'll bet he thought the pandemic could be over in 6 months, it would like he said in speeches - burn itself out. And it didn't. Another gamble that did not pay off. And this is the problem - he gambles rather than play the long slow and steady game.

I base my theory on no facts.

I get that the Trump properties are hurting for cash flow right now, but interest rates are low, and--with the vaccines rolling out--we should expect that customers will flood back in for the second half of the year. For the Florida properties, it's basically one winter season that's been lost.

I think the next three years will be interesting. 
Biggest problem the Trump Organization has (as I see it) is the $322MM in personally guaranteed loans which will come due over the next two years.  It doesn’t particularly matter that interest rates are low - if he doesn’t have the cash flow to cover those, he’ll be forced into bankruptcy (again!).  It’s almost uncanny how similar this all sounds to his Casino days, when he needed to have above-industry-average profits just to keep afloat for a few years.  Didn’t work out so well.  He was so leveraged (read: Risky) that most banks wouldn’t extend him more credit, nad the ones that did charged him above prime rates.

When your businesses are operating heavily in the rd, and you have debt coming due, and the banks which you have been working with have all publicly dropped you as a client - that’s all the ingredients for a debt spiral. Adding to that, he’s lost several lucrative events, including the PGA (both the scheduled US Open as well as his hoped-for British Open).

Maybe Donnie’s got $500MM on hand he can use to right the ship.  Maybe, as you say, customers will come flocking back in Q3/Q4 of this year.  Or maybe we’re tipping into a double-dip recession, or customers won’t come back in record numbers, and/or he won’t be able to refinance his debt at record low levels.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7269 on: January 22, 2021, 08:40:57 AM »
So pivoting the meaning of “Trump outrage” from “things we are outraged that Trump has done” to “Things Trump is [probably] outraged about”...

Trump’s required business filings upon leaving office paint a horrible picture about the fiscal health of the Trump Organization.  Overall, revenue from 47 of his businesses declined over 35% last year and reported combined losses of over $120MM last year.
The picture for several of his marque properties are even worse.  The Washington Post reports:
Quote
His Washington hotel, which has a $170 million loan outstanding, saw revenue drop more than 60 percent. His Doral resort in Miami — also carrying a huge debt load — saw a 44 percent drop.

Fundraising from his supporters not withstanding, it’s unclear how Trump can around these properties in 2021 while new lock-down procedures are going into place, he can no longer conduct EO business at his properties and there’s less incentive for lobbyists and foreign governments to patronize those establishments.

Maybe that was his COVID plan - to rush towards herd immunity as fast as possible so that after he is a private citizen again the worst of COVID has passed and people will go back to living normally and patronizing his establishments. VIPs won't be patronizing his businesses as much after he is a private citizen.

After all, Americans have short memories so they'll forget about 500,000 dead quickly won't they? It was unavoidable. He did the best anyone could he'd say.

Now that he isn't President, he can't control the COVID non-response and financially he suffers like everyone else. I'll bet he thought the pandemic could be over in 6 months, it would like he said in speeches - burn itself out. And it didn't. Another gamble that did not pay off. And this is the problem - he gambles rather than play the long slow and steady game.

I base my theory on no facts.

I get that the Trump properties are hurting for cash flow right now, but interest rates are low, and--with the vaccines rolling out--we should expect that customers will flood back in for the second half of the year. For the Florida properties, it's basically one winter season that's been lost.

It depends on if he can find a bank willing to lend him the money. If his properties are bleeding cash, (and without the crown prince buying up empty rooms will there actually be any profit?) there may have to start selling off more of his properties an consolidate his assets. He's reported to have lost about $1 Billion dollars between 1985-1995, and even in the past decade his networth is thought to have dropped from about 6 Billion to about 2. My guess is that within the next 10 years he'll be worth less than $1 Billion. I can't think of any bank that would want to touch that without a serious interest rate.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7270 on: January 22, 2021, 08:47:16 AM »
... lotsa quotes.... Snip......

And then you have those who are walking examples of the Dunning–Kruger effect, who refuse to accept that they might not immediately be suited for a task and refuse to do any of the work to become actually competent. Trump had no experience with elected office, or even as the head of a non-family or publicly traded company. Yet he was sure that he alone could save America and was the best person to do it. He knew more than anyone about business, law, science, medicine, foreign policy, immigration, etc. It’s why anyone around him with real expertise was fired or muzzled (BTW, did anyone see how joyful Dr. Fauci was during yesterday’s press conference?) and why he eventually had mostly “acting” directors and secretaries; that way he could surround himself with yes-men without having them scrutinized in a normal confirmation process.

