Author Topic: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?  (Read 47194 times)

vivian

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #50 on: August 30, 2015, 09:23:26 PM »
Stupid question perhaps, but if you have sex every day or every other day of the month, do you need an ovulation or fertility monitor?

If everything is working as expected, no. But, you wouldn't know if you weren't ovulating. Having the information you get from charting can really help with targeting (and minimizing) medical testing and intervention, if needed.


I get the idea, and someone's point that having the information history already logged can save time, but I think we'll spend at least 6-12 months doing things the old fashioned way first.  We're oldish, but not in the "OMG biological clock" zone yet, and my partner agrees that all that stuff seems stressful, and like it would take a lot of the joy and passion out of sex (and maybe even a little mystery and wonder out of the whole creation of human life thing). 
It's something we both want, but its also not a tragedy if it doesn't happen - a lot of people commented on the first part of my comment, but no one about adoption being a viable alternative!

Understanding your cycle can be very informative to diagnose any problems if you have them. How long it takes you to ovulate, how long your luteal phase is (needs to be long enough so embryo has time to implant in uterus), etc. And, maybe I've been married too long, but being sure to have sex every day or every other day for 6-12 months seems quite exhausting. It's fine to say you want "mystery" in the creation of human life - at least until you've gone month after month after month being disappointed. Then you will desperately want those months back.

We have adopted and it's been a tremendous blessing in our life with our son. At the same time it is incredibly stressful, expensive, and risky. So many people think adoption is just this simple thing - kids who need stable families, couples who want kids, let's bring them together with lots of rainbows. That's not how the process works.

La Bibliotecaria Feroz

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #51 on: August 30, 2015, 09:46:32 PM »
Another advantage to charting is it helps you know what your due date is. When we got pregnant with Little Brother, I was actually charting to aid in the AVOIDANCE of pregnancy (Oops! You really do have to follow those directions exactly!) and knew that I had conceived on day 24.

So I lied about the day of last menstrual period to avoid being pushed into a too-early delivery (especially as a TOLAC patient.

cheapbarb

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #52 on: August 31, 2015, 01:14:31 PM »
Hi everyone- I'm new here but I just had to reply to this thread.  Way back when the mr. and I were trying, pregnancy tests had different sensitivities. You might want to search that topic and see if that is still true. I'm not sure about OPK's

Please also consider when you post that reproduction is a very personal and painful area of life. We don't know who on this board might have given up a child for adoption, or have been adopted and still hurt by their start in life. How about if we don't try to backseat drive other people's family building and just wish everyone the best.

Bracken_Joy

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #53 on: August 31, 2015, 02:27:53 PM »
Hi everyone- I'm new here but I just had to reply to this thread.  Way back when the mr. and I were trying, pregnancy tests had different sensitivities. You might want to search that topic and see if that is still true. I'm not sure about OPK's

Please also consider when you post that reproduction is a very personal and painful area of life. We don't know who on this board might have given up a child for adoption, or have been adopted and still hurt by their start in life. How about if we don't try to backseat drive other people's family building and just wish everyone the best.

I'm sorry if you felt this thread was potentially hurtful- I actually thought almost all posts were extremely respectful and well thought out, far less divisive and "judgey" feeling than a lot of conversations on this topic you see online. I agree though, it is important to remember that the "other" is a false concept when you don't know someone's story.

Lizzy B.

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #54 on: August 31, 2015, 02:59:05 PM »
I'm also following since I practically could have written the OP.

I checked out TCOYF from the library like a good little mustachian, but then it sat on my bedside table so long that I had to pay the library replacement fee. Whoops! Would have been cheaper to just buy it... 

As others have mentioned, charting is pretty cool, but as a scientist I'm getting frustrated by only getting one data point a day. I seriously wish I'd charted before trying to conceive. Instead, I was on the pill because I was so afraid of getting pregnant...  The irony...

goatmom

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #55 on: September 02, 2015, 03:47:30 PM »
Charting can also be so helpful when you go into the OB/GYN and they want to figure out your due date.  Especially if you have weird cycles - "Yes, I know my lmp was 4 months ago but I conceived 6 weeks ago - here is the the data!"  Can save you from diagnosis of IUGR (intrauterine growth retardation).   It is also great after delivery if you are nursing and don't want to use hormonal contraceptives - you can usually predict when your fertility is returning.  I know - not 100 percent - but I thought it was very helpful to know when I was going to have to start worrying about getting pregnant again.  And with ecological breastfeeding - my fertility stayed away for one whole year!

There is also some who say there are certain foods that increase fertility.  Can't hurt to eat them if you like them.  Sweet potatoes for example.  Also, caffeine can decrease fertility. Herbs such as chasteberry can help too. If your BMI is too low that can interfere as well.  Some people around where I live use acupuncture and swear by it.  Chinese herbs also.  But those might be pricey.  I never went that route.

