The sourdough thread

[GuitarStv]

It's been about a year since I made my own sourdough culture, and have regularly been making sourdough bread, muffins, cupcakes, English muffins and other stuff.  It's awesome for several reasons:

- The expensive yeast that you would normally buy becomes the same cost as some water and flour.
- Sourdough bread made with white flour is actually healthier than regular whole wheat bread when looking at insulin response (http://www.ctvnews.ca/sourdough-bread-may-be-better-than-whole-wheat-1.307157)
- Sourdough is chock full of probiotics if you're into that sort of thing
- Sourdough has been shown to reduce gluten intolerance in people with celiac disease (http://www.thehealthyhomeeconomist.com/can-celiacs-eat-true-sourdough-bread/)
- The bread tastes awesome.
- It's really, really easy.


Making your own sourdough starter
Alright . . . so how do I get on this sourdough bandwagon of awesomeness?  First you need a starter.  A starter culture is basically a bunch of yeast (and some good bacteria) kicking around in a bowl with some flour and water.  Steven's foolproof way to get your starter going:

Step 1:
Take 1/4 cup of warm water, take about 1/2 cup of whole wheat or whole grain flour (I find that white bleached flour doesn't work well to get the starter going).  Stick it in a container or bowl big enough to hold 3-4 cups of stuff or more.  Cover the top with a plastic bag or some plastic wrap.  Let sit for 12 hours.  Check the starter.  If you see some bubbles forming move on to step 2.  If not, wait another 12 hours.  Again, if you see bubbles move on to step to.  If after a day and a half you don't see any bubbles starting to form and it hasn't risen, rinse out the container and try again (maybe try some different flour).

Step 2:
Alright!  Your starter has been born!  Now you just need to strengthen it.  To do this, we will feed it some flour and water it regularly.  Don't worry, you just have to do this for a couple days.

You started with 1/4 cup of warm water and 1/2 cup of whole wheat.  You're going to add the same amount of water, but this time use regular old white flour.  Let the yeast bubble away for another 12 hours.  When you check on your new baby, you will notice that it has grown considerably.  If it's getting too big for your container, scoop out half of it and toss it away.

Keep adding about an equivalent amount of warm water and white flour to your starter as there is starter in the bowl every 12 hours for about three days.  At this point your starter should be raring to bake with.

Care and feeding of your sourdough starter:
My rule of thumb is that every 12 hours your starter is at room temperature, you need to use/discard half of the starter and add an equivalent amount of water/flour mixture.  This keeps your sourdough starter happy and healthy.  If you leave it out on the counter for 2 days or more it might pick up some funny smells/colours and no longer be good for baking.

If you don't want to keep feeding the starter every day I've had great luck sticking it in the fridge for up to two weeks.  Just make sure to do a feeding before you put it in the fridge, and let the starter completely warm up on the counter before you try baking with it.



Next up . . . some easy and delicious recipes for your new sourdough starter!

[GuitarStv]

Sourdough Bread:

1/3 cup starter
1 cup Whole wheat flour
5 cups White bread flour
2 1/2 cups warm water
2 tsp Salt

Mix the water and sourdough starter together in a bowl, then add the whole wheat flour and salt.  Keep mixing in the bowl and adding white flour until it starts to form a ball. pour some flour on a board and coat your hands with flour.  Move the doughball on to the board and knead the flour in.  You want the dough to be just a little bit moist but not super sticky to your fingers.  Depending on the consistency of your starter you might not need to use all of the flour.

Once you've got your dough ball made, divide it into two smaller balls.  Stick the small balls into small baking tins (I usually grease the tins with some olive oil).  Cover the tins with some plastic baggies/saran wrap and leave some place room temperature for 8-10 hours.  The balls should roughly double in size (not double in height though, they get wider) over this time.

Take off the plastic baggies, use a sharp knife to score a cut down the middle of each loaf and Stick 'em in the oven at 375 for about 45 minutes.  Remove from oven and enjoy delicious bread!

