Author Topic: Floor register next to bathroom tub  (Read 3351 times)

StashingAway

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Floor register next to bathroom tub
« on: April 08, 2020, 01:09:32 PM »
The other floor register thread reminded me that I have been playing with some options.

I will doing a moderate update of our bathroom this summer. In this bathroom, built in the 90's, there is a floor HVAC register right next to the tub. It seems like an odd placement to me, because any puddling of water on the floor seems likely to end up in the ducting. I have no evidence that this is causing any problems, but it's one of those things that has me scratching my head.

So, as I see it I have a few options.
  • leave well enough alone and just assume that the code and builders have some reasoning behind the maddness. If it ain't broke...
  • run the ducting to a wall and put in a wall register. Seems way excessive, but now's the time to do it if I want to
  • cap the register and have it an HVAC free zone. I will be putting in a quality ceiling vent for moisture regulation anyway

Any thoughts?

Wrenchturner

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Re: Floor register next to bathroom tub
« Reply #1 on: April 08, 2020, 01:50:47 PM »
Can you see how the ducting is routed and simply move the vent to a different spot on the plenum?

Dogastrophe

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Re: Floor register next to bathroom tub
« Reply #2 on: April 08, 2020, 04:11:33 PM »
We had a floor register in our main bath - was about 2 feet from both the toilet and tub.  Wanna know what happens when the 2nd floor toilet overflows.


Spoiler: show
It rains in your basement workshop!  However it only happened once in 14 or so years otherwise we had no issues with its placement

lthenderson

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Re: Floor register next to bathroom tub
« Reply #3 on: April 08, 2020, 08:51:17 PM »
Well if you were redoing the floor and the joist direction was favorable, I would look at pulling up the subfloor and moving it but in my experience, most bathroom vents end up where they are located because of joist direction and all the other obstacles underneath the floors like drains and supply lines. To put in a wall vent versus a floor vent, you would be adding X amount of feet to the duct plus two right angles, all of which dramatically reduce airflow. Might not matter so much for a bathroom but something to consider. Also, with a wall vent in a bathroom with an exhaust fan, you would pretty much be sucking the conditioned air right out of the building and not doing much good when both are on at the same time.

If you are concerned, they make vent deflectors for them with magnets to hold them in place that would redirect any splashed water so it didn't go down the vent.

https://www.amazon.com/Home-Intuition-Adjustable-Deflector-Registers/dp/B0714QP65Y/

StashingAway

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Re: Floor register next to bathroom tub
« Reply #4 on: April 09, 2020, 07:20:26 AM »
Can you see how the ducting is routed and simply move the vent to a different spot on the plenum?

It's running perpendicular to the tub, but there's only about three feet between tub and wall so it would be a minimal move. But that's an interesting point: I think it would be pretty reasonable to route up to the wall coming from that duct run.

Also, with a wall vent in a bathroom with an exhaust fan, you would pretty much be sucking the conditioned air right out of the building and not doing much good when both are on at the same time.

Isn't it doing that anyway? I'm just moving an existing vent. Exhaust fan is already there and so is a duct, both original to the house...

The idea is just to exhaust the humid air when in use, correct?

StashingAway

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Re: Floor register next to bathroom tub
« Reply #5 on: April 09, 2020, 07:22:10 AM »
We had a floor register in our main bath - was about 2 feet from both the toilet and tub.  Wanna know what happens when the 2nd floor toilet overflows.

So what you're telling me is that I really need is an overflow moat around the vent with a controlled drainage; like those spillproof laptops!

What did you do with the register after the overflow incident? Cap it or leave as-is?

lthenderson

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Re: Floor register next to bathroom tub
« Reply #6 on: April 09, 2020, 08:08:12 AM »
Also, with a wall vent in a bathroom with an exhaust fan, you would pretty much be sucking the conditioned air right out of the building and not doing much good when both are on at the same time.

Isn't it doing that anyway? I'm just moving an existing vent. Exhaust fan is already there and so is a duct, both original to the house...

The idea is just to exhaust the humid air when in use, correct?

