Author Topic: Invest 500k uk pound lump sum for 10 years?....advice needed folks!  (Read 2312 times)

bthewalls

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I have 500k I need to invest for 10 years and then Iím retiring...thinking vanguard vusa or vwrl as Iím familiar with them.

My tax free isa only allows 20k per year so its of no use.

Should I dollar point average in given the market is quite strong and buys the dips as they occur, or just put whole lot in in one go?

Ta for any helpful knowledgeable advice.

Barry

robartsd

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Re: Invest 500k uk pound lump sum for 10 years?....advice needed folks!
« Reply #1 on: July 18, 2019, 04:04:56 PM »
Time in market usually beats market timing (sometimes people do get lucky).

I'd start with maxing your tax advantaged account (can't put all the 500k in, but might as well put in the 20k you can).

Lots of people would be nervous about putting in a large sum at once; so breaking it into several transactions over several weeks isn't a terrible ideal; If I had zero transaction costs for making purchases, I might transact 20k a week for the next 25 weeks. If I didn't consider the costs of transactions negligible, I would be more likely to invest 5 x 100k transactions.

Andy R

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Re: Invest 500k uk pound lump sum for 10 years?....advice needed folks!
« Reply #2 on: July 18, 2019, 07:29:58 PM »
I have 500k I need to invest for 10 years and then Iím retiring

So you're taking it all out when you retire?

bthewalls

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Re: Invest 500k uk pound lump sum for 10 years?....advice needed folks!
« Reply #3 on: July 19, 2019, 01:39:30 AM »
Thanks folks for replies....I know a bit about investment but always learning.

To answer question, not taking all out in 10 years, will draw 4 percentish  but leave remained in to compound.

Be lovely to put whole lot in in a correction dip but impossible to time eh.

Barry

vand

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Re: Invest 500k uk pound lump sum for 10 years?....advice needed folks!
« Reply #4 on: July 19, 2019, 04:16:37 AM »
I'm sure you would find plenty of good feedback on the UK specific ("tax" but really "main") forum.

Personally I would not rush to whack all your money into the market.

- Max out your annual allowance pension this year, including making use of all possible carry forward from the previous 3 years, except if you are already at a stage where it looks like you're well on course to hit the lifetime allowance. Do likewise for spouse if applicable.
- Fill out ISA allowance. Do likewise for spouse if application.
- Fill out children's JSIPP and/or JISA allowances if applicable and you plan to provide any sort of nestegg for them

This might take between 4-8 years depending on if you have spouse/children, but if you are desperate to have your money working for you sooner rather than later you can buy in regular taxable accounts in the sort of amounts that would be unlikely to trigger the CGT 11k limit. you'll have to figure that out based on varying projected rates of return and how long it is invested for, but it would be possible to have a plan that has your money working in a taxable account which you can cash out a few years later without triggering CGT and then continue moving that money into an SIPP/ISA

But I would do a lot of thinking also about how fast you want to put the cash to work and how long you want to spread your buying period out over... and crucially also about asset allocation.. from which you may well want to leave chunk of it in cash. You can also as part of a diversified strategy buy gold/silver coins from the Royal mint (sovereigns, Britannias, Queens' Beasts), from which any gains are CGT except (silver is not VAT exempt, but there are ways around that).
« Last Edit: July 19, 2019, 04:19:45 AM by vand »

bthewalls

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Re: Invest 500k uk pound lump sum for 10 years?....advice needed folks!
« Reply #5 on: July 19, 2019, 04:50:16 AM »
Vand
Thanks for the info...Will need to study up on what you suggested.

Had assumed 500k to small to have specific asset allocation at this point, other using a few diverse eft index funds and gold eft.?...would 500k be enough to establish an all weather portfolio or similar?

Already have a smaller all weather structure through isa account....could just add the 500k to it in proportion, over time.?

