Author Topic: Trump outrage of the day  (Read 680980 times)

Roadrunner53

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6150 on: December 23, 2020, 12:00:01 PM »
It would be like saying I have done illegal things as a president so I will pardon myself. It would seem like a pretty bad summary of his own presidency.

He doesn't think that way. He thinks everyone is out to stick it to him and he is Little Mr. Innocent. So, to pardon himself would just be to protect himself from the big bad bullies. Because he has never done anything wrong or sleezy since he was...in his tiny little mind...the best President since Lincoln.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6151 on: December 23, 2020, 12:28:32 PM »
Trump's latest factually deficient twitter-rant about the Covid relief bill has me again wondering: Does he himself not understand what was a part of the Covid package, and/or does he just expect that his followers won't know the difference either?

In under two minutes Trump's video contained so many falsehoods and misrepresentations it would suggest that he doesn't have a clue what he's talking about.  Except we know Trump loves to do everything to keep the attention on him - so perhaps he does, but doesn't care and knows his base will believe only him and won't know the difference.

Which is scarier? A president who doesn't understand the fundamentals of one of the largest and most important spending bills that his own appointee helped negotiate, or that he's willing to throw firebombs just hours after it passed following months of complex and at times nasty negotiations?

bacchi

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6152 on: December 23, 2020, 12:34:01 PM »
Not really a Trump outrage but he's the root cause.

The Thomas More Society, et al, filed a DC Court lawsuit about the failure of the state legislatures (but only in the battleground states) to meet after the election. Or something.

One of the defendants is the Electoral College. Yes, really. Another defendant is Pence, a known Deep State operative.

Comical and pathetic.

sixwings

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6153 on: December 23, 2020, 12:41:06 PM »
Trump's latest factually deficient twitter-rant about the Covid relief bill has me again wondering: Does he himself not understand what was a part of the Covid package, and/or does he just expect that his followers won't know the difference either?

In under two minutes Trump's video contained so many falsehoods and misrepresentations it would suggest that he doesn't have a clue what he's talking about.  Except we know Trump loves to do everything to keep the attention on him - so perhaps he does, but doesn't care and knows his base will believe only him and won't know the difference.

Which is scarier? A president who doesn't understand the fundamentals of one of the largest and most important spending bills that his own appointee helped negotiate, or that he's willing to throw firebombs just hours after it passed following months of complex and at times nasty negotiations?

Trump has never understood any of the legislation that has been passed, he's an illiterate dipshit. This isn't really new. He had no idea what was in the tax cut bill, or any other bill that congress has passed. He had no role in any of those bills, wasn't interested in it. If he wanted more payments to americans he could have been involved, but no, he has no real interest in that so he doesn't bother.

I wonder if this is just part of the spectacle of the whole thing. Dems passed multiple covid relief bills that were way more generous and helpful for working families, republicans said no and played hardball to create what is really a pretty garbage bill, Dems pass it and the Dem leadership celebrate it as a great bi-partisan solution then Trump rejects it and blames democrats. Dems just suck at this, instead of talking about what a great effort at bi-partisanship this was they should have been saying that the Republican senate sucks and wouldn't even discuss what dems want so they had to agree to something and this garbage bill is what they got because Trump and McConnell won't budge.
« Last Edit: December 23, 2020, 01:00:21 PM by sixwings »

partgypsy

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6154 on: December 23, 2020, 12:43:03 PM »
This is an interesting article. According to this article people are still betting that Trump will win the election? Honestly I was not sure that Biden would win, despite projections and Trump's historic unlikability. However that people bet for Trump winning even if making virtually nothing, and even AFTER the election is over, boggles the mind.

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2020/12/trump-betting-markets-sportsbooks-offshore-2020-election-gambling.html?fbclid=IwAR2xuKoT1YLImjuhCONdzsd2sLD1WsQOsHl94O4Xd_2BpySxTE66vhrf9JA

OtherJen

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6155 on: December 23, 2020, 01:01:10 PM »
Trump's latest factually deficient twitter-rant about the Covid relief bill has me again wondering: Does he himself not understand what was a part of the Covid package, and/or does he just expect that his followers won't know the difference either?

Yes.

bacchi

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6156 on: December 23, 2020, 01:05:53 PM »
This is an interesting article. According to this article people are still betting that Trump will win the election? Honestly I was not sure that Biden would win, despite projections and Trump's historic unlikability. However that people bet for Trump winning even if making virtually nothing, and even AFTER the election is over, boggles the mind.

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2020/12/trump-betting-markets-sportsbooks-offshore-2020-election-gambling.html?fbclid=IwAR2xuKoT1YLImjuhCONdzsd2sLD1WsQOsHl94O4Xd_2BpySxTE66vhrf9JA

Yeah, it's difficult to wrap my head around.

Their next hope is that Pence and the Senate+House will reject the battleground electors on Jan 6. I'm not sure how they think that'll go down since the full House votes on each challenge.

This is another glaring hole in the US system. If the current Trump GOP controlled Congress, there would be a strong possibility of electors being rejected.

