Author Topic: Media for the Passive Investor?  (Read 2471 times)

Crease

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Media for the Passive Investor?
« on: February 01, 2022, 05:22:25 PM »
Now that I predominantly work from home, I like to throw CNBC or Bloomberg on the TV for background noise. However, all of the programming seems geared towards encouraging the at-home retail investor to be constantly moving their money around. And to speculate in individual stocks. Everything based on what happened in the market or news today or, at the longest, this week. It's kind of crazy--are the stations in bed with the brokerage houses? I could not care less which ten stocks Jim Cramer thinks are hot right now or why some CEO thinks his particular company is well positioned for Q1 2022. Is there quality media for the passive investor--or should I just stick to reading the Economist, as MMM suggests?
« Last Edit: February 01, 2022, 05:29:07 PM by Crease »

Blender Bender

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Re: Media for the Passive Investor?
« Reply #1 on: February 01, 2022, 05:49:46 PM »
Now that I predominantly work from home, I like to throw CNBC or Bloomberg on the TV for background noise. However, all of the programming seems geared towards encouraging the at-home retail investor to be constantly moving their money around. And to speculate in individual stocks. Everything based on what happened in the market or news today or, at the longest, this week. It's kind of crazy--are the stations in bed with the brokerage houses? I could not care less which ten stocks Jim Cramer thinks are hot right now or why some CEO thinks his particular company is well positioned for Q1 2022. Is there quality media for the passive investor--or should I just stick to reading the Economist, as MMM suggests?

I don't think you can see on TV the boring passive investment news :) But not fully sure since i don't have TV.

For me, just reading. Something like https://www.morningstar.ca. They are pretty good with a balanced views.

But in general i get my investing info from Apple News, the Stock Markets section.

Also, there is plenty info on retirement/investing forums as this one. I see here many well informed guys, they should have better ideas. 

The good thing about passive investment is that you don't have to obsess about it even day/week. By definition, passive. Go skiing or biking instead.

PDXTabs

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Re: Media for the Passive Investor?
« Reply #2 on: February 01, 2022, 05:58:28 PM »
I read the Economist and the WSJ. If you like podcasts you could check out https://rationalreminder.ca/. It has a Canadian tilt but that doesn't bother me.

reeshau

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Re: Media for the Passive Investor?
« Reply #3 on: February 01, 2022, 10:17:26 PM »
Point 1, is that as a passive investor, you shouldn't need a lot of market news.

Second the vote for Morningstar.  If you really want to go old school, you can also try Value Line.  They are both oriented to individual stocks, but have broad enough coverage that they have market views.  And 5 year time horizons.

They may not be right, but they will also not shirk at the truth, or panic at a sudden event.  And that's just about the kernal of a long-term perspective.

vand

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Re: Media for the Passive Investor?
« Reply #4 on: February 02, 2022, 02:18:15 AM »
OP makes an excellent point.

Most financial news media is geared for content and turnover, which is the antithesis and enemy of the rational investment, full stop - whether you consider yourself a passive or active. Investing is a long term orientated venture by its definition.

The best way to switch off from financial media coverage is to literally switch it off.

There's not really much else you can do except to intentionally avoid exposing yourself to it.. seriously, its in your power to completely tune it out if you are purposeful enough, and once you do you will find that you think less about it too - out of sight, out of mind as they saying goes.

Instead of a background of Jim Cramer, try putting on some Mozart or Tchaikovsky.
« Last Edit: February 02, 2022, 04:21:26 AM by vand »

matchewed

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Re: Media for the Passive Investor?
« Reply #5 on: February 02, 2022, 05:06:11 AM »
Television media just can't be any other way. You can listen to podcasts or YouTube videos that deep dive into subjects which may start a road into broadening your vies and knowledge.

Morning Glory

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Re: Media for the Passive Investor?
« Reply #6 on: February 02, 2022, 07:12:50 AM »
You could listen to Paula Pant or choose fi podcasts, if you like the talking noise. Otherwise just listen to music.

simonsez

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Re: Media for the Passive Investor?
« Reply #7 on: February 02, 2022, 07:53:23 AM »
MMM forums

If you're a passive investor, why seek out video media that are largely counter to your interests?  Anything curated, a channel with an agenda, algorithms suggesting what you watch, etc. are just going to lead to actions that line the pocket of someone other than you.   I feel on the MMM forums (and in a few other places) you can be reassured of your passive plans while also learning about other non-passive financial maneuvers if you wish at a safe distance without feeling like you have to join in the fray.  For instance, I like reading about options trading, crypto, tax loss harvesting, how people in other countries invest, etc. - while not feeling pressured and it can be educational and if the day comes that I do dip my toe, then I'm not starting at the ground floor and have some background.  One example of that is the HSA - I didn't have one on day 1 in my career job, learned about them here after a couple years, and then changed my health care plan and enrolled in one and now that's a part of my portfolio. 

