Should I sell my gun?

[Mustache_In_Training]

Hi all,

I wanted to get your opinion on owning a gun. I have a fancy pants Kimber 1911 that's worth ~$900. I bought it with the intention of home defense and because it was pretty badass. A lesser gun wouldn't do at the time, because I had to have only the finest. (This was purchased pre-MMM days)

In effort to rid my life of shit I don't need or use on a regular basis, this frequently comes up in my mind. Should I keep it "just in case" or should I part ways with it? I've never encountered a situation where I needed to use the gun and hope I never will. In the unlikely event my home is broken in to, I'm not sure I would actually use it? It's difficult to know how one would act in a situation like that.

Thoughts?

[ShoulderThingThatGoesUp]

I was just thinking of posting a similar thread, though my gun is a 10/22 that I only have because it's a barrel of fun to target-shoot with. I might replace it with a small revolver of a bigger caliber that I could more reasonably keep in a combination safe, because people do sometimes break into houses around here.

And does anybody have recommendations of the best way to sell a gun?

[Ottawa]

Ditch the gun.  You are more likely to kill someone you love, yourself, or a 'non-deserving' stranger than you are to actually successfully defend yourself.  Plus, you'll be richer for it!  :-)

[Rural]

OP, a cheap 12-gauge shotgun will do what you're looking for. If you know what you're doing with the gun. If you don't, either learn or sell that sucker and don't replace it, and you'll be safer.

[Timmmy]

Fellow gun owner here.  I have a few and they are all lifetime items for me.  They don't wear out and they will be just as useful to me 30 years from now as they are today.  So it's not like they are rapidly losing value like a car might.  If you don't love the kimber I would consider selling it and maybe look at buying something less expensive that could serve the same purposes.  If you are thinking home defense, a shotgun would be way better.  Even if you wanted a pistol there are better choices. 

The 10/22 is a gun that I think everyone who owns firearms should own.  It's cheap, reliable and a great gun to learn to shoot and to do your own cleaning and maintenance.  I have one that I will never sell. 

As far as selling...  Take a look at your state laws to determine what's legal.  There are websites where you can buy/sell as long as the transfers go through a licensed FFL holder.  They usually charge a fee to the buyer to facilitate the transfer. 

[Gilead1986]

I'd sell it, but since it's not a priority you should be able to sell it for a decent price because you have time to be patient, maybe try Gunbroker, you might have to go through an FFL to sell it depending on your state.  The cost of ammo for a .45 probably prevents you from training with it properly compared to 9mm or .38.  Passive measures for your peace of mind would probably be a better route than lethal defense. 

  I'm actually considering selling some of my firearms as well, mostly because I only use about 3 to hunt with anymore and barely have the time or desire to shoot for recreation. 

[Mississippi Mudstache]

OP, a cheap 12-gauge shotgun will do what you're looking for. If you know what you're doing with the gun. If you don't, either learn or sell that sucker and don't replace it, and you'll be safer.

This. Every criminal knows the sounds of a pump-action shotgun. You don't even need shells, just the sound.

I have two guns: a 30-06, and a 12 guage. I should probably sell the .30-06, but it's a bit sentimental, because my dad bought it for my 16th birthday. I use it for deer-hunting every few years, but I don't like it, because it's overkill for whitetail and it kicks too hard to practice marksmanship very much. Really, I just need to get over it and sell the stupid thing. The 12-gauge isn't worth much, and is more versatile, so I'm keeping it.

If I wanted to keep a pistol for protection, I would keep it loaded with one blank and the rest would be rat shot (ie, tiny pellets that don't penetrate walls and are non-lethal unless fired at point-blank range). As Ottawa said, you're far more likely to kill someone you didn't want to kill than to protect yourself if you keep a loaded gun around the house. Sell the gun.

[GuitarStv]

They don't wear out and they will be just as useful to me 30 years from now as they are today.

I agree, which is why I think it would be a good idea to sell the gun.

[PeachFuzzInVA]

I know I'll be in the minority here, but I'd suggest selling it and buying 2 lesser expensive guns. It doesn't do any good to have a fancy gun that:
a) you don't practice with because you'll never hit what you're aiming for if you don't practice and
b) is stashed away somewhere you can't get to if you ever do need it

[JLee]

Ottowa - please do not use flawed statistics. The "studies" you refer to are including gang violence and suicides, which dramatically skew figures in favor of the anti-gun crowd.

Do not use blanks for home defense. Do not use rat shot.  If you use a firearm you damn better be able to justify the use of deadly force or you can plan on going to prison for a long time.

There's no "playing around." If you've crossed that threshold where deadly force is justifiable - i.e. you are countering an imminent and immediate threat of unlawful deadly force (i.e. force that can cause serious bodily injury or death) and you decide to deploy a firearm, whatever you use is considered deadly force by law. Rat shot or hollow points - it doesn't matter.  Rat shot is for rats.  We are a lot bigger than rats. Read this: http://www.theboxotruth.com/the-box-o-truth-30-snakeloads-o-truth/

Please do your research and understand your state's use of force laws.  There has been some terrible (and inaccurate) advice in this thread and use of deadly force can change your life - for your own safety (both physically and legally) and the safety of others, please make sure you are very familiar with your state laws as well as with your firearm (and how to use it). Training is important. Training under stress is important. Most people (including myself) do not do this enough.

I am far from an "expert," but with 19 years owning firearms and 5 years in law enforcement, I have more than a passing knowledge of this topic.

[hdatontodo]

Look at closed gunbroker auction that actually sold (there's a tab for that in the advanced search) to get an idea of what it would go for.

Look at a local shooting forum's for sale section.

Find a local FFL who would ship it to an out of state buyer's FFL. Buyer would have to provide you a copy of his FFL's license and you can verify it online.

If you use a local shooting forum, you could sell it to someone in state and follow that state's xfer laws. In MD, for example, you can do the paperwork at an FFL or the State Police and transfer possession like a week later to a buyer that has the new MD HQL card.