Do you know the fertility history in your family?  Often it is genetic.  If your mom was able to have a baby later in life - your chances are better too.

Best of luck!

 

sunflower_yellow

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #56 on: September 10, 2015, 09:57:32 AM »
Great thread.

This is how much it cost me to get pregnant:

1) Start taking a good prenatal supplement now.  They don't have to be expensive to be effective.  Mine were $10.
2) Exercise.  Eat well.  Rest.
3) Get Taking Charge of Your Fertility out of the library.  (My BFF was pregnant shortly after reading it, and I borrowed her copy.)
4) Chart your temps.  Just do it, starting with your very next cycle!  Get a $10 thermometer that tracks temperatures to the fraction of a degree.  I used Fertility Friend, free edition, worked great.
5) ENJOY sex.  In addition to making babies, it's fun, relaxing, free, and bonds you with your partner.
6) Purchase 2 pregnancy tests from the dollar store ($2).  Don't test until you are at least a few days late for your period and your charts are showing sustained raised temps.  Test once, then test again when you don't believe your eyes seeing the second line.  ;-)  Don't buy a zillion, or you'll drive yourself nuts peeing on anything that's stick like.

Total cost:  $22.

I am very thankful that it was very easy (and cheap!) for us to make a baby.  My heart goes out to couples who endure so much physical, emotional, and financial pain to build their families.  I have considered offering my womb for surrogacy after we are done building our family.

mm1970

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #57 on: September 10, 2015, 10:05:24 AM »
Funny story:

With my first kid, I'd been trying for 9 months, nothing.  I did have I think an early pregnancy loss.  Started the fertility tests, etc.  Started charting.  Learned that I only had a 10 day luteal phase.

After 1. 5 years, was about to start clomid + IUI, was just waiting.  Had an HSG in June, right before my 35th birthday.  Got the Clomid.  Sadly, the "right day" in July was to be when we were on vacation, so we were postponing till August.

July 4 my friend's sister said "you are getting old!"  Well, duh.

Mid-July, charting my temps, and on day 10 they take a nose-dive.  Yep, as expected (but still slightly above base temp).  Go out for our 9th anniversary dinner.  Have two glasses of Chardonnay.  Next two days same temp, doesn't drop anymore, no period as expected.  Hmmm.  4th day temp goes up a lot. 

Next day, Sat morn, get a + test and say "holy shit".

3 months later throw the Clomid in the trash.

gbbi_977

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #58 on: November 06, 2015, 07:09:54 AM »
And as for expense, well, the OP did say
Quote
"Obviously we'll spend what we have to spend "

Not that it sounds like anyone here in this thread actually did so, but I hear stories of people (friends of friends, etc) who spend thousands of dollars on various tests, fertility treatments, egg storage, in-vitro... and then of course there's even surrogates ($100,000+).
It gets crazy. 
Hence my taking ever opportunity to remind everyone everywhere that families are about more than DNA.
Pregnancy lasts 9 months.  Parenthood lasts about 60-80 years.

Hi everyone, I'm back and hoping for more advice!

First wanted to comment on this - I did say "we'll spend whatever we have to" but as you'll see from my original post, that was in reference to a sperm test. This response seemed to be implying that I was declaring a willingness to spend tens, hundreds of thousands of dollars to have a biological child, which wasn't an accurate reading of my post. As an aside, that's a pretty intimate decision - how much to spend on trying to make a biological child happen - which I don't really plan to discuss here personally. [But I agree with the poster that family is about more than DNA, I just think there has to be a lot of sensitivity around these things so I wanted to comment in response.]

ANYWAY - update - it's been 10 months now, and as of today officially another month that we're not pregnant. I read 'Taking Charge of Your Fertility' and feel confident we've been timing things spot on (also using ovulation strips which showed I am indeed ovulating). I'm starting to feel anxious.

I think it's time to get husband's sperm tested, and I assume I should also be having a HSG (?) test to make sure there are no blockages.

My question is: do I just go ahead and get those tests done, or do I need to go see a doctor first and have her refer me to do those tests?

Sorry, I'm really not familiar with the US healthcare system. My insurer has a thing called 'Castlight' which helps you find out where to go to get the best price on testing, so I was thinking should I just use that and go ahead and get the tests done, instead of adding an extra doctor's visit in there? (Obviously I'd need to see the doctor after the tests to discuss).

gbbi_977

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #59 on: November 06, 2015, 08:31:41 AM »
OK I'm not sure if anyone's reading along but I'm home alone and need to talk, so I'm writing an update. I took a pregnancy test this morning and it was negative, but I went back about 90 minutes later and saw a faint but definite line where the positive should be. Google tells me this is probably an evaporation line and not a positive but gosh it's so hard not to get your hopes up (I previously said got my period but it's just a tiny bit of spotting so Google is again getting my hopes up that that could be implantation bleeding - and I did have a cramp last night).