It'll be interesting to see how McConnell votes in these challenges.

nessness

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6157 on: December 23, 2020, 01:08:56 PM »
It would be like saying I have done illegal things as a president so I will pardon myself. It would seem like a pretty bad summary of his own presidency.
He'll just claim he's trying to prevent malicious prosecution from people who dislike him, and his supporters will buy it.

Remember, he's already claimed he's been subject to the greatest witch hunt in history (I guess he forgot about the literal witch hunts, where suspected witches were murdered), and that he's been treated worse than any president in history (I guess he forgot about all the presidents who were assassinated).

OzzieandHarriet

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6158 on: December 23, 2020, 01:39:11 PM »
This is an interesting article. According to this article people are still betting that Trump will win the election? Honestly I was not sure that Biden would win, despite projections and Trump's historic unlikability. However that people bet for Trump winning even if making virtually nothing, and even AFTER the election is over, boggles the mind.

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2020/12/trump-betting-markets-sportsbooks-offshore-2020-election-gambling.html?fbclid=IwAR2xuKoT1YLImjuhCONdzsd2sLD1WsQOsHl94O4Xd_2BpySxTE66vhrf9JA

Yeah, it's difficult to wrap my head around.

Their next hope is that Pence and the Senate+House will reject the battleground electors on Jan 6. I'm not sure how they think that'll go down since the full House votes on each challenge.

This is another glaring hole in the US system. If the current Trump GOP controlled Congress, there would be a strong possibility of electors being rejected.

It'll be interesting to see how McConnell votes in these challenges.

Does the full House vote or is the vote apportioned by which party holds that state’s legislature? The latter is what is very worrying.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6159 on: December 23, 2020, 01:51:51 PM »
It would be like saying I have done illegal things as a president so I will pardon myself. It would seem like a pretty bad summary of his own presidency.

Indeed, a  pardonee can never escape  opprobrium for their misdeed(s) because  a pardon "carries an imputation of guilt; acceptance a confession of it."





BURDICK v. UNITED STATES
(1915)

This brings us to the differences between legislative immunity and a pardon. They are substantial.  the latter carries an imputation of guilt; acceptance a confession of it. The former has no such imputation or confession. It is tantamount to the silence of the witness. It is noncommittal. It is the unobtrusive act of the law given protection against a sinister use of his testimony, not like a pardon, requiring him to confess his guilt in order to avoid a conviction of it.
« Last Edit: December 23, 2020, 01:53:50 PM by John Galt incarnate! »

bacchi

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6160 on: December 23, 2020, 01:56:35 PM »
This is an interesting article. According to this article people are still betting that Trump will win the election? Honestly I was not sure that Biden would win, despite projections and Trump's historic unlikability. However that people bet for Trump winning even if making virtually nothing, and even AFTER the election is over, boggles the mind.

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2020/12/trump-betting-markets-sportsbooks-offshore-2020-election-gambling.html?fbclid=IwAR2xuKoT1YLImjuhCONdzsd2sLD1WsQOsHl94O4Xd_2BpySxTE66vhrf9JA

Yeah, it's difficult to wrap my head around.

Their next hope is that Pence and the Senate+House will reject the battleground electors on Jan 6. I'm not sure how they think that'll go down since the full House votes on each challenge.

This is another glaring hole in the US system. If the current Trump GOP controlled Congress, there would be a strong possibility of electors being rejected.

It'll be interesting to see how McConnell votes in these challenges.

Does the full House vote or is the vote apportioned by which party holds that state’s legislature? The latter is what is very worrying.

This law needs a Seldon Foundation parser but nothing in it mentions one vote per state. (Edit: Misread the question.)

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/3/15


Edit: The law also mentions electors from different state authorities: "two or more of such State authorities." I don't believe any of the battleground states have dual electors. In 2000, Florida was about to nominate a 2nd group but the SC intervened before they did so.
« Last Edit: December 23, 2020, 02:19:42 PM by bacchi »

Plina

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6161 on: December 23, 2020, 02:40:28 PM »
It would be like saying I have done illegal things as a president so I will pardon myself. It would seem like a pretty bad summary of his own presidency.
He'll just claim he's trying to prevent malicious prosecution from people who dislike him, and his supporters will buy it.

Remember, he's already claimed he's been subject to the greatest witch hunt in history (I guess he forgot about the literal witch hunts, where suspected witches were murdered), and that he's been treated worse than any president in history (I guess he forgot about all the presidents who were assassinated).

Yes, he probably would get away with hos voters but he should have someone point out to him that his voters are not writing the history books so even if he has been or would be maliciously prosecuted, the history books would probably see it as an admission of guilt ( even thought that would of course not be the case for the best president in the history).

Actually, it would be pretty interesting to see if he manage to pull that off and how he would justify it.

Sometimes, I wish I could live in an alternative reality as he and his voters.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6162 on: December 23, 2020, 05:36:35 PM »
... and so it continues with pardons for: Manafort, Stone (previously commuted), and Charles Kushner.

katsiki

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6163 on: December 23, 2020, 07:20:17 PM »
I read a reasonably crappy book (Total Power by Kyle Mills) a few weeks ago about this guy who hacked the US electric grid and tried to sell it around, eventually partnering with some middle eastern terrorists to actually bring down the grid. Chaos ensues, violence, looting, government on the verge of collapse, the usual fiction stuff. The premise seemed plausible and then the rest of the book went downhill.