I advise friends to fortify their residence with window security film, an alarm, secure door jamb, get a dog (i.e. solve the physical entry problem first.) Beyond that, a $300 Mossberg 12ga would be a good choice.

Remember if someone is messing with your car or shed, in many states you can't defend property with lethal force, so stay indoors and keep from losing all your savings from getting into a costly shooting situation.

[Stash Engineer]

Ottowa - please do not use flawed statistics. The "studies" you refer to are including gang violence and suicides, which dramatically skew figures in favor of the anti-gun crowd.

Do not use blanks for home defense. Do not use rat shot.  If you use a firearm you damn better be able to justify the use of deadly force or you can plan on going to prison for a long time.

There's no "playing around." If you've crossed that threshold where deadly force is justifiable - i.e. you are countering an imminent and immediate threat of unlawful deadly force (i.e. force that can cause serious bodily injury or death) and you decide to deploy a firearm, whatever you use is considered deadly force by law. Rat shot or hollow points - it doesn't matter.  Rat shot is for rats.  We are a lot bigger than rats. Read this: http://www.theboxotruth.com/the-box-o-truth-30-snakeloads-o-truth/

Please do your research and understand your state's use of force laws.  There has been some terrible (and inaccurate) advice in this thread and use of deadly force can change your life - for your own safety (both physically and legally) and the safety of others, please make sure you are very familiar with your state laws as well as with your firearm (and how to use it). Training is important. Training under stress is important. Most people (including myself) do not do this enough.

I am far from an "expert," but with 19 years owning firearms and 5 years in law enforcement, I have more than a passing knowledge of this topic.

This.  Being an avid firearm owner, my suggestion is to have at least one that you can use for home defense and know how to use it.  Many people mistakingly assume that because they own a gun, they are fully protected in any possible senario.  Hardware is much less useful if there's no software to run it. 

You could sell your Kimber, purchase a HD shotgun, take a shotgun-oriented training course, and still bank a couple hundred dollars.

[Eric]

Ottowa - please do not use flawed statistics. The "studies" you refer to are including gang violence and suicides, which dramatically skew figures in favor of the anti-gun crowd.

Suicide doesn't count?  Damn, man, that's some cold shit right there.  I would feel absolutely terrible if my gun was used by someone I loved to kill themselves.  Even worse than if I had to kill someone else. 

[Tetsuya Hondo]

Ottowa - please do not use flawed statistics. The "studies" you refer to are including gang violence and suicides, which dramatically skew figures in favor of the anti-gun crowd.

Do not use blanks for home defense. Do not use rat shot.  If you use a firearm you damn better be able to justify the use of deadly force or you can plan on going to prison for a long time.

There's no "playing around." If you've crossed that threshold where deadly force is justifiable - i.e. you are countering an imminent and immediate threat of unlawful deadly force (i.e. force that can cause serious bodily injury or death) and you decide to deploy a firearm, whatever you use is considered deadly force by law. Rat shot or hollow points - it doesn't matter.  Rat shot is for rats.  We are a lot bigger than rats. Read this: http://www.theboxotruth.com/the-box-o-truth-30-snakeloads-o-truth/

Please do your research and understand your state's use of force laws.  There has been some terrible (and inaccurate) advice in this thread and use of deadly force can change your life - for your own safety (both physically and legally) and the safety of others, please make sure you are very familiar with your state laws as well as with your firearm (and how to use it). Training is important. Training under stress is important. Most people (including myself) do not do this enough.

I am far from an "expert," but with 19 years owning firearms and 5 years in law enforcement, I have more than a passing knowledge of this topic.

In other words, live in CONSTANT FEAR! Carry a gun with you everywhere! Because someone somewhere is waiting to kill you!

This has been a paid public service announcement of the National Rifle Association, the Marketing Wing of Big Gun Industries. Keep those cash registers ringing folks!

As for those "studies," (there's no need for quotation marks, they really are studies) please show me exactly where in the actual articles from the journals your assertion about gangs being included is validated and actually has a significant effect on the observed relationships. And as for suicides, those are real deaths too. Having a gun in the home isn't a lot of help to the suicidal.

As for the OP, if you can put the cash to better use then sell it. If it really makes you that much happier to have it, I would say keep it. But, given that you've lumped it in the category of "shit you don't need or use on a regular basis," it sounds like you already made up your mind.

[ShoulderThingThatGoesUp]

Let's not have the ideological discussion here. It's not the place.

[JLee]

Ottowa - please do not use flawed statistics. The "studies" you refer to are including gang violence and suicides, which dramatically skew figures in favor of the anti-gun crowd.

Do not use blanks for home defense. Do not use rat shot.  If you use a firearm you damn better be able to justify the use of deadly force or you can plan on going to prison for a long time.

There's no "playing around." If you've crossed that threshold where deadly force is justifiable - i.e. you are countering an imminent and immediate threat of unlawful deadly force (i.e. force that can cause serious bodily injury or death) and you decide to deploy a firearm, whatever you use is considered deadly force by law. Rat shot or hollow points - it doesn't matter.  Rat shot is for rats.  We are a lot bigger than rats. Read this: http://www.theboxotruth.com/the-box-o-truth-30-snakeloads-o-truth/

Please do your research and understand your state's use of force laws.  There has been some terrible (and inaccurate) advice in this thread and use of deadly force can change your life - for your own safety (both physically and legally) and the safety of others, please make sure you are very familiar with your state laws as well as with your firearm (and how to use it). Training is important. Training under stress is important. Most people (including myself) do not do this enough.

I am far from an "expert," but with 19 years owning firearms and 5 years in law enforcement, I have more than a passing knowledge of this topic.

In other words, live in CONSTANT FEAR! Carry a gun with you everywhere! Because someone somewhere is waiting to kill you!

This has been a paid public service announcement of the National Rifle Association, the Marketing Wing of Big Gun Industries. Keep those cash registers ringing folks!