It is doing that anyway, but when the register is located on the floor, it is also conditioning the air between the floor and the exhaust fan on it way to being sucked out of the house. When you have a register mounted high up on the wall, it can't do nearly as much conditioning. But saying that, this is a minor consideration in my opinion. For me, the biggest consideration would just be if it is possible. and there are things in the floor and wall joist cavity to block it from being done.

Also, I tend not to worry about ducting on the floor and overflowing toilets. With modern toilet designs, the bowl can hold an entire tank full of water and not overflow so overflows are something of the past unless perhaps you have kids or adults who aren't really thinking and try to flush twice.  Even if there wasn't a vent there, I've never seen a bathroom floor tight enough to prevent water from leaking through to below. Generally it will run to the walls, under the baseboard, down to the subfloor and whatever is below.

lthenderson

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Re: Floor register next to bathroom tub
« Reply #7 on: April 09, 2020, 08:12:06 AM »
Just had a thought, if the floor flooding is a concern, most registers sit proud of the floor so one could run a bead of silicone around the bottom side of the flange before sitting it in place. This would mean any flooding would have to fill the entire floor to a depth of the top of the register before going down into the ductwork.

Dogastrophe

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Re: Floor register next to bathroom tub
« Reply #8 on: April 09, 2020, 08:25:08 AM »
We had a floor register in our main bath - was about 2 feet from both the toilet and tub.  Wanna know what happens when the 2nd floor toilet overflows.

So what you're telling me is that I really need is an overflow moat around the vent with a controlled drainage; like those spillproof laptops!

What did you do with the register after the overflow incident? Cap it or leave as-is?

I left it as is.  Reminded my wife where the toilet water supply shut off valve was and explained the importance of getting it turned off if the bowl water started to rise.  We only had a single issue in entire time we lived in house.

StashingAway

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Re: Floor register next to bathroom tub
« Reply #9 on: April 09, 2020, 09:50:48 AM »
We had a floor register in our main bath - was about 2 feet from both the toilet and tub.  Wanna know what happens when the 2nd floor toilet overflows.

So what you're telling me is that I really need is an overflow moat around the vent with a controlled drainage; like those spillproof laptops!

What did you do with the register after the overflow incident? Cap it or leave as-is?

I left it as is.  Reminded my wife where the toilet water supply shut off valve was and explained the importance of getting it turned off if the bowl water started to rise.  We only had a single issue in entire time we lived in house.

Hmmm. I'm tempted to do the same, then. It looks pretty clear in there, and running the HVAC surely dries out what little water gets splashed in there. Thanks!

StashingAway

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Re: Floor register next to bathroom tub
« Reply #10 on: April 09, 2020, 09:51:40 AM »
Just had a thought, if the floor flooding is a concern, most registers sit proud of the floor so one could run a bead of silicone around the bottom side of the flange before sitting it in place. This would mean any flooding would have to fill the entire floor to a depth of the top of the register before going down into the ductwork.

I like it! That's what I'm going to do.

Dicey

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Re: Floor register next to bathroom tub
« Reply #11 on: April 09, 2020, 10:25:34 AM »
While we're on the subject, it's wise to replace the shutoff valves and supply hoses. Those failures are typically much more serious than overflowing toilets or bathtubs. Cheap insurance.

lthenderson

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Re: Floor register next to bathroom tub
« Reply #12 on: April 09, 2020, 01:17:36 PM »
While we're on the subject, it's wise to replace the shutoff valves and supply hoses. Those failures are typically much more serious than overflowing toilets or bathtubs. Cheap insurance.

Normally whenever I go to yank a toilet, I find that I can't completely shut off the cheapo gate valves that everyone uses. They get gunked up and can't completely seal off the water. So I am forced to replace them with nice ball valves whether I want to or not. I've always wished those cheap gate valves were banned from being sold.  This is why I have a bin of solder on ball valves in my garage.

StashingAway

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Re: Floor register next to bathroom tub
« Reply #13 on: April 10, 2020, 06:18:46 AM »
While we're on the subject, it's wise to replace the shutoff valves and supply hoses. Those failures are typically much more serious than overflowing toilets or bathtubs. Cheap insurance.