[GuitarStv]

Sourdough Pizza Crusts:

1 1/2 cup sourdough starter
1 tablespoon olive oil
1 teaspoon Salt
1 1/2 cups of flour

Mix everything together and knead the dough into a ball.  Let the dough sit for an hour or so.  Preheat your oven to 450 degrees.  Stick the dough on a pizza pan or large baking tray that has been covered in olive oil, and stretch or roll out the dough.  Add your pizza toppings, and then bake for 15 - 20 minutes (the amount of toppings can really change baking time).

[davisgang90]

Awesome stuff!  I've wanted to make my own starter and now I can!

Thanks for sharing!

[GuitarStv]

Sourdough English Muffins:

1 cup of starter
2 tablespoons honey
2 cups of milk (2% or whole milk tastes better)
4 cups of unbleached white flour

Stick all of the above ingredients in a bowl and just mix them enough to get all the flour wet.  Wait eight hours (do this the night before if you want English muffins for breakfast).

After you've waited 8 hours add in:

1-2 cups unbleached white flour
2 teaspoons sea salt
1 teaspoon baking soda

Work the dough on a bread board until it's not sticking too much to your hands.  then I just roll the stuff out about an inch or so high and cut it into English muffin sized pieces.  Sprinkle some flour on top of them, and then let the pieces rise for about 20 - 30 minutes.

To cook them up, heat some butter in a pan on low or medium (the temperature is tricky) and cook the english muffins for about 4 minutes a side.  They seem to cook better if you squish them down a bit with your spatula as you're cooking.  I always set the temperature too hot and burn the outside of my English muffins for the first few.

[GuitarStv]

High Protein Blueberry Banana Muffins (great to toss down before that morning bike commute):

1 egg
1.5 teaspoons vanilla
1/4 cup oil
1 cup sourdough starter
3/4 cup blueberries
1 smooshed up banana

1/4 teaspoon salt
1 cup whole wheat flour
1 teaspoon baking soda
1/2 cup sugar
1/4 cup vanilla or non-flavoured protein powder

Mix up the dry ingredients in one bowl, and then mix up the wet ingredients in another bowl.  Preheat your oven to 425.  Get your muffin tins ready (you really want to put cups in them or use a non-stick spray, because these little buggers are very hard to get out of the tins otherwise).  Mix the wet stuff with the dry stuff until everything's wet, then ladle out into the muffin tins.  (Should make about 8 good sized muffins).  Bake for about 16 minutes (keep an eye on them, it can be easy to burn the tops).

[GuitarStv]

Awesome stuff!  I've wanted to make my own starter and now I can!

Thanks for sharing!

No problem.  It's pretty easy as long as you remember to make the starter with whole wheat flour.


If anyone else has recipes that you like for sourdough, please post them up!

[davisgang90]

I'm inherently lazy and own a bread maker, have you used these recipes in a bread maker?

[GuitarStv]

I'm inherently lazy and own a bread maker, have you used these recipes in a bread maker?

If you can adjust the time delay to allow bread to rise I think the bread machine should work fine.  Sourdough bread usually takes about 8 or 9 hours to rise properly (the wild yeast is not as fast as commercially developed stuff), so you could get your machine to mix it all, wait 8 hours, then get the machine to bake it (or just throw it in the oven).

I have tried making sourdough bread with regular bread machine rise times in ours.  The bread will bake, but won't rise much at all.  Comes out as dense as a hockey puck.

[decibelle]

I love baking with sourdough and making pancakes with it. 

When I read you give raw dough to your dog I was a little shocked.  I thought it was poisonous?  http://www.petpoisonhelpline.com/poison/bread-dough/

[GuitarStv]

It's not actually dough that I was feeding her, but leftover sourdough starter.  The starter has already completed it's rise when it's being thrown out, so I suspect that it's not the same thing that article is talking about.

Sourdough also doesn't expand anywhere near as fast as commercial yeast in bread dough, and I was just giving her a tablespoon of the stuff on her kibble.  It's never seemed to cause her any problem.  My last dog was a 12 lb spaniel, and she once ate got into and ate an entire bowl of sourdough starter (about three cups) and didn't have any problems.  I've also read from several places that feeding dogs yeast helps to prevent fleas.