As for those "studies," (there's no need for quotation marks, they really are studies) please show me exactly where in the actual articles from the journals your assertion about gangs being included is validated and actually has a significant effect on the observed relationships. And as for suicides, those are real deaths too. Having a gun in the home isn't a lot of help to the suicidal.

As for the OP, if you can put the cash to better use then sell it. If it really makes you that much happier to have it, I would say keep it. But, given that you've lumped it in the category of "shit you don't need or use on a regular basis," it sounds like you already made up your mind.

To the contrary - the entire point of my post was to help the OP. I don't give any fucks at all if any of you do or do not carry a gun. If you do, I want you to be prepared for the fallout that's possible.

[Cookie78]

Ottowa - please do not use flawed statistics. The "studies" you refer to are including gang violence and suicides, which dramatically skew figures in favor of the anti-gun crowd.

Do not use blanks for home defense. Do not use rat shot.  If you use a firearm you damn better be able to justify the use of deadly force or you can plan on going to prison for a long time.

There's no "playing around." If you've crossed that threshold where deadly force is justifiable - i.e. you are countering an imminent and immediate threat of unlawful deadly force (i.e. force that can cause serious bodily injury or death) and you decide to deploy a firearm, whatever you use is considered deadly force by law. Rat shot or hollow points - it doesn't matter.  Rat shot is for rats.  We are a lot bigger than rats. Read this: http://www.theboxotruth.com/the-box-o-truth-30-snakeloads-o-truth/

Please do your research and understand your state's use of force laws.  There has been some terrible (and inaccurate) advice in this thread and use of deadly force can change your life - for your own safety (both physically and legally) and the safety of others, please make sure you are very familiar with your state laws as well as with your firearm (and how to use it). Training is important. Training under stress is important. Most people (including myself) do not do this enough.

I am far from an "expert," but with 19 years owning firearms and 5 years in law enforcement, I have more than a passing knowledge of this topic.

In other words, live in CONSTANT FEAR! Carry a gun with you everywhere! Because someone somewhere is waiting to kill you!

This has been a paid public service announcement of the National Rifle Association, the Marketing Wing of Big Gun Industries. Keep those cash registers ringing folks!

As for those "studies," (there's no need for quotation marks, they really are studies) please show me exactly where in the actual articles from the journals your assertion about gangs being included is validated and actually has a significant effect on the observed relationships. And as for suicides, those are real deaths too. Having a gun in the home isn't a lot of help to the suicidal.

As for the OP, if you can put the cash to better use then sell it. If it really makes you that much happier to have it, I would say keep it. But, given that you've lumped it in the category of "shit you don't need or use on a regular basis," it sounds like you already made up your mind.

I feel like you missed the point entirely and went off to argue about something completely different. He's not saying you NEED a gun. He's saying you NEED to know how to use one and what the laws are if you have a gun.

[Mustache_In_Training]

Thanks for all the comments everyone, I didn't mean to start an ideological war on guns. Most of the comments are reaffirming what I've been thinking, ditch the pistol and pocket the cash.

It's somewhat difficult to admit, but in the event of a home invasion, I likely wouldn't be able to use it in an effective manner due to the minimal amount of practice I've had with it. Thus, I would probably be better off not having one at all. Yes I could practice more and take classes, but truthfully I don't have desire to do so. This coupled with the fact that I have a wife who suffers from depression, it seems like a no brainer. What am I waiting for?

[ShoulderThingThatGoesUp]

Thanks for all the comments everyone, I didn't mean to start an ideological war on guns. Most of the comments are reaffirming what I've been thinking, ditch the pistol and pocket the cash.

It's somewhat difficult to admit, but in the event of a home invasion, I likely wouldn't be able to use it in an effective manner due to the minimal amount of practice I've had with it. Thus, I would probably be better off not having one at all. Yes I could practice more and take classes, but truthfully I don't have desire to do so. This coupled with the fact that I have a wife who suffers from depression, it seems like a no brainer. What am I waiting for?

Yeah get that thing out the door.

[Ottawa]

Ottowa - please do not use flawed statistics. The "studies" you refer to are including gang violence and suicides, which dramatically skew figures in favor of the anti-gun crowd.

Sorry mate, but not a leg to stand on.  The reasons folks put forth in support of gun ownership are indigo herrings(* and **)

Back to the OP.  The data supports the proposition that the majority of deaths by gun are the result of suicide.  Something like 20,000 people per year in the states.  Unintentional deaths are around 100 per year. Homicides are around 10,000 per year.  Ridiculous.  I don't know how many 'rightful deaths by firearm for protection' occur.  I would bet it is a very small number.  Get rid of the gun! 

*2 levels up from red herrings.
**I have no further interest in gun debates.  I agree to disagree with guns kept for self protection.

[JLee]

Let's keep the philosophical arguments on Facebook, k? This is not the place.

Thanks for all the comments everyone, I didn't mean to start an ideological war on guns. Most of the comments are reaffirming what I've been thinking, ditch the pistol and pocket the cash.

It's somewhat difficult to admit, but in the event of a home invasion, I likely wouldn't be able to use it in an effective manner due to the minimal amount of practice I've had with it. Thus, I would probably be better off not having one at all. Yes I could practice more and take classes, but truthfully I don't have desire to do so. This coupled with the fact that I have a wife who suffers from depression, it seems like a no brainer. What am I waiting for?

Sell. No question, IMO.

[SpicyMcHaggus]

Thanks for all the comments everyone, I didn't mean to start an ideological war on guns. Most of the comments are reaffirming what I've been thinking, ditch the pistol and pocket the cash.

It's somewhat difficult to admit, but in the event of a home invasion, I likely wouldn't be able to use it in an effective manner due to the minimal amount of practice I've had with it. Thus, I would probably be better off not having one at all. Yes I could practice more and take classes, but truthfully I don't have desire to do so. This coupled with the fact that I have a wife who suffers from depression, it seems like a no brainer. What am I waiting for?

