Author Topic: Retirement planning in UK  (Read 998 times)

UKLEARNING

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Retirement planning in UK
« on: January 16, 2021, 03:04:32 PM »
Life Situation:
Living in the UK (not London or a major city), renting, married, no dependents (but hope that will change in near future), I am late 30s, partner is early 40s. Most importantly for this question, very little pension saving to date between either of us, other than through very minimal ‘National Insurance’ scheme. All numbers in GBP – British pounds. I manage finances; partner is on board.

Gross Salary/Wages: Between both of us, about £54,360 per year, £4530 per month. I say ‘about’ because my partner’s income is variable. It breaks down to:
Me: £42,900 a year, £3575/month. Expected to go up to £4167/month from April.
Partner: variable. Can rely on about £9600 a year/£800 a month but is usually more like £11-13k a year.

Taxes and deductions (applicable to my income only):
Income tax: £481/month
Pension contributions: £154.05 to employer pension scheme (In line with UK law, my employer also contributes 3% to my pension. No further ‘matched’ contributions are on offer from my employer.)
Student loan: £178/month (this was a government loan and this is the minimum contribution. In the UK there is no value in paying off student loans any quicker than at minimum rates thanks to very low interest rates on student loans.)
Council tax is included in ‘spending’ below. It’s £120 a month.

Other income: We usually get various unpredictable bits of income from cashback, bank rewards, interest etc. This came to £561.28 in 2020 but is likely to be less this year as there aren’t such big rewards on offer for switching bank accounts.

Net Income: Not counting potential bank rewards etc, it’s £3383.51/month (assuming £950 from my partner’s work, which is what we use to budget). We give away 10% of this, so it then comes to £3045.16 available for spending.

Current expenses: I've attached our budget for 2021. For comparison, I have included what we actually spent in 2020. Some of these are over-budgeted (like internet) in case costs go up, so we may find savings by end of year.

Assets:
£6897.30 across two Help to Buy accounts – we currently save £200 a month in each, which is the maximum allowed. We are not particularly excited about buying a house, but Help to Buy is a very good offer for first time buyers, and it seemed like it might be sensible so we have somewhere to live when we’re retired, given our pension situation (see below).

About £3k in cash savings

We also have another approx 3K saved up in specific 'irregular expenses' categories (e.g. for expenses that are about to come up). The biggest of these are about £933 for car expenses between the two car categories, and £750 that we have saved up for holidays. Pretty much all cash savings are in a savings account with I think 0.50% AER (variable) - except those for imminent payments (e.g. car insurance and tax are due soon).

Investment in a Schroder ‘Balanced Fund Accumulation’ – having issues with online access so can’t see current valuation, but value of investments as of Oct 2020 was £9730.12

Liabilities:
£9,117.49 remaining on student loan, 1.1% interest, repayments in line with income, currently paying minimum rate as per above, gets forgiven if I reach age 65 without having repaid all of it.

Specific Question(s):
The big hole in our financial world is pensions. We are not particularly looking to retire early, but we are concerned about how little we have to support retirement at any age. We both have a handful of pension accounts from previous employment, none of which have much in them (hundreds, not thousands). Setting up the Help to Buy account a year ago was an attempt to rectify this – to give us somewhere to live in retirement.

Now we want to put the rest of our savings into a pension investment. We’ve got just shy of £150 a month to put towards that now, on top of our Help to Buy contributions, but as our income is expected to increase this year, we are planning to put all increases in income directly into a pension account. Our aim is to get to the ‘half our age, as a %’ going into pensions.

I haven’t set up a SIPP yet because investments overwhelm me and I wasn't sure what pension vehicle I should use. I have learned a fair amount from reading blogs and trying to self-educate but it’s been a steep learning curve. I am VERY good at not selling out of fear when markets crash, so I’m not worried about that, but I am not at all good at ‘managing’ accounts as it's almost like a foreign language to me. I have tried to research the ‘best’ or most diversified index fund investments for a pension and got a bit overwhelmed.

