Dentist surprise

[skyler]

Took our youngest to the dentist for a routine cleaning today.
After taking X-rays, was given an estimate for "repairs" to the tune of $672 !!!

Kid is 5 years old, all of the affected ones are baby teeth that will fall in about 4 years...We are talking about 5 cavities!!!!
Largest expense--crown, I guess cavity too big to just fill.

I cannot understand how we can develop 5 cavities in 6 months? We have been brushing and doing 6 month cleaning/checkups...

Is this something we can shop around?  Second opinion?
or just pull the teeth out?? :-)

[Mr.Macinstache]

A lot of times cavities are caused from an unbalanced diet, so all the brushing in the world one help. Cavities are internal and can't be seen on him, right?

He's 5, I'm sure they'll fall out and be fine, but I'm not a dentist or a doctor. My kids are 5 and 6 with no (visible) cavities. :) They've never been to the dentist but have great smiles. I'll be the first to admit their diet isn't perfect either.

This book has some great reviews:
http://www.amazon.com/Cure-Tooth-Decay-Cavities-Nutrition/dp/1434810607/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1379363905&sr=8-1&keywords=cure+cavities

And take this for what it's worth:
http://www.thehealthyhomeeconomist.com/how-i-healed-my-childs-cavity/

[footenote]

Are the kids drinking soda? Even diet soda is bad for teeth (and of course regular soda is even worse): http://medicalxpress.com/news/2013-08-erosion-tooth-enamel-soda-permanent.html

[Samsam]

Are the kids drinking soda? Even diet soda is bad for teeth (and of course regular soda is even worse): http://medicalxpress.com/news/2013-08-erosion-tooth-enamel-soda-permanent.html

In my sister's teen years she would brush her teeth a couple times a day and would still get a ridiculous amount of cavities (9 in one appt!)  Once she stopped drinking pop it brought her down to about 1 or 2 a year.   

[apennysaved]

I would try get a second opinion.  I had a dentist tell me I needed a crown on a tooth that had a small fracture.  I had no pain in the tooth.  Got a second opinion and the new dentist said we would watch the fracture and only do something if it got worse or if I started to have pain.  Needless to say, I switched to the new dentist.  I eventually did get it crowned because I started to have pain... about 5 years later. If your child is not in pain, then I would try to delay work if possible as it does not seem it would have any long term impact on the permanent teeth.

[skyler]

Diet:
I would say our diet is very well balanced...
There is nothing that we eat that comes out of a box (except brownies occasionally)...
We never have soda in the house, only get it  for birthday parties...

Year ago went through the Weight Watchers program with my husband and we are very mindful of what real food should be.
To this day we maintain a good BMI and are not on any medications. Same with the kidlets--all healthy and happy!

We cook from scratch, the fruit bowl is always full and we carry water bottles around.
Granted I put a juice box in their lunch every other day (we pack school lunches).

Let'see what else...Water is provided by county (assume enough fluoride).
Last visit  dentist even "painted" the fluoride treatment on his teeth supposedly to help prevent cavities...

[skyler]

And take this for what it's worth:
http://www.thehealthyhomeeconomist.com/how-i-healed-my-childs-cavity/

just read it...very interesting....

[oldtoyota]

Do you brush your child's teeth?
Do you floss your child's teeth?
Does your child use child's mouthwash to regenerate enamel?

My understanding is that all of the above will help.

Is your child possibly getting sticky sweets or soda from someone else?

[skyler]

Oldtoyota,
we send kids to brush daily... we floss using the floss picks, kids love them.
We do use mouthwash (I encourage it, can't say it's done daily).

I was thinking about other sources of junk/sweets:

Candy--our school seems to be using a very weird reward system where if a kid stays on "green" all week long, they encourage them to pick a piece of candy from "the treasure chest".

Although we pack lunches from home, there is the "ice-cream Friday" at school --kid gets an ice-cream cone if he behaved well the entire week...and the birthday treats (although certainly not everyday).
This is his first year at school--before we were in day care and food was decent there...at least from looking at the printed menus...


