Author Topic: Actuary: Master's degree in Math, two exams passed, 6 months of looking  (Read 9936 times)

Mesmoiselle

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This is actually about my husband. As the title says, he has two exams under his belt. He dropped out of a P.h.D. Math program that he was working as a T.A. within around May 2014. Been applying for 6 months to various teaching as well as actuarial positions.

He now works at UPS doing hard labor with teenagers for $10/hour.

He's gotten exactly one interview and they chose someone else. Part of the problem is that he is ethically against working for the Federal government (fine with State), non-accredited colleges, or the Health insurance actuarial field, which I am guessing severely limits what remains as options.

I was playing with :http://networthify.com/calculator/earlyretirement?income=50000&initialBalance=0&expenses=20000&annualPct=5&withdrawalRate=4

from the MMM blog. Here I was thinking that he and I needed both of us to double our current incomes (from 60k to 120k+) to become FI in 13 years (because I'd have to get a degree that takes 5 years and pay off his 28k of school loans.) And then we input the numbers for him getting a Actuarial job even at 50k a year and it tells me the number is 13.4 years. And I'm like really? Not that I love my current job but if the effort and time has me coming out even, I don't know why I'd bother on improving upon my own career (at 48k-52k a year working crazy variable partime hours.)

I feel like he is somehow unemployable with a Master's degree and two Actuarial exams. This doesn't compute in my brain.

Advice?

Edit ADD

And I will put this in a reply below. But felt incoming people would benefit from it's placement here.

AS a TA, he was earning a 20k salary. UPS ends up being barely 10k a year, but this particular branch covers tuition to a good local University. This means he can take the MFE class free or near free, moving him forward toward his goal of being a well paid actuary. Also, upon his initial interview with UPS, they recognized that he was over qualified and stated that there were positions within UPS that were more geared towards his qualifications. But that 9/10 of those positions were "Internal Applications Only" so he would have to already be an Employee at UPS to ever hear of them. He's only been there three months, and no internal positions have appeared thus far, but UPS usually has a good retention rate of professional employees s we didn't expect something to appear immediately. I want to add that we're not counting on a position to appear, so we're using the schooling benefits to open up options elsewhere.

Furthermore, regarding his avoidance of certain employers;he does not think "all corporations are evil" and is willing to work for more companies than not. He's not willing to volunteer for war either, just to earn an income, and I mean this in a pleasant commentary bemused way; why would Mustachians, who essentially want to work so they can afford "Fuck you" money tell him to go work for an industry he doesn't believe in just to get to that point?

Edit add 2:
we have no children and are no where close to the point of welfare. Detailed income/expenses found here: http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/ask-a-mustachian/reader-case-study-debt-free-and-financially-independent-in-15-years-(or-less)/msg438647/#msg438647
« Last Edit: November 18, 2014, 09:49:46 AM by Mesmoiselle »

Numbers Man

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Re: Actuary: Master's degree in Math, two exams passed, 6 months of looking
« Reply #1 on: November 17, 2014, 04:42:12 PM »
He's very employable but should start thinking about jobs that require a strong math background. He probably should start with openings at his university. He must know some people there to network for job openings. Plus, he can do much better than UPS for an interim job.

Future Lazy

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Re: Actuary: Master's degree in Math, two exams passed, 6 months of looking
« Reply #2 on: November 17, 2014, 04:43:15 PM »

I feel like he is somehow unemployable with a Master's degree and two Actuarial exams. This doesn't compute in my brain.


Except that you said yourself that he's not unemployable because of his education, but refuses to apply to jobs he has a moral objection against. That's not unemployable, that's refusing employment at his level.


Part of the problem is that he is ethically against working for the Federal government (fine with State), non-accredited colleges, or the Health insurance actuarial field, which I am guessing severely limits what remains as options.


That's probably why it doesn't compute.



Has he considered fields that he might not be as clearly qualified for, but might be hired on because of similar education/experience? As in, almost-qualified?

Has he considered private tutoring?

pbkmaine

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Re: Actuary: Master's degree in Math, two exams passed, 6 months of looking
« Reply #3 on: November 17, 2014, 04:49:34 PM »
 The retirement field uses a lot of actuaries to calculate pension benefits. That might fit his altruistic instincts. He should talk to a company like TIAA-CREF. Its not-for-profit orientation might appeal to him.

Mesmoiselle

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Re: Actuary: Master's degree in Math, two exams passed, 6 months of looking
« Reply #4 on: November 17, 2014, 05:07:55 PM »
He has done the following.

