Author Topic: I need suggestions with a home repair project.  (Read 1925 times)

carloco

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I need suggestions with a home repair project.
« on: October 28, 2018, 08:30:27 PM »
When this house was built I suspect the lower level room was a carport.  At some point it was converted to a rec room/den.  The floor is concrete slab. In front of the house the previous owner built a planter.  When it rains a lot the carpet in the room on one corner gets damp.  I am trying to stop water from getting in that room.
I have removed a lot of the bricks to see how I can fix this problem.
Would itbee wise to clean all the dirt well, apply waterproof material, a layer of cement even with the driveway, and another coat of waterproof paint like dryloc.


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Re: I need suggestions with a home repair project.
« Reply #1 on: October 29, 2018, 04:14:40 AM »

I'm assuming you have satisfied yourself that there are no broken or dripping water or sewage pipes within several yards of the problem.  So then we are looking at the way the house is built.  Is the damp coming in 1) up through the floor, 2) through the wall, or 3) where the wall and floor meet?  The answer might be different for each. 

Getting rid of the planter looks like a good start.  If the wall and concrete floor were properly built with a damp proof course, then the damp problem is likely to be that the planter allowed damp to pass through the wall above the level of the damp proof course.  If so, then taking away the planter, letting the wall dry out and then repointing the wall could be all that is needed - I'd be tempted to try that first.

If the damp persists after that then there was a problem with the way either the wall or floor was built, which is beyond my knowledge to solve for you.

MrSal

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Re: I need suggestions with a home repair project.
« Reply #2 on: October 29, 2018, 10:10:17 AM »
is the dirt in direct contact with the bricks?

If it is, those bricks are absorbing all the water and passing it through the wall! You need to isolate the wall from any sippage possible..I would try applying a water membrane and then maybe XPS foam rated for foundations. Gravel underneath the dirt and maybe drill a few sippage holes away from house. It might help ...

CCCA

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Re: I need suggestions with a home repair project.
« Reply #3 on: October 29, 2018, 12:09:28 PM »
A couple of things come to mind.  How is the cement sloped?  Does water run towards the house when it rains on that walkway/driveway?  If it flows towards the house, that will be problematic.  If so, you might want to look at how to prevent water from flowing up to the house.


Are you wanting to keep a planter box there?  I'd suggest against it since it's clear that it holds moisture up against the house. 


If getting rid of the planter box and sloping runoff away from the house doesn't help, I've seen folks dig down below that area and install gravel and a french drain and a moisture barrier to prevent water from seeping into the house.

Jon Bon

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Re: I need suggestions with a home repair project.
« Reply #4 on: October 29, 2018, 12:11:01 PM »
If I am seeing that right it sure looks like negative grading to me, which would fix 95% of your issue.  Does water pool in that area between bricks and driveway?

So fix the grading or in your case add a drain right next to the house? I think a driveway drain might be good here.

Other folks here are also right, bricks and concrete or super porous and going to wick that water right up to your carpet. I would also peel that carpet back, my guess is you will not like what you find.

MrSal

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Re: I need suggestions with a home repair project.
« Reply #5 on: October 29, 2018, 01:08:54 PM »
If I am seeing that right it sure looks like negative grading to me, which would fix 95% of your issue.  Does water pool in that area between bricks and driveway?

So fix the grading or in your case add a drain right next to the house? I think a driveway drain might be good here.

Other folks here are also right, bricks and concrete or super porous and going to wick that water right up to your carpet. I would also peel that carpet back, my guess is you will not like what you find.

I agree. If the carpet is wet I can't imagine what the inside of those walls look like! Those bricks will absorb a lot of the water in the planter and wick all the way inside!

carloco

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Re: I need suggestions with a home repair project.
« Reply #6 on: October 29, 2018, 05:54:33 PM »

I'm assuming you have satisfied yourself that there are no broken or dripping water or sewage pipes within several yards of the problem.  So then we are looking at the way the house is built.  Is the damp coming in 1) up through the floor, 2) through the wall, or 3) where the wall and floor meet?  The answer might be different for each. 

3) it appears to be coming underneath the block that is above the concrete slab that is the floor to the room behind the planter. 
Getting rid of the planter looks like a good start.  If the wall and concrete floor were properly built with a damp proof course, then the damp problem is likely to be that the planter allowed damp to pass through the wall above the level of the damp proof course.  If so, then taking away the planter, letting the wall dry out and then repointing the wall could be all that is needed - I'd be tempted to try that first.

If the damp persists after that then there was a problem with the way either the wall or floor was built, which is beyond my knowledge to solve for you.

carloco

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Re: I need suggestions with a home repair project.
« Reply #7 on: October 29, 2018, 05:58:55 PM »
A couple of things come to mind.  How is the cement sloped?  Does water run towards the house when it rains on that walkway/driveway?  If it flows towards the house, that will be problematic.  If so, you might want to look at how to prevent water from flowing up to the house.

the water runs down and around the house.  the problem is that the bottom of the the planter is the concrete slab that is the floor of the room behind the wall.   I think water once inside the planter seeps in between the brick and the floor.


Are you wanting to keep a planter box there?  I'd suggest against it since it's clear that it holds moisture up against the house. 

NO I am getting rid of it..


If getting rid of the planter box and sloping runoff away from the house doesn't help, I've seen folks dig down below that area and install gravel and a french drain and a moisture barrier to prevent water from seeping into the house.

carloco

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Re: I need suggestions with a home repair project.
« Reply #8 on: October 29, 2018, 06:13:45 PM »
Thanks for the replies and suggestions.  I suspect that because it was a carport there is some kind of slope away from the room.  The problem is that the driveway is built up above the level of the original concrete slab.  I am hoping that if fill the foot print of the planter and apply a waterproof paint like dryloc to the brick it will be enough to keep water from getting in that room.