This is hard!

BeanCounter

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #60 on: November 06, 2015, 09:18:06 AM »
Hang in there. It is hard. But just because you're over thirty doesn't mean you don't have great odds at getting pregnant and having healthy kiddos. I was over thirty for both my boys. What helped me was using the ovulation tests. Yes they are expensive, but I think they are really worth it. I also took plain old generic Mucinex for two weeks around ovulation. You can google it for more info. I'm not positive that helped but it sure seemed like it did! Rest, exercise, eat well and don't stress about this. Especially around the holiday's. Just enjoy yourself and know that it will all work out. Stress can really work against you.

rockstache

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #61 on: November 06, 2015, 10:23:50 AM »
Hi annejane, I'm sorry that you're having a hard time. I can't comment much on having a child, but I can comment on the US healthcare system (just a bit). The answer is...it depends on your plan. You would have to call your insurance company in order to know if they require a referral or not and what they cover in your plan. I encourage you to do this yourself and not let a doctor do it for you, as the doctors sometimes don't know, so they perform the service, and then...oops you're not covered, so sorry, here is a bill.

Anyway, mostly just wanted to let you know that someone was reading along and hoping hard for you.

NeverLost

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #62 on: November 06, 2015, 10:54:22 AM »
AnneJane-   I am sorry you are having such a hard time.  I have been there and remember the rollercoaster of emotions.  I got pregnant with my son while on the pill so I was shocked when I couldn't get pregnant a second time.  After a few months of fertility treatments we ended up adopting a 2 year old internationally, which was ridiculously expensive, however we had 2 separate friends who had 2 failed in-vitro attempts and didn't want to go down that road.  Anyway, if I were you I would go ahead and get both myself and my husband tested at this point.  The way we did it was our normal OB has a fertility specialist in house so he set us up for a consultation.  We went to the initial meeting and he referred us for testing.  Best of luck!!

AllieVaulter

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #63 on: November 06, 2015, 10:59:46 AM »
I'm sorry this has been so stressful and difficult for you.  I would also encourage you to just go ahead and call your insurer to find out the procedure for getting tested.  If you're just sitting at home stewing, then you might as well stew while you're on the phone, right? 

I haven't tried to have kids yet, so I don't know what you're going through.  I can imagine it's incredibly emotional though.  It might help if you had something to keep yourself busy.  Is there something you could do to keep your mind occupied and/or distracted from this?  Good luck!

Dicey

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #64 on: November 06, 2015, 11:11:18 AM »
I don't have kids, so this is kind of a foreign topic to me. Just commenting to wish you well and eventually hope to read about your success. No advice, no anecdotes, just lots of warm wishes for your success.

brycedoula

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #65 on: November 06, 2015, 11:59:39 AM »
Your test instructions should tell you that the results are only valid for 10-20 minutes or so. Any result you see after that time frame should be considered invalid. Which sucks, I know.

If you don't get your full-on period, test again in 2 days with your first pee of the day - the reason being that if you ARE pregnant the hCG levels in your bloodstream will double every 48 hours or so.

(I found it easier to pee into a clean cup & stick the test in the cup for 30 seconds or whatever, rather than awkwardly try to aim on a stick)

TVRodriguez

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #66 on: November 06, 2015, 01:35:25 PM »
Your test instructions should tell you that the results are only valid for 10-20 minutes or so. Any result you see after that time frame should be considered invalid. Which sucks, I know.

If you don't get your full-on period, test again in 2 days with your first pee of the day - the reason being that if you ARE pregnant the hCG levels in your bloodstream will double every 48 hours or so.

+1.  I tested negative at least twice the first time I was pregnant.  I knew I was pregnant bc of the temperature chart I was keeping, and sure enough, a few days later, the pee stick showed a positive.

The waiting is frustrating.

JROH

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #67 on: November 07, 2015, 03:16:28 PM »
Go to you OBGYN to discuss your options.  They can order the preliminary testing and refer you to a reproductive endocrinologist (RE) if necessary.  It's important that you go through these steps so you understand your options and make an informed decision about how you will move forward.  As others have mentioned, it will depend on the type of insurance you have as to whether or not certain fertility tests are covered.  I had to be pre authorized for fertility coverage, i.e., referral from my OB to an RE.

Definitely start the process now if you are serious about investigating your options.  Just because you seek out information doesn't mean you have to stop trying the old fashioned way! 

Best of luck to you! 

