Author Topic: Long-Term Returns  (Read 16269 times)

irastache

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Long-Term Returns
« on: May 17, 2013, 09:19:21 AM »
[MOD EDIT: Everest Wealth Management has threatened the MMM blog with legal action due to this thread.  See discussion here. /END EDIT]

I want to share a link for an excellent financial blog: Long-Term Returns http://www.longtermreturns.com/

You might start at the first post and read, just like MMM or, two introductory posts that say it all

http://www.longtermreturns.com/p/how-to-invest.html
http://www.longtermreturns.com/2012/03/selecting-investment-strategy.html

Why is this one of the best investing blogs?
Short: The author admits blogging requires posts but the answers all already posted in the above links.
Honest: "It is extremely difficult to beat the market returns in the long term." "It is trivially easy to obtain market-level returns through disciplined passive index investing. This site will help you estimate what those market returns (and associated risks) are likely to be so you can make educated decision on how to invest"

There are some excellent fund reviews and advice in the archives. If you read through the blog, just like MMM, I think you will answer many questions.
« Last Edit: June 29, 2016, 11:21:20 PM by arebelspy »

bkru21

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #1 on: May 17, 2013, 09:44:24 AM »
I've just started reading it as well. It's a great blog, has some really good advice.

arebelspy

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #2 on: May 17, 2013, 09:47:06 AM »
Thanks for the recommendation, I'll check it out.
We are two former teachers who accumulated a bunch of real estate, retired at 29, spent some time traveling the world full time and are now settled with two kids.
If you want to know more about us, or how we did that, or see lots of pictures, this Business Insider profile tells our story pretty well.
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Joet

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #3 on: May 17, 2013, 10:49:57 AM »
also not sure if it's in that article but it IS becoming a little more difficult to 'make market level returns' for a growing reason:

1] Fewer companies are going public, more companies are going private

as an example of this, vanguards 'total stock market index' US for around 2,000 had approx 9,000 companies. Today? 4,000 and change.

Has the US economy fundamentally changed somewhat? Yes, more towards private equity. Is there anything you can do about it? No, not really.

matchewed

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #4 on: May 17, 2013, 10:53:01 AM »
also not sure if it's in that article but it IS becoming a little more difficult to 'make market level returns' for a growing reason:

1] Fewer companies are going public, more companies are going private

as an example of this, vanguards 'total stock market index' US for around 2,000 had approx 9,000 companies. Today? 4,000 and change.

Has the US economy fundamentally changed somewhat? Yes, more towards private equity. Is there anything you can do about it? No, not really.


I'm a bit confused as to that statement Joet. Isn't the market the market regardless of the number of businesses? So if I'm looking to match market returns and I invest in a broad index which mirrors the entire market what does the number of businesses have to do with the return? Isn't my goal of making market level returns guaranteed by investing in the entire market?

bkru21

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #5 on: May 17, 2013, 11:06:34 AM »
Matchewed, I think has to do with the theory there is greater strength in numbers. If there are fewer companies on the market, you have a greater risk of lower returns as there are fewer stronger companies to balance it out. I could be oversimplfying this idea though.

arebelspy

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #6 on: May 17, 2013, 11:25:33 AM »
also not sure if it's in that article but it IS becoming a little more difficult to 'make market level returns' for a growing reason:

1] Fewer companies are going public, more companies are going private

as an example of this, vanguards 'total stock market index' US for around 2,000 had approx 9,000 companies. Today? 4,000 and change.

Has the US economy fundamentally changed somewhat? Yes, more towards private equity. Is there anything you can do about it? No, not really.


I'm a bit confused as to that statement Joet. Isn't the market the market regardless of the number of businesses? So if I'm looking to match market returns and I invest in a broad index which mirrors the entire market what does the number of businesses have to do with the return? Isn't my goal of making market level returns guaranteed by investing in the entire market?

Yes.  Those other companies are outside the market.  So you will still make market returns, you just may not make the average  return of all companies (public and private), if you think private companies are more successful.  Either way you will still make market returns minus fees/expenses with index funds.
We are two former teachers who accumulated a bunch of real estate, retired at 29, spent some time traveling the world full time and are now settled with two kids.
If you want to know more about us, or how we did that, or see lots of pictures, this Business Insider profile tells our story pretty well.
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Joet

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #7 on: May 17, 2013, 11:39:05 AM »
Right, if anything 'ultrasmall' has more or less disappeared. If I understand [an oversimplification] of what my VC friends tell me the trend is these 50-250m companies that would have IPO'd 10+ years ago presently receive private equity funding/angel investors/etc and are often simply directly required by a megaco.

