Author Topic: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?  (Read 193660 times)

GuitarStv

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1200 on: August 22, 2020, 12:33:42 PM »
I live in NC, and my MiL took us out on the large lake near Charlotte. If you go simply by the flags on the boats there, Trump will probably win this election.

I went for a walk around my city and if you went by the yard signs it would be trump winning by a land slide in November.

I went for a walk around my city and if you went by the yard signs, Trump would get about 1% of the vote.



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You must not win in real America.  :P

RetiredAt63

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1201 on: August 22, 2020, 03:11:05 PM »
I live in NC, and my MiL took us out on the large lake near Charlotte. If you go simply by the flags on the boats there, Trump will probably win this election.

I went for a walk around my city and if you went by the yard signs it would be trump winning by a land slide in November.

I went for a walk around my city and if you went by the yard signs, Trump would get about 1% of the vote.



FileUnder: Useless Anecdotes

And this is why democracies have secret ballots.

LaineyAZ

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1202 on: August 22, 2020, 07:41:38 PM »
I didn't realize until this week that you can buy political face masks.  I saw a woman wearing a "Trump 2020" mask. 
Of course I'm thinking of getting a "Biden/Harris" mask, but not sure I want to put up with the comments I'd likely get when I run into Trumpists in my area (which is actually purple, very close to turning blue). 

ysette9

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1203 on: August 22, 2020, 09:49:33 PM »
I didn't realize until this week that you can buy political face masks.  I saw a woman wearing a "Trump 2020" mask. 
Of course I'm thinking of getting a "Biden/Harris" mask, but not sure I want to put up with the comments I'd likely get when I run into Trumpists in my area (which is actually purple, very close to turning blue).
I thought Trump was against masks or at least didn’t support them? My head is spinning on the Trump mask.

GuitarStv

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1204 on: August 23, 2020, 07:36:47 AM »
I didn't realize until this week that you can buy political face masks.  I saw a woman wearing a "Trump 2020" mask. 
Of course I'm thinking of getting a "Biden/Harris" mask, but not sure I want to put up with the comments I'd likely get when I run into Trumpists in my area (which is actually purple, very close to turning blue).
I thought Trump was against masks or at least didn’t support them? My head is spinning on the Trump mask.

But we've always been at war with Eurasia. . .

RetiredAt63

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1205 on: August 23, 2020, 02:47:33 PM »
I didn't realize until this week that you can buy political face masks.  I saw a woman wearing a "Trump 2020" mask. 
Of course I'm thinking of getting a "Biden/Harris" mask, but not sure I want to put up with the comments I'd likely get when I run into Trumpists in my area (which is actually purple, very close to turning blue).
I thought Trump was against masks or at least didn’t support them? My head is spinning on the Trump mask.

He was only off by 36 years.  ;-/

But we've always been at war with Eurasia. . .

Khaetra

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1206 on: August 23, 2020, 03:57:38 PM »
I live in NC, and my MiL took us out on the large lake near Charlotte. If you go simply by the flags on the boats there, Trump will probably win this election.

I went for a walk around my city and if you went by the yard signs it would be trump winning by a land slide in November.

I went for a walk around my city and if you went by the yard signs, Trump would get about 1% of the vote.



FileUnder: Useless Anecdotes

Sadly my neighborhood/street is loaded with Trump flags and signs.  I'd love to put a Biden/Harris sign out but people can't seem to stay off other peoples property or keep their hands to themselves, so I won't.

talltexan

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1207 on: August 24, 2020, 07:16:33 AM »
Here in Charlotte we are entering the week of disruptions that were anticipated all along with the GOP convention. People are going nuts over the party's statement that they do not plan to adopt any kind of platform this year.

While I personally would like a statement of principles because I would like to live in a world in which people win power by stating their beliefs and following the constitution, I cannot help but see that--logically--this is going to be good for them, politically.

Dee18

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1208 on: August 24, 2020, 07:18:28 AM »
I have friends who have made it part of their daily routine to put out a Biden/Harris sign each morning and take it down each evening.  One of my friends found a pile of Biden/Harris signs the evening before garbage day and took them home to pass them out to the neighbors whose signs had been stolen.  Years ago, way back when Kerry was running, my sign was stolen.  A friend told me to coat my new sign with a light layer of motor oil.  I did and the sign remained, although twice there were hand prints  where someone had started to take the sign!

bacchi

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1209 on: August 24, 2020, 09:47:42 AM »
Years ago, way back when Kerry was running, my sign was stolen.  A friend told me to coat my new sign with a light layer of motor oil.  I did and the sign remained, although twice there were hand prints  where someone had started to take the sign!

This is a great idea. I don't have to do it now but I may eventually live in an angry pro-Trump neighborhood.

Castor oil would probably also work, eh?

wenchsenior

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1210 on: August 24, 2020, 09:55:36 AM »
Out of curiosity, what is the actual practical purpose of putting up political signs in such high profile races? Everyone already knows who they are going to vote for...putting a sign up isn't going to change anyone's mind.