Maybe we can rename the Dunning–Kruger effect to the Trump effect.  I can think of no one more worthy of the honor. 
He would probably proud of getting a major affliction named after Himself.

Poor Dunning and Kruger, most other people get a Syndrome or Disease named after them, not just a mere effect. 

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7271 on: January 22, 2021, 09:11:46 AM »
So pivoting the meaning of “Trump outrage” from “things we are outraged that Trump has done” to “Things Trump is [probably] outraged about”...

Trump’s required business filings upon leaving office paint a horrible picture about the fiscal health of the Trump Organization.  Overall, revenue from 47 of his businesses declined over 35% last year and reported combined losses of over $120MM last year.
The picture for several of his marque properties are even worse.  The Washington Post reports:
Quote
His Washington hotel, which has a $170 million loan outstanding, saw revenue drop more than 60 percent. His Doral resort in Miami — also carrying a huge debt load — saw a 44 percent drop.

Fundraising from his supporters not withstanding, it’s unclear how Trump can around these properties in 2021 while new lock-down procedures are going into place, he can no longer conduct EO business at his properties and there’s less incentive for lobbyists and foreign governments to patronize those establishments.

Maybe that was his COVID plan - to rush towards herd immunity as fast as possible so that after he is a private citizen again the worst of COVID has passed and people will go back to living normally and patronizing his establishments. VIPs won't be patronizing his businesses as much after he is a private citizen.

After all, Americans have short memories so they'll forget about 500,000 dead quickly won't they? It was unavoidable. He did the best anyone could he'd say.

Now that he isn't President, he can't control the COVID non-response and financially he suffers like everyone else. I'll bet he thought the pandemic could be over in 6 months, it would like he said in speeches - burn itself out. And it didn't. Another gamble that did not pay off. And this is the problem - he gambles rather than play the long slow and steady game.

I base my theory on no facts.

I get that the Trump properties are hurting for cash flow right now, but interest rates are low, and--with the vaccines rolling out--we should expect that customers will flood back in for the second half of the year. For the Florida properties, it's basically one winter season that's been lost.

It depends on if he can find a bank willing to lend him the money. If his properties are bleeding cash, (and without the crown prince buying up empty rooms will there actually be any profit?) there may have to start selling off more of his properties an consolidate his assets. He's reported to have lost about $1 Billion dollars between 1985-1995, and even in the past decade his networth is thought to have dropped from about 6 Billion to about 2. My guess is that within the next 10 years he'll be worth less than $1 Billion. I can't think of any bank that would want to touch that without a serious interest rate.

With Deutche not lending to him anymore, that might be difficult to pull off.

I hope his empire implodes and all of his shady business practices are brought to light.

talltexan

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7272 on: January 22, 2021, 09:17:32 AM »
So pivoting the meaning of “Trump outrage” from “things we are outraged that Trump has done” to “Things Trump is [probably] outraged about”...

Trump’s required business filings upon leaving office paint a horrible picture about the fiscal health of the Trump Organization.  Overall, revenue from 47 of his businesses declined over 35% last year and reported combined losses of over $120MM last year.
The picture for several of his marque properties are even worse.  The Washington Post reports:
Quote
His Washington hotel, which has a $170 million loan outstanding, saw revenue drop more than 60 percent. His Doral resort in Miami — also carrying a huge debt load — saw a 44 percent drop.

Fundraising from his supporters not withstanding, it’s unclear how Trump can around these properties in 2021 while new lock-down procedures are going into place, he can no longer conduct EO business at his properties and there’s less incentive for lobbyists and foreign governments to patronize those establishments.

Maybe that was his COVID plan - to rush towards herd immunity as fast as possible so that after he is a private citizen again the worst of COVID has passed and people will go back to living normally and patronizing his establishments. VIPs won't be patronizing his businesses as much after he is a private citizen.

After all, Americans have short memories so they'll forget about 500,000 dead quickly won't they? It was unavoidable. He did the best anyone could he'd say.