I realize I just need to just go in there and brush his teeth morning and night--just like changing a diaper, mom just needs to do it:-(

[MissStache]

Some people just have bad teeth.  I was like that as a child even though I had a great diet and a mom that hovered over me as I flossed and brushed 2x per day.  We went to the dentist twice a year and I still had cavities all the time.  We were on well water, so potentially lack of flouride was an issue.

If it is any consolation, they have gotten MUCH better as I've aged and I rarely have dental problems anymore. 

I'd get a 2nd opinion for sure.  I once had a dentist tell me I needed $7,000 worth of dental work (including two crowns!) and when I went for a 2nd opinion I had one cavity that needed filling and one more to keep an eye on.  I think the bill was $120 and 3 years later I've needed zero additional work and have had no pain...

[Mr.Macinstache]

And take this for what it's worth:
http://www.thehealthyhomeeconomist.com/how-i-healed-my-childs-cavity/

just read it...very interesting....

If you read the sample pages from the other link I posted, there is good info in there too. The $9 kindle version is a lot less than those dental bills.

Can you see the cavities or are they all internal?

I would stop any fluoride treatments. Sodium fluoride is poison. Its the same reason you have to call poison control if you eat too much toothpaste. My kids have never once any sort of fluoride toothpaste and our city water is not fluoridated. And my kids do get their fare share of sweets (thanks to Mom!)

[pdxcyn]

I am an older reader of this forum (47) and I am pretty sure I never saw a dentist until I had permanent teeth. Definitely never had any baby teeth filled. But I also never wore a bike helmet or sat in a car seat. Those were dangerous times and I'm lucky to have survived! <sarcasm>

I agree with the others that you should get a second opinion. I went to one dentist, he wanted to refill every filling I had. I switched to another dentist who said the fillings were holding up just fine. I'm concerned that your dentist may be taking an overly aggressive approach.

[oldladystache]

Some dentists will pretend there's a problem just to get the business. A second opinion is definitely in order.

[skyler]

 

I'd get a 2nd opinion for sure.  I once had a dentist tell me I needed $7,000 worth of dental work (including two crowns!) and when I went for a 2nd opinion I had one cavity that needed filling and one more to keep an eye on.  I think the bill was $120 and 3 years later I've needed zero additional work and have had no pain...

Do I need to request copies of the Xrays? Because that's what the discovery of the new cavities was based on, not visual...

[Mr.Macinstache]

 

I'd get a 2nd opinion for sure.  I once had a dentist tell me I needed $7,000 worth of dental work (including two crowns!) and when I went for a 2nd opinion I had one cavity that needed filling and one more to keep an eye on.  I think the bill was $120 and 3 years later I've needed zero additional work and have had no pain...

Do I need to request copies of the Xrays? Because that's what the discovery of the new cavities was based on, not visual...

Yes have them forwarded to the new dentist or see if you can have them. You paid for them.

Also you might want to see if there are any pediatric dentists in your area. There is one in our small town and I actually use her. She's great.

[impaire]

Definitely get a second opinion but I will say some kids teeth are just cavity prone regarless of care. My dad and my older sister are like that, they had tons of cavities even though they took good care of their teeth. I, on the other hand, had pretty bad hygeine as a kid but had no cavities until my 20's

Yeah, all of that. I'm also someone with very bad teeth--my first visit (at age 5), the dentist actually found 7 cavities. No fluoride in our water and maybe too much cereal in my diet, but I had been doing everything else well (no soda, little candy, and my mom supplemented me with fluoride until I turned 3 because bad teeth run in the family). Sometimes that's just the way it is.
I'm also of the opinion that superficial cavities in non-permanent teeth can be ignored for a while, and that a second opinion is a good idea if you're uncomfortable with your dentist's recommendation, BUT I would say do not ignore deep cavities. The pain when the cavities reaches to/pushes on the nerve is not something you want to risk for you kids. Trust me :)

[katheh]

Get a 2nd opinion. Pay to have the xrays redone (we have "new patient" specials around here with xrays for around $69 all the time, check the Money Mailer/Value Pak).

