Is my driveway beyond DIY repairs?

[feelingroovy]

I have a rental house with a driveway that needs a bit of TLC.  See pics.

It clearly needs a new level of asphalt.  $3200 is the best estimate from a contractor to totally resurface.

The big issue is safety--there are no real potholes, but there are a lot of dips, cracks, and sunken areas--it's very uneven.

I'm not worried about it being pretty, just safe.

We've added some cold-asphalt repair stuff (http://www.lowes.com/pd_134917-36498-MRN12_4294715704__?productId=3656652&Ntt=asphalt&pl=1&currentURL=%3FNtt%3Dasphalt&facetInfo=) to fill in the worst of the holes.  The tenants are still complaining that it's unsafe. 

We're already filled in with 20 bags and we can certainly get 20 or 30 more and it will cost a heck of a lot less than $3200.  I've searched for local companies to just deliver real asphalt and do the raking and tamping ourselves (Home Depot rents the tamping mahine) but there don't seem to be any.

Do I just bite the bullet or is there another creative option out there?  Could I just put gravel over the old asphalt to get everything level?

Would my DIY attempts just look and work so terribly that we should hire it out?

[fireferrets]

If it's just a safety thing, maybe you can cover the driveway and fill in the potholes with gravel?
Not sure if that's a viable solution as I'm not a homeowner, but I thought I'd give my input. Good luck!

[GuitarStv]

My experience is that patching big potholes in driveways is always a temporary solution.  The patches leave cracks around the edges and don't bond well with the driveway beneath . . . then in the winter water gets into the cracks, freezes, and pushes them up a bit . . . then a car drives over them and breaks off chunks of the patch.  If it needs to be resurfaced, it needs to be resurfaced.  If you have very mild winters this might not apply.

[Thegoblinchief]

That doesn't look unsafe to me, but obviously you want happy tenants.

In my experience, DIY concrete or asphalt patches don't last for shit if you have freeze thaw cycles, just like GuitarStv said.

[Overseas Stache]

Unsafe for what? Humans were made to walk on uneven terrain surely your tenants can walk to the mailbox and back without falling down. Oh and I have no experience resurfacing driveways and nothing useful to add except that: Humans be soft yo!!

[Le Barbu]

It doesnt look unsafe at all unless your tenant have a serious handicap. If you want to improve things anyway, its your own choice. What are the dimentions of the driveway (square foot) ? 3k seems a lot for resurfacing. Maybe have another quotation...

The other choices are:

Leave it that way and patch holes and cracs when they grow to much

Remove asphalt and put 4" of some nice and clean gravel

The house look pretty good and maintained, I woud rent it anytime and never complain about the driveway. By the way, this kind of improvement do not increase potential value or rental.

[ncornilsen]

The issue is that they can't just resurface that driveway, it'll look like hell in no time. The subgrade for the pavement has failed and needs replaced, which is likely the reason for the $3200 quote.

-Nick

[feelingroovy]

Thanks, everyone.

Yeah, I don't think it's unsafe either (at least for most of us).  The (new) tenant who has issue with it has a feeble elderly mother who lives with her.  She is someone who has trouble (but can) go up the one 6" step to the porch.  She apparently tripped when getting out of a car right into that dip in pic #1 and this freaked out the daughter.  She is speaking to legal aid.  I've checked and I am pretty sure we're not legally responsible but I don't want anyone getting hurt either.

The previous tenants also complained about the driveway, but they were very picky about how things looked.  The two houses next door were just built and have beautiful brand-new driveways.  The neighborhood is mostly owner occupied and very well kept up. 

We're seriously thinking of selling next spring when this tenant's lease is up, so yes, we need it safe for them and also I don't want it looking like the crappiest house in the neighborhood. 

We do have nasty winters--it's getting almost too late in the year to do anything. 

[feelingroovy]

The issue is that they can't just resurface that driveway, it'll look like hell in no time. The subgrade for the pavement has failed and needs replaced, which is likely the reason for the $3200 quote.

-Nick

Thanks, Nick.  You're right.  That strip in pic #1 that sunk in was from when the town put in a storm sewer upgrade 10+ years ago (before we owned the house).  I suspect they didn't do the substrate correctly.  But also the edges of the driveway have sunk, so it's probably the whole thing.

But no, the estimate ($3200 was the *lowest*) is to patch up broken edges, hot tar all cracks, then add 2 inches asphalt to the  top.  That's not including doing anything to the base.

So with the intention of selling in the spring and keeping it reasonably safe for elderly mom now, it seems our reasonable options are to patch ourselves, fill cracks, and maybe seal it.  Or rip it all out and put it gravel.

[Le Barbu]

considering all this, dont put 3,200$ to resurface neither remove everything to put gravel. do your best to patch holes and craks, spend no more than 200$ to do so. you will not have any legal issue in the current state of your driveway and woud at best recover 25% out of the full job price when selling next year.