In any case the author had a note at the end in which he commented that he was surprised how vulnerable our grid is as part of the research he did for his writing.

Now we have proof that we have been hacked and much more than what the book imagined, and I’m thinking back to what the author had imagined happening to our society should do one actually choose to pull the plug.

Can someone give me reasons why I shouldn’t think we could have things collapse around us should whoever holds the keys to the kingdom now think it would be fun to watch us struggle?

Someone more knowledgeable will likely chime in...  but I know enough to know that our electrical grid is very vulnerable and in need of hardening.  It is a significant amount of money but we would be DOA without the grid.
You want the read something really scary.  This is the actual research done by a respected journalist.  https://www.amazon.com/Lights-Out-Cyberattack-Unprepared-Surviving/dp/0553419986

Thanks!  I remember hearing about this book but had completely forgotten.  Adding to library list...

Travis

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6164 on: December 23, 2020, 10:41:50 PM »
None of will be surprised by the immediately-before-Christmas-when-people-are-distracted slate of 20 pardons that Trump just issued.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/22/us/politics/trump-pardons.html

Two salient paragraphs from the NYT article:

Quote
A tabulation by the Harvard Law School professor Jack Goldsmith found that of the 45 pardons or commutations Mr. Trump had granted up until Tuesday, 88 percent aided someone with a personal tie to the president or furthered his political aims.

Not much to say on this other than that it continues to be an abuse of the intent or pardon power.

and
Quote
One of them, Nicholas Slatten, had been sentenced to life in prison after the Justice Department had gone to great lengths to prosecute him. Mr. Slatten had been a contractor for the controversial company Blackwater and was sentenced for his role in the killing of 17 Iraqi civilians in Nisour Square in Baghdad — a massacre that left one of the most lasting stains on the United States of the war.

On the Blackwater contractor point, it is worth noting that Eric Prince, head of Blackwater, is related to Besty DeVos and has a clear political bent. For example, when he was eager to spy on Americans who leaned left:
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/07/us/politics/erik-prince-project-veritas.html

Prince has a clear interest in his contractors being able to literally get away with murder. Our military operations should not be privatized and the existence of organizations like Blackwater are very problematic in my mind.

The prerequisites for a Trump pardon: you murdered Arab/Afghan civilians, you were convicted of his breaking of elections laws, or you're a Republican politician who was convicted of a crime. Note that Duncan Hunter is on the list as well. Skimmed straight out of his reelection funds and tried to put it all on his wife.

And her name wasn't on the pardon list. She's still in prison for her part of the scandal.

OzzieandHarriet

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6165 on: December 23, 2020, 10:48:49 PM »
This is an interesting article. According to this article people are still betting that Trump will win the election? Honestly I was not sure that Biden would win, despite projections and Trump's historic unlikability. However that people bet for Trump winning even if making virtually nothing, and even AFTER the election is over, boggles the mind.

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2020/12/trump-betting-markets-sportsbooks-offshore-2020-election-gambling.html?fbclid=IwAR2xuKoT1YLImjuhCONdzsd2sLD1WsQOsHl94O4Xd_2BpySxTE66vhrf9JA

Yeah, it's difficult to wrap my head around.

Their next hope is that Pence and the Senate+House will reject the battleground electors on Jan 6. I'm not sure how they think that'll go down since the full House votes on each challenge.

This is another glaring hole in the US system. If the current Trump GOP controlled Congress, there would be a strong possibility of electors being rejected.

It'll be interesting to see how McConnell votes in these challenges.

Does the full House vote or is the vote apportioned by which party holds that state’s legislature? The latter is what is very worrying.

This law needs a Seldon Foundation parser but nothing in it mentions one vote per state. (Edit: Misread the question.)

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/3/15


Edit: The law also mentions electors from different state authorities: "two or more of such State authorities." I don't believe any of the battleground states have dual electors. In 2000, Florida was about to nominate a 2nd group but the SC intervened before they did so.

This is kind of interesting, written sometime last year, laying out a scenario of a disputed election with two slates of electors in contrasting swing states (which did not actually happen).

https://www.luc.edu/media/lucedu/law/students/publications/llj/pdfs/vol-51/issue-2/7_Foley%20(309-362).pdf

The Appendix parses out 3 U.S.C. § 15.

What do the lawyers here make of this?



ministashy

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6166 on: December 24, 2020, 12:29:05 AM »

Trump has never understood any of the legislation that has been passed, he's an illiterate dipshit. This isn't really new. He had no idea what was in the tax cut bill, or any other bill that congress has passed. He had no role in any of those bills, wasn't interested in it. If he wanted more payments to americans he could have been involved, but no, he has no real interest in that so he doesn't bother.

I wonder if this is just part of the spectacle of the whole thing. Dems passed multiple covid relief bills that were way more generous and helpful for working families, republicans said no and played hardball to create what is really a pretty garbage bill, Dems pass it and the Dem leadership celebrate it as a great bi-partisan solution then Trump rejects it and blames democrats. Dems just suck at this, instead of talking about what a great effort at bi-partisanship this was they should have been saying that the Republican senate sucks and wouldn't even discuss what dems want so they had to agree to something and this garbage bill is what they got because Trump and McConnell won't budge.