Now that he isn't President, he can't control the COVID non-response and financially he suffers like everyone else. I'll bet he thought the pandemic could be over in 6 months, it would like he said in speeches - burn itself out. And it didn't. Another gamble that did not pay off. And this is the problem - he gambles rather than play the long slow and steady game.

I base my theory on no facts.

I get that the Trump properties are hurting for cash flow right now, but interest rates are low, and--with the vaccines rolling out--we should expect that customers will flood back in for the second half of the year. For the Florida properties, it's basically one winter season that's been lost.

It depends on if he can find a bank willing to lend him the money. If his properties are bleeding cash, (and without the crown prince buying up empty rooms will there actually be any profit?) there may have to start selling off more of his properties an consolidate his assets. He's reported to have lost about $1 Billion dollars between 1985-1995, and even in the past decade his networth is thought to have dropped from about 6 Billion to about 2. My guess is that within the next 10 years he'll be worth less than $1 Billion. I can't think of any bank that would want to touch that without a serious interest rate.

With Deutche not lending to him anymore, that might be difficult to pull off.

I hope his empire implodes and all of his shady business practices are brought to light.

Why do people think personal bankruptcy is something Trump cannot handle? He's beaten a couple of them already.

FIPurpose

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7273 on: January 22, 2021, 09:33:41 AM »
So pivoting the meaning of “Trump outrage” from “things we are outraged that Trump has done” to “Things Trump is [probably] outraged about”...

Trump’s required business filings upon leaving office paint a horrible picture about the fiscal health of the Trump Organization.  Overall, revenue from 47 of his businesses declined over 35% last year and reported combined losses of over $120MM last year.
The picture for several of his marque properties are even worse.  The Washington Post reports:
Quote
His Washington hotel, which has a $170 million loan outstanding, saw revenue drop more than 60 percent. His Doral resort in Miami — also carrying a huge debt load — saw a 44 percent drop.

Fundraising from his supporters not withstanding, it’s unclear how Trump can around these properties in 2021 while new lock-down procedures are going into place, he can no longer conduct EO business at his properties and there’s less incentive for lobbyists and foreign governments to patronize those establishments.

Maybe that was his COVID plan - to rush towards herd immunity as fast as possible so that after he is a private citizen again the worst of COVID has passed and people will go back to living normally and patronizing his establishments. VIPs won't be patronizing his businesses as much after he is a private citizen.

After all, Americans have short memories so they'll forget about 500,000 dead quickly won't they? It was unavoidable. He did the best anyone could he'd say.

Now that he isn't President, he can't control the COVID non-response and financially he suffers like everyone else. I'll bet he thought the pandemic could be over in 6 months, it would like he said in speeches - burn itself out. And it didn't. Another gamble that did not pay off. And this is the problem - he gambles rather than play the long slow and steady game.

I base my theory on no facts.

I get that the Trump properties are hurting for cash flow right now, but interest rates are low, and--with the vaccines rolling out--we should expect that customers will flood back in for the second half of the year. For the Florida properties, it's basically one winter season that's been lost.

It depends on if he can find a bank willing to lend him the money. If his properties are bleeding cash, (and without the crown prince buying up empty rooms will there actually be any profit?) there may have to start selling off more of his properties an consolidate his assets. He's reported to have lost about $1 Billion dollars between 1985-1995, and even in the past decade his networth is thought to have dropped from about 6 Billion to about 2. My guess is that within the next 10 years he'll be worth less than $1 Billion. I can't think of any bank that would want to touch that without a serious interest rate.

With Deutche not lending to him anymore, that might be difficult to pull off.

I hope his empire implodes and all of his shady business practices are brought to light.

Why do people think personal bankruptcy is something Trump cannot handle? He's beaten a couple of them already.

It all depends on how his investments are setup, and also how the debt that he is able to secure is setup. I don't know the details but from what I understand, the debt he has coming due soon is backed by him personally. So he can't just bankruptcy away that debt.

Whereas, if he owns a particular corporation that owes a lot of money, he would be able to declare it bankrupt without it touching his other wealth. My guess is that the banks were already unwilling to lend him money without him personally backing it and refused to lend directly to one of his corps.

nereo

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7274 on: January 22, 2021, 09:48:29 AM »

Why do people think personal bankruptcy is something Trump cannot handle? He's beaten a couple of them already.

It all depends on how his investments are setup, and also how the debt that he is able to secure is setup. I don't know the details but from what I understand, the debt he has coming due soon is backed by him personally. So he can't just bankruptcy away that debt.

