Author Topic: The beatles Case Study  (Read 262733 times)

1967mama

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #100 on: January 08, 2017, 11:08:44 AM »

Wish people would post a sample daily menu their family eats, including drinks and snacks.

Here's what we typically eat in the 1967 family!

Breakfast:
Oatmeal (from scratch, not packets) with toppings that I keep in a box with tiny jars of: brown sugar, craisins, raisins, blanched almonds, coconut (I can hear 1967dada chopping apples right now for the oatmeal!)
Homemade granola (sometimes with milk, sometimes over yogurt) - buy a full sized container, not little cups of yogurt)
Toast
Eggs and toast
Eggs and bacon
Eggs and sausages

Lunch:
Any leftovers reheated
Homemade bread from the freezer - sandwiches: pbj, chicken salad, egg salad, ham (from a whole ham), cheese and cucumber, grilled cheese
Soup made with frozen bone broth from chicken bones
Homemade pizza
Eggs (poached, fried, scrambled, put in a wrap with grated cheese)

Dinner:
A whole roasted chicken with carrots and potatoes
Spaghetti and meat sauce
Chili and buns with raw veggies
Casserole with bits of chicken, veggies and rice
Homemade hamburgers on the grill (and homemade buns)
Beef stew with biscuits
Chicken stew and dumplings
Curry

Snacks:
Smoothies (no mixes - frozen fruit - save those 1/2 pieces of fruit from the kids in a ziplock in the freezer and also chop up and freeze fruit that is about to go bad)
Popcorn
Homemade baked goods - cookies, homemade granola bars, the brownie mixes you have - use them up
Then make your own)
Fresh fruit cut up
Cheese cut into little squares

Drinks:
Milk
Water
Homemade iced tea and lemonade

ETA photo from today's breakfast. Those are the little jars I was mentioning with toppings for the oatmeal.
« Last Edit: January 08, 2017, 11:34:43 AM by 1967mama »

Bracken_Joy

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LadyMuMu

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #102 on: January 08, 2017, 11:15:15 AM »
Once you're done using up the food you already have, here's a sample shopping list and meal plan I made from the Budget Bytes website. It takes about 1 hour to make a new meal plan about once a month. I add it to the others I keep on Google Drive and rotate. Once you have five or six of these, you don't need to meal plan again.

Lunches:

Chunky Lentil and Veg Soup
http://www.budgetbytes.com/2014/01/chunky-lentil-vegetable-soup/

Slow Cooker Potato Soup
http://www.budgetbytes.com/2011/12/slow-cooker-potato-soup/


Dinner:
Creamy Spinach and Sausage Pasta
http://www.budgetbytes.com/2013/01/creamy-spinach-sausage-pasta/

Balsamic Chicken Thighs
http://www.budgetbytes.com/2015/03/balsamic-chicken-thighs/
With Skillet Potatoes and Green Beans
http://www.budgetbytes.com/2015/03/skillet-potatoes-and-green-beans/

Beef and Cabbage Stir Fry
http://www.budgetbytes.com/2016/08/beef-cabbage-stir-fry/
With Freezer Biscuits
http://www.budgetbytes.com/2016/10/5-ingredient-freezer-biscuits/

Sesame Glazed Salmon and Green Beans
http://www.budgetbytes.com/2015/11/sesame-glazed-salmon-and-green-beans/
With green salad



Produce
2 lb. fresh green beans
2 inch fresh ginger, grated or minced
½ head green cabbage
3 lb carrots
4 green onions
Garlic bulb
1.25 lbs. red creamer potatoes
Fresh parsley
3 yellow onion
Celery
3 lbs. Potatoes
3 cups fresh spinach

Dairy
1 pint heavy whipping cream
2 cups milk
1 cup (4 oz.) shredded monterrey jack

Meat
1 lb. salmon filet
1 lb. lean ground beef
6 boneless skinless chicken thighs
6 oz. smoked sausage

Canned Goods/Condiments

6 Tbsp soy sauce
2 Tbsp rice wine (mirin)
1 clove garlic, minced
2 Tbsp sriracha*
¼ C balsamic vinegar
8  cups chicken broth*
1 can black beans
1 cup lentils
1 (15 oz.) can petite diced tomatoes
4 C veggie broth
1 (14.5 oz.) can diced tomatoes w/chiles
8 oz. pasta


Baking Goods/Spices
3 cups all-purpose flour
Salt
Black Pepper
Sugar
5 Tbsp brown sugar
4 tsp baking powder
2 Tbsp sesame seeds
2 Tbsp toasted sesame oil
½ Tbsp neutral cooking oil
Olive Oil
Oregano
Cumin
Paprika
Cayenne pepper








RetiredAt63

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #103 on: January 08, 2017, 11:18:56 AM »
Given the work situation, there is no reason for you to be buying everyone a lunch.  The lunch is part of why we kept asking about work (that and your tax situation, we don't care or need to know what you do). 

If you like it because it is a chance for everyone to enjoy lunch together, there are alternatives:
1.  a pot luck - everyone brings something and you all share.  Either everyone will enjoy this and it will become a thing.  OR, suddenly it is work for the others, and it will fade out.
2.  Everyone brings their own lunch but you all get together at a set time and place (i.e. where and when you are now) and enjoy each others' company.

If it is always pizza and you don't want to talk $ to your office mates, just say you are trying to improve the quality of your diet and fast food is out - no pizza, no bought lunch, you are bringing in home-made now.

Which leads me to . . . . .
You should be taking a "brown bag" lunch - not buying food for lunch.  Is that what some of those restaurant charges are now?  Stop.  Plan dinner (with your wife) and plan for extras - you are not eating leftovers, you are eating planned-overs.  Or make things ahead just for lunches and grab a lunch each morning.  This means you and your wife have to talk - you don't want to eat lunch and find out you are having the same thing for dinner.  And if there is no fridge or microwave at work now, maybe the office as a whole can get them?  Also a coffee-maker so you are not all heading out for coffee on a regular basis.  At worst, it would be a good long-term investment for you to have a microwave in your office if no one else is interested, you can boil water for coffee/tea, heat up a lunch.  My gorgeous kitchen microwave cost me $20 on Kijiji, we are not talking a lot of money for this.

There are all sorts of ways to save money once you start looking for them.  And they are no harder or more time-consuming than what you are doing now.

marion10

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #104 on: January 08, 2017, 11:20:30 AM »
Good luck- you are going to have to make major changes in your lifestyle- the good news is you are young and can do it. I agree with the other poster about getting professional advice in negotiating with the IRS. Your lifestyle unfortunately reminds me of my sister and her husband who ignored over due taxes and had to pay many more times than the original amount. Now in their 50s- no money for retirement, no money for kids college- because they could not say no. Take Hawaii off the table- flying with a 2 and 4 year old all that way would be awful and they would not remember anyway.

PharmaStache

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #105 on: January 08, 2017, 11:21:00 AM »
Plenty of people on the forums have sub-$400/month grocery budgets with 4+ person families. Should be especially easy since your kids are so young- you still have a ton of power to shape their tastes.

Here are some threads you may benefit from reading:
http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/ask-a-mustachian/cutting-grocery-budget-for-family-of-five/
http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/ask-a-mustachian/how-much-do-you-spend-on-groceries/
http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/ask-a-mustachian/groceries-for-a-family-of-3/

And best of all, a challenge thread:
http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/throw-down-the-gauntlet/stick-to-a-grocery-budget-2016/

Thanks. Reading them now.

Wish people would post a sample daily menu their family eats, including drinks and snacks.

I have a 4 y/o and a newborn.  I admit to buying some pre-packaged snacks (especially at the moment) but they could easily be subbed with buying larger quantities and dividing them up. 

Breakfast
-eggs & toast
-oatmeal
-cereal
-bagel with PB & J
-PB sandwich
-yogurt (from a tub..not a tube)

Lunch
-leftovers from homemade supper
-cut up veggies
-fruit
-applesauce (homemade…or from a jar, not a single serving cup)
-cheese (not cheese strings…or single serving packaged cheese….cut from a block of cheese. speaking of cheese, what is the cheese expense listed on your purchases?)
-yogurt (from a tub)
-homemade muffins…cookies…granola bars….etc
-raisins

Supper
-other people have ideas covered.  Soups, chilli, spaghetti sauce, stir fry, homemade pizzas (put them on naan bread, super easy, we just had that for lunch)

Beverages
-milk or water. anything else is a treat once in a while.

meandmyfamily

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #106 on: January 08, 2017, 11:25:48 AM »
Hello!  Groceries and eating out used to be tough for us until we realized how much we were spending!!!  We have 4 kids (13, 11, 6 and 5) plus 2 adult parents.  We spend $850 a month on just groceries (food) and $150 on eating out (that includes anything like a soda at gas station or Starbucks or pizza).  Today we had steel cut oats for breakfast with walnuts, brown sugar and dried cranberries (so cheap and filling), for lunch we are having burritos/quesidillas with homemade beans, cheese (we shred our own from big blocks we get at Costco), salsa, avocadoes,  then dinner tonight is hamburgers with lots of toppings.  I hope that helps you with your meal planning.  Kids can snack on nuts or any fruit/vegetables we have around.  We don't buy all the prepackaged stuff you mentioned.  We do have a batch of homemade cookies they will probably eat some of them too.  We drink water with occasionally tea made at home for the older people.

