Author Topic: Giving away free copies of the book I wrote about selling covered calls for FIRE  (Read 18781 times)

RR

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Got my copy of this book in a couple of days after requesting it.  Looking forward to reading it and expanding my covered call knowledge. Thanks again for the book!

kindoflost

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Hey, thanks for doing this!
I just requested my copy and I am anxiously waiting for it.
I started selling covered calls and cash-secured puts in July 2022 after finding a guy on Twitter that I bought an online course from... Yes crazy and something I never do but it worked right away on the stocks and money I already had. Anyway, I do weekly calls, and every week I think it will be the last time it is going to work and it keeps working and I am getting crazy returns. I don't try to understand it anymore and try not to overthink too much for fear of ruining it by being the very analytical guy that I am...
Oh well. I write calls against stocks and seems like this is about index funds which I assume would be less risky so I am here to try and learn another new thing.
Thanks again and I will post an update once I get the book and after I read it.
I can't believe there are still books available after so long

I really appreciate the in-depth reply! Your book is on it's way (I believe I have already emailed you a tracking number).

I, too, bought lots of books, and maybe one or three digital things. And I did a put-call "wheel" strategy on some higher volatility stocks when I first went live after paper trading. Return was about 35% in 4 months, and then one Friday erased all that and more!

I say this not to disparage your strategy and success (which is awesome), but to kind of share that I had a similar journey but after lots of ups and down settled on OTM portfolio overwriting of indexes (which I would own anyway) for some extra monthly scratch. And it's imho pretty fun and rewarding.

And I actually am so passionate about options as a conceptual risk/reward thing I was happy to sit down and write about the subject in a way that kind of "gives back" to the Mustachians. Without MMM, I'd be a paycheck to paycheck pharmacist still, and I really respect everyone in the space who puts out genuine, sometimes free, material, and think it would be fulfilling to be even peripherally in the orbit of that group.

You probably already understand everything in the book intellectually, but I'm hoping with my 10+ years of experience, there will be some new way of looking at things, or just some fun Easter eggs in there you find interesting.

Thanks again for posting! I, too, am surprised I have about 19 left after so long, but (as you know) I've been asking people to just post here once they got a real, free book (only if they want to) in order to hopefully spur others to reach out [this is a hint to anyone reading this ;) ].

Have an awesome Labor Day weekend.

Matt C

Best!

hey I just got my free copy of the book. thank you!
already got ahead reading online but continue on the physical copy now
regards

CoffeeR

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I received my copy. Thank you!!

mjchamb

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Oh, I can see where you inferred 1/4th rise like the S&P 500, which wasn't my intent.  After a big move in the S&P 500, I figure most people have larger portfolios.  Not 1/4th larger, but yes I assumed your portfolio had grown in 2023.

Although recent evidence supports a potential "soft landing", it's still possible we see a crash within the next couple years.  I could be wrong, but I think the market underestimates the risk.  We'll see - I hold married puts to mitigate the risk.

I have admittedly been buying bonds as SGOV while the short-term rates are high.

mjchamb

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Got my copy of this book in a couple of days after requesting it.  Looking forward to reading it and expanding my covered call knowledge. Thanks again for the book!

Oh good! Fast turnaround by USPS.

I hope it expands your knowledge so much you go up a hat size and a wallet size.

Thanks for replying here once you got it!

Best,
Matt C

MustacheAndaHalf

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Although recent evidence supports a potential "soft landing", it's still possible we see a crash within the next couple years.  I could be wrong, but I think the market underestimates the risk.  We'll see - I hold married puts to mitigate the risk.
I have admittedly been buying bonds as SGOV while the short-term rates are high.
Looks like a good choice.  I held SGOV(*) some time ago, but switched to BIL(*) when it had lower interest rate risk (maturity).  Now SGOV beats BIL on average maturity and expense ratio, so I might have to reconsider.

(*)
SGOV : iShares 0-3 Month Treasury Bond ETF
https://www.ishares.com/us/products/314116/ishares-0-3-month-treasury-bond-etf
BIL : SPDRŽ Bloomberg 1-3 Month T-Bill ETF
https://www.ssga.com/us/en/individual/etfs/funds/spdr-bloomberg-1-3-month-t-bill-etf-bil

mjchamb

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Although recent evidence supports a potential "soft landing", it's still possible we see a crash within the next couple years.  I could be wrong, but I think the market underestimates the risk.  We'll see - I hold married puts to mitigate the risk.
I have admittedly been buying bonds as SGOV while the short-term rates are high.
Looks like a good choice.  I held SGOV(*) some time ago, but switched to BIL(*) when it had lower interest rate risk (maturity).  Now SGOV beats BIL on average maturity and expense ratio, so I might have to reconsider.

(*)
SGOV : iShares 0-3 Month Treasury Bond ETF
https://www.ishares.com/us/products/314116/ishares-0-3-month-treasury-bond-etf
BIL : SPDRŽ Bloomberg 1-3 Month T-Bill ETF
https://www.ssga.com/us/en/individual/etfs/funds/spdr-bloomberg-1-3-month-t-bill-etf-bil

Oh cool, I was wholly unaware of BIL!