The most believable analysis I've seen is that Trump is threatening to veto the bill solely to get back at Mitch, because he's trying to ensure he retains control of the Republican party even after he leaves office.  So he's trying to make the bill fail and/or make it look like Mitch 'caved' to the Democrats.

I agree with you that what got passed was a crap bill in terms of Covid relief, but I've reluctantly come to believe that the Democrats had to pass it, if only because the Republicans have proven over and over that they are perfectly willing to not only take the American people hostage, but shoot them if necessary (see: 300K dead and counting).

sixwings

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6167 on: December 24, 2020, 09:02:48 AM »
Yeah they did because Democrats actually care about people but their messaging sucked. They starting talking about how proud they were of this bi-partisan effort and bill blah blah blah. They should have been saying this bill sucks, it needed a lot more, it needed more direct payments, but this is all that republicans are willing to give you. It set them up perfectly to look foolish on this.

rocketpj

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6168 on: December 24, 2020, 11:01:32 AM »
So Trump can't take bribes for pardons, officially.  Of course, he can't use his office to benefit himself either and he's been doing that blatantly and egregiously for 4 years now.

What is the over/under on Trump pardoning a massive crowd of rich people who have coincidentally donated money to his 'Stop the steal' grift campaign, then following up with a broad self-pardon for all of it - including taking bribes for pardons.

It will go to the courts, but it will be such a mess that after a year or so most people will stop paying attention.  His whole life he's used lawyers to avoid consequence, there is no reason this will be different.  Look at how much effort went into getting access to his tax returns, for example.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6169 on: December 24, 2020, 12:43:52 PM »
So Trump can't take bribes for pardons, officially.  Of course, he can't use his office to benefit himself either and he's been doing that blatantly and egregiously for 4 years now.

What is the over/under on Trump pardoning a massive crowd of rich people who have coincidentally donated money to his 'Stop the steal' grift campaign, then following up with a broad self-pardon for all of it - including taking bribes for pardons.

It will go to the courts, but it will be such a mess that after a year or so most people will stop paying attention.  His whole life he's used lawyers to avoid consequence, there is no reason this will be different.  Look at how much effort went into getting access to his tax returns, for example.

There's a downside though to accepting a pardon. It leaves them open to Civil liability. So a pardon in a way maybe a way for them to get a do over, but they would basically have to pay back all the money that they've stolen plus some.

Being pardoned means that you can no longer be protected by the 5th Amendment, so any crimes that have Civil suits attached to them become much more open and shut cases. They'll avoid jail time, but they'd end up losing most if not more money than they started with. Or face jail time for obstruction of justice if they don't confess. Congress could even fine Trump and all of his children daily if they don't talk.

How many of these Trump associates will now be forced to testify against Trump and his family? They certainly know many misdeeds, and if they don't talk, they'll almost certainly face more obstruction charges.

All of Trump's tax records or finances would no longer be protected, and a complete a through accounting of all of his business dealings would almost certainly become public record. And Trump would no doubt owe huge sums of back taxes. (Especially under a Biden IRS which will return to actually pursuing this sort of work).

It's corrupt as anything, but Trump pardoning himself may actually harm him more financially than if he just tried to go quiet into the night.

Travis

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6170 on: December 24, 2020, 07:51:49 PM »
Congress could even fine Trump and all of his children daily if they don't talk.

How many of these Trump associates will now be forced to testify against Trump and his family? They certainly know many misdeeds, and if they don't talk, they'll almost certainly face more obstruction charges.


Wiping your ass with a Congressional subpoena, or committing blatant perjury in front of them - great traditions of the American elite.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6171 on: December 25, 2020, 03:03:59 PM »
This is an interesting article. According to this article people are still betting that Trump will win the election? Honestly I was not sure that Biden would win, despite projections and Trump's historic unlikability. However that people bet for Trump winning even if making virtually nothing, and even AFTER the election is over, boggles the mind.

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2020/12/trump-betting-markets-sportsbooks-offshore-2020-election-gambling.html?fbclid=IwAR2xuKoT1YLImjuhCONdzsd2sLD1WsQOsHl94O4Xd_2BpySxTE66vhrf9JA

Yeah, it's difficult to wrap my head around.

Their next hope is that Pence and the Senate+House will reject the battleground electors on Jan 6. I'm not sure how they think that'll go down since the full House votes on each challenge.

This is another glaring hole in the US system. If the current Trump GOP controlled Congress, there would be a strong possibility of electors being rejected.

It'll be interesting to see how McConnell votes in these challenges.

Does the full House vote or is the vote apportioned by which party holds that state’s legislature? The latter is what is very worrying.

At some point it goes back to the state official who sent their delegation to verify they got the correct electoral votes.  Which in the case of Michigan would have Gov. Whitmer, a Democrats getting to say, he’ll yes the voters of MI voted for Biden etc.

meghan88

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6172 on: December 25, 2020, 03:15:28 PM »
Could a pardon for Ghislaine Maxwell be in the cards?