Given that, and from what I’ve read on here and on blogs, I am thinking of opening a Vanguard SIPP and then using a LifeStrategy 80 account within that, or probably even better, a ‘target retirement’ fund. I’m happy with a fairly high level of stocks relative to bonds, for now. I have very, very limited choice of funds with employer pension so don't really want to contribute more that way.

A few questions:
•   Does this sound sensible or would you recommend a different pathway?
•   Should I get two separate SIPPs for myself and my partner, with different companies, in case one goes under or has any issues (we know people who suffered with both having pensions in Northern Rock)
•   Should I get over myself and make myself learn how to manage investments so that I can get the lower fees of 0.15 or 0.16 instead of 0.24 on Vanguard’s target retirement fund?
•   Any other comments or glaring concerns from all of the above! We are very open to feedback and are learning – a bit late in life, but better late than never!

Edited to add: my workplace pension annual management cost is 0.40%
« Last Edit: January 17, 2021, 06:16:20 AM by UKLEARNING »

Vashy

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Re: Retirement planning in UK
« Reply #1 on: January 17, 2021, 05:20:40 AM »
One thing to consider I think is to make more use of pre-tax pension contribution via a salary sacrifice - essentially the government lets you take money from your gross salary and for your tax band, that's basically a roughly 20% saving/return upfront. You might also consolidate all the small company pensions into one for better overview/simplification, and it's quite possible that your main one is cheaper (if your employer has negotiated a good rate).

In the UK, the fully owned house is often a major part of people's pension - but you don't have that, and low pension reserves, so it feels to me like you might have to majorly beef up pension contributions to a) make use of the compound effect, and b) not end up essentially on the state pension to pay for ever-increasing costs of living/property if you don't own a house.

I see quite a bit of fat in the budget (holidays, gifts specifically) which, if reined in, would make a huge difference. I'd recommend you play with the pension calculators based on your outgoings, work out how much you need in terms of pensions, and then reverse engineer to see how much you need to save/invest. It might be sobering - it definitely was for me. Good luck!



UKLEARNING

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Re: Retirement planning in UK
« Reply #2 on: January 17, 2021, 06:14:40 AM »
Thanks for that Vashy, I really appreciate your reply.

My employer doesn't offer any salary sacrifice scheme (it's a really small business) but I could ask about it as I think it ultimately benefits them too. They might consider it. Thanks for the suggestion.

The Annual Management Charge on my workplace pension is 0.40% - hence wanting to put extra contributions into something cheaper. I think it would be very sensible to combine all the pension pots - I was thinking into two things i.e. 1. my workplace pension and 2. Vanguard SIPP with target retirement fund, as it's cheaper. Does that sound sensible to you? (Obviously disclaimers on financial advice fully recognised!)

You're absolutely right that we need to beef up our pension contributions. I'd like to get an account set up ASAP because I know that behaviorally, once something is there, we tend to siphon a lot more into it (we did that with Help to Buy until we maxed out our monthly contributions) but when it's sitting in our account we're more likely to spend it. I've played around with some of those pension calculators and they are pretty panic-inducing! Our current goal is to get to £400/month into Help to Buy (so that we can buy a house) and £580/month (between us) into pensions. We're a long way off that, I realise, but I think we'll get there quickly once we start making cuts because we're both on board.

Thanks for comments on the budget. We had a good conversation about holiday spending and cutting back today. Gifts is a harder one - we are both horrified by the yearly spend there but haven't worked out a good solution. I'm about to do some messaging to friends and family about whether we can all agree to spend less in this area, but it's a bit of a sensitive topic, especially as a pretty high earner!

Thanks again for taking the time to reply.

Vashy

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Re: Retirement planning in UK
« Reply #3 on: January 17, 2021, 08:09:29 AM »
My employer doesn't offer any salary sacrifice scheme (it's a really small business) but I could ask about it as I think it ultimately benefits them too. They might consider it. Thanks for the suggestion.