That said, I'll modify my original post to remove mention of dogs as I certainly wouldn't want anyone's pet being hurt due to my advice!


Can you share your sourdough pancake recipe?

[Spork]

You can also get free sourdough starter from 1847 source if you don't want to go down the path of making your own.

And if you have a good one with it's own intricate/delicious tastes, you can spread it out thin, let it dry a bit, crunch it up and share it with your friends.

[totoro]

Great original recipe and this link is fabulous Spork!  I'm ordering the 1857 starter.  Great stocking stuffer with recipes and story.

[decibelle]

It's not actually dough that I was feeding her, but leftover sourdough starter.  The starter has already completed it's rise when it's being thrown out, so I suspect that it's not the same thing that article is talking about.

Sourdough also doesn't expand anywhere near as fast as commercial yeast in bread dough, and I was just giving her a tablespoon of the stuff on her kibble.  It's never seemed to cause her any problem.  My last dog was a 12 lb spaniel, and she once ate got into and ate an entire bowl of sourdough starter (about three cups) and didn't have any problems.  I've also read from several places that feeding dogs yeast helps to prevent fleas.

That said, I'll modify my original post to remove mention of dogs as I certainly wouldn't want anyone's pet being hurt due to my advice!

Can you share your sourdough pancake recipe?

That makes sense.  Commercial yeast would probably be bad for dogs.  Anyway, here's an easy recipe for sourdough pancakes.  The last time I made it, I topped it with grilled peaches and blueberries. :)  http://whatscookingamerica.net/Bread/SourdoughPancakes.htm

[GuitarStv]

Anyway, here's an easy recipe for sourdough pancakes.  The last time I made it, I topped it with grilled peaches and blueberries. :)  http://whatscookingamerica.net/Bread/SourdoughPancakes.htm

I am ashamed to admit it, but I've never made sourdough pancakes.  I know what we'll be having for breakfast on Saturday . . . thanks for sharing!

[decibelle]

Great, I just have to warn that you won't want to eat regular pancakes anymore after that. :)

[GuitarStv]

OK, those pancakes are pretty awesome!  We ate them until our tummies were about to burst this weekend.

[NumberCruncher]

Made sourdough pancakes and bread yesterday. :)  Did anyone else find the sourdough pancake batter to be really thick/bubbly at first, then get progressively thinner? We were doing one 'cake at a time in a pan as we don't have a griddle, so maybe it just took too long and yeast started dying? No clue  O.o

Started my starter a couple weeks ago or so, and this was my first time doing it the full-on slow rise bread with no added commercial yeast. Taste was pretty fantastic - so much waiting time, though!

[GuitarStv]

Made sourdough pancakes and bread yesterday. :)  Did anyone else find the sourdough pancake batter to be really thick/bubbly at first, then get progressively thinner? We were doing one 'cake at a time in a pan as we don't have a griddle, so maybe it just took too long and yeast started dying? No clue  O.o

Started my starter a couple weeks ago or so, and this was my first time doing it the full-on slow rise bread with no added commercial yeast. Taste was pretty fantastic - so much waiting time, though!

I usually mix up my bread the night before, then wake up in the morning to bake it . . . that way there's no real waiting time, you're asleep!

[NumberCruncher]

Made sourdough pancakes and bread yesterday. :)  Did anyone else find the sourdough pancake batter to be really thick/bubbly at first, then get progressively thinner? We were doing one 'cake at a time in a pan as we don't have a griddle, so maybe it just took too long and yeast started dying? No clue  O.o

Started my starter a couple weeks ago or so, and this was my first time doing it the full-on slow rise bread with no added commercial yeast. Taste was pretty fantastic - so much waiting time, though!

I usually mix up my bread the night before, then wake up in the morning to bake it . . . that way there's no real waiting time, you're asleep!

The recipe I was using was King Arthur Flour's "Extra Tangy" sourdough - which had mix, 4 hour wait, put in fridge 12 hours, mix in more flour, wait 4 hours, form dough, wait 2 hours.  O.o   Imma do the just rest overnight option next time ;)

[Li]

Sourdough Pizza Crusts:

Thanks for the recipe.  Have you tried the pizza crusts on a baking stone?  I'm wondering if you would put olive oil on the stone first or just put the pizza crust directly on the stone?