Our middle kid had bad baby teeth, a number of cavities. Our diet was fine, he didn't drink pop, etc. But he did not erupt any teeth at all until he was over 18mos old and they took FOREVER to fully come in, they were 1/3 or 1/2 erupted for an extended time. The dentist (the 2nd one we visited) said that is sometimes an issue with baby teeth cavities.

He had a crownable deep cavity in one baby tooth when he was 7 years old and the dentist simply extracted it instead of messing with it.

[tooqk4u22]

Let'see what else...Water is provided by county (assume enough fluoride).

This is not true.  A lot of public water, even in highly urbanized areas, does not have flouride in it - mine doesn't. Check yours specifically.

I would stop any fluoride treatments. Sodium fluoride is poison. Its the same reason you have to call poison control if you eat too much toothpaste. My kids have never once any sort of fluoride toothpaste and our city water is not fluoridated. And my kids do get their fare share of sweets (thanks to Mom!)

Flouride is beneficial to teeth and just because your kids are fine doesn't make it accurate, certainly genetics play a role like in everything else.  Flouride is toxic at certain amounts and is why you shouldn't swallow toothpaste, but in small amounts it is ok, which is why in areas that don't provide flourinated water pediatricians (not he dentist) prescribe flouride pills.  Do you know you can die if you drink too much good old fashion water, and I don't mean through drowning or from being polluted, does that mean water is poison and you shouldn't drink it.  No. 

I am going to go out on a limb and guess you are anti-vaccine as well.

[skyler]

Let'see what else...Water is provided by county (assume enough fluoride).

This is not true.  A lot of public water, even in highly urbanized areas, does not have flouride in it - mine doesn't. Check yours specifically.

 Just checked the water report for the county, 2012 testing report shows fluoride detected at 0.91 ppm with an asterisk saying "Fluoride is added to water to help in the prevention of dental cavities in children".

[EMP]

Juice is almost as bad as pop.  Any other non-water consumption? 

[skyler]

Juice is almost as bad as pop.  Any other non-water consumption?

We are in the South, so lots of iced tea in the summer time, lightly sweetened with...yep.. sugar :-(

[lifejoy]

I just want to echo the idea that some people have bad teeth. I brush and floss like a fiend, don't drink pop, and generally stay away from sugared drinks.

I get cavities fairly often for someone that is so vigilant!! :(

My boyfriend drinks soda and brushes once a day and never flosses - and he's never had a cavity in his life. Needless to say, I hope our kids get his teeth! HAHA

So some people, it's the chemical makeup in their mouth and apparently deep grooves in the teeth. Sucky but reality.

[aaronhann85]

I agree with looking for a second opinion.

When the responsibility for dental care moved from my parents to myself i did what any foolish teenager with a fear of dentists would do... I didn't go.

For 8 years I just brushed twice a day until I chipped a tooth. I went in to get the chip fixed and I was told my teeth were excellent. Since then I've been going back every 6 months and lo and behold every time I go theres another 2 or 3 fillings required!

Amazing that I had none in 8 years and now I'm up to 5 in the last 12 months.

[Daleth]

Second opinion, brush TWICE a day minimum, and is there a dental school near you? They offer very reasonably priced dental care. Students provide it with professors looking over their shoulders. I've had great experiences at two different dental schools.

[prosaic]

Get a second opinion. When our son was 7 we were told he needed full general anesthesia, sedated dental work to the tune of 5 cavities and $2600 out of pocket.

Second opinion: one extraction (abcess we couldn't see) and one small filling. Done with novocaine, cost was $116 after insurance.

Also, our kids have gone from 1 cavity every 6-12 months to one every 2-3 years since we started using toothpaste with Xylitol in it.