You have to STOP lunch purchase at work!  It blows my mind.  Just sent out a mass email that says "It was fun for a bit but I have to stop buying lunches!"

You owe the IRS!!!!  You can't afford anything extra!

Good luck!
« Last Edit: January 08, 2017, 11:27:34 AM by meandmyfamily »

RetiredAt63

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #107 on: January 08, 2017, 11:26:51 AM »
One potentially controversial piece of advice- take steps to ensure you do not have a third child until your financial house is in order. You are on the edge of ruin as it is. (the nearly 2 year old, with previous child spacing, makes me wary that this could be upcoming). Assuming she's a similar age, you and your wife are young enough that a one year delay before any further children should make no difference in eventual number of children, etc.

OMG YES.  Super good point, BJ.  Not only is a third child not affordable for the beatles right now, Mrs. beatle needs to have her energy focused on being a super CFO, not a baby machine.


One nice thing about the Leanne Ely books is that she organizes menus by seasons, so your shopping list is based on what produce should be low cost for that time of year.  No fresh strawberries in January sort of thing.

The Tightwad Gazette had lots on food waste (how not to have).  One basic thing with kids - portion control.  Kid does not get a whole orange, kid gets a few segments.  Kid can always have a few more.  Rest go in the fridge for next time.  Kid gets a few slices of apple, rest is in the fridge.  etc.  Leftovers - buffet supper on the weekend, empty the fridge, lots of choices, leftovers get eaten. 

Trifle

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #108 on: January 08, 2017, 11:45:45 AM »
Beatles --

My two favorite cookbooks are Good and Cheap (L. Brown) and Lickety Split Meals (Zonya Foco).  Both focus on good, healthy, cheap meals.  Strongly suggest that you get them both. 

You asked for examples of how we eat.  Our family of 4 eats very similarly to 1967Mama. We shop mostly at Aldi, and have a garden.  Other than Aldi hummous and salsa, we buy almost nothing prepackaged and we make all our meals:

Breakfast: 
Whole wheat toast with peanut butter
Hot cereal (not from packets) -- oatmeal, barley, buckwheat, or rice. Add peanut butter and honey -- delish!
Aldi brand oat rings ("cheerios"), cornflakes
Eggs/bacon/sausage
Milk/coffee/tea

Lunch:
Sandwiches/wraps with cheese and vegetables
Leftover soups/stews from previous dinners
Omelettes with vegetables and cheese
Green salads with protein added -- chick peas, cottage cheese
Baked sweet potatoes with avocado
Wraps with scrambled egg, vegetables and cheese.  (whisk the egg and microwave it in a bowl or coffee cup)


Dinner:
Crockpot stews, either meat based (chili, beef stew) or vegetarian (minestrone, potato, etc)
Quesadillas -- super easy.  Add any meat, vegetables or cheese you like.  I have never met a kid that didn't love quesadillas.
"Burrito Night" = everyone fixes their own burrito from choices on the table -- meat, beans, shredded lettuce, cheese, chopped vegetables, sour cream. Kids love it.
Indian stews/curries over rice.  Last night I made chana masala and it was crazy easy and good.
Spaghetti/pasta with various sauces and sometimes vegetables added
Lasagna -- either veggie or meat. Make two and freeze one.
Homemade bread -- easy and satisfying to the soul.

Snacks -- apples, bananas, carrots, broccoli, oranges, popcorn, hummous.  Seriously -- these are the snacks our kids eat.  Once your body switches over to whole foods, you'll be amazed that you ever ate crappy pre-packaged stuff. 

Drinks:  Water, milk, coffee, tea, beer.   No juice or soda ever. 

Your kids are so young, they will adapt quickly.  You can start with "transitional" snacks like apple slices with peanut butter, celery sticks with cream cheese, etc.  It is totally doable.  And added bonus -- you'll be eating much healthier.

Go Beatles!!
« Last Edit: January 08, 2017, 11:54:57 AM by Trifele »

LadyMuMu

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #109 on: January 08, 2017, 11:56:13 AM »
Also a tip for getting the kiddos on board. Instead of saying you're no longer buying X snack or eating X, just start having "cooking lessons" with him or her. They can use a butter knife to make cheese slices, an apple corer, etc. When they cook it, they're much more enthusiastic about eating it.

Don't believe me? My sons just helped to make warm broccoli and pear salad with cranberries (from Budget Bytes) and corn muffins for lunch--and ate it! They are 8 and 9.

SwordGuy

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #110 on: January 08, 2017, 11:59:57 AM »
Well, I suspect you've felt some of those "face punches". :)

If you look past the hurt you'll realize that total strangers care enough about helping you that they've taken quite a bit of time to write out recipes, write out long pieces of advice, look up lots of links for you, etc.

I hope you'll stick with turning your life around.

It's a lot to absorb.

What would be helpful to those who took the time you help you out would be a list of the things that

(a) You have already done to turn things around, and
(b) The things you will take care of this week, and
(c) The things you will be taking care of over the next 3 months.

It will also be useful for you as a check list.

Trifle

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #111 on: January 08, 2017, 12:04:50 PM »
Also a tip for getting the kiddos on board. Instead of saying you're no longer buying X snack or eating X, just start having "cooking lessons" with him or her. They can use a butter knife to make cheese slices, an apple corer, etc. When they cook it, they're much more enthusiastic about eating it.

Don't believe me? My sons just helped to make warm broccoli and pear salad with cranberries (from Budget Bytes) and corn muffins for lunch--and ate it! They are 8 and 9.

This is true, and great advice.  Involve the kids in the food prep -- don't just put the plate in front of them.   I've been cooking with my kids since they were the same age your kids are now.  Even a two year old can try to spread cream cheese, separate an orange, etc.   My kids used to love making "ants on a toilet seat" -- take an apple ring, spread peanut butter on it, and then put raisins into the peanut butter.   

MDM

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #112 on: January 08, 2017, 12:08:52 PM »
But to put it simply, I do NOT have employees. I am self employed and work with other self employed people, under a company umbrella. So I, and other self employed people, share secretaries and office staff and their expense is pooled and split.
...
Accountant says because of the structure and who receives the food, I am not allowed to deduct the lunch expense.

Let us know how the "Hey folks, I've had my turn - who's going to start buying the lunches for 2017?" talk goes tomorrow.

LadyStache in Baja

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #113 on: January 08, 2017, 12:23:53 PM »
You guys eat out so much!  You need to make a plan for that together.  Can you be in charge of dishes and clean-up if your wife promises to cook 3 meals every day?

Just a heads-up....I know advertising makes it seem like prepackaged crap is normal, but its not.  We literally buy 0 single-serving pouches of anything, and in fact no packaged food at all beyond an OCCASIONAL box of ritz crackers or cereal.

Do you have kids?
Glad you asked!

I have 4: a just turned 5 year old, twin 4 year olds, and a 2 year old!  I also work part-time and run a vacation rental. 
« Last Edit: January 08, 2017, 01:03:08 PM by LadyStache in Baja »

With This Herring

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #114 on: January 08, 2017, 12:35:27 PM »
You guys eat out so much!  You need to make a plan for that together.  Can you be in charge of dishes and clean-up if your wife promises to cook 3 meals every day?

Just a heads-up....I know advertising makes it seem like prepackaged crap is normal, but its not.  We literally buy 0 single-serving pouches of anything, and in fact no packaged food at all beyond an OCCASIONAL box of ritz crackers or cereal.

Do you have kids?

Kids, especially kids who are not even in grade school and aren't subject to peer pressure yet, do not need single-size serving packages.  It is a simple thing to take big jar of applesauce, plop some in a little bowl, and give it to the child.  Small children do not need to go feeding themselves tiny snacks at random.

"Good news.  Mom/Dad made MUFFINS!"  *cue super-excitedness from other parent*  Now your kids are happy about muffins.

With their ages, kids will be very happy to watch popcorn pop in a pot on the stove.  It's like  happy, noisy magic, especially if that pot has a glass lid.

Groceries So Far in 2017

That is a LOT on groceries, even at $357.  What did you guys buy?  What of it is non-perishable, packaged snack food/boxed mixes/instant dinners that can be returned?  What of it is overpriced brand name cleaning supplies that can be returned?  Dig that receipt out of the trash! Return what you can!  Return what is not staples!  No soda pop, no single-serving packages.  Almost all cleaning can be done with baking soda and vinegar.  Buy a 5-lb box of baking soda for $2 and a $2 gallon of white vinegar, and you are set for a long time.