[jawisco]

Those pancakes sound awesome.

I have been making sourdough bread weekly for over 5 years.  I love the flexibility and taste of sourdough bread.  Here is my recipe:

1)In the AM sometime, take my starter from fridge and put into large bowl.  Add cup of water.  Stir for 10 seconds.  Add flour till it is about pancake batter consistency.  Stir for 10 seconds.  Cover with plastic bag or saran wrap and put somewhere at room temperature.

2)At least 4 hours later or up to 12 hours (very flexible), stir starter mix for 5 seconds, take out 1/2 and put in container and into fridge.  Then I add 2 cups of water, 1 TB of salt, and keep adding flour until the bread is at proper consistency (I don't measure the flour because I use different grains and proportions of WW flour in each loaf).  Put bread dough in fridge overnight.

3) Take out dough in AM and let it come to room temp.  Then I punch it down, give it a few kneads, and shape my loaf (I free form on cookie sheet).   I spread some oil on top, cover with plastic and hand towel, and wait till it is almost double.  Then I put it into oven at 475 degrees and then turn down to 400 after 15 minutes and then cook until done.

This recipe sounds long, but it is very, very little hands-on time and all that time is developing great flavor.  The only part of recipe that requires timing is the final rise - everything else is super flexible.  Don't be a slave to your bread!  I make my bread in kitchenaid mixer, so my hands on time for a complete loaf is less than 15 minutes. 

[Simple Abundant Living]

Thanks for posting!!  I ❤ sourdough!!!

[worms]

The only part of recipe that requires timing is the final rise - everything else is super flexible.  Don't be a slave to your bread!

Absolutely! Best piece of advice on this thread!

[GuitarStv]

Sourdough Pizza Crusts:

Thanks for the recipe.  Have you tried the pizza crusts on a baking stone?  I'm wondering if you would put olive oil on the stone first or just put the pizza crust directly on the stone?

I've never used a baking stone and don't really know how they work.  If the olive oil runs off of it though, I guess you could dust it with flour or cornmeal to prevent sticking.

[GuitarStv]

Made sourdough pancakes and bread yesterday. :)  Did anyone else find the sourdough pancake batter to be really thick/bubbly at first, then get progressively thinner? We were doing one 'cake at a time in a pan as we don't have a griddle, so maybe it just took too long and yeast started dying? No clue  O.o

If you add baking soda to a sourdough mix you're actually using the baking soda to get a quick rise, not really the yeast.  Baking soda reacts with the acidic bacteria/yeast in the sourdough, but if you leave it in for too long it might use up all of the baking soda and stop bubbling.

[shadowmoss]

Once you get your starter going really well, take a cup of it and put it in the freezer.  That way all you have to do is thaw it well and you have a bit of head start from beginning again with making a new starter.  This is good if your original starter dies, or you go on vacation and can't keep up with it or something.  This works probably 2/3 of the time at least. 

[StarswirlTheMustached]

Thanks! I need to try this. I tried to get into sourdough once before via a friend's starter, but it was a terrible, gooey mess, and his bread recipe was, too To add insult to injury, it never rose!

 

Sourdough Pizza Crusts:

Thanks for the recipe.  Have you tried the pizza crusts on a baking stone?  I'm wondering if you would put olive oil on the stone first or just put the pizza crust directly on the stone?

I've never used a baking stone and don't really know how they work.  If the olive oil runs off of it though, I guess you could dust it with flour or cornmeal to prevent sticking.

I've never put oil on a pizza stone for any recipe. Olive oil would smoke like gangbusters at the temp I run my pizzas at, anyway.

[Spork]

Thanks! I need to try this. I tried to get into sourdough once before via a friend's starter, but it was a terrible, gooey mess, and his bread recipe was, too To add insult to injury, it never rose!