I have been pondering this b/c a friend of mine REALLY wants us to put up a Biden sign (in a super Trump-y town). I don't really have a huge objection (though I'd worry about our car being vandalized if we left it parked out of the garage), but I also don't see the point.

At all.

RetiredAt63

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1211 on: August 24, 2020, 10:05:05 AM »
Out of curiosity, what is the actual practical purpose of putting up political signs in such high profile races? Everyone already knows who they are going to vote for...putting a sign up isn't going to change anyone's mind.

I have been pondering this b/c a friend of mine REALLY wants us to put up a Biden sign (in a super Trump-y town). I don't really have a huge objection (though I'd worry about our car being vandalized if we left it parked out of the garage), but I also don't see the point.

At all.

I've often thought it was opposition voter brainwashing.  That there is so much support for one candidate, there is no point bothering to get out and vote for the opponent. So opponents give up and don't vote, and the candidate with lots of signs does win. 

It's more fun here.  Last election, when I lived in farm country, there were red, blue, orange and green lawn signs.  Colourful.

wenchsenior

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1212 on: August 24, 2020, 10:22:08 AM »
Out of curiosity, what is the actual practical purpose of putting up political signs in such high profile races? Everyone already knows who they are going to vote for...putting a sign up isn't going to change anyone's mind.

I have been pondering this b/c a friend of mine REALLY wants us to put up a Biden sign (in a super Trump-y town). I don't really have a huge objection (though I'd worry about our car being vandalized if we left it parked out of the garage), but I also don't see the point.

At all.

I've often thought it was opposition voter brainwashing.  That there is so much support for one candidate, there is no point bothering to get out and vote for the opponent. So opponents give up and don't vote, and the candidate with lots of signs does win. 

It's more fun here.  Last election, when I lived in farm country, there were red, blue, orange and green lawn signs.  Colourful.

Ah, yes.  Good point.

Psychstache

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1213 on: August 24, 2020, 10:46:56 AM »
Out of curiosity, what is the actual practical purpose of putting up political signs in such high profile races? Everyone already knows who they are going to vote for...putting a sign up isn't going to change anyone's mind.

I have been pondering this b/c a friend of mine REALLY wants us to put up a Biden sign (in a super Trump-y town). I don't really have a huge objection (though I'd worry about our car being vandalized if we left it parked out of the garage), but I also don't see the point.

At all.

I've often thought it was opposition voter brainwashing.  That there is so much support for one candidate, there is no point bothering to get out and vote for the opponent. So opponents give up and don't vote, and the candidate with lots of signs does win. 

It's more fun here.  Last election, when I lived in farm country, there were red, blue, orange and green lawn signs.  Colourful.

Ah, yes.  Good point.

The yard sign thing came up here during the Cruz/Beto Senate Race. Beto had tons of signs and really energized voters in a way we hand't seen in a long time. Beto signs were everywhere, and Cruz supporters were mad because his campaign wasn't selling signs, because they didn't think there was a need as research showed yard signs had little impact on voting and was not a good use of funds. Eventually there was enough pressure from their constituency that they ended up printing and selling signs to 'compete'.

I don't think the sign issue had a real impact on the race, though it was incredible to see a statewide race be so close, esp given the trouncing of the last major 'competitive' race in the state (Wendy Davis taking on Gov Abbott).

Here's a whole article about the yard sign issue:

https://www.texastribune.org/2018/08/29/beto-orourke-ted-cruz-yard-signs/

economista

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1214 on: August 25, 2020, 08:11:34 AM »
We don't know how they voted last time, but a group of 27 republican former congressmen have come out to endorse Biden. I'm happy to continually hear about more people willing to cross party lines for this election.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/tommybeer/2020/08/24/27-prominent-republicans-including-jeff-flake-announce-theyll-endorse-joe-biden/#5e6361ab6a9d

Bloop Bloop

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1215 on: August 26, 2020, 07:36:26 PM »
You guys are lucky in the US that you can vote Democrat and still have a fiscally conservative government.

Here in Australia if I want to vote for the socially progressive party I also have to accept a big hike in my taxes. Always.

RetiredAt63

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1216 on: August 26, 2020, 08:17:23 PM »
You guys are lucky in the US that you can vote Democrat and still have a fiscally conservative government.

Here in Australia if I want to vote for the socially progressive party I also have to accept a big hike in my taxes. Always.

Every place is different.  Our Conservative Party is very conservative socially, not so much financially.

PKFFW

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1217 on: August 27, 2020, 05:30:49 AM »
You guys are lucky in the US that you can vote Democrat and still have a fiscally conservative government.

Here in Australia if I want to vote for the socially progressive party I also have to accept a big hike in my taxes. Always.
That's pretty funny.