Maybe I can help. I'm a recovering gun addict.
Guns, when sold do not depreciate by age like cars or homes. If it's in good condition, it should sell for what you bought it for. If you are willing to hold out for the right buyer, you should get almost all your money back.
Guns, when stored and used properly are not a danger any more than a kitchen knife or garden shears. If your wife has depression, I strongly suggest that you get a good lock box and lock them all up except the one you are carrying.
Guns require practice. a .45ACP 1911 specifically requires practice. It's not a .22LR. You don't have the desire. That is the final straw for me-like people who drive only as a way to get somewhere, but are totally uninterested, so text or watch a movie while they drive- if you are going to own one, you should know how to use it and be practiced.

Regardless of what you do, you need to lock it down when you aren't carrying it.
If you want to sell it, I'm interested.
If you want to keep it, you need to take some classes.

Don't feel too bad about the price. You learned. I have a fancy-pants Springfield EMP that was $1299 MSRP.

[MsPeacock]

This seems like a topic for "Off Topic" (if at all) since it seems less about financial decisions and rather about arguments about owning or not owning guns, etc. I see this heading rapidly in the same direction as home schooling and creationism/evolution.

[Zora]

In other words, live in CONSTANT FEAR! ...

I wish there was a "like" button.

[hunniebun]

I am a gun owner and have have several restricted and non restricted weapons (in Canada restricted are mostly handguns and non-restricted are long guns for hunting). They are strictly regulated and we have them stored with trigger locks on all of them, in a full sized gun safe and all ammo is stored in a separate safe.  The odds of someone being accidentally harmed with a gun in our possession is zero.  Also, the odds of us being able to use any of these guns to defend ourselves in home intrusion is zero (unless they are really really slow stupid burglars).  Having said all that, we will not be selling them. We use them for leisure (target shooting) and hunting.  We always feel like if times were tough we could fill our freezer with game.    But that is just us.  If you don't use it for any reason besides 'just in case' I would be tempted to sell it.  See how you feel living without one and if you change your mind, you can buy something more practical with the end use in mind (basic self defense?).

Good luck whatever you decide!

[Guesl982374]

Sell. It sounds like you rarely ever use it and it wouldn't be of help in a home defense situation.

[BlueMR2]

I'd sell it and get a 9mm instead.  You can get a good one of those for half the price, ammunition is much cheaper, and they're just as effective with today's ammunition.

Do not get a shotgun.  If you're ever forced to use it in the house, you will be deaf afterwards.  A 9mm isn't exactly quiet either, but it's a LOT better.  I've been in enclosed spaces firing .223 caliber rifles, which are not as loud as a shotgun, and it was very painful, even with ear protection in place.  9mm is just a small pop in comparison.

[purplepants]

In the unlikely event my home is broken in to, I'm not sure I would actually use it? It's difficult to know how one would act in a situation like that.

I think if you're going to own a gun, you have to know the answer to this question. 

I know, without a doubt, that if someone tried to break into my house I would not hesitate to use my firearm.  When the cops arrived they'd probably find me rocking back and forth with my head in my hands.  I would probably need months or even years of therapy to deal with the aftermath.  I'm not saying it wouldn't affect me.  I'm just saying I know what I would do.

If you aren't sure if you could even bring yourself to use it, it's probably more of a liability than it is an asset.

[Gone Fishing]

Yes.

The current ammo/gun scare is winding down and prices are dropping.  While Kimbers do tend to hold their value well, you would probably get the best price by selling it as soon as you can.

When (and if) you decide what you want one for (self defense, target, hunting etc), you can buy back in (the appropriate model) at a lower price point. 

[Scandium]

In the unlikely event my home is broken in to, I'm not sure I would actually use it? It's difficult to know how one would act in a situation like that.

I think if you're going to own a gun, you have to know the answer to this question. 

I know, without a doubt, that if someone tried to break into my house I would not hesitate to use my firearm.  When the cops arrived they'd probably find me rocking back and forth with my head in my hands.  I would probably need months or even years of therapy to deal with the aftermath.  I'm not saying it wouldn't affect me.  I'm just saying I know what I would do.

If you aren't sure if you could even bring yourself to use it, it's probably more of a liability than it is an asset.

I'm mostly wondering about the logistics of using your gun on an intruder. How would you do it? Can you turn on all your lights? How do you verify it's not your wife or kids? Your kid's secret slumber party? Do you know what's the behind the wall your shooting against? (i.e. your kids room? Your neighbor's house?). Would you shoot immediately or yell freeze?

I appreciate, and support the idea of home defense, but I'm never sure how well it would work in practice. Part of the reason I haven't bothered owning a gun myself. I just have some pepper-spray and powerful flashlights. And would get a tazer if it wasn't illegal here (unlike guns.. :rolleyes:)

[SpicyMcHaggus]

In the unlikely event my home is broken in to, I'm not sure I would actually use it? It's difficult to know how one would act in a situation like that.

I think if you're going to own a gun, you have to know the answer to this question. 

I know, without a doubt, that if someone tried to break into my house I would not hesitate to use my firearm.  When the cops arrived they'd probably find me rocking back and forth with my head in my hands.  I would probably need months or even years of therapy to deal with the aftermath.  I'm not saying it wouldn't affect me.  I'm just saying I know what I would do.

If you aren't sure if you could even bring yourself to use it, it's probably more of a liability than it is an asset.

I'm mostly wondering about the logistics of using your gun on an intruder. How would you do it? Can you turn on all your lights? How do you verify it's not your wife or kids? Your kid's secret slumber party? Do you know what's the behind the wall your shooting against? (i.e. your kids room? Your neighbor's house?). Would you shoot immediately or yell freeze?

I appreciate, and support the idea of home defense, but I'm never sure how well it would work in practice. Part of the reason I haven't bothered owning a gun myself. I just have some pepper-spray and powerful flashlights. And would get a tazer if it wasn't illegal here (unlike guns.. :rolleyes:)

I have a strong strobing flashlight. No kids. Know what time the 'wife' comes and goes. The house is brick and plaster. According to law, you use deadly force only if in fear of great injury or death to yourself or another. IE, if they are climbing back out the window they broke in thru, shooting them in the back is frowned upon.

