Author Topic: What would you have done differently if you could go back and restart?  (Read 2821 times)

rythix

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What would you have done differently if you could go back and restart your financial journey? And what would you have done if you were my age (20-year-old student) regarding financial planning for the future?

I'm planning to study computer science (bachelor's- 3 years at uni) and focusing on cybersecurity. I am already investing part of my student finance (about 400$ a month, and it's free money from the goverment bc I study in/am from Sweden) and I also have a 3k emergency fund and about 1.5k in stocks/index funds, and I am now saving towards a down payment. Am I on the right track?
« Last Edit: March 08, 2024, 07:52:46 AM by rythix »

SweatingInAR

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Congratulations on starting early!

The Money Mustach Investment order is a fantastic resource, we have USA, Australia, and Canada here: https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/investor-alley/investment-order/

It's a lot to comprehend, but you don't have to understand it all now! When I was a 20-year-old college student in the USA, I would have only needed to know numbers 0, 2, and 4. I was good with 0 and 2, but I should have put all of my excess earned income into a Roth IRA instead of a CD.

Boll weevil

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1. Would not have purchased target-date retirement funds in my regular non-retirement investment account.

2. Need to actually take action. I’ve done the easy-for-me stuff (index funds, stocks, Roth IRA, and 401(k), but haven’t yet done anything with real estate even though I’ve been considering it for years. I’m sure there’s been some opportunity cost there.

ixtap

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I wish I had known known that I could rollover workplace plans much earlier. I had a tiny pension and a crappy variable annuity that were completely stagnant from 2000 when I left that position to 2017 when I learned about rollovers. I also lost a couple of hundred dollars to fees for a 401k from working summers in grad school because I didn't know to roll it over. At least those were profit sharing, not my own contributions.

Tasse

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You've probably already got this one, since you're here, but what I needed to know earlier was: you don't have to save 10% and spend the rest. You can save extra and there is a good reason to do so!

I figured that out around 24, so no major regrets, but my roadblock was just in knowing there were options worth saving hard for.

JAYSLOL

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I found MMM right around when I turned 30, now I’m in my late 30s and extremely thankful that I got the wake up call that I did, Im now in a pretty good spot and can only imagine what I could have set myself up for if I had another decade on top of that.  I would tell 20 year old me to make sure I was saving minimum 25%, but to be shooting for 50%+ and investing hard in index funds.  I was always pretty good at saving some money, I also stayed away from debt, but I never really invested properly, and my savings could have been higher and worked so much harder. 

solon

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I wish I would have known earlier that you can save 50% of your income and still have a pretty good life.

If you haven't read JL Collins' Simple Path to Wealth, I suggest you do it.

GilesMM

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I didn't start saving until I was 30 as I didn't have a decent job.  I wish I had found a way to save more those ten years they make all the difference at the other end of the compounding juggernaut.

Kris

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I was in grad school for all of my twenties. My biggest regret was that I did not start saving for retirement until I got my first “real” job at 31.

Start saving/investing. Now. Massively. As much as you can.

Freedomin5

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I had savings from my summer jobs at 20. Instead of buying a new car, I wish I had bought a cheap used one and kept all my savings invested in index funds.

And I wish JLCollins and his advice to his 19-year-old daughter had existed when I was 20.

And also his Financial Independence Checklist. It works. We basically followed the steps and reached FI in less than 10 years.
« Last Edit: March 08, 2024, 04:15:20 AM by Freedomin5 »

jrhampt

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Re: What would you have done differently if you could go back and restart?
« Reply #10 on: March 08, 2024, 05:34:21 AM »
1.  I didn't know anything about IRAs when I was working in my teens - would have been amazing to get started contributing then, even if only a little
2.  I probably should have graduated w engineering in college instead of switching to another major at the eleventh hour
3.  It's difficult to say whether I would have ended up where I am now at all without the meandering journey of my 20s, but I wish I had gotten there more directly and started maxing out retirement accounts in my 20s instead of getting serious (and lucking into a career path) around age 30.  I did get a couple of Master's degrees out of it though, so there were some things I did right.
4.  I still would have traveled just as much as I did in my 20s and 30s, but I really could have spent less on things like restaurants and clothes and saved a lot more without missing it

Laura33

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Re: What would you have done differently if you could go back and restart?
« Reply #11 on: March 08, 2024, 10:26:22 AM »
I wish I had been less risk-averse and been willing to spend more money and take more chances.