Whereas, if he owns a particular corporation that owes a lot of money, he would be able to declare it bankrupt without it touching his other wealth. My guess is that the banks were already unwilling to lend him money without him personally backing it and refused to lend directly to one of his corps.

This.  As reported by the NYT and later verified by a number of outlets, to secure credit Trump personally guaranteed over $400MM in loans, of which $320MM are due within the next couple of years. ‘

True, Trump has declared bankruptcy numerous times and emerged from it, but the open question is what would he go to this time?  ‘The Apprentice’ allowed him to bail out his failing casino and real-estate deals (to the tune of over $400MM, split roughly half between his direct earnings and then licensing agreements from the show).  His real-estate ‘empire’ was largely build (and lost) from his inheritance (also in the nine-figures). 

It’s not at all clear to me how he gets another ‘lifeline’ of $300MM or so over the next several years to keep it all afloat.  He could certainly do the speaker-circuit (or more likely ‘paid rallies’) but if Clinton is any indication that’s likely to bring in several million, not several hundred million.  I dont’ see the networks signing eight or nine figure deals with him. Limbaugh and Stern have never managed to make the kind of money Trump got for The Apprentice - no in talk-show land has.

I’m not counting him out, but he’s got a number of major problems; 1) looming debt coming due, 2) negative revenue stream, 3) a tarnished brand, 4) no easy source of credit 5) his age

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7275 on: January 22, 2021, 09:56:09 AM »
It all depends on how his investments are setup, and also how the debt that he is able to secure is setup. I don't know the details but from what I understand, the debt he has coming due soon is backed by him personally. So he can't just bankruptcy away that debt.

Whereas, if he owns a particular corporation that owes a lot of money, he would be able to declare it bankrupt without it touching his other wealth. My guess is that the banks were already unwilling to lend him money without him personally backing it and refused to lend directly to one of his corps.
It helps if he still has Saudis, Qataris, Russians bailing his family out.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7276 on: January 22, 2021, 10:21:40 AM »
It all depends on how his investments are setup, and also how the debt that he is able to secure is setup. I don't know the details but from what I understand, the debt he has coming due soon is backed by him personally. So he can't just bankruptcy away that debt.

Whereas, if he owns a particular corporation that owes a lot of money, he would be able to declare it bankrupt without it touching his other wealth. My guess is that the banks were already unwilling to lend him money without him personally backing it and refused to lend directly to one of his corps.
It helps if he still has Saudis, Qataris, Russians bailing his family out.

But was that sort of aid dependent on his continued position in the Oval Office?

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7277 on: January 22, 2021, 11:11:11 AM »
The House is sending articles of impeachment to the Senate on Monday. Pelosi is clearly playing hardball, which is good and appropriate. The immediacy of the Capitol mob favors conviction.

As to the business stuff, the other twist is that Trump has clearly been keeping two sets of books: one to show potential investors/lenders and one to show the IRS. This also has huge legal and financial implications. If his IRS forms are shown to lenders, that source of cash flow likely gets more expensive or less available. IRS penalties will exacerbate his financial woes; I seem to remember IRS payments due in the order of $70m+ in the NYT reporting a few months back. He will likely do everything he can to extend those cases as much as  possible and try to run out the clock or buy time. As stated above, it will be difficult to prevent a snowball.

One thing I have very poor understanding of is the liability faced by his kids. Are they signatories on any of this debt, or participants in any of the tax (and other) fraud?

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7278 on: January 22, 2021, 11:13:27 AM »
It all depends on how his investments are setup, and also how the debt that he is able to secure is setup. I don't know the details but from what I understand, the debt he has coming due soon is backed by him personally. So he can't just bankruptcy away that debt.

Whereas, if he owns a particular corporation that owes a lot of money, he would be able to declare it bankrupt without it touching his other wealth. My guess is that the banks were already unwilling to lend him money without him personally backing it and refused to lend directly to one of his corps.
It helps if he still has Saudis, Qataris, Russians bailing his family out.

But was that sort of aid dependent on his continued position in the Oval Office?
He is still a very powerful man with lot of tools at his disposal. There was enough smoke that they were propping him up before 2016 and during his presidency so they wont be stopping now.

nereo

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7279 on: January 22, 2021, 11:15:49 AM »
Trump leveraged his presidency to benefit his properties and they still lost considerable money. And it isn’t just the pandemic - they were s shopping for a buyer of his flagship DC hotel over a year ago as that has been a revenue loser.