I'll check out the long term performance, dividend rate/frequency, expense ratio etc, etc. But it sounds like you already did and prefer SGOV.

I mostly have actual, individual, short term treasuries (aside from the index funds) right now, but I use SGOV as a place to add cash until I hit the ~face value of another bond, and as a larger chunk for small, passive, monthly income.

I talk about this a bit in the book- how I'm a bad indexer, but dividends (even though they theoretically can cause underperformance) and things like dividends (call premiums) keep me motivated, and make me save/invest a lot more than I would otherwise.

ChpBstrd

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Unfortunately there's no way to run a covered call strategy on BIL or SGOV. BIL offers practically no premiums and SGOV doesn't even have an option market.

But these risk-free solutions do offer a baseline by which to measure what one hopes to achieve with a covered call strategy. I.e. if you can't expect to earn at least a couple percent over their yield, there's no need trying.

wantstoinvest

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I'm halfway through the book now and the general concept is explained pretty well!

I'm still getting to the meatier chapters but one thing I'm misunderstanding is what is the downside if your covered stock falls? I get the upside risk (you lose out on gains if the stock you are offering a call contract on skyrockets) but is there a downside if the stock tanks? Seems like there is not to me because you would be making a premium on a stock you were already holding.

Also, is there a preferred platform to try doing this on? I'm going to try it on my Merrill Lynch account, but its a taxable account. Is that bad?

Rob_bob

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I'm halfway through the book now and the general concept is explained pretty well!

I'm still getting to the meatier chapters but one thing I'm misunderstanding is what is the downside if your covered stock falls? I get the upside risk (you lose out on gains if the stock you are offering a call contract on skyrockets) but is there a downside if the stock tanks? Seems like there is not to me because you would be making a premium on a stock you were already holding.

Also, is there a preferred platform to try doing this on? I'm going to try it on my Merrill Lynch account, but its a taxable account. Is that bad?

I don't see a downside if the stock falls because as you said you have received a premium which has effectively lowered your cost basis.

Option premiums are short term cap gains and taxed as ordinary income so it would be best to use an IRA.

ChpBstrd

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I'm halfway through the book now and the general concept is explained pretty well!

I'm still getting to the meatier chapters but one thing I'm misunderstanding is what is the downside if your covered stock falls? I get the upside risk (you lose out on gains if the stock you are offering a call contract on skyrockets) but is there a downside if the stock tanks? Seems like there is not to me because you would be making a premium on a stock you were already holding.

Also, is there a preferred platform to try doing this on? I'm going to try it on my Merrill Lynch account, but its a taxable account. Is that bad?
Your downside is that the stock could go to zero, and all you're left with is the option premium, which is maybe 1% of the value.

Of course, index funds will never go to zero (except in the case of some Russia funds in 2022) so your risk is the experience of a double-digit percentage loss, offset a tiny amount by the premium received.

familyFIguy

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Just wanted to drop a note that I recieved my copy yesterday and this book looks great! I'm already on chapter four and given that I know nothing about selling covered calls, I'm finding it really interesting -- much more information here than I thought! So far the book is very approachable -- especially for what I was assuming was a very complicated topic.

Came with stickers too so extra point for that!

Thanks again OP!

mjchamb

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I'm halfway through the book now and the general concept is explained pretty well!

I'm still getting to the meatier chapters but one thing I'm misunderstanding is what is the downside if your covered stock falls? I get the upside risk (you lose out on gains if the stock you are offering a call contract on skyrockets) but is there a downside if the stock tanks? Seems like there is not to me because you would be making a premium on a stock you were already holding.

Also, is there a preferred platform to try doing this on? I'm going to try it on my Merrill Lynch account, but its a taxable account. Is that bad?
Your downside is that the stock could go to zero, and all you're left with is the option premium, which is maybe 1% of the value.

Of course, index funds will never go to zero (except in the case of some Russia funds in 2022) so your risk is the experience of a double-digit percentage loss, offset a tiny amount by the premium received.

Exactly! After some big losses with options on riskier stocks, I narrowed the focus to OTM calls on indexes and now I sleep great at night, and my account goes up instead of down.

mjchamb

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Just wanted to drop a note that I recieved my copy yesterday and this book looks great! I'm already on chapter four and given that I know nothing about selling covered calls, I'm finding it really interesting -- much more information here than I thought! So far the book is very approachable -- especially for what I was assuming was a very complicated topic.

Came with stickers too so extra point for that!

Thanks again OP!

Hey! Thanks for the kind feedback. This is exactly the reaction I'm hoping for. I hope as the chapters go on and it gets dense I've hooked you enough to power through to the end.

Also, notice how the stickers have absolutely no information about my book or website on them. Turns out I'm not great at marketing, lol (a friend was making fun of me for that recently).

mjchamb

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Unfortunately there's no way to run a covered call strategy on BIL or SGOV. BIL offers practically no premiums and SGOV doesn't even have an option market.