[wtjbatman]

I'm mostly wondering about the logistics of using your gun on an intruder. How would you do it? Can you turn on all your lights? How do you verify it's not your wife or kids? Your kid's secret slumber party? Do you know what's the behind the wall your shooting against? (i.e. your kids room? Your neighbor's house?). Would you shoot immediately or yell freeze?

I appreciate, and support the idea of home defense, but I'm never sure how well it would work in practice.

How would you do it? Well generally, you squeeze the trigger :)

Anyway, it's really not a difficult concept. No you don't shoot at a shadow you can't see, and you don't shoot through doors, or any such nonsense. You shoot at an identified threat to your own safety or the safety of others. What's an identified threat? Well it's not your wife and kids (and you shouldn't be shooting unless you can easily tell that, hey, that ain't them). You don't shoot at random children or teenagers who are having a secret slumber party either. Shooting in self-defense means just that, shooting when you believe your life is in danger. You're not shooting at a noise you heard in the kitchen.

I currently work private security (unarmed), went to school for LE, and am an avid shooter and firm believer in the right to own and use a weapon legally if you are properly trained and motivated to do so. OP, you clearly aren't. Sell that gun to someone who will appreciate it.

[Mississippi Mudstache]

Ottowa - please do not use flawed statistics. The "studies" you refer to are including gang violence and suicides, which dramatically skew figures in favor of the anti-gun crowd.

Do not use blanks for home defense. Do not use rat shot.  If you use a firearm you damn better be able to justify the use of deadly force or you can plan on going to prison for a long time.

There's no "playing around." If you've crossed that threshold where deadly force is justifiable - i.e. you are countering an imminent and immediate threat of unlawful deadly force (i.e. force that can cause serious bodily injury or death) and you decide to deploy a firearm, whatever you use is considered deadly force by law. Rat shot or hollow points - it doesn't matter.  Rat shot is for rats.  We are a lot bigger than rats. Read this: http://www.theboxotruth.com/the-box-o-truth-30-snakeloads-o-truth/

Please do your research and understand your state's use of force laws.  There has been some terrible (and inaccurate) advice in this thread and use of deadly force can change your life - for your own safety (both physically and legally) and the safety of others, please make sure you are very familiar with your state laws as well as with your firearm (and how to use it). Training is important. Training under stress is important. Most people (including myself) do not do this enough.

I am far from an "expert," but with 19 years owning firearms and 5 years in law enforcement, I have more than a passing knowledge of this topic.

LOL. I don't even lock my doors at night. Plus I live in Florida. If I shot my neighbor who drunkenly stumbled into my house one night thinking it was his own, the idiots at the state capitol would give me a medal.

But seriously, I am a hunter. I won competitions in skeet shooting and air rifle in high school. I don't mind guns. But I can't have a pleasant conversation with a true gun enthusiast, so I'm just going to stop right here. I absolutely hate America's bipolar relationship with guns.

[SantaFeSteve]

Let's not have the ideological discussion here. It's not the place.

+1

I agree with some other here - sell the Kimber (sweet as it is) and buy a pump action shotgun for home defense then use the money to pay debt or invest.

[Timmmy]

I'm mostly wondering about the logistics of using your gun on an intruder. How would you do it? Can you turn on all your lights? How do you verify it's not your wife or kids? Your kid's secret slumber party? Do you know what's the behind the wall your shooting against? (i.e. your kids room? Your neighbor's house?). Would you shoot immediately or yell freeze?

I appreciate, and support the idea of home defense, but I'm never sure how well it would work in practice.

How would you do it? Well generally, you squeeze the trigger :)

Anyway, it's really not a difficult concept. No you don't shoot at a shadow you can't see, and you don't shoot through doors, or any such nonsense. You shoot at an identified threat to your own safety or the safety of others. What's an identified threat? Well it's not your wife and kids (and you shouldn't be shooting unless you can easily tell that, hey, that ain't them). You don't shoot at random children or teenagers who are having a secret slumber party either. Shooting in self-defense means just that, shooting when you believe your life is in danger. You're not shooting at a noise you heard in the kitchen.
...

This ^

I'll add my 2 cents to this as well.  My pistol and a high powered flashlight are within arms reach when I'm laying in bed so only a few seconds away from being armed.  You would not want to turn on all the lights.  Being that it's your house you would have a distinct tactical advantage with the lights off.  You use the flashlight to identify your target and determine the threat level.  Once you've identified your target you can decide how you want to proceed.  Personally, I would issue verbal commands in an attempt to avoid having to shoot but your state laws would dictate what's required.

As far as shooting through things.  This is one of the reasons you only should use hollow points in a self defense situation.  Hollow points reduce the amount of penetration.  The chance of a hollow point coming out with enough force to do damage through a sheetrock wall if shot at any sort of angle is very slim.  But you should consider what is behind your target before pulling the trigger.  This is all basic gun safety/home defense stuff. 

The best form of home defense is to not have (or look like you have) nice things.  As mustachians that should be easy. 

[Scandium]

I'm mostly wondering about the logistics of using your gun on an intruder. How would you do it? Can you turn on all your lights? How do you verify it's not your wife or kids? Your kid's secret slumber party? Do you know what's the behind the wall your shooting against? (i.e. your kids room? Your neighbor's house?). Would you shoot immediately or yell freeze?

I appreciate, and support the idea of home defense, but I'm never sure how well it would work in practice.

How would you do it? Well generally, you squeeze the trigger :)

Anyway, it's really not a difficult concept. No you don't shoot at a shadow you can't see, and you don't shoot through doors, or any such nonsense. You shoot at an identified threat to your own safety or the safety of others. What's an identified threat? Well it's not your wife and kids (and you shouldn't be shooting unless you can easily tell that, hey, that ain't them). You don't shoot at random children or teenagers who are having a secret slumber party either. Shooting in self-defense means just that, shooting when you believe your life is in danger. You're not shooting at a noise you heard in the kitchen.
...