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Re: I need suggestions with a home repair project.
« Reply #9 on: October 30, 2018, 06:15:46 AM »
it appears to be coming underneath the block that is above the concrete slab that is the floor to the room behind the planter. 

OK.  Generally speaking, all houses should have a foundation level which may or may not be damp depending on the condition of the ground it stands on, and a level above the foundations which is part of the house structure and which should not be damp.  Between the two layers there should be a form of waterproofing, which I know as a "damp proof course" which stops damp from foundations from wicking up into the house.  The damp proof course should be above ground level, so that damp from the ground can't wick into the house through the walls from damp ground above the damp proof course. 

Usually this damp proof course will be at one single level all around the structure, and should be obvious once you start looking, but when there have been alterations it can be at different levels and that can cause problems.  (I'm assuming no basement here, which is a complication I've never had to deal with.)  I'm hoping here for your sake that the concrete pad which used to be the carport has a waterproof layer of some sort to prevent damp from coming up from underneath, and even better if it was part of the original construction.  But as a car port, there would not have been walls.  So the new walls may have been built without a dampproof layer.  If they were built on top of a concrete pad which did have a dampproof layer that's not a problem.  If they were built straight onto the ground, or on a concrete pad which could itself become damp then that is a problem.  From what you say, the damp is coming in at or above the level of the pad, so I think you are basically all right, with walls built on top of a waterproof pad.

That means that your big question is: how are the relative levels between inside and outside?  I'm seeing 9 courses of brick below the window sill and above the tarmac, but the tarmac appears to be covering at least one more level of brick.  So how does the level of tarmac outside relate to the level of the concrete pad/level of the damp proof course for the rest of the house?  It looks to me as though the problem is that there is damp ground outside which is wicking damp through the wall/bottom of the wall.

There will be a way for damp to get in as long as there is material against the outside wall which is above the level of the damp proof course/level of waterproofing in the concrete pad.  The permanent solution is to dig out the tarmac against the wall down to the below the level of the waterproofing, so that there is no damp material against the wall at all.  If that leaves a deep trench against the wall that you can't live with then the answer is a dutch drain/french drain as suggested by CCCA.

Waterproof paint (only once the wall has dried out, otherwise you are just sealing the damp in) may only be a temporary solution, if there is still a way for damp to get into or under the wall because the ground level outside is too high relative to the damp proofing.

carloco

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Re: I need suggestions with a home repair project.
« Reply #10 on: October 30, 2018, 10:41:14 AM »
I should say that the dirt on the right side facing the house was dry.  I had removed the dirt from the right side and the little left in there was moist.  That’s the only area that gets wet inside the room. On that left corner.

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Re: I need suggestions with a home repair project.
« Reply #11 on: October 30, 2018, 11:57:40 AM »
I should say that the dirt on the right side facing the house was dry.  I had removed the dirt from the right side and the little left in there was moist.  That’s the only area that gets wet inside the room. On that left corner.

OK, so you've probably found the problem: the damp was wicking through the wall from that damp dirt.  Now it's gone, let the wall dry out, repoint and waterproof if you like.  Don't allow any more dirt to pile up against the wall at that level, at any point around the house, and you probably won't have any more problems.

carloco

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Re: I need suggestions with a home repair project.
« Reply #12 on: October 30, 2018, 01:10:03 PM »
Thanks, and what about the concrete  slab being below the grade of the asphalt? Water would puddle in there.  Should I paint the brick and slab and then fill it with concrete up to the asphalt?

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Re: I need suggestions with a home repair project.
« Reply #13 on: October 30, 2018, 03:57:31 PM »
The problem with painting waterproofing on brick is that it will probably fail over time if it is against a constantly damp environment, as it sounds as though it might be.  There might be some building material that forms a damp proof membrane which you could fasten against the wall at the level the damp gets in, but fastening a fabric to a wall so that it is truly waterproof all around could be difficult, I would have thought.

Ideally you would reduce the height of the ground around the house to below where the damp is getting in (although not below the foundations, because that gives you a whole new set of problems by upsetting their stability!).  If you can't do this, what you probably want is a French drain/Dutch drain - google for instructions.  Don't put any new concrete or asphalt alongside the walls if it would be above the concrete slab- you would just be recreating the conditions for damp to continue to wick into the wall while making it more difficult to carry out any future work.

If you look up French drains, along the outside of the house you probably need to dig a trench.  The trench needs to have the bottom below the point at which damp can get into the room. You then put a perforated pipe in the bottom of the trench, backfill with gravel.  Make sure that gravity ensures that the end of the pipe drains well away from the house.  Water is thus directed away from the house, hopefully enough that the house walls are not sitting in damp.  Because the walls are drier, painting waterproofing on the walls before backfilling the drain would work better than if the painted waterproofing were in a constantly damp environment.  What you would end up with would look like a strip of gravel maybe a foot wide along the bottom of the wall, probably to a height a bit below the asphalt.

Where I live, I think these sorts of drains are fairly frequently used for houses which were either built without modern damp proofing, or where the land around the house has risen over time.

Jon Bon

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Re: I need suggestions with a home repair project.
« Reply #14 on: October 31, 2018, 04:58:16 AM »
Yeah I don't love drylock either. You are treating the sympthoms not the disease.

Go get a 4 foot level and find out where the water is going and the easiest way to get it to go where you want too.

Based on the info we have you need better grading, which might not be an option with the driveway. So you need an active drain of some sort. Your local big box has many options.

 

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