But these risk-free solutions do offer a baseline by which to measure what one hopes to achieve with a covered call strategy. I.e. if you can't expect to earn at least a couple percent over their yield, there's no need trying.

Yeah its a bummer it's not optionable but I'm guessing there wouldn't be enough uncertainty to garner any meaningful premium whatsoever.

I like short term bonds and bond funds as a benchmark, like you said, and as a "risk free" portion of the portfolio. Also good to have sitting around in case of another market crash. But like I said, I'm a bad indexer; don't do what I do. But do feel free to let me tell you how covered calls work :D

MustacheAndaHalf

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Looks like a good choice.  I held SGOV(*) some time ago, but switched to BIL(*) when it had lower interest rate risk (maturity).  Now SGOV beats BIL on average maturity and expense ratio, so I might have to reconsider.

(*)
SGOV : iShares 0-3 Month Treasury Bond ETF
https://www.ishares.com/us/products/314116/ishares-0-3-month-treasury-bond-etf
BIL : SPDRŽ Bloomberg 1-3 Month T-Bill ETF
https://www.ssga.com/us/en/individual/etfs/funds/spdr-bloomberg-1-3-month-t-bill-etf-bil

Oh cool, I was wholly unaware of BIL!

I'll check out the long term performance, dividend rate/frequency, expense ratio etc, etc. But it sounds like you already did and prefer SGOV.

I mostly have actual, individual, short term treasuries (aside from the index funds) right now, but I use SGOV as a place to add cash until I hit the ~face value of another bond, and as a larger chunk for small, passive, monthly income.

I talk about this a bit in the book- how I'm a bad indexer, but dividends (even though they theoretically can cause underperformance) and things like dividends (call premiums) keep me motivated, and make me save/invest a lot more than I would otherwise.
That's interesting, because I believe good behavior is underappreciated in investing.  Behavorial finance has examples of people avoiding losses at twice the price of gains.

I have a Schwab International account which pays very little on idle cash, which is why I looked at BIL and SGOV.

I have a very strong risk aversion with bonds, personally.  I hate being taxed on interest while my investment loses money.  Equities are the opposite for me.

mm9356

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I received my copy of the book in the mail just a few days after requesting it. Thanks again, Matt, for sharing what you've learned. I look forward to checking it out.

mjchamb

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I received my copy of the book in the mail just a few days after requesting it. Thanks again, Matt, for sharing what you've learned. I look forward to checking it out.

Awesome! I have 8 more left so hoping 8 more people ask for one.

Hope you find it illuminating!

wingfold2001

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Got the book yesterday, thanks MJChamb. My kids loved the shiny stickers too, big hit!

mjchamb

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Got the book yesterday, thanks MJChamb. My kids loved the shiny stickers too, big hit!

HAHA thanks! I get more compliments on the stickers than the books lol

I hope you enjoy it and use a call premium to take the kids to the zoo or something.

Best,
Matt C

P.S. Anyone reading I have 8 BOOKS LEFT please lmk if you want one

shuffler

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I got my copy!

I was on vacation for a bit, and then last week I FIRE'd, so I expect I'll have time to dig into it soon.
I'm hoping to find a bit of "free lunch" to goose my fun-money budget in FIRE.  ;^D

Also, the stickers are legit.  Slapped one on my desktop PC case.

Rob_bob

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I received my copy.  It looks like it has a lot of technical information that I have never delved into so should be educational.

tj

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Book arrived. Many thanks! I'm surprised there were still some available.

kindoflost

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Hey, I just finished reading the book and posted reviews on Amazon and Goodreads.
I am also recommending it to friends (we'll see how this goes).
For now, I will keep doing what I have been doing until it stops working: weekly calls and puts on the three stocks I already know. What they call the wheel strategy. If and when this breaks for me, then I will maybe switch to index funds.
Two pieces of constructive feedback: you make no mention of fees in the book. I think this is because the funds you buy are more expensive than my stocks (all between $12 and $16) so the fee may be less than 1% of the trade. For my stocks, it's been around 7% and in bad weeks it hurts... The other is that maybe there needs to be more detail on explaining how to get back into the option once the option is assigned. You barely mention puts so you just buy back at whatever the price?
Great read!

Rob_bob

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ctive feedback: you make no mention of fees in the book. I think this is because the funds you buy are more expensive than my stocks (all between $12 and $16) so the fee may be less than 1% of the trade. For my stocks, it's been around 7% and in bad weeks it hurts...

What fees are you paying and what premiums are you collecting?  I pay $0.66 per contract which would be a lot if you are only getting $8 in premium.  Have you figured what the annualized  yield is on the trade?

Maybe you could look for a few other stocks with better premiums and just trade the wheel with them.  The $0.66 I'm paying goes unnoticed to me.

kindoflost

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ctive feedback: you make no mention of fees in the book. I think this is because the funds you buy are more expensive than my stocks (all between $12 and $16) so the fee may be less than 1% of the trade. For my stocks, it's been around 7% and in bad weeks it hurts...

