Author Topic: Trump outrage of the day  (Read 156359 times)

OtherJen

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2862
  • Location: Metro Detroit
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1100 on: February 18, 2020, 01:45:13 PM »
Heh, I would have said the chief characteristics were general partisanship and divisive communications.   
Same thing.

Old Drumpf joking about having a third term is like when Dubya said, "If this were a dictatorship it would be a heck of a lot easier, there's no question about it." And yet somehow he left office.

Being unable to distinguish humour from reality, and being oblivious to irony, are also characteristic of American culture. Peoples who take themselves very very seriously tend to have higher rates of homicide and trying to blow up other countries. That's why Germans, Arabs and Americans have started so many wars.


Calm down.

Come on. Do you truly believe, assuming Trump loses the election, he’ll accept the results and admit defeat? The same guy who claimed millions of votes in 2016 were fake, and were the only reason he lost the popular vote? The same guy who then opened a federal investigation over that ridiculous claim. Of course you don’t. No sensible human thinks Trump will behave this way. “Both sides”ism is plain nihilism at this point. Be better.

Be best?

(Sorry, couldn't help myself.)

Norioch

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 283
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1101 on: February 18, 2020, 02:19:09 PM »
I now think the more likely motivation for all the pardons today is just to grab headlines, to distract from other revelations coming to light right now. This book was just released today:

Dark Towers: Deutsche Bank, Donald Trump, and an Epic Trail of Destruction

Doing something big and asinine as a distraction is perfectly in line with Trump's MO.

OtherJen

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2862
  • Location: Metro Detroit
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1102 on: February 18, 2020, 02:31:31 PM »
I now think the more likely motivation for all the pardons today is just to grab headlines, to distract from other revelations coming to light right now. This book was just released today:

Dark Towers: Deutsche Bank, Donald Trump, and an Epic Trail of Destruction

Doing something big and asinine as a distraction is perfectly in line with Trump's MO.

Yeah, probably. I like the title of NY Times' book review: ‘What the Hell Are We Doing Lending Money to a Guy Like This?’

Quote
Then there was client Trump. Enrich’s portrait isn’t new, but it makes for painful reading: the smooth persuasions, the obsequious flatteries, the lying about his net worth to garner loans for office buildings, resorts, casinos.

When Deutsche’s real estate team cut off Trump, private banking opened the spigot. When a loan came due, Trump had “no intention” of repaying, as if the rules for him were different. Deutsche’s brass was so in thrall to Trump’s celebrity, and so eager to expand in America, one division lent $48 million to cancel the debt on a Chicago skyscraper — a debt Trump had defaulted on with another wing of the same bank. They bought his pitch as voters would. In what could serve as a requiem for the country’s lost innocence, the general counsel said, “What the hell are we doing lending money to a guy like this?”

I mean, Trump was stiffing contractors and lying about his finances for literally decades. This was all over the news. I heard about it as a teenager in the 90s, and I didn't live anywhere near NYC. Why do so many people overlook this guy's absolute lack of business ethics and experience in any form of elected government, including on the board of directors of literally any corporation? (Seriously, I've served on more boards than he has.)

Norioch

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 283
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1103 on: February 18, 2020, 02:33:32 PM »
He portrayed a successful businessman on a reality TV show, so he must be a successful businessman. Because everything on reality TV is real. I mean, come on, "reality" is right there in the name.

scottish

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1612
  • Location: Ottawa
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1104 on: February 18, 2020, 04:56:40 PM »
Yeah, the Deutsche Bank story is just unbelievable enough to be real.    They stopped lending him money for a few years after he sued them to try and get out of a loan.    You could make this stuff up, but nobody would believe you.

If Bloomberg wins the blue nomination we can watch a TV businessman campaign against a real businessman.   A TV billionaire against a real billionaire.    It will be excellent drama for us foreigners.

GuitarStv

  • Senior Mustachian
  • ********
  • Posts: 15594
  • Age: 38
  • Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1105 on: February 18, 2020, 05:05:12 PM »
Trump's been president for quite a while . . . plenty of time and opportunity to become a real billionaire.  His children have all certainly been enriched by the presidency.

MasterStache

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2426
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1106 on: February 18, 2020, 05:12:16 PM »
He portrayed a successful businessman on a reality TV show, so he must be a successful businessman. Because everything on reality TV is real. I mean, come on, "reality" is right there in the name.