This ^

I'll add my 2 cents to this as well.  My pistol and a high powered flashlight are within arms reach when I'm laying in bed so only a few seconds away from being armed.  You would not want to turn on all the lights.  Being that it's your house you would have a distinct tactical advantage with the lights off.  You use the flashlight to identify your target and determine the threat level.  Once you've identified your target you can decide how you want to proceed.  Personally, I would issue verbal commands in an attempt to avoid having to shoot but your state laws would dictate what's required.

As far as shooting through things.  This is one of the reasons you only should use hollow points in a self defense situation.  Hollow points reduce the amount of penetration.  The chance of a hollow point coming out with enough force to do damage through a sheetrock wall if shot at any sort of angle is very slim.  But you should consider what is behind your target before pulling the trigger.  This is all basic gun safety/home defense stuff. 

The best form of home defense is to not have (or look like you have) nice things.  As mustachians that should be easy.

Sure, all easy now. Every single one here would obviously never shoot the wrong person when they are half asleep, in the dark, and have 0.5 sec to decide. Yet it does seems to happen..

And you're saying you have a loaded weapon within arms reach of your bed every night? Shit, I've gone to the bathroom while basically asleep (hit the target every time though..), or started putting my pants on and other dumb things. Not sure I'd want to risk bumping a loaded gun in my sleep, but maybe that's just me.

[mdc]

The probability of both very bad (murder, accidental homicide) and very good (successful self-defence) outcomes of gun ownership are pretty low. Any comments on this are ideology rather than real advice; you probably have one, but not for us to say what it should be.


If you want to turn gun ownership into a hobby, have you considered trading it for a .22lr that you can use to target shoot cheaply?

[Capsu78]

I consider my firearms and ammo "stache" simply part of a well diversified portfolio.   

[thd7t]

You have a $900 asset that will not depreciate or appreciate.  You don't use it.  It's taking up space and not making you happier.  Sell it.  There are more where that came from.

There.  A non-ideological (gunwise), but mustachian answer.

[alsoknownasDean]

Sell it. If you decide you want one later down the track, you can always buy another. Put that $900 to work in the meantime :)

[Timmmy]

I'm mostly wondering about the logistics of using your gun on an intruder. How would you do it? Can you turn on all your lights? How do you verify it's not your wife or kids? Your kid's secret slumber party? Do you know what's the behind the wall your shooting against? (i.e. your kids room? Your neighbor's house?). Would you shoot immediately or yell freeze?

I appreciate, and support the idea of home defense, but I'm never sure how well it would work in practice.

How would you do it? Well generally, you squeeze the trigger :)

Anyway, it's really not a difficult concept. No you don't shoot at a shadow you can't see, and you don't shoot through doors, or any such nonsense. You shoot at an identified threat to your own safety or the safety of others. What's an identified threat? Well it's not your wife and kids (and you shouldn't be shooting unless you can easily tell that, hey, that ain't them). You don't shoot at random children or teenagers who are having a secret slumber party either. Shooting in self-defense means just that, shooting when you believe your life is in danger. You're not shooting at a noise you heard in the kitchen.
...

This ^

I'll add my 2 cents to this as well.  My pistol and a high powered flashlight are within arms reach when I'm laying in bed so only a few seconds away from being armed.  You would not want to turn on all the lights.  Being that it's your house you would have a distinct tactical advantage with the lights off.  You use the flashlight to identify your target and determine the threat level.  Once you've identified your target you can decide how you want to proceed.  Personally, I would issue verbal commands in an attempt to avoid having to shoot but your state laws would dictate what's required.

As far as shooting through things.  This is one of the reasons you only should use hollow points in a self defense situation.  Hollow points reduce the amount of penetration.  The chance of a hollow point coming out with enough force to do damage through a sheetrock wall if shot at any sort of angle is very slim.  But you should consider what is behind your target before pulling the trigger.  This is all basic gun safety/home defense stuff. 

The best form of home defense is to not have (or look like you have) nice things.  As mustachians that should be easy.

Sure, all easy now. Every single one here would obviously never shoot the wrong person when they are half asleep, in the dark, and have 0.5 sec to decide. Yet it does seems to happen..

And you're saying you have a loaded weapon within arms reach of your bed every night? Shit, I've gone to the bathroom while basically asleep (hit the target every time though..), or started putting my pants on and other dumb things. Not sure I'd want to risk bumping a loaded gun in my sleep, but maybe that's just me.

When I'm suddenly awakened in the middle of the night, I snap to pretty fast.  Maybe you don't but I do.  Technically it's not loaded but the slide is open with a mag loaded so push a button and it's ready. 

If you think you can "bump" a loaded modern gun and cause it to fire you have a gross misunderstanding of the most basic principles of firearm operation.

Congrats on the perfect record of always hitting the target.  I'm proud of you!  Two gold stars today for you!

[Scandium]

I'm mostly wondering about the logistics of using your gun on an intruder. How would you do it? Can you turn on all your lights? How do you verify it's not your wife or kids? Your kid's secret slumber party? Do you know what's the behind the wall your shooting against? (i.e. your kids room? Your neighbor's house?). Would you shoot immediately or yell freeze?

I appreciate, and support the idea of home defense, but I'm never sure how well it would work in practice.

How would you do it? Well generally, you squeeze the trigger :)

Anyway, it's really not a difficult concept. No you don't shoot at a shadow you can't see, and you don't shoot through doors, or any such nonsense. You shoot at an identified threat to your own safety or the safety of others. What's an identified threat? Well it's not your wife and kids (and you shouldn't be shooting unless you can easily tell that, hey, that ain't them). You don't shoot at random children or teenagers who are having a secret slumber party either. Shooting in self-defense means just that, shooting when you believe your life is in danger. You're not shooting at a noise you heard in the kitchen.
...

