Lab diamonds

[iris lily]

Whoah, the cost of lab diamonds is dropping by the month. A decent  2 carat rock is several hundred dollars. Peanuts.

Lab diamonds are exactly the same material as mined diamonds.

I’m having fun looking at pink diamonds. Am also looking at “warm” diamonds of H or I color because they strike me as being so elegant and old world, kind of antique looking with that tinge of cream.

This is going to be very hard on the mined diamond industry.

[Metalcat]

Every single person I know who has gotten engaged in the past few years has a lab diamond.

Even my spendy-as-hell ex-chearleader SIL and all of her ex-chearleader friends who are mostly married to professional athletes and are obsessed with appearances and status, they all have lab diamonds, because there's just no social value anymore to having a mined diamond, not for the younger folks.

Mined diamonds seem to be a very stale "old person" thing to them as far as I can tell.

[dcheesi]

Every single person I know who has gotten engaged in the past few years has a lab diamond.

Even my spendy-as-hell ex-chearleader SIL and all of her ex-chearleader friends who are mostly married to professional athletes and are obsessed with appearances and status, they all have lab diamonds, because there's just no social value anymore to having a mined diamond, not for the younger folks.

Mined diamonds seem to be a very stale "old person" thing to them as far as I can tell.

If anything, there's negative social value in mined (aka "blood") diamonds. Lab diamonds are a win-win: save money while also virtue-signaling.

(FWIW, I bought a lab diamond for my wife's engagement ring, so I'm right there with 'em!)

[Wolfpack Mustachian]

I wonder at what point mined diamonds will be essentially worthless and if any other gem will follow suit.

[dcheesi]

I wonder at what point mined diamonds will be essentially worthless and if any other gem will follow suit.

Diamonds are a weird case, since their value was largely the result of market manipulation (on both the supply and demand sides) to begin with. They're also like the "vodka" of gemstones --unlike other varieties, where the specific impurities determine the qualities of the product, for diamonds it's the lack impurities that make them desirable. Lab synthesis is uniquely suited to creating high-purity gemstones, so diamonds are really the perfect target for that.

I suppose a truer test might the market for sapphires/rubies? We've been able to make high-quality sapphire "glass" for years, which is used for things like watch faces etc. But a big part of what makes sapphire gems desirable is their unique colors, which arise from impurities and inclusions.

I haven't looked into the lab-grown sapphire market, though they are apparently "a thing"; perhaps someone else can offer some insight?

[iris lily]

I wonder at what point mined diamonds will be essentially worthless and if any other gem will follow suit.

Diamonds are a weird case, since their value was largely the result of market manipulation (on both the supply and demand sides) to begin with. They're also like the "vodka" of gemstones --unlike other varieties, where the specific impurities determine the qualities of the product, for diamonds it's the lack impurities that make them desirable. Lab synthesis is uniquely suited to creating high-purity gemstones, so diamonds are really the perfect target for that.

I suppose a truer test might the market for sapphires/rubies? We've been able to make high-quality sapphire "glass" for years, which is used for things like watch faces etc. But a big part of what makes sapphire gems desirable is their unique colors, which arise from impurities and inclusions.

I haven't looked into the lab-grown sapphire market, though they are apparently "a thing"; perhaps someone else can offer some insight?

Can’t speak to corundum (sapphires and rubies) but I have a lab emerald, cheap and boring. Clear like glass. Yawn.

It is the inclusions in natural emeralds that make them beautiful and interesting. I like inclusions that cover only part of the stone and look like bubbles, with clear bits to give depth.

[Financial.Velociraptor]

The oilfield uses a lot of synthetic diamond as cutters in "PDC" drill bits.  They are coal black and mass produced in cylinders of various diameters that are welded in.  Each 'diamond' bit can be run four times.  You pull the bit, remove the diamond cutter with a torch, rotate 90 degrees and weld back in place for the next trip down hole.

Natural diamond abrasive is still used for "impreg" bits as it turns out tiny and non gem quality diamond is ubiquitous and cheaper than what can be manufactured.

[GilesMM]

Gems are a luxury good and, as such, buyers will always prefer the real article to synthetic.  Supply and demand means the genuine article will always be far more valuable.   Case in point, you can buy a "synthetic" Rolex watch of fairly high quality these days for $300-1500 when the real one starts around $10K.  However, real Rolex watches continue to hold value and in fact increase.  The fake ones are accessible to buyers farther down the market who, after buying one, then aspire to the real thing so it may actually help the market for the genuine watches.

[charis]

Whoah, the cost of lab diamonds is dropping by the month. A decent  2 carat rock is several hundred dollars. Peanuts.

Lab diamonds are exactly the same material as mined diamonds.

I’m having fun looking at pink diamonds. Am also looking at “warm” diamonds of H or I color because they strike me as being so elegant and old world, kind of antique looking with that tinge of cream.

This is going to be very hard on the mined diamond industry.

Where are you looking at these diamonds for peanuts?

[uniwelder]

My wife's engagement ring is a semi-mustachian (as precious metals and gems go) example of the phenomenon.  It seemed ridiculous to pay so much money and support horrible working conditions when we could get a 'superior' gem elsewhere.  She wanted a ruby in a platinum setting.  I was able to find an old platinum solitaire setting on Ebay for $500, which was the scrap price for the weight of metal, and a 2 carat marquise Chatham ruby for $350.  A jeweler got the stone set in the prongs, and then later made a matching wedding band to go with it.  Overall, I think about $1,200 for a very memorable item.