To be fair, doesn't Faux news, and the Conservatives in general, regularly tout the ratings of Faux news? I've always found that sadly funny. "Hey our base watches more TV than any other political base out there. Take that!" Umm ok. Winning I guess.

Davnasty

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2448
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1107 on: February 18, 2020, 05:32:25 PM »
He portrayed a successful businessman on a reality TV show, so he must be a successful businessman. Because everything on reality TV is real. I mean, come on, "reality" is right there in the name.

To be fair, doesn't Faux news, and the Conservatives in general, regularly tout the ratings of Faux news? I've always found that sadly funny. "Hey our base watches more TV than any other political base out there. Take that!" Umm ok. Winning I guess.

Has anyone ever come across data on how much reality TV Trump supporters watch vs everyone else?

That could be interesting.

Kris

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 5193
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1108 on: February 18, 2020, 05:38:47 PM »
He portrayed a successful businessman on a reality TV show, so he must be a successful businessman. Because everything on reality TV is real. I mean, come on, "reality" is right there in the name.

To be fair, doesn't Faux news, and the Conservatives in general, regularly tout the ratings of Faux news? I've always found that sadly funny. "Hey our base watches more TV than any other political base out there. Take that!" Umm ok. Winning I guess.

Has anyone ever come across data on how much reality TV Trump supporters watch vs everyone else?

That could be interesting.

No, but there are some observable patterns among Trump supporters regarding the amount and type of TV they watch.

http://theconversation.com/what-the-favorite-tv-shows-of-trump-supporters-can-tell-us-about-his-appeal-63433

GreenEggs

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1004
  • Location: Here & There
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1109 on: February 18, 2020, 08:07:50 PM »
Trump's been president for quite a while . . . plenty of time and opportunity to become a real billionaire.  His children have all certainly been enriched by the presidency.


But we'll never know how much he owed Putin. 

ysette9

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6477
  • Location: Bay Area, CA
    • The Best Is Yet To Come
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1110 on: February 18, 2020, 10:36:27 PM »
Jim Wright is an amazing essayist, and I think he really knocked it out of the park with this one: https://www.stonekettle.com/2020/02/those-who-forget-history.htmlg

The link doesn't work for me. "Sorry, the page you were looking for in this blog does not exist."

http://www.stonekettle.com/2020/02/those-who-forget-history.html  <- There was an extra g in the first link
That was a good read

Cool Friend

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 356
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1111 on: February 19, 2020, 06:57:02 AM »
Quote
Let us pause for a moment to take stock of this vision of government. It is a state in which the legislature can neither oversee the executive branch nor pass laws that constrain it. A state in which legal requests for government records on those associated with the political opposition are satisfied immediately, and such requests related to the sitting executive are denied wholesale. It is a system in which the executive can be neither investigated for criminal activity nor removed by the legislature for breaking the law. It is a government in which only the regime party may make enforceable demands, and where the opposition party may compete in elections, but only against the efforts of federal law enforcement to marginalize them for their opposition to the president. It is a vision of government in which members of the civil service may break the law on the leader’s behalf, but commit an unforgivable crime should they reveal such malfeasance to the public.

Were it in any other nation, how would you describe a government that functions this way?

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/02/trump-regime/606682/

GuitarStv

  • Senior Mustachian
  • ********
  • Posts: 15594
  • Age: 38
  • Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1112 on: February 19, 2020, 08:15:58 AM »
Trump's been president for quite a while . . . plenty of time and opportunity to become a real billionaire.  His children have all certainly been enriched by the presidency.


But we'll never know how much he owed Putin.

Owed?  Paid in full by now - Putin got his money's worth.

PathtoFIRE

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 748
  • Age: 40
  • Location: Dallas
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1113 on: February 19, 2020, 10:23:12 AM »
Owed?  Paid in full by now - Putin got his money's worth.

Yeah, that's not the way mobsters work. He's in for the rest of his life, at least until he accidentally falls out of a tall building.

former player

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 5287
  • Location: Avalon
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1114 on: February 19, 2020, 12:26:29 PM »

A witness in Julian Assange's extradition hearing will claim President Donald Trump offered the Wikileaks founder a pardon if he said Russia was not involved in leaking emails during the US election.

