Author Topic: Microsoft?  (Read 1589 times)

Frznrth

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Microsoft?
« on: January 17, 2023, 11:55:24 AM »
Hi
I’m intrigued by all the buzz about AI and how Microsoft made a huge investment in Chat GPT.  Do you think buying  Microsoft would be a good way to “invest” in the future?
I know this isn’t a bunch of people that are much for picking stocks - to me that makes your opinions even more valuable.
Just looking for a stock, or a few, to have some fun with that isn’t likely to lose a ton but still has lots of - possible- potential.
Thanks for your time.

PDXTabs

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Re: Microsoft?
« Reply #1 on: January 17, 2023, 11:58:59 AM »
Microsoft is already ~5.5% for the SP-500. Personally I think that I already own enough of it.

Frznrth

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Re: Microsoft?
« Reply #2 on: January 17, 2023, 05:08:40 PM »
That is a big chunk.  How do you think the SP will do overall in a recession?

PDXTabs

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Re: Microsoft?
« Reply #3 on: January 17, 2023, 05:15:38 PM »
That is a big chunk.  How do you think the SP will do overall in a recession?

I have no idea. But it is already down ~17% nominal, more in real terms with inflation.

ATtiny85

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Re: Microsoft?
« Reply #4 on: January 17, 2023, 07:30:54 PM »
As part of some old legacy holdings I have 59 shares with an average cost basis of $30.40, acquired sometime around 2002. I think the first order was for 50, then reinvested dividends for several years. Now that is shut-off and dividends get swept into VTSAX.

I will keep buying as part of VTSAX, and expect MSFT to go up, to go down, and to go sideways over the coming years. I prefer to keep buying the haystack to be sure I have them and their possible replacement(s).

Paul der Krake

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Re: Microsoft?
« Reply #5 on: January 17, 2023, 08:12:13 PM »
I won't pretend to do a discounted cash flow analysis of Microsoft, instead offering a vibes analysis. In short, I'm quite impressed by Nadella's leadership.

In a decade the stock has grown nearly 10x. Office is still an incredible cash cow, and they successfully transitioned to subscription-based model.

XBOX is also a massive success.

They bought Github, LinkedIn, and juiced up their ARRs. Did you know that LinkedIn now brings in 15B of revenue per year? That's incredible.

Azure is leaving Google Cloud in the dust and now the uncontested runner up to AWS, and growing faster.

They shed their shitty image with developers. It's cool to work at Microsoft again. That wasn't the case in the early 2000s.

And now there are layoffs, announcing to the world that they're serious about operational efficiency. I doubt we'll see as many lifers working there now.


Frznrth

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Re: Microsoft?
« Reply #6 on: January 18, 2023, 10:48:25 AM »
Sounds impressive to me.  Hopefully they keep it up. 

ChpBstrd

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Re: Microsoft?
« Reply #7 on: January 19, 2023, 11:55:00 AM »
I'll play devil's advocate. Here are a few reasons not to back up the truck on MSFT:

Microsoft's PE ratio (~25) is in the high end of its range compared to the last 23 years.
https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/MSFT/microsoft/pe-ratio

If superstar CEO Nadella ever announces his exit... expect MSFT to tank.

Microsoft's acquisition-based strategy is risky, considering how the majority of mergers fail to create value. Yes, several past acquisitions have worked amazingly, but eventually the luck will run out. There's also the risk that MSFT has become more focused on absorbing acquisitions - each bought at a rich premium - and less focused on organic growth and innovation. Buying one's growth is the more expensive way to do things.

Microsoft's old Windows franchise is at risk as people continue to migrate their activities to mobile devices and cloud-based application platforms like Google's version of office or cloud-based CRM.

Microsoft's old XBox franchise could be at risk if people start using their phones or VR devices from Meta for gaming.

Microsoft Azure is a nice business, but what is its technical edge over Amazon or Google or newcomers? What makes it not a commodity?

Apple's integration of chips and software (i.e. integrating the M1 and OSX) is a stunt that, if it works, would leave Microsoft's devices far behind in terms of performance.

If Apple ever decided to compete in the corporate space, what investments would they have to make that they haven't already made? Some cloud apps, some IT department tools, some networking improvements, some app improvements, and a more rugged macbook model would seemingly put them on par with Microsoft's ecosystem. If hardware turnover could be slower - like every 4-5 years instead of every 2-3  - then Apple could be more economical. Like with touch-screen laptops, I don't know why Apple hasn't already done it. Apple would also have the opportunity to vertically integrate security services, VPN, cloud storage, cloud apps and CRM, etc. which would eliminate the corporate problem of having dozens of IT vendors who point fingers at each other when their products don't work together.

Several metrics are signalling recession, including the yield curve, 475+bp of Fed Funds Rate hikes that have never NOT preceded a recession, manufacturing data, consumer and business sentiment, the NFCI, full employment that can only go down, falling retail sales, a period of high inflation, falling residential investment, falling home prices, falling rents, falling business formation, falling international trade, falling profits for retailers and manufacturers, and even a sharply falling money supply (M2) the likes of which we've never seen. Do you really want to buy MSFT at the high range of its valuation right before a potential recession?

Yields of 7% are available in IG bonds, and 9% in high-yield. These yields could increase in the event of a financial panic this year. What will a risky bet in MSFT yield, by comparison?

vand

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Re: Microsoft?
« Reply #8 on: January 21, 2023, 04:16:11 AM »
Don't you just love these single stock threads? I mean, it's not like MSFT isn't one of the most followed, owned, and analyzed stocks out there.. what we really need is to talk about it some more.

Frznrth

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Re: Microsoft?
« Reply #9 on: January 22, 2023, 10:27:52 AM »
Thanks for all the thoughts.  What is really standing out to me is the risk to reward comment.  Maybe AI won’t make a huge impact on an already giant company. 

NWOutlier

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Re: Microsoft?
« Reply #10 on: January 22, 2023, 10:45:02 AM »
I just do VTI - total stock market, it has MSFT.. I get a dividend... but I get the balance of ups and downs of all the companies.  I would like to do individual stocks; but - I prefer my base (financial foundation) to be in place first.

Once I have a solid foundation, I may start looking into individual stocks, but not based on something trendy... maybe dividends.. not sure, I'm not there yet.  Until I hit my base, my fortress of solitude, I won't do individual stocks.  there is a cool "the gambler vid" on this; done by the movie and JLCollins....

Note: some swear words are said - they don't bother me, but some feel they could be offensive...

Movie:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJjKP8vYjpQ

JLCollins:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eikbQPldhPY

Frznrth

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Re: Microsoft?
« Reply #11 on: January 22, 2023, 11:31:47 AM »
Good advice.  F U are words to live by for sure. Great goal.