The myth that the Liberals are fiscally conservative is one of the best bits of political brainwashing ever.  The Liberals outspend Labour just about every time they are in government.

ixtap

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1218 on: August 27, 2020, 05:36:41 AM »
You guys are lucky in the US that you can vote Democrat and still have a fiscally conservative government.

Here in Australia if I want to vote for the socially progressive party I also have to accept a big hike in my taxes. Always.
That's pretty funny.

The myth that the Liberals are fiscally conservative is one of the best bits of political brainwashing ever.  The Liberals outspend Labour just about every time they are in government.

We have the same problem between Dem and Rep. The Republicans run on a fiscally conservative policy, everyone says that, not the racist shit, is the appeal, and they promptly run up the deficit. But no one cares, because the racist, classiest shit was the important thing all along

Bloop Bloop

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1219 on: August 27, 2020, 05:51:45 AM »
You guys are lucky in the US that you can vote Democrat and still have a fiscally conservative government.

Here in Australia if I want to vote for the socially progressive party I also have to accept a big hike in my taxes. Always.
That's pretty funny.

The myth that the Liberals are fiscally conservative is one of the best bits of political brainwashing ever.  The Liberals outspend Labour just about every time they are in government.

Compare the two parties' platforms for the last election. Labor was promising to spend big on:

- Free dental
- Free childcare
- Mandating wage rises for certain workers
- blah blah blah

And to pay for this Labor would have had to:
- Raise the top tax bracket
- Repudiate the stage 2 and stage 3 tax cuts

This would have led to an earner on $200,000 a year being $11k a year worse off under Labor than Liberal. I'd say that's a big difference.

Even at state level, state Labor just hiked the stamp duty on vehicles above $150k from 5% to 9%

So it's not just about raw taxing and spending figures. It's also about how much of that taxing and spending goes straight to redistributive policies.

RetiredAt63

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1220 on: August 27, 2020, 07:01:13 AM »
You guys are lucky in the US that you can vote Democrat and still have a fiscally conservative government.

Here in Australia if I want to vote for the socially progressive party I also have to accept a big hike in my taxes. Always.
That's pretty funny.

The myth that the Liberals are fiscally conservative is one of the best bits of political brainwashing ever.  The Liberals outspend Labour just about every time they are in government.

Compare the two parties' platforms for the last election. Labor was promising to spend big on:

- Free dental
- Free childcare
- Mandating wage rises for certain workers
- blah blah blah

And to pay for this Labor would have had to:
- Raise the top tax bracket
- Repudiate the stage 2 and stage 3 tax cuts

This would have led to an earner on $200,000 a year being $11k a year worse off under Labor than Liberal. I'd say that's a big difference.

Even at state level, state Labor just hiked the stamp duty on vehicles above $150k from 5% to 9%

So it's not just about raw taxing and spending figures. It's also about how much of that taxing and spending goes straight to redistributive policies.

In Australia, is $200,000 in the top 10%, 5%, or what?

Growing up in a province where a lot of people had terrible teeth, the free dental makes sense.  People on tight budgets often put dental care way down on the list of priorities.

Quebec found its $5/day subsidized daycare ($7 now) was a moneymaker, as stay at home young mothers went back to work.

I'm a red panda

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1221 on: August 27, 2020, 07:31:58 AM »
Out of curiosity, what is the actual practical purpose of putting up political signs in such high profile races? Everyone already knows who they are going to vote for...putting a sign up isn't going to change anyone's mind.

I have been pondering this b/c a friend of mine REALLY wants us to put up a Biden sign (in a super Trump-y town). I don't really have a huge objection (though I'd worry about our car being vandalized if we left it parked out of the garage), but I also don't see the point.

At all.

This is the first year I've ever had a yard sign, because I always felt the same thing.  During the primary races, I had a Buttigieg sign.  I had SO many people ask about it, and it gave me a chance to talk to them about why I liked the candidate. A number of former Republicans from my neighborhood actually changed party to come to the caucus and caucus for Pete.

I have a Biden yard sign now because a lot of people feel resigned that Trump just has an overwhelming presence, so there is no point in trying to defeat him.  Showing that there are people with minority views does help empower the minority.   I've noticed more "I believe in science" and "Black Lives Matter" signs pop up than Biden signs lately, but sadly, they seem to mean the same thing.  But in a conservative city, it's good for the minority to show they are here too.

PKFFW

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1222 on: August 27, 2020, 07:16:42 PM »
You guys are lucky in the US that you can vote Democrat and still have a fiscally conservative government.

Here in Australia if I want to vote for the socially progressive party I also have to accept a big hike in my taxes. Always.
That's pretty funny.

The myth that the Liberals are fiscally conservative is one of the best bits of political brainwashing ever.  The Liberals outspend Labour just about every time they are in government.

Compare the two parties' platforms for the last election. Labor was promising to spend big on:

- Free dental
- Free childcare
- Mandating wage rises for certain workers
- blah blah blah

And to pay for this Labor would have had to:
- Raise the top tax bracket
- Repudiate the stage 2 and stage 3 tax cuts

This would have led to an earner on $200,000 a year being $11k a year worse off under Labor than Liberal. I'd say that's a big difference.

