Author Topic: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?  (Read 13988 times)

Slow2FIRE

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Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« on: August 04, 2016, 06:47:46 PM »
- edited for privacy -
« Last Edit: December 09, 2016, 06:40:45 PM by Slow2FIRE »

boy_bye

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #1 on: August 04, 2016, 06:53:53 PM »
I don't know much about these places but I do know that Boise, ID is one of the hottest places I have ever  been. I was there for a week last summer and the extreme heat + wind made it fairly unpleasant to be outside after like 10 am. I thought it was a super cute town, though -- unexpectedly great food -- I just hated the weather that week so much.

I'm living in Boulder now (renting) and like even the hottest weather here a lot more.

Roland of Gilead

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #2 on: August 04, 2016, 06:58:51 PM »
Spokane is hot in the summer (90s) and cold in the winter (10 to 40)

You might look into the coast of Washington around Ocean Shores.  50 to 75 all year.  Rains a bit.  Go in the summer and you will think you are in heaven.  Much cheaper land than Seattle, about 1.5 hours from Portland.

Telecaster

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #3 on: August 04, 2016, 07:42:26 PM »
Wind blows like mad in Ocean Shores. 

TomTX

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #4 on: August 04, 2016, 07:50:33 PM »
Hawaii

Probably Kona at your income level. They have a Costco and an airport.

Laserjet3051

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #5 on: August 04, 2016, 08:50:36 PM »
Olympia, WA.

Not too cold, not too hot, not too expensive. Seattle driveable.

tj

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #6 on: August 04, 2016, 08:53:22 PM »
We have some family in Colorado Springs. My parents tell me it's a very religious place if that makes any difference to you.

Choices

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #7 on: August 04, 2016, 09:34:10 PM »
For background, I'm a Phoenix native who spent a few years on the east coast and a few more in Nashville, so my thoughts might be similar to your wife's-

1.  The sun is very important. Gray, dreary clouds do dampen your mood if you're used to sunshine. Being able to see the horizon is important. Tall buildings or thick, tall trees can make you feel claustrophobic.

2. Not having to shovel snow is very important. If you can't get to work because the roads haven't been plowed and you have a job you have to be at on time, this equals disaster. Not having a garage and not knowing if you'll need to get up an hour early to shovel the car out and shovel the walk gets old pretty fast.

***Alert, the following statements are from my experience only. Take them with a grain of salt.***

3. Nashville is a very fun city for vacation with a lot to see and do. It has a fairly low cost of living, decent freeways, and all the amenities of a big city. The music there is truly incredible.

4. People there "smile through gritted teeth," so they're friendly to your face but don't speak their minds if there's a problem, or at least they don't tell the person who needs to know. Any insult or meanness will be followed with "bless your heart," which is supposed to make the inappropriate comment okay somehow.

5. There's also a large amount of social importance placed on where you attend church, so if you're not religious it will be harder but not impossible to fit in.

6. It's the South. There are a lot of transplants from other areas, so it's not the Deep South, but it's still the south. If you're not white, you're not likely to feel very welcome at times. The neighborhoods can be quite segregated.

7. It's about 50 years behind in terms of gender roles as well. There are exceptions, but many people are surprised to see female physicians and even more surprised when you don't quit your job when you get married so you can raise the kids and have plastic surgery.

8. There is a lot of nature to enjoy and countless gorgeous hikes within a day's drive.

My vote would be for Flagstaff. It's lots of fun, and if there's a cold snap she can always warm up in Phoenix for a few days.

MoonLiteNite

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #8 on: August 05, 2016, 02:26:24 AM »
I would love to move to the northwest, idaho/oregon area. Cheap land and everything.

My only requirement would be a ping of less than 20ms to google.com and at least 300mb connection.

I have a feeling need to wait another 50 years until that will happen.

ShoulderThingThatGoesUp

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #9 on: August 05, 2016, 05:55:59 AM »
Corpus Christi, Texas - it's a substantial city (> 300,000 people), the climate is not so severe especially if you're on the barrier islands (seem to run about 10 degrees cooler than inland in the summer), it's cheap, and a decent mix of Southwest and South. The airport can get you anywhere with one hop to DFW.

Hurricanes are an issue, but compared to the coasts of Washington and Oregon with the Cascadia subduction zone hanging over their heads, you get tons of warning and the solution is easy if somewhat annoying - go west.

