Author Topic: How do REITs work anyways?  (Read 1329 times)

Le Poisson

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How do REITs work anyways?
« on: June 20, 2022, 08:31:23 PM »
OK, I'm smart enough (barely) to know that any business, including a REIT has three major factors in the viability of the company - The Management Strategy, The Capital holdings, and the operating profit/loss. So Slick Willy's Chevrolet with a one time deal on hot pink Camaros, available only if you come in today before noon and sign on the line, has:

Management strategy - sales offers, workforce management, an inventory control program, and advertising and marketing strategies.
Capital holdings - the physical dealership, tools, inventory, service vehicles, etc.
Operating profit/loss - the staff salaries, maintenance on the building and lot, franchise fees, etc.

I can take Willy's accounting ledger and see how much capital value the dealership has. I can take a look at teh assets to get a feel for capital valuation, and from those two lines get a feel for the market value of the company, then I can look into Willy's beady little eyes, see his management strategy and project that current value forward to guess whether an investment in his Chevrolet dealership would see a gain or loss.

In a REIT though, the capital holdings are the product. However much value they gain can never be realized... and if it is, the operating value of the REIT changes since rents will change with addition/loss of a property, which means that the more actively a REIT trades property, the less stable its income should be - and yet (I think) most REITs become profitable by buying/selling property to realize capital gains and reinvest them.

If that is the case, then the dividends paid from the REIT are actually eroding the capital increase, limiting it's ability to grow/purchase new properties. So yeah, I think that I completely don't understand these investments. Can someone explain at me how a REIT makes money?


ChpBstrd

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Re: How do REITs work anyways?
« Reply #1 on: June 21, 2022, 10:39:29 AM »
Equity REITs are basically run the same way as any other company, but with some key exceptions:

1) They have to pay 90% of income to shareholders, and in exchange they don't have to pay taxes on that income (but the shareholders do, and usually at the higher individual tax rate, but at least they aren't double-taxed).
     a) Of course, taxable income is different from cash flows, and REITs reduce their taxable income A LOT through the use of depreciation.
     b) Having to distribute 90% of income certainly limits their ability to reinvest and grow organically. They mostly issue stock or debt to grow.

2) REITs use depreciation to reduce taxable income, with widely varying levels of success, so traditional earnings-based metrics like the PE ratio may be an inaccurate way of evaluating these companies. Funds from Operations (FFO) is the standard way of measuring REIT profitability, because it is based on cash flows, not accounting earnings.

3) Depreciation also affects the price-to-book-value ratio. If an REIT appears to be selling for far more than the book value of its properties, that may be because they've been aggressively depreciating those properties to lower taxable income. The actual resale value of the properties may be a lot higher than the book value.

4) Most real estate projects have a low return-on-assets, so REITs use debt to boost return-on-equity. This works great when properties or construction costs are cheap, or interest rates are low. Be wary in the current environment though! If interest rates rise higher than the capitalization rates on the REIT's properties, then they will be, for example, borrowing money at 7% to pay for a property that yields 5% of its value in net cash flows. A lot of REITs may have bought low-yielding properties long ago, and now their revolving debt agreements are coming in at higher and higher interest rates.   

Le Poisson

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Re: How do REITs work anyways?
« Reply #2 on: June 21, 2022, 12:29:58 PM »
Thanks @ChpBstrd - do Canadian REITs follow these same rules? Is there an advantage for me (CDN) to buy US Reits?

Financial.Velociraptor

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Re: How do REITs work anyways?
« Reply #3 on: June 21, 2022, 12:33:32 PM »
It is important to note REITs come in two flavors: growth and yield.  Anyone who tries to split the difference will do both really poorly.  Most  growth REITs own real estate for the purpose of collecting rents and focus on a specific type of property - residential, multi-family, commercial, health care, data warehousing, etc.  Most yield REITS are 'm'REITs (mREITS) or mortgage REITs.  They borrow money short and lend it long and are basically a shadow banking operation.  Many mREITs now also have a side business in mortgage processing.  Either way they are paper pushers.

VNQ is a weird bunny in that it is the entire universe of REITs and even some non-REIT in real estate space and doesn't specialize in growth or yield.  There should really be two (or three) products.

ChpBstrd

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Re: How do REITs work anyways?
« Reply #4 on: June 21, 2022, 01:52:33 PM »
Thanks @ChpBstrd - do Canadian REITs follow these same rules? Is there an advantage for me (CDN) to buy US Reits?

I do not know the answer to either question.

clarkfan1979

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Re: How do REITs work anyways?
« Reply #5 on: June 21, 2022, 04:31:37 PM »
It is important to note REITs come in two flavors: growth and yield.  Anyone who tries to split the difference will do both really poorly.  Most  growth REITs own real estate for the purpose of collecting rents and focus on a specific type of property - residential, multi-family, commercial, health care, data warehousing, etc.  Most yield REITS are 'm'REITs (mREITS) or mortgage REITs.  They borrow money short and lend it long and are basically a shadow banking operation.  Many mREITs now also have a side business in mortgage processing.  Either way they are paper pushers.

VNQ is a weird bunny in that it is the entire universe of REITs and even some non-REIT in real estate space and doesn't specialize in growth or yield.  There should really be two (or three) products.

Is that why the returns are horrible on VNQ?

5.67% total over 5 years.

Pass. 

PDXTabs

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Re: How do REITs work anyways?
« Reply #6 on: June 21, 2022, 05:48:19 PM »
It is important to note REITs come in two flavors: growth and yield.  Anyone who tries to split the difference will do both really poorly.  Most  growth REITs own real estate for the purpose of collecting rents and focus on a specific type of property - residential, multi-family, commercial, health care, data warehousing, etc.  Most yield REITS are 'm'REITs (mREITS) or mortgage REITs.  They borrow money short and lend it long and are basically a shadow banking operation.  Many mREITs now also have a side business in mortgage processing.  Either way they are paper pushers.

VNQ is a weird bunny in that it is the entire universe of REITs and even some non-REIT in real estate space and doesn't specialize in growth or yield.  There should really be two (or three) products.

Is that why the returns are horrible on VNQ?

5.67% total over 5 years.

Pass.

That's why you have to look at total returns and not just share price. Because 90% of the profit is paid out every quarter.
https://screener.fidelity.com/ftgw/etf/goto/snapshot/performance.jhtml?symbols=VNQ