It would have been fun to take a job in NYC right out of law school.  I didn't do it because I was petrified at how expensive everything was, and I didn't really want to work that hard and wasn't sure I could cut it; I was looking for stability, and the idea of a job that might last only a year or two was terrifying.  I wish I'd taken the chance.  Because what better time?*

I also wish I had been more willing to live internationally after I got married.  We both said we wanted to live internationally for a couple of years.  But I had just started a new job (where I am now, in fact), and there were always Reasons not to look, and suddenly the kids were in high school and we didn't want to uproot them at that point.  So my family never had that experience of really being in a different culture.

I also passed up on a trip to Switzerland when studying abroad because of the money and a legit Turkish rug when I was in Greece for some ridiculous low amount. 

Obviously, my life has worked out fine -- in fact, things are far better than I ever expected them to be, or even hoped they might be (knock on wood!).  So my desire for security ended up serving me well in the end.  But I regret those earlier choices because I made them out of fear.  My ultimate choices may well have been the right ones, but I didn't even think seriously about a whole variety of options simply because they scared me.  But sometimes the scary things are how you grow. 


*Then again, I met DH through the job that I took instead, and it's coming up on 28 years.  So, hmmmm, maybe I shouldn't complain too much about that particular choice.  ;-)

Omy

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Re: What would you have done differently if you could go back and restart?
« Reply #12 on: March 08, 2024, 12:58:54 PM »
My first marriage was to someone who loved to spend and didn't see the point in saving or investing. He's still working (and will likely have to work for another decade) and I FIREd 4 years ago. If FIRE is important to you, it's a lot easier to accomplish with a partner who has the same goals.

halfling

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Re: What would you have done differently if you could go back and restart?
« Reply #13 on: March 13, 2024, 10:07:22 PM »
Pretty much just wish I'd bought a house as soon as I could in the city I wanted to move to, instead of rushing to pay off my student loans first. Very 2020-era regret! But not very relevant today.

EverythingisNew

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Re: What would you have done differently if you could go back and restart?
« Reply #14 on: March 14, 2024, 05:48:11 AM »
You will be better off than you can imagine! This is the power of compound interest and a college degree.

I regret punishing myself for financial losses. Over time you will do something stupid and lose money, or you will have misfortune and get some big bills. Let it go! One thing I’ve learned is that there is a lot of luck in life! If something goes wrong and it takes a lot of money to fix it, let it go. I think my mistakes and misfortunes have cost me 20% of my spending and this is normal.

Examples: Investing in individual stocks and losing 50% in 1 month (happened mostly when I was young. Now we index.) Losing $50k on a house we lived in for 1 year! Medical bills (with 3 kids there is always something). Dental bills. Home repairs. Getting a graduate degree that I don’t use. Booking a trip and having to cancel. Buying things we don’t keep as long as planned.

We are very thoughtful, careful and wise, but this stuff happens to everyone (more so with kids). It sucks, but you just have to pay and move on.

In the long run these things don’t matter. Heath and happiness are more important than money. We also have done a lot right financially, like staying married, starting to save and invest early in life, immigrating to the US, good jobs and living in a good area with home price appreciation.

The biggest cost is not working. We used to dream of extreme early retirement, but we traded that for a nice house in a very good area of town. Now we say our house is our early retirement! But having kids also changed that dream because I realized that they thrive in a more stable life and if we need to be stable, we might as well have one of us working through all the years they are in school. Now I am a stay at home mom but I’m busy with the kids and my husband works. I will go back to work doing something most likely flexible and non-professional next year. Our dream is now for one of us to always work, but to move to something low stress, fun, seasonal or altruistic. Even my 90 year old grandma works at a museum. This is our financial dream now: always having one of us working, but lowering the burden to being a community helper. Changing this goal has made us reach FI and we get to start enjoying the lower burden now!
« Last Edit: March 14, 2024, 07:11:42 AM by EverythingisNew »

Lalalauren

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Re: What would you have done differently if you could go back and restart?
« Reply #15 on: March 14, 2024, 06:04:54 AM »
This is a great podcast where the question on “guiding young people to wealth” has a long discussion on this that isn’t solely focused on investing. Worth a listen. https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/radical-personal-finance/id896153632?i=1000648536822

Retire-Canada

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Re: What would you have done differently if you could go back and restart?
« Reply #16 on: March 14, 2024, 08:08:10 AM »
What would you have done differently if you could go back and restart your financial journey? And what would you have done if you were my age (20-year-old student) regarding financial planning for the future?

