How do I help my son become more mustachian?

[straycat]

I have a 6-year-old (grade 1) son, and live in Oakville, Ontario. He is growing up with some thrift ways, seeing me buy most things at thrift stores, and we love the library, and he has learned the value of buying things used off Kijiji instead of new. But is greatly affected by classmates. For example, his three closest friends have all been to Disneyworld (FL). One family owns a house there and so visits several times a year. The other one has been numerous times already with their 3 children. He keeps asking to go over and over and is at the point of crying sometimes saying he will save "his" money for a plane trip. It makes me feel SO guilty. We are saving for a vacation but it is a last priority. I don't know how to explain this to him. He is also in the habit of being "bored" by what he has and wanting something "new" every couple of days. It drives us NUTS. I try to explain to him how his last "new" thing didn't last very long did it, and the same thing would happen with the next new thing. But I'm not getting through. Any suggestions please?! He does get an allowance ($6/week as per Gail Vaz-Oxlade's reco) and is learning about having to save etc. for things he wants (video games - don't even get me started).

[GizmoTX]

It sounds like he doesn't know how to entertain himself & is relying on video games, new toys, etc. to do the job for him. As you've noticed, this leads to more & more consumption without satisfaction. Try not to feel guilty about peer group pressure.

How much access does he have to building things, lego blocks, playmobil, crafts, or other imagination oriented play? Scooter or biking? Day trips to parks & museums? Are there any youth groups he can be a part of? Our son started Cub Scouts at this age, & it had a lot of age appropriate activities & projects to do at home with dad or mom as well as with friends.

In full disclosure, we've done a lot of trips with our son, who is now 21, including DisneyWorld once when he was around six or seven. He enjoyed it, but he remembers other vacations much more fondly, such as skiing & camping with his friends & their families.

[MrMoogle]

I don't have kids, but I was raised pretty mustachian.  When I was little, I remember hearing, "we can't afford it," so I stopped asking.  Little did I know how much they were saving for retirement and my college.  I played some video games, but I was outside with friends most of my free time.  I had a friend across the street, I'd meet up with almost every day after school.  We were actually told we couldn't come inside until dinner time, so no video games or watching tv.  When I got older (teens), I got more into video games.

[lpep]

I was raised frugal, and now both my sister and I will never buy any clothes from a store if they're not on the clearance rack.

One thing I know contributed to my understanding of the value of money was saving up for a Gameboy when I was maybe 10. I just wanted to play Pokemon! It was $75, which took me months to save - and I played with that thing for YEARS. I also started work, during the summers, when I was 14, and then related everything I would buy to hours of my life. It definitely made a difference.

[sleepyguy]

OMG, had to be Oakville... land of the millionaires... LOL.

I lived in the "blue collar" area for about 7yrs.  Still own our rental house up there.

We grew up pretty poor and I remember all my buddies going off all over the place with family... where I just stayed put at my house for the summers.

Yeah I felt "left out" as any kid would... my parents basically just said.... it's either we eat or go on those trips.  That shut me up.

Kinda funny nowadays I could afford to travel quite a bit... I choose not to, lol.

With 2 kids of my own, I'm sure I'll go through the same thing... not sure i can use the "not eating excuse"... maybe... trips or pay for your university :)

[galliver]

My mom's response to "I'm booooored..." eventually became "I can give you something to do!" (e.g. washing dishes, vacuuming, math problems to solve, books to read in Russian, etc). Guess how long it took us to stop asking! ;) When you're feeling less snarky, you could just make productive suggestions. "Did you finish your library book(s)? We could get you new library books." "Did you finish your craft project for Grandma?" I don't have kids but I have sisters 5 and 8 years younger than me, so I remember them and their friends as kids pretty well. And I think all of us went through phases of "boredom," probably around the time we learned about computer games...but we were also kids and not mature enough to independently come up with alternative ways to entertain ourselves. We had tunnel vision.

Do you get your son random things he asks for? I don't remember my sisters or me ever asking for or getting toys/stuff in elementary school, except for birthdays and Christmas, when we were asked what we wanted (but didn't necessarily get everything we asked for). I think we knew it wouldn't be forthcoming until then, anyway. We did sometimes ask for sweets at the grocery store...because that *did* sometimes work. (We didn't care about things like clothes yet.)

Disneyworld is hard...it's hard to be left out of something that *seems* so important, that your whole peer group and especially closest friends are doing. Theme parks are kind of dumb, but 6 year olds don't know that. And they idealize things, and build them up, oh so much. If I wasn't in debt, I would try to make it happen. Although I think I would sit down with the kid and teach a hard lesson about tradeoffs. Like, we can go to Disney in a year if we give up ice cream and going to movies and you chip in half your allowance. Even if those things don't make a huge dent in the budget. Maybe I'm a softie. Or maybe I remember feeling like I was missing important experiences (an 8th grade science trip and music classes) and being really grateful that I got to experience those after all. Also the only way I found out theme parks were pretty dumb was by actually going a few times (not a regular thing for us, the camping trips vastly outweighed Disneyland and Legoland and all the other lands and worlds). I don't vouch for this being the right answer or anything; I just don't think I could keep blankly saying 'no way' if there was.