If I were to watch video media on a cable channel about a topic I'm not actively involved with, I feel like there is a good chance it would be aggressively persuasive instead of being a well-rounded topic.

SwordGuy

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Re: Media for the Passive Investor?
« Reply #8 on: February 02, 2022, 07:56:20 AM »
Why anyone would want Jim Cramer's stock market advice is beyond me.   

ChpBstrd

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Re: Media for the Passive Investor?
« Reply #9 on: February 02, 2022, 09:55:15 AM »
There's a larger lesson buried in this example.

Different media formats effectively filter out certain types of messages. For example, it is very hard to transmit a lesson about statistical inference through the medium of music, but it is very easy to make a song about romantic love. Therefore, there is very little information about statistics on Pandora. Information about how to do taxes is typically expressed in text rather than as classical oil paintings, so there are very few oil paintings about tax loss carryovers. I'm sure you can think of many more examples where it would be absolutely awkward to convey a particular message in a given medium. This is basic communications theory.

The point here is that it would be nearly impossible for a CNBC broadcast to sell advertising if the talking heads just said boring things like "Looks like VTI is up 0.19% so far today. I'm looking forward to my quarterly rebalancing. You Ted?" "Oh yea, come March I might sell a couple shares of VTI and buy a couple shares of BIV or TIP. You know, fractional shares help me rebalance even more precisely." Such a show would be immediately cancelled, even if it was talking about a superior investment approach. The ratings would tank. An excitement-filled, get-rich-quick program with a breathless and animated host would take its place.

Similarly, if you talked like that on social media - which has algos to optimize ad revenue - your message would quickly be buried because it's not exciting enough to hold the attention of dopamine addicts used to speeded-up videos of people doing stupid things. Therefore, the only information that can persist in these media formats is the kind that engages people to watch ads. CNBC, Bloomberg, and social media are background noise and are constantly fighting to obtain people's attention - to pull them away from a reality that is inherently more rewarding and stimulating so that they'll stare at a screen for at least a few more hours.

Because some formats cannot convey certain types of information, you have to pick the format that could possibly convey accurate info before you get the information. The inevitable conclusion is that most electronic media / social media is not worth consuming, and at worst it is dangerous to consume (see Joe Rogan's dead fans who used him for medical advice).

DaTrill

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Re: Media for the Passive Investor?
« Reply #10 on: February 02, 2022, 05:26:44 PM »
Now that I predominantly work from home, I like to throw CNBC or Bloomberg on the TV for background noise. However, all of the programming seems geared towards encouraging the at-home retail investor to be constantly moving their money around. And to speculate in individual stocks. Everything based on what happened in the market or news today or, at the longest, this week. It's kind of crazy--are the stations in bed with the brokerage houses? I could not care less which ten stocks Jim Cramer thinks are hot right now or why some CEO thinks his particular company is well positioned for Q1 2022. Is there quality media for the passive investor--or should I just stick to reading the Economist, as MMM suggests?

You watch QVC for stocks and shocked they spend all the time pumping investments of companies who buy ad time???  Really?  Once the crypto ads dry up, you will see what investment professionals really think of it.  As long as crypto, ARK, others advertise on CNBC and Bloomberg, these "Investment channels" will pump their garbage.  It's OK to watch these channels for trends and CEO interviews, but it's nothing more than QVC for stocks where airtime is provided to companies who spend the most of ads.   