[Mr.Macinstache]

Let'see what else...Water is provided by county (assume enough fluoride).

This is not true.  A lot of public water, even in highly urbanized areas, does not have flouride in it - mine doesn't. Check yours specifically.

I would stop any fluoride treatments. Sodium fluoride is poison. Its the same reason you have to call poison control if you eat too much toothpaste. My kids have never once any sort of fluoride toothpaste and our city water is not fluoridated. And my kids do get their fare share of sweets (thanks to Mom!)

Flouride is beneficial to teeth and just because your kids are fine doesn't make it accurate, certainly genetics play a role like in everything else.  Flouride is toxic at certain amounts and is why you shouldn't swallow toothpaste, but in small amounts it is ok, which is why in areas that don't provide flourinated water pediatricians (not he dentist) prescribe flouride pills.  Do you know you can die if you drink too much good old fashion water, and I don't mean through drowning or from being polluted, does that mean water is poison and you shouldn't drink it.  No. 

I am going to go out on a limb and guess you are anti-vaccine as well.

So drinking just a little bit of antifreeze wont hurt does that mean you should? Fluoride is still poison and should not be ingested, it's only to be used topically. Do you drink shampoo to wash your hair? Even the former top EPA scientist said fluoridated water was one of the biggest frauds, if not THE biggest fraud put on the people. He was fired. Sodium fluoride is industrial waste, its a byproduct of aluminum production. Much of what goes in the water supply comes purchased from China. A little research on the topic goes a long here. Get your google on. Using it as a topical agent like in toothpaste is fine, but when it comes to ingesting it in water, my issue is one of informed consent. If you want to drink/eat sodium fluoride, knock yourself out - just don't force me to by adding it to the public water. Same with vaccines...take all you like, just don't wag your finger at me because you are protected, right? Awesome blog post is awesome.


/hijack

[z4cth3p4c]

Cavities are filled in baby teeth because if they are not treated or pulled they can develop infection or become abscessed, abscess can lead to bone loss and blood poisoning . One of the reasons why dentists opt to fill them instead of pulling them is because the permanent tooth has not had a chance to fully develop yet to replace the baby tooth. Meaning that for a while there will be an empty space there. Your teeth constantly move, when an empty space is present your remaining teeth and bone will change to fill in the space, this may not always happen in straight or aesthetically appealing ways. Meaning premature tooth loss can lead to crooked teeth, that may require orthodontics or braces (in the eyes of some parents). If you have your dentist pull a baby tooth due to decay, they will almost always recommend the addition of a space maintainer. A space maintainer is a   piece of metal that holds the space the tooth used to occupy until the adult tooth grows in. Having a filling completed on the baby tooth is cheaper then the alternative, extraction and space maintainer. So the question I guess is, whats more important to you your child's straight smile or a few extra dollars in your pocket?