I question why foreign entities would continue to prop up his hotels now that he is no longer president. What “power” does he have and what “tools” are at his disposal? @achvfi ?

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7280 on: January 22, 2021, 11:16:50 AM »
An interesting additional question is who the lawyers are that will be representing him to the IRS and just generally in his bank negotiations and business.  With good lawyers, I'm confident he could fend off the IRS for a decade or more (i.e. the rest of his natural life), but who are these lawyers that are going to keep working for him without getting paid?  I am a lawyer and you do a lot for clients, especially long-time ones, but no firm and no top partners are going to continue to sink tons of time into complex litigation and negotiations without some remuneration.  It's not like they can hope to get paid on contingency. 

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7281 on: January 22, 2021, 11:28:36 AM »
Trump leveraged his presidency to benefit his properties and they still lost considerable money. And it isn’t just the pandemic - they were s shopping for a buyer of his flagship DC hotel over a year ago as that has been a revenue loser.

I question why foreign entities would continue to prop up his hotels now that he is no longer president. What “power” does he have and what “tools” are at his disposal? @achvfi ?

We will learn just how much influence he continues to wield within a major political party quite soon. The greater that influence, the greater his value to unscrupulous creditors.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7282 on: January 22, 2021, 11:30:37 AM »
Trump leveraged his presidency to benefit his properties and they still lost considerable money. And it isn’t just the pandemic - they were s shopping for a buyer of his flagship DC hotel over a year ago as that has been a revenue loser.

I question why foreign entities would continue to prop up his hotels now that he is no longer president. What “power” does he have and what “tools” are at his disposal? @achvfi ?

He could continue to sow division, just be a distraction. He could influence a senator or two to their favor. He could throw his support around.

I dont like to say this but he could compete in next election to influence it or may be he will be our next president.

A billion dollars can be considered cheap to buy influence like that in geopolitical scheme.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7283 on: January 22, 2021, 11:42:54 AM »
It all depends on how his investments are setup, and also how the debt that he is able to secure is setup. I don't know the details but from what I understand, the debt he has coming due soon is backed by him personally. So he can't just bankruptcy away that debt.

Whereas, if he owns a particular corporation that owes a lot of money, he would be able to declare it bankrupt without it touching his other wealth. My guess is that the banks were already unwilling to lend him money without him personally backing it and refused to lend directly to one of his corps.
It helps if he still has Saudis, Qataris, Russians bailing his family out.

But was that sort of aid dependent on his continued position in the Oval Office?
He is still a very powerful man with lot of tools at his disposal. There was enough smoke that they were propping him up before 2016 and during his presidency so they wont be stopping now.

I assumed that he was propped up because he was likely to end up in the White House, where he would have the power and leverage to pay back the favor. He’s no longer in the White House, he may be barred from future political office, three of his four major crediting banks have cut ties with him, he’s facing expulsion from the Screen Actors Guild (which means another round of the Apprentice is very unlikely), and he has hundreds of millions of dollars in personally guaranteed debt coming due. He doesn’t have nearly as many tools as he did 4 years ago.
« Last Edit: January 22, 2021, 01:32:22 PM by OtherJen »

nereo

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7284 on: January 22, 2021, 12:30:40 PM »
Trump leveraged his presidency to benefit his properties and they still lost considerable money. And it isn’t just the pandemic - they were s shopping for a buyer of his flagship DC hotel over a year ago as that has been a revenue loser.

I question why foreign entities would continue to prop up his hotels now that he is no longer president. What “power” does he have and what “tools” are at his disposal? @achvfi ?

He could continue to sow division, just be a distraction. He could influence a senator or two to their favor. He could throw his support around.

I dont like to say this but he could compete in next election to influence it or may be he will be our next president.

A billion dollars can be considered cheap to buy influence like that in geopolitical scheme.

Given the outcome of both senate elections, would his support still be seen as an asset?

A billion dollars might be cheap ( though I refute that) - though he doesn’t seem to have anywhere that amount in cash to just toss around. Liquidity seems to be a core problem of the Trump organization right now...