[dividendman]

I am from Oakville originally!

Hey, screw disneyworld. My mom took me and my brother to disney world AFTER we had already gone to Canada's Wonderland. Talk about a bust!

Wonderland was so much better then and I'm sure is still so much better (for way cheaper!). There are like 2 roller coasters in all of disney world (and I'm counting you as one of them, you piece of shit space mountain - what a complete bust compared to The Bat or MineBuster at wonderland!!)! In wonderland they're all over the place! Not to mention all of the other rides and shows.

I remember we got to go to Wonderland once a year and we looked forward to it SO much. We hated disney world and got in lots of trouble for voicing that opinion since we wasted all that money on it and we weren't wealthy by any stretch of the imagination.

Also I would like to echo the above, we were not allowed in the house until dinner time in the summer!

[straycat]

My husband and son go to Wonderland a LOT in the summer. We pay for the season's passes and so it works out to be a great deal. He LOVES it. Thanks for all of the ideas - it's hard because it's so different nowadays. I grew up in a small town where we would meet up with kids in the street too, and that does NOT happen anymore. "Playdates" have to be arranged in advance. We lived a few blocks away in Mississauga but moved to the Oakville side a few years ago because of a wonderful, brand-new school.

[NonprofitER]

I have noticed that there is an inverse relationship between how frequently my 5 1/2yo daughter can enjoy passive entertainment and then be capable of entertaining herself.  Meaning, the more screen time she gets, the less she is able to immerse herself in creative play/ get lost in a sense of flow with art/building projects/outdoor play. 

We had a conversation about this as a family (explicitly asking her input) and early in 2014 we did a several week "screen fast" (including my husband and I NOT looking at our mobile phones haphazardly while at home).  After the fast, we all agreed to having only 2 days per week of screen time (one hour each on 2 days for my daughter; a little more for the adults after she is in bed - but still sticking to 2 days/week), and overall, it has completely eliminated her "I'm boooooored" discussions.  The screen time is pre-set so she already knows when it will happen and having it not be a default option has increased her creative play substantially.

I'd really recommend a fast and an explicit conversation about passive entertainment limitations.  I also would recommend avoiding new gadgets/toys.  My daughter knows she can only expect "new things" on her birthday and Xmas.  She will sometimes see a new item at a friends house and will say "I wish I had that.  I'll put it on my Xmas list!" -- of course, many of those desires are fleeting and are completely forgotten about by Xmas. 

[going2ER]

If he is starting to get a concept of money why don't the 2 of you sit down and plan a trip to Disney? Ask him where he wants to stay and for how long? Get a price on that. Then look at flights, how much will they cost? What things will he want to do there? have lunch with a character? add in that cost, and so on. Maybe if he understands that his $6 will buy this, this and this, but a trip to Disney is $X thousands he may understand why you don't go. Or you could calculate how much you would have to save weekly for 2-3 years?

[RunHappy]

If he is starting to get a concept of money why don't the 2 of you sit down and plan a trip to Disney? Ask him where he wants to stay and for how long? Get a price on that. Then look at flights, how much will they cost? What things will he want to do there? have lunch with a character? add in that cost, and so on. Maybe if he understands that his $6 will buy this, this and this, but a trip to Disney is $X thousands he may understand why you don't go. Or you could calculate how much you would have to save weekly for 2-3 years?

Love this idea.

[oldfierm]

I don't have kids, but I was raised pretty mustachian.  When I was little, I remember hearing, "we can't afford it," so I stopped asking.  Little did I know how much they were saving for retirement and my college. 

Yup.  My Dad got so used to telling me that "lie" that he still says it sometimes even though we all know it is not even remotely true.  Last weekend he was visiting my house and started up with the "we can't - " and then stopped himself and kind of chuckled because *yeah dad, you can afford it*.

That was very effective when I was a kid.  We just thought we were poor. 

[Lia-Aimee]

Definitely second (third? fourth?) the "we can't afford it" line. Makes kids think more critically about money and consumption.  Just don't go overboard so he has a crippling fear of poverty his entire adulthood.

[TrMama]

Lots of good advice already. Especially about assigning chores to kids who complain of boredom. Works like a charm for us. The chore is often being sent to clean their rooms. Once they get there, they just start playing with the toys on the floor instead of cleaning them up. Fine with me!

I have noticed that there is an inverse relationship between how frequently my 5 1/2yo daughter can enjoy passive entertainment and then be capable of entertaining herself.  Meaning, the more screen time she gets, the less she is able to immerse herself in creative play/ get lost in a sense of flow with art/building projects/outdoor play. 

This is true for our kids as well. We haven't gone as far as doing a screen fast, but I did notice a huge improvement in the "I wants" when we switched from regular cable TV to Netflix. As soon as they stopped being exposed to all those horrible ads, they quit asking for X crappy plastic toy or Y junky snack item. This year for Christmas, all my 6yo could think to ask for was a pair of mitts and a new bouncy ball (to replace her old one that was eaten by raccoon).