Think of your mouth as if it was in a war against bacteria, everything you eat depending on what you eat changes the make up of your saliva, either changes its PH or the sugar supply in your mouth. Acid eats away at your enamel, and sugar supplies nutrition for the bacteria to grow even more. When bacteria eat their waste secretions are acidic causing your enamel to wear away even more. Fluoride helps preserve enamel, fluoride is good. Genetics do play a role in tooth decay because genetics are the instructions for the building blocks of the enamel and the enzyme make up of your saliva. Some peoples genetics favor strengthened enamel and your saliva has enzymes that help maintain PH levels in your saliva. Maybe people with more favorable genetics produce more of these enzymes. Eating habits also affect tooth decay people who drink things faster are less likely to get cavities then people who drink things slower because the sugar has less time to sit on your teeth if you drink your pop all in one drink. Try to drink water without a straw and pop or juice with a straw because the straw sends it past your teeth first, meaning it has less contact with your teeth. Brushing after meals is also a good idea.
Second opinions are good but consider who the second opinion is from, ask your dentist if his practice has updated x-ray equipment. Digital x-rays are proven to be more effective in diagnosing the extent of decay, and if your dentist relies on film based x-rays he or she could be missing tons of decay. Digital x-rays systems released since 2010 are proven to be superior to the digital x-rays systems released prior to 2010. There is more to a proper diagnosis than education, because without the proper technology even the most knowledgeable dentist can miss decay.
In a worst case scenario if you had to start rebuilding your mouth from scratch and actually went through with building your mouth from scratch then brushing your teeth for two minutes, two times a day can make you the equivalent to 60 dollars an hour. It is important to keep up with regular cleanings because you have a tissue pocket around every tooth, when bacteria are allowed to survive on your tooth's surface they build up in these pockets and form plaque and tartar. Normal brushing can not clean out these pockets, as the bacteria feed on the sugar and nutrients in your diet they secrete acid that eats away at your tissue, and this forms deeper harder to clean pockets, this process is called gum disease. Once the bacteria has eaten away at all the tissue that exists it reaches bone and eats away at the bone, this can lead to tooth loss. Going to the dentist for regular cleanings and preventive work will always save you more money then the alternative of having to replace teeth. The only way not going to the dentist is going to save you money is if you never wanted teeth to begin with, do not care if they fall out and have no intention of replacing them.
Quality of life!

Source: Dental assistant 5 years - Pre-Dental Intern

[Mr.Macinstache]

^ Thanks for sharing.

Good point about the straws. My kids always drink through them.... that could be part of the reason they don't have any.

Also, when I lost a filling and let it go, my upper tooth either dropped or grew down in the empty hole. Is that possible?? I ended up having to get a root canal. That is why I will NEVER ignore my teeth again.

[skyler]

Having a filling completed on the baby tooth is cheaper then the alternative, extraction and space maintainer. So the question I guess is, whats more important to you your child's straight smile or a few extra dollars in your pocket?


Source: Dental assistant 5 years - Pre-Dental Intern

Thank you for the thorough reply.

I have no problem with filling the cavities for my baby, I am just surprised that there are so many and they developed so fast since the last 6 month check up...

I am posting on this site because of the understanding that this community is not only concerned with FI, but also its members are looking for ways to cut consumerism and waste from their life.
 I am not trying to cut corners and not take care of my kid. Merely looking for advice from those who know more about the topic.

Every 6 months, all 5 members of my family go in for cleanings. Throughout the years  we had cavities for the other two kids--we go  in and fill cavities as they come. No question -- it just needs to be done.

Ultimately what is bothering me with our youngest  developed so many all of a sudden and the suggestion that we need a crown.

It is my understanding that dentist is talking about a pre-fab metal piece, pretty common thing for kids.
The problem is  that this piece of "hardware" is not covered by insurance. I would be paying 100% out of pocket.
Which only makes me wonder about its necessity, especially since it's paired with the nitrous oxide treatment, (which is also not covered by insurance--thus easy $$ for the dentist's office).

What can I say? I had problems in the past with dentists. We were presented with bills after insurance has paid and find out that billing codes were submitted incorrectly, stuff should have been covered but did not. My husband even went through a treatment for a non existing gum problem (had second opinion about some more "repair"work and found out previous doctor was just looking for "billable" work). He did pay out of pocket to the tune of thousands of $$.

As far as spacers once a tooth is removed--my DD had a tooth (molar) pulled and had a spacer installed. The spacers are covered by insurance
The dentist gave us the "disclaimer" though, that even with a spacers, we may still need to have orthodontic work done...

So if anyone has had a metal crown for a large cavity (molar)--please chime in and let me know how it works/holds over time.
My baby has the tooth fairy visiting "regularly" these days, as he is actively loosing his front teeth...

Is putting in a crown for a limited amount of time the only solution?

[NumberJohnny5]

Don't brush immediately after meals. I didn't know this either, could explain a lot. Some of my research shows that the best time to brush may be immediately BEFORE a meal.