His barrister, Edward Fitzgerald QC, told the court there was evidence alleging that former US Republican Congressman Dana Rohrabacher made the pardon offer.  Mr Rohrabacher visited the Ecuadorian embassy in August 2017, where Mr Assange was staying, he said.  Mr Fitzgerald said a statement from Assange's lawyer Jennifer Robinson shows "Mr Rohrabacher going to see Mr Assange and saying, on instructions from the president, he was offering a pardon or some other way out, if Mr Assange... said Russia had nothing to do with the DNC leaks."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-51566470

nereo

  • Senior Mustachian
  • ********
  • Posts: 12510
  • Location: Just south of Canada
    • Here's how you can support science today:
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1115 on: February 19, 2020, 12:37:39 PM »

A witness in Julian Assange's extradition hearing will claim President Donald Trump offered the Wikileaks founder a pardon if he said Russia was not involved in leaking emails during the US election.

His barrister, Edward Fitzgerald QC, told the court there was evidence alleging that former US Republican Congressman Dana Rohrabacher made the pardon offer.  Mr Rohrabacher visited the Ecuadorian embassy in August 2017, where Mr Assange was staying, he said.  Mr Fitzgerald said a statement from Assange's lawyer Jennifer Robinson shows "Mr Rohrabacher going to see Mr Assange and saying, on instructions from the president, he was offering a pardon or some other way out, if Mr Assange... said Russia had nothing to do with the DNC leaks."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-51566470

Since his acquittal, Trump has revamped efforts to reframe Russia’s involvement in the 2016 election. It seems clear that he wants the historical narrative to shift away from everything that was concluded by our intelligence agencies and documented in the Mueller report.

GuitarStv

  • Senior Mustachian
  • ********
  • Posts: 15594
  • Age: 38
  • Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1116 on: February 19, 2020, 12:39:18 PM »

A witness in Julian Assange's extradition hearing will claim President Donald Trump offered the Wikileaks founder a pardon if he said Russia was not involved in leaking emails during the US election.

His barrister, Edward Fitzgerald QC, told the court there was evidence alleging that former US Republican Congressman Dana Rohrabacher made the pardon offer.  Mr Rohrabacher visited the Ecuadorian embassy in August 2017, where Mr Assange was staying, he said.  Mr Fitzgerald said a statement from Assange's lawyer Jennifer Robinson shows "Mr Rohrabacher going to see Mr Assange and saying, on instructions from the president, he was offering a pardon or some other way out, if Mr Assange... said Russia had nothing to do with the DNC leaks."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-51566470

Sounds like another 'perfect phone call'.

Norioch

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 283
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1117 on: February 19, 2020, 03:47:13 PM »
Trump has ousted the Pentagon’s top policy official who certified last year that Ukraine had made enough anti-corruption progress to justify release of congressionally authorized aid to Kyiv in its conflict against Russian-backed separatists. John Rood resigned Wednesday.

Trump ousts top defense official who certified Ukraine aid

aetheldrea

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 112
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1118 on: February 19, 2020, 09:34:33 PM »
There's another tic I notice among Trump defenders:

Trump does XXXX.

TD: "Well, it's legal, he has that power"

Me: "Great, but it's a bad policy"

TD: "Well, Presidents can do that for any reason or no reason"

Me: "But it's bad policy"
I’ve had many similar conversations.
TD: he can legally do that
Me: ok, butshould he do that?
TD: it’s legal!
Me: that wasn’t my question
TD: as long as it’s legal I don’t see why not
Me: oh really? So legality is the only standard for whether a president should do something?
This is hardly limited to Trump defenders. Joe Biden says that his son “working” for a Ukrainian corporation was perfectly legal and he did nothing wrong. The Trumplicans in Congress know there’s a big difference between those statements and are itching to “investigate” the Bidens and highlight those differences, in my opinion. The hypocrites.

nereo

  • Senior Mustachian
  • ********
  • Posts: 12510
  • Location: Just south of Canada
    • Here's how you can support science today:
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1119 on: February 20, 2020, 06:12:06 AM »
There's another tic I notice among Trump defenders:

Trump does XXXX.

TD: "Well, it's legal, he has that power"

Me: "Great, but it's a bad policy"

TD: "Well, Presidents can do that for any reason or no reason"

Me: "But it's bad policy"
I’ve had many similar conversations.
TD: he can legally do that
Me: ok, butshould he do that?
TD: it’s legal!
Me: that wasn’t my question
TD: as long as it’s legal I don’t see why not
Me: oh really? So legality is the only standard for whether a president should do something?
This is hardly limited to Trump defenders. Joe Biden says that his son “working” for a Ukrainian corporation was perfectly legal and he did nothing wrong. The Trumplicans in Congress know there’s a big difference between those statements and are itching to “investigate” the Bidens and highlight those differences, in my opinion. The hypocrites.