What fees are you paying and what premiums are you collecting?  I pay $0.66 per contract which would be a lot if you are only getting $8 in premium.  Have you figured what the annualized  yield is on the trade?

Maybe you could look for a few other stocks with better premiums and just trade the wheel with them.  The $0.66 I'm paying goes unnoticed to me.

I am at Vanguard so I pay $1 per contract. I used Merrill Lynch before where it was 0.65 but they p'd me off with how slowly they released the funds the few times I bought back the call and also when I wanted to get the money out quickly to pay for expenses.
Looks to me that if you are trading VTI which is around $200 and the options are, say, $4 I'd be paying $1 for a $400 deal. But my stocks are, say $14 and the options around 0.10 so I pay $1 for a $10 deal. Also, I am doing weekly not monthly so this brings down the option value.
I am still debating whether what I'm doing is the best. 15 months into this and still scratching the surface.

mjchamb

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I got my copy!

I was on vacation for a bit, and then last week I FIRE'd, so I expect I'll have time to dig into it soon.
I'm hoping to find a bit of "free lunch" to goose my fun-money budget in FIRE.  ;^D

Also, the stickers are legit.  Slapped one on my desktop PC case.

I swear I get more compliments on the stickers than anything else, and stupid me didn't put any website info or anything on them. I'm glad you think they're cool! My beautiful, talented fiance made the design.

I took a while replying to this, so I hope your vacation was great!

THERE IS NO FREE LUNCH, but there were free books from some weirdo in Ohio for a while :)

mjchamb

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I'm halfway through the book now and the general concept is explained pretty well!

I'm still getting to the meatier chapters but one thing I'm misunderstanding is what is the downside if your covered stock falls? I get the upside risk (you lose out on gains if the stock you are offering a call contract on skyrockets) but is there a downside if the stock tanks? Seems like there is not to me because you would be making a premium on a stock you were already holding.

Also, is there a preferred platform to try doing this on? I'm going to try it on my Merrill Lynch account, but its a taxable account. Is that bad?

HEY!

Sorry, life a little crazy.

Your thinking is along the right lines. The downside if the stock tanks is the same downside as if you just owned the stock and it tanked.

AND you are correct, that downside is lower thank just owning stock because you made a call premium.

The other risk, which isn't typically called downside, is what is usually referred to as upside risk. It's not an explicit loss of value within your account from starting, but rather the risk that by selling calls you cap your upside (to whatever the strike of the option you sold is) and will, over time, underperform a buy and hold investor. So, even though your account isn't "shrinking" per se if you are only selling OTM calls above cost basis, it won't look as nice as a buy and hold investor's account under conditions where your chosen index keeps surpassing your chosen strike prices.

Upside risk is very real, and likely to happen if you write calls for long enough. So real that I wouldn't recommend selling calls against your entire account.

mjchamb

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Just wanted to drop a note that I recieved my copy yesterday and this book looks great! I'm already on chapter four and given that I know nothing about selling covered calls, I'm finding it really interesting -- much more information here than I thought! So far the book is very approachable -- especially for what I was assuming was a very complicated topic.

Came with stickers too so extra point for that!

Thanks again OP!

Thank you family FIguy!!!!!

I hope your enthusiasm is maintained as the arithmetic intensifies, but look forward to some fun chapters and acknowledgments near the end, as a treat. And enjoy the stickers that I neglected to put any real marketing material on.

<3,
Matt C

mjchamb

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I received my copy of the book in the mail just a few days after requesting it. Thanks again, Matt, for sharing what you've learned. I look forward to checking it out.

The turnaround time on media mail has been killer! Best $4.87 you can spend as a guy giving away free books.

I do hope you enjoy it!

mjchamb

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Book arrived. Many thanks! I'm surprised there were still some available.

Oh good! Many welcomes.

I, too, was surprised at how long it took to give away 100 books for free. The last 20 took as long as the first 80.... something something pareto distribution.

Hope you like it!

mjchamb

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ctive feedback: you make no mention of fees in the book. I think this is because the funds you buy are more expensive than my stocks (all between $12 and $16) so the fee may be less than 1% of the trade. For my stocks, it's been around 7% and in bad weeks it hurts...

What fees are you paying and what premiums are you collecting?  I pay $0.66 per contract which would be a lot if you are only getting $8 in premium.  Have you figured what the annualized  yield is on the trade?

Maybe you could look for a few other stocks with better premiums and just trade the wheel with them.  The $0.66 I'm paying goes unnoticed to me.

Fidelity is like $0.65 a contract or something, but the ATM premiums on SCHD are around $1.00, or $100 total for 100 shares. Like, when you say you are getting a premium of $8, do you mean $8 total ($0.08 per share) or $8 per share? In which case $0.66 of $800 is negligible.

I traded options on individual stocks for a while and learned that it was too dangerous for me...the hard way. So I definitely didn't write about that. But I may just be a bad investor.