Gray Matter

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #68 on: November 08, 2015, 05:34:00 AM »
Your test instructions should tell you that the results are only valid for 10-20 minutes or so. Any result you see after that time frame should be considered invalid. Which sucks, I know.

I know they say that (evaporation line), but with my second, the test was negative in the first 10 minutes, so I threw it away.  Later that day, I just had this niggling feeling that I was pregnant, so I dug it out of the trash and it showed positive by then.  Could have been coincidence, but I was indeed pregnant.

Just writing that brought such a feeling of nostalgia over me (said child is now 11).  I kind of miss those days of peeing on sticks!

gbbi_977

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #69 on: November 09, 2015, 07:27:13 AM »
Hello everyone,

Thank you all for your kind words and encouragement, I found your responses very touching and useful.

I took another test on Saturday and there was a faint positive line within the 5 minute window. Same result yesterday and today, and very slightly stronger each time. It doesn't feel real but it seems it might be a positive.

I am going to go see my doctor tomorrow.

So now I have a follow-up question relating to healthcare - assuming this is a viable pregnancy, do I need to 'shop around' different hospitals for different rates? I guess I'll call my healthcare concierge today and just have a general chat, but if anyone has any advice they think would be helpful to someone very unfamiliar with the healthcare system here, gratefully received.

La Bibliotecaria Feroz

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #70 on: November 09, 2015, 08:59:38 AM »
Congrats! So exciting! Doc probably can't tell you much more than the stick can at this point, but hopefully in a few weeks you'll be able to see the little heartbeat.

Trying to compare costs for childbirth is super complicated. Maybe one hospital charges more for an epidural--but they have better nurses, and don't GIVE as many epidurals.* A low c-section rate is also important if you have a high deductible plan. (I had 2 c-sections, but I was paying a lot every month for insurance that had no copay at all for childbirth.) And i hear it is difficult to get actual prices for things. That's not to say you shouldn't TRY, just get as much qualitative and quantitative info as you can.

That said, I tried really hard to avoid a c-section, both times, and it was just not in the cards. So prepare to maximize your chances of the best outcome, but budget for the worst!

*If you know you want one, I won't judge :-).

NeverLost

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #71 on: November 09, 2015, 09:06:47 AM »
annajane83-  Sorry you aren't getting any clarity on a potential pregnancy.  Did you go to the doctor?  Frugalparagon is right, the doctor will just have you pee on a stick to either confirm or deny a pregnancy so it may be a bit early.  If you were showing as pregnant, they wouldn't normally even have you come until  8 weeks or later since there's not much they can do. If it were me I would just go to the store and get one that says pregnant or not pregnant so I wouldn't keep stressing over it.  Since you are several days past you should be clearly showing one or the other now...  Your doctor/hospital choices will depend quite a bit on your insurance.  Also, if you like your doctor and want to stay with him (her?), he might only work at one hospital.  Best of luck. 

gbbi_977

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #72 on: November 10, 2015, 08:02:18 AM »
I went to the doctor this morning. She did an ultrasound and could see a tiny little speck! I got a picture and everything. It still doesn't feel real - but she said that the lining looks good and thick, and she could see the cyst that produces progesterone, so it seems like everything is on track. I also had a blood test for HcG, progesterone and thyroid levels.

I've decided to relax a bit about the healthcare costs - from what I can tell, it's not much good 'shopping around'. Another spanner in the works - my husband's company is moving to a new corporate exchange next year, so we won't have the same insurance provider most likely (and I'm guessing the premiums will go up).

birdie55

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #73 on: November 10, 2015, 09:05:01 AM »
Congratulation, Mom.  How thrilling. 

Bracken_Joy

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #74 on: November 10, 2015, 09:31:16 AM »
!! Congratulations. That is very exciting.

AllieVaulter

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #75 on: November 10, 2015, 09:56:14 AM »
Yay!  Congratulations!  I hope you're able to relax and enjoy this new stage in life!

farmerj

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #76 on: November 10, 2015, 01:59:26 PM »
"My question is: do I just go ahead and get those tests done, or do I need to go see a doctor first and have her refer me..."

So this post may have been influenced by early pregnancy hormones. I'll bet that was an emotional whiplash. Congratulations, and good luck!

Do contact your insurance company, who will be happy to chat with you and may send you a "getting started" package. In our case, the package included the "Mayo Clinic Guide to a Healthy Pregnancy", which was great... except we'd already bought a copy. Anyway, I found it very handy --  more scientific/technical than most of the other 'You've Got Baby' books.

okits

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #77 on: November 10, 2015, 06:23:31 PM »
Congrats on your speck, annajane83!  <3

I second the usefulness of the Mayo Clinic guide.  An obstetrical nurse also gave it the thumbs up for quality of medical information when she saw me reading it when I was pregnant with my DD.

