Case Study: Northern Rockies DINKs Seeking Input from Wise Mustachians

[Speedgoats]

We discovered the idea of FIRE in 2016 after hearing Dave Ramsey’s podcast and have since come to love reading the MMM forums. We’d appreciate any thoughts, critiques or face punches that you’d care to offer.

Life Situation:
Married filing jointly. No dependents. DW and I are both 40. No kids. Northern Rockies, MCOL area.
Here’s the breakdown:

Gross salary: $165k

Pre Tax Deductions:
Pre-tax simple IRA: $13,000
Pre-tax HSA: $6750
Total: $19,750
AGI: $145,250

Taxes: 

Federal: 18,735.84
Social Security: 10,138.32
Medicare: 2371.20
State: 8,189.28

Total Taxes: $39,434.64

Take Home Yearly: ~$105,815.36

Current Yearly Expenses:
Roth IRA savings: $12,000
Mortgage: $1896 PITI x 12 = $22,752
DW Health Insurance Premium = $2,664
Gym: $696
Electric & Gas: $1200
Car Insurance (2 vehicles): $2300
Cell Phone: $2040
Spotify/iTunes/Netflix/Google: $360
Internet & DirecTv: $1644
Trash: $372
Gasoline for vehicles: $2400
Recycling: $240
Groceries: $4800 ($400/month)
CSA: $500
DW allowance: $5,520
DH allowance: $5,520 (allowance is for clothes, haircuts, drinks/dinner out with friends, toys (new bikes!), etc...
Extra mortgage payment: $39,120 ($3260/month)
Date Night: $1200
Charity: $600
Side hustle: $600 - this is generating very little money - evaluating this.
Cushion: $50-$2800 -fluctuates monthly - used for random bills, life insurance, tires, car repairs/maintenance, etc. Get various misc. reimbursements from work that we put here.

Total Yearly Spending: $106,528-$110,344

Assets:

DW Trad IRA: $103K
DH Trad IRA: $4,200
DW Roth: $33,000
DH Roth: $78,000
DH Simple IRA: $67,000
Money Market/Emergency: $27,000

Of the above investment portfolio, approx. 60% are in US equities, 25% non-US equities, 5% fixed income, 3% cash alternatives, and rest cash.

Residence: ~$500,000 - we purchased a foreclosed home on 4 acres only 8 miles on surface streets from our downtown mountain town in 2011, and built a new custom home. A creek flows through the middle of our property, we can’t see our neighbors, lots of wildlife on property. We ended up with our dream property at age 34 and want to keep it for the duration.


Other savings: $3,000
DH vehicle: 2008 Tacoma - $8,000 - will drive till it falls apart
DW vehicle: 2010 Honda Fit - $8,000  - gonna keep for awhile
Jewelry: $15,000

Liabilities:
Mortgage: $76,000 on a 30/yr 4.0% fixed

Net worth:
$770,200

Specific Question: We aren’t entirely sure what we want to be doing in 10 years, but we don’t think E.R. is the answer. We both need something to do, we’re both creative and driven, and we both want to feel productive. DW works remotely and DH has a good job with great time off and flexibility. One goal we know is  that we both want to spend our winters elsewhere: somewhere warmer. DW could do this now but DH might have to shift a bit in current job to make this happen. In an attempt to get to FI sooner, we’ve dabbled in renting out our house (primary residence) through Airbnb. We don’t mind this and enjoy the money we get ($250/night). We live in a college town and are intrigued with the idea of renting our house to grad students or visiting professors for the spring semester, allowing us to be somewhere warm January until mid-May. While we don’t want to stop working, we both work a lot at fairly high-paced jobs and we do want the option to work less, take some more risks with sabbaticals and also have the option to try new things (DW interested in starting her own business, DH also interested in business ventures, maybe real estate?). Being fairly FI would give us the stability we would need to take risks and try new things for a while. Working less could mean seasonal, or 3 days a week or 4 hours a day, we’re not sure. We’ve gone pretty fullbore with the MMM way of life, limiting our spending, our only protein is wild game, biking to work (not in winter), etc and feel that we have learned to enjoy a frugal life without feeling too deprived. The question is, I guess, aside from you telling us to not pay down our house (we’re on track to have it paid off Dec 2020 and we know some of you will take umbrage w. that :)), are there any suggestions, things we’re missing, or should be doing? We figure if we put away 25K a year for next 10 years we’ll be in good shape by age 50. Can we cut back on work, make significantly less and put only a minimum of 25K into our retirement plan? What might we be missing? Our house will be paid off in roughly 13 months out, which will free up $58,272 a year (mortgage plus extra payment minus current property taxes). Sure we could keep on our same track and put that right into mutual funds, etc, but we’d like to cut back some and try new things.