So perhaps it's not a big a deal as I make it, and perhaps the risk picture has actually improved for investors. AKA fewer webvan's and pets.com's vs more seasoned companies that do finally IPO. But the 'small/value' growth premium may be disappearing a bit in the market as well. But if you do invest in the broad indexes you get exposure to these megacos, and the investment banks [goldman, JP, etc] that are mostly responsible for bringing these guys to market. And if its a private VC firm well when that company finally gets aquired its part of a megaco thats already in the indexes anyways.

again, this is more or less just noise/ramblings and there isnt much you can do about it.

Wish I could find the stat on it, Vanguards total stock market index had ~8-9K and change companies in ~2000 vs 4k ish today

But if we want to get right down to it, the S&P 500 represents something like 75-80% of the total market cap of the US publicly traded companies. So we're splitting hairs.

matchewed

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #8 on: May 17, 2013, 11:48:24 AM »
Thanks for the clarification.

secondcor521

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #9 on: May 17, 2013, 12:55:41 PM »
@Joet,

Nowadays, VTSMX samples the broader total market.  The 3,278 companies they own now are selected to match the broader market in key indicators such as market capitalization, industry affiliation, and so on.  I believe the reason they do this is that for a large fund, owning the smaller companies can result in excess trading costs and affect the market prices of those smaller stocks.  Owning a large representative sample still gets you the market returns without these other negatives.

I don't know how many stocks it owned back in 2000, but it is possible that back then they were trying to buy all of the stocks in the index back then.

arebelspy

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #10 on: May 18, 2013, 11:41:30 PM »
Thanks for the recommendation, I'll check it out.

Follow up: I spent several hours reading this blog today, and have a bunch more tabs open to read later.

LOVE it.  Thanks so much for sharing.

This will be the place I direct people if they make it through JLCollins' advice, and want to learn more on index investing (and Joshua Kennon's blog if they want to learn more about valuing individual companies).

This is high on my list of investing blogs though - detailed, in-depth, yet simple, conversational tone that is accessible to anyone.
We are two former teachers who accumulated a bunch of real estate, retired at 29, spent some time traveling the world full time and are now settled with two kids.
If you want to know more about us, or how we did that, or see lots of pictures, this Business Insider profile tells our story pretty well.
We (rarely) blog at AdventuringAlong.com. Check out our Now page to see what we're up to currently.

irastache

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #11 on: May 20, 2013, 01:26:56 PM »
Thanks for the recommendation, I'll check it out.

Follow up: I spent several hours reading this blog today, and have a bunch more tabs open to read later.

LOVE it.  Thanks so much for sharing.

This will be the place I direct people if they make it through JLCollins' advice, and want to learn more on index investing (and Joshua Kennon's blog if they want to learn more about valuing individual companies).

This is high on my list of investing blogs though - detailed, in-depth, yet simple, conversational tone that is accessible to anyone.

Very glad this is helpful. I agree -- the advice is so good you could pay money for it and sadly the advice people do pay money for is usually much worse. Likewise the advise from most paid writers in the financial press.

There is not a day in the financial press that I don't see bad ideas that could be disproved using things I learned on the LTR blog.

Active trading strategies -- no!
Market timing schemes -- keep them!
Tactical asset allocation -- oh no!
the list could go on...


savingtofreedom

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #12 on: May 21, 2013, 09:47:15 PM »
This is a great website - thanks for sharing.

julieanderson

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #13 on: May 29, 2013, 03:34:14 PM »
Thanks for sharing!

bkru21

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #14 on: June 25, 2013, 12:45:17 PM »
Does anyone know what happened to this blog? Seems to have just disappeared.

arebelspy

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #15 on: June 25, 2013, 12:52:00 PM »
Does anyone know what happened to this blog? Seems to have just disappeared.

How odd, I am getting a 404 as well.