Explain to me how Hunter Biden - who is not a government employee in any way and who’s father is not currently in office - is even remotely comparable to POTUS Donald Trump.

This is ‘whataboutism’ at it’s most extreme absurdity.  Trump holds actual power, and is wielding that power in ethically dubious ways.  Hunter Biden does not.  His father would like to be POTUS next year, but is currently a private citizen (and had limited actual power as the former VP).

Beyond those obvious facts, the abusive actions of one person never excuse the more extreme actions of another. Trump’s corruption is not ok if other people are also trying to use their family name for political or monetary favor.

JLee

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6010
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1120 on: February 20, 2020, 07:58:08 AM »
There's another tic I notice among Trump defenders:

Trump does XXXX.

TD: "Well, it's legal, he has that power"

Me: "Great, but it's a bad policy"

TD: "Well, Presidents can do that for any reason or no reason"

Me: "But it's bad policy"
I’ve had many similar conversations.
TD: he can legally do that
Me: ok, butshould he do that?
TD: it’s legal!
Me: that wasn’t my question
TD: as long as it’s legal I don’t see why not
Me: oh really? So legality is the only standard for whether a president should do something?
This is hardly limited to Trump defenders. Joe Biden says that his son “working” for a Ukrainian corporation was perfectly legal and he did nothing wrong. The Trumplicans in Congress know there’s a big difference between those statements and are itching to “investigate” the Bidens and highlight those differences, in my opinion. The hypocrites.

Most of the complaints I hear are that Hunter 'wasn't qualified', not specifically that it was a Ukrainian corporation. Why is nobody concerned about Biden "working" on the board of Amtrak in 2006?

bacchi

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 4532
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1121 on: February 20, 2020, 09:46:22 AM »
Most of the complaints I hear are that Hunter 'wasn't qualified', not specifically that it was a Ukrainian corporation. Why is nobody concerned about Biden "working" on the board of Amtrak in 2006?

Why wasn't anyone concerned about Hunter and his "work" in 2017? The evidence would have been that much fresher!

MKinVA

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 327
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1122 on: February 20, 2020, 12:39:16 PM »
JLee: "Most of the complaints I hear are that Hunter 'wasn't qualified', not specifically that it was a Ukrainian corporation. Why is nobody concerned about Biden "working" on the board of Amtrak in 2006?"

Have you ever looked at the people serving on corporate boards in this country? That is one of the biggest problems with corporations getting away with murder. They put friends and family on boards and then behave badly and there is no one to say boo. Example in Virginia: Dominion Energy, then Dominion Resources, our power company put a state senator on the board (yup, the power company is overseen by the state legislature) who was an opthamologist. Closest he ever got to electrical energy was flicking a light switch. After he retired from the Senate, he left the board with a stock options worth $18 million (to be purchased at 1/2 price). He was replaced on the board with the wife of a congressman (yup, a sitting congressman). Her background held nothing that would recommend her for any position much less board member of a major regional and international power company.

Not to hijack the thread, but this Biden thing is ridiculous for any of them to use as a sword. It is absolutely outrageous the number of sweetheart positions politicians have given their kids, spouses, ex-wives, and lovers. All of it should be restricted.

https://www.businessinsider.com/anthony-kennedy-son-loaned-president-trump-over-a-billion-dollars-2018-6

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2019/02/william-barr-son-in-law-white-house

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/mcconnell-dismisses-report-that-his-wife-transportation-secretary-elaine-chao-steered-funds-to-kentucky/2019/06/11/79bba63e-8c78-11e9-adf3-f70f78c156e8_story.html

OtherJen

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2862
  • Location: Metro Detroit
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1123 on: February 20, 2020, 02:36:41 PM »
^^^This.

And let's add Jared Kushner and Ivanka Trump, both "senior White House advisors," while we're discussing nepotism and sweetheart positions. But then, if there's one area where the current president truly excels, it is in projecting his own flaws onto others. Hence the freak-out about Hunter Biden.

Just Joe

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3639
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1124 on: February 20, 2020, 03:00:33 PM »
^^^This.

And let's add Jared Kushner and Ivanka Trump, both "senior White House advisors," while we're discussing nepotism and sweetheart positions. But then, if there's one area where the current president truly excels, it is in projecting his own flaws onto others. Hence the freak-out about Hunter Biden.