If I could start over:

1. Spend Less.
2. Save/Invest More.
3. Invest in index funds.
4. Buy a house earlier.
5. Retire 10+ years sooner.

Greystache

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Re: What would you have done differently if you could go back and restart?
« Reply #17 on: March 14, 2024, 08:15:37 AM »
I did a lot of things right and was able to retire early at age 55. But here are some of the things that I did wrong that I now regret:
1. I wish that when I was your age I had sat down and seriously examined what things were important and worthwhile to spend my time and money on.  Instead, I wasted a lot of time and money on things that did not make me happy or enhance my well being just because that's what everyone around me was doing. A little self examination early on would have got me to FI much earlier.
2. I regret giving my money to a financial advisor. It didn't seem like it cost much early on, but as my portfolio grew, so did his fee. If you feel you must use a FA, get one that charges by the hour, not one that charges a % of your portfolio. I would have been much better off educating myself instead of hiring someone who cost too much and did not add that much value.
3. Don't invest in something you don't understand.
4. I wish I had been able to read Simple Path To Wealth when I was young. I did give a copy to both of my children.

aloevera1

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Re: What would you have done differently if you could go back and restart?
« Reply #18 on: March 14, 2024, 08:30:08 AM »
I am also in the camp of being too risk-averse early on. I had good reasons but I just wish I sat down and figured stuff out much faster than I actually did. I knew I was not doing the optimal thing but I lacked knowledge to act in a more optimal way. I was also not in a rush to learn. So, there was a lot of time lost.

ChpBstrd

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Re: What would you have done differently if you could go back and restart?
« Reply #19 on: March 14, 2024, 08:57:57 AM »
If I could restart at age 20 I would:
  • Major in something with a high pay rate.
  • Invest every penny I could invest in the Nasdaq.
Or basically what this person is doing:

I'm planning to study computer science (bachelor's- 3 years at uni) and focusing on cybersecurity. I am already investing part of my student finance (about 400$ a month, and it's free money from the goverment bc I study in/am from Sweden) and I also have a 3k emergency fund and about 1.5k in stocks/index funds, and I am now saving towards a down payment. Am I on the right track?

Oh wait, that's the OP :)) Good job OP.

Regarding home ownership, I have some regrets about buying at age 23. I settled on buying a house I hated because it was a bargain, and then switched houses two more times in the same zip code. These moves cost more than it would have cost to buy something I liked in the first place.

In today's financial environment, I don't know if it makes sense to pursue home ownership in one's twenties. Every time I bought, my mortgage payment was less than rent, but that's probably not be the case any more. It would have been a more interesting life to float around different places for a while, expanding my career instead of mowing grass and raking leaves. I bought into the romance of the suburban ideal back when it was a bargain, but it's certainly not a bargain any more.

My biggest regret was financial cowardice. Back when I was worth maybe $250k I was terrified that the market would drop again like it did in 2000 and 2008, so I jumped in and out of stocks in reaction to financial news. This was disastrous in hindsight, and cost me more in gains than the losses I would have avoided even if my timing was perfect. So if I could start over I would invest aggressively and stay invested no matter what.

Villanelle

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Re: What would you have done differently if you could go back and restart?
« Reply #20 on: March 14, 2024, 09:10:50 AM »
Avoid the front-loaded funds and whole life policy.

I thought I was doing the right thing by starting early and seeking professional financial help.  And I'm guessing that had I not done that, I wouldn't have invested at all, so I probably came out ahead compared to what I'd have done otherwise. I'm glad I started investing in my 20s, and that it became a habit, but that money would have grown so much more if I'd known/done better.

It wasn't until my mid-30s that I figure out that basics of this stuff, and realized I could do it on my own and likely have better results than the fund selected for me by a commission-based financial advisor.  Canceled those monthly investments, rolled everything into low-costs index funds, and righted the ship. 