[Metalcat]

I wonder at what point mined diamonds will be essentially worthless and if any other gem will follow suit.

Diamonds are a weird case, since their value was largely the result of market manipulation (on both the supply and demand sides) to begin with. They're also like the "vodka" of gemstones --unlike other varieties, where the specific impurities determine the qualities of the product, for diamonds it's the lack impurities that make them desirable. Lab synthesis is uniquely suited to creating high-purity gemstones, so diamonds are really the perfect target for that.

I suppose a truer test might the market for sapphires/rubies? We've been able to make high-quality sapphire "glass" for years, which is used for things like watch faces etc. But a big part of what makes sapphire gems desirable is their unique colors, which arise from impurities and inclusions.

I haven't looked into the lab-grown sapphire market, though they are apparently "a thing"; perhaps someone else can offer some insight?

Lab made emeralds, sapphires and rubies have been enormously popular for years. It's actually pretty hard to find jewelry made from mined rubies and sapphires now and they're generally only very expensive pieces.

In the average retail jewelry store you will see endless displays of affordable lab gem jewelry.

But as was mentioned above, they're too flawless, they look kind of like jolly ranchers.

[spartana]

The oilfield uses a lot of synthetic diamond as cutters in "PDC" drill bits.  They are coal black and mass produced in cylinders of various diameters that are welded in.  Each 'diamond' bit can be run four times.  You pull the bit, remove the diamond cutter with a torch, rotate 90 degrees and weld back in place for the next trip down hole.

Natural diamond abrasive is still used for "impreg" bits as it turns out tiny and non gem quality diamond is ubiquitous and cheaper than what can be manufactured.

I've used a lot of diamond grinders and blades to cut metal but my (very limited) experience with drill bits was kind of meh. But that was on small stuff not big oil rig stuff. They were always natural diamonds but I image now most industry uses lab grown diamonds. They may be even harder and better at cutting metal and of course less environmentally and socially harmful.

As for diamond jewelry, well any jewelry, I think they are all pretty but couldn't tell the difference between a natural gem stone, a lab grown one or a piece of glass. Personally I never really wore jewelry except ear rings and don't see their value beyond industrial use or as pretty shiny and usually expensive bling. 

[Financial.Velociraptor]

The oilfield uses a lot of synthetic diamond as cutters in "PDC" drill bits.  They are coal black and mass produced in cylinders of various diameters that are welded in.  Each 'diamond' bit can be run four times.  You pull the bit, remove the diamond cutter with a torch, rotate 90 degrees and weld back in place for the next trip down hole.

Natural diamond abrasive is still used for "impreg" bits as it turns out tiny and non gem quality diamond is ubiquitous and cheaper than what can be manufactured.

I've used a lot of diamond grinders and blades to cut metal but my (very limited) experience with drill bits was kind of meh. But that was on small stuff not big oil rig stuff. They were always natural diamonds but I image now most industry uses lab grown diamonds. They may be even harder and better at cutting metal and of course less environmentally and socially harmful.

As for diamond jewelry, well any jewelry, I think they are all pretty but couldn't tell the difference between a natural gem stone, a lab grown one or a piece of glass. Personally I never really wore jewelry except ear rings and don't see their value beyond industrial use or as pretty shiny and usually expensive bling.

The size of the diamonds used on hand tools suggest they were probably natural diamond.  Those are available in enormous quantity.  The idea that diamonds are rare is a myth.  Diamond is one of the most ubiquitous crystal minerals in the Earth's crust.  Most of the US can go in their backyard with a shovel and turn up natural diamond.  They are just barely macroscopic and not 'pretty'.  It is just 'large' and 'pretty' natural diamond that are in limited supply.  For a PDC bit you might need dozens of cylinders that are about the diameter of a quarter (or as small as a #2 pencil eraser) and half an inch or more thick.  They don't form like that naturally. 

DeBeers is actually one of the biggest players in gemstone quality synthetics and synthetic abrasive. I think they call the abrasive division Element 6.  The other big player is Diamond Abrasive Corporation.  It is as simple as injecting CO2 into a Helium cooled chamber and zapping the hell out of it with a laser.  Of course, I left the oilfield in 2012 so my knowledge is probably rather dated.

[Metalcat]

The oilfield uses a lot of synthetic diamond as cutters in "PDC" drill bits.  They are coal black and mass produced in cylinders of various diameters that are welded in.  Each 'diamond' bit can be run four times.  You pull the bit, remove the diamond cutter with a torch, rotate 90 degrees and weld back in place for the next trip down hole.

Natural diamond abrasive is still used for "impreg" bits as it turns out tiny and non gem quality diamond is ubiquitous and cheaper than what can be manufactured.

I've used a lot of diamond grinders and blades to cut metal but my (very limited) experience with drill bits was kind of meh. But that was on small stuff not big oil rig stuff. They were always natural diamonds but I image now most industry uses lab grown diamonds. They may be even harder and better at cutting metal and of course less environmentally and socially harmful.

As for diamond jewelry, well any jewelry, I think they are all pretty but couldn't tell the difference between a natural gem stone, a lab grown one or a piece of glass. Personally I never really wore jewelry except ear rings and don't see their value beyond industrial use or as pretty shiny and usually expensive bling.

You could 100% tell the difference between a natural ruby as a lab ruby. It's so obvious, you would probably assume they're different stones.

But yeah, it would only matter which one you found more pretty.

[iris lily]

Whoah, the cost of lab diamonds is dropping by the month. A decent  2 carat rock is several hundred dollars. Peanuts.