This ^

I'll add my 2 cents to this as well.  My pistol and a high powered flashlight are within arms reach when I'm laying in bed so only a few seconds away from being armed.  You would not want to turn on all the lights.  Being that it's your house you would have a distinct tactical advantage with the lights off.  You use the flashlight to identify your target and determine the threat level.  Once you've identified your target you can decide how you want to proceed.  Personally, I would issue verbal commands in an attempt to avoid having to shoot but your state laws would dictate what's required.

As far as shooting through things.  This is one of the reasons you only should use hollow points in a self defense situation.  Hollow points reduce the amount of penetration.  The chance of a hollow point coming out with enough force to do damage through a sheetrock wall if shot at any sort of angle is very slim.  But you should consider what is behind your target before pulling the trigger.  This is all basic gun safety/home defense stuff. 

The best form of home defense is to not have (or look like you have) nice things.  As mustachians that should be easy.

Sure, all easy now. Every single one here would obviously never shoot the wrong person when they are half asleep, in the dark, and have 0.5 sec to decide. Yet it does seems to happen..

And you're saying you have a loaded weapon within arms reach of your bed every night? Shit, I've gone to the bathroom while basically asleep (hit the target every time though..), or started putting my pants on and other dumb things. Not sure I'd want to risk bumping a loaded gun in my sleep, but maybe that's just me.

When I'm suddenly awakened in the middle of the night, I snap to pretty fast.  Maybe you don't but I do.  Technically it's not loaded but the slide is open with a mag loaded so push a button and it's ready. 

If you think you can "bump" a loaded modern gun and cause it to fire you have a gross misunderstanding of the most basic principles of firearm operation.

Congrats on the perfect record of always hitting the target.  I'm proud of you!  Two gold stars today for you!

Sure if you keep the safety on you should be fine. I do have some idea how firearms work, but that was from my time in the military 15 years ago. And they only gave me an automatic rifle, no pistols. I have shot shot one a few times though. I'd be partial to the mp5, if I had to choose. for home defense.. :)

[GetItRight]

Keep the 1911, particularly if it's your only gun. Your life and the lives of your loved ones are worth at least $900. If you want to save a few bucks you could always buy a cheaper gun, but you have a nice 1911 which is a simple and reliable design that has been around forever. When you spread the cost over the rest of your life it's pretty cheap insurance even if you never need to use it in self defense.

Ignore the naysayers, you as an individual are far less likely to kill or injure an innocent person or any other than self defense shooting than police, who are the real danger... Yet I don't see the naysayers here proposing to disarm the police, who injure and kill innocent people at an alarming rate these days.

[Timmmy]

I'm mostly wondering about the logistics of using your gun on an intruder. How would you do it? Can you turn on all your lights? How do you verify it's not your wife or kids? Your kid's secret slumber party? Do you know what's the behind the wall your shooting against? (i.e. your kids room? Your neighbor's house?). Would you shoot immediately or yell freeze?

I appreciate, and support the idea of home defense, but I'm never sure how well it would work in practice.

How would you do it? Well generally, you squeeze the trigger :)

Anyway, it's really not a difficult concept. No you don't shoot at a shadow you can't see, and you don't shoot through doors, or any such nonsense. You shoot at an identified threat to your own safety or the safety of others. What's an identified threat? Well it's not your wife and kids (and you shouldn't be shooting unless you can easily tell that, hey, that ain't them). You don't shoot at random children or teenagers who are having a secret slumber party either. Shooting in self-defense means just that, shooting when you believe your life is in danger. You're not shooting at a noise you heard in the kitchen.
...

This ^

I'll add my 2 cents to this as well.  My pistol and a high powered flashlight are within arms reach when I'm laying in bed so only a few seconds away from being armed.  You would not want to turn on all the lights.  Being that it's your house you would have a distinct tactical advantage with the lights off.  You use the flashlight to identify your target and determine the threat level.  Once you've identified your target you can decide how you want to proceed.  Personally, I would issue verbal commands in an attempt to avoid having to shoot but your state laws would dictate what's required.

As far as shooting through things.  This is one of the reasons you only should use hollow points in a self defense situation.  Hollow points reduce the amount of penetration.  The chance of a hollow point coming out with enough force to do damage through a sheetrock wall if shot at any sort of angle is very slim.  But you should consider what is behind your target before pulling the trigger.  This is all basic gun safety/home defense stuff. 

The best form of home defense is to not have (or look like you have) nice things.  As mustachians that should be easy.

Sure, all easy now. Every single one here would obviously never shoot the wrong person when they are half asleep, in the dark, and have 0.5 sec to decide. Yet it does seems to happen..

And you're saying you have a loaded weapon within arms reach of your bed every night? Shit, I've gone to the bathroom while basically asleep (hit the target every time though..), or started putting my pants on and other dumb things. Not sure I'd want to risk bumping a loaded gun in my sleep, but maybe that's just me.

When I'm suddenly awakened in the middle of the night, I snap to pretty fast.  Maybe you don't but I do.  Technically it's not loaded but the slide is open with a mag loaded so push a button and it's ready. 

If you think you can "bump" a loaded modern gun and cause it to fire you have a gross misunderstanding of the most basic principles of firearm operation.

Congrats on the perfect record of always hitting the target.  I'm proud of you!  Two gold stars today for you!

Sure if you keep the safety on you should be fine. I do have some idea how firearms work, but that was from my time in the military 15 years ago. And they only gave me an automatic rifle, no pistols. I have shot shot one a few times though. I'd be partial to the mp5, if I had to choose. for home defense.. :)

Uh oh....  I'm screwed.  My gun doesn't have a safety. 

Mp5? Spray and pray for home defense?  Seems like an excellent plan. 

[southern granny]

If it is not important to you, and you don't know if you would even use it on an intruder, then by all means sell it.  I will keep mine and I can guarantee that if I wake up and find an intruder, that when I am 100 % sure that is an intruder, I would fire one warning shot and if he doesn't tear out the door, the second shot will be center mass.  Bless my redneck soul.

[Scandium]

I'm mostly wondering about the logistics of using your gun on an intruder. How would you do it? Can you turn on all your lights? How do you verify it's not your wife or kids? Your kid's secret slumber party? Do you know what's the behind the wall your shooting against? (i.e. your kids room? Your neighbor's house?). Would you shoot immediately or yell freeze?