Normally I wouldn't link direct to a manufacturer, but I figure that it's somehow more believable if you hear from a toothpaste manufacturer that there are times it's less beneficial to use their product. Per http://www.colgate.com/app/ColgateSensitiveNew/US/EN/Brushing-Right-After-A-Meal.cvsp :

"Research suggests that the exposure to acidic food and drinks during meals softens the enamel of your teeth. Brushing your teeth immediately after consuming acidic foods and drinks increases the chance of enamel erosion.

Therefore, to help prevent dental erosion, it is recommended you avoid brushing for at least 60 minutes after eating or drinking acidic foods or drinks."

[skyler]

Don't brush immediately after meals. I didn't know this either, could explain a lot. Some of my research shows that the best time to brush may be immediately BEFORE a meal.

Normally I wouldn't link direct to a manufacturer, but I figure that it's somehow more believable if you hear from a toothpaste manufacturer that there are times it's less beneficial to use their product. Per http://www.colgate.com/app/ColgateSensitiveNew/US/EN/Brushing-Right-After-A-Meal.cvsp :

"Research suggests that the exposure to acidic food and drinks during meals softens the enamel of your teeth. Brushing your teeth immediately after consuming acidic foods and drinks increases the chance of enamel erosion.

Therefore, to help prevent dental erosion, it is recommended you avoid brushing for at least 60 minutes after eating or drinking acidic foods or drinks."

Definitely news to me...thanx for sharing!

[Rangifer]

And take this for what it's worth:
http://www.thehealthyhomeeconomist.com/how-i-healed-my-childs-cavity/

just read it...very interesting....

I have serious doubts about what is posted in that article. The rest of the site lacks a lot of journalistic integrity as well.


(put more bluntly, I think it is a load of bullshit and the rest of the website is a collection of inappropriate extrapolations and because-I-think-so science)



Edit: To contribute to the aim of this thread, I will say that the mouth bacteria feed on carbohydrates, not just the sugars.

[z4cth3p4c]

@ Mr. Macinstache: Yes hyper eruption is very common your teeth grow longer until they hit something to stop them from growing. This is the body's natural way of making sure you have a properly aligned bite. Which is why it causes problems for you when you lose your bottom teeth. Fillings have a life expectancy they last longer if you take better care of them, a lot of people think white fillings form a better tighter bond and are less likely to leak, they obviously look more like a tooth and the dentist does not have to remove as much healthy tooth structure to place them and they do not contain mercury like their silver amalgam filling counterparts. But resin is not as strong as metal.

@ Skyler: Unfortunately billing errors do happen if you want to know more about saving money at the dentist with or without insurance here is a bit of knowledge about it. (also I apologize if I insulted you in anyway that was not my intention). Dentists and Doctors offices are not required to bill your insurance at all, they do so as a courtesy to you and ultimately it is the patients responsibility to get the funds from the insurance company to reimburse yourself after you pay the doctor for the services the doctor provided you. The reason the doctor hires office staff to take care of insurance for you is it is less stress on the patient and to some extent I would think that someone who processes insurance claims all day is going to be able to do it faster and with less error. There are actually quite a few doctors offices who make it the patients responsibility to submit the insurance claim and pay the doctor in cash for services in advance. Personally I avoid places like this because to me that just seems like a stressful amount of work.

I do not think that dentists usually make a lot of money on nitrous oxide, they usually bill just enough per hour to cover the expense of the gas, and it actually probably costs them more to use it because they have to pay staff hourly to prep the equipment and to upkeep the equipment. Insurance does not cover nitrous because they deem it an unnecessary expense, much like they do not cover white fillings on back teeth.