Other questions:
How do we reduce our AGI? We don’t have kids. DW works for a small family business with no 401K option.

[terran]

The HSA limit for 2019 is $7000, and $7100 in 2020.

Since your wife is not covered by a retirement plan at work (and you are) and your MAGI is under $193k, she could contribute to traditional IRA instead of Roth: https://www.irs.gov/retirement-plans/2019-ira-deduction-limits-effect-of-modified-agi-on-deduction-if-you-are-not-covered-by-a-retirement-plan-at-work

[MoneyizHere]

Definite go T-IRA instead of ROTH for your situation for 2020 - you're getting killed on taxes without any child-tax credits there.  I estimate at least $2k saved on State/Fed taxes by doing so. (make sure you adjust your Fed/State withhholding for 2020 accordingly).
You could Increase your Simple IRA to maximum contribution for pre-tax - figure thats 19k. 
Getting rid of that mortgage would be great for your cash-flow - pour it into maxing out that Simple IRA
(I'd say when you're close enough - use the Emergency fund/excess cash to totally wipe it out sooner), then rebuild the E fund since you'll be really accelerating your cash flow after mortgage gets wiped out. 

Life Insurance:  since you're not really looking to RE - evaluate your life insurance situation
Cell Phones - seems high-  evaluate cheaper plans (this might include phone payments - but alot of carriers offering free premium phones now for switching to them ie Tmobile).
Your groceries seem high considering your protein is wild game
Car insurance seems quite high - considering older cars - assuming you're on full-coverage still - but you'll be able to afford a replacement vehicle with your cash flow starting in 2020 - so evaluate dropping the extras and definitely shop the quote around. 

You're already putting away $32k each year between the Ira's/simple IRA and HSA.  Why not increase your saving even after the Mortgage is done with?  Figure you could drop that extra $58k into savings and really accelerate your options.  Having the big stash gives you options...you'll definitely be ready with $90k savings for 10 years - but for only $25k being put away - I don't really think the math works out to be favorable for your goal of 10 years.  You're not looking to get rid of the residence - so you really need to look at your liquid assets as being your worth rather than including that. 

You could always accelerate it even more by cutting your expenses.

So far so good - but in your place - I'd evaluate fully dropping the mortgage cash flow into furthering your savings to really give yourself options.  Otherwise I'd imagine that you're just asking if you could inflate your lifestyle more now?

[somers515]

First off welcome!

You say you aren't interested in RE but you are interested in FI.  It appears that you want to be FI for the added flexibility it will give you.  How much do you want that?  The answer to that question will guide you as you make your decisions about what to spend money on.  It's really just that simple.

I find that just tracking my expenses helps to remind me if my spending is consistent with my priorities.  I recommend you change where you put stuff in your description below because it helps make more clear how much you are spending and how much you are saving etc.

https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2015/01/26/calculating-net-worth/

So your contributions to IRAs are savings not spending.  The link above explains not only how to calculate your net worth but also your spending and savings rate.  Once you know how much you are actually spending and how much you are actually saving THEN you can determine how many years you are from being FI.  Also it makes it easier to keep your spending priorities straight.

There is a lot of stuff that seems really expensive to me that I wouldn't budget for if I was really interested in reaching FI.  Sure you are very good compared to an average USA consumer but do you want to be better than average and slowly get to FI or be a little more aggressive and reach FI much sooner?

Gym $58 a month?  Exercise is important but is there no way you can't just run or bike or work out on your own to get the exercise you need?
Cell Phone?  Others have mentioned you can easily cut costs here.  My family of 4 spends $100 per month.
Spotify/iTunes/Netflix/Google/Internet/DirecTV?  How much do you want to watch tv and listen to music more than being FI?
Gasoline for vehicles: $2400?  That's a lot of driving.  Do you have long commutes?  Before each drive calculate how much it will cost you (hint its not just gas) and perhaps that will help you reduce some frivolous driving.
Recycling: $240?  What's this just curious?
Groceries: $4800 ($400/month)?  Seems ok to me if you weren't eating out all the time . . but . . .
is CSA also groceries?  and you do seem to be eating out quite a bit as its hard to tell from the way you broke this down with your "allowances" and "date nights" - I'm guessing its pretty sizable if you tracked it.
Extra mortgage payment: $39,120 ($3260/month)?  I sure hope this is all going to principal.  The way you phrase it makes me nervous for you.  There is an endless debate on MMM forums about if you should invest or pay down your mortgage as you seem to be aware but please make sure if you are paying it down you are paying all toward principal.  Also this would go in the savings column, its not spend.

