Facepunch My 403b

[Inkedup]

So I've been looking at my 403b fund options and have a sinking feeling I'm not getting the best bang for my buck with Lincoln. I'm at a point where I don't yet have a significant amount of money invested, so if I'm getting screwed I would rather cut ties with them now and open an IRA with Vanguard.

The $25 annual fee is waived, but my employer offers no matching.  I can't afford to max out my contributions.

The "total annual fund operating expenses" are listed as .46 (minimum) to 1.88 (maximum). That to me is a pretty big range so I have no idea how much Lincoln drains from the account on an annual basis.

My risk tolerance is moderate, but I wouldn't mind picking a more aggressive fund combination. Some of the ER's for available funds strike me as too high. So far I have $4400 invested in the following:

FIXED FUND 10%
LVIP SSGA S&P 500 INDEX 20%
LVIP SSGA INTERNATIONAL INDEX 10%
LVIP SSGA BOND INDEX 10%
LVIP VANGUARD DOMESTIC EQUITY ETF 20%
LVIP DELAWARE SPECIAL OPPORTUNITIES 10%
AMERICAN FUNDS GROWTH & INCOME 20%

Should I stick with those funds, ditch them for any of the following, or run away screaming from Lincoln altogether?

Here are the options available in my Lincoln Financial 403b:

AMERICAN FUNDS GROWTH & INCOME .54   
AMERICAN FUNDS GROWTH .60   
AMERICAN FUNDS INTERNATIONAL .79      
AMERICAN FUNDS GLOBAL GROWTH .80   
LVIP BARON GROWTH OPPORTUNITIES 1.01      
DELAWARE VIP VALUE .71      
DELAWARE VIP SMALL CAP VALUE 1.05      
FIDELITY VIP GROWTH .65      
MFS UTILITIES .79      
DELAWARE VIP HIGH YIELD .74   
DELAWARE VIP REIT .84      
FIDELITY VIP CONTRAFUND .63-.88   
DELAWARE VIP DIVERSIFIED INCOME .67   
LVIP DIMENSIONAL U.S. CORE EQUITY .38      
LVIP DELAWARE BOND .35       
LVIP MONEY MARKET .41      
LVIP DELAWARE SPECIAL OPPORTUNITIES .43      
LVIP DEL FOUNDATION CONSERVATIVE ALLOC .75       
LVIP DELAWARE SOCIAL AWARENESS .42       
LVIP DEL FOUNDATION AGGRESSIVE ALLOC .76       
LVIP MONDRIAN INTERNATIONAL VALUE .73      
LVIP T. ROWE PRICE MID-CAP GROWTH .76       
LVIP UBS LRGCAP GRWTH MANAGED VOLATILITY .72             
LVIP SSGA S&P 500 INDEX .21   
LVIP JPMORGAN MID CAP VALUE MANGD VLTLTY .82       
LVIP SSGA SMALL-CAP INDEX .37      
LVIP TEMPLETON GROWTH MANAGED VOLATILITY .76      
LVIP SSGA INTERNATIONAL INDEX .41      
LVIP SSGA BOND INDEX .33      
LVIP SSGA EMERGING MARKETS 100 .44      
LVIP DELAWARE FOUNDATION MODERATE ALLOC .75   
BLACKROCK GLOBAL ALLOCATION .73       
DEUTSCHE ALTERNATIV ASSET ALLOCATION VIP 1.59      
LVIP BLACKROCK INFLATION PROTECTED BOND .47      
LVIP DELAWARE DIVERSIFIED FLOATING RATE   .62   
LVIP CLARION GLOBAL REAL ESTATE .73   
DELAWARE VIP SMID CAP GROWTH .83      
PIMCO VIT TOTAL RETURN PORTFOLIO .65      
LVIP GLOBAL CONSERVATIVE ALLOCATION MRSK .68      
LVIP GLOBAL MODERATE ALLOCATION MGD RISK .69       
LVIP GLOBAL GROWTH ALLOCATION MANGD RISK .66      
LVIP SSGA GLBL TACTICAL ALLOCTN MGD VLTY .63      
LVIP MANAGED RISK PROFILE 2010 .73       
LVIP MANAGED RISK PROFILE 2020   .72    
LVIP MANAGED RISK PROFILE 2030   .73    
LVIP MANAGED RISK PROFILE 2040   .75    
LVIP MANAGED RISK PROFILE 2050   .74   
LVIP VANGUARD DOMESTIC EQUITY ETF  .35   
LVIP VANGUARD INTERNATIONAL EQUITY ETF .45       
LVIP BLACKROCK EMERGING MARKET MNGD VLTY .76

[forummm]

If you are investing less than $5500 year, then I would just contribute to a Vanguard IRA. But you really should be investing much more than that. So you would need to use the 403b for additional tax advantaged savings. I think it's worth doing. But when you leave this job, just roll everything over into a Vanguard IRA.