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6173 on: December 25, 2020, 03:36:52 PM »
Could a pardon for Ghislaine Maxwell be in the cards?
At his current rate I wouldn't rule out pardons for anyone up to and including Charles Manson and the unabomber.

OtherJen

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6174 on: December 25, 2020, 04:32:04 PM »
Could a pardon for Ghislaine Maxwell be in the cards?
At his current rate I wouldn't rule out pardons for anyone up to and including Charles Manson and the unabomber.

Trump will only pardon those of some value to him.

Just Joe

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6175 on: December 25, 2020, 05:14:19 PM »
Thanks!  I remember hearing about this book but had completely forgotten.  Adding to library list...

Nashville? AT&T?

OtherJen

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6176 on: December 25, 2020, 05:33:51 PM »
Thanks!  I remember hearing about this book but had completely forgotten.  Adding to library list...

Nashville? AT&T?

It certainly does seem to have been a test attack on infrastructure.

Just Joe

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6177 on: December 25, 2020, 05:53:02 PM »
Friends in and near Nashville report that part of the mobile phone infrastructure, part of the 911 service and some internet services were unavailable afterwards.

OtherJen

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6178 on: December 25, 2020, 06:04:21 PM »
Friends in and near Nashville report that part of the mobile phone infrastructure, part of the 911 service and some internet services were unavailable afterwards.

BNA airport in Nashville had to ground flights earlier today.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6179 on: December 27, 2020, 08:06:40 AM »
So, Trump refused to sign the relief bill, which cuts off unemployment benefits. He was more or less MIA during the long and contentious negotiations to get the bill through Congress and then issues ultimatums on content at the last minute and after bites have been cast. This wasn't a negotiation, it was a petulant temper tantrum with total disregard for the impacts to Americans. See also the veto if the defense bill.

It is as deranged as the asshole who would throw acid on a lover of they couldn't have them.  I feel like we don't so much need him out if office so much as we need a restraining order.
« Last Edit: December 27, 2020, 08:10:09 AM by Glenstache »

MudPuppy

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6180 on: December 27, 2020, 08:16:35 AM »
Friends in and near Nashville report that part of the mobile phone infrastructure, part of the 911 service and some internet services were unavailable afterwards.

And remain unavailable. Large parts of several local hospital communications are down, too. Hell, Walmart can’t take cards and the ATMs are also down.

ysette9

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6181 on: December 27, 2020, 09:09:35 AM »
So, Trump refused to sign the relief bill, which cuts off unemployment benefits. He was more or less MIA during the long and contentious negotiations to get the bill through Congress and then issues ultimatums on content at the last minute and after bites have been cast. This wasn't a negotiation, it was a petulant temper tantrum with total disregard for the impacts to Americans. See also the veto if the defense bill.

It is as deranged as the asshole who would throw acid on a lover of they couldn't have them.  I feel like we don't so much need him out if office so much as we need a restraining order.
It is such an incredibly asshole-y thing to do. I should be surprised, but damn. A toddler throwing a big tantrum and breaking all the toys so that no one else can enjoy them.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6182 on: December 27, 2020, 09:10:59 AM »
Anyone think Bernie Madoff will be pardoned?

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6183 on: December 27, 2020, 09:21:31 AM »
I really expected the communications network to be more capable of re-routing around problems like the Nashville bombing. I called someone in the affected region yesterday and got a "all circuits are busy" message. Its more than just Nashville, its many counties around it as well. Friend says the 911 system is down in multiple counties miles away from Nashville.
« Last Edit: December 27, 2020, 09:23:06 AM by Just Joe »

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6184 on: December 27, 2020, 09:44:53 AM »
So, Trump refused to sign the relief bill, which cuts off unemployment benefits. He was more or less MIA during the long and contentious negotiations to get the bill through Congress and then issues ultimatums on content at the last minute and after bites have been cast. This wasn't a negotiation, it was a petulant temper tantrum with total disregard for the impacts to Americans. See also the veto if the defense bill.

It is as deranged as the asshole who would throw acid on a lover of they couldn't have them.  I feel like we don't so much need him out if office so much as we need a restraining order.

Yep. Also, a bomb went off in a major US city on Friday morning and he hasn't issued a statement. Plus, we're facing a partial government shutdown on Tuesday. Crickets from the White House.

See below for his choice of Twitter rant this morning. I'm super glad that this, golfing, and employing his ethically deficient children are how he's using his US taxpayer-funded salary and housing:



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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6185 on: December 27, 2020, 10:01:05 AM »
I really expected the communications network to be more capable of re-routing around problems like the Nashville bombing. I called someone in the affected region yesterday and got a "all circuits are busy" message. Its more than just Nashville, its many counties around it as well. Friend says the 911 system is down in multiple counties miles away from Nashville.

Yep. The outages are felt down into Alabama and up into Kentucky. I’m really surprised that there hasn’t been some sort of reroute that can restore all but the areas closest to the site. I’m in the middle of several days off and I have food at home and plenty of books to read so my only problem is that I can’t binge The Mandalorian like I had planned and I don’t have any cash to go get bananas.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6186 on: December 27, 2020, 10:19:17 AM »
I really expected the communications network to be more capable of re-routing around problems like the Nashville bombing. I called someone in the affected region yesterday and got a "all circuits are busy" message. Its more than just Nashville, its many counties around it as well. Friend says the 911 system is down in multiple counties miles away from Nashville.