 

Sourdough Pizza Crusts:

Thanks for the recipe.  Have you tried the pizza crusts on a baking stone?  I'm wondering if you would put olive oil on the stone first or just put the pizza crust directly on the stone?

I've never used a baking stone and don't really know how they work.  If the olive oil runs off of it though, I guess you could dust it with flour or cornmeal to prevent sticking.

I've never put oil on a pizza stone for any recipe. Olive oil would smoke like gangbusters at the temp I run my pizzas at, anyway.

We don't either.   If the stone is hot (and it takes a while for it to get up to temp) it doesn't tend to stick.  You can use cornmeal or parchment paper if you want.

Pizza stones make a really nice crust.  Try 'em.  And they'll last forever (as long as you don't start a big fire in your gas grill and end up spraying a fire extinguisher on them.)

[decibelle]

A large cast iron pan turned upside down works just as well as a pizza stone. :)

[GuitarStv]

Pancake update - fry them up in coconut oil instead of butter.   OMG good . . .

[clutchy]

You can also get free sourdough starter from 1847 source if you don't want to go down the path of making your own.

And if you have a good one with it's own intricate/delicious tastes, you can spread it out thin, let it dry a bit, crunch it up and share it with your friends.

Wow that's amazing!  What a find.

Sourdough is my favorite bread but the acid buildup from it is almost intolerable.  I think I'm still going to try this. :)

[gimp]

A large cast iron pan turned upside down works just as well as a pizza stone. :)

And turned right-side-up works too! And lets you make deep dish if you want.

I suspect upside-down makes for better thin crust. What kind of pizza do you make on it?

[decibelle]

A large cast iron pan turned upside down works just as well as a pizza stone. :)

And turned right-side-up works too! And lets you make deep dish if you want.

I suspect upside-down makes for better thin crust. What kind of pizza do you make on it?

I like to make Neapolitan style, usually a simple Margherita.  I should experiment with deep dish since I've never made it. 

Great idea a few post above using coconut oil to cook the sourdough pancakes!

[Mr. Minsc]

Cool, I'll put this on my "to do" list. :)

[Dr.Vibrissae]

Our sourdough starter "Lars" was accidentally slain by our roommate, recently.  I think we will wait until he moves out to start another one, since he is not very mustachian and has taken over the fridge with condiments and leftovers he doesn't eat because he likes to order out.

But I am eager to try the pancakes, and can personally vouch for the yumminess of the homemade English muffins. (In fact I was dismayed one night by watching my friends BF devour 10 in one sitting after I offered them to try.  He ate my breakfast for the week!)

[GuitarStv]

Our sourdough starter "Lars" was accidentally slain by our roommate, recently.  I think we will wait until he moves out to start another one, since he is not very mustachian and has taken over the fridge with condiments and leftovers he doesn't eat because he likes to order out.

But I am eager to try the pancakes, and can personally vouch for the yumminess of the homemade English muffins. (In fact I was dismayed one night by watching my friends BF devour 10 in one sitting after I offered them to try.  He ate my breakfast for the week!)

Your starter might not be totally dead . . . I've brought mine back from the brink once already (it had turned colours and started smelling funny . . . well, funnier than usual).  Just keep it on the counter keep tossing half and feeding it twice a day for 2-3 days.  It's remarkably resilient stuff.

[Dr.Vibrissae]

Well, Lars was overheated in the oven, where he was resting due to a lack of counter space when the roommate drunkenly decided to cook some bean dip.  The Mr. attempted to revive him for a day.  Next time we'll try for a longer resucitation :) (Even worse: the bean dip was terrible.)

[tomatoprincess]

Made some sour dough bread today, rising now, hope it works!

[Beardog]

I've made my first loaves and am looking forward to trying the pancakes next.  Thank you for posting this wonderful thread.  I have a question about making the starter.  The ratio of 2 parts flour to one part water makes a very thick paste that I'm finding difficult to mix.  In fact, I have ended up adding some extra water.  Do you have a good technique for mixing the flour and water at the ratios recommended?  Thank you!