The thing I am most proud of?  (To offer the other side of this coin?)  Not even faltering for a second during 2008.  I don't check the markets, I don't check my balances (other than 2x/yr for rebalancing, and even then I just enter the totals in the spreadsheet to check my allocation against my target AA, and don't check to see what is up or down).  So I'm never stressed by the market. That has served me well. 


Log

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Re: What would you have done differently if you could go back and restart?
« Reply #21 on: March 14, 2024, 09:24:18 AM »
I had savings from my summer jobs at 20. Instead of buying a new car, I wish I had bought a cheap used one and kept all my savings invested in index funds.

And I wish JLCollins and his advice to his 19-year-old daughter had existed when I was 20.

And also his Financial Independence Checklist. It works. We basically followed the steps and reached FI in less than 10 years.

JL Collins is really all one needs. This was a good reminder, and renewed inspiration to see if I can save 50% this year.

swashbucklinstache

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Re: What would you have done differently if you could go back and restart?
« Reply #22 on: March 14, 2024, 10:38:43 AM »
What would you have done differently if you could go back and restart your financial journey? And what would you have done if you were my age (20-year-old student) regarding financial planning for the future?

If I could start over:

1. Spend more. 5k at 22 was a big deal and 12 years of compounding later it's what, 12k? Maybe 100k over 12 years max?
2. Save/Invest More. I work in a field that attempts to do the world good, as a programmer. I should have gone into tech proper to make a ton more money and learn a ton more then come here later. For you maybe that means getting a job in the US for five years. If you get into people management, people are people wherever you go and your job is about as stressful so you might as well make 2-5x as much.
3. Avoid people management if lucrative IC is available to you and you don't love it after trying it or have it as a goal.
4. Never burn out. See #3.
5. Understand your FI # will probably rise over time and plan accordingly. You're probably more like most people than you think so look at that data and prepare for it. 45 year old you probably has less in common with 20 year old you than his 45 year old neighbor I. 2049.

blueberrybushes

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Re: What would you have done differently if you could go back and restart?
« Reply #23 on: March 14, 2024, 11:49:05 AM »
Affirming other posts:

1)  Wish I understood that equity investment risk is time based.  Money invested in equities for 10 years or more is low risk.
2)  Wish the internet existed (yes, some of us are that old) because so much information is now available that was not in the 70s, 80s, and 90s

Other than investing too conservatively from 1977 - 1996, I would not change anything.  Max'd out company matching, "paid" ourselves first to max out savings, max'd IRAs and then ROTHs, carried no debt except a mortgage, were frugal consumers  mutual funds/index fund investors.  This was all helped because we opted to not have kids which was partly a financial decision.  Having kids would have resulted in a very different (not bad or good) lifestyle path.

We focused only on being FI because it means we never would HAVE to do something we hated doing.  Those times came when DW walked any from the corporate world at 41 and I walked away at 43.  BUT, we did not RE - got bored.  Almost 30 years later, DW continues to work PT from home at something she is good at.  And, I worked until 67 at a myriad of low stress, PT jobs I enjoyed.  The key was we only do/did things on our terms and our schedule.


Purple_Crayon

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Re: What would you have done differently if you could go back and restart?
« Reply #24 on: March 14, 2024, 12:54:45 PM »
I have thought about this question one and off over the years, and my answer has (as one might expect) changed over time.

When I was 25, I had averaged about $15k per year in income over the previous 5 years, had spent the previous 7 years playing in bands, roadtripping on the cheap around the US, Central America, and Europe, and drinking way too much.

Right about my 25th birthday, I had a period where I was really upset with the way I'd spent the years since high school. Essentially all of my friends were making 5x+ what I was, had gone to college, had started families, purchased homes, and so forth, and I had $0 to my name, no other assets, and no education. At the time, I wished I hadn't "squandered" seven years, and thought of all the things I wished I'd done differently.

So I turned on the gas and tried to catch up.

By 35, I had gone to college and grad school, was FI, one year from paying off my house, and was closing in on 10 years in a fantastic relationship. The way I felt about those years between 18 and 25 completely changed. I was SO GLAD I had spent them the way that I had.

Weird how our viewpoints on our own historical narratives change as our current situation does.