If the decimal after the fund name is the expense ratio, I would put all of my domestic equities into
LVIP SSGA S&P 500 INDEX .21
All of my international equities (if any) into
LVIP VANGUARD INTERNATIONAL EQUITY ETF .45
And my bonds (if any) into
LVIP SSGA BOND INDEX .33

It's hard to say for sure without more information. But given what you posted, this is it.

[Inkedup]

Thanks, forummm. I do invest more than 5500, so the entire account will have about 12k by the end of the calendar year.
This isn't the entirety of my retirement fund. I have a pension through work, as well as several Roths with Vanguard.

[forummm]

Thanks, forummm. I do invest more than 5500, so the entire account will have about 12k by the end of the calendar year.
This isn't the entirety of my retirement fund. I have a pension through work, as well as several Roths with Vanguard.

Great. Definitely max out your IRA ($5500 each year). And then put whatever you can into your 403b.

[seattlecyclone]

Those expense ratios are relatively high. What other 403(b) options do you have besides Lincoln?

[mrpercentage]

American Funds growth and income is probably CAIBX. Not sure what class of share it is but I would guess A. Not telling you what to do but at least you can look up CAIBX and see what your money is going into for that 20%. I don't know the rest

[Inkedup]

Those expense ratios are relatively high. What other 403(b) options do you have besides Lincoln?

MetLife, NY Life, Valic, AXA, American Century.

From talking to other people at work, the few people who choose to open 403b accounts either go with Lincoln or Valic.

[forummm]

Those expense ratios are relatively high. What other 403(b) options do you have besides Lincoln?

MetLife, NY Life, Valic, AXA, American Century.

From talking to other people at work, the few people who choose to open 403b accounts either go with Kincoln or Valic.

Check out the expense ratios for the funds available with these other providers. Hopefully there's something under 0.1% for you.

[Inkedup]

Those expense ratios are relatively high. What other 403(b) options do you have besides Lincoln?

MetLife, NY Life, Valic, AXA, American Century.

From talking to other people at work, the few people who choose to open 403b accounts either go with Kincoln or Valic.

Check out the expense ratios for the funds available with these other providers. Hopefully there's something under 0.1% for you.

Valic funds are definitely not under consideration. The expense ratios are mostly 1.0% (and up). Eek.

[mrpercentage]

My bad. I found your American Fund stock. Its right here

https://www.americanfunds.com/individual/investments/fund/cwgix
here is the menu, I can't match the fees you provided though
https://www.americanfunds.com/individual/products/mutual-funds.html

[Another Reader]

I am not familiar with Lincoln's plans.  It's possible this may not be a simple mutual fund investment plan.  LVIP stands for Lincoln Variable Insurance Product.  You need to understand exactly what you are investing in and whether the insurance company has some kind of annuity or insurance product through which you are investing in mutual funds.  Call the plan's liaison and get a complete description of how the plan works, what you are buying, and the fees.

Whatever you do, stay far, far away from Valic.

[Inkedup]

My bad. I found your American Fund stock. Its right here

https://www.americanfunds.com/individual/investments/fund/cwgix
here is the menu, I can't match the fees you provided though
https://www.americanfunds.com/individual/products/mutual-funds.html

Thanks!

[Inkedup]

I am not familiar with Lincoln's plans.  It's possible this may not be a simple mutual fund investment plan.  LVIP stands for Lincoln Variable Insurance Product.  You need to understand exactly what you are investing in and whether the insurance company has some kind of annuity or insurance product through which you are investing in mutual funds.  Call the plan's liaison and get a complete description of how the plan works, what you are buying, and the fees.

Whatever you do, stay far, far away from Valic.

Thanks for the advice. From my reading I believe it's an annuity, but no matter what I'm contacting the rep to clarify a few things, including a breakdown of the fees I'm actually paying. Neither the contract nor the prospectus, both of which I keep re-reading, is specific enough about the true cost to satisfy me.

[NICE!]

It makes my stomach hurt to see the expensive 401k/403b options people are given by companies. It is truly a sad situation.