Your assets allocation is one more typical of someone nearing or at FI then someone trying to grow their money to reach FI if you know what I mean.  If my calculations are correct you have 10% in cash and cash alternatives and that is a high percentage.  You should give this thought and make sure your asset allocation is right for you and your goals.  I'd also check to make sure you investments are not in high fees accounts as you mention "mutual funds" instead of index funds.

The residence you describe sounds awesome to me and would certainly give me a strong incentive to save and allow myself more time to enjoy the property rather than working to pay for dinners out and watching tv and driving back and forth to the gym.  I say these things not to be judgmental (but you did invite face punches) but because you should be asking yourself how important these things are to you vs being FI.  That's an answer only you can give.  The fact that you are on this forum asking questions shows that you want to be thoughtful about it.

I hope you find this helpful and I wish you much success on your journey to FI!

[terran]

You could Increase your Simple IRA to maximum contribution for pre-tax - figure thats 19k. 

No, they've already maxed it at $13k: https://www.irs.gov/retirement-plans/plan-participant-employee/retirement-topics-simple-ira-contribution-limits

$19k is the 401(k)/403(b)/457(b) salary deferral limit.

[insufFIcientfunds]

Hi @Speedgoats, welcome! I am newer too. I read something the other day from a highly respected forum member regarding "face punching" I thought was interesting:

[b]"Quote from: FIRE for Effect on October 24, 2019, 08:36:31 PM
Read the next bullet before face punches.
I’m a goddamned 2x combat veteran of the 101st Airborne, so spare me the face punches telling me I need to toughen up. Not planning to discuss our personal disabilities in this space.

@arebelspy, we talked about this once several years ago, but I’ll bring it up again (in public) since this is a military example of the issue.

I think the posters of this forum would benefit from self-regulating a change to the face-punching commentary.

Long long ago in a blog post far far away, Pete mentioned “face punch” in an offhanded comment about hair-on-fire debt emergencies.  It was described as self-administered (“Give yourself a face punch”), and then he moved on to the point of his debt comment.

Since that blog post, way too many forum posters have enthusiastically volunteered for face-punching duty— to other posters.  It’s not the way Pete intended his comment to be interpreted.

Those poster attitudes add a tone to this forum which I’ve felt is needlessly confrontational and even offensive.  Now that a combat vet feels obligated to bring it up on their very first post, other forum members might conclude that it’s an issue derived from a military stereotype.  Yet it’s really coming from the forum’s interpretation of Pete’s tangential comment.

It’s also a needless distraction from helping people to help themselves.

I suspect that the attitude might be making life harder for you moderators.  If that cultural face-punching issue could be clarified or even eliminated then it might make life easier for everyone."[/b]

Congrats on your progress and good luck as you move through your journey. Hopefully you will get some good advice (without the face-punching!)

[Speedgoats]

The HSA limit for 2019 is $7000, and $7100 in 2020.

Since your wife is not covered by a retirement plan at work (and you are) and your MAGI is under $193k, she could contribute to traditional IRA instead of Roth: https://www.irs.gov/retirement-plans/2019-ira-deduction-limits-effect-of-modified-agi-on-deduction-if-you-are-not-covered-by-a-retirement-plan-at-work

Thanks -- great -- makes sense.

[Speedgoats]

Definite go T-IRA instead of ROTH for your situation for 2020 - you're getting killed on taxes without any child-tax credits there.  I estimate at least $2k saved on State/Fed taxes by doing so. (make sure you adjust your Fed/State withhholding for 2020 accordingly).
You could Increase your Simple IRA to maximum contribution for pre-tax - figure thats 19k. 
Getting rid of that mortgage would be great for your cash-flow - pour it into maxing out that Simple IRA
(I'd say when you're close enough - use the Emergency fund/excess cash to totally wipe it out sooner), then rebuild the E fund since you'll be really accelerating your cash flow after mortgage gets wiped out. 