I think the only thing I would change if I could do it again (assuming I don't know all the things I know know like the price of houses, stocks, etc.) is just to buy a house in a more ideal location instead of caring primarily about price and letting it drive the whole decision. The house is just fine -- I just wish it was closer to trails, more scenic walking opportunities, etc. It turns out, those things are very important to me. Other than that, I'm pretty glad and grateful the way things turned out.
« Last Edit: March 14, 2024, 01:05:45 PM by Purple_Crayon »

GuitarStv

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Re: What would you have done differently if you could go back and restart?
« Reply #25 on: March 14, 2024, 01:07:23 PM »
I don't think I'd have changed anything.  Low cost diversified index investing, not paying much attention to what investments are doing, dumping money in there on the regular, not blowing cash on stupid crap . . . that's pretty much always been my approach.  And it's working.

NV Teacher

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Re: What would you have done differently if you could go back and restart?
« Reply #26 on: March 14, 2024, 01:33:45 PM »
A few things I did right . .

-Started investing my first year teaching
-Left that money alone and let it grow
-As I made more money I increased my investing
-Lived modestly without big frivolous expenses
-Paid off student loans much earlier than scheduled


A few things I should have done differently . . .

-Spent less on things for my classroom
-Bought a smaller house than I did
-Spent less time on my job and more time on hobbies or interests that bring me joy

Just Joe

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Re: What would you have done differently if you could go back and restart?
« Reply #27 on: March 15, 2024, 10:18:34 PM »
Less consumer debt. However that is part of what drove me (us) to self study the MMM blog+forum. It has turned out well enough. Several times we built up savings only to wipe it all out by stretching to buy things. Or put it on credit cards.

Wish we had gotten on the right track earlier but I was a late bloomer and don't think I could have been successful any sooner. DW had to reboot her career a couple of times as opportunities presented themselves. The Great Recession delayed alot of our plans but we were never unemployed at least.

Wish we weren't / aren't as introverted. Would be easier to set up a larger network of mentors and friends who could have notified us of further flung opportunities. About half of our successes were via friends passing along news of a job opportunity.

Wish I would have started saving ~$100 a month in my early 20s. I was in the military making $14K a year and it didn't go far. I was saving money but putting it in a savings account that was too easily accessible rather than an IRA or Vanguard (I think it existed then).

curious_george

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Re: What would you have done differently if you could go back and restart?
« Reply #28 on: March 16, 2024, 03:25:10 AM »
If I had to start all over again I would not worry so much about money or even make money the main priority in my life.

I would instead focus on my physical and mental health and relationships.

You can always make more money later on in life. It's much harder to recover your health and energy levels if you have tons of unhealthy behaviors and eating patterns and do not exercise at all.

I also would have went to therapy way sooner and learned to say 'no thanks' to other people instead of always caving to their demands.

Lalalauren

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Re: What would you have done differently if you could go back and restart?
« Reply #29 on: March 16, 2024, 05:50:28 AM »
The major thing I would have done differently is get a sense of how much I would need to reach Financial Independence. Once you have 25x your annual spending, according to the trinity study, you have enough to “retire”. I went to a financial advisor at one point. He projected that at our savings rate, we’d have 9M for retirement. I had no idea of that was “enough”. After digging into the FIRE literature and learning how ludicrous it would be to work till I hit 9M, I was able to feel like there was a target to hit and a goal to meet. Now, I’m aiming for less than $2M. However, knowing this amount was instrumental in my path to creating a plan.

wcschenk

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Re: What would you have done differently if you could go back and restart?
« Reply #30 on: March 16, 2024, 08:51:56 AM »
1.) I would have worked part time in college and in summers. Enough to max my Roth IRA.

At 30...(assuming a 6% REAL) return...I would have 128k....which wouldn't change my life TOO much but at 45 I would have 470k.  That basically makes your coast FI and give you EXTRA confidence to take career pivots, long sabbaticals, tell your boss off if they are out of line, quit and move to a lower paying position and SO SO SO many other options.