I also really like Ina May Gaskin's guides to childbirth (I found it informative and reassuring) and breastfeeding (if you want to breastfeed.)

TVRodriguez

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #78 on: November 11, 2015, 07:19:02 AM »
Woohoo! Very exciting. Prenatal vitamins. Also, homemade agua panela con limón helps with náusea for some people  (worked for me and some friends...). It's homemade lemonade using unrefined sugar called panela that comes in blocks or cones and looks like blocks of brown sugar. Sometimes called piloncillo. It has some vitamins. And saltines are good, too.

smella

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #79 on: December 07, 2015, 07:23:00 PM »
Question about avoiding pregnancy tests until 2 weeks after period is due. Wouldn't it be useful to know if you had a chemical pregnancy that only delayed it by a bit?


For me, no.
I would be really stressed to know about a chemical pregnancy- because it would get my hopes up, and then, dropped. If conceiving is difficult, I couldn't handle that emotional toll.


Totally, but if you are having repeats chemical pregnancies, that is important information for a fertility doc.

smella

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #80 on: December 07, 2015, 07:32:15 PM »
Hi folks- I have been trying to conceive for three cycles.  As a lesbian using artificial insemination and purchased sperm, the process is very expensive :(.   

Frozen sperm only lives for 12-24 hours once thawed, so I have become veryyy experienced with charting in the past 6 months.  I have to be super precise!

Happy to answer any fertility questions. I've learned a ton in the last year.

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #81 on: December 07, 2015, 09:18:12 PM »
I just found this thread, so many ups and downs. Congratulations, and good luck...I'm mainly commenting for future reference. Tomorrow I'm getting an iud in, but we're discussing kids in a few years

fitfrugalfab

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #82 on: January 29, 2016, 02:42:17 PM »
Posting to follow. We're trying to start our family, too.

fitfrugalfab

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #83 on: January 29, 2016, 02:57:31 PM »
I went to the doctor this morning. She did an ultrasound and could see a tiny little speck! I got a picture and everything. It still doesn't feel real - but she said that the lining looks good and thick, and she could see the cyst that produces progesterone, so it seems like everything is on track. I also had a blood test for HcG, progesterone and thyroid levels.

I've decided to relax a bit about the healthcare costs - from what I can tell, it's not much good 'shopping around'. Another spanner in the works - my husband's company is moving to a new corporate exchange next year, so we won't have the same insurance provider most likely (and I'm guessing the premiums will go up).

Yay! Congratulations :)

Briarly

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #84 on: January 31, 2016, 05:02:17 AM »
just wanted to share what we did for anyone looking for info.
I am gay, so to find sperm I had to look around. I used a friend for our donor. paid a lawyer to draw up a contract. paid for sperm testing before starting. saw a midwife to help me with timing. got acupuncture after insemination. it took 5 months of trying, still under $1000 to get pregnant, all worth it in costs for me. I was willing to do anything to improve our chances of it working. I'm old-ish, 36, didn't feel I had time to waste plus our donor lives several hours away so trying was not convenient.
I did monitor my temp. I also used clearblue ovulation predictor kits- my midwife prefers them. I also looked at my cervix every day for the first part of my cycle- it was easy to see when I was most fertile doing this. using multiple data sets about my fertility helped us with timing a lot.
I'm now 26 weeks along, it has been an easy pregnancy. I can feel the baby kicking right now!

smella

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #85 on: January 31, 2016, 06:41:06 AM »
just wanted to share what we did for anyone looking for info.
I am gay, so to find sperm I had to look around. I used a friend for our donor. paid a lawyer to draw up a contract. paid for sperm testing before starting. saw a midwife to help me with timing. got acupuncture after insemination. it took 5 months of trying, still under $1000 to get pregnant, all worth it in costs for me. I was willing to do anything to improve our chances of it working. I'm old-ish, 36, didn't feel I had time to waste plus our donor lives several hours away so trying was not convenient.
I did monitor my temp. I also used clearblue ovulation predictor kits- my midwife prefers them. I also looked at my cervix every day for the first part of my cycle- it was easy to see when I was most fertile doing this. using multiple data sets about my fertility helped us with timing a lot.
I'm now 26 weeks along, it has been an easy pregnancy. I can feel the baby kicking right now!

Congrats briarly! Gay pregnancy fist bump. I'm now 11 weeks, ended up conceiving on the third cycle of frozen, so ultimately under budget.