My returns are mentioned explicity in the book, and intentionally hidden near the back. I didnt want anyone without nuance to pick up the book and see "X%-Y% per year" and think I was selling some magic method for free money. Because nothing is. And it varies, some years it's almost nothing, some years I lag the market, etc, etc. Hence it's not on the cover in big bold letters. And any book that has that is likely trying to swindle you.

I actually do "wheel" my index shares, but this book was already 400 pages and i was getting tired, and figured if i ever sold enough copies to make it worth my time i would expand it to include put or write a second edition. Good news is, once you understand covered calls deeply and thoroughly, everything else is a walk in the park. So someone digesting all the info in my thing would be well-equipped to quickly pick up the wheel.
« Last Edit: October 27, 2023, 09:21:50 AM by mjchamb »

mjchamb

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Hey, I just finished reading the book and posted reviews on Amazon and Goodreads.
I am also recommending it to friends (we'll see how this goes).
For now, I will keep doing what I have been doing until it stops working: weekly calls and puts on the three stocks I already know. What they call the wheel strategy. If and when this breaks for me, then I will maybe switch to index funds.
Two pieces of constructive feedback: you make no mention of fees in the book. I think this is because the funds you buy are more expensive than my stocks (all between $12 and $16) so the fee may be less than 1% of the trade. For my stocks, it's been around 7% and in bad weeks it hurts... The other is that maybe there needs to be more detail on explaining how to get back into the option once the option is assigned. You barely mention puts so you just buy back at whatever the price?
Great read!

So, I didn't mention fees because my brokerage charges a small amount and i only sell a fairly low volume...I didnt know how to explain them in a way that wouldn't end up being too confusing, since every brokerage has a different fee structure. Same thing with how to actually "click" to sell an option.

I either buy back shares at whatever price, or will sell a put to wheel, but it was just so in-depth already i figured i'd save it for a future edition or another book.

Thanks for the feedback, I will implement some version of these if i come back to improve it or add to it. I have been considering hiring a professional editor at the behest of the other poster, Solon; I know I'm not a great writer.

BIG THANKS FOR READING. Every second you spent staring at that thing means the world to me you have no idea.

BIG BIG THANKS for the nice review. I was thinking if I mailed out 100 for free, maybe 10-20 would spread the word or leave a review and that's just super awesome, and I can't tell you how much appreciate it. It may catch on, it may not, but I didn't want to have some annoying website ads or anything. Word-of-mouth was the only way I felt good about, so that really makes my day you had something nice to say, and took the time to post it.

Much love,
Matt C

mjchamb

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ctive feedback: you make no mention of fees in the book. I think this is because the funds you buy are more expensive than my stocks (all between $12 and $16) so the fee may be less than 1% of the trade. For my stocks, it's been around 7% and in bad weeks it hurts...

What fees are you paying and what premiums are you collecting?  I pay $0.66 per contract which would be a lot if you are only getting $8 in premium.  Have you figured what the annualized  yield is on the trade?

Maybe you could look for a few other stocks with better premiums and just trade the wheel with them.  The $0.66 I'm paying goes unnoticed to me.

I am at Vanguard so I pay $1 per contract. I used Merrill Lynch before where it was 0.65 but they p'd me off with how slowly they released the funds the few times I bought back the call and also when I wanted to get the money out quickly to pay for expenses.
Looks to me that if you are trading VTI which is around $200 and the options are, say, $4 I'd be paying $1 for a $400 deal. But my stocks are, say $14 and the options around 0.10 so I pay $1 for a $10 deal. Also, I am doing weekly not monthly so this brings down the option value.
I am still debating whether what I'm doing is the best. 15 months into this and still scratching the surface.

It can be a lifelong thing, but after about 12 solid years of trying it all, I landed on OTM calls on indexes, and enjoy my time thinking about other things at this point. The options I still love but stock picking has become an annoyance colored by losses to me.

I do wish you the best on your journey.

"It's dangerous to go alone! Take this" hands him wizard-themed options book.

wantstoinvest

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I finished the book as well and it's a good read that explains the concept well but I think one thing missing too is a fee/taxes section.

It seems like a good strategy though, especially with the state of the market the last few weeks. Has anyone in this thread tried selling covered calls as a result of this book?

@mjchamb

Are you still selling covered calls? I have a merill account I want to try it in but its a post tax account and I'm not sure what would happen if I made any money.

mjchamb

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----------
10/17/2023 UPDATE: Books are GONE!!!! Thank you so much to anyone who requested one.

----------



Thanks to everyone who requested a book!

If you want to meet me in person, I am slated to do a talk for the local Columbus FIRE Facebook meetup group, ColumbusFI, Saturday February 17th. Location TBD, usually a library, and of course I'll have more free books. Hopefully it doesn't devolve into a shouting match.

As far as the website goes, my father very suddenly, very tragically passed away while I was giving these books away, and I have had lots of life changes around it. I am closer to FIRE now because of it, and will update the website at some point, but it really moved to the bottom of my list. I'm currently consumed by handling the estate. So we will see how that pans out as things calm down, and I find my center again.