Even at state level, state Labor just hiked the stamp duty on vehicles above $150k from 5% to 9%

So it's not just about raw taxing and spending figures. It's also about how much of that taxing and spending goes straight to redistributive policies.
That's one platform from one election.

Try looking at what each party has actually done while in power.

MasterStache

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1223 on: August 27, 2020, 08:05:53 PM »
Out of curiosity, what is the actual practical purpose of putting up political signs in such high profile races? Everyone already knows who they are going to vote for...putting a sign up isn't going to change anyone's mind.

I have been pondering this b/c a friend of mine REALLY wants us to put up a Biden sign (in a super Trump-y town). I don't really have a huge objection (though I'd worry about our car being vandalized if we left it parked out of the garage), but I also don't see the point.

At all.

This is the first year I've ever had a yard sign, because I always felt the same thing.  During the primary races, I had a Buttigieg sign.  I had SO many people ask about it, and it gave me a chance to talk to them about why I liked the candidate. A number of former Republicans from my neighborhood actually changed party to come to the caucus and caucus for Pete.

I have a Biden yard sign now because a lot of people feel resigned that Trump just has an overwhelming presence, so there is no point in trying to defeat him.  Showing that there are people with minority views does help empower the minority.   I've noticed more "I believe in science" and "Black Lives Matter" signs pop up than Biden signs lately, but sadly, they seem to mean the same thing.  But in a conservative city, it's good for the minority to show they are here too.

I’ve seen a lot of the “I believe in science” signs along with the Biden signs. It’s crazy and sad those signs are relegated to a political party. But that’s where we are in America

marty998

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1224 on: August 28, 2020, 06:29:38 AM »
You guys are lucky in the US that you can vote Democrat and still have a fiscally conservative government.

Here in Australia if I want to vote for the socially progressive party I also have to accept a big hike in my taxes. Always.
That's pretty funny.

The myth that the Liberals are fiscally conservative is one of the best bits of political brainwashing ever.  The Liberals outspend Labour just about every time they are in government.

Compare the two parties' platforms for the last election. Labor was promising to spend big on:

- Free dental
- Free childcare
- Mandating wage rises for certain workers
- blah blah blah

And to pay for this Labor would have had to:
- Raise the top tax bracket
- Repudiate the stage 2 and stage 3 tax cuts

This would have led to an earner on $200,000 a year being $11k a year worse off under Labor than Liberal. I'd say that's a big difference.

Even at state level, state Labor just hiked the stamp duty on vehicles above $150k from 5% to 9%

So it's not just about raw taxing and spending figures. It's also about how much of that taxing and spending goes straight to redistributive policies.
That's one platform from one election.

Try looking at what each party has actually done while in power.

Lol Bloop give it a rest. Labor raised your taxes by what? 1% in 2010 as a result of NDIS levy? That’s it. That was the only tax increase federally..

State taxes different story... they’ve got to raise the money somehow. Can’t have nurses and police not being paid. Nominate how your raise the money instead of carping how much of a burden life is on $200,000 a year buying cars only the 1% can ever afford.

Honestly comparing  things that happen two elections away and say “see I’m $11,000 a year worse off” when the Liberals tax cuts haven’t even come into effect yet.

That’s ridiculous. Stopping a decision to proceed with tax cuts that haven’t happened yet is not a tax increase. Granted I’ll concede bracket creep however.

Scott and Josh have added more to the national debt in the past year than Labor did in 6. This idea that one side is good and one side is bad when it come to tax policy is utter tripe.

« Last Edit: August 28, 2020, 06:35:47 AM by marty998 »

Kl285528

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1225 on: August 28, 2020, 07:32:42 AM »
First time in my life I've ordered yard signs for a candidate. I'm one of those former Republicans who voted for Hillary (I'm more of a John Kasich kind of guy). The election of Trump caused me to switch my registration to the Democratic Party. I have also debated as to what the yard signs will do to help Biden get elected. I'm hopeful that someone in my high income neighborhood will see my sign, think I'm a reasonable person, and either engage with me regarding the election, or be persuaded in some way that it is ok to vote Blue. I doubt there is much effect on the hardcore from either side. I also want to show that I'm not afraid to have that conversation.

Bloop Bloop

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1226 on: August 28, 2020, 08:10:19 AM »
Marty, Labor also raised LCT from 25% to 33% and prolonged the deficit levy (and they would have prolonged it even further if they'd won last year). I don't have an issue with the NDIS levy because that's fairly applied to all incomes other than the poor.

State taxes I can think of a million ways to increase revenue, e.g., the first thing I'd do is apply land tax to PPOR. Easy, lucrative, fair, impossible to evade.

GuitarStv

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1227 on: August 29, 2020, 01:49:10 PM »
You guys are lucky in the US that you can vote Democrat and still have a fiscally conservative government.