Topography is definitely lacking, but the Padre Island National Seashore is close and impressive.

gggggg

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #10 on: August 05, 2016, 06:22:13 AM »
I have always lived in the southeast us. It's ok, but I've enjoyed the time I spent in the southwest us (nm,az). There's something about the desert-y west to me. I think I'm just tired of the southeast to be honest.

driftwood

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #11 on: August 05, 2016, 06:41:49 AM »
Just north of Durango where the main color goes from brown to green. 

Blatant

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #12 on: August 05, 2016, 06:55:08 AM »
I'm in Phoenix. I love Flag, but wouldn't necessarily want to live there year-round due to the winter weather. I guess my opinion is just different in regard to Prescott. I think it's awesome and I'm in my 40s. I go there pretty regularly and don't get the "retirement" vibe you talk about. It's on my short list of potential locations when I pull the pin.

Charlie Foxtrot

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #13 on: August 05, 2016, 07:22:44 AM »
Hi all:

Trying to pull off FIRE in one year and need to move to LCOL place to do it. We are a family of 4 in Ohio and originally looked at Fountain Hills AZ in Phoenix. Decided it might be too pricey as2 school districts are still important to us. Then looked at Tucson and surprised to see it is a little cheaper and slightly cooler than Phoenix. We are flying out next month to take a look.

Anyone have any good or bad thoughts on Tucson. We were looking at Oro Valley as it seems to be a poor mans Longmont!

Choices

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #14 on: August 05, 2016, 08:25:07 AM »
Hi all:

Trying to pull off FIRE in one year and need to move to LCOL place to do it. We are a family of 4 in Ohio and originally looked at Fountain Hills AZ in Phoenix. Decided it might be too pricey as2 school districts are still important to us. Then looked at Tucson and surprised to see it is a little cheaper and slightly cooler than Phoenix. We are flying out next month to take a look.

Anyone have any good or bad thoughts on Tucson. We were looking at Oro Valley as it seems to be a poor mans Longmont!

Many people love Tucson because it has more of a small-town feel than Phoenix, even though it has 1M people. It has hiking and skiing nearby and is also close to Mexico. The main complaints are the traffic (the freeway system has not grown with the city), the airport (most people drive to Phoenix to avoid the extra leg of most flights), and that many concerts and events come to Phoenix rather than Tucson. The big sports teams are also in Phoenix, though the U of A usually has some decent teams. Some of these won't matter much to a true mustachian.

If there's an accident or construction on I-10 between Phoenix and Tucson, it backs up for hours and there isn't a great bypass option.
« Last Edit: August 05, 2016, 11:42:15 AM by Julie@ChooseBetterLife »

mm1970

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #15 on: August 05, 2016, 09:09:18 AM »
I have friends in Santa Fe and I love the area.

gggggg

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #16 on: August 05, 2016, 09:15:31 AM »
I have friends in Santa Fe and I love the area.

Shh, keep Santa Fe a secret!

dcheesi

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #17 on: August 05, 2016, 09:24:52 AM »
Quote
Reno, NV (at first glance just seems expensive to fly to Phoenix for visiting family and the State Income tax savings EASILY covers the difference in housing costs vs our current rental in Phoenix and the cost of flights - not sure what the negatives are about Reno)
I've only visited Reno, but it seemed like a very depressing place. All the sleaze of Vegas without much of the glitz. Plus everything just has a run-down feeling to it. YMMV of course, and I have no idea what the suburbs are like.

Slow&Steady

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #18 on: August 05, 2016, 09:27:48 AM »
I have friends in Santa Fe and I love the area.

Shh, keep Santa Fe a secret!
+1

ohmylookatthat

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #19 on: August 05, 2016, 10:35:07 AM »
Northern Nevada near tahoe

dougules

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #20 on: August 05, 2016, 10:48:19 AM »
Nashville, TN (talked about it very briefly - not sure how we feel about being back on the East Coast again and so far from [her] family).

If you move back east, skip Nashville, and go for Chattanooga.  And honestly, the west is so big, what's the difference really between TN to AZ as WA to AZ?