Life Insurance:  since you're not really looking to RE - evaluate your life insurance situation
Cell Phones - seems high-  evaluate cheaper plans (this might include phone payments - but alot of carriers offering free premium phones now for switching to them ie Tmobile).
Your groceries seem high considering your protein is wild game
Car insurance seems quite high - considering older cars - assuming you're on full-coverage still - but you'll be able to afford a replacement vehicle with your cash flow starting in 2020 - so evaluate dropping the extras and definitely shop the quote around. 

You're already putting away $32k each year between the Ira's/simple IRA and HSA.  Why not increase your saving even after the Mortgage is done with?  Figure you could drop that extra $58k into savings and really accelerate your options.  Having the big stash gives you options...you'll definitely be ready with $90k savings for 10 years - but for only $25k being put away - I don't really think the math works out to be favorable for your goal of 10 years.  You're not looking to get rid of the residence - so you really need to look at your liquid assets as being your worth rather than including that. 

You could always accelerate it even more by cutting your expenses.

So far so good - but in your place - I'd evaluate fully dropping the mortgage cash flow into furthering your savings to really give yourself options.  Otherwise I'd imagine that you're just asking if you could inflate your lifestyle more now?

Thank you! Love the suggestion to pull from Emergency fund for mortgage when time is right, DW been pushing for that but DH has been more cautious ;)
Also like suggestion to pare down car insurance considering cars are older. Hadn't thought to run it that way.
Cell phones + gasoline - we are in a more rural area with one major cell option. total plans for two people is $140 a month plus we have replacement insurance since we have old phones. we do get partial cell reimbursements from work. we have brought this down I think as far as we can (phones are not financed). Gasoline - we don't drive much, DW works from home, DH bikes 100 days a year. this number might actually be a little higher than actual but at the same time we do drive to do hikes or big bike rides on weekends. but yes a good call-out.
Life insurance - when would you recommend cutting that out? Maybe when mortgage paid off?
Groceries - ha we love bragging to friends how "low" our grocery bill is but yes point taken. we could likely cut this by $50 a month or a bit more.

re: savings after mortgage paid off: yeah we are tinkering with all of these options. do we keep our current jobs for a while and put away 60K a year and really pad the stash? do we cut back hours and save less? The truth is we both have a bit of an entrepreneurial bug and like the idea of taking risks for a few years to build our own shared business or businesses ... and do some travel/exploring ... we don't have children and not much to "lose." but maybe would be smarter to pad the stache for a few more years and then take a leap. DW is more risk-willing, DH perhaps a bit more risk-adverse. Renting out our primary residence for a few years and living somewhere dirt cheap while working remotely is also a feasible option. Hmm ...

[Speedgoats]

First off welcome!

You say you aren't interested in RE but you are interested in FI.  It appears that you want to be FI for the added flexibility it will give you.  How much do you want that?  The answer to that question will guide you as you make your decisions about what to spend money on.  It's really just that simple.

I find that just tracking my expenses helps to remind me if my spending is consistent with my priorities.  I recommend you change where you put stuff in your description below because it helps make more clear how much you are spending and how much you are saving etc.

https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2015/01/26/calculating-net-worth/

So your contributions to IRAs are savings not spending.  The link above explains not only how to calculate your net worth but also your spending and savings rate.  Once you know how much you are actually spending and how much you are actually saving THEN you can determine how many years you are from being FI.  Also it makes it easier to keep your spending priorities straight.

There is a lot of stuff that seems really expensive to me that I wouldn't budget for if I was really interested in reaching FI.  Sure you are very good compared to an average USA consumer but do you want to be better than average and slowly get to FI or be a little more aggressive and reach FI much sooner?

Gym $58 a month?  Exercise is important but is there no way you can't just run or bike or work out on your own to get the exercise you need?
Cell Phone?  Others have mentioned you can easily cut costs here.  My family of 4 spends $100 per month.
Spotify/iTunes/Netflix/Google/Internet/DirecTV?  How much do you want to watch tv and listen to music more than being FI?
Gasoline for vehicles: $2400?  That's a lot of driving.  Do you have long commutes?  Before each drive calculate how much it will cost you (hint its not just gas) and perhaps that will help you reduce some frivolous driving.
Recycling: $240?  What's this just curious?
Groceries: $4800 ($400/month)?  Seems ok to me if you weren't eating out all the time . . but . . .
is CSA also groceries?  and you do seem to be eating out quite a bit as its hard to tell from the way you broke this down with your "allowances" and "date nights" - I'm guessing its pretty sizable if you tracked it.
Extra mortgage payment: $39,120 ($3260/month)?  I sure hope this is all going to principal.  The way you phrase it makes me nervous for you.  There is an endless debate on MMM forums about if you should invest or pay down your mortgage as you seem to be aware but please make sure if you are paying it down you are paying all toward principal.  Also this would go in the savings column, its not spend.