Travis

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Re: Media for the Passive Investor?
« Reply #11 on: February 03, 2022, 01:00:48 PM »
Find something to watch that will make you laugh.  For me that actually includes CNBC sometimes for the exact same reasons that frustrate you. To answer your question, yes the cable channel owners have been in bed with whoever pays their bills for a long time, and that includes the banks. In the Dot Com era, "financial analysts" who were actually PR people for the investment banks underwriting IPOs would come on and talk about how hot that company's stock was about to become.  There was absolutely no distinction between financial sales and financial news. Not much has really changed. You'll get the same pundits in interviews every other week giving doom and gloom about the next recession, even in the middle of the current recession as if the real world had no influence on what they were saying so that you'll buy their book or join their hedge fund or just keep their names in the spotlight for another month.

windytrail

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Re: Media for the Passive Investor?
« Reply #12 on: February 03, 2022, 01:14:24 PM »
TV is for mindless people who want to be told things. Read books or listen to audiobooks/podcasts. Every time I accidentally gaze over to cable news (i.e. at the airport or office lobby) my IQ drops several points.

MustacheAndaHalf

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Re: Media for the Passive Investor?
« Reply #13 on: February 06, 2022, 04:26:30 AM »
Now that I predominantly work from home, I like to throw CNBC or Bloomberg on the TV for background noise. However, all of the programming seems geared towards encouraging the at-home retail investor to be constantly moving their money around. And to speculate in individual stocks.
Those are stations for active investing.  Back in March 2020 I was watching CNBC and Bloomberg for hours a day - to figure out what the market knew.  It was useful to know the market was distracted by the oil price war started by Saudi Arabia, and didn't realize Covid-19 was far more significant until it was too late.

Who would pay for a program about passive investing?  Not Vanguard, which hasn't spent on advertising in years past.  I think you're stuck with reading material, rather than viewing TV stations.  Although I've flipped to active investing, I invested passively for a couple decades, so I have some book recommendations.

"A Random Walk Down Wall Street", a classic that is still getting new editions.
"The Only Guide to a Winning Investment Strategy You'll Ever Need" by Larry Swedroe, who suggests a small/value tilt when indexing.
"The Little Book of Common Sense Investing", by John Bogle, who turned passive investing into a movement.

For investing, I would avoid "Rich Dad" books - the guy timed Hawaiian real estate right - doesn't make him an investor in stocks.  Similarly, Dave Ramsey and Suze Orman don't understand investments.  They can help with personal finance and getting people to stop making spending mistakes, but they don't have experience with investing.

The simplest advice for spotting the right book: look for historical tables showing stock market returns.  All 3 of the books I recommend have them, and none of the ones I warn against do.  Solid books on passive investing show decades of stock market history where their ideas proved valid.

baconschteam

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Re: Media for the Passive Investor?
« Reply #14 on: February 06, 2022, 07:47:06 AM »
Not sure if your mind is free enough in your job that you could follow a podcast or audiobook, but I'll make a suggestion based on the possibility that it is.

The success of our long-term investing approach depends precisely on NOT paying attention to, or making decisions based upon, "news" - financial or otherwise.

If you would like to consume media that could possibly enrich your knowledge or give you some eventual financial edge, I would suggest downloading and listening to some audiobooks from your local library. If they don't have one that you're looking for, contact the Reference Desk and they will likely be able to get it for you.

A few good ones that I've listened to recently:
- Naked Economics
- Random Walk Down Wall Street
- Debt: The First 5000 Years - (this recently opened my eyes to the fact that there is technically not a difference between money and debt, among many other epiphanies)

Try to get a few different perspectives on things

OurTown

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Re: Media for the Passive Investor?
« Reply #15 on: February 07, 2022, 06:13:33 PM »
Podcast: The Money Guy Show.  Itís actually two guys.

ChpBstrd

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Re: Media for the Passive Investor?
« Reply #16 on: February 07, 2022, 07:57:04 PM »
IDK, I'm kinda souring on podcasts as a source of legitimate information. Joe Rogan just got away with killing a lot of people. Would a financial podcaster be subject to the same attention economy factors that lead to misinformation in other social media formats?

waltworks

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Re: Media for the Passive Investor?
« Reply #17 on: February 07, 2022, 08:29:34 PM »
If you're on this forum, you already know what you need to about investing. Sure, you can tweak AA or make sure you've got your bonds in your tax advantaged accounts or whatever, but that's window dressing. Reading or watching more stuff about investing or finance is a waste of your time.

Find some other media to consume if you must be passively entertained.

-W

Malossi792

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Re: Media for the Passive Investor?
« Reply #18 on: February 08, 2022, 12:23:28 AM »
+1 for music you love.
I'd throw in the idea to buy a headphone which actually sounds good  (but not necessarily with premium looks or a high price tag). Makes all the difference.
You'll get bored with hearing ,,spend less, invest more, diversify, stay the course" pretty quick, believe me.