My email is in the back of the book and on the website, I will be deleting the giveaway email soon. Drop me a line if you want. I'll check the forum randomly, but not frequently.

Big thanks to the mods for letting me post.

<3,
Resident wannabe wizard,
Matt C
« Last Edit: October 27, 2023, 11:01:32 AM by mjchamb »

mjchamb

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I finished the book as well and it's a good read that explains the concept well but I think one thing missing too is a fee/taxes section.

It seems like a good strategy though, especially with the state of the market the last few weeks. Has anyone in this thread tried selling covered calls as a result of this book?

@mjchamb

Are you still selling covered calls? I have a merill account I want to try it in but its a post tax account and I'm not sure what would happen if I made any money.

Super Super thank you for reading! I don't want to continually gush over everyone that did, but it's super cool anyone cares adn you get to live in my brain for a bit.

I don't fully understand the tax implications, as I don't do my own and pay someone else to. Hence, I had to (sadly) leave that up to the reader to figure out :/

The last call I sold I think was an SCHD with a strike of $73, but with SCHD at $67 it might be a while before I can get a meaningful premium for an OTM call again. 2021 and 2022 it was relatively flat/slowly declining and i made around 3-4% with no upside loss vs holding through that period until now. This year will probably only be the one premium. C'est la vie.
« Last Edit: October 27, 2023, 10:16:14 AM by mjchamb »

Rob_bob

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ctive feedback: you make no mention of fees in the book. I think this is because the funds you buy are more expensive than my stocks (all between $12 and $16) so the fee may be less than 1% of the trade. For my stocks, it's been around 7% and in bad weeks it hurts...

What fees are you paying and what premiums are you collecting?  I pay $0.66 per contract which would be a lot if you are only getting $8 in premium.  Have you figured what the annualized  yield is on the trade?

Maybe you could look for a few other stocks with better premiums and just trade the wheel with them.  The $0.66 I'm paying goes unnoticed to me.

I am at Vanguard so I pay $1 per contract. I used Merrill Lynch before where it was 0.65 but they p'd me off with how slowly they released the funds the few times I bought back the call and also when I wanted to get the money out quickly to pay for expenses.
Looks to me that if you are trading VTI which is around $200 and the options are, say, $4 I'd be paying $1 for a $400 deal. But my stocks are, say $14 and the options around 0.10 so I pay $1 for a $10 deal. Also, I am doing weekly not monthly so this brings down the option value.
I am still debating whether what I'm doing is the best. 15 months into this and still scratching the surface.

When you say you are trading weekly options do you mean you are only selling one week to expiration?  I sell "weekly" options but sometimes go out two weeks to expiration.

You gave an example of a $14 stock and a premium of $0.10.  Assuming that is for one week lets figure the annualized yield. $10 premium minus $1 fee =$9.  Four weeks per month, 4 X $9= $36 X 12 months = $432 divided by $1400 stock value = 30.8% yield, not bad.

tj

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I finished the book as well and it's a good read that explains the concept well but I think one thing missing too is a fee/taxes section.

It seems like a good strategy though, especially with the state of the market the last few weeks. Has anyone in this thread tried selling covered calls as a result of this book?

@mjchamb

Are you still selling covered calls? I have a merill account I want to try it in but its a post tax account and I'm not sure what would happen if I made any money.

Super Super thank you for reading! I don't want to continually gush over everyone that did, but it's super cool anyone cares adn you get to live in my brain for a bit.

I don't fully understand the tax implications, as I don't do my own and pay someone else to. Hence, I had to (sadly) leave that up to the reader to figure out :/

The last call I sold I think was an SCHD with a strike of $73, but with SCHD at $67 it might be a while before I can get a meaningful premium for an OTM call again. 2021 and 2022 it was relatively flat/slowly declining and i made around 3-4% with no upside loss vs holding through that period until now. This year will probably only be the one premium. C'est la vie.

Why did you stop selling the calls? The current premiums are not worth the hassle?

kindoflost

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ctive feedback: you make no mention of fees in the book. I think this is because the funds you buy are more expensive than my stocks (all between $12 and $16) so the fee may be less than 1% of the trade. For my stocks, it's been around 7% and in bad weeks it hurts...

What fees are you paying and what premiums are you collecting?  I pay $0.66 per contract which would be a lot if you are only getting $8 in premium.  Have you figured what the annualized  yield is on the trade?

Maybe you could look for a few other stocks with better premiums and just trade the wheel with them.  The $0.66 I'm paying goes unnoticed to me.

I am at Vanguard so I pay $1 per contract. I used Merrill Lynch before where it was 0.65 but they p'd me off with how slowly they released the funds the few times I bought back the call and also when I wanted to get the money out quickly to pay for expenses.
Looks to me that if you are trading VTI which is around $200 and the options are, say, $4 I'd be paying $1 for a $400 deal. But my stocks are, say $14 and the options around 0.10 so I pay $1 for a $10 deal. Also, I am doing weekly not monthly so this brings down the option value.
I am still debating whether what I'm doing is the best. 15 months into this and still scratching the surface.