Space maintainers and crowns are two different things, a crown will hold the space as well as act as a functional tooth. a space maintainer is a metal band that wraps around the tooth next to the empty space, a circular wire protrudes from this band and pushes against the tooth on the other side of the space left absent by the missing tooth. This decreases the chances that the teeth on either side of the absent space are going to move. The space maintainer is meant to help but no dentist is going to tell a patient that just because they get a space maintainer this is going to insure they will not need orthodontics. Because the need for orthodontics is based on so many variables, Most of which can be easily prevented and occur in a child's late infancy. When your child's teeth are coming in as they suck on their pacifier, or bottle or chew on blankets or objects while teething, thumb sucking even. This causes your child's teeth to grow in crookedly often protruding outward in the front. This changes their jaw shape and facial structure.

The life expectancy of a crown is on average 3 to 5 years. However this 3 to 5 years can be longer or shorter dependent on many factors. when the crown was completed how much healthy tooth structure remained? A crown is completed because too much of the original tooth structure is missing to successfully hold a filling, or a root canal was completed thus making the tooth dead and hollow. Normally a crown is completed by prepping it with what is called a core, a core is completed by removing all of the decay in the tooth and replacing it with core material a highly resilient resin based material. The more healthy tooth structure available the less likely it is the core breaks the more there is to hold the core in place. The core is covered with the literal crown which is a stainless steel liner encased in porcelain cemented onto the core. The crown will last longer if you keep up on your regular cleanings and brush and floss regularly because it preserves the structure. If the structure decays it will undermine the crown and cause it to fall off. It will last longer if you take care of it better.

A crown on a child is more cost effective because it is a prefab metal crown, sometimes done in conjunction with a sedative fill, which is something like a baby root canal. the crown covers the sedative fill and protects it from increased decay that would undermine it and cause it to crumble. Or the crown is done because so much of the tooth is missing that once again the filling cannot be successfully held in place.

So in short a crown on a baby tooth has a higher chance of success in preserving the space, while acting as a functional chewing device. a space maintainer will only attempt to hold the teeth in place. But keep in mind that the tooth can fall out normally as the adult tooth grows the roots of the baby teeth reabsorb. So depending on the age of the baby tooth it may not serve a purpose for very long.

As far as saving money with insurance, some insurance plans might not cover very much but the value in having it is more then meets the eye. Insurances companies are not your friends, they are out to make money. They do not want to pay for services for you and they do not want to pay us to do work anymore then they have to. When a dentist agrees to accept an insurance we agree to work for set fees established by the insurance company. Fees that may be 30% to 40% less than what we actually charge. So when you sign up for things like PPO plans and you sign up for a plan that may only cover 20% of a crown you have to take into account that you also get the benefit of contractual fee schedules meaning we can only charge so much for a crown. Why do we do this you might ask? Because sometimes a dentist gets patients based on what insurance they accept so if you have insurance your not going to go to the dentist who does not accept your insurance. these plans can be costly so I would only enroll in them if I knew I wanted to get a lot of work done. and are unnecessary if your work provides insurance already.

Keep in mind I am a student so things I say should only be taken with a grain of salt, and I am not to be held legally responsible for decisions you make based on hypothetical advice I may give you. So someone correct me if they believe I am factually wrong about any of the services I have described, just trying to help.

In regards to brushing after meals I suppose I will have to look into that. They came out with a new product called MI paste which is suppose to help restore enzymes in your saliva that maintain acidity levels, ask your dentist about it because it is an amazing product that can save you tons of money by helping prevent cavities in you and your child's mouth.

[skyler]

z4cth3p4c, I certainly appreciate your time in helping me understand the process.

DH and I decided to go ahead with the metal crown after all...
Called the office and dentist advised to wait a bit since the kid had a positive dentist visit for the cleaning last week, doc thinks we should wait with the actual work, lest we make the kid "hate the dentist".

I dread this appointment as I do not know how my son will react to nitrous. We shall see...

[EMP]

z4cth3p4c  - I've learned a lot from your responses as well.  Thanks for the info.

[cosmie]

So if anyone has had a metal crown for a large cavity (molar)--please chime in and let me know how it works/holds over time.