  • applied to semi qualified jobs such as: data analyst, software development and support, private school teaching and public school substitute teaching
  • applied to qualified jobs such as community college teaching various non-health actuarial roles (similar to the mentioned TIAA-CREF)

He intends to work on this third exam (MFE) in the spring. He hasn't contacted his Master's University or considered private tutoring but would not want to give up guaranteed income, even if he's over qualified for his current position. This particular branch of UPS will cover all or nearly all the cost of the MFE class he intends to take so there are built in bonuses...

Are there any other semi qualified jobs that we haven't considered in the above?

Cromacster

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Re: Actuary: Master's degree in Math, two exams passed, 6 months of looking
« Reply #5 on: November 17, 2014, 05:37:06 PM »
Life insurance companies, it seems like they are always looking for acturies.  Though that might fall under his objectionable companies....

SpreadsheetMonkey

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Re: Actuary: Master's degree in Math, two exams passed, 6 months of looking
« Reply #6 on: November 17, 2014, 05:49:03 PM »
Actuary checking in here...

The actuarial field has a lot of career changers, so your husband isn't the first I've heard these kinds of questions from.  I know former teachers, nurses, musicians, factory workers, and soldiers who are now actuaries.  It is possible, especially with his math background and two exams under his belt.  A third exam will make a big difference because the first two (P and FM) are significantly easier than the remaining exams.

A few questions for you:

1) Are you geographically limited?  Actuarial work tends to be centralized in New York, Chicago, Hartford, Des Moines, and the Twin Cities.  There are other locations out there, but I bet those locations combine for 40% of all actuaries.  Being mobile helps.

2) How many applications has he sent to insurance companies or consulting firms?  One interview out of 10-20 applications isn't surprising.  With another exam and a well written cover letter, I think your hit rate will go up.

Three resources for you:

1) The Actuarial Outpost is a discussion board for actuaries.  It's as exciting as it sounds.  There is a careers forum where you can find old posts by people in similar positions (there are dozens) or post your own.
http://www.actuarialoutpost.com/actuarial_discussion_forum/forumdisplay.php?f=18

2) The Actuarial Directory lets you search for actuaries by location.  I wouldn't recommend cold emailing, but it can help you find companies in your area that might have a need.  Cold emailing might work better if you run across a small company with just a few actuaries.  For larger companies, you will need to go through the normal online process.
https://www.actuarialdirectory.org/

3) I'd be happy to review his resume if you want to send it to me.

Good luck!

Pigeon

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Re: Actuary: Master's degree in Math, two exams passed, 6 months of looking
« Reply #7 on: November 17, 2014, 06:14:05 PM »
Does his college have any kind of placement service? Has he been looking actively at state governments?  How are his interview skills?

The university where I work has an actuarial science program and their grads almost always have jobs lined up upon graduation. Your husband chose a field where he won't take most jobs. That's what doesn't compute to me. I have a friend who works for a state insurance regulator who used to complain that he couldn't fond enough actuaries to hire but it involved health insurance.

mooreprop

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Re: Actuary: Master's degree in Math, two exams passed, 6 months of looking
« Reply #8 on: November 17, 2014, 07:25:40 PM »
Everyone is ignoring the elephant in the corner of the living room.  I hate to do it, but I cannot follow suit.  What the heck?  I do not understand someone who is worried more about compromising their values than caring about a person who is actually a part of their life.  Man up and take whatever job you can get to help your loved ones.  You can continue to look for a job more in line with your values if you like.

 My sister-in-law did the same thing.  She did not want to work up to her money-making ability and always used "saving the planet as an excuse".  Wouldn't want to work for those planet-raping big businesses!  She passed up numerous opportunities for advancement and worked for minimum wage and no benefits in spite of an IQ around 150.  She spoke up against her bigoted boss at the minimum wage job and got her hours cut so that she had to take a second job at Wal-Mart (which is akin to working for the devil himself according to her)  She spent many years unable to afford to help her son after he was diagnosed with a chronic disease, and never had health insurance for herself. 

I'm sorry, but it is only great to live your values if they include taking care of your family.  $10 an hour at UPS is not really doing that if you have student loans to pay.  Sorry if this is offensive to you or your husband, but it is how I feel.  My husband and I always applied for and accepted any work that was not illegal, then looked for our preferred work from a financially sound position.  Also, you often find out about really good job opportunities when you are employed in the field already.

marty998

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Re: Actuary: Master's degree in Math, two exams passed, 6 months of looking
« Reply #9 on: November 18, 2014, 02:35:26 AM »
+1 mooreprop. Be the change you want to see in the world.