Barry

robartsd

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Re: Invest 500k uk pound lump sum for 10 years?....advice needed folks!
« Reply #6 on: July 19, 2019, 10:39:07 AM »
IMO, 500k is plenty for setting and maintaining an asset allocation (for some people it is more than 50% of the way to FI). I say as long as your asset mix would allocate at least 10k to your smallest allocation you should fully implement it.

bthewalls

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Re: Invest 500k uk pound lump sum for 10 years?....advice needed folks!
« Reply #7 on: July 19, 2019, 02:05:40 PM »
Rob
Would you mind giving me a rough suggestion/outline of an asset allocation you would consider with 500k? ....as an example.

I follow ray dalio alot online and his all weather portfolio.
 Although ray allocates portfolio percentages based on 'risk' isn't it roughly 25 percent 'value' for a) diverse equity etf b) bond c) gold d) commodity?

Barry

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bthewalls

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Re: Invest 500k uk pound lump sum for 10 years?....advice needed folks!
« Reply #9 on: July 19, 2019, 03:23:48 PM »
Never give up.

Ta dude...nice resource and easy to follow...going through it now

B

nsmall

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Re: Invest 500k uk pound lump sum for 10 years?....advice needed folks!
« Reply #10 on: July 19, 2019, 10:53:32 PM »
I have a similar problem but only 155k I just ran into.  Vanguard suggests a lot of international and since the international prices seem "fair" vs VTSAX maybe get your international funds funded.  Im just doing 3k a week as I am not tough enough to lump sum 155k.  Good luck.  Just dont sell when the market sours.

PDXTabs

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Re: Invest 500k uk pound lump sum for 10 years?....advice needed folks!
« Reply #11 on: July 20, 2019, 10:34:59 PM »
Normally I tell people to dollar cost average if they can't stomach lump sum investing. However, in your case I would run not walk to your broker and (personally) put it all in VT or similar. This is because of the currency risk around Brexit, so I'd turn those GBPs into shares of productive companies ASAP.

To be clear, theoretically Brexit could cause the pound to get stronger, not weaker, over then next 6-12 months. But as a card carrying British person I see far more downside risk than upside potential, plus your money could be invested earning dividends, etc.

bthewalls

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Re: Invest 500k uk pound lump sum for 10 years?....advice needed folks!
« Reply #12 on: July 21, 2019, 02:45:48 AM »
Thanks....

Had assumed pound could on drop in short term  (min 2 to 5 years) after brexit.

You think it could rise?

PDXTabs

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Re: Invest 500k uk pound lump sum for 10 years?....advice needed folks!
« Reply #13 on: July 21, 2019, 10:01:51 AM »
You think it could rise?

I think that Brexit could still get cancelled, which could cause the pound to rise. But it doesn't seem very likely at this point.

bthewalls

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Re: Invest 500k uk pound lump sum for 10 years?....advice needed folks!
« Reply #14 on: July 21, 2019, 01:25:22 PM »
I really believe it will be cancelled toi

Boris the clown will be pm for a short stint...then a general election followed by brexit been cancelled...totally believe it

PDXTabs

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Re: Invest 500k uk pound lump sum for 10 years?....advice needed folks!
« Reply #15 on: July 21, 2019, 06:33:10 PM »
I really believe it will be cancelled toi

Boris the clown will be pm for a short stint...then a general election followed by brexit been cancelled...totally believe it

I hope that you are right but I fear that you are wrong. Maybe Johnson succeeds in crashing the UK out, Scotland succeeds, and Ireland unifies. I don't know, I can't see the future.

bthewalls

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Re: Invest 500k uk pound lump sum for 10 years?....advice needed folks!
« Reply #16 on: July 22, 2019, 01:22:48 AM »
I'm willing to gamble my vanguard vwrl dividend that Boris is being put in place to wrap it around his neck when it's goes south....

No deal brexit would cause havoc to UKs small economy for along time...

In northern Ireland, legislation for gay marriage and abortion  is being put in place my England... Teresa Mays payback to the DuP for leaving her hanging?.