When you say you are trading weekly options do you mean you are only selling one week to expiration?  I sell "weekly" options but sometimes go out two weeks to expiration.

You gave an example of a $14 stock and a premium of $0.10.  Assuming that is for one week lets figure the annualized yield. $10 premium minus $1 fee =$9.  Four weeks per month, 4 X $9= $36 X 12 months = $432 divided by $1400 stock value = 30.8% yield, not bad.

Yes, correct. I am yielding more which is why I keep thinking it will stop at some point and I am already trying to learn what I will do next.

kindoflost

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----------
10/17/2023 UPDATE: Books are GONE!!!! Thank you so much to anyone who requested one.

----------



Thanks to everyone who requested a book!

If you want to meet me in person, I am slated to do a talk for the local Columbus FIRE Facebook meetup group, ColumbusFI, Saturday February 17th. Location TBD, usually a library, and of course I'll have more free books. Hopefully it doesn't devolve into a shouting match.

As far as the website goes, my father very suddenly, very tragically passed away while I was giving these books away, and I have had lots of life changes around it. I am closer to FIRE now because of it, and will update the website at some point, but it really moved to the bottom of my list. I'm currently consumed by handling the estate. So we will see how that pans out as things calm down, and I find my center again.

My email is in the back of the book and on the website, I will be deleting the giveaway email soon. Drop me a line if you want. I'll check the forum randomly, but not frequently.

Big thanks to the mods for letting me post.

<3,
Resident wannabe wizard,
Matt C


I am very sorry for your loss. I lost my dad two months ago and they've been the hardest two months of my life. People say it heals some with time.

Rob_bob

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  • Posts: 454
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ctive feedback: you make no mention of fees in the book. I think this is because the funds you buy are more expensive than my stocks (all between $12 and $16) so the fee may be less than 1% of the trade. For my stocks, it's been around 7% and in bad weeks it hurts...

What fees are you paying and what premiums are you collecting?  I pay $0.66 per contract which would be a lot if you are only getting $8 in premium.  Have you figured what the annualized  yield is on the trade?

Maybe you could look for a few other stocks with better premiums and just trade the wheel with them.  The $0.66 I'm paying goes unnoticed to me.

I am at Vanguard so I pay $1 per contract. I used Merrill Lynch before where it was 0.65 but they p'd me off with how slowly they released the funds the few times I bought back the call and also when I wanted to get the money out quickly to pay for expenses.
Looks to me that if you are trading VTI which is around $200 and the options are, say, $4 I'd be paying $1 for a $400 deal. But my stocks are, say $14 and the options around 0.10 so I pay $1 for a $10 deal. Also, I am doing weekly not monthly so this brings down the option value.
I am still debating whether what I'm doing is the best. 15 months into this and still scratching the surface.

When you say you are trading weekly options do you mean you are only selling one week to expiration?  I sell "weekly" options but sometimes go out two weeks to expiration.

You gave an example of a $14 stock and a premium of $0.10.  Assuming that is for one week lets figure the annualized yield. $10 premium minus $1 fee =$9.  Four weeks per month, 4 X $9= $36 X 12 months = $432 divided by $1400 stock value = 30.8% yield, not bad.

Yes, correct. I am yielding more which is why I keep thinking it will stop at some point and I am already trying to learn what I will do next.

Have you ever tried selling cash secured puts?  When a stock gets called away from me I will sells OTM puts to buy it back.  However there are times when the premiums on a particular stock are no longer attractive, they may even change from weekly to monthly options.  I try to have a number of stocks that I can use for options, I think I have been doing it every month now for 2, maybe 3 years.

kindoflost

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  • always trying to learn
    • tradelines information for sellers
ctive feedback: you make no mention of fees in the book. I think this is because the funds you buy are more expensive than my stocks (all between $12 and $16) so the fee may be less than 1% of the trade. For my stocks, it's been around 7% and in bad weeks it hurts...

What fees are you paying and what premiums are you collecting?  I pay $0.66 per contract which would be a lot if you are only getting $8 in premium.  Have you figured what the annualized  yield is on the trade?

Maybe you could look for a few other stocks with better premiums and just trade the wheel with them.  The $0.66 I'm paying goes unnoticed to me.

I am at Vanguard so I pay $1 per contract. I used Merrill Lynch before where it was 0.65 but they p'd me off with how slowly they released the funds the few times I bought back the call and also when I wanted to get the money out quickly to pay for expenses.
Looks to me that if you are trading VTI which is around $200 and the options are, say, $4 I'd be paying $1 for a $400 deal. But my stocks are, say $14 and the options around 0.10 so I pay $1 for a $10 deal. Also, I am doing weekly not monthly so this brings down the option value.
I am still debating whether what I'm doing is the best. 15 months into this and still scratching the surface.

When you say you are trading weekly options do you mean you are only selling one week to expiration?  I sell "weekly" options but sometimes go out two weeks to expiration.