Anywhere in the mid-South is going to be terrible for weather, though. 
« Last Edit: August 05, 2016, 10:51:54 AM by dougules »

seattlecyclone

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #21 on: August 05, 2016, 11:09:34 AM »
If you're looking for low income tax, you can't beat Washington. Maybe check out eastern Washington? The temperatures get warmer in the summer and colder in the winter than Seattle, but there's also more sunshine, which you said would keep you from living in Seattle.

bear88

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #22 on: August 05, 2016, 11:19:31 AM »
Hi all:

Trying to pull off FIRE in one year and need to move to LCOL place to do it. We are a family of 4 in Ohio and originally looked at Fountain Hills AZ in Phoenix. Decided it might be too pricey as2 school districts are still important to us. Then looked at Tucson and surprised to see it is a little cheaper and slightly cooler than Phoenix. We are flying out next month to take a look.

Anyone have any good or bad thoughts on Tucson. We were looking at Oro Valley as it seems to be a poor mans Longmont!

Many people love Tucson because it has more of a small-town feel than Phoenix, even though it has 1M people. It has hiking and skiing nearby and is also close to Mexico. The main complaints are the trafic (the freeway system has not grown with the city), the airport (most people drive to Phoenix to avoid the extra leg of most flights), and that many concerts and events come to Phoenix rather than Tucson. The big sports teams are also in Phoenix, though the U of A usually has some decent teams. Some of these won't matter much to a true mustachian.

If there's an accident or construction on I-10 between Phoenix and Tucson, it backs up for hours and there isn't a great bypass option.

We moved to Tucson in January and really like it. We will only be here for a year or so as my partner is in the military and is here for training, but we could see it as a place that we want to eventually retire to. We love the low cost of living and the fact that there is so much outdoor stuff to do. The heat is

For the OP: I hear the housing market in Colorado Springs is crazzzyyy right now.

patchyfacialhair

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #23 on: August 05, 2016, 11:22:08 AM »
We have some family in Colorado Springs. My parents tell me it's a very religious place if that makes any difference to you.

There is truth to this. Lots of military and religious groups, but the weather is awesome and there's lots to do outdoors. Housing is starting to get a little crazy though.

mm1970

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #24 on: August 05, 2016, 01:21:25 PM »
I have friends in Santa Fe and I love the area.

Shh, keep Santa Fe a secret!
+1

Ha ha my aunt and her wife just bought a place there and are moving in the next couple of years.  Well, not quite in Santa Fe, more like Las Vegas, NM area I think.  (Can't quite remember exactly...but this way I have TWO sets of people to visit, whee!!)

redbird

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #25 on: August 05, 2016, 04:59:26 PM »
I lived in Hawaii for 3 years. I would love to be FIRE there because the climate is perfect for my tastes, but it would require a much higher stash because of the HCOL. It's not just housing. The food costs are higher but you also have to deal with higher travel costs if you want to go anywhere that isn't the islands.

TomTX

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #26 on: August 05, 2016, 06:02:25 PM »
I lived in Hawaii for 3 years. I would love to be FIRE there because the climate is perfect for my tastes, but it would require a much higher stash because of the HCOL. It's not just housing. The food costs are higher but you also have to deal with higher travel costs if you want to go anywhere that isn't the islands.

A couple of years ago we found food pretty reasonable on the Big Island - especially fruit on the Hilo side. Walmart and Costco (Kona only) keep a lid on a lot of prices.

dougules

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #27 on: August 06, 2016, 09:11:05 AM »
I lived in Hawaii for 3 years. I would love to be FIRE there because the climate is perfect for my tastes, but it would require a much higher stash because of the HCOL. It's not just housing. The food costs are higher but you also have to deal with higher travel costs if you want to go anywhere that isn't the islands.

A couple of years ago we found food pretty reasonable on the Big Island - especially fruit on the Hilo side. Walmart and Costco (Kona only) keep a lid on a lot of prices.

Hawaii sounds cool, but does it not get old being stuck in the middle of the Pacific?  Or is Hawaii nice enough to make up for it?

ShoulderThingThatGoesUp

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #28 on: August 06, 2016, 09:38:21 AM »
Corpus Christi, Texas - it's a substantial city (> 300,000 people), the climate is not so severe especially if you're on the barrier islands (seem to run about 10 degrees cooler than inland in the summer), it's cheap, and a decent mix of Southwest and South. The airport can get you anywhere with one hop to DFW.