Save your receipts, because you will want a lot more detail on where this grocery money is going.  If you can't find the receipt in the trash, whoever did the shopping should make a list of everything they remember buying.  Look through the fridge, cabinets, pantries, etc.

*snip*
We don't throw away food due to expiration dates. But our kids will eat part of an orange and throw the rest away. Or open a banana and then not want it and we have to throw it away.
*snip*

Well, the kids don't get their own bananas and oranges now.  Mom opens an orange, gives segment to each child, then keeps feeding them segments until they are done.  Then she finishes off the orange and eats another if she wants.  Same with bananas.  Slice up a banana, feed the kids slices until they don't want more banana, and Mom finishes it off and decides if she wants a whole banana in addition.

Furniture Loan

What?  Oh no.  Sell the sofas.  Replace them with free ones on CraigsList.  That's where I got my sofa.

Taxes

I will second Pizzabrewer's advice on catching up on tax filings first, then getting help in setting up repayment plans.

For taxes going forward:  It looks like, since you have employee-style payroll withholdings yet also talk about paying tax estimates, that you are the sole shareholder of an S Corporation.  Is this correct?  (This is such a common setup that it is not personally identifying.)  If so, ask the accountant you mentioned advice on increasing up your paycheck income tax withholdings to cover your W-2 income AND your estimated S Corp income.  This might be the best move for you if you have a hard time saving up money for your quarterly estimates.

Clothing

If you, your wife, or kids really need a replacement shirt because the last few shirts are wearing out, you need to go to a thrift store.  Goodwill, VOA, Salvation Army - pick whichever one is cheapest in your area.  You should be able to pick up new articles of clothing for around $2 each.  If your kids have taller cousins and friends, ASK for hand-me-downs.  You and your wife are probably set for clothing for 5+ years at least, but your kids will keep growing.  The best clothes are free.  I am being completely serious.  I am financially in an excellent place, and when I purchase my one or two articles of clothing a year, I get them second-hand.  I am an adult, so I'm not growing, and I do not wear out clothing quickly.

Windfalls

The next time your family receives any financial windfall - such as a bonus, a tax refund, a gift from a family member, or (heaven forbid) an inheritance - it MUST go to paying off your debts.  Do not think "We have worked so hard lately; we deserve a treat" or "We were not expecting this money, so it doesn't matter to our budget.  We will take a nice vacation."  Do not do it!  That is something it makes us very sad to see.  A family that is only barely scraping by gets an income tax refund, and instead of making that money an emergency fund, they buy a TV or go to lots of restaurants or take a nice vacation.

To Do Today
  • Dig out that grocery receipt from the trash.  Yes, it is icky, but you can wash your hands after.  Figure out what stuff should be returned.
  • Decide what you are having for supper tonight and tomorrow night and the week.  Make up a grocery list.
  • Go to the grocery store.  Return stuff.  Buy only what is on the list.
  • Make tonight's supper.  Do any prep ahead for tomorrow night.  (Do you need to have food cut up to throw in the slow cooker tomorrow morning?)
  • Write down what you plan to do tomorrow (work day, so more organizations will be open) of the advice from this thread.  Decide who you are going to call on your lunch break and who your wife is going to call/visit at various points during the day.  Remember to cancel that cable!
  • Breathe. :)

LadyStache in Baja

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #115 on: January 08, 2017, 01:03:57 PM »
You guys eat out so much!  You need to make a plan for that together.  Can you be in charge of dishes and clean-up if your wife promises to cook 3 meals every day?

Just a heads-up....I know advertising makes it seem like prepackaged crap is normal, but its not.  We literally buy 0 single-serving pouches of anything, and in fact no packaged food at all beyond an OCCASIONAL box of ritz crackers or cereal.

Do you have kids?
Glad you asked!

I have 4: a just turned 5 year old, twin 4 year olds, and a 2 year old!  I also work part-time and run a vacation rental.


Oops got snarky again.  Just to be clear, it is not EASY, but life is not supposed to be easy.  It is supposed to be challenging, and you must rise to the challenge and enjoy the challenge.  :)

LadyStache in Baja

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #116 on: January 08, 2017, 01:13:41 PM »
Just thought of something.  Does your wife do the grocery shopping with the kids?  I definitely know how annoying it is for them to be whining in the store for something.  I could see how that might influence her purchases. 

Can you do the shopping on your way home from work from now on?  With your meal plan, you'll be able to get the next day's food.  (We shop everyday for one day's food...its a small town in mexico thing.  You might also do weekly shopping but leave the kids at home).

The beatles

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #117 on: January 08, 2017, 01:25:18 PM »

Wish people would post a sample daily menu their family eats, including drinks and snacks.

Here's what we typically eat in the 1967 family!

Breakfast:
Oatmeal (from scratch, not packets) with toppings that I keep in a box with tiny jars of: brown sugar, craisins, raisins, blanched almonds, coconut (I can hear 1967dada chopping apples right now for the oatmeal!)
Homemade granola (sometimes with milk, sometimes over yogurt) - buy a full sized container, not little cups of yogurt)
Toast
Eggs and toast
Eggs and bacon
Eggs and sausages

Lunch:
Any leftovers reheated
Homemade bread from the freezer - sandwiches: pbj, chicken salad, egg salad, ham (from a whole ham), cheese and cucumber, grilled cheese
Soup made with frozen bone broth from chicken bones
Homemade pizza
Eggs (poached, fried, scrambled, put in a wrap with grated cheese)

Dinner:
A whole roasted chicken with carrots and potatoes
Spaghetti and meat sauce
Chili and buns with raw veggies
Casserole with bits of chicken, veggies and rice
Homemade hamburgers on the grill (and homemade buns)
Beef stew with biscuits
Chicken stew and dumplings
Curry

Snacks:
Smoothies (no mixes - frozen fruit - save those 1/2 pieces of fruit from the kids in a ziplock in the freezer and also chop up and freeze fruit that is about to go bad)
Popcorn
Homemade baked goods - cookies, homemade granola bars, the brownie mixes you have - use them up
Then make your own)
Fresh fruit cut up
Cheese cut into little squares

Drinks:
Milk
Water
Homemade iced tea and lemonade

ETA photo from today's breakfast. Those are the little jars I was mentioning with toppings for the oatmeal.

Why do you make your own bread?

At least where I live, bread is very cheap.

pbkmaine

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #118 on: January 08, 2017, 01:25:43 PM »
Just thought of something.  Does your wife do the grocery shopping with the kids?  I definitely know how annoying it is for them to be whining in the store for something.  I could see how that might influence her purchases. 

Can you do the shopping on your way home from work from now on?  With your meal plan, you'll be able to get the next day's food.  (We shop everyday for one day's food...its a small town in mexico thing.  You might also do weekly shopping but leave the kids at home).

In fact, doing this could earn you a much higher hourly "wage" (in terms of lower household expenses) than a second job.

The beatles

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #119 on: January 08, 2017, 02:27:29 PM »
Thanks for the advice everyone.

I'm reading every post even if I don't respond to all of them.

QUESTION: I want to set a goal. What should be my 3, 6, 9, 12 month goals?


With This Herring

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #120 on: January 08, 2017, 02:29:04 PM »

Here's what we typically eat in the 1967 family!

Breakfast:
*snip*
Lunch:
Any leftovers reheated
Homemade bread from the freezer - sandwiches: pbj, chicken salad, egg salad, ham (from a whole ham), cheese and cucumber, grilled cheese
*snip*

Why do you make your own bread?

At least where I live, bread is very cheap.

How much does a 1-pound loaf of decent quality, non-Wonderbread cost in your area?  How much are the ingredients for a one-pound loaf of homemade bread?  Bread flour, salt, water, yeast/sourdough starter, plus add-ins.  Homemade bread can be cheaper than store-bought for basic bread, but homemade bread tends to be MUCH cheaper if you get into fancier (tastier) loaves, fancy ingredients, etc.  1967mama and family might like really fancy artisan oatmeal and whole wheat bread with baked-in nuts.  That might run $4+ in the store, while the ingredients might run $1.  So, it makes sense for them to bake four or more loaves at once, then store them in the freezer until they are needed.

We buy sliced bread occasionally (I should start making it), but I make all of our muffins, biscuits, cinnamon rolls, and rosemary buns from scratch.  It really isn't difficult, and the taste is so much better.  Have you ever had fresh, homemade cinnamon rolls?  They are a treat!

The beatles

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #121 on: January 08, 2017, 02:34:59 PM »
But to put it simply, I do NOT have employees. I am self employed and work with other self employed people, under a company umbrella. So I, and other self employed people, share secretaries and office staff and their expense is pooled and split.
...
Accountant says because of the structure and who receives the food, I am not allowed to deduct the lunch expense.