Lab diamonds are exactly the same material as mined diamonds.

I’m having fun looking at pink diamonds. Am also looking at “warm” diamonds of H or I color because they strike me as being so elegant and old world, kind of antique looking with that tinge of cream.

This is going to be very hard on the mined diamond industry.

Where are you looking at these diamonds for peanuts?

https://www.luvansh.com/


Mined stones that go for several thousand dollars have lab equivilents  that go for several hundred dollars.

This is one of several online overseas dealers that seem to be legit. I have not seen GIA ratings (Gemological Institute of America) there  but IGI (a less rigorous rater) ratings are there. I don’t think Luvansh holds these stones, I think it is a marketer.

For a few hundred bucks, I do not mind the lack of GIA ratings.

[iris lily]

Every single person I know who has gotten engaged in the past few years has a lab diamond.

Even my spendy-as-hell ex-chearleader SIL and all of her ex-chearleader friends who are mostly married to professional athletes and are obsessed with appearances and status, they all have lab diamonds, because there's just no social value anymore to having a mined diamond, not for the younger folks.

Mined diamonds seem to be a very stale "old person" thing to them as far as I can tell.

I don’t think the lab trend has taken off here in flyover country of small cities. This week I went into a jewelry store to see 2+ carat stone on my hand to gauge size. The biggest one they had in their sample box of Diamond simulants was 2.5.

With labs, you can go big, much bigger than that! But I think I am happy,with 2.5, seems about right. I won’t go over 3 c.

[Metalcat]

Every single person I know who has gotten engaged in the past few years has a lab diamond.

Even my spendy-as-hell ex-chearleader SIL and all of her ex-chearleader friends who are mostly married to professional athletes and are obsessed with appearances and status, they all have lab diamonds, because there's just no social value anymore to having a mined diamond, not for the younger folks.

Mined diamonds seem to be a very stale "old person" thing to them as far as I can tell.

I don’t think the lab trend has taken off here in flyover country of small cities. This week I went into a jewelry store to see 2+ carat stone on my hand to gauge size. The biggest one they had in their sample box of Diamond simulants was 2.5.

With labs, you can go big, much bigger than that! But I think I am happy,with 2.5, seems about right. I won’t go over 3 c.

I'm not seeing huge lab diamonds in stores here either, but I see a lot of 0.7-1.5 lab diamonds in mall jewelry stores, they're just much cheaper than rings with stones that size used to be when they were all mined. My BFF here just got a 0.7 lab solitaire ring for a fraction of what a mined version would have cost close to 20 years ago.

[iris lily]

Gems are a luxury good and, as such, buyers will always prefer the real article to synthetic.  Supply and demand means the genuine article will always be far more valuable.   Case in point, you can buy a "synthetic" Rolex watch of fairly high quality these days for $300-1500 when the real one starts around $10K.  However, real Rolex watches continue to hold value and in fact increase.  The fake ones are accessible to buyers farther down the market who, after buying one, then aspire to the real thing so it may actually help the market for the genuine watches.

This is just not true. Lab diamonds are not the same thing as knock off luxury goods because they are exactly the same thing as the natural product. Exactly.

Since Diamond market value has always been carefully controlled with planned scarcity, and there really was not an exact substitute for mined Diamonds*, diamond prices remained high until this new technology allowed laboratory production of quality gems.

Genuine Rolex like genuine Birkin bags and etc are different from the knock offs. These  are not the same products. The craftsman-made original products are quite different from mass produced knock offs.

* Diamond substitutes have ranged from cheap cubic zirconias to higher end moissonite.

Notice I do not say “diamond simulants” because moissonite is a cool element in its own right.

[okits]

Gems are a luxury good and, as such, buyers will always prefer the real article to synthetic.  Supply and demand means the genuine article will always be far more valuable.   Case in point, you can buy a "synthetic" Rolex watch of fairly high quality these days for $300-1500 when the real one starts around $10K.  However, real Rolex watches continue to hold value and in fact increase.  The fake ones are accessible to buyers farther down the market who, after buying one, then aspire to the real thing so it may actually help the market for the genuine watches.

This is just not true. Lab diamonds are not the same thing as knock off luxury goods because they are exactly the same thing as the natural product. Exactly.

Their provenance is different and some people care about that. 

[Metalcat]

Gems are a luxury good and, as such, buyers will always prefer the real article to synthetic.  Supply and demand means the genuine article will always be far more valuable.   Case in point, you can buy a "synthetic" Rolex watch of fairly high quality these days for $300-1500 when the real one starts around $10K.  However, real Rolex watches continue to hold value and in fact increase.  The fake ones are accessible to buyers farther down the market who, after buying one, then aspire to the real thing so it may actually help the market for the genuine watches.

This is just not true. Lab diamonds are not the same thing as knock off luxury goods because they are exactly the same thing as the natural product. Exactly.

Their provenance is different and some people care about that.

Not as much for lab diamonds as just about anything else. The younger generations have been leaning away from mined diamonds since before lab diamonds were even a viable option.

So the mined provenance is not really a feature of value for much of the market. It might matter to some, but DeBeers still perceives lab diamonds as an "existential threat" to the mined diamond industry.

https://fortune.com/2023/09/03/diamond-demand-falling-lab-grown-stones-de-beers-cutting-cutting-prices/

[blue_green_sparks]

Thinking about things like this, the formula seems to be:
(rarity) + (suffering and carnage to obtain) + (level of social acknowledgement) = market value.
Could be diamonds, ivory, T-Rex fossils, or even bluefin tuna, I suppose.