Hurricanes are an issue, but compared to the coasts of Washington and Oregon with the Cascadia subduction zone hanging over their heads, you get tons of warning and the solution is easy if somewhat annoying - go west.

Topography is definitely lacking, but the Padre Island National Seashore is close and impressive.

Corpus Christi vs Galveston?  Which is better?
Any worries of rising sea levels in either city?
How resilient are the houses to hurricanes and flooding?
Home owners insurance rates with hurricane and flooding coverage?
I'd have to also figure in the property tax impact vs income tax savings (which can make sense since we are still 10years out from retirement).

I haven't been in a few years, but Galveston was pretty dingy the last time I went. Corpus Christi felt much nicer - still not a rich town, but I didn't sense as much decay there.

On the coast you obviously have some risk from sea levels. These maps, which I just found today, show a six-meter rise at both Galveston and Corpus Christi and you can see that CC survives much better. The barrier islands are shown as wiped out in both places, which makes sense, but as they are natural coastal structures they should rebuild themselves with a gradual enough rise. Inland from the barrier islands, you get more protection from hurricanes, but less of the moderating effect of the ocean. Hurricanes just aren't that likely to destroy your house unless you're in a storm surge area or they drop a tree on it.

(Six meters is well beyond our lifetimes by almost everything I've seen - one is apparently the expected rise by 2100.)

Property insurance is definitely a big cost in Texas. Making sure you're not in a flood area helps a lot, as is buying in city limits so you have fire departments.

I picked a random McMansion in CC to see what the taxes were like. $6608 a year is a lot of money, but it seems on the low end of the state income taxes you looked up above - and those states all have property taxes too, right? Of course, you keep paying property taxes after you retire.

Blatant

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #29 on: August 06, 2016, 09:57:09 AM »
I'm in Phoenix. I love Flag, but wouldn't necessarily want to live there year-round due to the winter weather. I guess my opinion is just different in regard to Prescott. I think it's awesome and I'm in my 40s. I go there pretty regularly and don't get the "retirement" vibe you talk about. It's on my short list of potential locations when I pull the pin.

We may have to spend a month there to be sure that it should be marked as a negative.  I'm going off of my wife's assessment as she is the Phoenix native and I'm a newbie to Phoenix.

Would you mind speaking to the differences between Flagstaff and Prescott?

To be clear, I live in Scottsdale and only visit P-town and Flag, so I don't have the in-depth knowledge of those who actually live there. I'm also a mountain biker, so I tend to view places through the lens of year-round riding.

I LOVE Flagstaff. In the summer. Excellent mountain biking on Mt. Elden. It's a typical laid-back hippy mountain town, great vibe, decent food. I'm not a winter sports person, but they say the skiing is OK. It gets cold and snows quite a bit. That's not really my thing. Housing costs are relatively high given the overall lack of good jobs.

Prescott does have a different feeling, but I never personally picked up on a "retirement" vibe. It's more "western/cowboy/biker" than hippy and it does have an extraordinary number of halfway/recovery houses. Housing prices are cheaper, food is OK. For me, the setting is better overall than Flag due to elevation. Year-round riding, maybe not quite as good as Flag, but still good. Super-close to Flag and Sedona, and much easier to get down to Phoenix for travel or whatever. Much cooler than Phx and much warmer than Flag = win for me.

redbird

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #30 on: August 06, 2016, 11:44:25 AM »
I lived in Hawaii for 3 years. I would love to be FIRE there because the climate is perfect for my tastes, but it would require a much higher stash because of the HCOL. It's not just housing. The food costs are higher but you also have to deal with higher travel costs if you want to go anywhere that isn't the islands.

A couple of years ago we found food pretty reasonable on the Big Island - especially fruit on the Hilo side. Walmart and Costco (Kona only) keep a lid on a lot of prices.

I lived on Oahu. It was just certain things that were really costly. Produce was reasonable, but things like milk, cereal, and meat were all more expensive than the mainland.

If I lived there now, I would want to live on another island. Oahu just feels too crowded. I was just forced to be there before because of work.

I lived in Hawaii for 3 years. I would love to be FIRE there because the climate is perfect for my tastes, but it would require a much higher stash because of the HCOL. It's not just housing. The food costs are higher but you also have to deal with higher travel costs if you want to go anywhere that isn't the islands.