It was just updated a day or two ago, so hopefully this is a temporary glitch.  I'd be surprised if it wasn't back up and running in a few days.
We are two former teachers who accumulated a bunch of real estate, retired at 29, spent some time traveling the world full time and are now settled with two kids.
If you want to know more about us, or how we did that, or see lots of pictures, this Business Insider profile tells our story pretty well.
We (rarely) blog at AdventuringAlong.com. Check out our Now page to see what we're up to currently.

yolfer

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #16 on: June 25, 2013, 03:34:33 PM »
I'm less optimistic. The LTR twitter account is dead too:

https://twitter.com/LongTermReturns

And those don't just disappear by accident like a 404 on a webpage. Someone had to close the twitter account on purpose.

Whois isn't showing any contact info, and the only contact email listed on (a cached copy) of the site is Mike@LongTermReturns.com which might not work if the doman is down. I tried sending him an email anyway.

Fingers crossed. This is/was one of my favorite blogs.

arebelspy

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #17 on: June 25, 2013, 03:37:13 PM »
Ugh.  That bums me out.

His last update just a few days ago didn't give any indication of anything like that.

A decent amount of it is archived here:
web.archive.org/web/*/Longtermreturns.com
We are two former teachers who accumulated a bunch of real estate, retired at 29, spent some time traveling the world full time and are now settled with two kids.
If you want to know more about us, or how we did that, or see lots of pictures, this Business Insider profile tells our story pretty well.
We (rarely) blog at AdventuringAlong.com. Check out our Now page to see what we're up to currently.

Allknowing305

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #18 on: June 26, 2013, 02:25:16 PM »
The board and twitter went down when "Mike" (or whoever runs that blog) were notified of a federal law suit alleging slander, libelous statements, and false allegations.  Word has it his identity will be known soon...
« Last Edit: June 26, 2013, 02:41:30 PM by Allknowing305 »

yolfer

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #19 on: June 26, 2013, 03:04:05 PM »
The board and twitter went down when "Mike" (or whoever runs that blog) were notified of a federal law suit alleging slander, libelous statements, and false allegations.  Word has it his identity will be known soon...

Wha?!  Where'd you hear about this? I can't find anything about it online.

arebelspy

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #20 on: June 26, 2013, 03:07:00 PM »
The board and twitter went down when "Mike" (or whoever runs that blog) were notified of a federal law suit alleging slander, libelous statements, and false allegations.  Word has it his identity will be known soon...

That is incredibly unfortunate, if true.

The guy was writing brilliant stuff.

Would appreciate you keeping us updated, if you find out more.
We are two former teachers who accumulated a bunch of real estate, retired at 29, spent some time traveling the world full time and are now settled with two kids.
If you want to know more about us, or how we did that, or see lots of pictures, this Business Insider profile tells our story pretty well.
We (rarely) blog at AdventuringAlong.com. Check out our Now page to see what we're up to currently.

Eric

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #21 on: June 26, 2013, 04:45:38 PM »
The board and twitter went down when "Mike" (or whoever runs that blog) were notified of a federal law suit alleging slander, libelous statements, and false allegations.  Word has it his identity will be known soon...

Wha?!  Where'd you hear about this? I can't find anything about it online.

He edited that statement.  Previously, it sounded like it was his company filing the suit.  I'm assuming he knows from first hand knowledge.

Allknowing305

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #22 on: June 26, 2013, 07:18:37 PM »
All that matters is that in todays age dont think that because you sit behind a pc you are invincible or immune from the laws of this country.  I will post here once his identity is known, and beleive me, this guy is in the business and probably works for Vanguard or one of the big wall street firms.  Word to the wise, dont make libelous statements on the internet. 

arebelspy

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #23 on: June 26, 2013, 07:29:31 PM »
I must have missed those statements, everything I saw was pretty factual.  Then again, I only had been reading for a month or two.

Was he asked to remove said comments and refused, or was a lawsuit the first go-to option?
We are two former teachers who accumulated a bunch of real estate, retired at 29, spent some time traveling the world full time and are now settled with two kids.
If you want to know more about us, or how we did that, or see lots of pictures, this Business Insider profile tells our story pretty well.
We (rarely) blog at AdventuringAlong.com. Check out our Now page to see what we're up to currently.