You gave an example of a $14 stock and a premium of $0.10.  Assuming that is for one week lets figure the annualized yield. $10 premium minus $1 fee =$9.  Four weeks per month, 4 X $9= $36 X 12 months = $432 divided by $1400 stock value = 30.8% yield, not bad.

Yes, correct. I am yielding more which is why I keep thinking it will stop at some point and I am already trying to learn what I will do next.

Have you ever tried selling cash secured puts?  When a stock gets called away from me I will sells OTM puts to buy it back.  However there are times when the premiums on a particular stock are no longer attractive, they may even change from weekly to monthly options.  I try to have a number of stocks that I can use for options, I think I have been doing it every month now for 2, maybe 3 years.

yes I do, I think I am doing what the wizard is doing, the wheel strategy. my only "contribution" is that I rotate across 3 stocks, when one goes up too quickly and I get assigned I buy one of the other two that I consider to be on the low side. on the other hand, when I have the stock and it goes down too quickly I get stuck and have to wait selling cheap options at a strike equal to my basis.
the other tweak is that two of my stocks pay dividends and I'd rather get dividends than premiums because I may get to pay lower taxes and there is less uncertainty.
I am definitely still learning and adjusting as I go

mjchamb

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  • Posts: 92
  • Location: Columbus, Ohio
    • Call to FIRE Investing



----------
10/17/2023 UPDATE: Books are GONE!!!! Thank you so much to anyone who requested one.

----------



Thanks to everyone who requested a book!

If you want to meet me in person, I am slated to do a talk for the local Columbus FIRE Facebook meetup group, ColumbusFI, Saturday February 17th. Location TBD, usually a library, and of course I'll have more free books. Hopefully it doesn't devolve into a shouting match.

As far as the website goes, my father very suddenly, very tragically passed away while I was giving these books away, and I have had lots of life changes around it. I am closer to FIRE now because of it, and will update the website at some point, but it really moved to the bottom of my list. I'm currently consumed by handling the estate. So we will see how that pans out as things calm down, and I find my center again.

My email is in the back of the book and on the website, I will be deleting the giveaway email soon. Drop me a line if you want. I'll check the forum randomly, but not frequently.

Big thanks to the mods for letting me post.

<3,
Resident wannabe wizard,
Matt C


I am very sorry for your loss. I lost my dad two months ago and they've been the hardest two months of my life. People say it heals some with time.

Thank you. We are probably in the same boat, my father passed sometime around Sept 1st. Sending you well wishes and empathy.

Alternatepriorities

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My condolences Matt. I just realized reading this again that I probably sent them to the email you're not checking anymore. I lost my father just over a year ago and I've been the executor of his estate. I don't know that I've learned anything in particular that might help, but if you have any questions you feel comfortable asking a stranger send me a DM and I'd be happy to try. 

ChpBstrd

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Necropost update.

This is how long my ridiculous backlog of books is! I JUST RECENTLY finished the book and you did a good job. It improved my terminology, strategy, and comprehension of gamma in particular. I passed it along to an options-curious friend just as it was passed on to me, and encouraged them to pass it along when done.

I noted the publisher left massive margins on the sides and top/bottom, suggesting the book could have had many fewer pages. Typical Mustachian observation.

I'm a little bit curious about the later sections on strategy, and the advice to never roll down. I get that rolling down is a great way to lock in losses or essentially sell a temporary dip. However, if you never roll down no matter what, it seems like you could lose the ability to earn options income on a stock that stays down.

E.g. XYZ is $100 and your short call is at the 105 strike. Then, XYZ reports an accounting scandal and drops to $75. Next weeks/months 105 calls are going to be hard to sell, but OTOH the additional volatility means you could sell the 90 calls and claw back much of your losses. If you don't perceive the price movement as temporary (e.g. the company has actually screwed up in a way that makes it worth a lot less, or the merger was actually called off, or the medicine failed in clinical trials) then why not accept reality and start digging out?

Of course, you were generally talking about indices, which don't tend to have sudden enduring declines in value like this. Indices seem to always come back, but that's not always the case with companies. So is the never-roll-down advice just for index funds? Would you roll down on an individual stock that had a non-temporary incident, such as the loss of a key contract?

Also, indices can go into multi-year bear markets. If that happens, do you keep selling calls at your original strike prices for pennies or just give up selling calls for a few years until prices recover?

There's an element of this - even with index funds - that seems like we're not accepting reality. And the reality is what the shares are worth at any given time. So anchoring our options strategy on a particular price seems a lot like... well... the anchoring fallacy. But I also understand how a rolling-down strategy if practiced consistently could turn a temporary blip into a sell-near-the-bottom mistake. Perhaps the difference is our judgement of how temporary or permanent the impairment is. If a company just missed earnings or the indices just went down because of a comment somebody important made, then no, we should not roll down. But when an unexpected rate hike changes the valuation of stocks on a DCF basis, that might be a situation where it's more permissible to roll down.