I appreciate, and support the idea of home defense, but I'm never sure how well it would work in practice.

How would you do it? Well generally, you squeeze the trigger :)

Anyway, it's really not a difficult concept. No you don't shoot at a shadow you can't see, and you don't shoot through doors, or any such nonsense. You shoot at an identified threat to your own safety or the safety of others. What's an identified threat? Well it's not your wife and kids (and you shouldn't be shooting unless you can easily tell that, hey, that ain't them). You don't shoot at random children or teenagers who are having a secret slumber party either. Shooting in self-defense means just that, shooting when you believe your life is in danger. You're not shooting at a noise you heard in the kitchen.
...

This ^

I'll add my 2 cents to this as well.  My pistol and a high powered flashlight are within arms reach when I'm laying in bed so only a few seconds away from being armed.  You would not want to turn on all the lights.  Being that it's your house you would have a distinct tactical advantage with the lights off.  You use the flashlight to identify your target and determine the threat level.  Once you've identified your target you can decide how you want to proceed.  Personally, I would issue verbal commands in an attempt to avoid having to shoot but your state laws would dictate what's required.

As far as shooting through things.  This is one of the reasons you only should use hollow points in a self defense situation.  Hollow points reduce the amount of penetration.  The chance of a hollow point coming out with enough force to do damage through a sheetrock wall if shot at any sort of angle is very slim.  But you should consider what is behind your target before pulling the trigger.  This is all basic gun safety/home defense stuff. 

The best form of home defense is to not have (or look like you have) nice things.  As mustachians that should be easy.

Sure, all easy now. Every single one here would obviously never shoot the wrong person when they are half asleep, in the dark, and have 0.5 sec to decide. Yet it does seems to happen..

And you're saying you have a loaded weapon within arms reach of your bed every night? Shit, I've gone to the bathroom while basically asleep (hit the target every time though..), or started putting my pants on and other dumb things. Not sure I'd want to risk bumping a loaded gun in my sleep, but maybe that's just me.

When I'm suddenly awakened in the middle of the night, I snap to pretty fast.  Maybe you don't but I do.  Technically it's not loaded but the slide is open with a mag loaded so push a button and it's ready. 

If you think you can "bump" a loaded modern gun and cause it to fire you have a gross misunderstanding of the most basic principles of firearm operation.

Congrats on the perfect record of always hitting the target.  I'm proud of you!  Two gold stars today for you!

Sure if you keep the safety on you should be fine. I do have some idea how firearms work, but that was from my time in the military 15 years ago. And they only gave me an automatic rifle, no pistols. I have shot shot one a few times though. I'd be partial to the mp5, if I had to choose. for home defense.. :)

Uh oh....  I'm screwed.  My gun doesn't have a safety. 

Mp5? Spray and pray for home defense?  Seems like an excellent plan.

Yeah I guess if you can't aim it's spray and pray.

[libertarian4321]

Ditch the gun.  You are more likely to kill someone you love, yourself, or a 'non-deserving' stranger than you are to actually successfully defend yourself.  Plus, you'll be richer for it!  :-)

Nonsense.

Most of the gun deaths in this country (widely touted by liberals to take away our right to own guns) fall into a couple of categories 1) SUICIDES (that's the majority of them) and 2) homicides related to drug crime (mostly criminals killing each other over drugs, cops killing drug criminals (or vice versa), or innocent civilians cut down by drug criminals or cops in the "Drug war."

If you aren't suicidal, and aren't involved in drugs, aren't mentally ill, and are middle class or above, you have nearly a zero chance of being killed by a gun, and an even smaller chance of being killed by your own gun.

Back to the original topic:  The best weapon for home defense is a shot gun, with as short a barrel as possible (legal, of course :). 

Mustachian angle:  Shot guns are CHEAP.  You can still get a decent pump action shotgun (e.g. Mossberg Maverick) for LESS than $200 (just saw one for $189 at Academy, which annoys me, because I paid $200 for mine back in 1994).

So you could consider selling the M1911 and buying a shotgun.

Plus, when the Zombie Apocalypse happens, shotguns are going to be worth their weight in gold! :)

[Ottawa]

Ditch the gun.  You are more likely to kill someone you love, yourself, or a 'non-deserving' stranger than you are to actually successfully defend yourself.  Plus, you'll be richer for it!  :-)

Nonsense.

Most of the gun deaths in this country (widely touted by liberals to take away our right to own guns) fall into a couple of categories 1) SUICIDES (that's the majority of them) and 2) homicides related to drug crime (mostly criminals killing each other over drugs, cops killing drug criminals (or vice versa), or innocent civilians cut down by drug criminals or cops in the "Drug war."

If you aren't suicidal, and aren't involved in drugs, aren't mentally ill, and are middle class or above, you have nearly a zero chance of being killed by a gun, and an even smaller chance of being killed by your own gun.

Only nonsense if you misread what I said and then didn't read my other post on this topic further down the thread.

When you read the above bit you'll see that I postulate that you are more likely to misuse the gun than to SUCCESSFULLY SHOOT A REAL BAD GUY in your own home. 

Here is what I say further down in this thread (which aligns with what you say)

The data supports the proposition that the majority of deaths by gun are the result of suicide.  Something like 20,000 people per year in the states.  Unintentional deaths are around 100 per year. Homicides are around 10,000 per year.  Ridiculous.  I don't know how many 'rightful deaths by firearm for protection' occur.  I would bet it is a very small number.  Get rid of the gun! 

[JLee]

Plus, when the Zombie Apocalypse happens, shotgun shells are going to be worth their weight in gold! :)

Fixed ;)

[GuitarStv]

When the zombie apocalypse happens, I'm going to do my best to be bitten early so I can get some of the easy pickins brains before the inevitable and complete collapse of humanity.  The libertarian paradise that the zombie apocalypse would bring just isn't that appealing.