Let us know how the "Hey folks, I've had my turn - who's going to start buying the lunches for 2017?" talk goes tomorrow.

This is my favorite idea as far as the lunches go.

Instead of telling people "too bad, the lunch ride is over", spin it as my turn is simply over, and who is taking over the torch next?

ysette9

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #122 on: January 08, 2017, 02:44:54 PM »
I adore homemade bread but haven't been making it much because of the time and the fact that my yeast was old and sucky. I need to do that more though just because it tastes so good! That way you can also control the ingredients. Trader Joe's does a great job of good bread with only a few ingredients but good lord is the "healthy" bread at places like Safeway terrible. Twenty ingredients, half of them requiring a class in organic chemistry to pronounce, and all that added sugar. Stay far away if you possibly can.

On a separate note, it may be helpful to change your perspective on what "kids' food" is. We took that strategy from the beginning that we were not feeding our baby "baby food" but real people food. That meant at six months she got little pieces of avocado and banana, and then graduated to sweet potato fries and squash. She has always eaten pretty much what we eat except cooler and less spicy. Even kids with no or few teeth can eat almost everything with their hard gums. She doesn't get kids' snacks or drinks or pouches or any of that nonsense; she eats a proper meal with us or snacks with us. It always real food. My 2.5 year-old loves olives, my banana bread, cheese, dark chocolate covered almonds, and things like salmon and chicken skin (yes, she is a little weird). She can even eat fairly spicy food as long as we don't tell her it is spicy. :) Give your kids a chance to eat real good like real people and you may be pleasantly surprised. If not, then remember that you are the adult and you control what choices they have to eat, so start giving them the options of only good things.

swick

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #123 on: January 08, 2017, 02:58:25 PM »
Hey Beatles - Setting goals is great, but you can't be doing them by yourself. We can give you suggestions, but you and your wife need to be the ones working together to establish and follow through on them.

"True Love is not two people looking at each other, but two people looking in the same direction, together"

You have said your wife is on board, but you haven't really responded to all the suggestions about her being your family's CFO. I imagine you are both feeling pretty overwhelmed.

I would HIGHLY encourage your wife to create an account and get involved with the forums herself. There are so many SAHP on the boards who have fought these battles and are here to support each other. Yes, we can be a direct, no-nonsense, call you on your bullshit community - but it is because we care and want to see you succeed. many of the changes will need to be steered by your wife, she has a support network here if she chooses to get involved. Never underestimate the value of community.

As you are going through, I think it would be super valuable to look at everything in your life and figure out what is a universal truth, and what is a bullshit rule.  Universal truths are true for everyone.

Example: Sugar is addictive and has no nutritional value. Can't argue with it, it is an established universal truth. do you want to be setting your children up for a lifetime of health problems by giving in to their wants?

Examples of a bullshit rule (these are learned or impressed upon you, often from a young age that you have never questioned. They are constructs of how you were raised, society, culture and so on. Some have value, some do not, it is up to you to examine them as a free thinking adult and see if they have value FOR YOU): "there is no way I can't live without x" "It is impossible to spend less than x on something" "Success is measured by having x flashy thing" "having a house is always a better investment then renting" "If I don't give my kids X their life will be ruined" "Becuase I have done something once, I always have to continue to do it" "Buy now and pay later is a part of life" and on and on and on. How much of your thinking and decision making is on auto pilot? How has this been working out for you?

The beatles

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #124 on: January 08, 2017, 03:21:30 PM »
How much does a 1-pound loaf of decent quality, non-Wonderbread cost in your area?  How much are the ingredients for a one-pound loaf of homemade bread?  Bread flour, salt, water, yeast/sourdough starter, plus add-ins.  Homemade bread can be cheaper than store-bought for basic bread, but homemade bread tends to be MUCH cheaper if you get into fancier (tastier) loaves, fancy ingredients, etc.  1967mama and family might like really fancy artisan oatmeal and whole wheat bread with baked-in nuts.  That might run $4+ in the store, while the ingredients might run $1.  So, it makes sense for them to bake four or more loaves at once, then store them in the freezer until they are needed.

We buy sliced bread occasionally (I should start making it), but I make all of our muffins, biscuits, cinnamon rolls, and rosemary buns from scratch.  It really isn't difficult, and the taste is so much better.  Have you ever had fresh, homemade cinnamon rolls?  They are a treat!

We dont buy the fancy breads.

We buy the plain bread that is 99 cents.

birdie55

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #125 on: January 08, 2017, 03:31:08 PM »
Once your family starts cooking from scratch, you will find the bread you are buying has quite a bit of salt and maybe sugar too.  Let alone all the other ingredients that are not in homemade bread.  It is a process once you reduce the preservatives and other chemicals in your foods, you start making more items at home, stead of buying them at the store.

Bread, yogurt, rice instead of mixes are easy places to start.  Sauces from your ingredients will be cheaper and have less crap in them.  Start reading what is in the prepared foods you get in boxes.  Then decide if you want to feed that stuff to growing children.  It's amazing once you start reading...

MilesTeg

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #126 on: January 08, 2017, 03:39:42 PM »
I was about to pile on about the food expenses (yours are insane!) but looks like that is covered. This is something we have struggled with in our budget (2 adults) but you make us look down right ultra frugal!.

Our biggest problem is, honestly, laziness. To combat that, we cook up multi day meals and freeze them. We'll make up several dishes of enchiladas, meatloaf (good meatloaf is good!), soups, and other "bulk" foods and then package them up in individual servings and freeze. I take them to work for lunch (bonus, no cooler needed if they are frozen!) and we eat them as the "main course" of dinners only adding in veggie sides or other things that are much better never frozen.

We also do lots of crock pot meals (stews, etc.). We don't necessarily do it from scratch (often it's just a combination of canned/frozen items + a few fresh items) but it's a lot cheaper and easier than some alternatives. And with a big crock pot it is easily several meals worth (and sometimes we just refresh it!).

We've found the best way to keep variety while eating fairly cheaply is not in the "main course" but in the sides. Meatloaf every day for a few days sounds terrible, unless you have a rotating set of yummy sides.

MDM

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #127 on: January 08, 2017, 03:44:06 PM »
This is my favorite idea as far as the lunches go.

Instead of telling people "too bad, the lunch ride is over", spin it as my turn is simply over, and who is taking over the torch next?
Yep.  You might need to be the candy coated rock, or the velvet covered iron bar, or whatever metaphor you prefer - just smile nicely when you convey the message, but do convey the message.

LadyStache in Baja

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #128 on: January 08, 2017, 04:07:22 PM »
This is my favorite idea as far as the lunches go.

Instead of telling people "too bad, the lunch ride is over", spin it as my turn is simply over, and who is taking over the torch next?
Yep.  You might need to be the candy coated rock, or the velvet covered iron bar, or whatever metaphor you prefer - just smile nicely when you convey the message, but do convey the message.

This is fine for your coworkers.  But I'm noticing a pattern here.  You need to learn how to say no to people. 

No is a complete sentence.  You don't need to explain anything to anyone (unless you want to).  No is an answer all by itself.

You need to learn how to say no to your kids, to your wife*, and most importantly, to yourself. 

You should say no to crown molding, processed snacks, eating out, new furniture of any kind...etc.  Just no. 

*as a partner, not a dictator, as in, "No, we can't afford that. We've done the math and its not in our budget.  Should we revisit the budget to see if there's anything we can cut?"

Jakejake

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #129 on: January 08, 2017, 04:28:08 PM »
I'm just catching up on all this. Wow.

We're a two person family. My grocery spending for the first week of January was $7.23.
A typical set of meals for a day:

Oatmeal breakfast -  5 cents. add a handful of frozen cranberries - now it's 9 cents.

Packed Lunches for my husband: usually about 50 cents per day. Peanut butter and jelly sandwich on homemade bread, fruit, yogurt. Sometimes I splurge and he gets a chicken sandwich - sliced from chicken breast I cook when it drops to 99 cents/lb.

The jelly is homemade from berries I picked in a public park - so almost no cost (some pectin and sugar). The bread is from flour that was $1.50 for 5 lbs, and a few cents of costco yeast, but as others have pointed out to me elsewhere, once you get a sourdough started you don't even need that. So the bread is probably 20 or 30 cents a loaf. The peanut butter I stocked up on when it was $2.55 a jar or so - but it generated a $2.50 off my next purchase coupon, so basically free. The yogurt is homemade - so a gallon for $3.09, or a little under 3 cents for an 8 oz cup. Sweetened with the free jelly. Fruit's the big expense, I try to keep it at 50 cents/lb and buy a lot of marked down produce or bananas. Sometimes the prices are up and he wanders out of the house with a dollar or two of fresh fruit in his lunch.