[Rage]

This driveway seems like a giant bummer.  How much would it cost to haul it away, clean up the substrate and put down gravel?  Would a gravel driveway be any better for the little old lady? 

Sounds like you don't really care much about the property, but if you did, hauling away the asphault and laying in bricks that you recover from somewhere would be DIY and potentially very cheap as long as you don't just go buy the bricks at home depot.  Even then it might not be horribly expensive.

There are also pavers designed to be laid for a driveway that allow grass to grow through.  Apparently better for the environment too - driveway runoff goes into the ground instead of into the storm system. 

[GuitarStv]

You can not pave with regular bricks, especially in a place with freeze/thaw cycles.  All the bricks will crack and be damaged within a year.  Pavers work great, but if you have grass growing through it's going to shift and move them around.  Then when you go to shovel the snow off it's a real PITA . . . your shovel gets caught on multiple paver edges with every push.  It also means it's difficult to walk on because of the uneven surface.

[Left]

hm, what about ripping the area up and laying down sidewalk slabs? It almost looks like the right size, you can use the concrete mix to fill in gap and paint the entire thing black. I mention the sidewalk because it doesn't look like there is one there already and the tenants might like one? You can lay down some stepping stones once off the driveway that wraps around to the back of the house/front porch or something so you don't have a 10' "sidewalk" in the middle of the driveway.

Or turn it into a "speed" bump? And say it helps keep the cars from rolling into the street if there's ice? (not sure this is entirely legal/moral)

[Rage]

I forgot about shoveling snow.  It can indeed be a PITA with pavers.

[Spork]

I've had reasonable success with the cold patch (but I'm down south where we have less ice/snow).  I also have not done more than little patches.

I did one repair of large repaving (and added a parking spot) ... and it cost me WAY more then $3200... so... $3200 is high, but not unreasonable (IMO) if they were repaving that whole area.

What about the various asphalt sealers?  Does anyone have any experience with those to seal off the cracks/edges of patches?  How DIY friendly are those? 

[FrugalSpendthrift]

That's what my driveway looks like.  I also want to replace it, but can't justify the cost.  There's a big tree root pushing it up in one spot, but I never thought about any safety concerns.

[so.mpls]

I did asphalt work as a summer job in college, ~3-5 years ago.  Don't let anyone put 2" of asphalt over the top of that, it will just make the problem worse in the long run.  Especially not for $3200.

Your options as I see them are: 

a) Buy cold patch, crack filler, and sealant, and fix it yourself.  You should be able to smooth it out to the point where it isn't dangerous.  This won't hold up terribly well, but a good quality sealant will help a bit.  You'll probably have to repeat this process once per year or it'll deteriorate back to this condition. Will cost a couple hundred dollars.

b) Hire a contractor to completely re-do the driveway.  Depending on the size (looks like 700-1,000 sq ft or so?), you should be able to get someone to do this for 3-5k. 

Hope this helps.
 

[feelingroovy]

Thanks so much everyone.  This is incredibly helpful.

More data:

The driveway is ~1200 sq ft (I didn't measure, but that's what one of the estimates says and it sounds about right).

We've already put on about $250 worth of cold patch.  It seems that spending another $250 to continue to fill in the dips and to fill cracks and to seal will be $ well spent.

FWIW, we do care about the house and over the past 10 years have done a LOT of improvements, including a new roof, refinishing hardwood floors, a new garage door, re-staining the deck, upgrading kitchens and baths.  I could go on.   We set aside a certain amount from the rent for repairs and improvements each month.  The driveway has always been on the list to repair, but it just kept getting pushed from the top as other issues needed more immediate attention.  Now everything else is looking pretty good, the driveway has become the sore spot. 

I don't mind paying for needed repairs, but I do hate to throw a lot of money on a repair that won't hold up and won't help resale.  If another couple hundred (and a bit of work) will hold it until spring and won't turn off potential buyers, that seems like the best option. 

[Le Barbu]

I don't mind paying for needed repairs, but I do hate to throw a lot of money on a repair that won't hold up and won't help resale.  If another couple hundred (and a bit of work) will hold it until spring and won't turn off potential buyers, that seems like the best option.

Exactly why I think you just find the best option. At most 25% recovering for a drviway on resale. Easier to find a buyer ? I dont know, you'll see when you get some visits !

[Fishindude]

Looks like there wasn't much stone base there and they put in a really thin asphalt drive, so it is just worn out as would be expected.
You can keep band-aiding it along like you are doing almost indefinitely.  It's going to look ugly but I'd take that over gravel.

The correct fix is complete removal and replacement with new stone base and at least 2-3" of new asphalt.   Poured concrete would be more money, but it will outlast asphalt and no sealing will be required.    Paver stones or brick isn't a real good idea.   Take a pro to do that right and done correctly will be quite expensive.