Even with art/music it is assumed that "undergone suffering" adds value. Cut off an ear and post it in a letter, sell your soul at the crossroads. That kinda thing. We really are special animals.

[Metalcat]

Thinking about things like this, the formula seems to be:
(rarity) + (suffering and carnage to obtain) + (level of social acknowledgement) = market value.
Could be diamonds, ivory, T-Rex fossils, or even bluefin tuna, I suppose.

Even with art/music it is assumed that "undergone suffering" adds value. Cut off an ear and post it in a letter, sell your soul at the crossroads. That kinda thing. We really are special animals.

Except not really in this case, no one seems to be valuing the suffering part of mined diamonds, the.demand for them was plummeting well before lab diamonds were even an alternative.

Mined diamonds are more like the new version of the big 80s fur coats as a symbol of luxury.

This Guardian article covers the collapse of the mined diamond demand and prices, here's a quote from a diamond broker.

"Five years ago, 100% of the diamonds my company handled were mined; now that’s gone down to 20%
Broker Steve Richards"

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2025/jan/19/mined-and-lab-grown-diamonds-difference-can-you-tell-prices

[RetiredAt63]

I'm the much older generation and if I were buying a diamond now, lab grown would be first choice, mined in Canada would be next.

[NorCal]

Thinking about things like this, the formula seems to be:
(rarity) + (suffering and carnage to obtain) + (level of social acknowledgement) = market value.
Could be diamonds, ivory, T-Rex fossils, or even bluefin tuna, I suppose.

Even with art/music it is assumed that "undergone suffering" adds value. Cut off an ear and post it in a letter, sell your soul at the crossroads. That kinda thing. We really are special animals.

Except not really in this case, no one seems to be valuing the suffering part of mined diamonds, the.demand for them was plummeting well before lab diamonds were even an alternative.

Mined diamonds are more like the new version of the big 80s fur coats as a symbol of luxury.

This Guardian article covers the collapse of the mined diamond demand and prices, here's a quote from a diamond broker.

"Five years ago, 100% of the diamonds my company handled were mined; now that’s gone down to 20%
Broker Steve Richards"

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2025/jan/19/mined-and-lab-grown-diamonds-difference-can-you-tell-prices

If there's a list of industries that deserve to go down in flames, mined diamonds are somewhere near the top of the list.  I might not put it in the top 2 or 3, but it's certainly in the top 20.

Good news

[iris lily]

My wife's engagement ring is a semi-mustachian (as precious metals and gems go) example of the phenomenon.  It seemed ridiculous to pay so much money and support horrible working conditions when we could get a 'superior' gem elsewhere.  She wanted a ruby in a platinum setting.  I was able to find an old platinum solitaire setting on Ebay for $500, which was the scrap price for the weight of metal, and a 2 carat marquise Chatham ruby for $350.  A jeweler got the stone set in the prongs, and then later made a matching wedding band to go with it.  Overall, I think about $1,200 for a very memorable item.

Elegant design!

[spartana]

The oilfield uses a lot of synthetic diamond as cutters in "PDC" drill bits.  They are coal black and mass produced in cylinders of various diameters that are welded in.  Each 'diamond' bit can be run four times.  You pull the bit, remove the diamond cutter with a torch, rotate 90 degrees and weld back in place for the next trip down hole.

Natural diamond abrasive is still used for "impreg" bits as it turns out tiny and non gem quality diamond is ubiquitous and cheaper than what can be manufactured.

I've used a lot of diamond grinders and blades to cut metal but my (very limited) experience with drill bits was kind of meh. But that was on small stuff not big oil rig stuff. They were always natural diamonds but I image now most industry uses lab grown diamonds. They may be even harder and better at cutting metal and of course less environmentally and socially harmful.

As for diamond jewelry, well any jewelry, I think they are all pretty but couldn't tell the difference between a natural gem stone, a lab grown one or a piece of glass. Personally I never really wore jewelry except ear rings and don't see their value beyond industrial use or as pretty shiny and usually expensive bling.

You could 100% tell the difference between a natural ruby as a lab ruby. It's so obvious, you would probably assume they're different stones.

But yeah, it would only matter which one you found more pretty.

Maybe if someone pointed out the difference on each so that I could see them together but as a non-jewelry person I don't think I'd have enough knowledge to tell the difference. I'm a bit of a rock hound and like to go out into the desert and hammer on rocks to see what's there. I always get a ton of garnet which can look like rubies and come in different colors and clarities. In their rough natural state I could tell the difference...maybe...but when made into jewelry I couldn't tell. They're worthless of course but a fun little inexpensive hobby.

[Metalcat]

The oilfield uses a lot of synthetic diamond as cutters in "PDC" drill bits.  They are coal black and mass produced in cylinders of various diameters that are welded in.  Each 'diamond' bit can be run four times.  You pull the bit, remove the diamond cutter with a torch, rotate 90 degrees and weld back in place for the next trip down hole.

Natural diamond abrasive is still used for "impreg" bits as it turns out tiny and non gem quality diamond is ubiquitous and cheaper than what can be manufactured.

I've used a lot of diamond grinders and blades to cut metal but my (very limited) experience with drill bits was kind of meh. But that was on small stuff not big oil rig stuff. They were always natural diamonds but I image now most industry uses lab grown diamonds. They may be even harder and better at cutting metal and of course less environmentally and socially harmful.