Yep. The outages are felt down into Alabama and up into Kentucky. I’m really surprised that there hasn’t been some sort of reroute that can restore all but the areas closest to the site. I’m in the middle of several days off and I have food at home and plenty of books to read so my only problem is that I can’t binge The Mandalorian like I had planned and I don’t have any cash to go get bananas.

You would think the POTUS would be concerned about a multistate outage that affects first responders, especially since some of his most ardent supporters are from those states.

But it doesn't affect his ability to tweet or watch OAN so all is well, I guess.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6187 on: December 27, 2020, 11:16:06 AM »
Initial signs point to a white guy for the Nashville bombing (i.e. ‘Person of Interest’ #1). Since there’s no one wearing a turban Or speaking ‘mexican there’s little for Trump to get upset about (I guess).

I’m also cynical that Trump *wants* the economy to tank next month, or at least doesn’t care if it does. After all, then he can talk about how ‘great’ it was when he was POTUS and how horrible it was the minute Biden took office (even if the free-fall starts a few weeks early - hey, that’s everyone expecting Biden, amiright?!)

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6188 on: December 27, 2020, 02:21:48 PM »
Saw this one: https://youtu.be/VgtsSXbH7lE

Seems reasonable to ensure future presidents might have spending limitations when it comes to entertainment perhaps?

The cost to keep the big baby entertained is utterly ridiculous!

Give future presidents an expense account. Limit how and where they can spend it. If they want to go to the beach every weekend let them pay for it out of pocket! All of it out of pocket. If they want to weekend at Camp David or some other government facility - then pick up the tab.

Geez, government employees have to account for nickels and dimes and this guy is spending hundreds of millions of tax dollars to go to Florida every weekend - much of which he pockets. Should NEVER work like that. 

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6189 on: December 28, 2020, 04:49:04 AM »
Anyone think Bernie Madoff will be pardoned?

Only if he is related to or expressed support (dollars) for Trump.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6190 on: December 28, 2020, 08:09:00 AM »
Amid rampant speculation that Trump will run again in 2024 I found this fairly interesting:

The majority of US Presidents have severed less than 2 full terms.  Only one (Grover Cleveland) has lost as the incumbent and gone on to win a second (non-consecutive) term.

I had always been under the impression that the two-term president was the norm.  It's not. It's not even common in the 'modern' (i.e. post-WWII) era: just five have managed to serve two full terms (Eisenhower, Reagan, G.W Bush, Clinton and Obama) - 7 served less than two terms.*  Including all presidents, just 14 have served at least two full terms (FDR was elected 4x and died in office).

Grover Cleveland is the only elected president to serve non-consecutive terms, and it's worth noting that all prior to Eisenhower (the 34th President) were not limited by term limits (though eight died in office, thereby making them ineligible to run for re-election); 31 have served less than two full terms.

None of this is to say that Trump WON'T run for election or even that he won't win if he does, but eliminating those who died in office and served two full terms (a norm before it was a restriction) there were 24 could have run for re-election after losing the previous cycle, and only one succeeded.  Most simply decided not to run again, though Teddy Roosevelt notably tried (and failed) in a 3rd-party bid. 


*Kennedy was assasinated, LBJ served out the rest of his term plus one full term. Ditto for Truman (who replaced FDR). Nixon resigned leaving Ford to serve just under a term (he was the only president never elected to Prez or VP). Carter, Bush Sr, and Trump (so far) all served just one term.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6191 on: December 28, 2020, 09:24:22 AM »
Initial signs point to a white guy for the Nashville bombing (i.e. ‘Person of Interest’ #1). Since there’s no one wearing a turban Or speaking ‘mexican there’s little for Trump to get upset about (I guess).

I’m also cynical that Trump *wants* the economy to tank next month, or at least doesn’t care if it does. After all, then he can talk about how ‘great’ it was when he was POTUS and how horrible it was the minute Biden took office (even if the free-fall starts a few weeks early - hey, that’s everyone expecting Biden, amiright?!)

It was a 63-year old white man with an IT background who was reportedly near retirement. The buzz around here in middle TN is that he was a Q-anon conspiracy believer and specifically subcribed to the '5G' conspiracy. He lived near downtown and had knowledge of how to cripple the communications infrastructure. Internet and phone service has been down here since Christmas morning; including 911 services for many surrounding counties in TN and KY. I live 40 miles northwest of Nashville and I got limited cell service back last night...but it still isn't working properly. From what I'm reading and hearing around here, they won't call it "terrorism" until they can link his motive to a particular ideaology...which is bullshit. He was a domestic terrorist...but because he's a white dude named Anthony, they won't call it that...and of course not a peep from Trump.

We're getting to a point where this unchecked feeding of conspiracy theories by "news" outlets need to be addressed somehow. I fear that the closer we get to January 6th and/or January 20th, the more of this sort of thing may happen.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6192 on: December 28, 2020, 09:33:03 AM »
Initial signs point to a white guy for the Nashville bombing (i.e. ‘Person of Interest’ #1). Since there’s no one wearing a turban Or speaking ‘mexican there’s little for Trump to get upset about (I guess).