I had a horrible time with cavities until I was ~16, despite relatively good oral hygiene. One of my permanent bottom molars developed a cavity while it was emerging from a cavity next to it. Due to frequent moving it didn't get addressed until I was ~15, at which time it had degraded to the point of needing a root canal and crown (well, we actually tried to address it when I was 12 but the barbarian dentist recommended pulling the permanent molar, so I refused to go back).  Z4cth3p4c has already gone over the technicalities of it, but basically it consists of them hollowing out the remainder of the tooth, removing the root, leaving the outer "shell" intact, and filling the hollowed area with a hard resin, then putting a crown on top. For me it took 3 successive visits to complete the process, but I believe for children they just use stainless steel crowns and get it all done in one visit. It took a bit of getting used to (the new shape in your mouth is weird and takes getting used to, as well as pressure when biting/chewing, but otherwise it's been perfectly great for the past ~6-7 years.

For me the process was actually really easy; that dentist has done countless fillings (I don't get cavities nearly as badly anymore), a root canal, and pulled two wisdom teeth. Yet I still look forward to seeing him, and actually schedule my visits home to family (~3 hours away) to coincide with when I need to see him for a cleaning or (not in a few years) a filling. :D
But having a good dentist that your kid likes and trusts is key. I detested every dentist appointment up until I met my current one.

[PlayOutside]

here is a link to a blog about the link between Celiac disease and dental problems- you can google it for more info, but this blog has a nice explanation.

http://www.glutenfreeveganmom.com/2011/09/29/the-relationship-between-celiac-disease-and-dental-enamel-defects/

[Mr.Macinstache]

here is a link to a blog about the link between Celiac disease and dental problems- you can google it for more info, but this blog has a nice explanation.

http://www.glutenfreeveganmom.com/2011/09/29/the-relationship-between-celiac-disease-and-dental-enamel-defects/

Thanks for sharing! There are so many people who suffer from unknown allergies, deficiencies and disease and our western medicine is constantly 2 steps behind, treating the symptoms instead of addressing the root cause.

For a child who has all these cavities, the problem is not some external sugar, it all begins internally.

[Monkey stache]

Something else to consider is that it's not that uncommon for your child to be missing a few adult teeth. That means he might need some of his baby teeth to act as permanent teeth for the rest of his life. In less common cases there will be a large amount of adult teeth missing. I'm not sure at what age you'll know this by but it's something to keep in mind as a possibility. As an adult with many baby teeth and not great dental care as a child it's going to cost me around $4,000-$5,000 per dental implant (I need 3....for now).

[Mr.Macinstache]

I'm listening to an interview now.... were you vegan or vegetarian while your were pregnant with the child? Are they fed a vegan/vegetarian like diet?

[skyler]

No, we were never vegetarian.
I was nauseated the entire time I was pregnant so I ate lots of carbs and junk food :-(
At the time, I  was looking for "whatever stayed in"...

[Michread]

When my younger son was little he would get cavities.  This puzzled me because he had a very good diet.  I homeschooled him so he was with me 24/7. 

I finally figured it out - RAISINS!  He ate raisin cinnamon bread everyday.  Raisins are WORSE than regular candy with concentrated sugar and the power to STICK to the teeth.  We replaced it with cinnamon bread WITHOUT raisins.  Cavities greatly decreased to almost none/yr.

Gummy bears and fruit roll-ups are REALLY bad too!  I had a friend spend thousands to fix baby teeth because of fruit roll-ups. (NO, they are NOT fruit!)

[Mr.Macinstache]

No, we were never vegetarian.
I was nauseated the entire time I was pregnant so I ate lots of carbs and junk food :-(
At the time, I  was looking for "whatever stayed in"...

Ok, that could've contributed... I was listening to an interview with Ramiel Nagel who wrote the book Cure Tooth Decay because his child had the same problems... turns out moderns grains are a wrecking ball to establishing mineralization to healthy teeth.