Here in Australia if I want to vote for the socially progressive party I also have to accept a big hike in my taxes. Always.
That's pretty funny.

The myth that the Liberals are fiscally conservative is one of the best bits of political brainwashing ever.  The Liberals outspend Labour just about every time they are in government.

Compare the two parties' platforms for the last election. Labor was promising to spend big on:

- Free dental
- Free childcare
- Mandating wage rises for certain workers
- blah blah blah

And to pay for this Labor would have had to:
- Raise the top tax bracket
- Repudiate the stage 2 and stage 3 tax cuts

This would have led to an earner on $200,000 a year being $11k a year worse off under Labor than Liberal. I'd say that's a big difference.

Even at state level, state Labor just hiked the stamp duty on vehicles above $150k from 5% to 9%

So it's not just about raw taxing and spending figures. It's also about how much of that taxing and spending goes straight to redistributive policies.

In Australia, is $200,000 in the top 10%, 5%, or what?

Growing up in a province where a lot of people had terrible teeth, the free dental makes sense.  People on tight budgets often put dental care way down on the list of priorities.

Quebec found its $5/day subsidized daycare ($7 now) was a moneymaker, as stay at home young mothers went back to work.

An inconvenient fact that many 'fiscal conservatives' often overlook is that many times increasing government spending has net savings for the whole country.  It's important to make sure that when you're talking about 'fiscal conservatism' you're not really talking about 'puritanical nonsense that costs us all money'.

PDXTabs

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1228 on: August 29, 2020, 10:45:21 PM »
An inconvenient fact that many 'fiscal conservatives' often overlook is that many times increasing government spending has net savings for the whole country.  It's important to make sure that when you're talking about 'fiscal conservatism' you're not really talking about 'puritanical nonsense that costs us all money'.

Yup, copying and pasting the UK NHS would be fiscally conservative. Cutting the size of the military in half would be fiscally conservative. Raising taxes to pay down the debt would be fiscally conservative. There aren't enough fiscal conservatives left to get a bill passed.

scottish

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1229 on: August 30, 2020, 08:33:18 AM »
You guys are lucky in the US that you can vote Democrat and still have a fiscally conservative government.

Here in Australia if I want to vote for the socially progressive party I also have to accept a big hike in my taxes. Always.
That's pretty funny.

The myth that the Liberals are fiscally conservative is one of the best bits of political brainwashing ever.  The Liberals outspend Labour just about every time they are in government.

Compare the two parties' platforms for the last election. Labor was promising to spend big on:

- Free dental
- Free childcare
- Mandating wage rises for certain workers
- blah blah blah

And to pay for this Labor would have had to:
- Raise the top tax bracket
- Repudiate the stage 2 and stage 3 tax cuts

This would have led to an earner on $200,000 a year being $11k a year worse off under Labor than Liberal. I'd say that's a big difference.

Even at state level, state Labor just hiked the stamp duty on vehicles above $150k from 5% to 9%

So it's not just about raw taxing and spending figures. It's also about how much of that taxing and spending goes straight to redistributive policies.

In Australia, is $200,000 in the top 10%, 5%, or what?

Growing up in a province where a lot of people had terrible teeth, the free dental makes sense.  People on tight budgets often put dental care way down on the list of priorities.

Quebec found its $5/day subsidized daycare ($7 now) was a moneymaker, as stay at home young mothers went back to work.

An inconvenient fact that many 'fiscal conservatives' often overlook is that many times increasing government spending has net savings for the whole country.  It's important to make sure that when you're talking about 'fiscal conservatism' you're not really talking about 'puritanical nonsense that costs us all money'.

Instead, fiscal conservatives have been known to spend money to shore up their electoral prospects when nobody's looking.   For example...

Quote
G8 FUNDING: In the lead up to the 2010 G8 meeting in Huntsville, senior cabinet minister Tony Clement personally directed a $50-million “legacy” fund, funneling millions in infrastructure to his Muskoka riding. Municipalities far from the actual summit site were given hundreds of thousands of dollars for sidewalk improvements, parks, and most infamously, a gazebo. A subsequent investigation by the auditor general showed funds were doled out with no bureaucratic oversight or paper trails. Clement was later promoted to president of the Treasury Board, the department that oversees government spending.

ctuser1

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1230 on: August 30, 2020, 09:17:53 AM »
You guys are lucky in the US that you can vote Democrat and still have a fiscally conservative government.

Here in Australia if I want to vote for the socially progressive party I also have to accept a big hike in my taxes. Always.
That's pretty funny.

The myth that the Liberals are fiscally conservative is one of the best bits of political brainwashing ever.  The Liberals outspend Labour just about every time they are in government.

Compare the two parties' platforms for the last election. Labor was promising to spend big on:

- Free dental
- Free childcare
- Mandating wage rises for certain workers
- blah blah blah

And to pay for this Labor would have had to:
- Raise the top tax bracket
- Repudiate the stage 2 and stage 3 tax cuts

This would have led to an earner on $200,000 a year being $11k a year worse off under Labor than Liberal. I'd say that's a big difference.