Joet

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #24 on: June 26, 2013, 08:52:58 PM »
It's almost prima facie to demonstrate that whole life policies aren't going to appreciate as well as indexing. Various risk assumptions aside the whole cost/fee structure makes that sort of thing trivial. Libelous? um what? As far as I know, there werent even any parties with standing as he didnt even mention anyone by name or business (did he?, ok, I didnt read anything on the site, but honestly, water is wet, puppies are cute, paula dean is racist, and whole life policies dont make much sense and insurance salesman arent your buddy)

arebelspy

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #25 on: June 26, 2013, 09:00:33 PM »
It's almost prima facie to demonstrate that whole life policies aren't going to appreciate as well as indexing. Various risk assumptions aside the whole cost/fee structure makes that sort of thing trivial. Libelous? um what? As far as I know, there werent even any parties with standing as he didnt even mention anyone by name or business (did he?, ok, I didnt read anything on the site, but honestly, water is wet, puppies are cute, paula dean is racist, and whole life policies dont make much sense and insurance salesman arent your buddy)

What makes you think it's about whole life insurance?
We are two former teachers who accumulated a bunch of real estate, retired at 29, spent some time traveling the world full time and are now settled with two kids.
If you want to know more about us, or how we did that, or see lots of pictures, this Business Insider profile tells our story pretty well.
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grantmeaname

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #26 on: June 26, 2013, 09:07:39 PM »
All that matters is that in todays age dont think that because you sit behind a pc you are invincible or immune from the laws of this country.  I will post here once his identity is known, and beleive me, this guy is in the business and probably works for Vanguard or one of the big wall street firms.  Word to the wise, dont make libelous statements on the internet.
You're talking out your ass, and it shows. Point me to a single statement that meets any test anywhere in the nation for libel, and I'll give you my car.

arebelspy

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #27 on: June 26, 2013, 09:12:21 PM »
All that matters is that in todays age dont think that because you sit behind a pc you are invincible or immune from the laws of this country.  I will post here once his identity is known, and beleive me, this guy is in the business and probably works for Vanguard or one of the big wall street firms.  Word to the wise, dont make libelous statements on the internet.
You're talking out your ass, and it shows. Point me to a single statement that meets any test anywhere in the nation for libel, and I'll give you my car.

You have a car?
We are two former teachers who accumulated a bunch of real estate, retired at 29, spent some time traveling the world full time and are now settled with two kids.
If you want to know more about us, or how we did that, or see lots of pictures, this Business Insider profile tells our story pretty well.
We (rarely) blog at AdventuringAlong.com. Check out our Now page to see what we're up to currently.

grantmeaname

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #28 on: June 26, 2013, 09:15:57 PM »
Here it is. If you can prove I don't have it I'll give you my car.

Allknowing305

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #29 on: June 26, 2013, 09:17:44 PM »
I dont want your car, dont need it, and obviously none of you realize what your talking about.  The blog is down, there is a federal law suit thats been filed for libelous statements, and a judge signed off to reveal the identity of the blogger. 

If I were wrong, then why is the blog and twitter down?  Why the same day he was served did the it all go dark? 

grantmeaname

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #30 on: June 26, 2013, 09:26:30 PM »
I didn't say that no citizen of the United States alleged that LTR's author had said something libelous - it's a shamefully common tactic to shut down criticism. I said that he didn't do anything libelous, in response to your insinuation that he was breaking the laws of this country. And you still haven't provided any evidence that there even is a suit - show me the filings on PACER or even just name the jurisdiction involved!

Protip: the level of discourse on this site is a little higher than "obviously none of you realize what your [sic] talking about".

DoubleDown

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #31 on: June 27, 2013, 09:19:23 AM »
I dont want your car, dont need it, and obviously none of you realize what your talking about.  The blog is down, there is a federal law suit thats been filed for libelous statements, and a judge signed off to reveal the identity of the blogger. 

If I were wrong, then why is the blog and twitter down?  Why the same day he was served did the it all go dark?

That is all proof of exactly nothing. I don't know whether this blogger committed libel or not (very high bar to prove that, so good luck), but the fact that a corporation filed a lawsuit means nothing. It would not be the first time a company filed a lawsuit claiming defamation in an attempt to stifle legitimate speech. Lawsuits are filed all the time, many of them frivolously. And sadly, a prudent person would likely choose to take down their website to reduce their exposure, all thanks to a lawsuit hanging over them.

And of course a judge would allow the company to determine the blogger's identity in order to bring the suit forward. Would someone suing Mr. Money Mustache be required to bring forward some non-existent cartoon sketch to trial? The judge's actions mean nothing regarding actual proof of defamation or libel.