Doesn't some of this count as the "swamp" that Trump claimed he would drain??? ;)

Glenstache

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2481
  • Location: Seattle!
  • Target FI date 2027 (maybe?)
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1125 on: February 20, 2020, 03:09:53 PM »

MasterStache

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2426
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1126 on: February 20, 2020, 03:46:54 PM »
This is my surprised face:
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/20/us/politics/russian-interference-trump-democrats.html

"During the briefing to the House Intelligence Committee, Mr. Trump’s allies challenged the conclusions, arguing that Mr. Trump has been tough on Russia and strengthened European security. Some intelligence officials viewed the briefing as a tactical error, saying that had the official who delivered the conclusion spoken less pointedly or left it out, they would have avoided angering the Republicans."

ysette9

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6477
  • Location: Bay Area, CA
    • The Best Is Yet To Come
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1127 on: February 20, 2020, 03:47:23 PM »
If you don’t want to get yelled at for doing something that looks bad, then don’t do something that looks bad.

Glenstache

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2481
  • Location: Seattle!
  • Target FI date 2027 (maybe?)
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1128 on: February 20, 2020, 03:58:15 PM »
This is my surprised face:
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/20/us/politics/russian-interference-trump-democrats.html

"During the briefing to the House Intelligence Committee, Mr. Trump’s allies challenged the conclusions, arguing that Mr. Trump has been tough on Russia and strengthened European security. Some intelligence officials viewed the briefing as a tactical error, saying that had the official who delivered the conclusion spoken less pointedly or left it out, they would have avoided angering the Republicans."
Funny how they don't like it when reality doesn't line up with the talking points.

DaMa

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 434
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1129 on: February 20, 2020, 04:41:34 PM »
If a Ukrainian company wanted to hire me to do nothing just because they liked my last name, I'd say "Hell, yeah!" And laugh all the way to the bank.

Lots of companies put people on their boards due to nothing more than name recognition.  What is it that Hunter Biden did that was illegal while on that board?   

ixtap

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1966
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1130 on: February 20, 2020, 04:46:12 PM »
^^^This.

And let's add Jared Kushner and Ivanka Trump, both "senior White House advisors," while we're discussing nepotism and sweetheart positions. But then, if there's one area where the current president truly excels, it is in projecting his own flaws onto others. Hence the freak-out about Hunter Biden.

Doesn't some of this count as the "swamp" that Trump claimed he would drain??? ;)

I am told that all that doesn't matter because the economy is booming.

MasterStache

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2426
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1131 on: February 20, 2020, 05:16:32 PM »
If a Ukrainian company wanted to hire me to do nothing just because they liked my last name, I'd say "Hell, yeah!" And laugh all the way to the bank.

Lots of companies put people on their boards due to nothing more than name recognition.  What is it that Hunter Biden did that was illegal while on that board?

Unless you are a Dem and running for President. Then it's outright corruption.

nereo

  • Senior Mustachian
  • ********
  • Posts: 12510
  • Location: Just south of Canada
    • Here's how you can support science today:
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1132 on: February 20, 2020, 05:29:46 PM »
Apparently “Phase One” of the new trade deal struck with China is already falling way short...

Quote
U.S. Department of Agriculture chief economist Robert Johansson projected that agricultural exports to China would reach roughly $14 billion in the year that ends Sept. 30, a $4 billion increase from one year ago.
But that amount would still fall far short of what White House officials said would take place based on the recently announced “Phase One” trade deal with Chinese leaders. White House officials have said agricultural exports to China would be between $40 billion and $50 billion in each of the next two years. Last year, when he was promising the trade deal would lead to a huge increase in purchases, Trump told farmers to buy “more land” and “bigger tractors.”

So this isn’t the biggest trade deal with China ever?  I’m Shocked!

LennStar

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1751
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1133 on: February 21, 2020, 09:39:15 AM »
^^^This.

And let's add Jared Kushner and Ivanka Trump, both "senior White House advisors," while we're discussing nepotism and sweetheart positions. But then, if there's one area where the current president truly excels, it is in projecting his own flaws onto others. Hence the freak-out about Hunter Biden.

Doesn't some of this count as the "swamp" that Trump claimed he would drain??? ;)

I once put it like this:
Trump is draining the swamp by putting the biggest frogs in there he can find and such making the water overflow.

scottish

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1612
  • Location: Ottawa
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1134 on: February 21, 2020, 03:44:29 PM »
If a Ukrainian company wanted to hire me to do nothing just because they liked my last name, I'd say "Hell, yeah!" And laugh all the way to the bank.