Under $1000 is really impressive for a known donor and those procedures. I'm glad you had a lawyer advise on the contract. I know so many folks who think they can write up a donor contract without legal help, which is a frightening thought given that it's actually a complicated practice area with a big range in enforcement precedents (I work in a queer ART law firm).
« Last Edit: February 01, 2016, 05:47:11 PM by smella »

Prairie Stash

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #86 on: February 01, 2016, 01:41:01 PM »
One thing that has shocked me about being pregnant is the cost of all the ultrasounds etc. I'm very happy to be pregnant of course! But in terms of advice for people trying to conceive: we hit our deductible already this year and I'm not due til July (partly because of a $2000 biopsy unrelated to pregnancy), and our co-pay will go to 30% so we could still be looking at a $2000-$3000 bill for delivery before we hit our max out of pocket. It's so hard to do the numbers in advance of getting pregnant because of the lack of transparency, and most will have already picked their plans for this year, but picking the right plan is definitely something to think about.

Good luck to all of you who are following because you're also trying to conceive. I would echo the advice of others to borrow "Taking Charge of Your Fertility" - this made a big difference for us. We also used pro-fertility lubricant, and I purchased ovulation kits in bulk off Amazon for not much money.
I'm curious what ultrasounds cost? Free in Canada, so its not an issue. At the free price we had one for our first and will have 2 for our second, the 2nd is because we want to know the sex. My partner also had a blood test for genetic screening and we do monthly prenatal visits(should be 5 or 6 total) with the exception of first 2-3 months. I'm wondering if paid for care pushes more treatments onto you? Or maybe our doctor is a minimalist (she gets paid the same either way).

Congrats on the baby, good luck picking the perfect name.

Melissa

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #87 on: February 01, 2016, 07:27:55 PM »
My husband and I just attended a natural family planning class (because we are information hounds...no more babies here) and they taught the Creighton method. You still do charting and you are only looking at/for vaginal mucus each day. You work directly with a practitioner and visit every two weeks for the first couple of months so they can make sure you are going the charting correctly. Based of the findings on the chart you can pinpoint your ovulation. It can also be used to help find some potential problems (such as, if your period occurs the too closely after ovulation then you might have a progesterone problem)

The success they have with couple who are having difficulties getting pregnant is actually pretty high.

If you have any other questions about it PM me and I can try to find a local practitioner to help you out

Prairie Stash

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #88 on: February 02, 2016, 08:43:36 AM »
I did read your other post a while back, I too gamble, mostly it's delayed dental work though (all caught up when I turned 28, none or minimal insurance before that). $200 doesn't sound like much, I'd have difficulty saying no. Although we did decline a second ultrasound for our first child, when it was suggested that we check for cleft palate our first couldn't check for. Our reply was what difference will it make? You can't fix it, before birth, and we're not going to do anything either way. Sometimes the procedures really serve no point, that one was definitely optional.

I've been following your stories for awhile, similar circumstances here. My wife is currently pregnant with our second after trying for a year. The conception date should have been the first week of a 2 week holiday. We stayed home and threw a house party, saw local sights and slept in as much as our 2 year old allowed. In our case it was relaxing and forgetting about trying that seemed to work. We had been stressed with work, nothing like a vacation for the reboot.

TL;DR My personal theory is the mother needs to be relaxed and happy, that's key for conception, everything else is secondary.

Briarly

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #89 on: February 02, 2016, 07:45:38 PM »
my ultrasounds were just a $20 co-pay. I requested one at 9 weeks, had the anatomy scan at 20 weeks, and will have one more at 32 weeks to follow up on images of the kidneys. the 20 week scan looks at far more than a cleft lip... I would have wanted to know if anything was wrong with the baby since we're planning on having it at home.
my out of pocket cost for my prenatal care is $160 for the birth and prenatal care, $800 for a doula, $500 for a second midwife, $60 to rent a tub. I have fantastic insurance from my employer, I work for the state.
I don't feel my providers encourage me to have unnecessary testing at all.

Urchina

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #90 on: February 03, 2016, 11:28:05 PM »
Congrats to all the pregnant mamas here! Have fun!

To answer the OP's question about shopping around for hospitals -- in our area, when we were pregnant, there were only three options: Homebirth with a midwife, or one of two hospitals with an OB/GYN. And not all local OB/GYNs practiced at both hospitals.

I would find an OB/Gyn or midwife that you are comfortable with, then ask them which facilities they have privileges at. You may find a great midwifery practice with a freestanding birth center or have a very intervention-minded OB at a major hospital -- whatever works for you -- but I suspect your facility options will be reduced once you have your care provider.

Good luck!