As for diamond jewelry, well any jewelry, I think they are all pretty but couldn't tell the difference between a natural gem stone, a lab grown one or a piece of glass. Personally I never really wore jewelry except ear rings and don't see their value beyond industrial use or as pretty shiny and usually expensive bling.

You could 100% tell the difference between a natural ruby as a lab ruby. It's so obvious, you would probably assume they're different stones.

But yeah, it would only matter which one you found more pretty.

Maybe if someone pointed out the difference on each so that I could see them together but as a non-jewelry person I don't think I'd have enough knowledge to tell the difference. I'm a bit of a rock hound and like to go out into the desert and hammer on rocks to see what's there. I always get a ton of garnet which can look like rubies and come in different colors and clarities. In their rough natural state I could tell the difference...maybe...but when made into jewelry I couldn't tell. They're worthless of course but a fun little inexpensive hobby.

The kind of ruby that could be mistaken for a lab ruby would be insanely rare. You could absolutely,.immediately tell the difference between an average mined ruby and a lab ruby. The difference wouldn't even be subtle.

Now that's largely because people who don't encounter a lot of rubies tend to think they look very different than they do. That's primarily because what most people think are rubies are actually spinels. Many, if not most large red "rubies" featured in royal jewelry are actually spinels because large, deep red rubies are so rare. Spinels do actually look quite a bit like lab rubies.

It's not even common for rubies to be red, they're usually pink and quite cloudy. Even if you do see a red mined ruby, they're usually heat/chemical treated to make them redder, they don't come out of the ground that colour, except in a few limited regions of the world. 

So yeah, I'm very, very confident that virtually anyone could tell the difference between a mined ruby and lab ruby, even if they had no idea what rubies typically look like, because if they were in front of you, the difference would be so stark. 

[iris lily]

The oilfield uses a lot of synthetic diamond as cutters in "PDC" drill bits.  They are coal black and mass produced in cylinders of various diameters that are welded in.  Each 'diamond' bit can be run four times.  You pull the bit, remove the diamond cutter with a torch, rotate 90 degrees and weld back in place for the next trip down hole.

Natural diamond abrasive is still used for "impreg" bits as it turns out tiny and non gem quality diamond is ubiquitous and cheaper than what can be manufactured.

I've used a lot of diamond grinders and blades to cut metal but my (very limited) experience with drill bits was kind of meh. But that was on small stuff not big oil rig stuff. They were always natural diamonds but I image now most industry uses lab grown diamonds. They may be even harder and better at cutting metal and of course less environmentally and socially harmful.

As for diamond jewelry, well any jewelry, I think they are all pretty but couldn't tell the difference between a natural gem stone, a lab grown one or a piece of glass. Personally I never really wore jewelry except ear rings and don't see their value beyond industrial use or as pretty shiny and usually expensive bling.

You could 100% tell the difference between a natural ruby as a lab ruby. It's so obvious, you would probably assume they're different stones.

But yeah, it would only matter which one you found more pretty.

Maybe if someone pointed out the difference on each so that I could see them together but as a non-jewelry person I don't think I'd have enough knowledge to tell the difference. I'm a bit of a rock hound and like to go out into the desert and hammer on rocks to see what's there. I always get a ton of garnet which can look like rubies and come in different colors and clarities. In their rough natural state I could tell the difference...maybe...but when made into jewelry I couldn't tell. They're worthless of course but a fun little inexpensive hobby.

That is interesting Spartana that you get Garnet material out of rocks out west.

When anyone says Garnet, I can think of is the awful touristy garnet jewelry that’s all over the Czech Republic. Store after store after store had exactly the same pieces. I never wanted to see another garnet after that again. I know that garnets were popular in Victorian times.

[spartana]

The oilfield uses a lot of synthetic diamond as cutters in "PDC" drill bits.  They are coal black and mass produced in cylinders of various diameters that are welded in.  Each 'diamond' bit can be run four times.  You pull the bit, remove the diamond cutter with a torch, rotate 90 degrees and weld back in place for the next trip down hole.

Natural diamond abrasive is still used for "impreg" bits as it turns out tiny and non gem quality diamond is ubiquitous and cheaper than what can be manufactured.

I've used a lot of diamond grinders and blades to cut metal but my (very limited) experience with drill bits was kind of meh. But that was on small stuff not big oil rig stuff. They were always natural diamonds but I image now most industry uses lab grown diamonds. They may be even harder and better at cutting metal and of course less environmentally and socially harmful.

As for diamond jewelry, well any jewelry, I think they are all pretty but couldn't tell the difference between a natural gem stone, a lab grown one or a piece of glass. Personally I never really wore jewelry except ear rings and don't see their value beyond industrial use or as pretty shiny and usually expensive bling.

You could 100% tell the difference between a natural ruby as a lab ruby. It's so obvious, you would probably assume they're different stones.

But yeah, it would only matter which one you found more pretty.

Maybe if someone pointed out the difference on each so that I could see them together but as a non-jewelry person I don't think I'd have enough knowledge to tell the difference. I'm a bit of a rock hound and like to go out into the desert and hammer on rocks to see what's there. I always get a ton of garnet which can look like rubies and come in different colors and clarities. In their rough natural state I could tell the difference...maybe...but when made into jewelry I couldn't tell. They're worthless of course but a fun little inexpensive hobby.

That is interesting Spartana that you get Garnet material out of rocks out west.

When anyone says Garnet, I can think of is the awful touristy garnet jewelry that’s all over the Czech Republic. Store after store after store had exactly the same pieces. I never wanted to see another garnet after that again. I know that garnets were popular in Victorian times.