Dinner tonight: I got a huge box of eggplant marked down because the skin is pitted, so it's like 20 pounds or more for two dollars. The last two nights I made eggplant curry over rice. Tonight I'm making eggplant parm. Tomorrow I'm thinking roasted eggplant and red pepper sandwiches on fresh bread. The day after that .., maybe a lentil soup with eggplant. Every dinner's going to be well under a dollar for the two of us. And it will taste good.

To put that all in perspective - I retired this year, two years before my husband is going to. So I have made it my job to save money and have housewife skills. We have no debts, and have well funded retirement accounts. It doesn't matter. This is still my job.

If I can do this, you can do it. And the reason you can do it is that you have more motivation than me - My kid is grown, but you have two kids who are depending on you to get your act together because helping them go to college is more important than eating snacks packaged in one ounce pouches, or eating at restaurants or buying makeup kits.

Still trying to put it into perspective for you: every single week you bought lunches for your coworkers, you made a decision you'd rather throw that money away than pay for a credit hour of tuition for one of your kids at a community college.

And that's a great way to have the no more lunches conversation if you feel you do need an explanation: Hey guys, my kids are getting close to school age, and my wife and I decided instead of splurging on meals out, it's time to start a fund for their college.

Nobody will give you grief about that and it doesn't make you sound embarrassingly out of control with your debts; it makes you sound responsible.

And next time you want to make a large unnecessary purchase, like a new tv, do the math on how many college credits it will cost, and make a deliberate decision about which is more valuable - because you can't pay for both.

Trifle

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #130 on: January 08, 2017, 05:03:54 PM »
Beatles --

Just wanted to say -- you've had a full-facial blast of advice from all of us in the past two days.  Good on you for sticking with this, and we hope to see your wife on the forum too.   Remember -- if we can do it, your family can do it too.   We are here for you. 

T

Allie

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #131 on: January 08, 2017, 05:14:59 PM »
I love your case study, in part, because you are in a place where everything is so doable!  Seriously, you are in debt and super far behind, but it's because of crown molding and couches and gummy treats.  It's because of things you can happily live without.  If you were choosing between taking care of an elderly parent and saving, I'd be so worried, but you aren't.  You get to choose between Dave and Buster's and your future security and freedom.  Is there really a choice here?  How awesome is that!?!

I'm putting up our weekly menu on my journal, in case you want another list.  Most of my journal is travel, food, kid, and home related.  The link is below, just go to the last page!

Our situation was a little different, but we paid off debt a few years ago, drank the kook aid, and are on our way to FIRE.  It's uncomfortable at first, but totally worth it! 


The beatles

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #132 on: January 08, 2017, 05:41:08 PM »
I found something really cool.

A lot of people have asked for a receipt, but I had thrown ours away.

But then I realized that our store's website keeps a record of receipts so I was able to login and get it.

Here you go:

QTY
Product
Size
Department
Extended Price
ADD ALL TO LIST

1
Silk Nutchello Nut-Based Beverage, Rich Dark Chocolate + Walnuts
002529300300
48 FO
Nature's Marketplace
4.49


MFR COUPON SAVINGS
-1.00
1
Bananas
020401100000
1 LB
Produce
1.76


1
Skinny Cow Candy, Dreamy Clusters, Milk Chocolate
002800094274
6 OZ
Grocery Food
3.99


SHOPPERS CLUB SAVINGS
-0.50
1
Generic Shredded Sharp Cheddar Cheese
007789033441
16 OZ
Dairy
3.99


1
Generic Plain Chicken, Honey Brined Rotisserie
021768000000
1 EA
Packaged Meals, Entrees, and Sides
4.99


1
Greenhouse Grown Orange Peppers
024312100000
1 LB
Produce
2.35


1
Generic Sweet Bread & Butter Chips
007789055100
24 FO
Grocery Food
2.49


1
Bulk Garlic
020460800000
1 LB
Produce
0.60


1
Generic Food You Feel Good About One Dozen Large Eggs
007789080133
24 OZ
Dairy
1.19


1
Nest Skin Cow Crsp
002800032267
5 OZ
Grocery Food
3.99


SHOPPERS CLUB SAVINGS
-0.50
1
WB Nat Chnk Aplsc
007789020543
23 OZ
Grocery Food
1.79


1
Arm & Hammer Baking Soda, Pure, Value Size
003320001170
4 LB
Household Essentials
2.79


1
Generic Thin Sliced Swiss Cheese
007789099728
8 OZ
Dairy
2.49


1
Generic Food You Feel Good About Just Picked and Quickly Frozen Halves & Quarters Artichoke Hearts
007789060893
12 OZ
Frozen Foods
3.99


1
Generic Food You Feel Good About Yellow Onions
007789098054
2 LB
Produce
1.99


1
Old El Paso Refried Beans, Traditional
004600082121
16 OZ
International Foods
1.29


1
Generic Food You Feel Good About Vitamin D Milk
007789093986
0 GL
Dairy
1.79


1
Generic Food You Feel Good About Sour Cream
007789071492
16 OZ
Dairy
1.49


3
Stf Rotiss Chkn
001380091355
14 OZ
Frozen Foods
11.97


1
Sargento Off the Block Shredded Cheese, Traditional Cut, Extra Sharp Cheddar
004610041103
7 OZ
Dairy
3.19


2
Kraft Macaroni & Cheese Dinner, Original Flavor
002100065883
7 OZ
Grocery Food
2.18


1
Select Nectarines
020437800000
1 LB
Produce
3.41


1
Wg Dessert Cups
007789092124
5 OZ
OTHER
2.00


1
Goya Yellow Rice/C
004133102679
8 OZ
International Foods
1.99


1
Special K Pastry Crisps, Strawberry
003800049065
4 OZ
Grocery Food
2.99


1
WB Storage Bag Gal
007789035940
40 CT
Household Essentials
2.99


1
Generic Organic Food You Feel Good About Fruit Twists, Variety Pack, FAMILY PACK
007789036696
13 OZ
Nature's Marketplace
6.99


1
Generic Food You Feel Good About Cinnamon Apple Sauce Pouches
007789036837
13 OZ
Grocery Food
2.19


1
Weg FYFGA Parm Rom
007789036280
72 OZ
Grocery Food
2.99


1
Weg Nuggets Pasta
007789023399
16 OZ
Grocery Food
0.99


2
Nest Skinny Mk Cho
002800044955
5 OZ
Grocery Food
5.84


1
Driscoll's Raspberries, Organic
071575610004
6 OZ
Produce
3.49


1
Tasty Bite Channa Masala
078273300026
10 OZ
Nature's Marketplace
3.19


1
Greenhouse Grown Tomatoes On-The-Vine
020466400000
1 LB
Produce
2.12


1
Hass Avocados
020404600000
1 EA
Produce
1.50


1
Generic Food You Feel Good About Ultra Pasteurized Half & Half
007789033269
1 PT
Dairy
1.69


1
Generic Food You Feel Good About Fresh Living Basil
007789090497
1 EA
Produce
2.99


1
Monks' Bread, Wheat Wholegrain
004167821555
16 OZ
Bakery
2.59


1
A & W Root Beer, Diet
007800005346
2 L.
Beverages
1.59


1
Blue Diamond Almond Breeze Almondmilk, Unsweetened, Original
004157005670
64 FO
Dairy
2.99


1
Generic Whipped Topping
007789016387
8 OZ
Frozen Foods
1.29


1
Sprite Soda, Lemon-Lime
004900005017
2 L.
Beverages
1.69


SHOPPERS CLUB SAVINGS
-0.19
1
Generic Food You Feel Good About Just Picked Broccoli Cuts
007789012691
12 OZ
Frozen Foods
0.99


1
Amy's Pizza, Cheese
004227200101
13 OZ
Nature's Marketplace
6.49


1
Amy's Pizza, Pesto
004227200104
14 OZ
Nature's Marketplace
6.49


1
Generic Food You Feel Good About Steamables Jasmine White Rice
007789025087
10 OZ
Frozen Foods
1.19


1
Generic Baking Powder, Double Acting
007789056714
10 OZ
Grocery Food
1.79


1
Generic Food You Feel Good About Just Picked and Quickly Frozen Super-Sweet Corn
007789012694
12 OZ
Frozen Foods
0.99


1
Hebrew National Franks, Beef, Jumbo
007495628300
12 OZ
Dairy
4.99


SHOPPERS CLUB SAVINGS
-1.00
1
Frontera Taco Skillet Sauce, Texas Original, Mild
060418312170
8 OZ
International Foods
2.49


1
Generic Organic Rosemary Olive Oil Loaf
007789029881
18 OZ
Bakery
4.50


1
Stonyfield Organic YoKids Smoothie, Strawbana, 1% Milkfat
005215970082
19 FO
Dairy
3.99


1
Generic Fajita Tortilla Gordita Style, FAMILY PACK
007789033529
30 OZ
Dairy
2.49


1
Honest Kids Juice Drink, Organic, Apple Ever After
065762281584
54 FO
Nature's Marketplace
3.19


1
Skinny Cow Candy, Dreamy Clusters, Dark Chocolate
002800032143
6 OZ
Grocery Food
3.99


SHOPPERS CLUB SAVINGS
-0.50
3
Carnation Breakfast Essentials Complete Nutritional Drink Creamy Strawberry
005000041579
48 FO
Grocery Food
18.87