If he doesn't like the government the best thing to do is to change it from within. He's not Gandhi, a silent protest of unemployment is not going to do anything for anyone.

juuustin

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Re: Actuary: Master's degree in Math, two exams passed, 6 months of looking
« Reply #10 on: November 18, 2014, 04:52:56 AM »
Everyone is ignoring the elephant in the corner of the living room.  I hate to do it, but I cannot follow suit.  What the heck?  I do not understand someone who is worried more about compromising their values than caring about a person who is actually a part of their life.  Man up and take whatever job you can get to help your loved ones.  You can continue to look for a job more in line with your values if you like.

 My sister-in-law did the same thing.  She did not want to work up to her money-making ability and always used "saving the planet as an excuse".  Wouldn't want to work for those planet-raping big businesses!  She passed up numerous opportunities for advancement and worked for minimum wage and no benefits in spite of an IQ around 150.  She spoke up against her bigoted boss at the minimum wage job and got her hours cut so that she had to take a second job at Wal-Mart (which is akin to working for the devil himself according to her)  She spent many years unable to afford to help her son after he was diagnosed with a chronic disease, and never had health insurance for herself. 

I'm sorry, but it is only great to live your values if they include taking care of your family.  $10 an hour at UPS is not really doing that if you have student loans to pay.  Sorry if this is offensive to you or your husband, but it is how I feel.  My husband and I always applied for and accepted any work that was not illegal, then looked for our preferred work from a financially sound position.  Also, you often find out about really good job opportunities when you are employed in the field already.

+10000

I'd like to know if his moral opposition to the Federal government would hold when his family requires welfare and food stamps because of his minimum wage job.

MathNinja

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Re: Actuary: Master's degree in Math, two exams passed, 6 months of looking
« Reply #11 on: November 18, 2014, 05:38:58 AM »
Another actuary checking in here - I was in roughly the same place (dropped out of a PhD program with a Master's and decided to be an actuary) and it has worked out. I agree with SpreadsheetMonkey - if he is not geographically limited, it won't be hard to find a job in this field (in fact, with the current changing regulations I expect actuaries to be in increasingly high demand). Also like spreadsheetMonkey, I'd be willing to review his resume' if he is interested. One way to make his search potentially easier would be to work with an actuarial recruiter - you can just google that term and many guns for hire will appear.
Best wishes,
MathNinja

Mesmoiselle

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Re: Actuary: Master's degree in Math, two exams passed, 6 months of looking
« Reply #12 on: November 18, 2014, 09:01:50 AM »
As a TA, he was earning a 20k salary. UPS ends up being barely 10k a year, but this particular branch covers tuition to a good local University. This means he can take the MFE class free or near free, moving him forward toward his goal of being a well paid actuary. Also, upon his initial interview with UPS, they recognized that he was over qualified and stated that there were positions within UPS that were more geared towards his qualifications. But that 9/10 of those positions were "Internal Applications Only" so he would have to already be an Employee at UPS to ever hear of them. He's only been there three months, and no internal positions have appeared thus far, but UPS usually has a good retention rate of professional employees s we didn't expect something to appear immediately. I want to add that we're not counting on a position to appear, so we're using the schooling benefits to open up options elsewhere.

Furthermore, regarding his avoidance of certain employers;he does not think "all corporations are evil" and is willing to work for more companies than not. He's not willing to volunteer for war either, just to earn an income, and I mean this in a pleasant commentary bemused way; why would Mustachians, who essentially want to work so they can afford "Fuck you" money tell him to go work for an industry he doesn't believe in just to get to that point?

2ndTimer

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Re: Actuary: Master's degree in Math, two exams passed, 6 months of looking
« Reply #13 on: November 18, 2014, 09:41:00 AM »
The Hub turned down a job offer at a National Lab because "They make bombs."  A few years later he became an Army officer.  I love him so I don't comment.

Mesmoiselle

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Re: Actuary: Master's degree in Math, two exams passed, 6 months of looking
« Reply #14 on: November 18, 2014, 10:08:43 AM »
The Hub turned down a job offer at a National Lab because "They make bombs."  A few years later he became an Army officer.  I love him so I don't comment.

If my husband decided his values were different on this particular matter of his own accord and without any pressure from me, I would support his decision then as well.