[NumberCruncher]

I've made my first loaves and am looking forward to trying the pancakes next.  Thank you for posting this wonderful thread.  I have a question about making the starter.  The ratio of 2 parts flour to one part water makes a very thick paste that I'm finding difficult to mix.  In fact, I have ended up adding some extra water.  Do you have a good technique for mixing the flour and water at the ratios recommended?  Thank you!

I keep mine around pancake batter consistency. I don't actually know the ratio as I don't measure it out, but what I've seen from other places on the web a 1:1 ratio seems common. It really just matters on personal preference. I keep mine in the fridge, which makes it hard to stir if it's much thicker.

Sourdough will put up with all sorts of different behaviors. I'm just finding out myself! I've made another loaf of sourdough that I left to rise while going to work. It turned out great!

[Beardog]

Thank you, NumberCruncher.  Good to know how accommodating sourdough is!

[worms]

Yes, mine is about pancake batter consistency too.  Good cooking is art, not science, so don't get hung up on the proportions!

I just throw in some more flour and water every day or so and give it a good stir.  It lives in the kitchen normally and when it risks outgrowing its jar, I pour half into a jug, stir in an egg, some sugar and a splash of oil, fold in some bicarb and make hotcakes.

[GuitarStv]

I've made my first loaves and am looking forward to trying the pancakes next.  Thank you for posting this wonderful thread.  I have a question about making the starter.  The ratio of 2 parts flour to one part water makes a very thick paste that I'm finding difficult to mix.  In fact, I have ended up adding some extra water.  Do you have a good technique for mixing the flour and water at the ratios recommended?  Thank you!

I like my sourdough mix a bit on the thick side . . . not quite doughy, but thicker than pancake batter.  Thinner will work just fine, but it seems to last longer if you forget it on the counter for a couple days when it's thicker consistency.  That said, the 2-1 ratio is kinda a rough guide, I usually just eyeball the flour and water these days.  As long as it's bubbling and rising I think you're cool.

[Mr. Minsc]

My second batch of sourdough loaves just came out of the oven a short time ago.  I foresee my breadmaker getting increasingly less use in the future. ;)

Don't some quick searching I came across this website. http://www.sourdoughhome.com/  I found it very informative, does a good job of telling the "whys" of sourdough. :)

[NumberCruncher]

My second batch of sourdough loaves just came out of the oven a short time ago.  I foresee my breadmaker getting increasingly less use in the future. ;)

Don't some quick searching I came across this website. http://www.sourdoughhome.com/  I found it very informative, does a good job of telling the "whys" of sourdough. :)

Yes, seconded!

If I'm not mistaken, the author very much emphasizes the art part of sourdough baking too -- saying the best bread is made by hand because you get to know the dough and know exactly when it's had enough. I still really love my breadmaker for kneading, though. I'm sure I'm doing something wrong when kneading by hand that makes my loaves very dry, but that's a problem for another year when I'm out of school and have free time. :)

[GuitarStv]

http://www.sourdoughhome.com/  I found it very informative, does a good job of telling the "whys" of sourdough. :)

That's a great website!  I've made their sourdough carrot/pineapple and cream cheese icing cupcakes and they were AWESOME!  Definitely recommend them to try . . .

My second batch of sourdough loaves just came out of the oven a short time ago.  I foresee my breadmaker getting increasingly less use in the future. ;)

Don't some quick searching I came across this website. http://www.sourdoughhome.com/  I found it very informative, does a good job of telling the "whys" of sourdough. :)

I'm sure I'm doing something wrong when kneading by hand that makes my loaves very dry, but that's a problem for another year when I'm out of school and have free time. :)

Dry loaf = too much flour kneaded in.

You want to keep adding flour while kneading the bread just to the point where the bread is no longer ripping off and sticking to your hands.  It should still feel a touch moist.  I kinda do most of my sourdough baking by feel rather than recipe these days!

[m8547]

I made sourdough waffles this morning, and they were delicious!
http://www.kingarthurflour.com/recipes/classic-sourdough-waffles-or-pancakes-recipe

[Mr. Minsc]

Made sourdough pancakes this morning.  There's no going back now.

[zinnie]

Good thread! I am starting this later today; I have always wanted to do sourdough!