I’m also cynical that Trump *wants* the economy to tank next month, or at least doesn’t care if it does. After all, then he can talk about how ‘great’ it was when he was POTUS and how horrible it was the minute Biden took office (even if the free-fall starts a few weeks early - hey, that’s everyone expecting Biden, amiright?!)

It was a 63-year old white man with an IT background who was reportedly near retirement. The buzz around here in middle TN is that he was a Q-anon conspiracy believer and specifically subcribed to the '5G' conspiracy. He lived near downtown and had knowledge of how to cripple the communications infrastructure. Internet and phone service has been down here since Christmas morning; including 911 services for many surrounding counties in TN and KY. I live 40 miles northwest of Nashville and I got limited cell service back last night...but it still isn't working properly. From what I'm reading and hearing around here, they won't call it "terrorism" until they can link his motive to a particular ideaology...which is bullshit. He was a domestic terrorist...but because he's a white dude named Anthony, they won't call it that...and of course not a peep from Trump.

We're getting to a point where this unchecked feeding of conspiracy theories by "news" outlets need to be addressed somehow. I fear that the closer we get to January 6th and/or January 20th, the more of this sort of thing may happen.
Trump is openly calling his supporters to support him in person in DC on Jan 6 in opposition to the final process of the electoral college process in Congress. The GOP is either complicit in this or so lacking in backbone as to avoid openly speaking out against the actions of Trump out of fear of his retribution through his base. But Trump's power is illusory and only exists through the consent of those willing to avoid upsetting him.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6193 on: December 28, 2020, 11:20:27 AM »
Yep.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6194 on: December 28, 2020, 11:57:35 AM »
Initial signs point to a white guy for the Nashville bombing (i.e. ‘Person of Interest’ #1). Since there’s no one wearing a turban Or speaking ‘mexican there’s little for Trump to get upset about (I guess).

I’m also cynical that Trump *wants* the economy to tank next month, or at least doesn’t care if it does. After all, then he can talk about how ‘great’ it was when he was POTUS and how horrible it was the minute Biden took office (even if the free-fall starts a few weeks early - hey, that’s everyone expecting Biden, amiright?!)

It was a 63-year old white man with an IT background who was reportedly near retirement. The buzz around here in middle TN is that he was a Q-anon conspiracy believer and specifically subcribed to the '5G' conspiracy. He lived near downtown and had knowledge of how to cripple the communications infrastructure. Internet and phone service has been down here since Christmas morning; including 911 services for many surrounding counties in TN and KY. I live 40 miles northwest of Nashville and I got limited cell service back last night...but it still isn't working properly. From what I'm reading and hearing around here, they won't call it "terrorism" until they can link his motive to a particular ideaology...which is bullshit. He was a domestic terrorist...but because he's a white dude named Anthony, they won't call it that...and of course not a peep from Trump.

We're getting to a point where this unchecked feeding of conspiracy theories by "news" outlets need to be addressed somehow. I fear that the closer we get to January 6th and/or January 20th, the more of this sort of thing may happen.

Can you briefly summarize the "5G Conspiracy" so that I don't have to dive down another internet hell-hole?

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6195 on: December 28, 2020, 12:31:25 PM »
Initial signs point to a white guy for the Nashville bombing (i.e. ‘Person of Interest’ #1). Since there’s no one wearing a turban Or speaking ‘mexican there’s little for Trump to get upset about (I guess).

I’m also cynical that Trump *wants* the economy to tank next month, or at least doesn’t care if it does. After all, then he can talk about how ‘great’ it was when he was POTUS and how horrible it was the minute Biden took office (even if the free-fall starts a few weeks early - hey, that’s everyone expecting Biden, amiright?!)

It was a 63-year old white man with an IT background who was reportedly near retirement. The buzz around here in middle TN is that he was a Q-anon conspiracy believer and specifically subcribed to the '5G' conspiracy. He lived near downtown and had knowledge of how to cripple the communications infrastructure. Internet and phone service has been down here since Christmas morning; including 911 services for many surrounding counties in TN and KY. I live 40 miles northwest of Nashville and I got limited cell service back last night...but it still isn't working properly. From what I'm reading and hearing around here, they won't call it "terrorism" until they can link his motive to a particular ideaology...which is bullshit. He was a domestic terrorist...but because he's a white dude named Anthony, they won't call it that...and of course not a peep from Trump.

We're getting to a point where this unchecked feeding of conspiracy theories by "news" outlets need to be addressed somehow. I fear that the closer we get to January 6th and/or January 20th, the more of this sort of thing may happen.

Can you briefly summarize the "5G Conspiracy" so that I don't have to dive down another internet hell-hole?

5G is mind control AND causing the COVID symptoms/deaths.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6196 on: December 28, 2020, 12:34:06 PM »
Initial signs point to a white guy for the Nashville bombing (i.e. ‘Person of Interest’ #1). Since there’s no one wearing a turban Or speaking ‘mexican there’s little for Trump to get upset about (I guess).