Even at state level, state Labor just hiked the stamp duty on vehicles above $150k from 5% to 9%

So it's not just about raw taxing and spending figures. It's also about how much of that taxing and spending goes straight to redistributive policies.

In Australia, is $200,000 in the top 10%, 5%, or what?

Growing up in a province where a lot of people had terrible teeth, the free dental makes sense.  People on tight budgets often put dental care way down on the list of priorities.

Quebec found its $5/day subsidized daycare ($7 now) was a moneymaker, as stay at home young mothers went back to work.

An inconvenient fact that many 'fiscal conservatives' often overlook is that many times increasing government spending has net savings for the whole country.  It's important to make sure that when you're talking about 'fiscal conservatism' you're not really talking about 'puritanical nonsense that costs us all money'.

All politicians tend to lie and obfuscate.

I am not sure that the above, alone, is meaningful information. I am sure there are loads of instances of hypocrisy on the "liberal" side as well!!

The scarier thing is zombification of an ideology. Thankfully, you guys are much further away from US in how much the zombie followers the right-wing ideologies have created in the US. I will take a hypocritical right wing (like Canada/Australia) over a zombified right wing (like US) any day. Ditto for the "left" wing (curious thought: left can definitely be zombified, and worse than right. Can liberal's be zombified?).

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1231 on: August 31, 2020, 10:42:02 PM »
Regret? Lol no!

Watching the media loose their minds was worth it :)

ministashy

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1232 on: September 01, 2020, 03:24:44 AM »
Regret? Lol no!

Watching the media loose their minds was worth it :)

Given everything that this administration has done (or failed to do) since the last election that has resulted in a massive loss of both lives and livelihoods, I find this response truly disgusting.

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1233 on: September 01, 2020, 04:03:30 AM »
Regret? Lol no!

Watching the media loose their minds was worth it :)

Given everything that this administration has done (or failed to do) since the last election that has resulted in a massive loss of both lives and livelihoods, I find this response truly disgusting.
Human nature hasn't moved on from the Romans: bread and (deadly) circuses.

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1234 on: September 01, 2020, 06:46:06 AM »
Regret? Lol no!

Watching the media loose their minds was worth it :)

Given everything that this administration has done (or failed to do) since the last election that has resulted in a massive loss of both lives and livelihoods, I find this response truly disgusting.
I believe the technical term is Schadenfreude. Typically you don't find too many adults boasting about practicing it. 

Kris

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1235 on: September 01, 2020, 06:50:44 AM »
Regret? Lol no!

Watching the media loose their minds was worth it :)

Given everything that this administration has done (or failed to do) since the last election that has resulted in a massive loss of both lives and livelihoods, I find this response truly disgusting.
I believe the technical term is Schadenfreude. Typically you don't find too many adults boasting about practicing it.

Except Trump supporters. They are more than happy to give into — and boast about — their third-grade playground bully selves leading their decision-making.

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1236 on: September 01, 2020, 08:09:35 AM »
Regret? Lol no!

Watching the media loose their minds was worth it :)

"I triggered the media" is truly the dumbest response to this question.

RetiredAt63

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1237 on: September 01, 2020, 08:26:34 AM »
Regret? Lol no!

Watching the media loose their minds was worth it :)

"I triggered the media" is truly the dumbest response to this question.

The 10 year olds have found the forums.

DarkandStormy

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1238 on: September 01, 2020, 08:55:24 AM »
Regret? Lol no!

Watching the media loose their minds was worth it :)

"I triggered the media" is truly the dumbest response to this question.

The 10 year olds have found the forums.

10 year olds know the difference between loose and lose, though.

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1239 on: September 01, 2020, 10:38:53 AM »
Regret? Lol no!

Watching the media loose their minds was worth it :)

"I triggered the media" is truly the dumbest response to this question.

Counterpoint: it involves a world-view that incredibly little in the public sphere matters. Triggering and discrediting the media is ethical (and ethically elevated to a top priority) if you believe public investments and policies wouldn't have changed the state of play for COVID, wouldn't have improved the lives of undocumented immigrants, and won't have a meaningful impact on education or health.


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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1240 on: September 01, 2020, 11:02:01 AM »
Regret? Lol no!

Watching the media loose their minds was worth it :)

"I triggered the media" is truly the dumbest response to this question.

Counterpoint: it involves a world-view that incredibly little in the public sphere matters. Triggering and discrediting the media is ethical (and ethically elevated to a top priority) if you believe public investments and policies wouldn't have changed the state of play for COVID, wouldn't have improved the lives of undocumented immigrants, and won't have a meaningful impact on education or health.

Wouldn't you have to be pretty stupid to believe that though . . . given the evidence of wildly different results covid had around the world based on different public investments and policies?

