What if an 11/12 year old (gasp) does not have any idea what he/she wants to do for the rest of their lives? My son also says he wants to be an engineer when he is older but how can he know already? The last thing I want to do is to tell him that advanced math is necessary to get into an engineering school and absolutely freak him out or devastate him if he doesn't pass.
You don't tell him any of that -- that's for you to keep in mind, not him to fret about! Right now, you watch: you pay attention and try to help him make decisions that keep all of his options open, for as long as he is doing well on that path -- don't push, don't hold back, let his performance and behavior and emotional state tell you when he's on the right path and when it's too much or too little. IMO, if he studies for the test and doesn't pass it, then he belongs in the lower class, and that is a far better outcome than pushing him into something that may overwhelm him. OTOH, if he studies for the test and passes it, then he likely has both the work ethic and the intellectual development to do well in the harder class.
Look, my kid came home last year with this ridiculously stupid school schedule for this year -- all these AP classes, plus double calculus, plus two engineering classes as her "electives." WTF? I made an appointment with the guidance counselor and went in to tell her how stupid that was and to find another way that wouldn't overload my kid. But DD had zero interest in those other alternatives; she was thinking med school or engineering, she knew good colleges wanted to see tough classes, so she wanted to take a crack at it. So I said ok (and then privately talked with the guidance counselor about a backup plan for bailing a month or two into the year).
And then DD bowled me over by handling those tough classes, followed by doing well on the ACT.* Well, ok. So we took that information and used it to start identifying colleges that have the programs she is interested in and that seem to fit with her numbers so far; then we looked at their entrance requirements, and she is planning next year's classes around what those schools want to see. If she had done better or worse in her classes or on her tests, we'd be looking at different sets of colleges and making different choices about her schedule next year (me, my senior year was playtime; no way I'd have signed up for double calculus again, are you kidding me?).
You are not even close to that stage yet -- and you don't have to be. Your job right now is to follow your kid and watch what excites him, what he's good at, what he struggles with, and try to get him placed in the most challenging classes that he is both interested in and can succeed in. That's it. But the good news is that, if you keep watching and following his lead (with just the occasional push or tug as needed), by the time you are in our position, you will also have a much better view of what he can handle and what he is interested in, and so you can then make your own decisions about classes and colleges and such.
*I feel the need for a little backstory: DD is highly ADHD and impulsive; she always wants to bite off more than she can chew; and usually by winter or spring she is having massive meltdowns and the grades are cratering. As a result, much of my parenting has involved keeping her between the guard rails and slightly reined in. Which is why I had such a strong reaction to the classes they recommended she take, and why I was then completely flabbergasted when she stepped up and managed them (knock on wood -- still 2 mos. to go!). I mean, holy shit -- who are you and what have you done with my kid?
I think it depends on your area and the desired course of study. For ex., my DD is adamant that she wants to be an engineer. Every engineering school we are looking at is equally adamant that they want the kids to take the hardest math/science classes available (and I have seen a few that even say HS calc is mandatory for admission). So if she hadn't taken calc at all, that would be a real mark against her and would prevent her from even applying to or being considered at some places.
But beyond that, the hardest math track here is calculus ABCD junior year and multivariable calc senior year (both of which are two-semester, two-period classes). Most kids in the advanced math track do calc ABCD junior year and then AP statistics senior year (which is a one-semester, one-period class); she was one of the few kids who was recommended for the harder option. So she is making herself a more desirable candidate by choosing that path -- which, it turns out, is pretty critical given the schools she really wants to get into. But of course, that was all possible only because she was in the advanced math track all along; kids who start algebra a year later can only max out with Calc AB (they do a different version for the senior-level calc class, don't ask me why).*
So, again, YMMV. But I think the takeaway is to understand what your school district offers and what the colleges your kid may be looking at expect for the likely areas of study -- the story here is very definitely "take the hardest classes you possibly can" (with the unspoken addition of "as long as you can get As and maybe the occasional B in them").
*And FWIW, this is for a kid who is not MIT/Caltech material -- i.e., she's not the super-special genius who needs to go above and beyond to realize her full potential and get admitted to THE top schools. I'm just talking about top-25 engineering schools, not the tippy-top 5 or so.
This is very interesting. My thoughts:
#1 I think I'm pretty glad I'm old. I mean, I'm good at math. An engineer. Went to a top 10 school. Maybe could have gotten in to MIT or Caltech? But who knows, it was 30 years ago and I had to stay in-state because I was poor. In any event, as a female going into engineering with straight-As, HS valedictorian, good SATs, and parents who were blue collar (so I was first gen college student in my family) - they wanted me and were throwing money at me. Same goes for husband, also an engineer, also #1 in his class, a different top-10 engineering school - but his dad was a lawyer so he wasn't first gen college student.
So, my kids, being that they have parents who are engineers, and are UMC income, well, they are a dime a dozen these days. I like to think that I'm smart and all, but not sure I'd be considered super-genius. I didn't have calculus in HS because I changed schools when my parents divorced. My old high school, with a much better math program, had 10th grade geometry, 11th grade trig/pre-calc, 12th grade calc. The new HS, if you wanted calc, you had to take summer geometry after 9th grade, 10th was trig for advanced students, 11th pre-calc, 12th calc. Because I'd just finished geometry, in 11th I went into trig. Anyway, it was boring and the full year's trig class was based on a 6 month textbook and WE NEVER FINISHED IT. Still, despite that, I was able to go to a math competition in 12th with the calc students and wipe the floor with them.
2. The advice to watch is spot on. My 6th grader is advanced, and really good at math. But a lot of kids here are too and a good % of them are PUSHED. So while I think it's cute that he wants to go to Cal Tech, and I'll help him however - I don't know if he even has a shot. Times are different. And of course, I think he will be just fine wherever he goes. If he wants to be an engineer - fine, Cal Poly, any of the UCs, there are any number of schools where he can get a good education, that won't kill our pocketbook. (Which is, of course, the other factor - $$. I'd much rather he choose something affordable, even though we have enough money to send him to CalTech, or MIT, or Cornell, or CMU.)
Considering that husband and I went to private engineering schools, it seems weird to try and direct him to state schools. Many of my college classmates look at the sticker price of our alma mater ($72k) and complain that they'd never be able to send their kids there. Well, it's true that 30 years ago a year was approx 1/2 of the median family income of the time, and now that $72k is approx 1.5x the median family income. BUT!! Your parents couldn't afford to send you either, hello, we were all in ROTC!!
My 6th grader has a pretty ridiculous looking schedule for 7th, and we're just going to wait and see. His 6th grade teacher has been really challenging him this year, and luckily - he's risen to the challenge. This is a kid who has a tendency to be a bit lazy - to do JUST well enough to be better than everyone else. (My goal at his age was 100%!!)
I work in a company with a lot of PhDs, a lot of them from China and India and they are INTENSE! Their advice is INTENSE. I try to just ignore it.