MsPeacock

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #91 on: March 03, 2016, 02:37:22 PM »
I was also going to recommend Taking Charge of Your Fertility. SO MUCH INFO! I just did a paper chart (12 years ago)

Good Luck! :)

Another +1

Everyone of reproductive age should read it!

woopwoop

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #92 on: March 03, 2016, 10:13:37 PM »
Our first ultrasound was $415, I was in shock. Just a natural birth in the hospital near us (no anethesia or anything) costs around $12k. My OOP max is only $6500, so I guess I have that going for me. I was considering a home birth (which run around $4-5k), but in the event we would have to transfer to a hospital, we would be out that money on top of the OOP max, since a home midwife is "out of network" and that's not included in your deductible.

Now I'm freaking out about what else isn't covered in the OOP max. If they give you things at the hospital like lactation training or lanolin oil, could that be an extra charge? Even calling my health insurance doesn't help because they need codes before they'll tell you what they will pay for. The lack of transparency in medical billing is just freaking insane.

arebelspy

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #93 on: March 04, 2016, 02:56:47 AM »

Our first ultrasound was $415, I was in shock. Just a natural birth in the hospital near us (no anethesia or anything) costs around $12k.

Jesus. How do people afford to have kids? 

We went out of the country and just paid out of pocket... total cost for the birth (non-c-section) and hospital stay: $2300. Add in all the doctors visits before and after (just did through the one month checkup, including ultrasound on her hips to check for hip dysplasia, hepatitis b vaccine, etc.), all paid for out of pocket, no copay stuff, total was around 3 grand.

We calculated that if we were in the country, still with our jobs (both teachers with good health insurance, and on the higher tier of the two tier plan, which cost more monthly, but we got free as a perk of both being teachers), we'd have paid more just in co-pays and co-insurance.  In other words, having a kid with good health insurance in the USA would have cost us more than paying the whole thing elsewhere.

That's stupid.

And the hospital was nice, professional, super up to date technology, highly trained doctor, etc.

I'd recommend you go somewhere else to have the kid.  Save a few thousand bucks on the birth plus get a free vacation.  ;)
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little_brown_dog

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #94 on: March 04, 2016, 06:52:01 AM »
Our first ultrasound was $415, I was in shock. Just a natural birth in the hospital near us (no anethesia or anything) costs around $12k. My OOP max is only $6500, so I guess I have that going for me. I was considering a home birth (which run around $4-5k), but in the event we would have to transfer to a hospital, we would be out that money on top of the OOP max, since a home midwife is "out of network" and that's not included in your deductible.

Now I'm freaking out about what else isn't covered in the OOP max. If they give you things at the hospital like lactation training or lanolin oil, could that be an extra charge? Even calling my health insurance doesn't help because they need codes before they'll tell you what they will pay for. The lack of transparency in medical billing is just freaking insane.

That's insane - we had already reached our deductible for the year when I had my daughter so we lucked out. Total cost for the birth/stay was 10% of the cost due to our insurance. I think we paid $800 total for the entire thing. At our hospital the breastfeeding class and visits by lactation consultants were free of charge. The nipple cream/soothies, mesh underwear, maxipads, and cold gel pads were also automatically included. The only extra I have heard people get dinged on is the nursery. If they offer to take the baby to the nursery for a few hours so you can rest in between breastfeeding (commonly offered to c section moms or those with tough labors), watch out because that can definitely end up on the bill.

justajane

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #95 on: March 04, 2016, 06:59:13 AM »
One thing that annoys me about ultrasounds is that you have to pay twice if they check your belly and then use the vaginal probe. That is considered two ultrasounds, thus, double the cost. Since my uterus is tilted, you can never see anything until around 20 weeks on the belly anyway. I wised up after the first pregnancy and immediately informed the US tech at the 8-10 week ultrasound to just go straight to the probe. That saved us some money at least. Just a minor tip, although I would say in general, it's hard to avoid these types of costs, unless you forego certain ultrasounds altogether. I believe I had 3+ in each of my pregnancies. Could probably have gotten away with just one at 20 weeks.

GreenQueen

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #96 on: March 04, 2016, 07:47:53 AM »
Our first ultrasound was $415, I was in shock. Just a natural birth in the hospital near us (no anethesia or anything) costs around $12k. My OOP max is only $6500, so I guess I have that going for me. I was considering a home birth (which run around $4-5k), but in the event we would have to transfer to a hospital, we would be out that money on top of the OOP max, since a home midwife is "out of network" and that's not included in your deductible.

Now I'm freaking out about what else isn't covered in the OOP max. If they give you things at the hospital like lactation training or lanolin oil, could that be an extra charge? Even calling my health insurance doesn't help because they need codes before they'll tell you what they will pay for. The lack of transparency in medical billing is just freaking insane.