Lots of companies put people on their boards due to nothing more than name recognition.  What is it that Hunter Biden did that was illegal while on that board?

Hunter Biden didn't do anything illegal.   Arguably, the only thing he did that was unethical was taking a job that he wasn't qualified for.

The company that hired him was unethical in trying to purchase influence with Joe Biden by hiring his son.

former player

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 5287
  • Location: Avalon
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1135 on: February 21, 2020, 04:04:21 PM »
If a Ukrainian company wanted to hire me to do nothing just because they liked my last name, I'd say "Hell, yeah!" And laugh all the way to the bank.

Lots of companies put people on their boards due to nothing more than name recognition.  What is it that Hunter Biden did that was illegal while on that board?

Hunter Biden didn't do anything illegal.   Arguably, the only thing he did that was unethical was taking a job that he wasn't qualified for.

The company that hired him was unethical in trying to purchase influence with Joe Biden by hiring his son.
I'm not even sure that that's what Burisma were doing.  Hunter Biden was put on the board at the same time as Kwaśniewski (former President of Poland).  To me it looks more like a general PR exercise than a targeted attempt to corrupt Joe Biden.

nereo

  • Senior Mustachian
  • ********
  • Posts: 12510
  • Location: Just south of Canada
    • Here's how you can support science today:
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1136 on: February 21, 2020, 05:12:21 PM »
If a Ukrainian company wanted to hire me to do nothing just because they liked my last name, I'd say "Hell, yeah!" And laugh all the way to the bank.

Lots of companies put people on their boards due to nothing more than name recognition.  What is it that Hunter Biden did that was illegal while on that board?

Hunter Biden didn't do anything illegal.   Arguably, the only thing he did that was unethical was taking a job that he wasn't qualified for.

The company that hired him was unethical in trying to purchase influence with Joe Biden by hiring his son.
I'm not even sure that that's what Burisma were doing.  Hunter Biden was put on the board at the same time as Kwaśniewski (former President of Poland).  To me it looks more like a general PR exercise than a targeted attempt to corrupt Joe Biden.

That’s the root of the disagreement.  Viewed one way putting someone on your board is a PR gesture.  Looked at another way it’s cronyism. This isn’t limited to Ukraine.

Regardless, Hunter Biden wasn’t a public official, and neither was his father. If this were a legitimate complaint by the GOP they would have been placated by his leaving the board before the primaries even got started. Oh, and they’d insist that Eric and Don Jr. would stop pursuing deals in foreign countries leveraging the Trump brand.

GreenEggs

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1004
  • Location: Here & There
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1137 on: February 26, 2020, 11:06:11 PM »
DW has been following Heather Cox Richardson for a few months & I thought I'd share the link to her daily letters, in case you need more political things to read.  ;)


https://heathercoxrichardson.substack.com/




DaMa

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 434
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1138 on: February 27, 2020, 04:37:39 AM »
DW has been following Heather Cox Richardson for a few months & I thought I'd share the link to her daily letters, in case you need more political things to read.  ;)


https://heathercoxrichardson.substack.com/

I follow her on facebook.  I'm a history buff, so I love her historical perspective.

OtherJen

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2862
  • Location: Metro Detroit
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1139 on: February 27, 2020, 06:22:34 AM »
So by putting Pence in charge of the coronavirus response, is Trump setting him up as the fall guy or is it a big middle finger to all US residents? (I guess it could be both.)

I mean, Pence is the guy who massively bungled health services while governing Indiana, leading to a massive HIV outbreak, and Trump has cut both FEMA funding and the infectious disease control program implemented by Obama (and fired the experts). I wonder if the national approach to an outbreak will mainly involve thoughts and prayers. Seems logical.

nereo

  • Senior Mustachian
  • ********
  • Posts: 12510
  • Location: Just south of Canada
    • Here's how you can support science today:
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1140 on: February 27, 2020, 06:33:27 AM »
Pence is the clear scape-goat.  If this becomes a widespread epidemic throughout the US, Trump has already established how he will escape blame.  If this tapers off with only a few thousand cases on domestic soil Trump will crow about how he put “the best people” together to “stop this thing”.

What struck me last night listening to his public briefing was how Trump couldn’t resist the urge to pick on Democrats, single out Nancy Peolsi and at one point blame the stock market dip on fears that a Democrat might win the WH, rather than the glaringly obvious fear of iwhat COVID-19 may do to disrupt global and domestic markets.