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7285 on: January 22, 2021, 12:43:19 PM »
A billion dollars might be cheap ( though I refute that) - though he doesn’t seem to have anywhere that amount in cash to just toss around. Liquidity seems to be a core problem of the Trump organization right now...

I think you misread that; they're saying that the Saudis / whoever would be giving Trump a billion dollars for his influence, not that Trump would give it to someone else.

How much sway Trump still has in the Republican party is very much still an open question. But it looks to me like the answer is going to be "quite a lot".

nereo

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7286 on: January 22, 2021, 12:46:52 PM »
A billion dollars might be cheap ( though I refute that) - though he doesn’t seem to have anywhere that amount in cash to just toss around. Liquidity seems to be a core problem of the Trump organization right now...

I think you misread that; they're saying that the Saudis / whoever would be giving Trump a billion dollars for his influence, not that Trump would give it to someone else.

How much sway Trump still has in the Republican party is very much still an open question. But it looks to me like the answer is going to be "quite a lot".
As. Thanks for the clarification.

As talltexan said, we will know more of the extent of Trump’s influence in 2022

achvfi

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7287 on: January 22, 2021, 12:47:31 PM »
Given the outcome of both senate elections, would his support still be seen as an asset?

A billion dollars might be cheap ( though I refute that) - though he doesn’t seem to have anywhere that amount in cash to just toss around. Liquidity seems to be a core problem of the Trump organization right now...
He is still an big asset in many circles. I think we should stop underestimating him by now.

World beyond is crazier place when nations are involved in equation, there are no rules to be bound by.

More speculation here. What's to say money troubles are façade and he is already been paid up buku bucks waiting for him to safely access them by Saudis and Qataris at right time. For example during his presidency there were instances where Qataris were in big trouble one day, they were squeezed further by trump first and then trump-Kushner brokered a deal to get them out of the situation. Trump got paid some way. Same goes with Saudis.

Check this out for instance.
https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2019/02/qatar-666-5th-ave-jared-kushner


nereo

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7288 on: January 22, 2021, 01:17:50 PM »
Given the outcome of both senate elections, would his support still be seen as an asset?

A billion dollars might be cheap ( though I refute that) - though he doesn’t seem to have anywhere that amount in cash to just toss around. Liquidity seems to be a core problem of the Trump organization right now...
He is still an big asset in many circles. I think we should stop underestimating him by now.

World beyond is crazier place when nations are involved in equation, there are no rules to be bound by.

More speculation here. What's to say money troubles are façade and he is already been paid up buku bucks waiting for him to safely access them by Saudis and Qataris at right time. For example during his presidency there were instances where Qataris were in big trouble one day, they were squeezed further by trump first and then trump-Kushner brokered a deal to get them out of the situation. Trump got paid some way. Same goes with Saudis.

Check this out for instance.
https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2019/02/qatar-666-5th-ave-jared-kushner

So under this theory, Trump is breaking numerous laws to make his properties seem like they are making money, and to make him appear to be a failing businessman?  What’s the angle here?
There’s precious little to indicate he is doing well, financially, and just a steady stream of reports showing the contrary. 

The Kushner/Trump progress in the middle-east is one of the least substantive things to come out of this administration. There’s a reason why even conservative media stopped talking about it soon after it was announced.

achvfi

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7289 on: January 22, 2021, 01:46:40 PM »
So under this theory, Trump is breaking numerous laws to make his properties seem like they are making money, and to make him appear to be a failing businessman?  What’s the angle here?
There’s precious little to indicate he is doing well, financially, and just a steady stream of reports showing the contrary. 

The Kushner/Trump progress in the middle-east is one of the least substantive things to come out of this administration. There’s a reason why even conservative media stopped talking about it soon after it was announced.
I think you misunderstand what I am saying. I am not trying connect his business failures to an elaborate plot. Him being a bad business man is why his businesses are failing.

I am talking about quid pro quo corruption. I am saying not to underestimate how far he can go to get ahead.