2.) This wasn't a thing when I was 20...but it was when I was 30. I wish I would have understood and HSA is MORE LUCRATIVE than a Roth IRA and maxed it as SOON as I had the chance....both for my wife and myself. With an HSA you get a tax break in the year the money goes in AND it comes out tax free. ALSO....if you max the account annually form PAYROLL DEDUCTIONS ONLY (not 1 time lump sum deposits and such)....you get a break in payroll tax (social security/medicare). This is one of the ONLY ways to get a break on payroll tax (you pay payroll tax even when you set money aside in a Roth IRA and IRA). ALSO...what if down the road you have TOO much HSA....can convert it to an IRA.

3.) IF travel calls to you....backpack a little. Take a summer or even a year or two....save and work like a crazy person before your trip...maybe do some remote work AS you backpack and see the world a little. Youd be shocked how affordable it can be when you get into the research of it. I am 40 now, amazing wife, home, 2 great kids......but logistically.....longer term travel wont be a simple options for many years....would require home schooling and 4x the air tickets and nicer accomodations for family basics (no youth hostels). The is somewhat counter to save everything you have....but you have VERY limited opportunities for THIS kind of experience. With your degree...come home and find a job after a year of adventure...OR get a remote position and see if you an get your work done in 20-30 hours a week WHILE aboard. I spent 3.5 months in SE Asia between my Junior and Senior year of college.....while I didnt pay for it responsibly (used student loans to fund it) it was THE MOST WORTH WHILE MONEY I HAVE EVEN SPENT....more than any home, investment or anything. It changed me...filled me with memories and made me feel like I did something unique and worthwhile in life. That was ESPECIALLY valuable as I settled down....I had some big adventures....I had no regrets.....made it EASIER to stay on the straight and narrow with budgets and commit fully to my wife and kids. I look back on those times very fondly....youth hostels...meeting other travelers from Europe, learning from locals, getting off the beaten path, learning languages (I have forgotten all I learned but still), learning to ride motorcycles from a motorcycle cab drive I paid to teach me who had me whipping circles around buddest wats (temples essentially), seeing jungles, rock climbing "mountains", scuba diving in reefs, volunteering at a local orphanage, eat street food, take local buses to get places, live out of a small frame pack and realize how little you need to be happy....life changing.

4.) Live cheap. "Privacy is a luxury". My first apartment after college had 4 guys....was $188 a month for me and we split utilities. The very next year....I bought a 2 unit home and my unit had (5) bedrooms. I got rent from the lower apartment and from renting out the other 4 bedrooms for $300 a month including utilities. My mortgage back then....$782 all in...rent....$2000 and most of it was paid in cash (off the tax roll EXCEPT for the rent from my lower unit). I also got AMPLE tax write offs. I made a BOATLOAD of cashflow on that first place. I used some of the fund to help my now wife (girlfriend then) pay off her CC debt and buy a 2 unit. I moved in with her a year after I bought my home...rest is history. We had 2 multiunit but never made a ton at our primary jobs....those homes SET US UP. Between the cash flow....equity...tax write offs.....when the market heated up years later it was still RELATIVELY easy for us to buy and GUT/Renovate a home for our family. We moved when we were 35...lived in "her" multi unit for 10 years and our daughter was 1....knew we wanted a bigger place to have kid #2 and a home office. In 2018....bought a home with funds from a Heloc (paid off her rental and sold mine).....have a modern and updated 4 bed with an inground pool and furnished garage (pool house that we park in, in winters only)...with a 128k mortage....our mortgage is MINIMAL. Wouldn't be possible if we didn't set ourselves up earlier in life.

5.) Not much of a Dave Ramsey guy but he has 1 thing right....if you cant afford a home with a 15 year mortgage....you cant afford it period. Our rental HAD I learned that earlier in life....lifestyle creep would have been slower, maybe would have worked a LITTLE harder in my 20s.....few more side gigs here and there and would have NO mortgage today. Granted....at my loan amount that would only save me $7500 a year....but that would reduce life risk...maybe would have allowed my wife to quit a stressful job sooner...or at very least....stack more cash now to retire earlier. I know many people say "put as little down and put the difference into your investments".....MUCH easier said than done. When you have a mortgage, already have 15% automatically come out of your check for a 401k, have $500-600 automatically come out to max a Roth...its easy to THEN "coast". Keep it simple...say the bases are covered. Could I have afforded a 15 year mortgage and felt a little more pinch and worked more for a little more lifestyle...I could have. Could have I invested the "difference" in what I saved monthly from a 30 year and 15 years mortgage...yes you CAN....BUT in practice....it can FEEL almost illogical. Make it harder on yourself....with raises and inflation....those payments feel FAR more manageable after 5 years TRUST ME.