There might be tax benefits to them too - I'm unclear on the technicalities, but definitely a good avenue to have a look at - especially once your salary rises into the higher tax band (for example, I "sacrifice" every pound I make in the higher tax band so I'm keeping myself artificially in the 20% band - which is one way to combat lifestyle creep).

The Annual Management Charge on my workplace pension is 0.40% - hence wanting to put extra contributions into something cheaper. I think it would be very sensible to combine all the pension pots - I was thinking into two things i.e. 1. my workplace pension and 2. Vanguard SIPP with target retirement fund, as it's cheaper. Does that sound sensible to you? (Obviously disclaimers on financial advice fully recognised!)

In my view, 0.40% is actually pretty good (at my place it's 1% and it makes my eyes water). I've seen others at 1.25%, so I'd consolidate definitely somewhere that's nice and cheap. I don't know SIPPs - my post-tax contribution is in a Vanguard Stocks & Shares ISA, so I have no wisdom on that, but I'm sure some other UK folks can help. Might also be worth looking into whether you can get tax relief on post-tax pension contributions - worth calling an accountant for, or get a specialist opinion. Certainly as your salary increases there's ways to optimise things.

Also, in your late thirties you have a lot of time to ride the markets, so there could be a case made to go 100% equities - you have enough time to cope with the risks and swings and also the higher returns. My partner (aged 45) has his post-tax in Vanguard LifeStrategy 100 (so 100% equities) and it's done extremely well (28% return). You can slowly de-risk into bonds as you get closer to retirement, but it feels like you're at a stage where you can accept the risk and also need some very strong returns to set you up right for the next stage of the journey. 

You're absolutely right that we need to beef up our pension contributions. I'd like to get an account set up ASAP because I know that behaviorally, once something is there, we tend to siphon a lot more into it (we did that with Help to Buy until we maxed out our monthly contributions) but when it's sitting in our account we're more likely to spend it. I've played around with some of those pension calculators and they are pretty panic-inducing! Our current goal is to get to £400/month into Help to Buy (so that we can buy a house) and £580/month (between us) into pensions. We're a long way off that, I realise, but I think we'll get there quickly once we start making cuts because we're both on board.

Right? Those calculators definitely pack a punch. :) But yeah, while there are "mortgage versus investment" wars in the forum, I personally like owning a house, and the UK remains a market where buying a house is expensive but paying off a house is pretty cheap, and at the low interest rates currently, I feel it's a really good opportunity that's likely to last for a few more years. Provided you don't buy what MMM calls a "clown house", ie more house than you need.

Thanks for comments on the budget. We had a good conversation about holiday spending and cutting back today. Gifts is a harder one - we are both horrified by the yearly spend there but haven't worked out a good solution. I'm about to do some messaging to friends and family about whether we can all agree to spend less in this area, but it's a bit of a sensitive topic, especially as a pretty high earner!

I totally get that expectation and I imagine it's not an easy conversation to have because nobody wants to be seen as stingy when on the outside the money coming in looks good. If that's an issue, I'd definitely not talk about money/income numbers with people - though maybe tell them you're saving up for a house or paying down debt. You could also tell people that you'd rather put the money into one of those childrens' savings accounts for the future instead of adding to the tangible gift pile (the latter's something we do for Mr Vashy's godchildren) -  and then add sensible amounts or maybe even get the relevant other family to pitch in - all of that depends
on how generally wasteful spending is in your social circle. (Best of all, savings accounts mean you never have to worry about what to gift ever again, and there's a "delayed gratification" and "value of long-term savings" benefit here that might help others see the light, as it were.)

I'm sure other people on the forum have even more ideas. :)

UKLEARNING

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Re: Retirement planning in UK
« Reply #4 on: January 17, 2021, 03:51:18 PM »
Thank you for this!
Yes, you're right, I think I should consider 100% in stocks. I hadn't really considered that and if I could do that for say a decade, it could give me a bit of a head start with enough times to bring stability a bit later.
Hadn't thought of savings accounts for the kids - that's a good idea!
(Totally hear you on the stress of thinking of things too)
Yes hoping to hear others' ideas too - and thank you for your time!
Rachel

 

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