And also I am not talking about Trump/Kushner middle-east peace brokering. That is entirely different issue.

partgypsy

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7290 on: January 23, 2021, 06:06:24 PM »
Maybe shutting down this thread is premature. Looked like he was up for using the DOJ to throw out election results.

https://www.wral.com/trump-and-justice-department-lawyer-said-to-have-plotted-to-oust-acting-attorney-general/19486725/

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7291 on: January 23, 2021, 07:58:44 PM »
Maybe shutting down this thread is premature. Looked like he was up for using the DOJ to throw out election results.

https://www.wral.com/trump-and-justice-department-lawyer-said-to-have-plotted-to-oust-acting-attorney-general/19486725/

I think we are going to be finding out about outrageous things Trump did as president for some time to come.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7292 on: January 23, 2021, 09:26:53 PM »

nereo

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7293 on: January 24, 2021, 04:45:43 AM »
He’s still at it. Throw him in jail already ...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trump-republican-split/2021/01/23/d7dc253e-5cbc-11eb-8bcf-3877871c819d_story.html

Yup Trump is pushing his own “MAGA Party” to split from the GOP, most immediately to cajole wavering republicans in the senate (e.g. Collins) to support him during the impeachment trial.

Now that he’s lost he just wants to burn everything down.  Which his supporters seem more than happy to do.  The GOP’s “big tent” is getting smaller, bit by bit.

Travis

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7294 on: January 24, 2021, 05:06:49 AM »
He’s still at it. Throw him in jail already ...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trump-republican-split/2021/01/23/d7dc253e-5cbc-11eb-8bcf-3877871c819d_story.html

Yup Trump is pushing his own “MAGA Party” to split from the GOP, most immediately to cajole wavering republicans in the senate (e.g. Collins) to support him during the impeachment trial.

Now that he’s lost he just wants to burn everything down.  Which his supporters seem more than happy to do.  The GOP’s “big tent” is getting smaller, bit by bit.

All while Graham insists that if the Party implodes it'll be because McConnell supports impeachment.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7295 on: January 24, 2021, 08:26:06 AM »
I'm confused. Is he threatening to create his own party if they convict him and prevent him from holding office? Is he just doing it for spite? If they don't convict him he's just going to run again as republican? He's already proven he can't win an election though, even with the full backing of the GOP. 

Sounds like a lose lose situation for the GOP.  Sweet karma.

wenchsenior

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7296 on: January 24, 2021, 10:24:51 AM »
Maybe shutting down this thread is premature. Looked like he was up for using the DOJ to throw out election results.

https://www.wral.com/trump-and-justice-department-lawyer-said-to-have-plotted-to-oust-acting-attorney-general/19486725/

I suspect shutting this thread down will be premature until he finally dies.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7297 on: January 24, 2021, 10:36:56 AM »
I'm confused. Is he threatening to create his own party if they convict him and prevent him from holding office? Is he just doing it for spite? If they don't convict him he's just going to run again as republican? He's already proven he can't win an election though, even with the full backing of the GOP. 

Sounds like a lose lose situation for the GOP.  Sweet karma.




That sounds like an incentive for the GOP to happily Impeach him, so he'll never be able to run for office again.  Right?

ixtap

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7298 on: January 24, 2021, 10:39:39 AM »
I'm confused. Is he threatening to create his own party if they convict him and prevent him from holding office? Is he just doing it for spite? If they don't convict him he's just going to run again as republican? He's already proven he can't win an election though, even with the full backing of the GOP. 

Sounds like a lose lose situation for the GOP.  Sweet karma.




That sounds like an incentive for the GOP to happily Impeach him, so he'll never be able to run for office again.  Right?

It depends on whether you want to capitalize on his momentum or run a functioning democracy.

nereo

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #7299 on: January 24, 2021, 11:01:59 AM »
I'm confused. Is he threatening to create his own party if they convict him and prevent him from holding office? Is he just doing it for spite? If they don't convict him he's just going to run again as republican? He's already proven he can't win an election though, even with the full backing of the GOP. 

Sounds like a lose lose situation for the GOP.  Sweet karma.

He’s threatening to start his own party specifically to challenge any GOP legislator who votes for impeachment in the primaries.  It’s a political threat - vote against me and I will ensure you lose your next primary.

It seems he wants to play the role of spoiler even more than he wants to be a ‘kingmaker’.  It’s becoming a key part of his defense (i.e. “if you can’t defend your actions, threaten/scare the Jury”).  Why he is so worried about losing when he’s no longer in office is the interesting question - some think it’s so that he can run again in 2024.  I personally think it has more to do with not losing the $215k guaranteed Presidential stipend plus the additional $500k+ he can use for his post-presidential office expenses, which will almost certainly be at one of the Trump Organization properties (thereby giving him perpetual taxpayer income).