Whether you agree or disagree with this politics, during moments of national sorry or anxiety, Obama, W., Clinton, Bush Sr., Reagan were all adept at giving a unifying speech about how this transcends politics and we are all Americans and can all pull together...  Trump can never resist a fight though, and wont’ miss an opportunity to use the bully pulpit, regardless of the circumstances.

talltexan

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3277
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1141 on: February 27, 2020, 09:41:39 AM »
Pence can be easily replaced on the ticket by either Pompeo or Nikki Haley.

nereo

  • Senior Mustachian
  • ********
  • Posts: 12510
  • Location: Just south of Canada
    • Here's how you can support science today:
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1142 on: February 27, 2020, 09:46:59 AM »
Pence can be easily replaced on the ticket by either Pompeo or Nikki Haley.

I could be wrong, but I don't see Haley jumping on the ticket.  She successfully extracted herself from this administration without tarnishing her reputation - something very few other people can say.  During her tenure in this administration she never tied herself too closely with this POTUS, adn even managed to publicly disagree with his more racist tweets without being dragged into the mud herself.

Haley also left on her own terms, and wasn't pushed out.  Given her age (48) I'm guessing she's deeply considered her political future and has decided that tying herself to Trump isn't in her long-term best interest. 

Kris

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 5193
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1143 on: February 27, 2020, 09:54:08 AM »
Pence can be easily replaced on the ticket by either Pompeo or Nikki Haley.

I could be wrong, but I don't see Haley jumping on the ticket.  She successfully extracted herself from this administration without tarnishing her reputation - something very few other people can say.  During her tenure in this administration she never tied herself too closely with this POTUS, adn even managed to publicly disagree with his more racist tweets without being dragged into the mud herself.

Haley also left on her own terms, and wasn't pushed out.  Given her age (48) I'm guessing she's deeply considered her political future and has decided that tying herself to Trump isn't in her long-term best interest.

I agree. I think she's smarter and more calculating than that (calculating not meant in a particularly negative way... just that she's doing her political calculus).

OtherJen

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2862
  • Location: Metro Detroit
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1144 on: February 27, 2020, 10:13:14 AM »
Pence can be easily replaced on the ticket by either Pompeo or Nikki Haley.

I could be wrong, but I don't see Haley jumping on the ticket.  She successfully extracted herself from this administration without tarnishing her reputation - something very few other people can say.  During her tenure in this administration she never tied herself too closely with this POTUS, adn even managed to publicly disagree with his more racist tweets without being dragged into the mud herself.

Haley also left on her own terms, and wasn't pushed out.  Given her age (48) I'm guessing she's deeply considered her political future and has decided that tying herself to Trump isn't in her long-term best interest.

I agree. I think she's smarter and more calculating than that (calculating not meant in a particularly negative way... just that she's doing her political calculus).

Seconded. He won't select anyone with anything less then absolute fealty. I wonder if Pence is being set up as the fall guy because he's voiced concerns behind the scenes. I don't like Pence at all, but (unlike Trump) he does have prior experience as a high-level elected official and with a badly handled infectious disease outbreak. He may have at least learned from that enormous error, but I doubt Trump is willing to listen. He would probably view it as a challenge to his absolute authority.

Fireball

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 275
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1145 on: February 27, 2020, 10:37:59 AM »
Pence is the clear scape-goat.  If this becomes a widespread epidemic throughout the US, Trump has already established how he will escape blame.  If this tapers off with only a few thousand cases on domestic soil Trump will crow about how he put “the best people” together to “stop this thing”.

Agree 100%.  I'm just not sure why they would pick Pence as the scapegoat and not just loudly appoint the HHS director in charge of all things Coronavirus. Maybe Azar doesn't have enough name recognition for the blame to stick.

Kris

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 5193
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1146 on: February 27, 2020, 10:38:39 AM »
Pence can be easily replaced on the ticket by either Pompeo or Nikki Haley.

I could be wrong, but I don't see Haley jumping on the ticket.  She successfully extracted herself from this administration without tarnishing her reputation - something very few other people can say.  During her tenure in this administration she never tied herself too closely with this POTUS, adn even managed to publicly disagree with his more racist tweets without being dragged into the mud herself.

Haley also left on her own terms, and wasn't pushed out.  Given her age (48) I'm guessing she's deeply considered her political future and has decided that tying herself to Trump isn't in her long-term best interest.

I agree. I think she's smarter and more calculating than that (calculating not meant in a particularly negative way... just that she's doing her political calculus).