Quote
Juuustin: I'd like to know if his moral opposition to the Federal government would hold when his family requires welfare and food stamps because of his minimum wage job.

We have no children, and how is 60k anywhere close to welfare and food stamps? I added our income/expenses breakdown in a link to the OP. It is an interesting philosophical discussion. As a vegan, would I stay vegan in a zombie apocalypse? The answer is No. But luckily, I live in a first world country and there is no such thing as Zombies.

Quote
Mooreprop: I do not understand someone who is worried more about compromising their values than caring about a person who is actually a part of their life.  Man up and take whatever job you can get to help your loved ones.  You can continue to look for a job more in line with your values if you like.

I have chosen more freedom over stability in my own profession as well by choosing to work variable part time but highly paid hours with no benefits. so it'd be rather hypocritical of me not to let him choose who he would work for ethically based on his preferences so long as they don't actually put our lives at risk. Other than the idea that taking an "unethical job" may be the only easy to moderately easy way to get a preferred "ethical job", I disagree with the notion that what he is currently doing is selfish.

I know I'm not poor, I am no where close to welfare, we don't even qualify for health care subsidies. I just want peace of mind and "fuck you" money in the bank, preferably in 3 years not 13. So my husband getting an Actuary job would get me that and so I want to explore alternatives from financially fiscal smart flexible people (and other actuaries) so I turned to the MMM forum.

I'd like to finish my comments to this theme of responses with the following quote of what I said t my husband just this morning," I want you [my husband] to get a highly paid job so we can scrimp and save like rich people because right now we are scrimping and saving like poor [lower middle income] people."

Mesmoiselle

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Re: Actuary: Master's degree in Math, two exams passed, 6 months of looking
« Reply #15 on: November 18, 2014, 10:34:16 AM »
Actuary checking in here...

The actuarial field has a lot of career changers, so your husband isn't the first I've heard these kinds of questions from.  I know former teachers, nurses, musicians, factory workers, and soldiers who are now actuaries.  It is possible, especially with his math background and two exams under his belt.  A third exam will make a big difference because the first two (P and FM) are significantly easier than the remaining exams.

A few questions for you:

1) Are you geographically limited?  Actuarial work tends to be centralized in New York, Chicago, Hartford, Des Moines, and the Twin Cities.  There are other locations out there, but I bet those locations combine for 40% of all actuaries.  Being mobile helps.

2) How many applications has he sent to insurance companies or consulting firms?  One interview out of 10-20 applications isn't surprising.  With another exam and a well written cover letter, I think your hit rate will go up.

3) I'd be happy to review his resume if you want to send it to me.


I think he's applied to about the 20 you've guessed. We have been geographically limiting him, as we just purchased an "ugly" house 16 months ago to try a cautious hand at flipping it through our own sweat labor. Nevertheless, it was only a 52k house and we'd accept the loss if we had to. It'll still be tough to try to sell it suddenly since the bulk of the work to pretty it up hasn't been done.

A discussion between he and I occurred as a result of this thread and I'm still unsure if we should keep trying while he works on getting his MFE and give him to the end of 2015 to find a local job that's at least 30k/year, putting off rocking the boat until it's just ridiculous not to do otherwise. Benefits:
  • more time to repair/pretty up the house
  • wrap up my associates degree so I can transfer the block to the college in his new location
  • 2nd partner could get his apprenticeship good and started after he bags his pension


Of course, the drawback is the delay in receiving a 30k+ upgrade in yearly income. 30k the first year, grows more after that of course.

Then there is the possibility of his getting accepted cross country as an actuary come January and my remaining behind to do the 6 month to 1 year wrap up. Emotionally difficult. Temporary doubling of living expenses.

I'd love to send his resume to have you look at it. I have no idea what a good actuary cover letter and resume would look like; I'm an ultrasound technician.

DoubleDown

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Re: Actuary: Master's degree in Math, two exams passed, 6 months of looking
« Reply #16 on: November 18, 2014, 10:37:39 AM »
Has he had a professional (career placement center at his university, HR person you know, or career coach) independently assess his resume? Getting only one interview in 6 months sounds like he is generating very little interest, so maybe it should be looked at to see if it needs to be overhauled.

AnAmericanAbroad

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Re: Actuary: Master's degree in Math, two exams passed, 6 months of looking
« Reply #17 on: November 18, 2014, 07:54:00 PM »
Another actuary here, echoing the suggestions above. Being willing to move to one of the cities listed would help a lot. Boston might also be an option, there are a few firms there as well. Being an actuary is a great career path, but it's a bit limited in where most of the jobs are.