It's all over some places in Calif and Nevada and Utah but it's usually very small pieces so not really worth anything but fun to find. That and the endless Trilobites that I run across. @Glenstache is the resident geologist so maybe Garnett (and Trilobites) are common further north too.

[uniwelder]

The oilfield uses a lot of synthetic diamond as cutters in "PDC" drill bits.  They are coal black and mass produced in cylinders of various diameters that are welded in.  Each 'diamond' bit can be run four times.  You pull the bit, remove the diamond cutter with a torch, rotate 90 degrees and weld back in place for the next trip down hole.

Natural diamond abrasive is still used for "impreg" bits as it turns out tiny and non gem quality diamond is ubiquitous and cheaper than what can be manufactured.

I've used a lot of diamond grinders and blades to cut metal but my (very limited) experience with drill bits was kind of meh. But that was on small stuff not big oil rig stuff. They were always natural diamonds but I image now most industry uses lab grown diamonds. They may be even harder and better at cutting metal and of course less environmentally and socially harmful.

As for diamond jewelry, well any jewelry, I think they are all pretty but couldn't tell the difference between a natural gem stone, a lab grown one or a piece of glass. Personally I never really wore jewelry except ear rings and don't see their value beyond industrial use or as pretty shiny and usually expensive bling.

You could 100% tell the difference between a natural ruby as a lab ruby. It's so obvious, you would probably assume they're different stones.

But yeah, it would only matter which one you found more pretty.

Maybe if someone pointed out the difference on each so that I could see them together but as a non-jewelry person I don't think I'd have enough knowledge to tell the difference. I'm a bit of a rock hound and like to go out into the desert and hammer on rocks to see what's there. I always get a ton of garnet which can look like rubies and come in different colors and clarities. In their rough natural state I could tell the difference...maybe...but when made into jewelry I couldn't tell. They're worthless of course but a fun little inexpensive hobby.

That is interesting Spartana that you get Garnet material out of rocks out west.

When anyone says Garnet, I can think of is the awful touristy garnet jewelry that’s all over the Czech Republic. Store after store after store had exactly the same pieces. I never wanted to see another garnet after that again. I know that garnets were popular in Victorian times.

It's all over some places in Calif and Nevada and Utah but it's usually very small pieces so not really worth anything but fun to find. That and the endless Trilobites that I run across. @Glenstache is the resident geologist so maybe Garnett (and Trilobites) are common further north too.

I want to find trilobites!  Hopefully they don't become so scarce that we begin manufacturing 'lab sourced fossils'

[spartana]

The oilfield uses a lot of synthetic diamond as cutters in "PDC" drill bits.  They are coal black and mass produced in cylinders of various diameters that are welded in.  Each 'diamond' bit can be run four times.  You pull the bit, remove the diamond cutter with a torch, rotate 90 degrees and weld back in place for the next trip down hole.

Natural diamond abrasive is still used for "impreg" bits as it turns out tiny and non gem quality diamond is ubiquitous and cheaper than what can be manufactured.

I've used a lot of diamond grinders and blades to cut metal but my (very limited) experience with drill bits was kind of meh. But that was on small stuff not big oil rig stuff. They were always natural diamonds but I image now most industry uses lab grown diamonds. They may be even harder and better at cutting metal and of course less environmentally and socially harmful.

As for diamond jewelry, well any jewelry, I think they are all pretty but couldn't tell the difference between a natural gem stone, a lab grown one or a piece of glass. Personally I never really wore jewelry except ear rings and don't see their value beyond industrial use or as pretty shiny and usually expensive bling.

You could 100% tell the difference between a natural ruby as a lab ruby. It's so obvious, you would probably assume they're different stones.

But yeah, it would only matter which one you found more pretty.

Maybe if someone pointed out the difference on each so that I could see them together but as a non-jewelry person I don't think I'd have enough knowledge to tell the difference. I'm a bit of a rock hound and like to go out into the desert and hammer on rocks to see what's there. I always get a ton of garnet which can look like rubies and come in different colors and clarities. In their rough natural state I could tell the difference...maybe...but when made into jewelry I couldn't tell. They're worthless of course but a fun little inexpensive hobby.

That is interesting Spartana that you get Garnet material out of rocks out west.

When anyone says Garnet, I can think of is the awful touristy garnet jewelry that’s all over the Czech Republic. Store after store after store had exactly the same pieces. I never wanted to see another garnet after that again. I know that garnets were popular in Victorian times.

It's all over some places in Calif and Nevada and Utah but it's usually very small pieces so not really worth anything but fun to find. That and the endless Trilobites that I run across. @Glenstache is the resident geologist so maybe Garnett (and Trilobites) are common further north too.

I want to find trilobites!  Hopefully they don't become so scarce that we begin manufacturing 'lab sourced fossils'

Too late!  https://newatlas.com/lab-made-fossils/55619/

[YttriumNitrate]

Gems are a luxury good and, as such, buyers will always prefer the real article to synthetic.  Supply and demand means the genuine article will always be far more valuable.   Case in point, you can buy a "synthetic" Rolex watch of fairly high quality these days for $300-1500 when the real one starts around $10K.  However, real Rolex watches continue to hold value and in fact increase.  The fake ones are accessible to buyers farther down the market who, after buying one, then aspire to the real thing so it may actually help the market for the genuine watches.