When e.u. funding is no long abundant for northern Ireland agricultural sector you'll see it collapse and United ireland...that combined with Scotland will leave England out in a limb.

A Fella from Stella

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Re: Invest 500k uk pound lump sum for 10 years?....advice needed folks!
« Reply #17 on: July 22, 2019, 08:56:12 AM »
Very good job thinking this out 10 years ahead.

How old will you be?

May I recommend "investing" in jujitsu? During a particularly good year, I send a fair amount of time at a gym, and it was really beneficial. I lost a bunch of weight, got my resting heart rate down to something like 50 bpm, and just felt great. I've gained the weight back since, but have to wonder how heavy I'd be if I hadn't have done it.

vand

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Re: Invest 500k uk pound lump sum for 10 years?....advice needed folks!
« Reply #18 on: July 22, 2019, 11:50:16 AM »
I wouldn't do anything differently regardless of Brexit. GBP is already very weak; it's likely that whatever bad news the market is expecting is already discounted in the price, and we will probably be higher a year from now as the uncertainty is resolved one way or another.

Jamese20

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Re: Invest 500k uk pound lump sum for 10 years?....advice needed folks!
« Reply #19 on: July 30, 2019, 08:38:02 AM »
I really believe it will be cancelled toi

Boris the clown will be pm for a short stint...then a general election followed by brexit been cancelled...totally believe it

I hope that you are right but I fear that you are wrong. Maybe Johnson succeeds in crashing the UK out, Scotland succeeds, and Ireland unifies. I don't know, I can't see the future.

so you hope that a democratic decision gets cancelled? you could move to Russia or China if you want to be dictated to? North Korea too

poppydog

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Re: Invest 500k uk pound lump sum for 10 years?....advice needed folks!
« Reply #20 on: July 30, 2019, 09:09:54 AM »
If it was me, Iíd find a low cost platform, dump the lot in the Vanguard Lifestrategy 100 fund, close my laptop and get on with life!

EvenSteven

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Re: Invest 500k uk pound lump sum for 10 years?....advice needed folks!
« Reply #21 on: July 30, 2019, 09:46:38 AM »
I really believe it will be cancelled toi

Boris the clown will be pm for a short stint...then a general election followed by brexit been cancelled...totally believe it

I hope that you are right but I fear that you are wrong. Maybe Johnson succeeds in crashing the UK out, Scotland succeeds, and Ireland unifies. I don't know, I can't see the future.

so you hope that a democratic decision gets cancelled? you could move to Russia or China if you want to be dictated to? North Korea too

How about delay exiting the European Union until the year 2654. That would still be in compliance with the wording of the referendum that people voted on?

Jamese20

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Re: Invest 500k uk pound lump sum for 10 years?....advice needed folks!
« Reply #22 on: July 30, 2019, 12:55:04 PM »
I really believe it will be cancelled toi

Boris the clown will be pm for a short stint...then a general election followed by brexit been cancelled...totally believe it

I hope that you are right but I fear that you are wrong. Maybe Johnson succeeds in crashing the UK out, Scotland succeeds, and Ireland unifies. I don't know, I can't see the future.

so you hope that a democratic decision gets cancelled? you could move to Russia or China if you want to be dictated to? North Korea too

How about delay exiting the European Union until the year 2654. That would still be in compliance with the wording of the referendum that people voted on?

that would not be leaving, so no it wouldnt

EvenSteven

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Re: Invest 500k uk pound lump sum for 10 years?....advice needed folks!
« Reply #23 on: July 30, 2019, 01:46:54 PM »
I really believe it will be cancelled toi

Boris the clown will be pm for a short stint...then a general election followed by brexit been cancelled...totally believe it

I hope that you are right but I fear that you are wrong. Maybe Johnson succeeds in crashing the UK out, Scotland succeeds, and Ireland unifies. I don't know, I can't see the future.

so you hope that a democratic decision gets cancelled? you could move to Russia or China if you want to be dictated to? North Korea too

How about delay exiting the European Union until the year 2654. That would still be in compliance with the wording of the referendum that people voted on?

that would not be leaving, so no it wouldnt

It would be leaving. It would just be leaving in 2654. There was no time limit specified on the referendum. This way Democracy remains intact, nobody has to move to Russia or North Korea, and Britain gets to stay in the EU.