I can say this -- if I was that blogger, and a company filed a defamation lawsuit that was eventually dismissed or the plaintiff lost, I would be emboldened 100x to bring attention to that company's practices and thin skin. Now, if the blogger actually lied and hurt the company, then the company did what they had to do. I guess we'll see.

matchewed

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #32 on: June 27, 2013, 09:28:24 AM »
I'm going solely off of recollection but one of his articles did mention he works for a large financial firm and had expressed that he was not entirely certain of the future of the blog if his identity was known to his employer. I know that what I'm saying is about as solid as smoke so take it with a grain of salt.

arebelspy

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #33 on: June 27, 2013, 09:48:55 AM »
I'm going solely off of recollection but one of his articles did mention he works for a large financial firm and had expressed that he was not entirely certain of the future of the blog if his identity was known to his employer.

I remember this post as well, and he mentioned he thought his name might get out eventually. 

His employer probably makes lots of money on active management, the exact opposite of his blog.
We are two former teachers who accumulated a bunch of real estate, retired at 29, spent some time traveling the world full time and are now settled with two kids.
If you want to know more about us, or how we did that, or see lots of pictures, this Business Insider profile tells our story pretty well.
We (rarely) blog at AdventuringAlong.com. Check out our Now page to see what we're up to currently.

bkru21

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #34 on: June 27, 2013, 09:56:59 AM »
I'm going solely off of recollection but one of his articles did mention he works for a large financial firm and had expressed that he was not entirely certain of the future of the blog if his identity was known to his employer. I know that what I'm saying is about as solid as smoke so take it with a grain of salt.

He choose to remain anonymous because he wanted to work for a large firm in the future, and didn't want the blog jeopardizing that. I don't remember him revealing that he did work for a large firm.

matchewed

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #35 on: June 27, 2013, 09:58:29 AM »
I'm going solely off of recollection but one of his articles did mention he works for a large financial firm and had expressed that he was not entirely certain of the future of the blog if his identity was known to his employer. I know that what I'm saying is about as solid as smoke so take it with a grain of salt.

He choose to remain anonymous because he wanted to work for a large firm in the future, and didn't want the blog jeopardizing that. I don't remember him revealing that he did work for a large firm.

Well I knew there was a reason I put some caveats in there.

forward

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #36 on: June 27, 2013, 11:45:04 AM »

Do we know that he is not a she?

arebelspy

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #37 on: June 27, 2013, 11:49:30 AM »

Do we know that he is not a she?

On the internet, no one knows you're a dog.

(In other words, "Mike" could be a woman, yes, but unlikely.)
We are two former teachers who accumulated a bunch of real estate, retired at 29, spent some time traveling the world full time and are now settled with two kids.
If you want to know more about us, or how we did that, or see lots of pictures, this Business Insider profile tells our story pretty well.
We (rarely) blog at AdventuringAlong.com. Check out our Now page to see what we're up to currently.

NYD3030

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #38 on: June 27, 2013, 01:27:09 PM »
This is a bummer, LTR had quickly become one of my favorite blogs.  I hope this resolves itself in a manner that does not deprive us of his wisdom, but if what you see above is true I am not optimistic.

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #39 on: July 12, 2013, 03:08:14 PM »
If you make comments about a company that you actually have zero knowledge of since it is a single location company on the other side of the country, then this kind of thing happens.

IF he did actually work in the industry and didn't disclose his outside activity to FINRA then he has a whole other can on worms to deal with.  Didn't any of you find it odd he pushed Vanguard a LOT?

It was not whole life...that is all

grantmeaname

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #40 on: July 13, 2013, 05:59:00 AM »
If you make comments about a company that you actually have zero knowledge of since it is a single location company on the other side of the country, then this kind of thing happens.
Which company would that be? How do you know which side of the country LTR lives on?

Quote
IF he did actually work in the industry and didn't disclose his outside activity to FINRA then he has a whole other can on worms to deal with.
I don't believe so. The only standard disclosure that I do is the one for reportable securities transactions (meant to prevent front-running clients' money), and it looks like the blog guidelines deal only with firm-run blogs, not with things employees can or cannot do in their spare time.