6.) DO NOT PLAN FOR LINEAR PATHS. This is hard to internalize without lots of life experience BUT sock A LOT away when you can. Why...because you WILL have set backs. We ALL use retirement calculators when we calculate how much money well have one day when we put aside X dollars every year for X years at X return.

What those calculators are BAD at helping you internalize...the ups and downs. No one get a consistent market return....its +20% one year and -15% another year. Also....few us of are blessed to contribute the same amount EVERY year....you have layoffs, company does bad and misses bonuses for a couple years, you enter a 2-4 year recessions, new babies / homes or other large expenses, you or your spouse or kids need a large medical expense, parents passing or needing extra help (time or financial) AND you have unexpected gains.....promotions, inheritances, work bonuses, once in a lifetime deals (home or car) and so on. 

DONT LIVE BIG when things are on the up and up. It is NOT uncommon to have a 3-10 year "hot streak" of good things but EVERYTHING REVERTS TO THE MEAN....meaning there WILL CERTAINLY be down times. I got lucky...I graduated college RIGHT into a huge recessions....it set my expectations EARLY.  You my friend.....are living in the sequel "roaring 20s" (google it) .... things are too good to be true almost. Sock away what you can, live small (still travel though) and expect some BIG DOWNSIDES. 

6.) Get a modest emergency fund AFTER you max roth IRA and HSA and 401k match. You are young....2 months of ALL EXPENSES is for someone who lives on their own...even if you still live at home...so rent, utilities, car insurance, health insurance and all that) and invest it conservatively....HYSA or CDs or bonds with short maturities...or 3-4 months BUT invested in stocks (I double it incase markets crash out AND THEN you need to tap it). If it grows....let it be....as you get older emergencies are more likely...you have spouses and kids and homes to consider risks for. Id even consider leaving 1 month in a HYSA just for ease

7.) The pecking order

a) 1 month emergency fun in EASY to tap investments like HYSA or CD (pay a small fee to withdrawal early) .
b) 401k to get the FULL matching IF AND ONLY IF there is matching.
c) max HSA if applicable
d) max Roth IRA as long as youll finish the year in one of the 2 bottom tax brackets for federal taxes.
e) brokerage "emergency" for a 2nd month of expenses. THEN every 2 years....build up an additional month UNTIL you have 12-18 months in that brokerage account (always keeping 1 month in HYSA). Why SO MUCH....because layoffs tend to happen more WHEN the economy tanks.  So say you have 12 months of expenses in a total market etf in your brokerage.....12 months drop 40% now you have 7.2 months. BAM you get laid off....AND need all 7.2 month BUT also owe taxes...now your have 6 months AFTER tax. See how quickly you went from 12 to 6.

So why bother with a brokerage for your emergency fund (its controversial advice)....well...young people are resilient and can easily take a lower paying job to cover LOW living expense....second...less likely for a health emergency....third if you have an HSA you have some OTHER funds for a health emergency that are tax free....fourth...if you get 6% returns and NO emergency in 5 years.....you grew your emergency fund 44%.  If you can go 10 year with no emergency....79% growth. Lets say your expenses are 4k a month...and EVERY YEAR from year you set aside 4k for emergency. the FRIST year....money goes to a HYSA....years 2-10....invested at 6% real return. After 10 years your invested emergency grew to $46k...PLUS 4k in a HYS (lets say that treaded water and made no gains).....10 years out you have 50k....which is 12.5 months emergency.  If you go 13 years (from 22 *post college* to 35) you have almost 72k which is 18 months emergency fund and you never need to save for emergencies again....unless you have one...then just replenish. At some point...emergency fund becomes a "retire a year or two early" fund and you hit the 1-2M mark.
f) max 401k / solo 401k / sep / federal sponsored program
g) IF you have an interest rate on your mortgage 6% or over...pay down mortgage. If rate is under 6%....backdoor Roth.
h) do the OTHER option from option "g"
i) at this point...you are insanely financially secure.....make sure you are LIVING and utilizing TIME.  Stop worrying about finances. You are good.