I also recommend using a recruiter. They have a lot of job openings and can help with your resume. I found my current job with a recruiter, but it took about 6 months. Networking is really the fast lane to a job, but that can be tough if you're applying to another geography.

Future Lazy

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Re: Actuary: Master's degree in Math, two exams passed, 6 months of looking
« Reply #18 on: November 18, 2014, 08:35:21 PM »
I have chosen more freedom over stability in my own profession as well by choosing to work variable part time but highly paid hours with no benefits. so it'd be rather hypocritical of me not to let him choose who he would work for ethically based on his preferences so long as they don't actually put our lives at risk. Other than the idea that taking an "unethical job" may be the only easy to moderately easy way to get a preferred "ethical job", I disagree with the notion that what he is currently doing is selfish.

I know I'm not poor, I am no where close to welfare, we don't even qualify for health care subsidies. I just want peace of mind and "fuck you" money in the bank, preferably in 3 years not 13. So my husband getting an Actuary job would get me that and so I want to explore alternatives from financially fiscal smart flexible people (and other actuaries) so I turned to the MMM forum.

I'd like to finish my comments to this theme of responses with the following quote of what I said t my husband just this morning," I want you [my husband] to get a highly paid job so we can scrimp and save like rich people because right now we are scrimping and saving like poor [lower middle income] people."

That's exactly the point the group here is trying to make clear to you, though. You want to be FI in three years, not thirteen years, and that is best served by the DH getting an actuary job. The unwillingness to apply to any possible position means that DH doesn't have the same commitment to 3 years as you do. It means he would rather scrimp and save like 'poor people'. Are you okay with that?

You DID ask a forum full of "do whatever it takes" type people, and you have to expect them to question someone's commitment when they aren't showing do whatever it takes behavior.

olivia

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Re: Actuary: Master's degree in Math, two exams passed, 6 months of looking
« Reply #19 on: November 18, 2014, 08:50:42 PM »
It's a lot easier to get a job when you already have experience in the field, and being picky is not working out for your husband.  If I were in his shoes I would start applying to all jobs he's qualified for.  He can always change to a company/field he feels better about working for once he gets some experience under his belt.

Mesmoiselle

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Re: Actuary: Master's degree in Math, two exams passed, 6 months of looking
« Reply #20 on: November 19, 2014, 11:09:33 AM »
I have chosen more freedom over stability in my own profession as well by choosing to work variable part time but highly paid hours with no benefits. so it'd be rather hypocritical of me not to let him choose who he would work for ethically based on his preferences so long as they don't actually put our lives at risk. Other than the idea that taking an "unethical job" may be the only easy to moderately easy way to get a preferred "ethical job", I disagree with the notion that what he is currently doing is selfish.

I know I'm not poor, I am no where close to welfare, we don't even qualify for health care subsidies. I just want peace of mind and "fuck you" money in the bank, preferably in 3 years not 13. So my husband getting an Actuary job would get me that and so I want to explore alternatives from financially fiscal smart flexible people (and other actuaries) so I turned to the MMM forum.

I'd like to finish my comments to this theme of responses with the following quote of what I said t my husband just this morning," I want you [my husband] to get a highly paid job so we can scrimp and save like rich people because right now we are scrimping and saving like poor [lower middle income] people."

That's exactly the point the group here is trying to make clear to you, though. You want to be FI in three years, not thirteen years, and that is best served by the DH getting an actuary job. The unwillingness to apply to any possible position means that DH doesn't have the same commitment to 3 years as you do. It means he would rather scrimp and save like 'poor people'. Are you okay with that?

You DID ask a forum full of "do whatever it takes" type people, and you have to expect them to question someone's commitment when they aren't showing do whatever it takes behavior.

oops. I define "fuck you money" as being financially able to quit your job fr 3-9 months without any issues. Since I'm the main bread winner, this is not at all true. Financial Independence is when I can quit my job and never get another one and be totally okay financially.

lifejoy

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Re: Actuary: Master's degree in Math, two exams passed, 6 months of looking
« Reply #21 on: November 20, 2014, 10:06:44 AM »
Tutoring. I did it when I couldn't find a job. I charged $50/hr for English tutoring. I quit because I realized I was grossly overcharging. But it was great because you set your own schedule.

Good luck!