A big difference is that there are not trademarks associated with gems. A casual observer looking at a lab grown gem cannot tell whether it was mined or made in a lab. A casual observer looking at an imitation Rolex will know that it is not a real Rolex (or the company making the imitation will get sued by Rolex). As such, a real Rolex acts as a significant status symbol while a real gem does not.

[markbike528CBX]

I've always wanted to wander outside a jewlery store (preferably at a mall) with the phase diagram of carbon (see attached).
Diamonds are Thermodynamically Unstable!

I did have to wait until I retired, but now I'm too lazy :-)

You can go to a state park and scrape up some diamonds yourself.
https://www.arkansasstateparks.com/parks/crater-diamonds-state-park

Diamonds are chemically unstable too.
https://www.gemsociety.org/article/can-diamonds-burn/

[Glenstache]

All you need for garnet is a schist or higher grade metamorphic rock with a reasonable aluminium content. Pretty common, though usually not gem grade. Usually where you have mountains you have at least some metamorphic rocks, so garnet is not far away.

[crocheted_stache]

I've never been too excited about diamonds. I don't like wearing rings, especially with any features that stick out. I wear a pretty plain wedding band, and I made it clear to DH when I asked him to marry me that I didn't want an engagement ring. Other than that, I wear the occasional pendant that would probably be described as art jewelry, and that's about it.

If I ever decided to get a diamond, it would be lab grown or possibly heirloom/secondhand. I have no desire to fuel the cartels, slave labor, or environmental damage that is most diamond mining.

If anyone recalls the silly "Millennials are killing ___" articles from a few years back, diamonds were one of the things that completed such headlines. Even at the time, all I could think was, good riddance, and I hope they/we do a thorough job of it.

[jrhampt]

All you need for garnet is a schist or higher grade metamorphic rock with a reasonable aluminium content. Pretty common, though usually not gem grade. Usually where you have mountains you have at least some metamorphic rocks, so garnet is not far away.

Yep.  We have loads of garnet muscovite schist around here.

[GuitarStv]

Every single person I know who has gotten engaged in the past few years has a lab diamond.

Even my spendy-as-hell ex-chearleader SIL and all of her ex-chearleader friends who are mostly married to professional athletes and are obsessed with appearances and status, they all have lab diamonds, because there's just no social value anymore to having a mined diamond, not for the younger folks.

Mined diamonds seem to be a very stale "old person" thing to them as far as I can tell.

If anything, there's negative social value in mined (aka "blood") diamonds. Lab diamonds are a win-win: save money while also virtue-signaling.

(FWIW, I bought a lab diamond for my wife's engagement ring, so I'm right there with 'em!)

Pffft.  Stupid younger generation doesn't value the blood, sweat, and tears that went into having slaves mine actual diamonds for their rings.  Just another thing they're ruining.  :P

[FireLane]

I suppose a truer test might the market for sapphires/rubies? We've been able to make high-quality sapphire "glass" for years, which is used for things like watch faces etc. But a big part of what makes sapphire gems desirable is their unique colors, which arise from impurities and inclusions.

I haven't looked into the lab-grown sapphire market, though they are apparently "a thing"; perhaps someone else can offer some insight?

It's definitely a thing. I got my wife an engagement ring with Canadian diamonds from Brilliant Earth, but almost all the jewelry she's bought since then has lab stones.

She has a ring with an 11-carat (not a typo!) lab sapphire from SylvaRocks, which cost $400 - mostly for the gold band. It looks really spectacular. No one would ever guess how little it actually cost. She's also bought her mom lab-made ruby and emerald earrings as gifts.

[Louise]

Interesting that this was posted. This may not be frugal, but one thing I would love to do is buy some nicer jewelry. I don't have any nice jewelry except one pair of small amethyst stud earrings and my engagement/wedding ring (it's the same ring).

All my other jewelry (mostly dangly silver and bead stuff) I have aged out of and haven't worn in years. I'd love some simple gemstone hoop earrings and maybe a pendant necklace or two. I'd like to go with white gold (can't do yellow gold) instead of silver, but I'm having a hard time with the prices! Even the lab grown gems. My spouse says I should just get what I want, but I can't do it yet lol.

[crocheted_stache]

Interesting that this was posted. This may not be frugal, but one thing I would love to do is buy some nicer jewelry. I don't have any nice jewelry except one pair of small amethyst stud earrings and my engagement/wedding ring (it's the same ring).

All my other jewelry (mostly dangly silver and bead stuff) I have aged out of and haven't worn in years. I'd love some simple gemstone hoop earrings and maybe a pendant necklace or two. I'd like to go with white gold (can't do yellow gold) instead of silver, but I'm having a hard time with the prices! Even the lab grown gems. My spouse says I should just get what I want, but I can't do it yet lol.

I think there's space in frugality for one good set of jewelry in the same sort of way that there's space for one good suit. Past the point where you're otherwise financially on track, frugality isn't about avoiding every speck of excess, just being selective and intentional about things over and above the necessities.

[the_hobbitish]

Why white gold instead of silver? Doesn't white gold need a coating that eventually rubs off and tarnishes?

[iris lily]

Why white gold instead of silver? Doesn't white gold need a coating that eventually rubs off and tarnishes?

Silver is softer and it tarnishes. I have one white gold ring and I never have it re-dipped just like I never  have my platinum ring polished. Good settings with detail are never made in silver (tho I suppose you could argue about definition of “good.”)

[Louise]

Why white gold instead of silver? Doesn't white gold need a coating that eventually rubs off and tarnishes?

Silver is softer and it tarnishes. I have one white gold ring and I never have it re-dipped just like I never  have my platinum ring polished.