A couple of years ago we found food pretty reasonable on the Big Island - especially fruit on the Hilo side. Walmart and Costco (Kona only) keep a lid on a lot of prices.

Hawaii sounds cool, but does it not get old being stuck in the middle of the Pacific?  Or is Hawaii nice enough to make up for it?

I didn't get bored of it in 3 years, but maybe I wasn't there long enough! I'm not even a beach person either. I just really liked that 70-85F year round temperature. Some locals in Hawaii literally don't even own a pair of pants and just wear shorts year round. I also really liked the way that American, Hawaiian, and Asian culture was mixed together there. Also, it didn't take much driving to find pretty places to hike.

seattlecyclone

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #31 on: August 06, 2016, 09:11:47 PM »
The Wikipedia page for most cities has typical climate data broken down by month (average high, average low, records, etc.). That might prove more useful than temperature data for July of one year.

NorCal

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #32 on: August 06, 2016, 09:59:43 PM »
I stayed in Colorado Springs for about a week last year.  Given your criteria, I think you should research that more.  I think it has everything you're looking for. 

I also lived near Nashville about a decade ago.  The summers are hot, but not nearly as bad as Phoenix.  It's a fun city and worth looking into more.  The pros might outweigh the cons.

seattlecyclone

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #33 on: August 06, 2016, 10:02:56 PM »
The Wikipedia page for most cities has typical climate data broken down by month (average high, average low, records, etc.). That might prove more useful than temperature data for July of one year.

I used similar data previously from City-Data for average temperatures.

This left us unprepared for the actual temperatures we experienced in Colorado and my wife was pretty miserable on a few days when it was hitting single digit temps while the city data average low lead us to believe 20 degrees is typical in December and January for a low.

This was probably caused by the widely varying temperatures during winter in the area.  This time I wanted to know what temperatures were really hit rather than just the average.  From what I pulled up, I see that flagstaff is a no go right off the bat.

You might want to pay attention to record highs and lows then. Comparing just one year isn't going to tell you much if one city was going through an unusually warm heat wave and others weren't. The year I moved to Seattle we had several days where the temperatures got up to 100 degrees. That hasn't happened since. One year is not sufficient data. If you can't deal with a single winter where the temperatures get down to single digits, look at record lows, not last year's lows.

HPstache

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #34 on: August 06, 2016, 10:48:11 PM »
I'd probably take a good hard look ar Bend, OR. Bt I am pretty happy in NW washington for now

TomTX

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #35 on: August 07, 2016, 06:45:59 AM »
I decided to make a graph showing summer time temperature differences for a few of the areas we're interested in.
Snapshot of temps recorded by a weather website from July 1 to August 5.
(attachment added - I'm not sure if I have everything correct and will edit later with a hosted image if this fails).
The highs don't look bad for any of the areas, but I am a bit concerned with the temperatures in Corpus Christi with the humidity in the area (and the summertime lows this year are only 10 degrees cooler than the summertime highs; this equals zero relief from the heat to me in that I can't wake up early and get in a bike ride or go for a run/walk/hike).

I would consider Corpus Christi, Galveston and much of the Texas coast pretty ridiculous for summertime outdoor activities, unless you are literally in the pool or in the ocean. The humidity is generally very high, and as you noted the low temperatures aren't very low.

Even here in Austin it's only getting down to 75 at night, and the humidity is high.

Temperature alone isn't enough. 85F and 20% humidity is great. 85F with 99% humidity sucks.

Roland of Gilead

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #36 on: August 07, 2016, 06:46:05 AM »
There was some grumble in Washington state about bringing in an income tax.  With the 9.6% average sales tax, the medium high property tax, and the bonus excise tax we had to pay when we sold our house there, it could get a bit ugly.

TheMCP

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Re: Where would you move, in the US, if you could?
« Reply #37 on: August 07, 2016, 08:59:58 AM »
FYI, you can get average weather info from city-data.com... I just google "city data <name of city>" to bring up the specific page.  Part way down the page there are a number of graphs that have average temps, humidity, snowfall, etc. Here is the page for Santa Fe, for example: http://www.city-data.com/city/Santa-Fe-New-Mexico.html

I like to open multiple cities at once, scroll them down to the graphs, and alt+tab between browser tabs to compare them.  I find it's a nice way to compare places that I have been with places I haven't.

HTH