Mesmoiselle

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Re: Actuary: Master's degree in Math, two exams passed, 6 months of looking
« Reply #22 on: November 23, 2014, 01:33:45 PM »
As a result of this discussion, we've decided it's in our best interests for us to not geographically restrict  him.

He's been polishing his cover letter and resume via the Actuarial forum mentioned in this thread. And applied to two local positions in the last two weeks. After he gets the stamp of approval from his fellow actuaries about his CL/resume, he will contact a couple of headhunter businesses. We're pretty open to living anywhere except California, Alaska, and New York City. California is off the list because I would have to take and pay for up to 10 licences just to work there myself along with a huge COL. Weird state.

YoungInvestor

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Re: Actuary: Master's degree in Math, two exams passed, 6 months of looking
« Reply #23 on: November 23, 2014, 02:15:04 PM »
In today's world, 2 exams is hardly a sign of dedication to the field. Most people coming out of universities (and getting hired) have at least 3-4 exams, an internship, or, fairly often, both. Becoming an actuary is much harder than it used to be, and the field is now very competitive. He should apply to both jobs and interships (which should pay at least 2-2.5x as much as his UPS job anyway) and pass maybe 2-3 more exams.

+1 on him joining the actuarialoutpost discussion forums. Be warned that it can be a bit depressing to see so many people struggling so much to find a job. I know it was for me, but the insight is generally very good.

Also, not that it's any of my business, but the fact that his wife is the one who is going out there looking for career advice for him while he has sent out about 20 resumes in 6 months doesn't bode too well for his personality.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2014, 02:23:29 PM by YoungInvestor »

elnion

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Re: Actuary: Master's degree in Math, two exams passed, 6 months of looking
« Reply #24 on: November 23, 2014, 03:23:18 PM »
He has done the following.

  • applied to semi qualified jobs such as: data analyst, software development and support, private school teaching and public school substitute teaching
  • applied to qualified jobs such as community college teaching various non-health actuarial roles (similar to the mentioned TIAA-CREF)
[...]
Are there any other semi qualified jobs that we haven't considered in the above?

I'm not sure what fell under 'data analyst' since that seems to be an overloaded term, and it depends on location, but he has the right background for Data Science/Business Intelligence jobs, and in many cases the skill set overlaps reasonably with being an Actuary, at least at the basic science level.  To give an idea: I recently interned with Nokia's Research group in Chicago, and the internship annualized to around $60K (so higher, obviously, for FT).  My background is B.S. in Mathematics, current Ph.D. student in Computational Biophysics, so I would imagine there's a heavy overlap in skill sets, depending on what area of mathematics he was specializing in during grad school. And frankly, any math background makes it pretty easy to pick up enough to do the job as you go.  Internships are obviously not the same risk for the company as a job, so it would be a little harder to break in, but I know the company was hurting for more talent, and I've seen a lot more demand than supply for data science talent in general in this region.  YMMV for different locations however, and this is obviously a different career track than Actuary (similar good pay, nice hours, and overlapping skills though, so it might be appealing).  Tends to involve more programming, although it's much more writing analysis scripts, not so much actual software engineering.

hdatontodo

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Re: Actuary: Master's degree in Math, two exams passed, 6 months of looking
« Reply #25 on: November 23, 2014, 03:37:03 PM »
Too bad no Fed interest. My sis in law with a Math degree got a programming job with Fannie Mae near DC.

How about a job working on a state Obamacare computer system?
« Last Edit: November 23, 2014, 07:20:28 PM by hdatontodo »

Mesmoiselle

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Re: Actuary: Master's degree in Math, two exams passed, 6 months of looking
« Reply #26 on: November 23, 2014, 04:03:17 PM »

Also, not that it's any of my business, but the fact that his wife is the one who is going out there looking for career advice for him while he has sent out about 20 resumes in 6 months doesn't bode too well for his personality.

Lot of factors. Reading and researching everything MMM is my new "hobby of the moment" so I'm on two different finance related forums as well as reading MMM's blog from the first post to now. I type my thoughts 3x faster. Those 20 resumes were only for jobs within busing distance within his ethical framework. I was sort of initially complacent about his taking the UPS job because of the temporary $20/hour bonuses and potential for free school cost coverage and healthcare coverage. But as I learned more MMM stuff and got even more fired up about FI, I realized I can't be complacent and needed to learn more about what it takes to get a job in that field.

In exchange, he does 3/4 of the housework. Seems fair to me, our strengths lie in different areas.