8.) I wish I understood the FINANCIAL ramifications of health and time used. Every beer/shot I bought in my 20's...made me less wealthy and less healthy. If I could go back in time.....id take back 2/3 of those beers and 100% of the shots lol. Restaurant meals are the same...id take back 50% of them. I would take back money I spent when I was bored...."walking around a mall or store ... spending for something to do"...or a concert or movie I wasnt 100% pumped about because it was something to do. Would have watched less TV and played less video games and worked a bit more. Still see friends and do exciting things....but skip "c and b" tier level activities...especially if they are medium or high price tags. Also realized "free" activities....still have costs. BE ACTIVE....join sports or physical activities you LIKE. What you pay to do those activities will be 100% recouped in health issues and treating them later. Not only do you lose money traeating medical conditions.....you lose TONS OF TIME later in life 9during your highest eaning years).

9.) If you have friends to rent to...or make friends easily.....buy a home early and house hack (rent out the extra rooms). Id go as far to build a room in the basement to live in....rent out all bedrooms and pay that sucker down ASAP OR buildup emergency fund FAST. It is a GREAT side hustle.....bonus points if you buy a multiunit AND rent extra rooms in your unit.

10.) embraces "low lifestyle" it is never EASIER and MORE ACCEPTALE to be broke than when your young. If ways easier to say "sorry I cant make that nice dinner or b level movie" than tell our kids later you cant afford them to be in XYZ sport or tell your wife you guys cant afford to celebrate your 20 year anniversary with a dream trip.



Log

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Re: What would you have done differently if you could go back and restart?
« Reply #31 on: March 16, 2024, 05:03:10 PM »
I have thought about this question one and off over the years, and my answer has (as one might expect) changed over time.

When I was 25, I had averaged about $15k per year in income over the previous 5 years, had spent the previous 7 years playing in bands, roadtripping on the cheap around the US, Central America, and Europe, and drinking way too much.

Right about my 25th birthday, I had a period where I was really upset with the way I'd spent the years since high school. Essentially all of my friends were making 5x+ what I was, had gone to college, had started families, purchased homes, and so forth, and I had $0 to my name, no other assets, and no education. At the time, I wished I hadn't "squandered" seven years, and thought of all the things I wished I'd done differently.

So I turned on the gas and tried to catch up.

By 35, I had gone to college and grad school, was FI, one year from paying off my house, and was closing in on 10 years in a fantastic relationship. The way I felt about those years between 18 and 25 completely changed. I was SO GLAD I had spent them the way that I had.

Weird how our viewpoints on our own historical narratives change as our current situation does.

I think the only thing I would change if I could do it again (assuming I don't know all the things I know know like the price of houses, stocks, etc.) is just to buy a house in a more ideal location instead of caring primarily about price and letting it drive the whole decision. The house is just fine -- I just wish it was closer to trails, more scenic walking opportunities, etc. It turns out, those things are very important to me. Other than that, I'm pretty glad and grateful the way things turned out.

Great response. If I had been more informed and more pragmatic about money at a younger age, I wouldn't have had the audacity to go into music at all. Learning about money after the sunk costs of spending years and significant tuition dollars on music school gave me the chance to find out I'm good enough to "make it," instead of never trying. There have been some downer periods - I've certainly been frustrated that building this career is a long and slow and unpredictable climb, as opposed to something like tech or finance where the money starts flowing the second you graduate. But the fact is so much more of my time is my own than if I were working all day every day in a traditional knowledge work job.

And further +1 on location, location, location. Being in a walkable city that I feel a cultural affinity for is priceless.

BlueHouse

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Re: What would you have done differently if you could go back and restart?
« Reply #32 on: March 17, 2024, 09:31:00 AM »
I didn't make enough money when I was starting out to save much, so I wish I had focused on changing my own behavior to just be more mindful. 

I wish I had committed to learning ONE thing EACH YEAR **in depth** that could be used throughout my life.  Like researching how to find and buy a great used car.  Or learning how to take advantage of frequent flyer miles.  Or how to do a 1031 exchange in real estate. 

I find that when I can become an expert level at one thing, not only is it no longer intimidating, but I can leverage expertise into other areas.   I've never had any interest in spending the time to get good at mileage points, but because the payoff could be so great this year (I'd actually have time to go somewhere), I hope to spend some time learning how to play that game this year.