Your assets allocation is one more typical of someone nearing or at FI then someone trying to grow their money to reach FI if you know what I mean.  If my calculations are correct you have 10% in cash and cash alternatives and that is a high percentage.  You should give this thought and make sure your asset allocation is right for you and your goals.  I'd also check to make sure you investments are not in high fees accounts as you mention "mutual funds" instead of index funds.

The residence you describe sounds awesome to me and would certainly give me a strong incentive to save and allow myself more time to enjoy the property rather than working to pay for dinners out and watching tv and driving back and forth to the gym.  I say these things not to be judgmental (but you did invite face punches) but because you should be asking yourself how important these things are to you vs being FI.  That's an answer only you can give.  The fact that you are on this forum asking questions shows that you want to be thoughtful about it.

I hope you find this helpful and I wish you much success on your journey to FI!

Thanks a bunch, you're right we didn't categorize this correctly. Roth Savings and the extra mortgage payments should have gone under savings.

Good face punches re: expenses :)
Gym is high yes. this is for DW who works from home and uses gym for social hours too. However, your post inspires us to go in and negotiate it down, I think they would be amenable because I think there are some extra perks included here. good inspiration to research.
Subscriptions - yes message received ... Spotify can likely go as we can live with commercials :) Direct TV can likely go too. Sigh.
Recycling: we live in a rural area and its not included with our waste management carrier which sucks. its important to us to recycle (our plastic esp.) so we pay $20 / month for a service.
Groceries: we are giggling at the Grocery face punches. you should have seen what it used to be. yes CSA is all produce from our local neighbor we love supporting. point taken, we will try to nudge this down, we are def food snobs and organic is important to us.
Extra mortgage payments are ALL going to principal. 13 months away!
Thank You!

 

[Speedgoats]

You could Increase your Simple IRA to maximum contribution for pre-tax - figure thats 19k. 

No, they've already maxed it at $13k: https://www.irs.gov/retirement-plans/plan-participant-employee/retirement-topics-simple-ira-contribution-limits

$19k is the 401(k)/403(b)/457(b) salary deferral limit.

Thx for confirming this, 13K is our understanding too.

[Speedgoats]

Hi @Speedgoats, welcome! I am newer too. I read something the other day from a highly respected forum member regarding "face punching" I thought was interesting:

[b]"Quote from: FIRE for Effect on October 24, 2019, 08:36:31 PM
Read the next bullet before face punches.
I’m a goddamned 2x combat veteran of the 101st Airborne, so spare me the face punches telling me I need to toughen up. Not planning to discuss our personal disabilities in this space.

@arebelspy, we talked about this once several years ago, but I’ll bring it up again (in public) since this is a military example of the issue.

I think the posters of this forum would benefit from self-regulating a change to the face-punching commentary.

Long long ago in a blog post far far away, Pete mentioned “face punch” in an offhanded comment about hair-on-fire debt emergencies.  It was described as self-administered (“Give yourself a face punch”), and then he moved on to the point of his debt comment.

Since that blog post, way too many forum posters have enthusiastically volunteered for face-punching duty— to other posters.  It’s not the way Pete intended his comment to be interpreted.

Those poster attitudes add a tone to this forum which I’ve felt is needlessly confrontational and even offensive.  Now that a combat vet feels obligated to bring it up on their very first post, other forum members might conclude that it’s an issue derived from a military stereotype.  Yet it’s really coming from the forum’s interpretation of Pete’s tangential comment.

It’s also a needless distraction from helping people to help themselves.

I suspect that the attitude might be making life harder for you moderators.  If that cultural face-punching issue could be clarified or even eliminated then it might make life easier for everyone."[/b]

Congrats on your progress and good luck as you move through your journey. Hopefully you will get some good advice (without the face-punching!)