Seconded. He won't select anyone with anything less then absolute fealty. I wonder if Pence is being set up as the fall guy because he's voiced concerns behind the scenes. I don't like Pence at all, but (unlike Trump) he does have prior experience as a high-level elected official and with a badly handled infectious disease outbreak. He may have at least learned from that enormous error, but I doubt Trump is willing to listen. He would probably view it as a challenge to his absolute authority.

Yeah, that could be. My main thought about why Trump shunted this off on Pence is that discussions behind the scenes with his advisors have made him dimly aware that this might not go very well. So since there's a good chance of negative press, he's setting things up so that he can say, "none of this is my fault, it's Pence's".

OtherJen

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2862
  • Location: Metro Detroit
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1147 on: February 27, 2020, 10:47:14 AM »
Pence can be easily replaced on the ticket by either Pompeo or Nikki Haley.

I could be wrong, but I don't see Haley jumping on the ticket.  She successfully extracted herself from this administration without tarnishing her reputation - something very few other people can say.  During her tenure in this administration she never tied herself too closely with this POTUS, adn even managed to publicly disagree with his more racist tweets without being dragged into the mud herself.

Haley also left on her own terms, and wasn't pushed out.  Given her age (48) I'm guessing she's deeply considered her political future and has decided that tying herself to Trump isn't in her long-term best interest.

I agree. I think she's smarter and more calculating than that (calculating not meant in a particularly negative way... just that she's doing her political calculus).

Seconded. He won't select anyone with anything less then absolute fealty. I wonder if Pence is being set up as the fall guy because he's voiced concerns behind the scenes. I don't like Pence at all, but (unlike Trump) he does have prior experience as a high-level elected official and with a badly handled infectious disease outbreak. He may have at least learned from that enormous error, but I doubt Trump is willing to listen. He would probably view it as a challenge to his absolute authority.

Yeah, that could be. My main thought about why Trump shunted this off on Pence is that discussions behind the scenes with his advisors have made him dimly aware that this might not go very well. So since there's a good chance of negative press, he's setting things up so that he can say, "none of this is my fault, it's Pence's".

Also very likely. Quite possibly a combination of the two possibilities.

nereo

  • Senior Mustachian
  • ********
  • Posts: 12510
  • Location: Just south of Canada
    • Here's how you can support science today:
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1148 on: February 27, 2020, 12:20:39 PM »
Pence is the clear scape-goat.  If this becomes a widespread epidemic throughout the US, Trump has already established how he will escape blame.  If this tapers off with only a few thousand cases on domestic soil Trump will crow about how he put “the best people” together to “stop this thing”.

Agree 100%.  I'm just not sure why they would pick Pence as the scapegoat and not just loudly appoint the HHS director in charge of all things Coronavirus. Maybe Azar doesn't have enough name recognition for the blame to stick.

Similar to what Kris said - Trump gutted all the work that the Obama administration had done to beef up our emergency response to epidemics just like this.  Obama did it after the Ebola outbreaks, which thankfully we were able to contain from spreading outside Africa.

So hiring a 'COVID-19 czar" would only emphasize how he fired the US Pandemic Response team back in 2018.  It would be a tacit admission that "oops - we shouldn't have done that".  Pence remains VP ... there's no new position created.

OtherJen

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2862
  • Location: Metro Detroit
Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #1149 on: February 27, 2020, 12:29:36 PM »
Pence is the clear scape-goat.  If this becomes a widespread epidemic throughout the US, Trump has already established how he will escape blame.  If this tapers off with only a few thousand cases on domestic soil Trump will crow about how he put “the best people” together to “stop this thing”.

Agree 100%.  I'm just not sure why they would pick Pence as the scapegoat and not just loudly appoint the HHS director in charge of all things Coronavirus. Maybe Azar doesn't have enough name recognition for the blame to stick.

Similar to what Kris said - Trump gutted all the work that the Obama administration had done to beef up our emergency response to epidemics just like this.  Obama did it after the Ebola outbreaks, which thankfully we were able to contain from spreading outside Africa.

So hiring a 'COVID-19 czar" would only emphasize how he fired the US Pandemic Response team back in 2018.  It would be a tacit admission that "oops - we shouldn't have done that".  Pence remains VP ... there's no new position created.

Very true. He will never admit to a mistake because he believes that he is perfect.

I would actually have more respect for him if he admitted to this fuck-up, even tacitly. Instead, his pathological narcissism is likely to damage this country in ways that even the most astute political scientists may not have foreseen.