I don't own any white gold, but I read it tarnishes less. I'd prefer something lower maintenance. My ring is platinum too. I've only had it cleaned once and it's been almost 25 years. It still looks great and I wear it 24/7.

[Louise]

Interesting that this was posted. This may not be frugal, but one thing I would love to do is buy some nicer jewelry. I don't have any nice jewelry except one pair of small amethyst stud earrings and my engagement/wedding ring (it's the same ring).

All my other jewelry (mostly dangly silver and bead stuff) I have aged out of and haven't worn in years. I'd love some simple gemstone hoop earrings and maybe a pendant necklace or two. I'd like to go with white gold (can't do yellow gold) instead of silver, but I'm having a hard time with the prices! Even the lab grown gems. My spouse says I should just get what I want, but I can't do it yet lol.

I think there's space in frugality for one good set of jewelry in the same sort of way that there's space for one good suit. Past the point where you're otherwise financially on track, frugality isn't about avoiding every speck of excess, just being selective and intentional about things over and above the necessities.

This is good advice and I'm taking it to heart. I may consider a nice piece or two this year. I don't need a lot, that's for sure.

[Smokystache]

Always wanted to get my spouse some nice diamond earrings, but balked at the price tag.

For Xmas this year, I found 1 total ct weight diamond earrings (lab grown) for $350. Macys & Kay's Jewelers was showing regular prices of ~ $2500 for the same thing (sale prices of ~$1200). My Gen-X spouse was thrilled and especially happy that no one had to labor in a mine to get them. Now I don't have to buy jewelry for another 15 years (again!)

[hdatontodo]

My (64M) partner (58F) is near a family run local jewelry store that had a used fancy band with a diamond and side-diamonds for about $500. We asked about having the stone replaced with a larger lab grown diamond, and they referred me to another jewelry store. My partner picked out a 1.25 carat lab diamond and is having it mounted. Under $1K with new mounting pin setup and diamond was much cheaper than $5000 or whatever for a natural mined slave diamond would cost. Update: as it worked out, the jeweler located a similar but larger 1.4ct stone. it looks fantastic.

[Kathryn K.]

Always wanted to get my spouse some nice diamond earrings, but balked at the price tag.

For Xmas this year, I found 1 total ct weight diamond earrings (lab grown) for $350. Macys & Kay's Jewelers was showing regular prices of ~ $2500 for the same thing (sale prices of ~$1200). My Gen-X spouse was thrilled and especially happy that no one had to labor in a mine to get them. Now I don't have to buy jewelry for another 15 years (again!)

Where did you find that deal?

[iris lily]

Why white gold instead of silver? Doesn't white gold need a coating that eventually rubs off and tarnishes?

Silver is softer and it tarnishes. I have one white gold ring and I never have it re-dipped just like I never  have my platinum ring polished.

I don't own any white gold, but I read it tarnishes less. I'd prefer something lower maintenance. My ring is platinum too. I've only had it cleaned once and it's been almost 25 years. It still looks great and I wear it 24/7.

I don’t know that white gold tarnishes so much as it becomes creamy/cloud with the rodium wearing off.  But I haven’t really noticed a change after having it for 15 years.

I still prefer yellow gold for its no maintenance properties and it seems to be back in style.
I was surprised recently to see platinum is cheaper than gold.

[RetiredAt63]

Why white gold instead of silver? Doesn't white gold need a coating that eventually rubs off and tarnishes?

Silver is softer and it tarnishes. I have one white gold ring and I never have it re-dipped just like I never  have my platinum ring polished.

I don't own any white gold, but I read it tarnishes less. I'd prefer something lower maintenance. My ring is platinum too. I've only had it cleaned once and it's been almost 25 years. It still looks great and I wear it 24/7.

I don’t know that white gold tarnishes so much as it becomes creamy/cloud with the rodium wearing off.  But I haven’t really noticed a change after having it for 15 years.

I still prefer yellow gold for its no maintenance properties and it seems to be back in style.
I was surprised recently to see platinum is cheaper than gold.

Wow!  Platinum was the most expensive option for so long - my mother's engagement and wedding rings are platinum.

I like warm colours so yellow gold is great.  Rose gold is also pretty although I gather it is out of fashion right now?  My old Fitbit is rose gold and I like the colour.

[iris lily]

Why white gold instead of silver? Doesn't white gold need a coating that eventually rubs off and tarnishes?

Silver is softer and it tarnishes. I have one white gold ring and I never have it re-dipped just like I never  have my platinum ring polished.

I don't own any white gold, but I read it tarnishes less. I'd prefer something lower maintenance. My ring is platinum too. I've only had it cleaned once and it's been almost 25 years. It still looks great and I wear it 24/7.

I don’t know that white gold tarnishes so much as it becomes creamy/cloud with the rodium wearing off.  But I haven’t really noticed a change after having it for 15 years.

I still prefer yellow gold for its no maintenance properties and it seems to be back in style.
I was surprised recently to see platinum is cheaper than gold.

Wow!  Platinum was the most expensive option for so long - my mother's engagement and wedding rings are platinum.

I like warm colours so yellow gold is great.  Rose gold is also pretty although I gather it is out of fashion right now?  My old Fitbit is rose gold and I like the colour.

Rose gold is always offered along with white gold and yellow gold. I see rose gold as a perpetually second choice after white or yellow gold.

It’s funny that the ring I’m most contemplating right now will be in Rose

Gold is trading for around $2650 an ounce while platinum is trading for $960 ounce these days.