1
LesserEvil Buddha Bowl Foods Popcorn, Organic, Himalayan Pink
018099900100
5 OZ
Grocery Food
3.19


SHOPPERS CLUB SAVINGS
-0.40
1
Yasso Frozen Yogurt Bars, Greek, Coffee Chocolate Chip
085103500332
14 FO
Frozen Foods
4.49


3
Stouffers Fit Kitchen Monterey Chicken
001380044535
14 OZ
Frozen Foods
11.97


1
Dunkin' Donuts Coffee, Hazelnut, K-Cup Packs
088133400301
10 CT
Beverages
7.49


2
Special K Cracker Chips, Honey Barbecue
003800059952
4 OZ
Grocery Food
5.98


1
20 Mule Team Borax Detergent Booster & Multi-Purpose Household Cleaner
002340000201
65 OZ
Household Essentials
4.49


1
Generic Food You Feel Good About Thin Sliced Chicken Cutlets
020076400000
1 LB
Meat
7.91


1
Generic Italian Classics Fresh Mozzarella Cheese
027706700000
8 OZ
Cheese Shop
3.49


1
Nestle Skinny Cow Candy Bar, Heavenly Crisp, Peanut Butter Flavor
002800032113
5 OZ
Grocery Food
3.99


SHOPPERS CLUB SAVINGS
-0.50
1
Navel Oranges
020401400000
1 EA
Produce
0.80


SHOPPERS CLUB SAVINGS 3.59
TOTAL SAVINGS 4.59
BOTTLE DEPOSIT 0.10
TAX 3.41
TOTAL 237.48
BOTTLE RETURN 1.05
COINSTAR 0.00
*****4517 Credit Card 236.43

pbkmaine

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #133 on: January 08, 2017, 06:07:42 PM »
Others will have much more to say, but what jumps out to me is that you have a lot of prepared food. Much of it is very expensive on a per pound basis, and is of little or no nutritional value.

Then I look at your chicken cutlets at $7.91 per pound. I get boneless, skinless chicken breasts at Sam's Club for $1.88 per pound, so you are spending 4x what I am.

The good news is that adjustments could easily be made, and would be positive for your family both nutritionally AND economically.

ChipmunkSavings

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #134 on: January 08, 2017, 06:10:54 PM »
Hello, first time posting in this thread. I would suggest you look at this :
http://www.squawkfox.com/fluff-factor/

The ''fluff'' factor is basically non-essential, low-nutrition foods such as snacks and pre-packaged items. I looked quickly through your list and noticed many ''Skinny Cow'' items coming up. If I remember correctly, those are 'diet' chocolate snacks, such as ice cream and chocolate? That's fluff, and you are better off eating the real deal, but in smaller amounts. It will be cheaper and more satisfying. You can freeze it if you tend to eat too much. For example, I often crave chocolate chips cookies, and I will go through a batch in no time. However, I can freeze them and refreeze 1-2 when I get a craving. It's more reasonable, healthier and cheaper as well.

Another way to look at it is to consider it as food groups. Separate ''fruits and veggies'', ''dairy products (milk, yogurt and cheese only)'', ''meats and alternatives'' as well as ''grain products (such as pasta, rice, bread)''. All other items should be kept to a minimum, as they are unhealthy as well as more expensive.

LadyMuMu

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #135 on: January 08, 2017, 06:26:02 PM »
I agree with the Aldi advice. Also, just a back of the envelope figure and snack, candy, and desert foods make up about 1/3 of that grocery bill. The good thing is if you cut all those out today, you could see an instant 1/3 drop in your bill. I also notice there's a lot of diet food there--cutting out snacks and candy will help watch the calories. Finally, you can still have snacks and goodies--just enjoy preparing them. Don't have time? Eat fruit.

Here's my envelope:

Silk Nutchello Nut-Based Beverage, Rich Dark Chocolate + Walnuts   4.49
Skinny Cow Candy, Dreamy Clusters, Milk Chocolate   3.99
Generic Sweet Bread & Butter Chips   2.49
Nest Skin Cow Crsp   3.99
Wg Dessert Cups   2
Special K Pastry Crisps, Strawberry   2.99
Generic Organic Food You Feel Good About Fruit Twists, Variety Pack, FAMILY PACK   6.99
Generic Food You Feel Good About Cinnamon Apple Sauce Pouches   2.19
Nest Skinny Mk Cho   5.84
A & W Root Beer, Diet   1.59
Sprite Soda, Lemon-Lime   1.69
Stonyfield Organic YoKids Smoothie, Strawbana, 1% Milkfat   3.99
Honest Kids Juice Drink, Organic, Apple Ever After   3.19
Skinny Cow Candy, Dreamy Clusters, Dark Chocolate   3.99
Carnation Breakfast Essentials Complete Nutritional Drink Creamy Strawberry   18.87
LesserEvil Buddha Bowl Foods Popcorn, Organic, Himalayan Pink   3.19
Yasso Frozen Yogurt Bars, Greek, Coffee Chocolate Chip   4.49
Special K Cracker Chips, Honey Barbecue   5.98
Nestle Skinny Cow Candy Bar, Heavenly Crisp, Peanut Butter Flavor   3.99
   TOTAL: 85.94

The beatles

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #136 on: January 08, 2017, 06:40:17 PM »
OMG Beatles.  Thank you for posting this. Lightbulb just went on.  You shop at Wegmans, don't you?   

I lived in upstate NY, outside Syracuse for 20 years and I totally understand Wegmans.  For the other forum members in other parts of the country -- Wegmans is an excellent, upscale grocery chain. Here's the thing about Wegmans -- they have reasonable/cheap prices on food staples.   An independent study by a Syracuse newspaper reporter a few years ago showed that Wegmans beat the other local chains hands-down on costs for staples.   The thing is -- (1) Wegmans cannot beat Aldi (discount grocery) overall for costs.  And (2) Very, very few people have the discipline to just buy staples at Wegmans, but not the insanely good, upscale items.  Wegmans is very, very seductive.

Beatles -- here's what you must do:  Stop going to Wegmans.  (I say that with a pang, because part of me loves Wegmans.)  But you must stop going.  You can't afford it right now.   As of now, you shop at Aldi.  Trust me, you will be able to get what you need at Aldi.  Until your financial situation is stabilized, you are an Aldi shopper.  Please trust me on this. 

Shop -- without the kids-- at Aldi.     

     

Hey there neighbor! (Sort of)

Yes, it's wegmans!

The beatles

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #137 on: January 08, 2017, 06:46:52 PM »
I agree with the Aldi advice. Also, just a back of the envelope figure and snack, candy, and desert foods make up about 1/3 of that grocery bill. The good thing is if you cut all those out today, you could see an instant 1/3 drop in your bill. I also notice there's a lot of diet food there--cutting out snacks and candy will help watch the calories. Finally, you can still have snacks and goodies--just enjoy preparing them. Don't have time? Eat fruit.

Here's my envelope:

Silk Nutchello Nut-Based Beverage, Rich Dark Chocolate + Walnuts   4.49
Skinny Cow Candy, Dreamy Clusters, Milk Chocolate   3.99
Generic Sweet Bread & Butter Chips   2.49
Nest Skin Cow Crsp   3.99
Wg Dessert Cups   2
Special K Pastry Crisps, Strawberry   2.99
Generic Organic Food You Feel Good About Fruit Twists, Variety Pack, FAMILY PACK   6.99
Generic Food You Feel Good About Cinnamon Apple Sauce Pouches   2.19
Nest Skinny Mk Cho   5.84
A & W Root Beer, Diet   1.59
Sprite Soda, Lemon-Lime   1.69
Stonyfield Organic YoKids Smoothie, Strawbana, 1% Milkfat   3.99
Honest Kids Juice Drink, Organic, Apple Ever After   3.19
Skinny Cow Candy, Dreamy Clusters, Dark Chocolate   3.99
Carnation Breakfast Essentials Complete Nutritional Drink Creamy Strawberry   18.87
LesserEvil Buddha Bowl Foods Popcorn, Organic, Himalayan Pink   3.19
Yasso Frozen Yogurt Bars, Greek, Coffee Chocolate Chip   4.49
Special K Cracker Chips, Honey Barbecue   5.98
Nestle Skinny Cow Candy Bar, Heavenly Crisp, Peanut Butter Flavor   3.99
   TOTAL: 85.94

Thank you for this.

So all that is an $86 savings?