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1241 on: September 01, 2020, 11:51:02 AM »
Regret? Lol no!

Watching the media loose their minds was worth it :)

"I triggered the media" is truly the dumbest response to this question.

Counterpoint: it involves a world-view that incredibly little in the public sphere matters. Triggering and discrediting the media is ethical (and ethically elevated to a top priority) if you believe public investments and policies wouldn't have changed the state of play for COVID, wouldn't have improved the lives of undocumented immigrants, and won't have a meaningful impact on education or health.

Wouldn't you have to be pretty stupid to believe that though . . . given the evidence of wildly different results covid had around the world based on different public investments and policies?

Aha! You can't trust the media reports on what's going on with covid around the world! Did Italy really have a massive outbreak? Were there refrigerated corpse trucks outside NYC hospitals? Were nursing home residents dying like flies in Washington state?

GuitarStv

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1242 on: September 01, 2020, 12:18:05 PM »
Regret? Lol no!

Watching the media loose their minds was worth it :)

"I triggered the media" is truly the dumbest response to this question.

Counterpoint: it involves a world-view that incredibly little in the public sphere matters. Triggering and discrediting the media is ethical (and ethically elevated to a top priority) if you believe public investments and policies wouldn't have changed the state of play for COVID, wouldn't have improved the lives of undocumented immigrants, and won't have a meaningful impact on education or health.

Wouldn't you have to be pretty stupid to believe that though . . . given the evidence of wildly different results covid had around the world based on different public investments and policies?

Aha! You can't trust the media reports on what's going on with covid around the world! Did Italy really have a massive outbreak? Were there refrigerated corpse trucks outside NYC hospitals? Were nursing home residents dying like flies in Washington state?

I didn't take the stupidity far enough.  My mistake.  :P

A common problem with creating a system that's completely foolproof is that people constantly underestimate the ingenuity of utter fools.

RetiredAt63

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1243 on: September 01, 2020, 12:52:25 PM »
Regret? Lol no!

Watching the media loose their minds was worth it :)

"I triggered the media" is truly the dumbest response to this question.

Counterpoint: it involves a world-view that incredibly little in the public sphere matters. Triggering and discrediting the media is ethical (and ethically elevated to a top priority) if you believe public investments and policies wouldn't have changed the state of play for COVID, wouldn't have improved the lives of undocumented immigrants, and won't have a meaningful impact on education or health.

Wouldn't you have to be pretty stupid to believe that though . . . given the evidence of wildly different results covid had around the world based on different public investments and policies?

Aha! You can't trust the media reports on what's going on with covid around the world! Did Italy really have a massive outbreak? Were there refrigerated corpse trucks outside NYC hospitals? Were nursing home residents dying like flies in Washington state?

I didn't take the stupidity far enough.  My mistake.  :P

A common problem with creating a system that's completely foolproof is that people constantly underestimate the ingenuity of utter fools.

And the fools survive and the gene pool gets shallower.  Used to be, stupid dug the well too close to the outhouse, the stupid genes got eliminated.  Of course in cities stupidity affected a larger circle, so the not-stupid had to protect themselves.

Sorry, feeling awfully cynical today. As in, will American companies be allowed to keep the new vaccine contracts they signed with the Canadian government?  After all the recent history of breaches of contract between American companies and Canadian purchasers forced by the American government?  American compliance with the new NAFTA is a joke.  Any American reputation for reliability with foreign purchasers is already shaky, right down there with the Chinese.  And Americans will whinge when buyers start looking for more reliable suppliers.  Hope Trump's supporters are happy when foreign exchange takes a nosedive. You Trumpies want to be isolationist, we'll help you.

To clarify, Canadians generally like individual Americans, and that hasn't changed. But individual Canadians have never trusted American governments not to throw their weight around, and Trump is surpassing our already cynical expectations.

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1244 on: September 01, 2020, 01:08:45 PM »
Regret? Lol no!

Watching the media loose their minds was worth it :)

"I triggered the media" is truly the dumbest response to this question.

Counterpoint: it involves a world-view that incredibly little in the public sphere matters. Triggering and discrediting the media is ethical (and ethically elevated to a top priority) if you believe public investments and policies wouldn't have changed the state of play for COVID, wouldn't have improved the lives of undocumented immigrants, and won't have a meaningful impact on education or health.

Wouldn't you have to be pretty stupid to believe that though . . . given the evidence of wildly different results covid had around the world based on different public investments and policies?

Aha! You can't trust the media reports on what's going on with covid around the world! Did Italy really have a massive outbreak? Were there refrigerated corpse trucks outside NYC hospitals? Were nursing home residents dying like flies in Washington state?

I didn't take the stupidity far enough.  My mistake.  :P

A common problem with creating a system that's completely foolproof is that people constantly underestimate the ingenuity of utter fools.

And the fools survive and the gene pool gets shallower.  Used to be, stupid dug the well too close to the outhouse, the stupid genes got eliminated.  Of course in cities stupidity affected a larger circle, so the not-stupid had to protect themselves.