Wins all around!

bthewalls

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Re: Invest 500k uk pound lump sum for 10 years?....advice needed folks!
« Reply #24 on: August 01, 2019, 03:40:49 PM »
...Iíve just booked my ticket to North Korea....Iíve had enough!....

PDXTabs

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Re: Invest 500k uk pound lump sum for 10 years?....advice needed folks!
« Reply #25 on: August 01, 2019, 08:19:45 PM »
I really believe it will be cancelled toi

Boris the clown will be pm for a short stint...then a general election followed by brexit been cancelled...totally believe it

I hope that you are right but I fear that you are wrong. Maybe Johnson succeeds in crashing the UK out, Scotland succeeds, and Ireland unifies. I don't know, I can't see the future.

so you hope that a democratic decision gets cancelled? you could move to Russia or China if you want to be dictated to? North Korea too

Just to be clear, the voters voted to "leave the EU" but were also basically promised by the leave campaign that they could have their cake and eat it to.

As a slight aside it would not be a violation of the "leave the EU" language to end up in the EEA, but outside of the EU. Which as far as I am concerned would be the best possible outcome.

It also wouldn't be a violation of democracy to hold the referendum again. Now that the voters see what Brexit actually looks like they might well change their mind.

Jamese20

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Re: Invest 500k uk pound lump sum for 10 years?....advice needed folks!
« Reply #26 on: August 04, 2019, 06:27:05 AM »
I really believe it will be cancelled toi

Boris the clown will be pm for a short stint...then a general election followed by brexit been cancelled...totally believe it

I hope that you are right but I fear that you are wrong. Maybe Johnson succeeds in crashing the UK out, Scotland succeeds, and Ireland unifies. I don't know, I can't see the future.

so you hope that a democratic decision gets cancelled? you could move to Russia or China if you want to be dictated to? North Korea too

How about delay exiting the European Union until the year 2654. That would still be in compliance with the wording of the referendum that people voted on?

that would not be leaving, so no it wouldnt

It would be leaving. It would just be leaving in 2654. There was no time limit specified on the referendum. This way Democracy remains intact, nobody has to move to Russia or North Korea, and Britain gets to stay in the EU.

Wins all around!

so when we voted to join... i guess the same should have applied then too shouldnt it? oh that is right i forgot.... we didnt get the democratic choice to join the common market did we where the deceit and true motives were kept in hidden in the top secret document

Jamese20

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Re: Invest 500k uk pound lump sum for 10 years?....advice needed folks!
« Reply #27 on: August 04, 2019, 06:28:14 AM »
I really believe it will be cancelled toi

Boris the clown will be pm for a short stint...then a general election followed by brexit been cancelled...totally believe it

I hope that you are right but I fear that you are wrong. Maybe Johnson succeeds in crashing the UK out, Scotland succeeds, and Ireland unifies. I don't know, I can't see the future.

what cake and eat it? it was clear in the government leaflet if you cared to read it - a vote to leave was leaving CU and single market... and the country still voted out - no cake involved

so you hope that a democratic decision gets cancelled? you could move to Russia or China if you want to be dictated to? North Korea too

Just to be clear, the voters voted to "leave the EU" but were also basically promised by the leave campaign that they could have their cake and eat it to.

As a slight aside it would not be a violation of the "leave the EU" language to end up in the EEA, but outside of the EU. Which as far as I am concerned would be the best possible outcome.

It also wouldn't be a violation of democracy to hold the referendum again. Now that the voters see what Brexit actually looks like they might well change their mind.