For that cost, have you considered a homebirth with a midwife? I have many friends who went this route, out of personal preference and due to cost. I've been reading a lot about how non-hospital births for normal pregnancies (no complications or high risk) are considered safe and even recommended. I'm grateful to be in a country where I don't have to think the cost.

little_brown_dog

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #97 on: March 04, 2016, 08:51:12 AM »
Our first ultrasound was $415, I was in shock. Just a natural birth in the hospital near us (no anethesia or anything) costs around $12k. My OOP max is only $6500, so I guess I have that going for me. I was considering a home birth (which run around $4-5k), but in the event we would have to transfer to a hospital, we would be out that money on top of the OOP max, since a home midwife is "out of network" and that's not included in your deductible.

Now I'm freaking out about what else isn't covered in the OOP max. If they give you things at the hospital like lactation training or lanolin oil, could that be an extra charge? Even calling my health insurance doesn't help because they need codes before they'll tell you what they will pay for. The lack of transparency in medical billing is just freaking insane.

For that cost, have you considered a homebirth with a midwife? I have many friends who went this route, out of personal preference and due to cost. I've been reading a lot about how non-hospital births for normal pregnancies (no complications or high risk) are considered safe and even recommended. I'm grateful to be in a country where I don't have to think the cost.

Homebirth in the US is not safe unlike in many Western European nations. Most midwives who do homebirth here are not certified nurse midwives (CNM) with medical training. They are certified professional midwives (CPM) or licensed midwives (LM) and are not required to have any medical or nursing training at all. Basically they have to just pass a certification exam and watch a certain number of births to be certified. They can have no college degree, or a degree in english lit.  They usually only carry really basic instruments like scissors and hand held fetal doppler. Basically, they rely almost completely on the fact that the birth will go perfectly smoothly. If something goes wrong, they have to call 911 and even in the best circumstances it will take at least 20 minutes to get mom and baby to a hospital.

In the US we see many infant deaths in homebirths that could have otherwise been prevented in a hospital setting. I think the most recent estimate was that 2 out of 3 infant deaths in homebirth could have been prevented in a hospital. If a woman chooses to give birth at home in the US, she is unwittingly choosing to have a 3 fold increase in her chances of her or her infant dying or having serious injuries should something go wrong. Here, homebirth is really predicated on the false assumption that birth is not inherently dangerous and that if you are low risk everything will be fine. The trouble is, problems and complications happen pretty frequently even to the healthiest mothers, and there is no telling if a problem will occur until it happens.

Sorry to get on my soapbox - I have just known way too many crunchy and green oriented women (myself included) who would have been ideal candidates for homebirth but needed emergency c sections, had protracted labors, or hemorrhaging. One woman I knew was going the homebirth route, developed preeclampsia (and was not followed appropriately due to her and her CPM's belief in very little prenatal care), and almost bled out when she gave birth at the hospital. Only an immediate blood transfusion saved her. If she had attempted to give birth at home, she most certainly would have died. Then of course there are all the moms across the US who lost their babies, or whose babies are permanently injured.

The desire to give birth at home, or the money saved, really isn't worth it when you consider that the repercussions of not having immediate medical care are death or brain damage. If anyone is interested in homebirth in the US, I really suggest looking at both sides of the issue and not just the very supportive stuff. Visit a homebirth trauma and loss support group and read the stories of the births gone wrong (you need to hear about the bad stuff as well as the good to make a truly informed choice). Yes, when birth goes smoothly homebirth can be fine, just as it would be in a hospital. But when it doesn't, the results can be absolutely catastrophic. Any you never know whether you will be one of the lucky ones.
« Last Edit: March 04, 2016, 08:59:47 AM by little_brown_dog »

Simply827

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #98 on: March 04, 2016, 11:30:10 AM »
I'm so happy for all of the pregnant mums and I'm getting emotional reading this thread. We're probably 1-1.5 years away from TTC, but would love to start trying now. Instead, I've been doing reading and this thread and others in this sub forum have been very helpful.

And I'm also now convinced that I'm staying at my employer because the insurance is dirt cheap and covers mostly everything. I work for a municipal government.
« Last Edit: March 04, 2016, 11:33:18 AM by Simply827 »

I'm a red panda

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Re: Trying to Conceive, the Mustachian way?
« Reply #99 on: March 04, 2016, 11:42:26 AM »
Homebirth in the US is not safe unlike in many Western European nations. Most midwives who do homebirth here are not certified nurse midwives (CNM) with medical training.

When you say "most", do you have a citation? Do you have statistics on the safety of homebirth in the US when using a CNM? 
Most of the people I now who have had homebirths have used a CNM/ARNP. The same person who provides their primary well-woman care over a period of years. 
Obviously, that's only an anecdote, "my friends" are highly unlikely to be representative of any group- but I'm wondering what data your statement is based on.

Because your post seems to make the assumption everyone uses a CPM, and that is not the only kind of midwife available. Is it still unsafe in the US to deliver at home with a CNM/ARNP?