Trifle

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #138 on: January 08, 2017, 06:48:52 PM »
Hi neighbor!  Yep, you got it -- you will save that much and more. :)

former player

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #139 on: January 08, 2017, 07:03:57 PM »
I think I see the problem.  Almost everything on that shopping list says to me "single girl about town" and almost nothing on it says "married woman feeding a family of four".  So there is the big change which needs to be made, and once it is the rest will start to fall into place.

Is there anyone on your wife's side of the family who cooks basic meals from scratch?  Mother, grandmother, aunt?  Someone who can pass on some shopping tips and a familiar and basic family recipe for something like cottage pie?  Otherwise, the lists and resources already posted on this thread are the place to start, but it is often easier to make a big change such as this by starting from a familiar place and with help in person from someone known.

I agree with going to Aldi - not only is it cheaper, but changing the place where you shop is probably the easiest way to make a clean break and start new shopping habits.

Also, this is a win/win - the whole family will be healthier for cutting out all those nonsense bits and pieces as well as wealthier.

MoseyingAlong

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #140 on: January 08, 2017, 07:08:00 PM »
Our situation was a little different, but we paid off debt a few years ago, drank the kook aid, and are on our way to FIRE.  It's uncomfortable at first, but totally worth it!

Kook aid!

What a great typo. That made me chuckle. And, from some people's perspective, so true.
Thanks for the laugh.

terran

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #141 on: January 08, 2017, 07:37:08 PM »
Just to chime in on wegmans, my wife and I do most of our shopping there and budget $75/week for the two of us (usually come in a bit under), and only a few things on our list tend to be cheaper elsewhere. A couple of things I notice from that last shopping trip:

> lots of cheese (not the cheapest stuff anyway) and lots of it is preshredded -- 8oz of any of those is $2.99 at wegmans, and cheaper per unit if you buy in larger quantities (as long as that doesn't make you eat more)
> lots of skinny cow which looks pretty pricey.
> lots of sweet beverages (soda, chocolate nut milk, carnation) that you could probably do without
> Not the time of year to be buying fresh raspberries. Shopping seasonally and not expecting to always buy whatever you want is a good way to save money. Some things don't really change year round, others do and berries are definitely one of them.
> Fresh herbs (basil) are always pricey. You might try substituting dry, and shopping around for a standalone spice store or buying online can save money since McCormick, etc found at grocery stores is pretty expensive.
> Single packs (like the applesauce, maybe the yogurt) are usually more expensive than buying the full size version and portioning it out yourself.
> "Just add rice" type meals (channa masala) are usually a good place to look for savings by creating it from scratch yourself.
> From scratch pizza isn't that hard as a replacement for the frozen pizzas.
> $7.91/lb chicken cutlets are very expensive. boneless/skinless chicken breast is $1.99 at wegmans. We "spring" for the hand trimmed version at $2.99/lb because I find I have less fat trimming work to do, but it's certainly not necessary.
> Rice is cheap and can easily be cooked in 15-20 minutes while you're prepping the rest of dinner. No need to microwave in the bag rice. What you bought is $1.19/2-serivings. We buy Goya Canilla for $1.49/lb (serves 10 -- or a 20lb, 202 serving bag for $10.99), and there are definitely cheaper options

If you're in Rochester I might be able to give you a couple of other location specific tips.

I think it's already been mentioned, but definitely check out https://www.budgetbytes.com/. I think you'll find some things that are up your alley given some of your shopping choices.

Jakejake

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #142 on: January 08, 2017, 08:14:42 PM »
Good job finding the receipt! That helps a lot to see where the grocery money is going - and how easy it would be to save significantly there. Without even changing stores, I came up with $139.34 in savings.

I broke it into two categories:
Stuff you should swap for healthier/cheaper options ($65.87)
and Crap you Shouldn't Buy at all ($73.47)

Here's my breakdown of swapped foods:

Dunkin' Donuts Coffee, Hazelnut, K-Cup Packs 10 CT 7.49
NO. This works out to $24/lb for coffee. (< -- edited - late night math isn't my thing.) Sell the keurig, get a regular coffee pot - a drip pot or french press. In theory you could keep your machine and get reusable pods that you fill yourself with coffee at a noninsane price. But given your habits, I wouldn't trust you to stop doing impulse buys of disposable pods even if a refillable one was in your house and all you had to do was literally put a spoonful of coffee into it. A 12 ounce bag of 8 o’clock coffee with a 1 dollar coupon was $4.49 last week at wegman's, or $6/lb.
Savings: $6.08

Stf Rotiss Chkn  14 OZ 11.97
This is $13.68/lb, and wegmans had boneless/skinless chicken breasts on sale last week for $1.88/lb.
Savings: $10.32

Generic Food You Feel Good About Thin Sliced Chicken Cutlets 1 LB 7.91
NO. The chicken was 1.88/lb last week at the same store!
Savings: $6.03

Stouffers Fit Kitchen Monterey Chicken 14 OZ 11.97
No. $13.68/lb for chicken? No. It was 1.88/lb if you make it yourself.
Savings: $10.32

Amy's Pizza, Cheese 13 OZ 6.49
No. This is $8/lb. Make your own pizza, 50 cents for the crust, I’ll generously give you a dollar for all toppings.
Savings: $5

Amy's Pizza, Pesto 14 OZ 6.49
Nope. Make your own.
Savings: $5

Yasso Frozen Yogurt Bars, Greek, Coffee Chocolate Chip 14 FO 4.49
NO. You have a great price on milk in your area. Now you make your own yogurt and freeze it. Instead of $5/lb, you now spend 22 cents/lb, plus a little extra for sweetener
Savings: $4.25

Generic Food You Feel Good About Sour Cream 16 OZ 1.49
Now you make your own yogurt from your awesomely priced milk, and use the yogurt in place of sour cream.
Savings: $1.20

Tasty Bite Channa Masala 10 OZ 3.19
No. At $5/lb it’s too expensive. You need to learn to make your own for 50 cents/lb.
Savings: $2.87

Old El Paso Refried Beans, Traditional 16 OZ 1.29
Your wife stays home all day, she can manage cooking dried beans.
Savings: 50 cents

Silk Nutchello Nut-Based Beverage, Rich Dark Chocolate + Walnuts: 4.49
If you are lactose intolerant you now make your own rice milk. Here’s the directions: http://www.seriouseats.com/recipes/2012/12/diy-rice-milk-recipe.html
Savings: $4

Blue Diamond Almond Breeze Almondmilk, Unsweetened, Original 64 FO 2.99
No. You make your own rice milk now.
Savings: $2

Sargento Off the Block Shredded Cheese, Traditional Cut, Extra Sharp Cheddar 7 OZ 3.19
You got a pound of shredded cheese for 3.99 earlier on the receipt; why are you paying double for this cheese?
Savings: $1.44

Kraft Macaroni & Cheese Dinner, Original Flavor 7 OZ 2.18
Barilla pasta was $1.14 at wegmans last week with a coupon. Add a handful of your shredded cheese and a splash of milk to that instead of paying $5/lb for something less healthy.
Savings: $1.40

Goya Yellow Rice/C  8 OZ 1.99
$4/lb for rice is absurd. You should be able to find it for $1/lb.
Savings: $1.50

Monks' Bread, Wheat Wholegrain 16 OZ 2.59
No. Make your own bread for 50 cents or less.
Savings: $2

Hebrew National Franks, Beef, Jumbo 12 OZ 4.99
No. $6.65/lb - the b/s chicken breasts were way cheaper and healthier.
Savings: $2.78

Frontera Taco Skillet Sauce, Texas Original, Mild 8 OZ 2.49
No. Buy the dry spices, quit paying for something that’s probably mostly water.
Savings: $2

Generic Organic Rosemary Olive Oil Loaf 18 OZ 4.50
NO. Make your own bread for 50 cents, add rosemary to it if you want it fancy.
Savings: $4

Stonyfield Organic YoKids Smoothie, Strawbana, 1% Milkfat 19 FO 3.99
No. Make your own yogurt, make your own smoothies for $1/lb (cost of homemade yogurt and your crazy expensive bananas.)
Savings: $2.88

Generic Food You Feel Good About Steamables Jasmine White Rice 10 OZ 1.19
Look for a regular bag of dry rice. Forget paying for packaging.
Savings: $.62

Now the crap you shouldn't have bought at all:

Skinny Cow Candy, Dreamy Clusters, Milk Chocolate 6 OZ 3.99
You are paying over $10/lb for crap.
Savings: $3.99

Nest Skin Cow Crsp  5 OZ 3.99
Almost $13/lb for crap.
Savings: $3.99

Skinny Cow Candy, Dreamy Clusters, Dark Chocolate 6 OZ 3.99
NO. This is over $10/lb for garbage.
Savings: $3.19

Nestle Skinny Cow Candy Bar, Heavenly Crisp, Peanut Butter Flavor 5 OZ 3.99
No. This is crap.
Savings: $3.19