I’m also cynical that Trump *wants* the economy to tank next month, or at least doesn’t care if it does. After all, then he can talk about how ‘great’ it was when he was POTUS and how horrible it was the minute Biden took office (even if the free-fall starts a few weeks early - hey, that’s everyone expecting Biden, amiright?!)

It was a 63-year old white man with an IT background who was reportedly near retirement. The buzz around here in middle TN is that he was a Q-anon conspiracy believer and specifically subcribed to the '5G' conspiracy. He lived near downtown and had knowledge of how to cripple the communications infrastructure. Internet and phone service has been down here since Christmas morning; including 911 services for many surrounding counties in TN and KY. I live 40 miles northwest of Nashville and I got limited cell service back last night...but it still isn't working properly. From what I'm reading and hearing around here, they won't call it "terrorism" until they can link his motive to a particular ideaology...which is bullshit. He was a domestic terrorist...but because he's a white dude named Anthony, they won't call it that...and of course not a peep from Trump.

We're getting to a point where this unchecked feeding of conspiracy theories by "news" outlets need to be addressed somehow. I fear that the closer we get to January 6th and/or January 20th, the more of this sort of thing may happen.

Can you briefly summarize the "5G Conspiracy" so that I don't have to dive down another internet hell-hole?

5G is mind control AND causing the COVID symptoms/deaths.

Bejezuss.... that’s worse than I thought.  I was expecting something along the lines of “it’s a Trojan Horse for China and will lead to a communist takeover”.  That at least would be based a teeny-tiny amount on reality (e.g. security).

I give the conspiracy theorists too much credit.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6197 on: December 28, 2020, 01:13:29 PM »
Initial signs point to a white guy for the Nashville bombing (i.e. ‘Person of Interest’ #1). Since there’s no one wearing a turban Or speaking ‘mexican there’s little for Trump to get upset about (I guess).

I’m also cynical that Trump *wants* the economy to tank next month, or at least doesn’t care if it does. After all, then he can talk about how ‘great’ it was when he was POTUS and how horrible it was the minute Biden took office (even if the free-fall starts a few weeks early - hey, that’s everyone expecting Biden, amiright?!)

It was a 63-year old white man with an IT background who was reportedly near retirement. The buzz around here in middle TN is that he was a Q-anon conspiracy believer and specifically subcribed to the '5G' conspiracy. He lived near downtown and had knowledge of how to cripple the communications infrastructure. Internet and phone service has been down here since Christmas morning; including 911 services for many surrounding counties in TN and KY. I live 40 miles northwest of Nashville and I got limited cell service back last night...but it still isn't working properly. From what I'm reading and hearing around here, they won't call it "terrorism" until they can link his motive to a particular ideaology...which is bullshit. He was a domestic terrorist...but because he's a white dude named Anthony, they won't call it that...and of course not a peep from Trump.

We're getting to a point where this unchecked feeding of conspiracy theories by "news" outlets need to be addressed somehow. I fear that the closer we get to January 6th and/or January 20th, the more of this sort of thing may happen.

Can you briefly summarize the "5G Conspiracy" so that I don't have to dive down another internet hell-hole?

5G is mind control AND causing the COVID symptoms/deaths.

Bejezuss.... that’s worse than I thought.  I was expecting something along the lines of “it’s a Trojan Horse for China and will lead to a communist takeover”.  That at least would be based a teeny-tiny amount on reality (e.g. security).

I give the conspiracy theorists too much credit.
Ironically, Qanon appears to exert some sort of mass mind control/hysteria and encourages actions that result in covid deaths...

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6198 on: December 28, 2020, 01:19:51 PM »
Initial signs point to a white guy for the Nashville bombing (i.e. ‘Person of Interest’ #1). Since there’s no one wearing a turban Or speaking ‘mexican there’s little for Trump to get upset about (I guess).

I’m also cynical that Trump *wants* the economy to tank next month, or at least doesn’t care if it does. After all, then he can talk about how ‘great’ it was when he was POTUS and how horrible it was the minute Biden took office (even if the free-fall starts a few weeks early - hey, that’s everyone expecting Biden, amiright?!)

It was a 63-year old white man with an IT background who was reportedly near retirement. The buzz around here in middle TN is that he was a Q-anon conspiracy believer and specifically subcribed to the '5G' conspiracy. He lived near downtown and had knowledge of how to cripple the communications infrastructure. Internet and phone service has been down here since Christmas morning; including 911 services for many surrounding counties in TN and KY. I live 40 miles northwest of Nashville and I got limited cell service back last night...but it still isn't working properly. From what I'm reading and hearing around here, they won't call it "terrorism" until they can link his motive to a particular ideaology...which is bullshit. He was a domestic terrorist...but because he's a white dude named Anthony, they won't call it that...and of course not a peep from Trump.

We're getting to a point where this unchecked feeding of conspiracy theories by "news" outlets need to be addressed somehow. I fear that the closer we get to January 6th and/or January 20th, the more of this sort of thing may happen.


The Troubles:  US Edition

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #6199 on: December 28, 2020, 02:32:58 PM »
Wait, I thought the Covid vaccine was the mind control vehicle!

It will be hard for Trump to run in 2024 from prison.