[galliver]

... and a new bouncy ball (to replace her old one that was eaten by raccoon).

Poor raccoon!!! :/

[2ndTimer]

The famous Amy D of Tightwad Gazette talked now and then about raising her (many) children.  You might find that helpful.

[lemonlime]

Is his $6/week an allowance that he's given like an entitlement or does he have to do something to get it? I think it's really important for kids to understand that to get money, you have to work. It enables them to put a different kind of value on stuff - the effort to get the money to get the thing. So I think you should make sure that that "allowance" is tied to work like chores. And then you have to make him do the chores. When we did this with my stepdaughter, she stopped asking for things and started prioritizing what she really wanted and making plans for saving for those things. I would also recommend that you absolve yourself of guilt. Your child is not suffering in any way. He's using the tears and whining to manipulate you (it's not conscious, of course, he's just a kid!). Let your love for him help you to be more stubborn about your values than he is about his little-kid-wanting-stuff. You are paving the way for him to have a life of character and contentedness, he can't do that for himself at this age. Hang in there, stick to your guns, it will get better!

[hunniebun]

I also have a 6 year old and can relate to your post...the only difference is we are going to Disneyland (in two weeks to be exact). We booked the trip before I discovered MMM last year and this will actually be our 3rd time...and likely our last (although it really is the happiest place on earth for little kids)  I can assure you that even if you were going...he would find something else to 'want'.   We have park tickets for 4 days and tickets to a hockey game and I still hear whining that we are not going to Legoland too. And can he have a new lego set for the plane? and he doesn't like any of his shorts...can he have new shorts?   He received literally mountains of toys for Christmas and his Birthday and many are still in boxes unopened in the closet and I still hear "I'm bored".  We have dozen's of toys to foster imaginative play, from art supplies to dress up clothes, to lego, to cabin log/blocks. We have an indoor playroom with an indoor trampoline, trapeze and swing...and i still hear 'I want ..." constantly.  I have also noticed what others have mentioned that, more screen time leads to more "I'm bored" comments when not playing minecraft. So we have limited it to only one hour each day on the week-ends and that seems to be working a little better.  I have also kind of learned that I'm bored often means - I want your attention...so when I am hearing this, I try to take some extra time to play a board game, or read some books or play lego with him...to give him the attention he wants and to get him rolling with some creative play.

We used to do allowance but have since moved to the stance that money comes from work. We have a list of chores that he is capable of doing on his own (above and beyond the normal daily chores like cleaning his plate, putting clothes away picking up toys etc.) and he get's 25 cents per chore to a maximum of 6$ per week.  Guess how much allowance I have paid in 2015 - None.  He has a wallet full of money from the holidays too...and I suspect that when the money run's out (after our trip no doubt) he will be more motivated to do the chores.  I have been working hard the last little while to make changes and address the sense of entitlement that my kids have...but it is not easy (and it is our fault since we have all been living a spendypants lifestyle for the last decade).

I guess what I am trying to say is that at this age (and pretty much every age) the wants are never ending, so if Disney is not on your to do or to save for list, then don't feel badly...just focus on what you DO have and be thankful for that (and the fact that you are setting your child up for a great future)!

[MountainBeard]

Not sure how it would work with a 6 year old as they're already getting pretty big, but...  We started our now 4 year old on an allowance when he was ~2.5.  At that time we took him to the store and let him pick out a piggy bank.  The piggy bank got a name and personality, and every Sunday we feed it to which we have it reply, "thank you, oink oink".

Saving has become a habit already, and he knows the piggy will be hungry if he spends it.  The other day we were at Target, and my wife allowed him to pick out one $5 toy.  He was looking at things that were more expensive, and we told him that he could pay the difference to which he replied, "but then I'd have to spend my money".

Keep putting them in situations where they have to be responsible for their money - they'll eventually get it, and the lessons are way lower stakes now if they don't.
 

[CheapskateWife]

I have noticed that there is an inverse relationship between how frequently my 5 1/2yo daughter can enjoy passive entertainment and then be capable of entertaining herself.  Meaning, the more screen time she gets, the less she is able to immerse herself in creative play/ get lost in a sense of flow with art/building projects/outdoor play. 

We had a conversation about this as a family (explicitly asking her input) and early in 2014 we did a several week "screen fast" (including my husband and I NOT looking at our mobile phones haphazardly while at home).  After the fast, we all agreed to having only 2 days per week of screen time (one hour each on 2 days for my daughter; a little more for the adults after she is in bed - but still sticking to 2 days/week), and overall, it has completely eliminated her "I'm boooooored" discussions.  The screen time is pre-set so she already knows when it will happen and having it not be a default option has increased her creative play substantially.

This seems like an interesting discussion to have with my family and specifically the 6 yr old son as well.  Thank you for sharing the tip!