Sorry, feeling awfully cynical today. As in, will American companies be allowed to keep the new vaccine contracts they signed with the Canadian government?  After all the recent history of breaches of contract between American companies and Canadian purchasers forced by the American government?  American compliance with the new NAFTA is a joke.  Any American reputation for reliability with foreign purchasers is already shaky, right down there with the Chinese.  And Americans will whinge when buyers start looking for more reliable suppliers.  Hope Trump's supporters are happy when foreign exchange takes a nosedive. You Trumpies want to be isolationist, we'll help you.

To clarify, Canadians generally like individual Americans, and that hasn't changed. But individual Canadians have never trusted American governments not to throw their weight around, and Trump is surpassing our already cynical expectations.
This is reminiscent of Iran in a “the government is kind of evil but the people themselves are nice” sort of way.

Psychstache

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1245 on: September 01, 2020, 05:20:32 PM »
Regret? Lol no!

Watching the media loose their minds was worth it :)

"I triggered the media" is truly the dumbest response to this question.

Counterpoint: it involves a world-view that incredibly little in the public sphere matters. Triggering and discrediting the media is ethical (and ethically elevated to a top priority) if you believe public investments and policies wouldn't have changed the state of play for COVID, wouldn't have improved the lives of undocumented immigrants, and won't have a meaningful impact on education or health.

Wouldn't you have to be pretty stupid to believe that though . . . given the evidence of wildly different results covid had around the world based on different public investments and policies?

Aha! You can't trust the media reports on what's going on with covid around the world! Did Italy really have a massive outbreak? Were there refrigerated corpse trucks outside NYC hospitals? Were nursing home residents dying like flies in Washington state?

I didn't take the stupidity far enough.  My mistake.  :P

A common problem with creating a system that's completely foolproof is that people constantly underestimate the ingenuity of utter fools.

And the fools survive and the gene pool gets shallower.  Used to be, stupid dug the well too close to the outhouse, the stupid genes got eliminated.  Of course in cities stupidity affected a larger circle, so the not-stupid had to protect themselves.

Sorry, feeling awfully cynical today. As in, will American companies be allowed to keep the new vaccine contracts they signed with the Canadian government?  After all the recent history of breaches of contract between American companies and Canadian purchasers forced by the American government?  American compliance with the new NAFTA is a joke.  Any American reputation for reliability with foreign purchasers is already shaky, right down there with the Chinese.  And Americans will whinge when buyers start looking for more reliable suppliers.  Hope Trump's supporters are happy when foreign exchange takes a nosedive. You Trumpies want to be isolationist, we'll help you.

To clarify, Canadians generally like individual Americans, and that hasn't changed. But individual Canadians have never trusted American governments not to throw their weight around, and Trump is surpassing our already cynical expectations.
This is reminiscent of Iran in a “the government is kind of evil but the people themselves are nice” sort of way.

Also, in the religious zealotry sort of way.

GuitarStv

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1246 on: September 02, 2020, 07:05:18 AM »
Zealotry makes sense.  The US has always been a Christian nation.

You can never be elected president of the United States unless you openly profess your Christianity.  Even if you are openly Christian with a long history of following the Christian faith, you can be politically attacked (and have political damage done) by people saying that you're secretly Muslim - we all learned this when Obama was president.

The idea that you can be president and not Christian is theoretically possible, but has never been borne out in reality.

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1247 on: September 02, 2020, 07:52:27 AM »
Zealotry makes sense.  The US has always been a Christian nation.

You can never be elected president of the United States unless you openly profess your Christianity.  Even if you are openly Christian with a long history of following the Christian faith, you can be politically attacked (and have political damage done) by people saying that you're secretly Muslim - we all learned this when Obama was president.

The idea that you can be president and not Christian is theoretically possible, but has never been borne out in reality.

It has been a Protestant nation, not a Christian nation.  People criticized JFK's nomination because he was Roman Catholic, so he would be controlled by the Pope. 

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1248 on: September 02, 2020, 08:55:25 AM »
Indeed the protestant-catholic rivalry throughout the first half of the twentieth century is under-appreciated today. The waves of Italian and Irish immigrants were subject to mistrust partly because of this divergence in faith. Were he elected, Biden would be only the second Roman Catholic to serve as President.

RetiredAt63

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1249 on: September 02, 2020, 10:01:29 AM »
Indeed the protestant-catholic rivalry throughout the first half of the twentieth century is under-appreciated today. The waves of Italian and Irish immigrants were subject to mistrust partly because of this divergence in faith. Were he elected, Biden would be only the second Roman Catholic to serve as President.

Getting old is a pain, but it gives perspective.  I remember the fuss and I was a kid.  I wonder what today's 10 year olds will remember 50/60 years from now about this election round?

I also remember Trudeaumania.  ;-)  Charismatic politicians are rare in Canada.