Nest Skinny Mk Cho  5 OZ 5.84
No. This is $18.68/lb for garbage.
Savings: 5.84

A & W Root Beer, Diet 2 L. 1.59
No. You drink tap water now.
Savings: 1.59

Generic Whipped Topping 8 OZ 1.29
No.
Savings: 1.29

Sprite Soda, Lemon-Lime 2 L. 1.69
No.
Savings: 1.69

Generic Food You Feel Good About Just Picked and Quickly Frozen Halves & Quarters Artichoke Hearts  12 OZ 3.99 I love artichoke hearts as much as anyone, but I gave them up as a luxury and you need to also.
Savings: 3.99

Wg Dessert Cups  5 OZ 2.00
NO. I don’t know what this is exactly, but it’s $6/lb for something I’m sure is junk food.
Savings: $2

Special K Pastry Crisps, Strawberry 4 OZ 2.99
NO. $12/lb for garbage.
Savings: 2.99

Generic Organic Food You Feel Good About Fruit Twists, Variety Pack, FAMILY 13 OZ Nature's Marketplace 6.99
NO. $8.60/lb. Just buy 13 oz of real fruit for $2. This is not something you can “feel good about.”
Savings: $5

Driscoll's Raspberries, Organic 6 OZ 3.49
No. Healthy, but at $9.30/lb you need to pick other fruit.

Honest Kids Juice Drink, Organic, Apple Ever After 54 FO 3.19
No. Train your kids to drink tap water.
Savings: 3.19

Carnation Breakfast Essentials Complete Nutritional Drink Creamy Strawberry
48 FO
18.87
NO. Make an actual breakfast. $6/lb is too much for fake food.

LesserEvil Buddha Bowl Foods Popcorn, Organic, Himalayan Pink
5 OZ
3.19
NO. It’s over $10/lb for something with no nutritional value.

Special K Cracker Chips, Honey Barbecue 4 OZ 5.98
NO. $24/lb for crackers? No. Make bread, eat bread instead of crackers. Or make crackers yourself.

----------
With all the carbs I eliminated, you may need to sub in some calories. But since it's almost all junk food, you could make a couple batches of cookies or popcorn that you pop from an actual bag of kernels for less than $5 total. Or even better, swap in more yogurt, maybe with fruit or toasted oatmeal for toppings.
« Last Edit: January 09, 2017, 07:56:30 AM by Jakejake »

Poundwise

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #143 on: January 08, 2017, 08:28:44 PM »
I live in NY  too.  Yes, the taxes and prices are something awful, and when Mr. Poundwise and I first moved here we were horrified at how the entire society seems to exist to peel the money off a person.  But the good news is with your income, with only a few small adjustments that you'll hardly miss, you'll be able to live as well as before.

You've gotten a lot of world-class advice here.  I have nothing to add but to ask, what are you going to do tomorrow?  Attack some of the low hanging fruit, like calling to downgrade your cable or cancel massage appointments?  Pack a home lunch? Have a chat with the wife? Join one of the MMM Gauntlet challenges for January? Or find a CPA to help you deal with the IRS issue?

You don't have to do it all at once, but you'll feel a lot better once you start. Good luck!!!

Splendid

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #144 on: January 08, 2017, 08:52:39 PM »
What I find interesting is that you were questioning why people made their own bread, and stated that you buy the cheap $0.99 white bread, but your receipt has two fancy (and expensive!) breads on it: Monks' Bread, Wheat Wholegrain (2.59) and Generic Organic Rosemary Olive Oil Loaf (4.50). I know this is just one receipt, and maybe they're an unusual purchase, but there seems to be some disconnect between what you think you do and what actually happens. You need to be honest and clear with yourself (and your wife!) about what is actually going on, what you actually spend your money on. Because I doubt that the bread scenario is the only place this happens. No shame, no blame, but clarity. On the plus side, since there's obviously a taste for some fancy bread, that could be a fun place for the family cooking to start. Easy, cheap, delicious, and seems like a decadent treat!

Bee21

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #145 on: January 09, 2017, 03:19:23 AM »
Avoid the middle aisles. It is sad that food companies managed to persuade us that the only way to feed our families is opening boxes, packets and bags. Cooking from scratch is not hard. There are heaps of video tutorials out there about how to make proper food. Check out the cooking videos at marthastewart, sarah carey is cooking everything there from brownies to salad dressing and she is awsome. Challenge yourself to learn how to cook without boxes and jars.Baking bread takes time but baking basic muffins takes only 30 minutes. Actually it doesn't take longer to make them from scratch than opening a box and adding the wet ingredients.

I recommend reading the kitchen counter cooking school, by kathleen flint, that might give you or the wife some ideas.

If impulse control is a problem, order the food online. The delivery fee will be well worth it if you buy only the items on your list. And don't  forget, you are not buying groceries, you are buying ingredients for the pre planned meals.

As for kids, you are the boss. I have a 5 and a 7 year old and they don't eat too much crap, because i don't buy them. Of course they are picky, but they have sandwiches, soups,  cut up fruit and vegetables, because that's what everyone is getting. I don't keep snacks and soft drinks in the house, because there is always screaming and tantrums about them, and i don't put up with that. My kids can make their own oj, lemonade, red drink (water and cushed berries), hot chocolate, they love mint tea. I bake a batch of muffins every week, freeze half of them and that's their treat. Today, they had 2 hummus and carrot wraps, a jam sandwich, homemade hummus dip and cucumber slices, cherry tomatoes, 3 crackers (i bought that) a banana muffin and 2 pieces of fruit in their lunch box. They don't eat much meat unfortunately, i hope that's a passing phase but at least we don't struggle with the rest of the food groups. I just finished yelling at them, because they refused to eat the lamb for dinner (but ate the salad, the peas and the sweat potatoes). Feeding kids is stressful.

And btw, how did the announcement about work lunches go? Got an appointment with a cpa yet? Have you contacted realtors?  Have you decided which credit card to pay off first?

Actually, can you sell something to give yourself a cash injection?  Any misjudged purchase you regret and still paying off?

ShoulderThingThatGoesUp

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #146 on: January 09, 2017, 03:23:27 AM »
Is that couch loan new? Did you add it because you bought couches this weekend?

katscratch

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #147 on: January 09, 2017, 04:09:20 AM »
I agree that you have a lot of room to cut your grocery budget.

I also agree that your family should start cooking every single meal from scratch.  No more prepackaged stuff that isn't good for you anyway.

What I want to add is that this will be hard at first.  It will take a long time to make meals if you're not used to cooking.  Definitely use a simple meal plan - heck for the first month I would even make the same 4-5 recipes on repeat until you and your wife have a routine down for cooking/cleanup.  Once you have meal planning and lunch-taking and cooking down pat, then expand the recipes.

I'll also say that sugar is wickedly addictive and your kids get a lot of it with all the prepackaged foods - they might act out pretty dramatically once all that is gone.  It will get better.  It'll be a great learning experience for them to see that you'll be a united front as parents and there is no turning back :) 

There's a lot of other fluff in your budget, but being able to prepare your meals is just as important as managing your money and will also lead to life-changing long term habits. 

RetiredAt63

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #148 on: January 09, 2017, 06:52:22 AM »
The Frugalwoods are always good to read (I recommend you and especially your wife read their whole blog) and today's is relevant.
http://www.frugalwoods.com/2017/01/09/my-foolproof-method-to-stop-impulse-spending/

kms

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Re: The beatles Case Study
« Reply #149 on: January 09, 2017, 07:57:59 AM »
The Frugalwoods are pretty extreme if you ask me. I consider myself decently frugal but I would never do what they do simply because I don't want to. I highly doubt beatles and his family will be able to go from their current lifestyle to dumpsterdiving for used clothes. If anything this will turn them away from the path to a frugal life. My suggestion at this point would be something much less radical: taking baby steps at a time and not overdoing it right away. I realize beatles is in deep shit (I'm still desperately trying to wrap my head around the fact that a 30-year old can be 100k in debt) but in the long run taking one baby step each couple of days can be much more effective than doing a full 180 within a week. It's like trying to help a hoarder - cleaning out their apartment while they're out to lunch isn't going to help them but cause so much emotional stress instead that it has the potential of breaking them. I see the same problem here: doing a full 180 within a few days might break beatles or his family, and that's certainly not what he wants.

beatles, there's been tons of really good advice here already, and I don't really have much to add. Just remember that we're here to help you, and not to mock you. Yes, it's going to be hard. Yes, you need to rethink your life decisions and the choices you've made so far. Yes, it will require your entire family and most importantly your wife to get onboard. But it will be worth it in the long run. Just remember that for most people on these forums the ultimate goal in life is financial independence and early retirement at age 45. I know this is not my ultimate goal, and it might not be yours either. Make sure you know what you want to achieve, write it down and live every day to get a little bit closer to that goal.