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Didn't any of you find it odd he pushed Vanguard a LOT?
No. Many low-cost investors "push" Vanguard because it's the undisputed low-cost leader. See bogleheads, MMM, jlcollinsnh...

JoeK

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #41 on: July 16, 2013, 05:51:47 AM »
A decent amount of it is archived here:
web.archive.org/web/*/Longtermreturns.com

Looks like he had it pulled from the archive.  It's no longer there.  :(

arebelspy

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #42 on: July 16, 2013, 10:57:55 AM »
It'd be wonderful if someone with access to it all posted it anonymously in one big dump.  Some day, perhaps.
We are two former teachers who accumulated a bunch of real estate, retired at 29, spent some time traveling the world full time and are now settled with two kids.
If you want to know more about us, or how we did that, or see lots of pictures, this Business Insider profile tells our story pretty well.
We (rarely) blog at AdventuringAlong.com. Check out our Now page to see what we're up to currently.

yolfer

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #43 on: July 16, 2013, 12:04:17 PM »
Dang, it's purged from google's cache too:

https://www.google.com/search?q=site:longtermreturns.com

kyleaaa

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #44 on: July 23, 2013, 08:37:00 PM »
Yep, it was a lawsuit:

http://www.virginiadefamationlawyer.com/1.%20Everest%20Wealth%20Management.pdf

The plaintiffs seem to have an unconvincing argument on the face of it to me.
« Last Edit: July 23, 2013, 08:40:25 PM by kyleaaa »

fiveoclockshadow

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #45 on: July 24, 2013, 07:10:53 AM »
Heh - so it is now expunged from the internet except the plaintiffs have now made the very sensible claims about themselves part of the public record.

In general when you see companies like Everest doing this it is just a sure sign that the claims they are trying to suppress are true and that they are rotten to the core.

Another good example covered in this book:

http://www.amazon.com/Fooling-People-Complete-Updated-Epilogue/dp/0470481544
« Last Edit: July 24, 2013, 08:01:14 AM by fiveoclockshadow »

MissStache

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #46 on: July 24, 2013, 07:50:32 AM »
Heh - so it is now expunged from the internet except the plaintiffs have now made the very sensible claims about themselves part of the public record.


Yep!  Never read the website, but now I know what kind of company Everest is thanks to the complaint!

mpbaker22

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #47 on: July 24, 2013, 08:28:41 AM »
Heh - so it is now expunged from the internet except the plaintiffs have now made the very sensible claims about themselves part of the public record.


Yep!  Never read the website, but now I know what kind of company Everest is thanks to the complaint!

All I have to say is - good luck to Everest when it comes to proving they can guarantee a 7% return.  Given the US court system, I would not be shocked if they win this claim, but they obviously should not win.

arebelspy

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #48 on: July 24, 2013, 08:54:52 AM »
Yep, it was a lawsuit:

http://www.virginiadefamationlawyer.com/1.%20Everest%20Wealth%20Management.pdf

The plaintiffs seem to have an unconvincing argument on the face of it to me.

Very interesting, thanks.

I wish the best of luck to Mike.  I very much appreciated his website.

Sucks that someone else had that much power over him/it based on bullshit claims.  Hope Mike wins, and eventually republishes everything and keeps blogging.
We are two former teachers who accumulated a bunch of real estate, retired at 29, spent some time traveling the world full time and are now settled with two kids.
If you want to know more about us, or how we did that, or see lots of pictures, this Business Insider profile tells our story pretty well.
We (rarely) blog at AdventuringAlong.com. Check out our Now page to see what we're up to currently.

DoubleDown

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Re: Long-Term Returns
« Reply #49 on: July 24, 2013, 10:23:16 AM »
Wow what a load of crap in that complaint. LTR pointed out that no one can "guarantee" 7% returns, and the company files a lawsuit (since I guess they think they can). Unfortunately they've already mostly accomplished their mission in having the website taken down just through the lawsuit itself and intimidation. I also note snarkily that the plaintiff's attorneys don't know the difference between "principal" and "principle". I hope LTR has a good attorney that gets this lawsuit summarily dismissed.

Now that I think about it, maybe I'll call Everest today and tell them I want to sign up for their guaranteed 7% return, and when they say they can't deliver, I'll inform LTR. Or I guess I'll get a documented, guaranteed 7% return that they damn well better deliver lest they hear from more attorneys!