Normally whenever I go to yank a toilet, I find that I can't completely shut off the cheapo gate valves that everyone uses. They get gunked up and can't completely seal off the water. So I am forced to replace them with nice ball valves whether I want to or not. I've always wished those cheap gate valves were banned from being sold.  This is why I have a bin of solder on ball valves in my garage.

+1, although I have started using the press-on "shark bite" ball valves. If they're good enough to meet code for internal wall plumbing, they're good enough for my kitchen and bathroom ;). I'm perhaps overly eager to let my soldering equipment get dusty

Papa bear

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Re: Floor register next to bathroom tub
« Reply #14 on: April 10, 2020, 08:01:33 AM »
While we're on the subject, it's wise to replace the shutoff valves and supply hoses. Those failures are typically much more serious than overflowing toilets or bathtubs. Cheap insurance.

Normally whenever I go to yank a toilet, I find that I can't completely shut off the cheapo gate valves that everyone uses. They get gunked up and can't completely seal off the water. So I am forced to replace them with nice ball valves whether I want to or not. I've always wished those cheap gate valves were banned from being sold.  This is why I have a bin of solder on ball valves in my garage.

+1, although I have started using the press-on "shark bite" ball valves. If they're good enough to meet code for internal wall plumbing, they're good enough for my kitchen and bathroom ;). I'm perhaps overly eager to let my soldering equipment get dusty
Where are they approved for in wall?  That’s definitely not true in my state.  I’m fine with their use where you have them, but in wall? Not a chance.


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lthenderson

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Re: Floor register next to bathroom tub
« Reply #15 on: April 10, 2020, 07:44:43 PM »
While Shark Bite fittings are approved for the Universal Plumbing Code which many state codes are based upon, I have found many states (including my own) leave out the push/pull fitting section thus making them not to code at the state level even though you can readily buy them in stores.

Personally I would never use one buried in a wall because the connection is dependent on a rubber o-ring inside that gets exposed to chlorine in many water supplies.  Chlorine, rubber and long periods of time are not associated with each other for good reason.

StashingAway

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Re: Floor register next to bathroom tub
« Reply #16 on: April 12, 2020, 09:44:50 AM »
While Shark Bite fittings are approved for the Universal Plumbing Code which many state codes are based upon, I have found many states (including my own) leave out the push/pull fitting section thus making them not to code at the state level even though you can readily buy them in stores.

Personally I would never use one buried in a wall because the connection is dependent on a rubber o-ring inside that gets exposed to chlorine in many water supplies.  Chlorine, rubber and long periods of time are not associated with each other for good reason.

Interesting, I didn't know that! I would never bury them in walls either (I'll begrudgingly solder those, lol), but for exposed fittings like on the toilet I have been quite happy with them. Time may prove me wrong, though, because I've only really used them in the last couple of years.

lthenderson

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Re: Floor register next to bathroom tub
« Reply #17 on: April 12, 2020, 08:18:16 PM »
While Shark Bite fittings are approved for the Universal Plumbing Code which many state codes are based upon, I have found many states (including my own) leave out the push/pull fitting section thus making them not to code at the state level even though you can readily buy them in stores.

Personally I would never use one buried in a wall because the connection is dependent on a rubber o-ring inside that gets exposed to chlorine in many water supplies.  Chlorine, rubber and long periods of time are not associated with each other for good reason.

Interesting, I didn't know that! I would never bury them in walls either (I'll begrudgingly solder those, lol), but for exposed fittings like on the toilet I have been quite happy with them. Time may prove me wrong, though, because I've only really used them in the last couple of years.

I think the big advantage of Shark Bite fittings is that it has opened the doors for more DIY people to tackle plumbing jobs that they ordinarily wouldn't have attempted before. Assuming failures were caught in a timely manner and didn't cause damage, you could probably replace a Shark bite fitting every five years for the rest of your life and not come close to paying a professional plumber to come and solder the same joint once.