Thank you for this, ironically enough I read this same post this morning. I think it's an interesting balance for the forum to manage. I love the idea of holding one another accountable. It's critical, and important not to sugarcoat when someone is not making great decisions financially. It should involve some tough love. But also, coming from a place of compassion is important, bringing a bit of lightness to it all ... being closer to RE or FI than another does not make one of us "better" and using a term like face punch might imply it. We each only have one spin on this earth so why not start from there and and collaborate and dialogue accordingly. There is likely something for each of us to learn in every post, right?

But, whatever. We're new after all.

(Maybe "gut punch" is a better term.)

[somers515]

First off welcome!

...

I hope you find this helpful and I wish you much success on your journey to FI!

Thanks a bunch, you're right we didn't categorize this correctly. Roth Savings and the extra mortgage payments should have gone under savings.

Good face punches re: expenses :)
Gym is high yes. this is for DW who works from home and uses gym for social hours too. However, your post inspires us to go in and negotiate it down, I think they would be amenable because I think there are some extra perks included here. good inspiration to research.
Subscriptions - yes message received ... Spotify can likely go as we can live with commercials :) Direct TV can likely go too. Sigh.
Recycling: we live in a rural area and its not included with our waste management carrier which sucks. its important to us to recycle (our plastic esp.) so we pay $20 / month for a service.
Groceries: we are giggling at the Grocery face punches. you should have seen what it used to be. yes CSA is all produce from our local neighbor we love supporting. point taken, we will try to nudge this down, we are def food snobs and organic is important to us.
Extra mortgage payments are ALL going to principal. 13 months away!
Thank You!

Phew so glad to hear its going all to principal!  And fascinating to hear about the recycling expense, I learn something new every day.

Good luck on your journey as you try to nudge your spend even more into the right direction.  For me its not about getting your spend as low as possible but instead thinking critically about where your money is going and making sure it is spent and saved consistent with your priorities.  Sounds like you are on the right path.  Would love to hear an occasional update!

[insufFIcientfunds]

Hi @Speedgoats, welcome! I am newer too. I read something the other day from a highly respected forum member regarding "face punching" I thought was interesting:

[b]"Quote from: FIRE for Effect on October 24, 2019, 08:36:31 PM
Read the next bullet before face punches.
I’m a goddamned 2x combat veteran of the 101st Airborne, so spare me the face punches telling me I need to toughen up. Not planning to discuss our personal disabilities in this space.

@arebelspy, we talked about this once several years ago, but I’ll bring it up again (in public) since this is a military example of the issue.

I think the posters of this forum would benefit from self-regulating a change to the face-punching commentary.

Long long ago in a blog post far far away, Pete mentioned “face punch” in an offhanded comment about hair-on-fire debt emergencies.  It was described as self-administered (“Give yourself a face punch”), and then he moved on to the point of his debt comment.

Since that blog post, way too many forum posters have enthusiastically volunteered for face-punching duty— to other posters.  It’s not the way Pete intended his comment to be interpreted.

Those poster attitudes add a tone to this forum which I’ve felt is needlessly confrontational and even offensive.  Now that a combat vet feels obligated to bring it up on their very first post, other forum members might conclude that it’s an issue derived from a military stereotype.  Yet it’s really coming from the forum’s interpretation of Pete’s tangential comment.

It’s also a needless distraction from helping people to help themselves.

I suspect that the attitude might be making life harder for you moderators.  If that cultural face-punching issue could be clarified or even eliminated then it might make life easier for everyone."[/b]

Congrats on your progress and good luck as you move through your journey. Hopefully you will get some good advice (without the face-punching!)

Thank you for this, ironically enough I read this same post this morning. I think it's an interesting balance for the forum to manage. I love the idea of holding one another accountable. It's critical, and important not to sugarcoat when someone is not making great decisions financially. It should involve some tough love. But also, coming from a place of compassion is important, bringing a bit of lightness to it all ... being closer to RE or FI than another does not make one of us "better" and using a term like face punch might imply it. We each only have one spin on this earth so why not start from there and and collaborate and dialogue accordingly. There is likely something for each of us to learn in every post, right?

But, whatever. We're new after all.

(Maybe "gut punch" is a better term.)

I learn something in every post I read! I take things here as a "reality check" as opposed to a "face punch" lol. I used to just save 10% of my pay (of ~90k) because it was higher than what any of my co-workers do. Then I read things here and it's like "oh sh*t"...reality sets in, so I do the math to max out my 401k between Sept of this year and Dec.

I suppose what I learned most of is that I want to be more MMM than Spendy Pants, and this place acts like somewhat of a reality check for me.

Love the extra principal payments, that's amazing.